2013 Trx450r

[B.C.#11TRX400EX]

Honda just released the new 2013 CRF450R, CRF250L and everybody else is releasing there 2013 line-up, but when is Honda gonna release the 2013 TRX450R? Are they at least going to change things on it? or just keep changing the colors and really nothin new? Does anybody know anythin?

[Rohr397]

There are all kinds of rumors about a new trx450r but the same rumors have been floating around since 2010... Ill believe it when I see it.

Honestly they gotta do something to stay competitive but it doesn't seem like its much of a priority to Honda. You've got a 2013 Ds450 that comes stock with Fox Floats, ITP quadcross tires, full netted nerf bars, oversized handlebars and Beadlock rims. There's no way that the current Trx450r is gonna be able to compete with that. It'd be way more expensive to get a Trx450r to the same level as that Can-Am. And who knows what the others will have in store for 2013?

It's hard to tell, this year is really going to be a turning point for the sport quad market and Honda needs to put an updated 450r out. At the same time the fact they didn't even release a 450r between 2009 and 2012 makes me think they might not do it. I hope they do something but my gut tells me they won't.

[B.C.#11TRX400EX]

I agree, but they could of been testing or whatever on the new machine in that time to make it perfect, but I think they should do somethin because it needs a new version

[Rohr397]

Oh I don't disagree, Joe Byrd and several other Honda riders have said the quad exists. It's just a matter of how long Honda chooses to wait before they release it.

[B.C.#11TRX400EX]

Yup, I bet when they do tho the price will be pretty expensive if it has a lot of new stuff on it haha

[desratt]

ooo g0d not another one of these threads

[Rohr397]

Originally posted by desratt
ooo g0d not another one of these threads

Lol it's every year I swear! See if Honda would release a new 450r this discussion wouldn't be happening! ;)

[Lynch01ex]

go to nationals and see how many people are on a honda. if i were them wouldnt change a thing

[d3ktrix]

Originally posted by Lynch01ex
go to nationals and see how many people are on a honda. if i were them wouldnt change a thing

Yeah but the only thing stock on the hondas they are riding is the plastics, frame and engine cases.

A stock honda is useless for MX. The LTRs, KTMs and DS's rip right out of the box.

[Rohr397]

^Exactly. I love Honda's but when I can afford to get back on a 450 it won't be a Trx (unless they update the 450r this year). I can't afford to build a Trx450r up, so I'm gonna buy a Ds with Fox Floats stock for a little extra and on top of that enjoy the amazing factory support for all amateur riders who purchase and race a new Ds.

I don't want to stop riding Honda's but I don't have 15,000 to drop on a full blown race quad and neither do most the amateurs I know. I don't have the family support or anything like that to go do this, I've got a $9 an hour job and starting at the end of this year I'll have the privilege of financing to get me off my 12 year old trusty steed.

[hrc450er]

9,699 sticker on that can am. I bet they wont sell very many.

[blacknblue#2]

Originally posted by hrc450er
9,699 sticker on that can am. I bet they wont sell very many.

Theyll sell....Can Am supports the sprt through contingency...Plus you give 6 or 7 for a honda off the showroom floor and your at the 9000 with the 3 shocks. Thats not countin the tires, a-arms etc etc

[B.C.#11TRX400EX]

if they dont o well i guess, everybody seems to go back to the current 450r anyway so if they do come out with one haha people might still ride the old one

[400thacker]

Whatever they come out with will top everything else on the market. Personally I wouldn't want to spend 10g on a can am that everyone else can buy off the show room floor. The whole point is to have something thats unique and personalized. IMO Honda still makes the most dependable quads out there and I believe they will continue to do so.

But I AGREE THEY NEED TO RELEASE THE BEAST! A new TRX is well past due!

[B.C.#11TRX400EX]

i totally agree!! personlized is best

[quad2xtreme]

Not sure why people don't rag on Suzuki. You can't buy a new LTR450 at all so why talk them up?

[Rohr397]

I'm not sure what the length of time was exactly but Suzuki got into pretty big trouble with the EPA for the Cherry Bomb and they're not allowed to import any of the 450's. I don't know the details, but that's what I was told by the guys at the Suzuki shop when I was looking at the used ones.

[B.C.#11TRX400EX]

ill tell ya'll one thing Sazuki's and Kawasaki's to me suck, but maybe some of ya'll have had good luck with em, all the ones ive been around are fast but they just dont last as long as Honda's or Yamaha's. In my opinion Honda's are they best, they last long and run good, yeah you might have to personalize it quite a bit but doin that is fun and you can build it the way you want it.

[Pacheco_450r]

Originally posted by B.C.#11TRX400EX
ill tell ya'll one thing Sazuki's and Kawasaki's to me suck, but maybe some of ya'll have had good luck with em, all the ones ive been around are fast but they just dont last as long as Honda's or Yamaha's. In my opinion Honda's are they best, they last long and run good, yeah you might have to personalize it quite a bit but doin that is fun and you can build it the way you want it.


To add on to that, a lot of people say how much you have to do to make the Honda race ready. But if you look in the higher race classes even the guys running yfzr's and suzukies (race ready bikes) have just as many additions/after market parts as the Honda guys. Very few use the stock equipment whether the bike is tagged as being race ready or not.

[CJM]

Ill chime in with my 2 cents:

Where I ride I come across alot of people, the ones on a honda generally dont have any issues. Ones on yamaha or suzuki or whatever, generally have alot of issues. We all ride alot, just seems like those of us on a honda arent rebuilding them all the time. So far I counted 3 suzukis with blown 3rd gear and a few yamahas with valve problems and the oiling issues.

I ride the hell outta my EX and my buddy has royally beat his 450r up and they still keep on going no matter what.

[B.C.#11TRX400EX]

i agree with both ya'll!! when people say quads are race ready from the factory im thinkin well people dont hardly use those parts anyway so when ya buy like a $10 grand quad and put all that crap on it you might as well buy a Honda that'll last with all that and it'll be cheaper. Haha i guess people like spending money on bad stuff hahaha, yeah CJM those EX's are a beast i never had 1 problem all year last year and i rode the hell of it and its still goin with no problems, i got to say though my 450r has had zero problems too just the jetting was off put when i got all that done it runs like a champ, if i had the choice again to pick either a new 400ex or a new 450r id pick the 450r, back then i didnt really no how to ride but now that i have the experience its a no brainer, u really dont need the reverse too much, i only see that i need it when im hunting but besides that the extra power a 450 gives is well worth it.

[Rohr397]

I will say the Kfx450r is actually pretty nice, not my cup of coffee but ehhh I can't hate on them. I like'em a lot but idk, I like my Honda. I can't say much about the Can-Am, there's only three dealers in the state so there aren't too many out there, but when I see them they run great. I guess the attraction of "race ready" for me is the fact I am not an A-class racer and nobody around here can afford the aftermarket stuff unless they run pro class. Heck we got one rider in ProAm who takes a few laps since he doesn't race anyone. I love personalized but I don't have money for personalized so I make due with what I can.

[B.C.#11TRX400EX]

that sounds about like me i put a little on it and thats good until i want to drop the big bucks on it

[Pacheco_450r]

In regards to Can-Am, I know people may get defensive about this, but I haven't heard much of anything good about racing them hard. I personally know someone who was the team manager for can-am a couple years ago and he said it was a nightmare keeping them held together. Whether it was frames being destroyed or motors frying, the list goes on. Basically he said if you aren't riding for factory can-am you can't afford one. Granted that's pro guys abusing those bikes, but still, that doesn't impress me much. Makes me satisfied to keep racing my old reliable 05 450r :)

[Kawie450r]

Oh boy here we go again with all the bs honda humpers that think every other quad except the trx is junk. This **** is so annoying. Every damn quad has issues i dont care what make it is. Ive seen plenty of trx's blow up and other **** break on them but i dont go around saying they are the worst quad. And i have had my kfx for 4 years with out a single issue with it motor wise or chassis wise but that also doesnt mean its the best quad ever nor do i say it is. Ride what you have and enjoy it and keep your mouth shut about what other people choose to ride.

