Thanks ELKA!!!What's the deal HOUSER?

[416exmx]

Just got back from the first big race and real test on the all new suspension setup. The elka suspension was soooooo sweet. With the +3 LT a-arms and the quad rate dual adjust elkas and rear dual adjust elka, no jump was too big. I was totally impressed. On the other hand, the houser a-arms had a problem. Yeah the top heim joint broke. i was able to finish the race though. The whole setup has less than 1/2 hour on it and a broke heim??? Well thanks to houser i was unable to finish trying to pass the crf quad that was keeping me from first place.;)

[boogiechile]

Heims usually will only break when they reach the end of their range of travel. A arms are built to have the right range of motion at a certain frame clearance with a certain shock compressed length. Since there is no standard for so called long travel frt ends (shocks vary in length and travel) it is easy to get a shock with too short of a compressed length that will allow a heim or any type ball joint to snap. Of course if you bought your shocks from Houser with the a arms they should be right. But if you bought the a arms and then bought the elkas somewhere else there could be a problem. If they were not bought from Houser with the arms then you should ask Houser for the compressed and extended length specs on shocks for the arms and then see if it matches what your shocks are.

[Jnine]

That last post was exactly right. The A-arms are designed to move only so far, and no more. That means if you have a shock with more movement than the a-arm was designed for, you risk a failure. Since it was a top A-arm problem I can tell you that is what happened in your case. Better check with the A-arm maker and get his shock recommendations, and then don't exceed them.

[stocktires]

good info boogie!
I've had bad experiences wih Houser, and will be buying from other component builders from now on :(
But the problem definatley seems to be in the suspension geometry or shocks.

[1badcrf]

what problems did you have with houser???i might be building a crf through them?

[stroked300ex]

that sucks to hear about your a-arms.. i was thinkin about gettin some housier a-arms but now since i am hearin all this.. i am having second thoughts..
a simple question..but did u case the jump hard? that might be a problem lol.. but im not sure.. i havent had a lot of experience with housier a-arms.. well see ya later.. :eek:

[boogiechile]

If the compressed length of the shock is too short which is almost definately the cause then this is not Houser's fault. Houser products seem very well made to me and the customer service is very good. The only way that I see Houser at fault is if the shocks came directly from Houser with the arms. It bothers me when someone posts something and it gets going like this thread where everyone starts to question a product that probably has nothing wrong with it. I dont care who makes the a arms, if the ball joint reaches bind before the shock bottoms on jounce, it is a good chance it will snap the joint. This is especially the case on the top joint because it does not take the load of the impact like the bottom joint does. Of course he could have hit or been hit by another quad in the frt or back of the tire hard enough to break the joint but most likely it broke from the jumps due to an out of spec shock. Granted there is some junk out there but I don't think it is Houser.

[stroked300ex]

everyone has an opinion.. so either way ur gonna get people questioning products. Not that big a deal.

I have to agree with boogie and jnine 100% and you cant blame aurora (the people who made the "heim" joint) any more than Houser.

I have been running the same basic set up for over 8 months with only 2 diffs (+1 and comp adj fronts) and have bottomed them many times with no problems at all with anything breaking etc.

Let us know what happens when you speak with Houser and what you think then etc.


everyone has an opinion.. so either way ur gonna get people questioning products. Not that big a deal. :huh

Ok thats the point of this site in the first place but I would have learned more so far in this thread if he had spoke with houser and or elka first and posted the details etc.

I think we all learn something here, well at least from some threads, I know I do.

[Mxbubs]

How many times have I told you guys that the hiem joints on the top arm will break, so it is better to go with a brand that doesnt build them like that? :D

[QuadTrix6]

Originally posted by boogiechile
If the compressed length of the shock is too short which is almost definately the cause then this is not Houser's fault. It bothers me when someone posts something and it gets going like this thread where everyone starts to question a product that probably has nothing wrong with it. Most likely it broke from the jumps due to an out of spec shock. Granted there is some junk out there but I don't think it is Houser.


I totally agree with you. Why is it housers fault cuz elka make the compressed length to short?

[A4StrokeGuy]

I have another houser horror story! Last week my friend and I were riding at Silver Lake sand dunes, we were jumping this hill landing on a down side, very very smooth landing. Next thing i know he lands and his ball joint breaks in half and sends him tumbling down the hill!!! It broke off right where it goes into the a-arm. His dad works at bethlahem steel and had a friend run sum stress tests on the fractured ball joint and found that the metal is faulty, it will be interesting to see what Houser says. I'll have pics of the carnage in a few days. All i know is my Herrmann's didn't have much trouble handling the landing over and over again:rolleyes:

[QuadTrix6]

Originally posted by A4StrokeGuy
I have another houser horror story! Last week my friend and I were riding at Silver Lake sand dunes, we were jumping this hill landing on a down side, very very smooth landing. Next thing i know he lands and his ball joint breaks in half and sends him tumbling down the hill!!! It broke off right where it goes into the a-arm. His dad works at bethlahem steel and had a friend run sum stress tests on the fractured ball joint and found that the metal is faulty, it will be interesting to see what Houser says. I'll have pics of the carnage in a few days. All i know is my Herrmann's didn't have much trouble handling the landing over and over again:rolleyes:

how did you test it ? and where the bottom ball joints screwed in all the way ? cause they would sure break if they weren't

[416exmx]

i never said it was houser's fault that the heim broke. i did however call them today and they were very helpful and i have a new one on the way. they will look at my old one and find out if it was their fault or mine. i dont think the shock compressed too much causing this to happen because i even had the compression set pretty stiff and the jump was not all that big. i never felt the shocks bottom out and i knew i had them stiff but i figured it was better to start them out stiff and then adjust the compression down from there. ill let every one know what houser found out about the heim.

