Cams

[yellerfour00]

Whats a good cam that would work good with the wisco big bore kit (440)???


Thanks
Jason

[yzbill]

hotcams stage 2 best cam for the money!

[nacs400ex]

hahhaha hotcams are GARBAGE. Even if they say they fixed them, do you wanna be the one that grenades the motor. I personally would go with a TC mx grind cam, with hardened rockers, stiffer valve springs, and titanium retainers. If you havent got a carb yet, get a 39mm FCR, and get some porting too. Your 440 will have way more power then.

[Giz400ex]

I like the Webcams and you could probably deal with them directly (learned my lesson the first time).:D

[yzbill]

i called hotcams and they assured me that there was only one bad batch with the letters bhr on them also the guy told me when i pressed on the flange to put plenty of grease on the splines and that people were pressing them on dry. i think there are alot of happy hotcams customers and their problem should be worked out now, yeh it does suck if you are one of the people with the defective cam. Your also talking alot of money with other cams because they will be hardwelded cams which will require hardweld rockers. Or you get a hrc cam which is also pricey.

[Silverfox@C&DRacing]

Originally posted by nacs400ex
hahhaha hotcams are GARBAGE. Even if they say they fixed them, do you wanna be the one that grenades the motor. I personally would go with a TC mx grind cam, with hardened rockers, stiffer valve springs, and titanium retainers. If you havent got a carb yet, get a 39mm FCR, and get some porting too. Your 440 will have way more power then.

I guess I have GARBAGE in my motor:rolleyes:

I have used the web cam and I like the hot cam better and I did not have to spend the xtra money on all the other items rockers,springs ect...

I am happy with my decision on the hotcam and the price is right;)

[F-16Guy]

Originally posted by Silverfox@C&DRacing
I guess I have GARBAGE in my motor:rolleyes:

I have used the web cam and I like the hot cam better and I did not have to spend the xtra money on all the other items rockers,springs ect...

I am happy with my decision on the hotcam and the price is right;)
word.

[nacs400ex]

Well you go ahead and use your hotcams. They have had too many problems for my liking. It actually isnt too much money for hardened rockers and stiffer springs. For the rockers you bring them to a local car shop, they can harden them for you cheaper then the dealer/store can.

[H_W]

I got my hotcam stage 2 at about the time everyone started having problems with them. I have never had a problem with it. It runs just as good now as it did when I put it in. I am very pleased with it. I would buy another one in a minute.

[slosh13]

I got my hotcam stage 2 at about the time everyone started having problems with them. I have never had a problem with it. It runs just as good now as it did when I put it in. I am very pleased with it. I would buy another one in a minute.

yup:D

[pnut420]

Yah the hotcams problem is fixed, stuff happens, get over it. The hotcam is the best for the money, sure I would like to have Webcam with $250 hardened rockers, $70 springs, but I would rather put it towards suspension right now :D

[JOEX]

Has anyone suffered any damage due to the loose flanges?

Joe

[pnut420]

Originally posted by JOEX
Has anyone suffered any damage due to the loose flanges?

Joe

Yeah quite a few people did, it does suck.

[UglyMotha™]

Originally posted by pnut420
Yeah quite a few people did, it does suck.


yzroostinya's has a 100+ hours on his hotcam with a loose flange

[UglyMotha™]

Originally posted by nacs400ex
Well you go ahead and use your hotcams. They have had too many problems for my liking. It actually isnt too much money for hardened rockers and stiffer springs. For the rockers you bring them to a local car shop, they can harden them for you cheaper then the dealer/store can.



grow up, they've only had one problem and it's long since been fixed

[KILLER EX]

what is the hrc cam?i am looking for more power all around. i currently have a stage 1 hot cam

Originally posted by nacs400ex
hahhaha hotcams are GARBAGE. Even if they say they fixed them, do you wanna be the one that grenades the motor. I personally would go with a TC mx grind cam, with hardened rockers, stiffer valve springs, and titanium retainers. If you havent got a carb yet, get a 39mm FCR, and get some porting too. Your 440 will have way more power then.

LOL r u high!?!? they fixed that problem a LONG time ago...if u wanna race ill show u how garbage my bike is :devil:

[nacs400ex]

If you wanna drive up here, we will race for a case of beer. :D My lrd 265 against your 416.

I was just saying I wont trust them, just like I wont buy a ford. Its personal preference.

[JOEX]

Originally posted by pnut420
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by JOEX
Has anyone suffered any damage due to the loose flanges?

Joe
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Yeah quite a few people did, it does suck.

What kind of damage?

Joe

[hotex]

I'd like to know where you get your info at. And it's not as you say, pnut. AT ALL!!!

