Tear Down Time!

[CJM]

Finally got sick of my pos looking, well like a pos. The frame needs alot of attention, the underside is somewhat rusty and what paint that was on the frame is pretty worn in the end. Remember gang, Im a fan of the go before show philosophy. So while it might look horrible it sure does go!

Proposed build:
-Paint frame with epoxy appliance paint. Not quite sure on this stuff, but I have read good reviews and of course its cheaper than PC. If it holds up on my shifter test mule Ill do it.

-New rear wheels and tires. The kenda klaws gotta go. They are ok but def not the greatest, also one of my DWT A5 wheels is bent pretty badly on the lip. Probably gonna do razrs or razr2. Might buy some beadlocks or otherwise Im gonna try the rocky mtn gforce xc wheels or the sti brand RMATV offers. Would really prefer a champion in the box setup from DWT but thats $$$$

- +1 or 2 steering stem. Even with my pro taper atv hi's Im still to short and uncomfortable on long rides. A +1 stem should do the trick. JD performance offers a deal for $150 where you send your bent stuff and he just uses the lower part at the tierods and welds chromoly to the rest.

- +1 or +2 arms, probably JD performance. Torn between running +1 and keeping my stock fronts which are in good shape or doing +2 and doing 4:1 wheels to get the better steering. Also torn spending an extra 100 bucks and doing the nice ground clearanced arms as well.

-Redoing the rear shock is priority. I can live with the front 450s being stiff for now. Gonna do respring/revalve and linkage and do the GTT skid.

Im sure Ill find more to do. But I dont plan on riding for awhile till it warms up. Gotta fix my pick'em up truck but I got a bit of cash coming to me to handle that. More than likely I wont be getting this all done besides the frame, maybe some bearings and the rear setup for awhile.

I also need to buy the omf seat latch or make a setup myself, the dang latch is brand new and loose and worn already... buy a new front bumper and Im probably going to get a grab bar among other things.

Pictures:
http://i44.tinypic.com/ekq4gw.jpg

http://i43.tinypic.com/sm7t3a.jpg

http://i39.tinypic.com/16gyjyu.jpg

huh the pictures dont work now???

[Stickman400]

I don't see how you call that a pos. That's a solid looking quad. I mean sure it needs paint, but other than a fresh coat of paint, get a new bumper and use some de-greaser on the wiring harness and engine and that would look like a damn good quad man.

Now as for your list of parts, the paint or epoxy is up to you. But I'd go with whatever rims you like, just go with something that's built for punishment and then go Razr 2's or the equivalent off brand (X-rex or whatever), +1 stem unless you like your bars really high, +1 arms since you ride lots of trails (ground clearance if you want, don't think they would help that much for the extra $), and re-doing the rear shock and the link will be prefect. And then the various bearings and bushings you find that need replaced and you got a nice-er quad, because it's already nice.

[CJM]

If I do the +2 arms and 4:1 wheels it should work itself out. I like the benefit if I wanna play MX I can if I want to swap to the old wheels/tires. But who really knows, all tentative besides the shock.

I spent at least an hour fixing the tabs on my front plastics today. How someone rips those little tabs off IDK. I used a plastic welder. Its fixed, not perfect but fixed ok.

But yea so my quad looks nice lol? I wish it were nicer. Im a perfectionist to a degree and want my stuff as good as can be.

[Baileygunns]

Go +2 on the stem... It's cheaper to buy shorter bars if it's to tall then it is to find a taller stem if it's to short. Check out CST ambush tires, cheap and they're a great tire. Maybe look into stock KFX450 rims, the have the reenforcement rings and you can find them cheap. I've never had an issue running +2 arms on my 450 in the woods rec riding, if I was actually racing XC I would consider something narrower.. Plus you can usually find +2 pretty cheap, used... jmo

[Stickman400]

Those plastics are in damn nice condition from the year it is and how hard you ride it. And I guess you could go with the +2s if you got the 4:1 rims, I just thought 4:1s were hard to find in the aftermarket category.

