Which quad? Getting back into riding :)

[platinum350]

Decided to get back into the fun and get another quad and need some suggestions. I've done a a lot of research on the different models already. Unfortunately I'm unable to test drive any because, well don't know anyone with these models.

I had an '02 400EX with some mods (see sig) that I enjoyed quite a bit and honestly, it was probably fast enough for the type of riding I do nowadays. I'll mainly be doing trail riding, some jumps and some smaller sand dunes...but mainly trails.

Here are the quads I've been looking at and my thoughts, please share some suggestions:

TRX450R, KFX450R, YFZ450R:
Sweet but probably more than I need, I'm afraid having a 450 may get me in more trouble lol
-No reverse for trails
-nice suspension
-more $$

KFX400, Z400
-Good trail bike w/ reverse
-decent suspension
-pretty affordable for clean late model

However, I recently found a deal on a clean 2006 YFZ450 for $2900. I know they don't have reverse, but curious if they have electric start? I have ridden one a long time ago but can't remember.

[TacicalRedneck]

here where im at 450s are just a few hundred more than most people with 400s (on craigslist)

Id go with the 450(e)r personally. Honda relibility, available in a kick start, or electric start.

400ex will be the most dependable of them all though, and the best trail quad.

[cloudpump]

yfz has electric start. kfx does have reverse. i believe polaris with the ktm engine have reverse too. ive got a yfz, and never had any issues with no reverse. if you get a 400, you could still get hurt on them. either way, you most likely would want to modify what you get. might as well do it with a 450 to save paying for more parts on a 400 to keep up.

[beastlywarrior]

Ill stick with my warrior tough as grit dependability

[slightlybent47]

For mostly trails, I’d go with another tank and get another ex.
Reliable, dependable, tons of parts out there for cheap.
Just the other day I saw an add where Yamaha is still comparing there “new” 450 against a 400ex.
The ex was designed over a decade ago and is still viewed as something to compare to.
Besides, reverse is nice on the trails.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L5eFDbTPVNM

The LTR is nice if you dont need third gear.lol

[CJM]

Honda, either a 400 or 450. Cant go wrong. LTR goodbye 3rd gear, yfz has poor torque, KFX is ok (reverse is nice to have!) but handles poorly at speed, KTM-breaks way to much and is $$$ to fix.

Theres a reason more people ride hondas than anything else imho.

[muddy400EX]

love my ltr, wouldnt trade it for anything other than a new ltr. never had a problem with 3rd gear:ermm:

[KKiowaTJ]

Id get another 400 and go from there. 450 you will always dump $$ into maintence wise. Power is nice, Reliability is alot better. Good luck either way

[blacknblue#2]

For jumping on and going trail riding whenever ya want i would go with a 400. I dont care what anyone says about a 450 they are high maintenance. Ive tempted several times to sell what i have, buy a newer Z400, put an exhaust and suspension on it and just ride the wheels off of it.

[tripinator]

Originally posted by CJM
Honda, either a 400 or 450. Cant go wrong. LTR goodbye 3rd gear, yfz has poor torque, KFX is ok (reverse is nice to have!) but handles poorly at speed, KTM-breaks way to much and is $$$ to fix.

Theres a reason more people ride hondas than anything else imho.

CJM..You are kidding right? Biased! Show me the stats that say more people ride Honda than any other brand I'm sorry I forgot people on here think Honda's are the great ol mighty that never in a bazillion years have nothing go wrong with them.

[CJM]

Your on a honda site, full of people who ride mostly hondas-what do you expect?

[platinum350]

I've ridden the trx450 and yfz450 but it was in the desert with no paddle tires and they both felt SLOW but that's because they weren't hooking up.

I have ridden a 660 raptor in the dirt and that was just to much for my liking, guess to much torque. I prefer to manhandle my machine vs the other way around.

Question for you that have ridden a raptor and a 450 (really any model) - are they comparable in power?

[CJM]

Raptor has more power period, but I disliked how heavy it felt. 450r has good power, few simple mods and it will have quite a bit more.