[B.C.#11TRX400EX]

Exactly!!

[Rohr397]

Originally posted by Kawie450r
Oh boy here we go again with all the bs honda humpers that think every other quad except the trx is junk. This **** is so annoying. Every damn quad has issues i dont care what make it is. Ive seen plenty of trx's blow up and other **** break on them but i dont go around saying they are the worst quad. And i have had my kfx for 4 years with out a single issue with it motor wise or chassis wise but that also doesnt mean its the best quad ever nor do i say it is. Ride what you have and enjoy it and keep your mouth shut about what other people choose to ride.

Yeah I definitely agree with you, they've all got their issues. It really comes down to what you want to deal with based on what you know. As for your Kawi, see there's another Kawi owner who's satisfied and problem free. Congrats man, honestly my Honda wouldn't have even lasted that long! The topend was fried after two years and the valves never quite seemed right, I loved it to death but I didn't have the money to throw at the motor when my shocks had all blown.

In all fairness I think it's safe to say that there are some quads to be a little more afraid of though. I've got quite a few friends on Rmz's and just as many on Ltr's. They've all rebuilt their motors over three times in two years and not one bike shifts right. With that kind of track record I think I've gotta right to be suspicious of Suzuki.

[Kawie450r]

Right. There is deffiently quads that have less known issues than others. My and my buddy get nothing but **** constantly about our kfx's but yet we are the only 2 in the group who have had NO issues with our quads. Just seems like all honda and yammi owners want to do is put down every person that doesnt ride what they want them to ride. Its just stupid and iggnorant. If your happy with your "bullet proof" honda than that is great. Does not mean you have to go around talking **** about every other brand. I personally like zuki's. Not so much the ltr because of the tranny issues. But it is a beast of a mx quad. Alot comes down to maintence as well which alot of people do not do. So just beacuse somemone sees a kawi or zuki or whatever blow up doesnt mean its junk. For all you know that person could have never cleaned and oiled the filter. Never did oil changes etc.

Sorry for the long rant. This stuff just annoys the hell out of. We all have a love for the same sport but its constant childish **** talking all the time.

[Rohr397]

Yeah it is really frustrating. The sport is certainly better than it used to be BUT we are still not looking so good right now. The last thing we should be doing is tearing each other apart, riders gotta stick together right now.

As far as people hating on Kfx's, they clearly don't know the quad or the brand lol. People just like Yamaha's and Honda's a lot more because there's more of them out there. I have to drive an hour to the nearest Kawasaki dealer, there's only three or four left in the state, and they rarely have a Kfx. On the other hand there are four or five Honda/Yamaha dealerships within 30 minutes of my house. There used to be only two Suzuki dealerships but they're growing now since the big one sold off their models to a bunch of the other dealerships. I'd say that definitely is a factor in what people buy, and a lot of people are too biased to even consider the other side. There's a demand for the other brands, but no supply, so everyone ends up on a Honda or Yamaha and then they think it's the best. I used to be that way till I looked into them deeper. Every 450 out there is good in it's own way and it depends on the rider.

I know for me the reason I stick to Honda is the way it rides. They just have a different feel than the others. Same goes for all brands. Each one succeeds at providing certain characteristics that their riders desire. I know us Honda guys appreciate the low end power, the 250r genetics and the quality of the quads. While arguably not the best, they seem to provide a consistent level of quality and comfort, there's never really anything funky. That being said though I don't hate the other brands, I like them a lot. I just feel comfortable with what I've got so I stick to it.

[chronicsmoke]

Originally posted by Kawie450r
Sorry for the long rant. This stuff just annoys the hell out of. We all have a love for the same sport but its constant childish **** talking all the time.
Yours has only survived so long because of the TRX450R Battery!! lol jk

I had a stock Kawi too, it was a fun quad, choked up from the factory, but an awesome trail bike in stock form.. I kept blowing fuses, never tracked the issue down I ended up trading for a TRX250R set up for MX with LSR/Elka +$1000. I just didn't want to put the same money into the KFX that I put into my TRX450 to make it competative.


Originally posted by Rohr397
I know for me the reason I stick to Honda is the way it rides. They just have a different feel than the others. Same goes for all brands. Each one succeeds at providing certain characteristics that their riders desire. I know us Honda guys appreciate the low end power, the 250r genetics and the quality of the quads. While arguably not the best, they seem to provide a consistent level of quality and comfort, there's never really anything funky. That being said though I don't hate the other brands, I like them a lot. I just feel comfortable with what I've got so I stick to it.

imo I don't find the 400ex or the 450r feel at all like the 250r.. it's it's own animal lol. It feels like your sitting on the ground compared to the other two.

[B.C.#11TRX400EX]

There ya go exactly anybody ride what you want, me personally just hasnt seen any other brand last as long as Honda's, im not talkin **** on anybody, thats just my personal experience. Every brand no matter what it is is goin to break down eventually depending on how hard you ride it, these parts on these machines sure arn't industructible. If i didnt ride honda or yamaha my 3rd choice would be a Kawasaki, i dont really no much about the new 450r's but the KFX400 or Z400 (same thing) have not lasted that long compared to Honda, my buddy has a KFX400 and all he has is problems, my cousins friend has a Z400 and hes rebuilt his motor twice in one year!! so like i said thats just my personal experience, Honda's have lasted for me and been reliable so im not complaining, maybe ya'll have had good luck with your other quads, maybe all the ones ive seen were lemons idk, just my thoughts

[Kawie450r]

Really? Thats weird the kfx and ltz400 where pretty solid reliable quads. Did your buddys maintain them? My friend had a 03 z400 and the only issue he has was the frame but got it replaced under warranty. First year had swingarm and frame issues. Then he moved to az and it sat outside for 3 years with a tarp half covering it and he came back to visit and we cleaned the carb and put a new battery in and it fired right up haha i was amazed to say the least. He didnt really ever maintain the thing either.

I have nothing against hondas at all. The power that you can get from them is awesome. Fully built they can handle quite abit. Which other brands tend to suffer sometimes holding the same amount of power.
If i didnt ride a kawi i would be on a honda. But for me the ergos are perfect on the kawi for my riding style.

But like said before they seriously do need a updated quad.

[B.C.#11TRX400EX]

my friend with the kfx does cause im there usually when he does stuff with it, he has a track at his house and i ride with him on it, for the past year its just been me riding cause he hasnt money to fix the quad, he had transmission problems, the motor blew twice, somethin happened to the radiater but i dont remember as for the guy that owned the z400 he kept it up in the best shape he could he just kept havin motor problems

[Kawie450r]

Oh I see. That's to bad usually they are solid quads.

[B.C.#11TRX400EX]

yeah idk what the deal was

[Rohr397]

The only problem we ever had with the z400/kfx400 was the starter motors. They went out a lot so I was always towing my friends at the dunes to bump start them. Pretty nice quads though, not to take away from Kawasaki but good or bad they're not true Kawasaki's so I don't compare the Kfx450r to the Kfx400, even if Kawi used some of the notes from the Kfx400 for their quad. Looking at the Kx450f dirtbike, there's no doubt the motor is solid in the Kfx450r. My buddy race A-class and won at the Nationals on a completely stock 08 Kx450f. That bike was awesome, only thing that ever killed it was a shop fire, now it's just a hunk melted aluminum and steel that doesn't resemble a dirtbike whatsoever. :(

[Kawie450r]

Ya thats true the kfx400 was a suzuki with green or orange plastics.