[CJM]

Good call on the stem Bailey, I might just have to do that.

4:1 arent all that hard to find. Id probably buy some DWT rock outs or something.

Where I ride it can be quite tight but +2s can fit. I mean if an LTR can fit I should be fine. I mostly want the 4:1 and + setup for the good steering inclination.

As for the plastics, that sets awesome, and was just used by someone to race. My old set is NASTY lol. All scratched and beat up but still together-no stitches lol.

Anyways thats for the info and compliments. Im gonna see how the shifter paint is holding up in a week-thats full cure apparently. Then ill pull the gun on the frame. I do have someone offering to PC for 200 bucks but thats steep imho.

[Stickman400]

Damn, that's crazy. I got a company that PC's for a business around here to do it for $125, and that's with clear over the PC. I had another company do just the PC for $45 a long time ago, but it started flaking off.

[quadmanw]

$200 seems to be the average PC price to my knowledge

[CJM]

Well Im not sure it was even real quote. My boss rents yard space from the PC guy and in passing i mentioned to him what I wanted and he said 200.

I still rather do it myself. I enjoy painting.

[honda400ex2003]

did you do the carb before you tore it down?

subscribed
steve

[CJM]

Originally posted by honda400ex2003
did you do the carb before you tore it down?

subscribed
steve

nah parts arent in yet. You got a pm from me btw.

Found the wheels I want tho, gonna buy a package deal of razrs and g-force xc-1 wheels. People loved the XC wheel and the xc-1 is apparently stronger. Anythings better than the stupid DWT A5's that I literally tore chunks out of. The stockers are a better wheel than them.. Bead locks are nice, but not at 100+ per wheel.

[honda400ex2003]

nice combo on the wheels and tires, they should work out well.

a buddy and i were just discussing bead locks and came to the same conclusion about them lol

replied also,

steve

[CJM]

When i bought it had DWT ultimate shamrock billet beadlocks (sweet wheels btw) but they were 8" and had MX tires on there-totally use less for me. I had to practically let them go for 200 and the things were like brand new.

Now the only choice is polished or black, black scratches and shows wayyy to ez imho.

Also replied, lemme know if Im off base on it Steve. Just worried about the shipping being nuts cause of the weight/size.

[honda400ex2003]

the shamroks are similar to my quadroks

i have had good luck with my set on both my 400 and my 250r now this past summer.

ill be in the market for new ones this spring. the champion in a box set look pretty intriguing to me. my next set will be black rims with razrs on them.

[CJM]

I want the champion in a box set but cant justify the price. $500 bucks for them basically.

[honda400ex2003]

lol i guess i didnt look at the price of them, saw them a while back before i decided i was going to do more black stuff instead of polished aluminum on everything.

steve

[01boneless]

subed ... i always wanted to see pics of ur quad...dont get where u say its a pos look?? i think it looks good other than paint and bumper. i painted the frame on my 450 with valspar implement paint from tsc

[dxcody]

i just painted my frame with spray paint.

I got tired of my friends always having the nicer quads than me so i went all out one day, just said screw it and went to town.

Those front plastic tabs your talking about, i have broke them off of 2 different sets of plastics, i break them all doin MX.. I 400ex just isnt meant to go airborn i guess.

[CJM]

All I gotta say is thank god for plastic welders. Its not perfect but at least the tabs are on there.

[dxcody]

ive been looking to get a plastic welder for a while now.

I did the same thing as you but since i dont have a plastic welder, i just use a hot air tool (like an extreme hair dryer) and some plastic i have and melt it together.

Whatever works right!

[CJM]

Got mine from harbor freight, it works pretty dang good. Like a giant soldering iron. I have used a urethane supply company mini weld 6, its 100x better and easier to work with but its also 150 bucks vs 20 for the HF job. What I did was melt some mesh screen in there and used some plastic from some red nail containers/organizers you can get from home cheapo.

You cant see its fixed really unless you take off the black parts.

