hrc or hc2????

[fast1500]

i have a 2004 450r that being rebuilt at rage. Its getting a 11.1 weisco piston...new valves.... ported head thats gona be decked for extra compression...Sparks big core exhaust. and it has the hrc cam. dee said that the hc2 would be better. my tab is arleady up to$2,400 somethin. should i spend the extra cash on the hot cams 2 or should i just keep the hrc???

[audioworks04]

I'd keep the hrc. You my gain a little bottom end out of the hc2, but overall the hrc is a great cam. Always something you can change later.

[sunco]

since 04 all we run is hrc kits, pipe, open air box

[fast1500]

Yea I'm just keeping the hrc. Rage is putting in an 11.1 weisco piston. Hrc cam. New spring kit.Port and polish. Farra valves. Decking the head. New cylinder. New crank. And I got a sparks exhaust off of here. How much HP do y'all think it will have? I'm gona dyno it right after i put it in the bike. I'm guessing like 46-47. Hopefully higher.

[2001400exrida]

Id say around 42-45 hp

Not much done to it with stock bore, somewhat low compression piston, and stock stroke. The 04/05s only have about 36hp stock

[fast1500]

I've read that the 2004 with the hrc kit was 42 hp. So I think it will be at least 46. I will post the dyno chart after I get the motor back..

[fast1500]

Just got the 450 back. Made 50hp 33tq with no lid, and 47hp with EHS outerwears lid on it. Runs awesome! Thanks to RAGE ATV.

[8secnotch]

I would like to see the dyno sheet on this because I'm running a 05 with much more compression totally done up head (rather not say who did the head) stage 2 hot cam, sparks fcr carb no air box lid, balanced crank and rod and crf ign, and It only makes 51 hp and 37 rwtq on the dyno.

[Lquad71]

What does it mean to deck a head?
Ive heard of decking a cylinder but not a head so im curious. You said it gives more compression which in this case would show why the numbers are substantially high for the piston that is in it.

[fast1500]

yea i will ask him if he can get me the dyno sheet when i take it back......i really dont know. he said that hes gona deck the head a little bit so i can get more power out of it. and it still runs on pump gas. I run 1 gallon of 110 sunoco and 4 gallons 93. Its really fast.

[mx Eli]

when decking the head, the head is placed in a mill and some metal is milled off of where the gasket sits, therefore lowering the head adding more compression

[Lquad71]

will this throw off the timing or will it be so minimal that it wont matter and the tensioner will take care of the extra slack?

[MtnEX]

Decking can be a more effective way of getting power.

Head or cylinder. Shaving a little off either will up compression the old fashioned way.

Just depends on the motor and what it likes for efficient burn.

[2001400exrida]

any word on the dyno graph? I"m also very impressed with 50hp with that setup. you're running a low compression piston, actually it's lower than the stock 06+ 450's. I'm familiar with rage's work and they deck it so it's closer to 12:1 with your piston.

To be honest i find it hard to believe you're at 50hp with stock bore, stock stroke and 11:1 wiseco piston.

[want2bfast]

If Dee says a HC2 will be better it will be better.

A stock 04 is about 32-34hp. If lyou have all the right parts you be at 50hp..

Good luck.

[2001400exrida]

It depends on the dyno, i've seen stock 04/05's running 36-37hp.

HRC ftw!

[vegasjeep]

Originally posted by 2001400exrida
It depends on the dyno, i've seen stock 04/05's running 36-37hp.

HRC ftw!

then why wouldn't it be possible to reach those numbers if he had a strong 05 to begin with?

That statement contradicts your original post of you don't see it happening...

[2001400exrida]

i would be suprised at 50hp.

his mods don't = 14hp in my opinion, but who knows i could be wrong.

[Eclipsemike]

14 HP is alot to gain off of a port job and a cam. i could see running a 12.1 piston and decking the head possibly reaching 50. race gas and 93 could have helped with the numbers a little bit. but i wanna see the dyno sheets also.


HP is just a number til its proven......

[rageatvsupermom]

Originally posted by 2001400exrida
any word on the dyno graph? I"m also very impressed with 50hp with that setup. you're running a low compression piston, actually it's lower than the stock 06+ 450's. I'm familiar with rage's work and they deck it so it's closer to 12:1 with your piston.

To be honest i find it hard to believe you're at 50hp with stock bore, stock stroke and 11:1 wiseco piston.

Not sure why it is hard for you to believe it made 50. We have other 05's stock bore and stroke with a pump gas piston making more than that. The customer is happy and that is what we strive for.

Thanks, Michele
Rage Atv Racing

[want2bfast]

Originally posted by rageatvsupermom
Not sure why it is hard for you to believe it made 50. We have other 05's stock bore and stroke with a pump gas piston making more than that. The customer is happy and that is what we strive for.

Thanks, Michele
Rage Atv Racing

Michele,

Its actually pretty easy.. Every site he has been on he has been banned for being argumentative.