I actually like riding my worked 426EX vs my near stock 05 450r b/c of the torque difference. But in due time Im sure the 450r will be better once i mod it.

[platinum350]

I know I'm on a Honda forum but how about these Z400's? I like that it's a more refined 400 w/ better suspension. That's actually one of my hold ups with the 400EX - suspension sucks!

[CJM]

Besides the complicated dual overhead cam and poor swingarm design they are actually pretty good. Liquid cooled, overall better engine vs the 400, etc.

One thing the old 400ex has going for it is simplicity tho. Thats why I cant bring myself to sell mine, no matter what I do it wont die lol.

[KKiowaTJ]

Honda is hands down the most well rounded and reliable machines ever made. When i bought my 00' ex i sifted through many z400's that were 5+ years newer and same price.
To me that screams wrench more than ride and value of a bag of chit. If the suspension/shocks are the only thing holding you back from a solid quad, What will you do when you are taking it easy and the z fails?
You will end up spending the same amount of $$ and i would rather spend it on a honda with a better chance of getting your money back in the long run.

[platinum350]

Originally posted by CJM
Raptor has more power period, but I disliked how heavy it felt. 450r has good power, few simple mods and it will have quite a bit more.

I actually like riding my worked 426EX vs my near stock 05 450r b/c of the torque difference. But in due time Im sure the 450r will be better once i mod it.

Yea it was too much for me, not that I couldn't handle it, just not how I like to ride. Also, I didn't like it either, especially the ergonomics of it.

SOmething else I wanted to bring up is from the reading I'm doing, people say the 450's need a ton of clutch work and don't make the best trail bike or hill climber...do you agree?

[platinum350]

Originally posted by CJM
Besides the complicated dual overhead cam and poor swingarm design they are actually pretty good. Liquid cooled, overall better engine vs the 400, etc.

Cool, thanks for the info.


Originally posted by CJM
One thing the old 400ex has going for it is simplicity tho. Thats why I cant bring myself to sell mine, no matter what I do it wont die lol.

I totally regret selling my super clean 400EX that was setup just fine for me. Definitely don't sell yours!

[platinum350]

Originally posted by KKiowaTJ
Honda is hands down the most well rounded and reliable machines ever made. When i bought my 00' ex i sifted through many z400's that were 5+ years newer and same price.
To me that screams wrench more than ride and value of a bag of chit. If the suspension/shocks are the only thing holding you back from a solid quad, What will you do when you are taking it easy and the z fails?
You will end up spending the same amount of $$ and i would rather spend it on a honda with a better chance of getting your money back in the long run.

Yea I'm debating between modding a 400EX w/ suspension or just doing a 450.
I have never owned a Suzuki before and really don't know how reliable they are...actually, I did own an early '80's RM100 which was a fun bike lol

[CJM]

Yea, I just cant bring myself to sell it. Way too much into it to even get anything close to that selling it is impossible.

Im not sure how/where you ride, but so long as there are no large sections of whoops the suspensions ok. Longer swingarm helps greatly.

[platinum350]

Originally posted by CJM
Im not sure how/where you ride, but so long as there are no large sections of whoops the suspensions ok. Longer swingarm helps greatly.

^which bike are you referring too that has longer swingarm?

I mainly ride trails in PA and some sand pits in NJ...

[CJM]

400ex and 04-05 have a short swingarm. It kinda causes the back to buck around if you ride very hard on whoop sections. Longer swingarm helps, 06+ 450r has it and you can put it on the EX and older 450 with some work.

Not a deal breaker tho.

[Honda.rider5871]

400exs are reliable in stock form or mildly built (pipe, cams, etc.) , i sold both my 400s after i bought my yfz450x ( trail version of the efi yfz450r). I do miss my 400 sometimes, but i couldnt get myself to keep dumping money into a 400. I dont have any problems with the tight trails here in ky with my yfz. I dont know much about the older carbd yfzs but i would reccomend the efi yfzs to anyone, the x model being the way to go if you ride trails ( a bit narrower , but does fine on the track too ) over the r model

[platinum350]

I'm really curious about the power difference between the 400EX and say the trx450 and/or yfz450. Is it a HUGE difference? I know the 450's are obviously faster, I'm just trying to gain a perspective to what I'm familiar with and that's a slightly modded 400EX & a raptor660.