[B.C.#11TRX400EX]

thats true, those kx450f dirt bikes are beast, like i said Kawi would be my third or second choice after Honda. The Kawasaki enigines in Mowers are really good they last forever so i cant say nothin bad about that. i guess what im sayin is pretty much i hate sazuki either way i look at it, Kawasaki's arnt bad machines, but ive heard so many bad things about a sazuki i dont want to own one. Ktm's are ok they just have a lot of electical problems i hear, but there really fast machines, i dont no anybody down here in Oklahoma that rides a Can-Am besides the racers all my buddys ride Honda's, Yamaha's, Kawasaki's and a Sazuki. Those are pretty much the main ones that have been around awhile

[Kawie450r]

Ya i like them all pretty much. Just my choice was green. The aluminum frame, efi and reverse sold it for me.

Ktms i love but nervous about the engines lasting. (The sx anyway) Which is the only ktm i would buy.

Can am i like alot to especially how much they support the sport. But The frame makes me leary even though the replacent parts are easy to get i dont want a quad i have to change frame parts on constantly.

Ive always liked the honda it just doesnt suit my riding style as well as the kawi does.

Yamis just feel to flat for me. Like im sitting on a big 2x4. Just uncomfy IMO.

The ltr is a nice all around quad but its to big and bulky to me. Things handle like they are on rails though.

[Rohr397]

^I can pretty much agree with all that.

I would take any of them right now though, as much as I love my quad, a 2000 Trx400ex with a cracked frame is not my dream quad. I'd love a nice new 450 haha.

[Kawie450r]

Originally posted by Rohr397
^I can pretty much agree with all that.

I would take any of them right now though, as much as I love my quad, a 2000 Trx400ex with a cracked frame is not my dream quad. I'd love a nice new 450 haha.

Hahah ya but you have the most reliable engine everrrrr.

[B.C.#11TRX400EX]

are the BWRproductions kid by any chance? he has a 2000 400ex

[Rohr397]

Yeah that's me haha, I'm not a kid though haha I'm almost 18 :rolleyes:

It is reliable but between the frame crack and some questionable things happening with the engine I'd like to have another 450. So hard cause my quad is setup perfect for me too :/

[B.C.#11TRX400EX]

haha o i didnt no that, you otta post another vid up soon, u do a pretty good job at it, yeah i like your ex its setup pretty good!! u might be able to get enough out of it for a good 450 but it def wont be new

[Rohr397]

Haha I've got savings and if I have to I'll finance.

[B.C.#11TRX400EX]

sweet!! cant wait to see what ya get

[Rohr397]

Haha thanks! I can't wait either, I know I sWitch quads a lot but this is a bit different this time.

Also there should be a new walkaround and vids up soon.

[CJM]

Tried riding a kfx450, rode real nice but the steering was kinda twitchy to me. Nice quad tho.

[HondaRacing83]

i LOVE kawis. When I get a 450 which I will sometime soon my first choice will be kawasaki. Then Honda. Having a reverse sold kawi for me being an xc racer lol. I just really like how kawasakis feel to. Hondas 2nd to that. i dont like yamis or how they feel. Suzuki was plain weird to me. id really like to try can am or ktm xc soon though.

[B.C.#11TRX400EX]

Cool!! Guys to be honest you really dont need reverse, I hunt, fish, ride XC & MX and I dont really ever need it, when I had my EX I used to think I needed it but since I've had the 450r Im usually goin forward anyway and if I need to turn around ill just spin it around real fast not really that big a deal to me

[Rohr397]

Originally posted by B.C.#11TRX400EX
Cool!! Guys to be honest you really dont need reverse, I hunt, fish, ride XC & MX and I dont really ever need it, when I had my EX I used to think I needed it but since I've had the 450r Im usually goin forward anyway and if I need to turn around ill just spin it around real fast not really that big a deal to me

x2

[B.C.#11TRX400EX]

So if the new 450 has it I could care less haha its nice to have in some situations but naa if i need to ill just pick it up and move it

[dpitek151]

As far as a release date... Honda warehouses are empty of 450s! AND I have 2 more then reliable sources saying that as soon as the current nationwide dealership inventory hits a certain percentage Honda will then announce the release date. They are already crated up and immediately ready to ship too!!

[desratt]

ok phantom rider. you go

[walker054]

new 2013. hell i'm still riding my 2004 with a 14:1 Baldwin piston and HRC cam. why spend any money on a new one, upgraded the cam at dealer when purchased, piston in 05.

[motomadman]

The new CRF is sweet. Stock air fork.

http://motocrossactionmag.com/Main/News/5ab5b434-62cb-48b5-bdf7-8a1b5fa086e5.aspx

[Smoker]

I'm with walker054. Glad Honda is finally getting off their @ss (if they actually release it) and putting something new out there. Kudos to the folks who have the money to buy new but the aftermarket will take a minute to produce the parts to make it race worth plus it hasn't gotten any cheaper to build a bike. I know they are trying to make stuff more race ready buy it will still be far off where everyone has their present trx's built. Who knows if it will have the same stupid problems the 04's did. Anymore if I was going to buy new I would probably buy a Yamaha. They seem to be the only innovators still developing new technology in a slow economy. I wills always say, support the people that support your sport. Where's Honda been? Not developing quads or sponsoring teams.

[Black Sheep]

Honda just announced the 2013 ATV line up...the TRX 450R looks to be the same!!!

http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff223/motomanimal32/honda_trx450r_2013.jpg

[hrc450er]

Wow... Just wait til 2014 honda has new 450 just waiting lol. seriously though where is phantom at since he predicted a new one. I guess this one does have bold new graphics

[Rohr397]

FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU- :mad:

[blacknblue#2]

I don't know why I'm discouraged. But since I was gonna try to get back on a quad sometime in the near future I guess I was hoping try would actually make some changes. That special edition one is nasty and I don't mean good nasty I mean straight nasty lol.

[walker054]

WOW tri colored, like my 2004 even better now.

[B.C.#11TRX400EX]

Thats 7 years now, next year will probably be 8!!! Idk why they cant just make this one and there so called new one, If it has problems they can keep selling these, o well my 450 is runnin perfect anyway

[TWISTED]

BOLD NEW GRAPHICS FOR LIFE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[B.C.#11TRX400EX]

Haha yeah no kidding

[01boneless]

u guys dident think they would actully change it up did ya? lol

[zyoung04]

I would've atleast hoped to have seen FI on these models considering its been out on the bike for the past few years

[RosquistRacer39]

Hopefully they raised their price with all this new technology.....:huh

[DnB_racing]

Originally posted by zyoung04
I would've atleast hoped to have seen FI on these models considering its been out on the bike for the past few years why??? i would like to see them remove restrictions instead of adding.

in my mind less is better, Ive whittled my harness down to about 7 wires, and thats still more then needed, why add FI? most people have no problem beating all the so called newest and greatest technology, on 25 year old machines, with 80's technology, along with new designs in air flow for better porting, yes technology has helped make the 25 year old motors better, but they are still using the same old deigns

look at the new 350 cp 2 strokes cylinders putting out 68 hp, the only reason most arnt going much bigger (puma) is it would be to much motor to handle, unless its for hills or drags
a 431cc puma is almost 100 hp on a carb!!

too much regulations governing air and noise standards, ends up making a chocked up machine,

Im personally glad to see little change, honda's history has shown us, that...change from above usually means less performance
change isn't always better:devil:

[Rohr397]

All I was hoping for was a proven Crf450r motor and some more useful suspension. I like everything else the way it is, it works great it just needs something to keep it competitive in the market cause the guys who don't ride Honda's won't ever switch to a Trx450r unless it gets an update.

[B.C.#11TRX400EX]

Not true alot of riders switch back to Honda, its a great race quad just needs some updates to keep it goin

[01boneless]

Originally posted by B.C.#11TRX400EX
Not true alot of riders switch back to Honda, its a great race quad just needs some updates to keep it goin
you need more then some updates to be "really " ready to race. you will spend more on a honda to get it race ready then you will on a ltr,kfx,yfz,or can am.

[D Bergstrom]

Originally posted by 01boneless
you need more then some updates to be "really " ready to race. you will spend more on a honda to get it race ready then you will on a ltr,kfx,yfz,or can am.