I'm actually ashamed to reply to this crap. But, I can't not reply to such lies. It amazes me that people who know nothing about what they are talking about say things, that they themselves absolutely know for a fact, that they have no true information on. Other than what they read or think they read on a message board somewhere. This is the thing that you can be sued for. Liable can be nasty.

The words "a lot" implies majority. Majority is a gross overstatement for a bad batch of 30 cams.

You should all be ashamed for perpetuating lies and over stepping your knowledge on a subject which you obviously know little about. Everyone is entitled to their opinion but, when opinion becomes lie by pretending to know something about a subject that you truly know very little or nothing about, then writing something on a message board, it becomes liable.

I say stick to the facts, don't speculate, don't assume. Read the OPINIONS of people and get what you want out of it, find out for a FACT what the deal truly is and then express yourself appropriately.

I read a lot of message boards on a variety of subjects and there are always the people that think they know more than they actually do and being the strong willed people they are step across the bounds of what is true and what is a lie to drive their point across. That's wrong to do so. And you who do that, know it.

Let me finish this by saying stick to the facts, not as you THINK is a fact. Just to clear something up that I've seen on this particular board, the flange on the new style cam is not welded on, it's a press fit with a keyway.

Tony

[YZROOSTINYA]

Just to clear things up

Tony is cool as hell!

Over 250 hours here and I can pull mine off with my fingers

3 other motors built with a stage 2 and yes there all ****ts and giggles!

so those who do not know , take your foot out of your mouth now!

[YZROOSTINYA]

And Tony has talked with me several times for at least 30 mins each time without the slightest hesitation.

i agree 110% with u tony...thanks for clearing things up to people about hotcams

[JOEX]

Tony, I agree with what you posted too.

I thought the new Hotcams flanges were cast on as one piece? The original ones were pressed on and a small batch got out that didn't meet spec then the problem arose so Hotcams changed the setup.

May that was just another line of BS that came from here:confused:

Joe

[pnut420]

Haha, I run a hotcams right now, I havent got the motor yet, but I am sticking with hotcam. I cant remember the name of the guy on this site but his wife posted that all the rockers were shot, the cam flange came loose, thet said it looked like the cam pretty much deteriorated all the lobes were shot. Im not just making this stuff up like alot of people on here. Why is it so hard to believe that a loose flange wouldnt ever harm anything, your buddy with 100 hours on the loose flange might have got lucky who knows.

[pnut420]

Originally posted by JOEX
Tony, I agree with what you posted too.

I thought the new Hotcams flanges were cast on as one piece? The original ones were pressed on and a small batch got out that didn't meet spec then the problem arose so Hotcams changed the setup.

May that was just another line of BS that came from here:confused:

Joe

The flange presses on, then there is a set screw to make sure it stays on.

[pnut420]

Originally posted by hotex
I'd like to know where you get your info at. And it's not as you say, pnut. AT ALL!!!

I'm actually ashamed to reply to this crap. But, I can't not reply to such lies. It amazes me that people who know nothing about what they are talking about say things, that they themselves absolutely know for a fact, that they have no true information on. Other than what they read or think they read on a message board somewhere. This is the thing that you can be sued for. Liable can be nasty.

The words "a lot" implies majority. Majority is a gross overstatement for a bad batch of 30 cams.

You should all be ashamed for perpetuating lies and over stepping your knowledge on a subject which you obviously know little about. Everyone is entitled to their opinion but, when opinion becomes lie by pretending to know something about a subject that you truly know very little or nothing about, then writing something on a message board, it becomes liable.

I say stick to the facts, don't speculate, don't assume. Read the OPINIONS of people and get what you want out of it, find out for a FACT what the deal truly is and then express yourself appropriately.

I read a lot of message boards on a variety of subjects and there are always the people that think they know more than they actually do and being the strong willed people they are step across the bounds of what is true and what is a lie to drive their point across. That's wrong to do so. And you who do that, know it.

Let me finish this by saying stick to the facts, not as you THINK is a fact. Just to clear something up that I've seen on this particular board, the flange on the new style cam is not welded on, it's a press fit with a keyway.

Tony

Come on now man, I heard of a few people that had a problem, did I say "ALOT" or majority of them have problems, Im not dissing hotcams and I dont intended to start any crap on here. Im not ashamed of anything, he asked if anyone has had a problem, I stated yes, I didnt clam to be an expert on hotcams like you are trying to act like I said, maybe you got the imagination here.

