cam info

[cals400ex]

i have a 400ex and am looking into getting a cam. i will be going either a 406 or 416. i will be running on 93 octane. i am not sure what to look at. i know very little about cams. i did a search with not much success. i want big gains in midrange and top end. lowend can suffer a little but not a ton. i don't want to purchase hardened rockers but i can buy different springs if necessary since they are not that expensive compared to rockers. with the cam i don't want to push my factory internals to the max. i just don't want something to break in right after i get everything installed. however, the biggest cam i can get with being safe with factory parts would be great. any suggestions on cams?

[tdd6405]

best cams for mid and top end power woudl be the hotcams stage 2 or the webcam.. the only problem with webcam is they are ridiculously expensive if u compare them to another cam.. plus they ask for a core. u wouldnt have to get hard welded rockers, or springs i dont think.. i do have a new hotcams stage 2 cam that i was gonna use for my 400ex. i had a webcam but it needed replaced. i will sell u the hotcam if u want, cuz i sold my 400ex motor. i also have 4 new kibblewhite valve guides. shortened for high lift cams. email me if u want them td6405@yahoo.com or IM RideRed72

[oregonrider89]

If your looking for big gains from a cam you'll need springs and hardened rockers. Reason being the more aggressive a cam gets the harder it will work your springs and rockers. The oem springs and rockers won't last very long with an aggressive cam.

oregonrider89

[dj416]

the list wont hurt the rockers, its what the cam is made of the requires harden rockers. if u get a hot cam stage 1 or 2 stock rockers will work fine cause it is a billit cam and not a rewelded and reground cam. u might need stiffer springs with the higher lift on a stage 2. with a webcam it is rewelded and ground back down so the weld is harder than the rocker and will waer a hole in it. i got a stage 1 hotcam with a 416 piston and i'm really happy with it. awsome low and mid and good still up top.

[cals400ex]

i knew sparks and hotcam made drop-ins. this is not going to be an all out race bike. i will be just racing friends and playing around. if the web cams are overpriced, i don't see a point in getting one of those. WB and gt thunder also make cams. i understand that getting different rockers will give me more because then i would be able to get a better cam more than likely. i was just mainly trying to find out like the top three best drop-ins. i just don't want to get something and regret it later. i can always get rockers and such if i have the desire later on for a better cam. also, how is the top end speed with the stage 1? did you gain much from stock? thanks

[JD400exrider]

For mid - to top end go with the stage 2 Hot cam if you want the best Bang for the buck. For the money it should be a good cam if you get one of the newer ones with the flange already installed from Hot cams. I personally am running a HRC cam made by honda ant is gives very good gains throughout the power band without much loss on the low end. I think most people don't talk about the HRC because they don't know much about it and it costs a little more. The grind is close to a stage 2 hot cam and it is made by honda with the quility built in. ;) I would buy another if needed. :D

Just my .02

where u get urs and how much

I think your the guy Hot cams was thinking of when they made there cams.

Mild mods, a desire for more performance but still on a budget and not wanting to plop down 300.00 to 500.00 on rockers springs and stuff to make it all work.

Look around at whats out there and make your decision but I think you would deff do fine with the hot cam or HRC but then its the $$$ difference etc.

[cals400ex]

would the drop-in hrc outperfrom the hotcam? or is it just the more expensive because its a honda part?

Originally posted by cals400ex
would the drop-in hrc outperfrom the hotcam? or is it just the more expensive because its a honda part?

I'd have to say the Honda cam is MUCH better than the hotcams..hands down Period. After all it's a honda part and it has been truly tested unlike hot-cams..:ermm:

Here's a link to the FAQ section and a good article on cams...

http://www.exriders.com/vbb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=13988&perpage=15&pagenumber=2

Originally posted by Rico
I'd have to say the Honda cam is MUCH better than the hotcams..hands down Period. After all it's a honda part and it has been truly tested unlike hot-cams..:ermm:

Here's a link to the FAQ section and a good article on cams...

http://www.exriders.com/vbb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=13988&perpage=15&pagenumber=2

Since I only have run one Honda cam (the stk ex one) I cant compare but could you tell us why theres is "much better hands down" cause I bet I am not the only one who would like to know.

Thanx :D

i wanna kno where to get the HRC cam cheap cuz ive been wanting it for awhile now

Originally posted by 440EX4me
Since I only have run one Honda cam (the stk ex one) I cant compare but could you tell us why theres is "much better hands down" cause I bet I am not the only one who would like to know.