Guess it depends on what type of racing you are doing. For me racing desert, I would have to spend the same to get any of them ready, but the Honda is probably the cheapest to buy in the first place. Also, I know the Honda will get me to the finish line!

That is the biggest problem with a "race ready" quad, race ready for what? MX, XC, TT, desert, etc. Lets say someone produces a race ready quad for mx, will it be race ready for eveyone? Of course not. What rider weight and skill level will it be setup for from the factory? There will never be a truely "race ready" quad in my opinion.

As far as the 2013 450R being unchanged, doesn't really matter to me, I have no plans to buy one. Even with a major redesign, it still would not be any better then my current 2004 450R for the type of racing I do, I would still have to sink a bunch of money into it to get it to the same level as my 2004. Even if I was interested in a new 450 class machine, I would still chose a Honda. As I said, I would still have to spend a bunch of money to any quad race ready for the type of racing I do.

That being said, I would like EFI though, that is probably the only thing that would make me buy a new 450R. I love the EFI on my 700XX's.

Doug

[zyoung04]

Originally posted by DnB_racing
why??? i would like to see them remove restrictions instead of adding.

in my mind less is better, Ive whittled my harness down to about 7 wires, and thats still more then needed, why add FI? most people have no problem beating all the so called newest and greatest technology, on 25 year old machines, with 80's technology, along with new designs in air flow for better porting, yes technology has helped make the 25 year old motors better, but they are still using the same old deigns

look at the new 350 cp 2 strokes cylinders putting out 68 hp, the only reason most arnt going much bigger (puma) is it would be to much motor to handle, unless its for hills or drags
a 431cc puma is almost 100 hp on a carb!!

too much regulations governing air and noise standards, ends up making a chocked up machine,

Im personally glad to see little change, honda's history has shown us, that...change from above usually means less performance
change isn't always better:devil:

Ill tell ya why......Its a lot easier to go out and turn the key and fires on the 2nd turn everytime unless its a kick.....I've been there and done that in the winter and when I felt like doin dog nuts in the snow and we all know how hard a carb cold engine is to start sometimes.....the FI makes this a lot easier to deal with.....times change yeah their product is proven to be good but its looks like most are wanting a little something different

[B.C.#11TRX400EX]

Doug you are exactly right!! if Honda came out with everything on it for MX then people would change that stuff anyway to the stuff they like. i think if honda put FI on it, it would be better but they dont need to go and put a lot on it anyway, aluminum frame would be cool for MXer's but some people would probably destroy it haha (me) but idk thats my thoughts, if they did i wouldnt buy one for a long time anyway, mines in perfect shape and i got it set-up for XC almost perfect right now.

[DnB_racing]

Originally posted by zyoung04
Ill tell ya why......Its a lot easier to go out and turn the key and fires on the 2nd turn everytime unless its a kick.....I've been there and done that in the winter and when I felt like doin dog nuts in the snow and we all know how hard a carb cold engine is to start sometimes.....the FI makes this a lot easier to deal with.....times change yeah their product is proven to be good but its looks like most are wanting a little something different Never had any starting problems that fuel injection would have helped, I ALLWAYS prep my quad for whatever riding conditions im going to encounter, if it wasn't going to start FI wouldnt have made any difference,

I choose performance over "easy" any day, im not afraid to work a little to have better performance

Ive owned both carb and FI, and im able to get much more performance out of my engines with the carb and yes I do know how to program a power commander, but the amount your able to tune a FI is limited by the restrictions locked in to the programmer,and with the different maps the EPA allows you to run

Ive had just about every type of quad come through my shop, and have ridden almost all of them, and I can honestly say the best performing ones didnt have FI,

sure for a leisurely ride in the field with the kids FI would do, but these are supposedly race quads,FI has no place in the race quad market, unless your a factory rider that doesn't care about being able to work on there own quads,and getting the most out of it themselves. but for anyone wrecking there own quads FI will just be another limiting factor, I sure wouldnt want to be a desert rider depending on all the sensors and connections and wires and electronics associated with FI,Just way too many more chances for problems

I guess its all in what your looking for, im looking for as much performance i can tweak out of my motors, without bringing to a dealer, if your looking for a easier putt on weekends with the wife and kids then put FI in a ex and leave the race quads alone!!:devil:

try programing for no air box, race exhaust, high compression, ported over sized valves, never mind if your advanced in timing,, it just doesnt have the capability for most users to perform these adjustments, or try oxygenated fuels or alcohol, see how that one does...

[Rohr397]

See I don't want aluminum cause it's harder to find a welder for, and on top of that the vibrations are worse. I love the way steel soaks up vibes and bumps!

EFI is really cool but its hard to tune and expensive to get tuners for. Unless the put progammable EFI's with O2 sensors on I could care less about it.

The only reason I want "race ready" is because suspension is out of my reach money wise. I want to be able to actually use stock parts to my advantage. Like the yfz450r has LT shocks stock, all you need to do is get a rebuild from RaceTech or something and you'll be golden. But the Trx shock isn't all that great even rebuilt.

[D Bergstrom]

Originally posted by DnB_racing
I sure wouldnt want to be a desert rider depending on all the sensors and connections and wires and electronics associated with FI,Just way too many more chances for problems

I am not worried about it, I know a few guys who race in the desert and have never had an EFI related problem. The 700XX has just a few Baja wins under its belt, also no EFI problems. Yes, there is mroe stuff that can go wrong, but I feel the benefits outweigh the minimal risk.


Originally posted by DnB_racing
try programing for no air box, race exhaust, high compression, ported over sized valves, never mind if your advanced in timing,, it just doesnt have the capability for most users to perform these adjustments, or try oxygenated fuels or alcohol, see how that one does...

My one 700XX has a full exhaust, no lid, uni filter, oversize valves, porting, high comp piston, and a cam. Tuning it was the easiest thing I have ever done. I picked a shop that had a proven setup and they already had a Power Comander map for that setup. All I had to do was download the map into the box, hardest thing I was taking the seat off my quad! Yeah, I guess I cheated, but most people tune on a dyno anyway, so how many people tune their quads themselves? An experienced dyno operator can tune a EFI quad alot faster then taking time to swap a bunch of brass.

Like it or not, EFI is here to stay. Heck, even NASCAR has swapped to EFI. I figured hell would freeze over before they got away from a carb! I would say within 5 years or so, it will be hard to buy any quad with a carb, everything will be EFI by then. When was the last time you could go to a car dealer and buy a new car off the lot with a carb? Funny part is, I know guys 20 years ago that said they would never own a EFI car, carbs are the way to go. Guess what all those guys own today?

Doug

[Rohr397]

I think EFI is the way to go as long it's really good. Honda has it pretty good, but like my buddies Kfx450r has been in the shop nonstop cause the EFI fails or a sensor goes bad.

[zyoung04]

Originally posted by DnB_racing
Never had any starting problems that fuel injection would have helped, I ALLWAYS prep my quad for whatever riding conditions im going to encounter, if it wasn't going to start FI wouldnt have made any difference,

I choose performance over "easy" any day, im not afraid to work a little to have better performace

not everyone is U and always preps their quad or bike for the riding conditions and i bet theres more people out there that has to deal with the hard starting than theres not which is something i dont have to deal with anymore on my new one

i dont care about performance my completely stock FI model preforms just fine me i bought it to ride and have fun and does just fine on the track or trail if i get to where i want more ponies then ill spend the $$ to get it

like it or not honda will probably change to it one day in time especially since the crf has been FI for a few years now

[hrc450er]

Id rather see a chromoly frame like ktm went with.