I don't want too much quad for the trails...

[CJM]

What I find is the following:
yfz450: Good horsepower but not alot of torque in stock form. Once they get going the horsepower is nice, specially if you drag race. Problems oiling on the older models can lead to failure. Like the z400-dual overhead cam and more complicated than hondas single setup

450r: good all around power, higher torque than other 450s. Simple to tune and reliable. Downside is the cranks tend to have issues after alot of hours sometimes.

400EX: Best at home on the trails. Reliable, near idiot proof, good power. Dump an 11:1 piston and stage 2 hotcam in it and its alot better. In stock form they can easily keep up with a 450.

Id say the 400 is your ticket, but ride a 450 quad to be sure.

[KKiowaTJ]

Everytime i ride with 450's on trails, They are the same or worse off than my buddys or my 400. The power is nice but useless in most spots. The only time i have to worry about 450 is when we hit the open field and their speed kicks in. TRX 450's

IMO the YFZ450 is made for people 5'6 and under. Too narrow and as much power as a built 400. I have had no problems on the flat track or trails pulling away from them.

Id say go and test ride a bunch and see what you like if you want somthing differnt. Hit up CL and find a few you like and go look at them. Thats what i did after being off for many years. All i ever rode was 2 strokes until i got back into it.

[Honda.rider5871]

07+ yfzs have all the bugs worked out of them, however any year that has the "oil mod" done will be reliable. The fuel injected yfzs are completly different than the older ones, better suspension, geometry, lighter aluminum frame, T shaped seat, and opened ergos that suit taller riders, and new cams for more bottom end power.
400exs are reliable but the biggest limitation is suspension which is costly, even 450r rebuilds are over $1000 ( 450r shocks, rebuild on all 3 and link)
Go test ride them all at your dealer and buy the one you prefer

[platinum350]

Thanks guys, all your comments were very helpful!!
Thanks for clarification CJM.

Btw, I'm 6'1" so definitely looking for something comfortable.

I had no idea the dealer will let you test ride a quad, is this true? Otherwise I think I'll look at some on CL to test ride like KKiowaTJ mentioned. BTW, KKiowaTJ besides my past 400ex all I've ever rode was 2 strokes too. It's a new ball game out there with all these thumpers!

[madskrillz2]

You can't go wrong with a 400ex. I'm not a big Honda fan but I'd take one over a Z400 any day. I say that after owning both and figuring out the hard way how unreliable a z400 can be. Mainly the frame issues. They may have those worked out by now but I know I broke mine in 7 different places.

[slightlybent47]

You might look at some used built ex’s that have already been modded and get one at a good price.
Take advantage of someone else’s financial problems and look for a good used one.
I agree the stock ex suspension is not very good, but it’s a solid bike and can be modded easily.
Most all of the stuff on my ex is used when I got it and other then breaking an after market axel after 3 years of racing, its held up to everything I have thrown at it.
No one can argue that the ex is one of the most solid ATV’s ever built.
And probably one of the most sold ATV’s over the past 10 years and the longest in production ATV’s ever sold.

[muddy400EX]

Originally posted by platinum350
I'm really curious about the power difference between the 400EX and say the trx450 and/or yfz450. Is it a HUGE difference? I know the 450's are obviously faster, I'm just trying to gain a perspective to what I'm familiar with and that's a slightly modded 400EX & a raptor660.