Thanx :D


It's a Honda part....:blah:

Hot cams 40000 posts about a flange problem:confused: :ermm:

Actually blackguyona400 ran several cams and he told me his HRC cam out pulled TC cams, XR400 cams, GT thunder cams...so for experience I have none.. But just the reliability the honda cam offers over the hot-cam makes it a winner in my book. IF the hotcam does offer more..so be it..is it gonna actually make the difference to put someone across the finish line before the next guy..probably not.

I'm just about 100% positive the HRC cam is what I"m goin with this winter..

[cals400ex]

can you just install the hrc without changing rockers and springs? or will it be pushing the limits? if so, what needs to be changed? thanks

u dont have to change anything at all...its a drop in cam like the hotcams but where can i get it for under $200 anywhere i have been is $200+

[cals400ex]

i am not sure where you could get it at. maybe try C and C Racing. they usually have good prices but i don't know if they can get that cam. give them a call.

ive never even heard of C&C...do they have a site and if they dont whats there #

[JD400exrider]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Rico
[B]I'd have to say the Honda cam is MUCH better than the hotcams..hands down Period. After all it's a honda part and it has been truly tested unlike hot-cams..:ermm:

What Rico saying is the Exact Reason i bought a HRC cam. It is a Honda made cam that has been tested and proven. I had also asked a few builders what they thought of the cam. None had anything bad to say about it. Yes there are more aggressive cams out there but for a Drop In Cam I would say it is hard to beat the quality and the performance. I was ready to put heavier valve springs in at the same time and i was advised not to by several engine builders that would have gladly had my money. It has nice gains throughout the power band. I don't feel I lost any low end.

The Price for the cam new is around 280.00 +/- a few bucks.
Yea its not as cheap in price as the Hot Cam But it comes with the flange and decompression stuff already on. Truly a Drop In Cam
Would I spend the extra money again for the HRC cam. You Bet :cool:

XX rider. The cheepest place I found was either Planet Honda or Service Honda. Save a little extra money up and you won't be disapointed. (Put that oil cooler on hold for a while) ;)

[cals400ex]

sorry, i mean C and D racing, not C and C. they probally don't carry them but it was just a guess. also, what is this flange and decompression crap? do i need to buy this stuff too if i was to get a hotcam? do you all think a hrc cam will outperform the stage 2? if so, at what rpm's. to me it sounds like the hrc is the best performing drop-in avaliable.

well the oil cooler is so i can bore to 440 with no worries...and i dunno how to navigate service honda or planet honda...do u kno the part #

[JD400exrider]

It is hard to find in the service Honda site. I think is under the honda line window on the left side of screen under the xr400 motorcycle but here is the part #

14000-NKK-000

[JD400exrider]

Cals

The Hot cam does not use the decompression stuff. It gets removed when you install the hot cam. The flange now comes on the new hot cams. Before you had to remove the flange off your stocker and install on the new cam. That is where some problems came up. Now hot cams comes with the flange already on.
I think the stage 2 grind is a little more aggressive than the HRC cam. Will you be able to tell the difference Who knows. For what you stated at the top of this thread i think the HRC cam suits your riding style better than the stage 2 You will find there are a he$$ of allot of people on this site that like the performance of the stage 2.
Good luck

how the he77 do i work planet honda...all i can c is cars...also are those works triple rates wit ressies any good?

Originally posted by XxHonda_RacerxX
how the he77 do i work planet honda...all i can c is cars...also are those works triple rates wit ressies any good?

LMAO I think you were on the wrong web site ;)

try this

Service honda parts (http://www.servicehonda.com/hard%20parts/hard_parts.htm)

i been there its $277

May want to think of one of these while your ordering.

Item Number Description Qty-Pack List Price Each Our Price Each
14401-MEB-671 CHAIN, CAM (112L) 1 $35.11 $25.68

Was reading in another thread that this is the exact same chain as is being sold as the HD 400ex timing chain but at a realistic price.

There will be one on my next order to check it out and see for sure.

And its interesting how even honda likes to stick it to us, and here is the std 400ex chain :grr:

Item Number Description Qty-Pack List Price Each Our Price Each
14401-KCY-671 CHAIN, CAM 1 $85.55 $62.58

yep i saw that thread also

[rarinrex]

I race cross country and my compression relief is bad i thought about the hotcam to replace it my 400ex is all stock pipe and jetting coming soon should i go with stage 1 or 2

[YZROOSTINYA]

there was never REALLY a prob with the Hotcam

the play on the flange had no side effects. People just thought there was.