[DnB_racing]

Originally posted by zyoung04


like it or not honda will probably change to it one day in time especially since the crf has been FI for a few years now there is a big difference between the 2, for some ridiculous reason Honda felt it had to detune the trx,

we all know the head and cam differences,

a stock crf with a carb has much more performance then a lightly built trx, so its not really a fair statement to compare the 2,
but a stock crf now with FI is a detuned version of the carberated crf

now everyone want the trx detuned even more??? I just dont get it

Doug I can almost guarantee that Nascar went to FI, because of government regs, against what the mechanics or drivers wanted,
the people driving and wrenching im sure tried to fight it every step of the way,
your 700 is a perfect quad for FI, even with the mods its still far from a race quad, I just dont feel FI and race should go together,as im sure most of the nascar world did ethier

i find it funny the governing obstacle is called CARB
California air resource board, that in itself tells the story LOL
it used to be just CES, but now its CARB, think about That!!!!

I realize its inevitable, but im not so sure we should just let it happen without some voice of disapproval, its not a win win situation,

we will be sacrificing some performance gains

some proof of this is next time you get to the track,weather it be drags or mx, look close at the supposed new Yamaha's with FI, and see how many have got rid of the FI, there will be Quite a few, running a straight carb setup,

So I know im not alone in my feeling of not wanting to compromise performance

im sure by now we have all added many aftermarket add ons to get our quads up to speed, but remember how much of a dog it was in stock form, add FI to that and it wouldnt get out of its own way, the only way it would be competitive is by increasing the flow designs from the get go

the only changes I would like to see is the trx come stock with the better flowing heads, I dont get why thats so hard ...

could someone please answer me this
why does Honda feel the quads need less performance then the bikes???

just about everyone I know has done work to get in the mid 50"s hp, when Honda could reliably do this with a few minor changes, this is a change that all types of riding could use, but instead they will be dropping the numbers...WHY!!!!! answer.... to meet CARB's standards

[zyoung04]

Originally posted by DnB_racing
Doug I can almost guarantee that Nascar went to FI, because of government regs, against what the mechanics or drivers wanted,
the people driving and wrenching im sure tried to fight it every step of the way,
your 700 is a perfect quad for FI, even with the mods its still far from a race quad, I just dont feel FI and race should go together,as im sure most of the nascar world did ethier




i dont see how u can gurantee this....sprint cars have been running FI for years now and ill bet it had nothing to do with the government it had to do with performance i understand this is a car engine but its possible to better performance out of a FI engine than your acting like

do i want a detuned engine no but its just something u have to deal with im tired of going back and forth about this really im not a FI lover i just believe things change and theres not nothing any us can do about it but just deal with it

[DnB_racing]

Originally posted by zyoung04
i just believe things change and theres not nothing any us can do about it but just deal with it this statement is the problem,and im not saying its just you, unfortunately for the off road public its far too common a statement

yes there is something we can do about it... stop buying the products if we dont like them, but too many people just say oh well it will have to be good enough...

what ever happened to wanting the absolute best product you can get for your money?

you even admit that your not really the biggest fan of FI,

but yet you would still buy it, because its all that's left for options..if everyone that felt like that didnt buy it, they would do something about it..

but too many people are too eager to just roll with whats given,

im actually giving up on the 4 strokes, and devoting my time into real performance of the 2 stroke, but that doesnt mean I dont want better performing 4 strokes, it would be easy for the manufacturer to do, but everyone is content with mediocrity

Its a sad day!!

and you can think thats its pointless, but without any voice against these changes, things would be alot worse,,,

the 4 stoke performance market customers needs the die hard 2 stroke devotion to keep reminding the manufacturer that all out performance still maters to some,

I know youve given up to market pressure, I guess its going to happen, alot of people just dont care but ill go down fighting it any way I can:macho

[ish416]

I just dont feel FI and race should go together,as im sure most of the nascar world did ethier

So if FI and racing don't go together then why do all the major racing series use it? F1, Indycar, Le Mans, MotoGP, etc..

I am sure that if they thought they could get the upper-hand with a carb they would certainly be using them.

Nascar is not what I would consider a major racing series as they are completely against advances in technology and only race in the US. Only this year have they started with fuel injection. FYI, the last car from any of the manufactures in Nascar sold with a carburetor was in 1990, 22 years ago.

Like most things, technology has improved and prices have dropped. FI is here to stay and will only get better. It is true that a well tuned carb "may" outperform an FI system but the carbs days are numbered. FI is already a more efficient, easier technology that has some advantages over carbs such as more accurate fuel delivery, altitude compensation, temperature adjusting, better throttle response and efficiency.

I fail to see FI as a bad thing.

I wasn't aware that the new CRF made any less power than the carbureted version. I do know that they went for a stronger low end. So if that is what you are referring to then that was by design not because of FI.

As for the bike/quad de-tuning, most manufacturers take reliability seriously and thus de-tune the engines in the quads for a less powerful, more stressful life. So where a (hypothetical numbers, hp at the tire(s)) CRF450 makes 50hp, a TRX450 makes 36. The engineers know that the CRF engine will last 150 hours of hard riding time in the bike. Put that exact same engine in the quad and your engine will only last 40 hours. So they basically de-tune and beef up the quad engine. Also, remember that the CRF450 makes more power to the ground (50hp), install that exact same engine into a quad and your power output may drop to 43hp at the tires. So technically at the crank, a TRX engine could make 7hp less than a CRF but have a difference of 14hp to the ground.

[DnB_racing]

Originally posted by ish416

It is true that a well tuned carb "may" outperform an FI system but the carbs days are numbered.

I fail to see FI as a bad thing.


As for the bike/quad de-tuning, most manufacturers take reliability seriously and thus de-tune the engines in the quads for a less powerful, more stressful life. So where a (hypothetical numbers, hp at the tire(s)) CRF450 makes 50hp, a TRX450 makes 36. The engineers know that the CRF engine will last 150 hours of hard riding time in the bike. Put that exact same engine in the quad and your engine will only last 40 hours. So they basically de-tune and beef up the quad engine. im not really opposed to FI its the restrictions that comes with it that bothers me

on your response to bad, for the same performance as a well tuned carb vs FI.. no matter of price dropping it will still cost more for the FI just for same performance... how can you see this as positive, any builder will tell you best emissions and best performance are not always the same

along with infinite adjustments of the carb compared to the limits of the available maps, I see the availability of high performance maps to the general user as another negative
look what happened to the LTR because they left an option for bypassing the limits they were fined and made to seize production
not to mention the cost to build it up to be competitive in the race market. (this is still marketed as a race quad)

I dont see how its not possible for the dynos to be regulated along with fine imposed if found to violate any emission standards, dealers are already not supposed to remove or alter in any way any of the air fuel adjustments, as to not satisfy epa standards, without penalty, it wont be long till that spreads to the private shops as well, the law is the law and no one shop will be exempt

but as far as the hours thats an interesting statement, im sure your basing this just on experience and assumptions, but its an interesting theory and im curious how accurate the hours are??


I agree that the gearing needs to be different between the 2, but I dont see adding the better flow and timing as a reliability issue, im not saying change the low ends ...yes that would cause wear issues, but adding additional HP to equal the crf (as many have done ) hasn't greatly changed the reliability of the engine

and in the long run even the most die hard lover of FI shouldn't really be arguing with the nonconformists, its people like me that help keep the market with options

IF CARB or EPA had there way there wouldnt even be an offroad market, so I say fight them before its too late!!

[Rohr397]

See I completely agree with DnB_racing but to an extent. The EFI we're getting is not the good EFI system. The reason it works well for cars is because they have a closed loop system that self-adjusts using the O2 sensors. Whereas the EFI in the quads and dirtbikes is open loop, so we have to do all the work and try to tune it the best way possible. If they were to put closed loop systems on quads it would provide much better performance and would be worth having.

[chronicsmoke]

I have a biased opinion on FI since my old Kawi 450 gave me trouble, mind you it wasn't the injection system, it was the electronics associated with it. (all stock)

A good buddy of mine always plays with his laptop during practice, he's got a yfzr and can't get rid of popping on decel. Some maps pop way worse than others. When mine popped on decel it was an easy fix, couple turns here, different pilot there.