How many times have I told you guys that the hiem joints on the top arm will break, so it is better to go with a brand that doesnt build them like that?

I know your both busting and serious but I have to tell you that I am not anymore impressed with the other styles than the heim joint. Rod ends are in so many more demanding applications from aerospace to industrial and automotive that there has to be some other problems or design probs etc.

I have seen some pretty HD stuff that uses rod ends and I know we dont work them as hard as some think.

The post on the metal problems could have some merit as the steel industry has been having some hard times but if I remember right the mfg that supplies houser the rod ends buys their steel from bethlaham steel but then again maybe the steel is faulty from being fractured :)

And if it was the rod ends that were the cause of the problem how did all the pro's survive before when that was what was mostly yded b4 the t-pin etc.

[QuadTrix6]

Originally posted by 416exmx
i never said it was houser's fault that the heim broke.

Thanks ELKA!!!What's the deal HOUSER?:huh :huh

[A4StrokeGuy]

Originally posted by QuadTrix6
how did you test it ? and where the bottom ball joints screwed in all the way ? cause they would sure break if they weren't

I do not know how they tested it, i don't work there so i can't say what they did, i did see a print out of a stress test they did, i'll get it scan it and put it sometime today i hope. The ball joint was screwed most of the way in. My friend contacted houser last week and he bought a new ball joint and tie rod, he won't get a refund until he sends the mangled ball joint to houser for them to inspect, from what he said they were very friendly and easy to deal with.

Originally posted by A4StrokeGuy
The ball joint was screwed most of the way in.

First off it's good ta here your buddy is OK..i've been behind my MX racing buddy and his ball joint snap and I'm in the air right behind him thinking i'm gonna land on him not a good thing......anywho....

Most of the way doesn't get it...the bottom ball joint needs to go in all the way till it won't go no more...also.. Ball joints are like bearings,,,they do wear out and need replaced on a routine basis. Houser doesn't make the ball joints so it's not their problem/fault. I've seen lots of ball joints brake. I take my lower ball joints out every 3 months and check for cracks..most of them will crack way before they break..if your check it often you can catch it before you break it and posibly get hurt..

Sounds like houser is taking care of 416exmx,,and just because it broke doesn't mean it's junk and we need to boycott houser..it's metal and chit happens. Happens to all products..even the almight walsh race craft products.. Houser is taking care of him and that's what counts..:D

[Mxbubs]

Hey 440exme, I didnt clearify myself enough. What I meant was I dont like any type balljoint/rod end that uses a male stud to hold it into the a-arm. The studs are just a weak link in my opinion. The designs I like are ones that mold a cup to the end of the arm to fit a spercial raced bearing, aka king pin style setup, although it is not a 'true' kingpin setup, it works alot alike.

The ones I am talking about are the walsh's, herman's, gibson's, and the protrax. Im sure there are more out there, just cant think of them right now.

Mxbubs

First I got to tell you that I had to look twice cause of your new avatar :) lol

I just dont feel strongly either way about the two diff set ups. I know that both styles use the same spherical type bushing and the only diff would be the strength of the steel in the rod itself, and then I remember that most of the stronger setups just use the rod on the upper arm and that doesnt get much of the abuse etc.

So for now I am thinking its not an issue unless the rod is on thelower arm, but then it seems Laeger isnt having a bunch of problems with the countless arms they have sold with that design.

I have talked about this b4 but a friend that rides a lot faster than his ability had tagged a tree very hard on his raptor w/laeger arms and the only thing that didnt bend was the lower rod end and the a-arms. The frame and spindle were both trashed real bad, but not the lower joint.

So maybe theres more to this whole thing than we think.

[Mxbubs]

Maybe that Iraqi starring down that tank barrel may know something about it....

(My avator):D

[haydug]

I have ran Houser LT a-arms for 1 full year, using TCS shocks with NO failure of any component. Houser makes a nice, affordable product that in my opinion is as good as any out there. Instead of thanking Elka, I would have them contact Houser about shaft travel, bottoming length, etc. I'd probably slam Elka before Houser on this problem.

[A4StrokeGuy]

Well here are the pics of the broken ball joint enjoy!

[A4StrokeGuy]

heres what happens when u try to pull a gimped quad up a small hill in the sand w/o 4x4

[Mxbubs]

Oh, you are talking about regular ball joints...Heck yeah, they break alot....we thought you were talking about the long-travel setup.......o well, that stuff happens with ALL brand arms with those ball joints.:D