[pnut420]

http://www.exriders.com/vbb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=67449&highlight=hotcams+problem

Well call Skemp and Jenny a liar! Skemp is one of the most informational people I know on this board:mad:

I guess Im sooooo full of it :rolleyes:

And to clear things up a little more, hotcams did replace the defective cams with new ones, Ill give them some credit their, but Jenny was left hanging with the cost of other repairs as well. My dad owns a tile company and if you damage the downstairs because water leaked though a deck we tiled, we just dont just fix the deck and tile and leave the downstairs that we damaged like it is, seem what Im saying? And if it was only a few why wouldnt they just offer to replace all of Jennnys parts:confused:

How couls I bve SUED for what I am saying here, Im sick of that word

[hotex]

You have no idea of what you are talking about. Did you see those cams yourself? Did you see the other damage? Do you know what the EXACT cause of their failure was? The ONLY information you have is what you have gathered off this board or some other board from the person who doesn't see things objectively because they are pissed they had a problem. You haven't seen the damage. You don't KNOW what the whole picture is. You are accepting what someone else is stating as the cold hard truth then perpetuating it when you don't know what the facts are. Then you state as fact in the next post you make, which is Liable.

Nobody called Skemp and Jenny liars. Where did that come from? Sure, they had a problem, it was addressed, they were GIVEN cams for it. But their problem wasn't with the camshaft, the camshaft was damaged as the result of the problem.

In all my years of working on machinery of all kinds, there is one thing that every single one of them needs. LUBRICATION. Lots of it and with clean oil and grease.

When two tight fitting pieces of metal come in contact with one another, lubrication may be the only thing that keeps them from galling themselves into oblivion.

We got back the original 30 cams that were bad within a months time from when they left our facility. We are continuing to take back cams that were damaged when they were pressed together without any sort of lubrication.

You want to know how we know? No two pieces of metal that fit together will fit perfectly, there is always some amount of variance in the fit. When one extremely hard item is pressed onto another and they do not slide smoothly it leaves chatter marks in the surface of the metal of the softer piece. EVERY single camshaft that has come back is damaged in that way!!! I find that to be an incredible statistic. The flanges are being pressed onto the splines of the cams without any lubrication and it breaks the hardened surface of the cam and over time destroys the cam splines. If it slips on at the start, that's better than pressing the flange on dry!!!

I killed a Honda OE cam the same way for the sake of testing my theory. So not only did Hot Cams take back the ones that were defective (as rightfully they should), but they are taking back the installer of the flange mistakes as well. To me and everyone on this board, that's saying a lot about the company!!!

Fortunately, the above scenario is a moot point as the new cams have the flange on them. PRESSED ON OVER A KEYWAY. You assumed that there is a set screw on the flange, you haven't even seen one. You lied again!

Nobody is suing you or even considering it at this time. But, what you are doing is called Liable. You are directly affecting someone else's life or livelihood by telling untruths by design on your behalf!!! You are making statements that are lies that affects Hot Cams. As are some others.

I have a feeling you are either young or naive and new to the amount of POWER that the internet gives your voice and opinions and hiding behind the feeling of anonimity that posting something on a message board gives you. I can't tell you how to live your life but, I will suggest that a change should be made, pronto. Think, investigate, and verify before you voice your OPINION.

Tony

[pnut420]

I see where you are coming from, but you have to realize where Im coming from, I hear from skemp and Jenny that they had this problem, that to me is a problem, so are you saying when Joe asked if anyone suffered damage due to the flanges coming loose I should say no, when you stated that it wasnt the cams that were bad, the cam failed because the flange was loose correct? That would be damage to the cam and other engine components due to the flange being loose. Im not saying hotcams is junk or I wouldnt run one, I will be running one in 2 or 3 weeks. But it is true that their motors got messed up due to the flanges being loose, so I did honestly answer JoeEx's question.

Also, if hotcams would have provided good instructions about greasing the flanges before pressing them on, this would have saved alot of people time and money. But they did cut a few corners thats the bottom line.

[hotex]

BUT YOU DON'T HAVE ALL THE FACTS! How many times do I have to say this? You're going strictly by hear-say. I keep giving you chances to keep what you don't know to yourself and you keep typing.

Read this carefully because it's the last time I'm going to say this. I'll state it plainly so there is no confusion, I'm not going to discuss what happened to their machines because that is their choice on how they want to handle that. If they are smart people, which they have proven to me they are, they won't tell you what happened. It's their business and not yours.

In our instructions there is a sentence that states we cannot take responsibility for the installer's actions, in so many words. We DO NOT want the person who THINKS he can do it, to work on his machine. Take the machine to a person who knows. Why would you work on the heart of your machine when you don't know what the basics are? Even experienced people make simple mistakes from time to time, especially with the routine. They don't think about it and end up doing things that are not to the standard it should be. Like not using lubrication when pressing two pieces of metal together.