Different strokes i guess, but I'd rather play with something that I can physically see in my hands rather than press a couple buttons on a computer and hope for the best.

[Rohr397]

Originally posted by chronicsmoke
I have a biased opinion on FI since my old Kawi 450 gave me trouble, mind you it wasn't the injection system, it was the electronics associated with it. (all stock)

A good buddy of mine always plays with his laptop during practice, he's got a yfzr and can't get rid of popping on decel. Some maps pop way worse than others. When mine popped on decel it was an easy fix, couple turns here, different pilot there.

Different strokes i guess, but I'd rather play with something that I can physically see in my hands rather than press a couple buttons on a computer and hope for the best.

Exactly why a self-adjusting EFI system would be necessary.

[DnB_racing]

Originally posted by Rohr397
Exactly why a self-adjusting EFI system would be necessary. like I said its not the Fuel injection im opposed to, its the inevitable limits that will be implanted into all available maps..

the EPA is suggesting that off road vehicles represent 33% of the hydrofluorocarbons produced every year, and are forcing the manufacturer to get that number much lower... thats what troubles me, how will this be possible and still have a high performance motor..

thats why im saying race quads and FI dont go together, the road race market isn't as strictly regulated, as there percent of pollution is next to none..

its a completely different story with off road compared to any other form of racing..


33% thats ridiculous no way do our quads equal that, the epa states 1- 4 stroke quad puts out as much pollutants as 35 cars, and a 2 stroke snowmobile is equal to 100 vehicles or more, and we are being lumped together, so not only are our numbers greatly exaggerated, but they are putting our 4 strokes quads in the same category as1000 cc 2 strokes

this is the battle we are against, and them forcing FI down our throats is just a way to regulate the number of pollutants that the EPA falsely associated with us off road users

im not sure about the 4x4 atv market but i would be surprised if they dont have catalytic converters already,

if not its not long before they do and soon after the sport market will have to follow, the day I see a race quad at the track with a cat is the day I give up riding

and if anyone doesn't see this coming they are just being naive

[zyoung04]

Im sure there was car tuners from back in the day that felt the same way as u do just like my dad and grandpa....but how many carbureted cars are on the road now days? This is my point

[DnB_racing]

Originally posted by zyoung04
Im sure there was car tuners from back in the day that felt the same way as u do just like my dad and grandpa....but how many carbureted cars are on the road now days? This is my point none of them, and I would put up my first car I owned in high school against any of today's plastic disposable cars

i owned a 1970 r/t se challenger 440 magnum 6 pack ...

thats my piomt!!

[Pacheco_450r]

Originally posted by DnB_racing
im not really opposed to FI its the restrictions that comes with it that bothers me

on your response to bad, for the same performance as a well tuned carb vs FI.. no matter of price dropping it will still cost more for the FI just for same performance... how can you see this as positive, any builder will tell you best emissions and best performance are not always the same

along with infinite adjustments of the carb compared to the limits of the available maps, I see the availability of high performance maps to the general user as another negative
look what happened to the LTR because they left an option for bypassing the limits they were fined and made to seize production
not to mention the cost to build it up to be competitive in the race market. (this is still marketed as a race quad)

I dont see how its not possible for the dynos to be regulated along with fine imposed if found to violate any emission standards, dealers are already not supposed to remove or alter in any way any of the air fuel adjustments, as to not satisfy epa standards, without penalty, it wont be long till that spreads to the private shops as well, the law is the law and no one shop will be exempt...



To add on to that, I know two different guys who race out here on the west coast one in the intermediate class and one in pro-am and they both converted their Ltr's to carb and said it was the best switch they ever made. They both said that they always had problems with their efi system whether it was electrical or the infinite adjustments. Both bikes are rockets and consistently run up front (of course that's rider ability as well). The reliability factor and simplicity of carbs prevents a lot of headaches on race day.

[blacknblue#2]

as bad as some of us hate to see it happening EFI is gonna take over powersports just as it did cars. Do I think that's bad, No. Do I think it's great, No. Efi is easier for the weekend warrior out riding his quad as a hobby and stress releiver. You want more power just plug and play. I will agree they are easier in the winter to start. I'm a hobby rider and have been around every atv made. Fi bikes are running before the engine makes a full revolution. Now I'll agree a perfectly jetted carb will too BUT once again how many hobby riders are gonna spend 100 bucks in jets and 8 hours of their time jetting their toy. Then after spending that time and money jetting they leave southern Ohio drive to the mountains of WV to ride and guess what their jetting ain't perfect down there like it was at home. Trust me i've been through that several times. As far as. Comparing quads to cars. Quad efi is in the stages car efi was in back in the mid 80s. If I was gonna build an 86 z28 would I leave the throttle body injection on or a carb. Well duh I'd have an aluminum intake and a carb on it. But look how much it's progressed. My brother inlaw has a 2009 Corvette. Would I slap a carb on it. Heck no. That's truly the fastest car I've ever been in. Remapped with a set of long tube headers and full exhaust and that car will pin me back against the seat from 0 to 155 and that's when I started screamin to slow that mfer down. So all I'm satin is out of the millions of PPL that buy quads only thousands of us actually build and tinker with them. If Honda is gonna up their sales they are gonna have to go with efi. If jack schit walks in a dealer to buy his first quad and sees Yamaha YFZ450R "EFI" setting beside this TRX450R that looks just like the one his neighbors bought new 8 years ago then more than likely if he just wants something to ride he is gonna be setting on the yamaha that saturday

[DnB_racing]

Originally posted by blacknblue#2
as bad as some of us hate to see it happening EFI is gonna take over powersports just as it did cars. Do I think that's bad, No. Do I think it's great, No. Efi is easier for the weekend warrior out riding his quad as a hobby and stress releiver. You want more power just plug and play. I will agree they are easier in the winter to start. I'm a hobby rider and have been around every atv made. Fi bikes are running before the engine makes a full revolution. Now I'll agree a perfectly jetted carb will too BUT once again how many hobby riders are gonna spend 100 bucks in jets and 8 hours of their time jetting their toy. Then after spending that time and money jetting they leave southern Ohio drive to the mountains of WV to ride and guess what their jetting ain't perfect down there like it was at home. Trust me i've been through that several times. As far as. Comparing quads to cars. Quad efi is in the stages car efi was in back in the mid 80s. If I was gonna build an 86 z28 would I leave the throttle body injection on or a carb. Well duh I'd have an aluminum intake and a carb on it. But look how much it's progressed. My brother inlaw has a 2009 Corvette. Would I slap a carb on it. Heck no. That's truly the fastest car I've ever been in. Remapped with a set of long tube headers and full exhaust and that car will pin me back against the seat from 0 to 155 and that's when I started screamin to slow that mfer down. So all I'm satin is out of the millions of PPL that buy quads only thousands of us actually build and tinker with them. If Honda is gonna up their sales they are gonna have to go with efi. If jack schit walks in a dealer to buy his first quad and sees Yamaha YFZ450R "EFI" setting beside this TRX450R that looks just like the one his neighbors bought new 8 years ago then more than likely if he just wants something to ride he is gonna be setting on the yamaha that saturday I agree 100% and you couldnt be more right about the amount of people actually tinkering with there own motors,

the thing that gets me is 99% of the people wanting a race quad wont race it,there just buying it to caress there ego, and really arnt buying for performance but more to say "I ride a race quad"
these buyers could care less about something that will cross the line first, some even want reverse...I dont know anyone who won any form of race going backwards

I seldom race any organized racing any more, but im still helping build for people that do. and it kills me how watered down the market wants a race quad to be from the factory,

its just too bad people will want the fastest and best and never even use the potential, just to say they have it

In a perfect world they would sell quads with different options and a few performance and suspension packages, that I think would get more interest and sales

sell one without any factory suspension , and let the buyer pick his own, these types of options... like I said a perfect world lol

[Rohr397]

That's one reason I like what Can-Am is doing for 2013. A standard model Ds, an XC Ds with lots of upgrades right from factory, and an MX Ds with full Fox suspension is an amazing lineup. It's certainly better than what the others have offered. On that same note I really liked Ktm for doing this as well although they were too expensive for most. I think Can-Am is gonna sell a lot more this year than the others with all the racing support, amateur program and a much more race ready quad.