I don't want too much quad for the trails...

ive had 3 400ex's. when i got my ltr i couldn't believe the difference.

my cousin has a 400ex still, when i ride his, it feels like a turtle after riding my ltr.

i don't know why people are complaining about maintenance on 450's, it's just the basic stuff, take care of your ride and it will take care of you. mine is an 07, and hasnt had any issues, besides a dead battery in the winter

i know this, i could never go back to a 400 after having my zuke

and for the raptor comparison, a 660 doesn't feel any faster than mine, a 700 has some more power, but its taller and narrower. making it more tipsy

[slightlybent47]

I wouldn’t say any of them are bad, but I have seen my friends put lots more money keeping there 450’s going then I have on my ex.
I’m sure many 450’s last a long time if taken care of.
Just remember you may have to live with your decision for a long time, so ride a few if you can, and make up your own mind.

[mineralgrey01gt]

My 3rd gear has never been changed, original tranny since 07 so it doesnt always happen that way. KFX is a joke, yfz's arent bad and honda's feel like a dog to me

[platinum350]

haha man, it's really going to boil down to me getting on one of these 450's to really see how they perform. I think after that I'll quickly know which way to go.

And your right slightlybent47, it'll most likely be a decision I'll live with for a while. I don't plan on selling my next quad anytime soon!

Also, regarding the Raptor 660 comparison... how about torque compared to a 450? I hit a jump on that 660 and went sailing! Granite I wasn't used to the power gain compared to my 400 but man that was a little much. I'm assuming these newer 450's probably have a similar power/torque feeling compared to those 660 raptors.

[platinum350]

One last question....

How does the TRX450 perform in the trails, is it a good trail bike? I read you have to really work the clutch a lot because the bike likes high revs and prefers to go fast which can be difficult in the trails at times.

[slightlybent47]

The few Honda 450’s I have ridden seem to have a much crispier throttle response then my ex, even after the mods to the ex and I like that about them.
I’m sure a good rider could deal with what ever they ride and get use to it and not have too much trouble riding any of them.
One thought though, with a highly modded ex you may have an over heating problem on trails where you go slow and don’t get good air flow to keep it cool.
Water cooling may work better on trails and slow riding, unless the ex is stock, then there bullet proof.
A stock ex has more motor then it has suspension, so a stock motor on a built suspension may do well for you.

If I was going to ride a MX track most of the time I would seriously consider a 450.
But for trail riding, I think the ex fits the bill.

[slightlybent47]

If the legs are too long on a 450, you could play with the gearing and get it where you like it. That way you won’t need to feather the clutch so much on tight trails.

I have heard but I don’t know if its true, but I heard the 450 don’t like it when you use the motor for decelerating into corners, and if they don’t and that’s your riding stile, then you may want to find out if it’s true or a myth.

[Flyin_250r]

I may have missed it, if it was stated, but what is your budget? I think that determines a lot as well

[slightlybent47]

Originally posted by Flyin_250r
I may have missed it, if it was stated, but what is your budget? I think that determines a lot as well


Good point, also leave yourself so room for good safety gear.

[muddy400EX]

Originally posted by platinum350
One last question....

How does the TRX450 perform in the trails, is it a good trail bike? I read you have to really work the clutch a lot because the bike likes high revs and prefers to go fast which can be difficult in the trails at times.

i dont know why you would have to work the clutch alot, 450's have tons of torque. ltr's are more of a revver than the honda, and i don't have any problems. and trails are 90% of what i ride.

like bent said, try to ride some and see what you prefer. you may like the calmer feel of a 400, or you may like the powerful snap of a 450

[KKiowaTJ]

Originally posted by platinum350
Thanks guys, all your comments were very helpful!!
Thanks for clarification CJM.

Btw, I'm 6'1" so definitely looking for something comfortable.

I had no idea the dealer will let you test ride a quad, is this true? Otherwise I think I'll look at some on CL to test ride like KKiowaTJ mentioned. BTW, KKiowaTJ besides my past 400ex all I've ever rode was 2 strokes too. It's a new ball game out there with all these thumpers!


Comming from a 2 stroke, You will be able to find a quad that will suit you well. All have differnt torque and egronomics. Im also 6'4 so i have always been limited. My favorite was an old 87' J-arm banshee.