I am sure you guys have stock bores in the high 60's if not more..

Robert

[2001400exrida]

Originally posted by rageatvsupermom
Not sure why it is hard for you to believe it made 50. We have other 05's stock bore and stroke with a pump gas piston making more than that. The customer is happy and that is what we strive for.

Thanks, Michele
Rage Atv Racing

I'm not commenting on Rage's work or anything, that's got nothing to do with it. I'm saying i'd like to see a dyno of the OP's machine, nothing more, nothing less.

If you did the work, why not post a dyno run of his machine so we can see what the numbers were? Otherwise, i'll stand by my word, it's hard to believe the he got 14hp, just from head work and 11:1 piston on an 04/05.

i'll eat crow, i've got no problem doing that, i would love to see the real world numbers.

want2bfast - i'm not the only person wanting to see this dyno. read all the posts, we are all impressed with the numbers and would love to check out the graphs on this build.

[want2bfast]

Here ya go..

stock bore stock piston

http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb100/want2bfast/dyno/OxyFuel01.jpg

[rageatvsupermom]

What happened to the other replies? Did I miss something?

[fast1500]

Hey Michele this is Jeron Stokley. I guess im just gona have to come back up there and get the dyno graph or just just run it again when i come get the valves adjusted or sumthing and let them all see it. lol

[rageatvsupermom]

Originally posted by fast1500
Hey Michele this is Jeron Stokley. I guess im just gona have to come back up there and get the dyno graph or just just run it again when i come get the valves adjusted or sumthing and let them all see it. lol
Jeron, It does not matter to me at all. You should not have to prove anything to anyone. The dyno graph is yours to do what you want with it.

[MtnEX]

I hope it was not what I said... but it was true...

At the end there I wrote something to the effect of....

...If you won't quit after the builder posts in the thread, you're not gonna quit just because they post a dyno sheet...

....That is pretty much the truth. They would just start some crap about the dyno, or the dyno sheet, or how it was done, etc, etc.


Don't worry though. Those of us who are serious about the work we have done understand that a dyno number is just a dyno number that will be different down the street. All we want to see is a before run and an after run at the same place so we have an idea what the gain is. Then we are gonna go put it on the track and see how it works and what it feels like, which is all that matters really.

[Scro]

Originally posted by rageatvsupermom
What happened to the other replies? Did I miss something?

I got rid of all the BS. No sense in getting rid of good info because of a few lemons.

[rageatvsupermom]

Oh, ok I did not know what was going on.

[fast1500]

Yea I was just telling every body about my build. Didn't mean any harm. But yea when I get a graph I'll post it on here.

[Scro]

Just curious as to why you decided on 11:1 with decking, instead of just going with maybe 12.5:1 for the bump in compression?

[2001400exrida]

Would love to see the graph on your build. Did you go with bigger valves too?

[fast1500]

What I wanted a fast but reliable motor so Dee put in a wiesco piston 3 ring. I wanted a JE 12.1 that was a 3 ring piston but he said Weisco is better for reliability. And the decking made it just bump the compression up to 12.1 or more.

No it has stock size valves

[ghott]

50hp is VERY believable coming out of Rage's shop...they do some quality work. He ain't no "poke and hope" porter :) . The Manshack family will definitely treat you right and make ya happy!

[HondaRacing83]

Doesnt anything over 11:1 have to have race gas? I could be wrong because I'm really only familiar with 400ex motors but if an 06+ 450r comes stock with over 11:1 hows that work because i know for sure they dont come stock requiring race gas

[01boneless]

Originally posted by HondaRacing83
Doesnt anything over 11:1 have to have race gas? I could be wrong because I'm really only familiar with 400ex motors but if an 06+ 450r comes stock with over 11:1 hows that work because i know for sure they dont come stock requiring race gas
totally diffrent engine, for starters the 400ex is air cooled as to were 450r's are water cooled. 12:5:1 is the base line for 450r's and pump gas

[HondaRacing83]

Ohhh alright! see i wasnt sure thanks boneless.

[fast1500]

Just got another run on the dyno. Dee tuned it a little more and adjusted the valves, it makes HP 50.28 and TQ 32.70 With the EHS air box cover he could only get HP 47.60 and TQ 31.73. So i wont be putting it back on. It like how it keeps the air box clean but You can feel that 3 HP being robed away. I dont know how to resize the image!!! Can any one help??

[fast1500]

Just got another run on the dyno. Dee tuned it a little more and adjusted the valves, it makes HP 50.28 and TQ 32.70 With the EHS air box cover he could only get HP 47.60 and TQ 31.73. So i wont be putting it back on.

[fast1500]

.

[CJM]

So your using the stock lid and getting the most power? Thats interesting that the EHS lid actually hindered power slightly.

[fast1500]

No im running no lid now. I liked the idea of having a cleaner filter but if it takes away 3hp then i dont need it. Ehs said that it wouldnt take away power but it obviously does. I guess if i ride where its really dusty I will put it on.