[01boneless]

either one of these would work for me :)

[01boneless]

or this

[venom108]

buying stuff you don't need but you want is the American way of life. Who cares if they don't race it, it's their money and they can do what they want with it. "watered down" How are any of the new 450's even close to watered down compared to the two-strokers they have taken over? A good B, or C rider can put bolt on mods to the motor and race all year without putting a new piston in it. Yes 4-strokes are heavier and don't make the same hp per cc as a two-stroke but you get reliablility and torque as a trade off. EFI is also awesome. I've dealt with carbs and having to rejet sucks, cheap but still not fun trying to get your motor running just right. Most riders do nothing more than put a exhaust and intake on their quads and never do anymore. The EFI on quads and bikes today is like the very basic of EFI. Direct injection will be next but adds more expense to the quad. Hell everything is still open looped. EFI is probably twice as reliable as carbs. Whens the last time you had to un clog a EFI system? I'd love to see a two-stroke high performance atv again but we'll see if that happens anytime soon.

[DnB_racing]

Originally posted by venom108
buying stuff you don't need but you want is the American way of life. Who cares if they don't race it, it's their money and they can do what they want with it. "watered down" How are any of the new 450's even close to watered down compared to the two-strokers they have taken over? A good B, or C rider can put bolt on mods to the motor and race all year without putting a new piston in it. Yes 4-strokes are heavier and don't make the same hp per cc as a two-stroke but you get reliablility and torque as a trade off. EFI is also awesome. I've dealt with carbs and having to rejet sucks, cheap but still not fun trying to get your motor running just right. Most riders do nothing more than put a exhaust and intake on their quads and never do anymore. The EFI on quads and bikes today is like the very basic of EFI. Direct injection will be next but adds more expense to the quad. Hell everything is still open looped. EFI is probably twice as reliable as carbs. Whens the last time you had to un clog a EFI system? I'd love to see a two-stroke high performance atv again but we'll see if that happens anytime soon. the 4 strokes haven't taken over, on the contrary they have almost cut in quarter the quads at the gate, the 4 strokes have MUCH higher maintenance costs and MUCH fewer hours between scheduled maint then the 2 strokes, a lot of the old 2's are still running strong how is that not reliable,

the new high performance high maintence race quads have all but made racing impossible, for the average person

the FI system are no more resistant to the fuel tank deterioration then a carbed model, if you leave the methanol based fuel in your plastic tank it will still cause problems no matter what type of fuel delivery you have

[SHIFTx450]

So how about that 2013 trx450r?

[SHIFTx450]

Disregard..

Just found this..

http://www.trx450r.org/forum/92-lounge/201829-2013-trx-450r-released.html

What a disappointment...

[DnB_racing]

Originally posted by SHIFTx450
Disregard..

Just found this..

http://www.trx450r.org/forum/92-lounge/201829-2013-trx-450r-released.html

What a disappointment... your a few days late,,, go back about 5 or 6 pages lols

[SHIFTx450]

Can someone photoshop the white rear fender onto the red bike, and post it here please

[SHIFTx450]

And then the red front fender to the white bike.

[ThePhantomRider]

Originally posted by hrc450er
Wow... Just wait til 2014 honda has new 450 just waiting lol. seriously though where is phantom at since he predicted a new one. I guess this one does have bold new graphics


Sigh...if anyone cares to remember I said there is one that was complete, however due to the economy and surplus of existing models, they will hold off as long as possible to release.

What you are seeing is their attempt to take whatever is left and dress it up different enough to liquidate the final stock.

Till they see a financial gain for the release of a new quad, we are stuck with what we got.

Period, end of story. I do get a kick out of the "Special Edition Tri Color" name, straight out of the Italian Supercar handbook...

I am never wrong, however too far in advance for the everyday person. You will discover once the new quad is released, they will say it has been ready for years.

At this pace though, I fully expect electromagnetic, ride height adjustable shocks.

TPR

[desratt]

ok how many years have we been hearing this. my dealer said he couldn't get a 450r right now. he actually told me to go check other dealers. I think they are still making them. and won't change cause the cost to retool the assembly line cost more then it is worth.

[SHIFTx450]

Originally posted by ThePhantomRider


At this pace though, I fully expect electromagnetic, ride height adjustable shocks.

TPR

Dont forget about the flux capacitor which will require 1.21 jiggawatts to get her going at precisely 88mph

[01boneless]

im ahead of u there^^^

[grim one]

Originally posted by ThePhantomRider
Sigh...if anyone cares to remember I said there is one that was complete, however due to the economy and surplus of existing models, they will hold off as long as possible to release.

What you are seeing is their attempt to take whatever is left and dress it up different enough to liquidate the final stock.

Till they see a financial gain for the release of a new quad, we are stuck with what we got.

Period, end of story. I do get a kick out of the "Special Edition Tri Color" name, straight out of the Italian Supercar handbook...

I am never wrong, however too far in advance for the everyday person. You will discover once the new quad is released, they will say it has been ready for years.

At this pace though, I fully expect electromagnetic, ride height adjustable shocks.

TPR

You have been saying this for years, You clearly don't know Jack, you're GUESSING like everyone else.


Anybody can say, "yeah it's comming, and then when IF does, you'll say,,see I was right.....just move along

[ThePhantomRider]

Originally posted by grim one
You have been saying this for years, You clearly don't know Jack, you're GUESSING like everyone else.


Anybody can say, "yeah it's comming, and then when IF does, you'll say,,see I was right.....just move along

CLEARLY, you are right....and CLEARLY you do know Jack since you capitalized his name and CLEARLY you don't know sarcasm with my electromagnetic shock comment.

I'm as frustrated as anyone, but since I do know economics, and Honda's position, the true reality is as I stated.

So let's just forget that I scooped everyone, included Dirty Wheels and all the other mags on releasing details on the Raptor 700 weeks before anyone, and how about breaking the info on the KFX 450 being an alloy frame when I saw Kawasaki shipping 3 Cannondale frames to Japan over a year before it's reveal....I didn't know anything about the Can Am DS 450 as I was giving out real details about it in the months leading up to it (as well as the verified revelation that it was indeed initially designed and tested as a 250 two stroke. I let everyone know about the Renegade as well as the Commander over a year in advance....

You aren't the first to doubt me, and will not be the last, I just deal in the reality of what I have provided and have had proven.

TPR...The one and only....

I approve this message....

[Black Sheep]

Originally posted by ThePhantomRider


I'm as frustrated as anyone, but since I do know economics, and Honda's position, the true reality is as I stated.

You aren't the first to doubt me, and will not be the last, I just deal in the reality of what I have provided and have had proven.



I don't doubt you but, the economics part is not 100% accurate, there are other reasons for the delay that only mother nature can tell you ;)


Originally posted by ThePhantomRider

I am never wrong, however too far in advance for the everyday person. You will discover once the new quad is released, they will say it has been ready for years.

Not suprising, elsewhere I posted the patents for the new 450R, that were filed back in 2008 and 2009

Now, I will trump you...

...Honda will debut the new TRX 450R at this years Baja 1000. It will be released sometime in 2013 as a early 2014 model.


:devil: :devil::devil:

[ThePhantomRider]

Yes, thank you for pointing out the natural disaster issue as well, I forgot to add that element.

I did see the patents as well, great finds.

Now as for the release date, I've been removed from information gathering for a while, so I will defer to your call on the Baja 1000....well see if Wayne is going to help with the reveal......

Gosh, I remember when he was racing a DS650 and then Z400 back in the day...

TPR

[grim one]

Phantom faliure, Get over yourself, You guessed wrong again, Now pop that bloated head of yours and come down to reality.