Some dealers will. I lucked out and a friend owns a kawi/zuk/KTM shop so i got to try a good deal of quads out along with "test" riding them to ensure they were fixed etc. I cant say all but most have a demo model(s).

But CL would be the best bet. Find out if you want a 450 or 400, Then go around and find the best set-up close to what you would do so $$ mod's are minimal.
I wanted a stock 00' 400ex and searched until i found the "one" i guess you could call it. I would like all the bells and whistles, But for my riding style and im more of a trail/hill climber, Its wasnt needed.

If you go 450, Ease into it until you get the feel. But comming from 2 strokes, You will adapt to them faster plus your old 400 seat time.

[platinum350]

Thanks again fellas!! Good suggestions, I'm going to look at a couple and go from there. I just remembered that I was looking to change up to a honda 450 from my 400 a while ago but I was riding much harder than I plan on doing now. Either way, I think it's in my best interest to try out a 450.


Flyin_250r: I am kinda open to budget but I'd prefer to spend around $2K for a 400 and figure $2500 - 3000 for a 450.

On top of that, definitely need that safety gear...helmet, boots, pants etc. Still have my chest protector. BTW, has anyone tried that Fox Titan Jacket? That thing looks bad *****.

[slightlybent47]

Originally posted by platinum350
Thanks again fellas!! Good suggestions, I'm going to look at a couple and go from there. I just remembered that I was looking to change up to a honda 450 from my 400 a while ago but I was riding much harder than I plan on doing now. Either way, I think it's in my best interest to try out a 450.


Flyin_250r: I am kinda open to budget but I'd prefer to spend around $2K for a 400 and figure $2500 - 3000 for a 450.

On top of that, definitely need that safety gear...helmet, boots, pants etc. Still have my chest protector. BTW, has anyone tried that Fox Titan Jacket? That thing looks bad *****.


I see some of the kids wearing a vest that looks like the kind that bull riders wear. It protects the ribs better then just a plane chest protector.
I likda like them and may try one out soon. The only down fall is if there too hot in the summer.
Remember if you want or plan on getting a neck brace like a Leatt brace, they don’t fit well with all chest protectors.

[platinum350]

Originally posted by slightlybent47
I see some of the kids wearing a vest that looks like the kind that bull riders wear. It protects the ribs better then just a plane chest protector.
I likda like them and may try one out soon. The only down fall is if there too hot in the summer.
Remember if you want or plan on getting a neck brace like a Leatt brace, they don’t fit well with all chest protectors.

You have to check out the Fox Titan Jacket! I saw it while looking at quads and the parts said everyone loves them. They're supposedly really comfortable too.
I thought about the Leatt before but still not sure about a neck brace. Do you wear one all the time? Just can't make up my mind if I'll wear one while trail riding...

[slightlybent47]

Absolutely, I wear one on every ride, and I love it.
It was a bit cumbersome at first but now I can’t ride without it.
I have had the misfortune of testing it out for myself and I do believe it worked great.
I could tell my helmet was hitting the leatt braces as I was tumbling along the ground and could feel it working. So yes it really works.
The brace is mainly to keep your helmet from hitting your collar bone, that’s what breaks collar bones is the helmet.
If set up properly it does restrict your head movement somewhat when riding, especially turning your head and looking behind you, but I learned to drop my shoulder when I want to look back and it works for me.

I wear everything I can for protection and feel comfortable with it on. If I don’t wear something that I’m used to, I feel naked and unprotected and I don’t like it.

Its kind of like wearing a set belt, I never liked wearing it but now I’m use to it and I don’t mind.

I do like the vest that are getting popular and I think they may offer more protection, especially on the sides where conventional type chest protectors don’t.

[slightlybent47]

I roll out in the morning to our first race of the year and I’ll ask some of the riders that wear the new vest, what brand and where they got them and I’ll let you know Monday when I get back.

[CJM]

If your racing I think its very important to wear every piece of gear imaginable to keep you safe. The chances of a wreck when racing are much greater than just riding along the trails-but accidents can of course happen anywhere.