And if you look on our site there are specific instructions on certain models for the installation. What is left out is BASIC MECHANICAL KNOWLEDGE.

I'm doing my level best to help you realize that you don't have all the facts (1) and doing what you are doing is called LIABLE. You are going by hear-say. I can't seem to get threw to you that you don't have all the facts(2). You are stating something that you think is fact, when it is not. And you keep stating it is, even when you know you don't have all the facts (3). And by not having all the facts (4) you are not making good decisions on what you are saying. There are a fair amount of people that read this board and will see this post and they will know that you don't have all the facts (5) and are making statements that are not sound because you don't have all the facts (6). There, that was 6 times in one paragraph that I mentioned that you don't have all the facts. oops, 7.

Please, pnut, take this clue.

Tony

[pnut420]

Im sorry I didnt know you worked for hotcam.

This all started by Joe asking if anyone had a problem with the flange being loose. Wether it was their fault or not, yes they did have a problem. Then you go and jump on me:rolleyes:

[muff]

ok heres a real experience for u guys

I purchased a motor from a user on here, I recently pulled it apart and guess what, the flange on the hotcam is loose. So i call them up, they mail me a packaging slip so I don't even have to pay shipping to get it to them, and they're replacing it for free...ontop of all this its not like i actually purchased it new, they could have easily told me to screw off

I have also seen and looked at the newer designed flanges and they look real tough, I would get a hotcam in a second, all you need to do is drop it in, without havin to mess around with anything else

[JOEX]

Originally posted by pnut420
Im sorry I didnt know you worked for hotcam.

This all started by Joe asking if anyone had a problem with the flange being loose. Wether it was their fault or not, yes they did have a problem. Then you go and jump on me:rolleyes:
Well, I sure got some answers!LOL!:)

I think a large part of the argument is when you replied that 'many' people have had problems. You gave two examples, that is not 'many'

At least we got some more info on this subject.;)

Joe

ya i heard about hotcam problems...but i also didnt hear of many...like in totall...sure there were some..but u have to give credit to them...they gave new cams...and have GREAT customer help availible to customers...plus most of the loose cams still work to this day

[Smokin 440]

What are the sytoms of a loose flange? I think mine mite be one of the effed up ones either way i gotta check it out :( Cuz i sometimes get a ratllin noise and when i run WOT it stumb a does some funky crap and im 99% sure its not the jettin if anyone can help thanks.

[muff]

to find out if you flange is loose, take the top engine piece off, then you could probably grab the cam sproket and see if it'll slid along on the cam, if so then the flange is loose

if not then you're havin other problems

[pnut420]

Originally posted by pnut420
Yeah quite a few people did, it does suck.

I should have reworded this Im sorry. "Yeah a few people did and it does suck. But the synonyms of quite are: fairly, reasonably, moderately, it does not mean many or majority or alot like it was interpretted. Why does it suck? Because for all those that have ever run a XR400 cam or a OE cam have never had to worry about taking their engine apart due to loose flanges.

I have two friends that bought hotcams the same time as me from the same place. We didnt hear of any problmes at that point, so I sent mine to a builder back East and they had theirs done locally by the honda dealer. Even though it is the standard for Honda to grease the flanges when pressed together, we were told to check our flanges to see if they were loose. Im bummed that we even had to check for one thing, we had professionals install our engines and didnt want to pay another $200 to have them professionally looked at for a possible defective cam, so we did it ourselves, but I now realize that the Honda dealer wont be responsible for this engine now that we went into ourselves.

I hope it was the flange not being greased that was the problem, because I will be running mine with a cam that I thought might have been defevctive, so Im assuming now that I made sure it was greased this cam will not have a problem. I really dont want to tear into it and check the cam out.

[Crowdog]

Originally posted by pnut420
I should have reworded this Im sorry. "Yeah a few people did and it does suck. But the synonyms of quite are: fairly, reasonably, moderately, it does not mean many or majority or alot like it was interpretted.

But "quite a few" according to Merriam Webster dictionary means "many".

Libel: a written or oral defamatory statement or representation that conveys an unjustly unfavorable impression.

[pnut420]

Originally posted by Crowdog
But "quite a few" according to Merriam Webster dictionary means "many".

Libel: a written or oral defamatory statement or representation that conveys an unjustly unfavorable impression.

lol. I was off on the wording I admit, but I meant it more like yeah a few had problems but it was just a small batch that was bad. When late night posting I get a little mixed up, I dont think I should get jumped on over it :rolleyes: