Q's on 440 prices?? Pros and Cons??

[QuadJunkies]

I am seriously thinking of keeping my 400 and just doing a 440 in the early spring..:D I would like your opinoins on who would do best work and who has fair pricing..I am hoping alot of you who have had a 440 and had good and bad experiences that I can help make my decision a good one. Whats the Ave. time they will have my quad for( I need to prepare for withdrawls) and what is NOT an acceptable amt of time givin( Ive heard the horror stories of some keeping there quad for months and crappy work and high pricing) Pros and Cons of a 440. ect.. I know dependability will now be lessened , but I really love my EX.....I would love everyones imput....thanks :)
;) TINA

[QuadJunkies]

:o no one has a 440 here????:huh I just want to know that a 440 will be my best choice or not......:confused:

[UglyMotha™]

416 seems to be the popular choice

[sickmojave]

I thought everyone but me had a 440 :eek: surely someone will step up with the info you need. ;) Good Luck

[AtvMxRider]

Originally posted by UglyMotha™
416 seems to be the popular choice


I agree.

[ATVer14]

I love my 440. Its the IMS sleeve, a JE 11.5 to 1 piston, TC cam, Sparks pipe and headwork, just read my signature. The way mine was done is a local shop just took the parts and the bike and did all the work. My friend has a CT 440 and he likes his a lot too, but his blows a lot of smoke when it's cold, which mine doesnt.

[ATVer14]

Oops, I forgot I deleted my long signature. Sorry.

[The440Exorcist]

Originally posted by ATVer14
My friend has a CT 440 and he likes his a lot too, but his blows a lot of smoke when it's cold, which mine doesnt.

Tell your friend he probably needs his valve seals or rings replaced...simple fix. :macho

[Dave400ex]

I would call FDO and see what they say. I've heard nothing but good things about them, and they seem to be fast at getting stuff done.

[pnut420]

440 stroker is where its at. More power than a big bore, runs cooler, lasts longer.

What I love about the stroker is you can run a bigger cam and mid/top pipe and still have gobs of low end torgue.

I just got done doing a 426 and have a spare engine sitting in my garage, that will one day be a 426 stroked to about a 450.

[jb500ex]

i had a 440 from four stroke tech with a 13:1 piston. it definately made ahuge difference. the only thing is you have to do stud work so you dont pull them out.

440 bore is too much heat...440stroker is OWNAGE...its a 416 bore then the other 34 is obtained from the stroker rod/crank...as pnut420 said...lots of torque...major speed

[QuadJunkies]

Thanks for some replies!! This is what I was referred to get from some one else,tell me your input on this.......
Tina,
If money is not a huge road block, I would suggest: 440 kit, 12:1 -13:1 piston( I like JE or Ross a little better thatn Weisco, not a biggie though), Carillo Rod, new head studs from FDO, HD timing chain, TC or Sparks cam, hard faced rockers, oversize or at least s/s valves in stock size, port polish, FCR 39 carb, and a Dyna box. This will double your power. You could run a 11:1 piston, run straight pump and not give up too much. You might be able to get away without the Carillo rod and the HD studs with this psiton. The first thing I would ditch is the rev box, followed by the hard faced rockers, and cam, replaced with a drop in cam (XR400 cam, or a Hot Cam).
Now for a little more budget minded build: 416 0r 426 in stock sleve, piston of your choice (depending on your fuel), drop in cam, port and polished head, and the FCR carb.
I have a set up close to the first( but t 426), minus the black box, I am geting one soon! It runs great, I run race fuel ( 13 to 1) and it goes really good. Its as fast as most other 440s I have run. I would look into F.D.O. they build fast motors and are quick turn around. I also think that Baldwin, TC, FST,and Duncan build really nice motors. But the other alternative is to have a local machine shop bore cyl, send the hear out for p&p, order the cam, and a book and do it your self! Its not to hard if you have time and patience!
Good Luck

This was alot for me to absorb......:o but the info was great.!!So why is it that a 416 has such better power over a 440? Im a little puzzled over this, and I dont want to have to depend on running race gas all the time either

[shamisc]

A 416 doesn't have more power than a 440! It really does depend on who does the work. IMO, an IMS 440 kit sucks! They have thin sleeve walls that are tapered to fit into the cases and they often crack causing devastation to the engine! I personally have the FST 440 by Mickey Dunlap. It consist of a true 11:1 Wiseco piston which means when you put it back together you have 11:1 not 9.8:1 like other kits. Mickey has these custom made through Wiseco (who now owns JE). It comes with a thicker custom made sleeve. The sleeve does reqiure a little boring of the cases, but well worth the time and effort if you're looking for reliability! I have never been beat by a 416, 425, 425, or an IMS 440! My buddy has a 2002 C. Sparks 686 Raptor that see's the roost from mine everytime we race! My cousin has a 2001 Banshee with Toomey pipes, ported cylinders, shaved heads, .040 over pistons, and carb mods and I beat him from star to finish! I'm not braggin, but all the above is true! FST kits are the shiznit!! Mickey is very busy, but when you get in touch with him, he's a very knowledgable and helpful person. He knows his stuff! I bought the kit from him, followed his directions with the case boring, and did everything myself! My head and cylinder did go to a machine shop though. I am EXTREMELY PLEASED with the outcome of mine! If you decide to go that route, let me know and I'll help you with it as much as possible! BTW, the guy that did my head does an awesome job and he's much cheaper than others! Let me know!:D ;) shamisc@yahoo.com
The only thing I would have done different is gone with a Carillo rod, a 13:1 piston, and longer head studs.

[QuadJunkies]

Originally posted by shamisc
A 416 doesn't have more power than a 440! It really does depend on who does the work. IMO, an IMS 440 kit sucks! They have thin sleeve walls that are tapered to fit into the cases and they often crack causing devastation to the engine! I personally have the FST 440 by Mickey Dunlap. It consist of a true 11:1 Wiseco piston which means when you put it back together you have 11:1 not 9.8:1 like other kits. Mickey has these custom made through Wiseco (who now owns JE). It comes with a thicker custom made sleeve. The sleeve does reqiure a little boring of the cases, but well worth the time and effort if you're looking for reliability! I have never been beat by a 416, 425, 425, or an IMS 440! My buddy has a 2002 C. Sparks 686 Raptor that see's the roost from mine everytime we race! My cousin has a 2001 Banshee with Toomey pipes, ported cylinders, shaved heads, .040 over pistons, and carb mods and I beat him from star to finish! I'm not braggin, but all the above is true! FST kits are the shiznit!! Mickey is very busy, but when you get in touch with him, he's a very knowledgable and helpful person. He knows his stuff! I bought the kit from him, followed his directions with the case boring, and did everything myself! My head and cylinder did go to a machine shop though. I am EXTREMELY PLEASED with the outcome of mine! If you decide to go that route, let me know and I'll help you with it as much as possible! BTW, the guy that did my head does an awesome job and he's much cheaper than others! Let me know!:D ;) shamisc@yahoo.com
The only thing I would have done different is gone with a Carillo rod, a 13:1 piston, and longer head studs. Well thatis VERY nice of you to offer for helping us out on it!!! I would be a total basket case to do this work myself, what if I messed it up?:eek: :eek2: So I take it with tyour compression you run race gas.. correct? Do you mind me asking what you had to pay for all you done ???

[YZROOSTINYA]

I would suggest a 416 kit with a fcr 39 carb,port and polish to the head. run a 10.5-10.8:1 piston(xr head gasket gives you more compression)

You could spend the money from the sleeve on the fcr carb.

My next mod will be a FCR 39. Then my quad will really rip. Thats is the only thing holding me back right now

[Natertot426ex]

Tina maybe I should let you ride mine. You will be inpressed with the power it has. Well you've seen it. I am sure you guys can do the work yourself. Send the head off to someone that knows how to do a good port and polsh job on it and get a carb. I could even help you if you need it. I sat through 2 rebuilds. (mine and Robs). no matter what you do get the port and polish done. Mine is the port only and no polish and it makes a real big difference. A tripple angle valve grind will also do a little more with hard faced rockers and heavy duty springs. Lance said there is no real reason to put a Heavy duty cam chain in because the honda's are real strong anyways but since you have it down might as well do it. Also one thing that I would like to get for mine is an oversized oil tank. If you go to the bigger bore it helps to keep the thing cooler.

[QuadJunkies]

Originally posted by Natertot426ex
Tina maybe I should let you ride mine. You will be inpressed with the power it has. Well you've seen it. I am sure you guys can do the work yourself. Send the head off to someone that knows how to do a good port and polsh job on it and get a carb. I could even help you if you need it. I sat through 2 rebuilds. (mine and Robs). no matter what you do get the port and polish done. Mine is the port only and no polish and it makes a real big difference. A tripple angle valve grind will also do a little more with hard faced rockers and heavy duty springs. Lance said there is no real reason to put a Heavy duty cam chain in because the honda's are real strong anyways but since you have it down might as well do it. Also one thing that I would like to get for mine is an oversized oil tank. If you go to the bigger bore it helps to keep the thing cooler. Maybe I should take yours for a spin..... :D Troy said he liked the 426,but was dissapointed in how much $$ and expected more out of it.. Your help would be MUCH appreciated..

[300exQuadracer]

my one friend has a 426 and another has a 440 stroker i have ridden both quads and actually like the 440 better because i couldnt find a single gear i could bog it down in it had power all the way through, my buddy with the 426 has good power up to middle of 4th gear but it is really responsive in the low end

[Natertot426ex]

Hey tina i just got off the phone with my Utah buddies and they have an engine builder down there that does awesome work. They are going to find out the prices of having a 400 kit done in yours with the head done and everything so I should find out in the next couple days.

[Natertot426ex]

I mean a 440:p

[pnut420]

Originally posted by 300exQuadracer
my one friend has a 426 and another has a 440 stroker i have ridden both quads and actually like the 440 better because i couldnt find a single gear i could bog it down in it had power all the way through, my buddy with the 426 has good power up to middle of 4th gear but it is really responsive in the low end

Cant beat a stroker, with the money you spend on a big bore you could get a stroker.

http://www.powroll.com/honda_trx_400ex.htm

I would rather have the stroker, it may be a little more expensive, but it will be more reliable, develop less heat, etc... I would do bottom end work and porting of the head, then if you want to you can always put it a webcam with hardened rockers, better springs, etc...

Here is more on what their site says:

440cc BORE AND STROKE COMBINATION - #00302S & #16099 $504.45

87mm Bore and 4.0mm Stroke. The best horsepower bang for your buck, this kit has great overall power that can't be beat!

Piston has a shorter pin-to-deck height so no cylinder spacers are needed.

Piston kit bores into your stock liner and includes: Piston, pin, rings, clips and headgasket.

Strokers utilize your stock crank assembly to increase displacement (and generate more torque!) by relocating the crank pin further out on the flyweights. Stroke work is done on your good crank assembly and requires your stock rod, pin and needle assembly to be in good condition.

Price includes stroke work and bore kit only.

[pnut420]

So say:

$500 for the bore/stroke kit
$150 hotcam stage 2
$250 port the head

Maybe get exhaust if you already dont, and try to pick up a used FCR on here.

Their are tons of routes you can go though, like a 426 bore with higher compression 13:1, stronger jug bolts, hardened rockers, etc... If you want relaible power for the track, I would do the stroker and keep the cam on the smaller side for more consistent power, the stroker will develop gobs of power and it will be usable throughout the whole power band. I have seen strokers on chevys, frods and dodges and all I can say is holy torque.

[02 Red Rider]

Hey QJ!

Long time no post. (for me)

I have my 416 and love it I also have friends with 440 Bores and have rode theirs. For the type of riding/racing that you do I would not go the Big Bore route. The reason I say this is that bigger bores produce more torque than they do speed which is really not what you are looking for in TT and sand, IMHO. I agree with the others on a 416, 426, or take it a step further and stroke it.

Just my .02.

I'll get in touch offline soon.

Jason

[pnut420]

Originally posted by 02 Red Rider
Hey QJ!

Long time no post.

I have my 416 and love it I also have friends with 440 Bores and have rode theirs. For the type of riding/racing that you do I would not go the Big Bore route. The reason I say this is that bigger bores produce more torque than they do speed which is really not what you are looking for in TT and sand, IMHO. I agree with the others on a 416, 426, or take it a step further and stroke it.

Just my .02.

I'll get in touch offline soon.

Jason

Strokers are awesome for the sand, and it is speed she needs then the 13:1 compression and bigger cam would do awesome. Hard for me to say because Im not sure what type of riding she does. I'm still trying to figure out what type of riding I like best.

:macho

[QuadJunkies]

Originally posted by pnut420
Strokers are awesome for the sand, and it is speed she needs then the 13:1 compression and bigger cam would do awesome. Hard for me to say because Im not sure what type of riding she does. I'm still trying to figure out what type of riding I like best.

:macho I do all kinds of riding, flattrack TT this spring, and starting MX... I ride alot os sand in the summer too and trips to St. A's where there is alot of BIG dunes to climb.....:)

[QuadJunkies]

Originally posted by 02 Red Rider
Hey QJ!

Long time no post. (for me)

I have my 416 and love it I also have friends with 440 Bores and have rode theirs. For the type of riding/racing that you do I would not go the Big Bore route. The reason I say this is that bigger bores produce more torque than they do speed which is really not what you are looking for in TT and sand, IMHO. I agree with the others on a 416, 426, or take it a step further and stroke it.

Just my .02.

I'll get in touch offline soon.

Jason where you been hiding???:) Are you still doing any racing?>

[QuadJunkies]

Originally posted by Natertot426ex
I mean a 440:p WOW . Thanks Nate!:)

[joshridina400ex]

check out www.deserttoyz.com they do awsome work with 400's and have good service and good packages. i would do a crf 450 carb just my thoughts.