I tried the whole neck brace and chest protector thing-just feels uncomfortable to me. I also wear regular workboots as no matter what over the calf boot I tried I didnt like them. Ill say however that I always wear a helmet and I refuse to ride without nerf bars after almost running over my foot a few times.

[muddy400EX]

Originally posted by CJM
If your racing I think its very important to wear every piece of gear imaginable to keep you safe. The chances of a wreck when racing are much greater than just riding along the trails-but accidents can of course happen anywhere.

I tried the whole neck brace and chest protector thing-just feels uncomfortable to me. I also wear regular workboots as no matter what over the calf boot I tried I didnt like them. Ill say however that I always wear a helmet and I refuse to ride without nerf bars after almost running over my foot a few times.

if you give the riding boots time, you will adjust. i can't ride without my boots now, it feels wierrrrrd

[CJM]

Originally posted by muddy400EX
if you give the riding boots time, you will adjust. i can't ride without my boots now, it feels wierrrrrd

I tried, I highly dislike boots higher than 8" anyways.

[muddy400EX]

Originally posted by CJM
I tried, I highly dislike boots higher than 8" anyways.

ya i hear ya. i remember when i first started wearing them, i thought there was no way i could ride with them. now if i don't have them on, i feel incomplete.lol

[platinum350]

Originally posted by slightlybent47
Absolutely, I wear one on every ride, and I love it.
It was a bit cumbersome at first but now I can’t ride without it.
I have had the misfortune of testing it out for myself and I do believe it worked great.
I could tell my helmet was hitting the leatt braces as I was tumbling along the ground and could feel it working. So yes it really works.
The brace is mainly to keep your helmet from hitting your collar bone, that’s what breaks collar bones is the helmet.
If set up properly it does restrict your head movement somewhat when riding, especially turning your head and looking behind you, but I learned to drop my shoulder when I want to look back and it works for me.

I wear everything I can for protection and feel comfortable with it on. If I don’t wear something that I’m used to, I feel naked and unprotected and I don’t like it.

Its kind of like wearing a set belt, I never liked wearing it but now I’m use to it and I don’t mind.

I do like the vest that are getting popular and I think they may offer more protection, especially on the sides where conventional type chest protectors don’t.

I'm actually big into protective gear, almost superstitiously so. I've always worn helmet, chest protector, knee pads & MX boots and whenever I skipped wearing one (which was rarely) sure enough I wished I would've worn them which would've prevented some minor injury.

Maybe I should incorporate the neck brace, I'm sure I'd get used to it.

[platinum350]

Originally posted by slightlybent47
I roll out in the morning to our first race of the year and I’ll ask some of the riders that wear the new vest, what brand and where they got them and I’ll let you know Monday when I get back.

Cool man, thanks! Good luck tomorrow!!

[platinum350]

I love riding with riding boots too. Not sure what aspect you don't like CJM but what I do is lather a new pair of boots up with - damn, I forget what the stuff is called, it's like a leather polish but it's for breaking in leather and waterproofing it - and wear the boots around the house for a while. You may want to try that, make them more mobile.

[slightlybent47]

Originally posted by platinum350
I'm actually big into protective gear, almost superstitiously so. I've always worn helmet, chest protector, knee pads & MX boots and whenever I skipped wearing one (which was rarely) sure enough I wished I would've worn them which would've prevented some minor injury.

Maybe I should incorporate the neck brace, I'm sure I'd get used to it.


There are several deferent types out there now, I have the Leatt and there adjustable. I don’t know if the others are or not.
I’m sure the fit is important and what brand you choose may determine your neck size, comfort and what feels rite for you.
I think the more restrictive it is, would make it work better, but comfort and being able to ride with it on, will play into the rite fit.
About the only thing I don’t wear is elbow pads, they never stay put.

[slightlybent47]

Originally posted by platinum350
Cool man, thanks! Good luck tomorrow!!



Thanks, tomorrow is just practice, racing is on Sunday!