2005 build commenced :)

[Pittsburgh400ex]

Well i didnt think we'd have it all lined out already but got the list done and i started ordering today. Altogether in parts i'm around 2000$. The builder i've known for a while now and he's great so he cut me a deal on labor. I'm looking at having 2500-ish tiotal into this thing.

*CP 13:1 Piston kit
*Hotcam stage 3
*Kibblewhite complete spring kit
*Vortex X-10 Ignition
*New OEM crank
*New OEM head, hogged-out and polished by my guy
*All OEM replacement gaskets
*Complete Dasa 99DB full system
*Baldwin's needle

**Currently on motor to be transferred**

*Fluidyne Radiator
*Stanless brake lines
*Brand new Hinson clutch and internals


Already itching to get it done and nothing has even arrived yet. I'll post up some pics as it comes along. :D

[CJM]

Planning on running 100 in it?

Id also replace the valves at this time if that isnt already included in the port job. As well as the cam chain and tensioner just b/c.

[eastside 400]

if your not drag racing or doing a big bore i would drop down to a stg 2 cam...way better choice

[Pittsburgh400ex]

CJM:

Yes gonna be a racegas engine. 100 probably enough, i'm planning on c-12. I debated that for a while and decided to go with it. For most riding i'll just use my 426. If my 450 was my only quad, i wouldnt have done it.

He's going to look at the valvetrain and see what it looks like. Ordered the springs because that's a definate.

Eastside 400:

Have a stage 2 already in the 450 motor. Trying out this stage 3 for curisity really and my guy raves about it. If i end up not liking it, i will keep it for a future build and strow my stage 2 back in it. Simple changeover.

[punk rock kiel]

you dont need to run 100 for 13:1. i was running 93 octane for a while and when i just pulled mine apart, it was clean on the inside and no signs of damage or anything. i also tuned mine with a wideband tho.

[Pittsburgh400ex]

I;m no expert but i know the stock compression is 10.5:1. Spending 2500 on this thing i;m not going to chance losing it on cheap junk gas. So yea, running c-12

[Portuga]

i got a stage 3 on mine, and im about to drop back to a stage 2 cam. i got it like that, but i ride xc, and the stg 3 doesnt really work that good on mid. Top end the thing is brutal, with a stock bore at 14:1 on vp110.

[Pittsburgh400ex]

Portuga:

Yea i ordered it for the top end hit. Honestly i hate riding this thing in the woods anyway with all the clutching, thats why i got my 426. I'm drooling already waiting to get this thing out on some fireroads with some friends haha. Good input though, i kinda figured it wasnt gonna wanna rip my arms out till i got it wideopen.

[CJM]

Yea Pitts, since you have both like me you can pick and choose to take and not have to always spend. Im trying to make it run on pump just for ease of finding gas. Very few places here sell 100 octane and those that do arent close.

I find the right gearing is key for the woods. I dont have to clutch alot with my 04 but its all stock basically. IDK what its going to be like when I do the upgrades.

Course the trails I ride you can hit 3rd if not 4th in alot of spots.

@Kiel. 13:1 on pump gas is safe or no? I wanted to 12:1 on my 04 b/c of the detonation fear. But I do wonder 13:1 with the stage 2 hotcam it might have enough overlap with the valves to work I suppose. What were you running.

[Pittsburgh400ex]

CJM, did you see the goldenwest/duncan 450 in the dirt wheels not long ago? The build sheet on that bike is very very close to what i'm going to end up with. They ran straight c-12 on it to "have no fear of detonation and keep the running temp. down" I don't know if that means it's able to run on 93 or not, but for me, better safe than sorry. I believe that piston was just a 12.5:1 also.

[CJM]

Im sure I read it but I dont recall, dont have that issue laying about it seems either.

Honestly the jump from 12:1 to 13:1 wont be a huge increase imho Pitts. Worth it, maybe but the head unlocks most of the power a good port job is a must.

[Pittsburgh400ex]

Oh i totally agree and there isnt a doubt in my mind this guy knows what he's doing. He exclusively builds hondas, about 18 years exp. on them. He builds his own bikes and they run like raped apes. He's run flattrack now for about 15 years. I'm very curious to see how the Vortex performs, so many maps to choose from.

[CJM]

I wanna get a vortex too but man they aint cheap.

Let us know if its really worth it.