[SHIFTx450]

So who's gonna start the new 2014 trx450r thread?

[Rohr397]

Originally posted by grim one
Phantom faliure, Get over yourself, You guessed wrong again, Now pop that bloated head of yours and come down to reality.

[ATVRacing2]

Hey SHIFTx450, What the HE Double Hockey Sticks is a Jiggawhatt?!?!?!?! hahahahaha loved it when Marty said that, classic, I think it def fits in with this thread and what TPR is predicting. I thinks its about time to hop in the deloreon and send us Back to the Future!!! LOL

[ThePhantomRider]

Originally posted by grim one
Phantom faliure, Get over yourself, You guessed wrong again, Now pop that bloated head of yours and come down to reality.

Since announcing my retirement, and since the day is not over, I will indulge myself in one last spar for old time's sake.

In the past, I have taken on myths, legends, giants and other great men in this industry that held much higher esteem than you could possibly imagine...and although different than you believe and even fail to investigate yourself, I've been right many times more than wrong, and when I was wrong, i was the first to admit it.

Now, I didn't really come back on to dis you Grim One....no, no, no, no, that would be too easy...anyone with an IQ over room temperature could actually do that....No, that's not what I aim to do. You display fear....fear of the unknown truth, fear that someone else may just have information that runs contrary to your rudimentary thought process...fear that manifests itself in attacks on those that do not share your limited ability to even grasp half of what I say. It's ok, you are not the first, not the last but let me make one thing indelibly clear... No one ever....ever got over on the Rider..and most certainly not The Phantom Rider....

So while there are tears being shed today in the memory of one of, if not the greatest informants and personality of these forums...they are tears of joy that express the glory and admiration that have been poured onto me over the years. Each time I was told I was wrong....and proven right, many feet were stuffed into the pie holes of those doubters, and I stood up as if on Mt. Olympus, The King, The Champ...The Ruler Of The Atv World....and that can never be disputed.

I pray one day Grim One....that you can fully understand and appreciate how much I've done for you here.

Sincerely,

The Phantom Rider

[SHIFTx450]

Amen.

[ATVRacing2]

Hey TPR, Roads? Where were going we dont need roads! Compliments from the Doc.

[Rohr397]

Originally posted by ThePhantomRider
Since announcing my retirement, and since the day is not over, I will indulge myself in one last spar for old time's sake.

In the past, I have taken on myths, legends, giants and other great men in this industry that held much higher esteem than you could possibly imagine...and although different than you believe and even fail to investigate yourself, I've been right many times more than wrong, and when I was wrong, i was the first to admit it.

Now, I didn't really come back on to dis you Grim One....no, no, no, no, that would be too easy...anyone with an IQ over room temperature could actually do that....No, that's not what I aim to do. You display fear....fear of the unknown truth, fear that someone else may just have information that runs contrary to your rudimentary thought process...fear that manifests itself in attacks on those that do not share your limited ability to even grasp half of what I say. It's ok, you are not the first, not the last but let me make one thing indelibly clear... No one ever....ever got over on the Rider..and most certainly not The Phantom Rider....

So while there are tears being shed today in the memory of one of, if not the greatest informants and personality of these forums...they are tears of joy that express the glory and admiration that have been poured onto me over the years. Each time I was told I was wrong....and proven right, many feet were stuffed into the pie holes of those doubters, and I stood up as if on Mt. Olympus, The King, The Champ...The Ruler Of The Atv World....and that can never be disputed.

I pray one day Grim One....that you can fully understand and appreciate how much I've done for you here.

Sincerely,

The Phantom Rider

[grim one]

Originally posted by ThePhantomRider
Since announcing my retirement, and since the day is not over, I will indulge myself in one last spar for old time's sake.

In the past, I have taken on myths, legends, giants and other great men in this industry that held much higher esteem than you could possibly imagine...and although different than you believe and even fail to investigate yourself, I've been right many times more than wrong, and when I was wrong, i was the first to admit it.

Now, I didn't really come back on to dis you Grim One....no, no, no, no, that would be too easy...anyone with an IQ over room temperature could actually do that....No, that's not what I aim to do. You display fear....fear of the unknown truth, fear that someone else may just have information that runs contrary to your rudimentary thought process...fear that manifests itself in attacks on those that do not share your limited ability to even grasp half of what I say. It's ok, you are not the first, not the last but let me make one thing indelibly clear... No one ever....ever got over on the Rider..and most certainly not The Phantom Rider....

So while there are tears being shed today in the memory of one of, if not the greatest informants and personality of these forums...they are tears of joy that express the glory and admiration that have been poured onto me over the years. Each time I was told I was wrong....and proven right, many feet were stuffed into the pie holes of those doubters, and I stood up as if on Mt. Olympus, The King, The Champ...The Ruler Of The Atv World....and that can never be disputed.

I pray one day Grim One....that you can fully understand and appreciate how much I've done for you here.

Sincerely,

The Phantom Rider


umm huh....
So if you say a new honda will have a alum. frame and efi,,,,, that means you got "inside info":o :rolleyes:

anybody can guess that.

Now you said it would be here years and years now,, more blah blah from you.
You are dead wrong, now go away.

Your're info is worthless as tits on a bore.

[desratt]

please retire already.

[ThePhantomRider]

Originally posted by grim one
umm huh....
So if you say a new honda will have a alum. frame and efi,,,,, that means you got "inside info":o :rolleyes:

anybody can guess that.

Now you said it would be here years and years now,, more blah blah from you.
You are dead wrong, now go away.

Your're info is worthless as tits on a bore.

http://www.grammarly.com/?q=grammar&gclid=CIDI_a_vwLECFURfTAodE0wAyg

[Rohr397]

Originally posted by ThePhantomRider
http://www.grammarly.com/?q=grammar&gclid=CIDI_a_vwLECFURfTAodE0wAyg

I think you forgot to mention this

[SHIFTx450]

Wow

[bencasey217]

Originally posted by Rohr397
I think you forgot to mention this Thats so freaking hilarious!:D

[IRONFLIGHT2]

I have seen it as well ..... It's red

[ltrfofiddy32]

I raced a ****zuki for 2 seasons. blew the tranny both seasons. could never get me efi computer totally figured out. so i bought a honda and now i will never ride anything else. i love it. i can throw that thing around like a bicycle.

[IRONFLIGHT2]

Originally posted by ltrfofiddy32
I raced a ****zuki for 2 seasons. blew the tranny both seasons. could never get me efi computer totally figured out. so i bought a honda and now i will never ride anything else. i love it. i can throw that thing around like a bicycle.

^^x2 raced suzukis since o6 had enough with the headaches last year bought a honda and would never go back in a million years

[ah665]

I am coming from a Suzuki also. I loved the quad. Had a few small issues but in general, they are great race quads. When I first got my Honda, it took me awhile until I fell in love with it, cause it feels so different. I really have come to appreciate the simplicity of it though. I know a lot of guys are hoping for an overhaul and that is understood but there is something to be said for these quads being simple and effective. Especially since quads (unlike mx bikes) usually get a large majority of parts swapped out/upgraded anyways. If Honda keeps making the quad and there is a large aftermarket for them, this current platform will continue to be 1 of the more dominant quads at the races, in my opinion.

[rummerd]

I had an 07 LTR. I felt cramped on it and the tranny was weird. I am much happier on my Honda's, they just feel right. I wish I could have bought a few of the leftover's when they were going cheap. Would be nice to just uncrate a brand new machine every few years!

[SHIFTx450]

Originally posted by ah665
........ I really have come to appreciate the simplicity of it though. I know a lot of guys are hoping for an overhaul and that is understood but there is something to be said for these quads being simple and effective. Especially since quads (unlike mx bikes) usually get a large majority of parts swapped out/upgraded anyways. If Honda keeps making the quad and there is a large aftermarket for them, this current platform will continue to be 1 of the more dominant quads at the races, in my opinion.

DITTO