?'s about engine kit

[DirtDiggler]

I was going to get a Hetrick 416 kit and full exhaust. The kit includes:

Piston
drop in cam
gaskets
bore job
and labor

My question is:

The piston in the kit has 11:1 compression. Would this make a big difference in power vs. a stock bore 11:1 piston?

If not I could just go stock bore, drop in cam and gaskets and skip the rides to PA.

Will any head pipe work with a white bros e-series slip on? I know the slip on is made for the smaller diameter of the stock head pipe so I guess this is wishful thinking. If I have to I could sell the slip on and get a full exhaust.

In the end do you think a full pipe with 11:1 piston, drop in cam and gaskets would be that much different in power from a 416 kit?

[F-16Guy]

I don't know, but I wouldn't think 16cc would make an incredible difference in power. I think all of the ponies come from the compression increase and the cam. If you decide to go stock bore, let me know, I have a brand new 11:1 stock bore Wiseco with a Cometic gasket set that I'll make you a good deal on.

[jmoney45]

i'm also interested in this, so let's move it to the top. :cool:

[DirtDiggler]

anyone else got any info? Help a brutha out.

[lars]

im gonna get the 416 kit as well i chated with C&D racing and they said 416 kit with stage 2 hot cam and high comp gasket set will give u a good noticable power difference so thats what im goin with do the work myself except the bore job :) get the JE or ROSS piston kit i hear there the best

[DirtDiggler]

Don't you need hard faced rockers and heavy duty valve springs for a stage 2 cam?

[lars]

im not sure yet i havent gotten into it yet but i dont think it would hurt i have emailed a few places and neither of them told me i hade to so who knows going to a 416 isnt that big of a change i think i would replace the rod first but springs would be a plus im sure and another thing is if the springs are to strong they will rob power

[lars]

i guess the best thing to do would be ask someone like C&D racing they will know i emailed em with a few questions and they were very prompt about responding to my emails

[DirtDiggler]

I don't know for sure but I thought stage 1 was a "drop in" cam and stage 2 required the rockers and springs but maybe not. It's not like I know what I'm talking about or anything lol. Let me know what they tell you. I'm still leaning toward Hetrick just for the quality of work and the fact that the pistons cost about the same and the bore only cost aroun $40. The drive will suck since they are about 4 hours away but between Jmoney45 and DirtDragon I pretty much have it covered I'll just be paying for the gas and the grub.

[lars]

sounds good i am about a month away from doing my motor so when im finished i will let u know how it ended up i have to get shocks this month and motor next

[F-16Guy]

No hard face rockers needed with the HotCams 2. The cam is matched well with the rockers, hardness wise. If you hardface the rockers with a softer cam, you run the risk of damaging the lobes. The reverse happens when you get a hard faced cam and run stock rockers.

[DirtDiggler]

Thanks for the info F-16guy.

I heard and I noticed a lot of race shops do this that:

They use aftermarket gaskets that are thinner but made of tougher material to get the compression up. Mickey Dunlap said if you put an 11:1 piston in a 400ex without changing the gaskets you wont get any where near 11:1 compression. Is this true? Hetrick changes the gaskets as well.

[F-16Guy]

That is NOT true. That only applies to the Wiseco 89mm (440) flat top piston. The Wiseco 87mm (416) piston is domed. I took all of the measurements as I assembled my 416, and the CR was just a hair under 11:1 (10.9??) with stock thickness EX gaskets. The thinner XR gaskets will push you over 11:1. Unless you have access to race gas, I'd suggest staying on the lower side of 11:1. Do a search for "Have you decked the cylinder?", it will explain a lot about piston differences, how to calculate your TRUE compression ratio, and lots of other things that are very good to know when putting a top end together. It's a long thread, but probably the most informative ever started on this site. If you're serious about your motor, you'll take the time to read it.

[DirtDiggler]

F-16Guy,
That is one hell of a thread. I'm no real mechanic but what I can't do I can usually understand the theory of. Hetrick offers the 416 with wiseco or JE and I was going to go with JE.

Hetrick 416, 425, 440 Kits for Honda 400ex

Web Cam – 450/451 Grind (other cams available at request)
$160.00

Gaskets Head $16.07

Base $7.31

Labor if motor is shipped $150.00


Bore Cylinder $40.00


Total with Ross Racing or JE Piston 416/426 (includes all above items) $505.33


Total with Wiseco Piston 416/425 (includes all above items)
$472.08

I'm just curious about the gaskets as to whether or not they are thinner or just heavier duty. If the 416 piston does give the correct compression then maybe they are just heavier duty.

[lars]

yep thats what there web site says wow thats a good price im gonna just look into that get the 416