I have one of the originals and i have at least 100 (prob more like 200 )hours on it. I can slide my broach on and off with my hand.

still no probs and i have dropped the clutch from pinned SEVERAL times on the daily.

but yes they have corrected the problem and i would go with the HOTCAM

unless you want to help fund Honda's racing program

Originally posted by rarinrex
I race cross country and my compression relief is bad i thought about the hotcam to replace it my 400ex is all stock pipe and jetting coming soon should i go with stage 1 or 2


stage 1 for woods racers...wide open racing like Mx and desert are stage 2 cams..

Originally posted by Rico
stage 1 for woods racers...wide open racing like Mx and desert are stage 2 cams..

i disagree...the stage 1 is a waste of metal...stage 2 goes for all racing in my opinion...stage 1 is a waste of money

[UglyMotha™]

Originally posted by XxHonda_RacerxX
i disagree...the stage 1 is a waste of metal...stage 2 goes for all racing in my opinion...stage 1 is a waste of money



why, rico is right, have you ever used the stage1, i can tell you from experience that the stage1 would walk all over the stage2 in the woods there is a big difference between the two cams for low-end torque for the stage1 topend sucks compared to the stage2 but the stage2 lowend sucks compared to the stage1 i'm not saying the stage2 sucks for lowend but you would be amazed at the differance

well my bike has major low end as is...i dont see why i would need more from a stage 1...if u run a stage 2 with high comp piston u will have the same lowend as a stage 1...and if ur not happy with that then maybe u want to do wheelies by accident :huh

[cals400ex]

Originally posted by XxHonda_RacerxX
i disagree...the stage 1 is a waste of metal...stage 2 goes for all racing in my opinion...stage 1 is a waste of money


is this just a guess or have you had both cams? i would say that if anyone hasn't used both, how could anyone say which one is a better cam at different situations? you won't lose much top speed with the stage 2. my friend has the stage 1 while i have the stage two and i only pass him by about 1mph up top. i even have a full exhaust and a higher compression than him and he only has a slip on. i beat him through the gears without much problem, but top speed is not that much different. i am not sure, but that may have to do with my tires are heavier and wider than his. the stage 1 is better for torque. with the stage 2, you need to keep revving the bike out. when just going down the road and hitting it at the same time, the bike with the stage 1 pulls harder until you get the rpm's up on the bike with the stage 2. once the rpm's are up, the bike with the stage 2 seems to pull harder. if it was me, i wouldn't get a cam with less top speed as the stage 2. however, i want most of the power up top. i actually want a cam that will give more top speed than the stage 2. with the bike in the proper gear, the stage 2 cam performs better in a race. just keep the rpm's up more. good luck. also, i would get a high compression piston if you don't have one.

stage 1...waste of money...i am telling u people...that cam is 100% not needed...if all u wanted to get was a cam and not do high comp piston or nething else...i could see where u might want to get it...but if u r gettin a high comp piston the stage 1 is a major waste

[UglyMotha™]

Originally posted by XxHonda_RacerxX
stage 1...waste of money...i am telling u people...that cam is 100% not needed...if all u wanted to get was a cam and not do high comp piston or nething else...i could see where u might want to get it...but if u r gettin a high comp piston the stage 1 is a major waste




you seem to like pulling stuff out of your butt cause it's obvious you do not speak from experience cause from both post it shows that you have no clue what your talking about :rolleyes:

[rarinrex]

well i dont plan on putting a new piston in it tell i blow it up so i think i will go with stage 1 any comment thanks guys

Originally posted by XxHonda_RacerxX
stage 1...waste of money...i am telling u people...that cam is 100% not needed...if all u wanted to get was a cam and not do high comp piston or nething else...i could see where u might want to get it...but if u r gettin a high comp piston the stage 1 is a major waste

Go race a 2 hour XC race and let me know how many times you killed the motor. OH and you'll have arm pump so bad from clutching your motor that you'll wish you were dead. :blah:


Stage 1 for woods..

Stage 2 for High speed racing..


A cams lift and duration are what makes the cam hit in the area's it was designed for not the comp. of the piston...

[Doibugu2]

I called Sparks to ask about there cams last week. Not sure who are talked to, but he new his stuff.

He said, on a scale of 1-10 his mildest drop in cam is like a 1 1/2, the other drop in is like a 3 (also drop in). And the racing cam which needs the harden rockers and stuff is like a 9 1/2.

[rarinrex]

hey Rico I have raced cross country I know all about the arm pump and clutching it the whole race (it sucks) I know this sounds stupid but I guess your saying to go with the stage 1

Originally posted by rarinrex
hey Rico I have raced cross country I know all about the arm pump and clutching it the whole race (it sucks) I know this sounds stupid but I guess your saying to go with the stage 1

Yes sir. call an engine builder and ask them,,,they'll tell ya the same thing. I run a stock XR400 dirtbike cam in mine and i"m happy with it for in the woods. stage 1 hotcam is about the same, last thing you need is a stage 2 cam in your quad. Some guys will say they have a stage 2 and it works fine in the woods. I don't know what kind of woods they have but there not tight woods then. I"m lucky to get in 4th gear at a XC race so wtf is a topend cam gonna do except were you out tryin to make it work..

[Tommy 17]

for top and mid gains go with a TC MX GRIND CAM!!! i love mine...

205$ + the core


hotcams are junk... everyone has problems with them... u couldn't pay me to put one in my quad... no way i'm gonna worry if my flange is loose or not...

[remlapr]

From what I have heard in the past the HRC is between the hotcam stage 1 and 2, actually just this side of the stage 2. Also - don't forget about TC's drop in cams, I'm pretty sure he makes both a low-mid drop in and a mid-high drop in. Anybody know if his drop in cams get rid of the decompressor?

[remlapr]

Originally posted by Tommy 17
for top and mid gains go with a TC MX GRIND CAM!!! i love mine...

205$ + the core


hotcams are junk... everyone has problems with them... u couldn't pay me to put one in my quad... no way i'm gonna worry if my flange is loose or not...

Tommy - is yours a drop in? Did it get rid of the decompressor?

[JD400exrider]

Originally posted by UglyMotha™
you seem to like pulling stuff out of your butt cause it's obvious you do not speak from experience cause from both post it shows that you have no clue what your talking about :rolleyes:

Come on now Ugly. With a sig as long as his how could he not know what he is talking about. :rolleyes: :p

Never owned a stage 1 or 2 and never would. Actually have a HRC. Increased the mid - top end with out loosing much if any on the low end. Very nice cam.

Originally posted by Rico
Go race a 2 hour XC race and let me know how many times you killed the motor. OH and you'll have arm pump so bad from clutching your motor that you'll wish you were dead. :blah:


Stage 1 for woods..

Stage 2 for High speed racing..


A cams lift and duration are what makes the cam hit in the area's it was designed for not the comp. of the piston...

i do that on a regular basis...and ugly...u must have a beef to pick with me or some **** cuz every post i ever post on u come up and say im wrong...that is bull**** i have road a stage 1 cam bike and they r a ****ing waste of ****ing money...ok...dont say that im pulling **** out of my butt cuz i aint ****ing pulling **** and ur pissin me the hell off...now u can shut the hell up and leave me the hell alone...maybe u should consider its an opinion question and not somethin u can answer with a fact...and my opinion is they r a waste of money...k thx

[UglyMotha™]

don't you find it a little akward that your the only one on the boards with that answer :huh


what are you like 14 does your mother know you talk like that she should wash you mouth out with soap

dude LMAO...yes i am 14...and i think i know a lot more about some stuff then you sometimes...and no i am not the only 1 with this answer...i kno about 10-20 people that think this also...have u even road a bike with a stage 1...probably not or u would most likely agree with me...anyone who has road a modded bike with a stage 1...and then hopped on there modded stage 2 bike...will definantly preffer the stage 2 over the stage 1...that is all i am saying

[UglyMotha™]

Originally posted by XxHonda_RacerxX
dude LMAO...yes i am 14...


funny didn't surprise me



Originally posted by XxHonda_RacerxX
and i think i know a lot more about some stuff then you sometimes


from the few words you have fumbled so far.......that'll be the day




Originally posted by XxHonda_RacerxX
have u even road a bike with a stage 1..probably not or u would most likely agree with me...


already stated earlier in this thread that i have, i see no reason to have to repeat myself every post



Originally posted by XxHonda_RacerxX
that is all i am saying...


does it smell like rank butt in here :huh


well i'm done here your obviously thick skulled

ya i think it does...maybe thats ur mom? LMAO please take it out side :grr: and if u think ur smarter then me....THAT would be the day...not me being smarter then u...my dad is 1 of the top mechanics in the US...please...u cant compare