[shamisc]

Originally posted by QuadJunkies
Well thatis VERY nice of you to offer for helping us out on it!!! I would be a total basket case to do this work myself, what if I messed it up?:eek: :eek2: So I take it with tyour compression you run race gas.. correct? Do you mind me asking what you had to pay for all you done ???

- FST 440 kit = $299
- WebCam = $150
- WebCam Hard rockers = $250
- Port & polish head w/ valve job = $250
- Sleeve installation =$125
- Case boring (Very simple. takes patience)=$FREE
----------------------------------------------------------------------
$1,075
Sometimes I just run 93 oct.
and other times I run 50/50 (93 & 110)

[QuadJunkies]

Originally posted by shamisc
- FST 440 kit = $299
- WebCam = $150
- WebCam Hard rockers = $250
- Port & polish head w/ valve job = $250
- Sleeve installation =$125
- Case boring (Very simple. takes patience)=$FREE
----------------------------------------------------------------------
$1,075
Sometimes I just run 93 oct.
and other times I run 50/50 (93 & 110) I was hoping to stay at NO MORE than 1100.00 so this is good to hear....:) I still need A-arms and shocks too I hopd to have them first though....

[Waynes400ex]

I was curious about getting a stroker also. But I recently received this email from Curtis Sparks , who everyone says does the best 400ex motor work.

"We do not recommend stroking the 400x because it is less reliable and doesn't build as much power."

Powroll told me that they have a hard time not blowing head gaskets when you go over 11 to 1. Guys please help me i have a fcr already i just dont know what to do to my stock motor? I ride in the dunes and mx!! I'am a bigger guy also does this effect anything?

[seven]

Why dont you get the predator and troy take the 400 down and trade it in on a yzf yamaha? Then you will both have a new quad!

[twisted threads]

I LOVE my 440 so does Kari! It has Lots of torque, revs to the moon and very easy to ride. Tina I would look into the FST 440 kit if I was you or get a R. :cool::D

[QuadJunkies]

Originally posted by seven
Why dont you get the predator and troy take the 400 down and trade it in on a yzf yamaha? Then you will both have a new quad! in all honesty.Troy didnt really care for the new yami:huh I know.......... he is nuts huh......:o :p I ust hate to trade it the minute I start puting money into it too...... I love the Predator and all, but we had agreement.....next new quad is MINE.....:D :blah:

[QuadJunkies]

Originally posted by twisted threads
I LOVE my 440 so does Kari! It has Lots of torque, revs to the moon and very easy to ride. Tina I would look into the FST 440 kit if I was you or get a R. :cool::D hahaha. an R aint such a bad idea.........:D but Troy will shoot me if we get another 2stroke....:o

[02 Red Rider]

Originally posted by QuadJunkies
where you been hiding???:) Are you still doing any racing?>

Oh i've been here and there. Unfortunatly I have missed several races due to very nearly cutting off my left index finger (real tough to use my shorty clutch lever:mad: ) Got a lot to fill you in on, i'll drop you an email real soon.;)

Jason

[QuadJunkies]

Originally posted by 02 Red Rider
Oh i've been here and there. Unfortunatly I have missed several races due to very nearly cutting off my left index finger (real tough to use my shorty clutch lever:mad: ) Got a lot to fill you in on, i'll drop you an email real soon.;)

Jason Oh sure......sure, thats what you always say.....:o Sorry to hear about your finger.......:(

[02 Red Rider]

Originally posted by QuadJunkies
Oh sure......sure, thats what you always say.....:o Sorry to hear about your finger.......:(

I promise:D. I'll even get together some pics for ya;) :devil: .

[pnut420]

Originally posted by Waynes400ex
I was curious about getting a stroker also. But I recently received this email from Curtis Sparks , who everyone says does the best 400ex motor work.

"We do not recommend stroking the 400x because it is less reliable and doesn't build as much power."

Powroll told me that they have a hard time not blowing head gaskets when you go over 11 to 1. Guys please help me i have a fcr already i just dont know what to do to my stock motor? I ride in the dunes and mx!! I'am a bigger guy also does this effect anything?

powroll dynos all their stuff and the stroker develops awesome power, and they also say they are reliable, in all honesty a properly done stroker will outlast a 440 big bore, less heat, more power. And going over 11:1 compression, you need to use stonger jug bolts, dont try to take shortcuts and you will be fine

[Waynes400ex]

SO the 440 stroker is the best way to go then with the heavy duty rod? Also Powroll told me not to use the bigger studs they actually increase the problem. They recommend just either re-healey coiling the threads and using a torque wrench and following honda's torque pattern