[punk rock kiel]

i ran sunoco 93 only in my quad and jetting was spot on around 70 degrees. even when i ran it down to 40 degrees the one weekend, it didnt act any different except it didnt like starting. the piston is sitting right in front of me and it shows no signs of any issues. its also a cp tho.
maybe if you live in high temp area, id say run vp or something but after seeing this, i will stick to 93 like always.

thats just my 2 cents and i trail ride and climb some hills, so i know whats doable

[Pittsburgh400ex]

I spent the extra dough and got the CP kit also, that could be why it ran good on 93 for you. I have a wiseco in 426 now and love it, have had JE's and will never buy one again.
For me it's worth running the c-12, overkill or not. Gives me piece of mind and it's not like i blow through 40 gallon a weekend anyore lol.


CJM, yea i did a double-take on the vortex, 499 for a cdi isnt just a drop in the bucket. My guy runs them and says it's the gamechanger. Tons of torque maps he says, as well as any other curve or powerband you'd want.

[CJM]

Im gonna try and find a used CDI or save it for later on.

@Kiel, that might also be why it lasted so well. It gets hot out there but its all coal and trails. Where I ride is basically dunes and it can be hot as hell, plus theres always trips to the dunes I really want to go too.

[punk rock kiel]

air cooled limits and water cooled limits are different. you running the c12 on the 400 isnt the safe idea, its the only way. 13:1 on water cooled is where people start to swap to maybe 50/50 mix and some still run 93. im pretty sure 93 octane doesnt have ethonal in it either, so its still completely good.
i only took my motor apart cause my crank bearings started to vibrate a little too much and i didnt want it to sieze.

[CJM]

I totally agree Kiel. Problem is if it does go south your SOL. Err on the side of caution ya know.

IDK lol, decisions, decisions

[Pittsburgh400ex]

the point is moot lol, i'm gonna run good gas. Even if i's for nothing more than piece of mind. And probably outside of sunoco, you'll neer find a "car" pump gas with no ethanyol

Lol fck it, i'll just replace everything to run E-85. (yea right)


gotta say though, that e-85 powered YFZ dirtwheels tested was badass. I think it made like 77 horse if i recall correctly.

[CJM]

Sunoco round here stopped selling it cept for one station sadly.

I was more curious myself if it could be done.

[Pittsburgh400ex]

well i guinea pigged my 416 JE kit not gonna do it on this one lol. 12.5:1 in a 400 way too much for 93, found that out the hard way.

And remember even if it can be done, it doesn't mean you should do it.

[CJM]

Air cooled vs water cooled tho.

Sorry to hijack.

[punk rock kiel]

e85 is nice but its easier finding gas without ethonal. haha. you also burn alot more fuel, so mileage will drop off alot and if you go somewhere without e85 and need to fill up, your f'd.

[eastside 400]

depending on alititude, air temp and build specs-you can run 93 with a 13:1 compression...i run 13.25 in my 250f with 93 with no problems..every build is different though so if you can afford to mix 50/50 with race gas, it definitely wont hurt it.

as for the vortex, ive used one for several seasons and then switched to the standard non-programmable dyna and the seat of the pants feel was the same to me...the vortex is way overpriced, i would get the programmable dyna and the software and take it to get tuned with a custom ignition map if possible, i personally would never spend 500 on another vortex, in no way is it a "game changer"

what kind/size carb are you using?

[Pittsburgh400ex]

Well i bought the.vortex a while ago so ljttle late heh. Sorry it didnt work for.ya, im going by what my builder says and hes never steered me.wrong or really even exwggerated anything. Maybe the way he.builds his motors is what makes the.vortex awesome. Wont know till its finished. Like it it's was said earlier, every build is different.

That said eastside..the input is appriciated.
:cool:

[Pittsburgh400ex]

You asked about the carb too: We arent positive on that yet. First going to run the stocker with some baldwin needles and see. If its lacking i will go from there. Recommendations?

[eastside 400]

get an FCR and have it bored or taper bored...The FCR is a huge improvement on throttle reponse and when its bored you can pick up some decent HP...even a stock size FCR will make the bike feel way faster due to the throttle response

[Pittsburgh400ex]

Lol, i asked him bout the FCR and he just laughed and said "get off those forums." He said he was planning on throwing one on and not telling me till i rode it, he's got like 6 laying around he said. :D

Got my Dasa in yesterday and glad i spent the coin on it. Very nice i thought. Didn't think i'd see a nicer made system after i got my Sparks.

[eastside 400]

well theres a reason that every stock carbed mx bike and carb'ed quad has an FCR...but whatever