[CJM]

No pics, but I got the following done:

Removed:
-shock, linkage and swingarm. Ya'll gonna hate me but the bolt came out with ease..so IDK if Im gonna replace that setup.
-Chains and sprocket
-Most of the wiring harness
-Oil tank
-headers
-battery

All thats left is the rest of the harness, subframe, frontend and such. Probably another 2-3 hours of work. Taking your time, bagging and labeling everything is a total PITA but worth it when you go to reassemble.

[Stickman400]

You're only a hardcore wheeler lover if you can put it all in a pile and re-build it like I did, lol

[CJM]

Originally posted by Stickman400
You're only a hardcore wheeler lover if you can put it all in a pile and re-build it like I did, lol

Ive built stuff that way before, its 100x faster and easier when you know wtf your staring at lol.

So on my order list:
New chain roller and swingarm chain slider. Still waiting on motosport for my 450r carb parts.

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by Stickman400
You're only a hardcore wheeler lover if you can put it all in a pile and re-build it like I did, lol

like this? lol.. bolts were randomly placed EVERYWHERE.

subscribed for progress :macho :)

[Stickman400]

Yea, like that. That's alot worse than mine though, lol

[CJM]

Welp motor, harness and subframe have been pulled. Sadly no pics right now cause the camera decided it doesnt want to turn on.

Gonna take the motor and clean it off best I can. Where did (think it was someone here) get that stuff to clean AL really well? I have AL wheel cleaner but I dont think thats gonna do it to well.

[Stickman400]

Eagle One MAG cleaner. That's what I used. I also used some aluminum acid my dad had, and that pretty much made my engine look brand new. I had to do some scrubbing with a toothbrush though, I had a lot of baked on clay and dirt.

[Fix29]

I was too lazy to bag and label everything when I did my build. I did place every bolt back on the frame though so I knew which bolt went where. It also helped to keep paint from building up in the threads.

[CJM]

Yea I tried mothers mag wheel cleaner, did some but not much. Im gonna get some AL acid.

Stupid camera is shot so no pics, pos kodak junk. Not that theres much to see, its basically all torn apart and reduced to the frame. Im sure we all know what that looks like.

I got the some poly plastic coming to make my own case saver (thanks for the idea Reece!) and some other misc parts. Intake boot I found a crack in so thats coming as well. Motosport.com must love me by now, I wish RMATV had OEM wtf happened IDK with that. Id buy it all from my local dealer but they suck so hard its not even funny.

I tested this epoxy paint stuff and while its ok (and probably hasnt cured yet cause I can still scratch it easy) I think PC the frame is the way to go. Paint yea I can touch it up, but a good PC job is much stronger. So I lean towards PC at this point, gonna go talk to a friend of a friend who does it and see if I can get a better price. Last time they quoted me 200 for sandblasting and PC. Im hoping to get it for 150 or less. All I want is gloss black with clear over it.

Cant wait to get the rear wheels and tires, +1 stem, GTT rear setup+GTT skid and some a-arms. Thinking Im gonna do the shocks, stem and arms first and save the wheels/tires for later since my rear wheels and tires are still ok-at least then I can ride it. Then in a few months Im gonna get the fronts done and thats that. Total rebuild pretty much from top to bottom..

[beastlywarrior]

capital blasted and pc'd a frame for 125 also why dont you like the klaws i was gonna get them to replace my razrs

[dxcody]

*total rebuild pretty much from top to bottom*

Dont you love it?

Whenever i get another job i am going to buy another 400ex and do a COMPLETE build on it. EVERYTHING that i want. Then use my one now as a practice/stunt quad to try out new stupid stuff on.

[CJM]

The klaws lack bite on hard packed roads when set to the medium/hard and are worthless when set to soft on sand, they just spin and spin and spin. I ride what equates to a sand pit, fine sand, harder sand, woods, etc. They also lack side traction and just dont grab very well. They tend to want to spin out when doing a wide arcing turn even if I lean alot. My buddy is equally unhappy with them. Maybe if the quad had less power they might work better IDK. I wish i had bought razrs instead.

Its clearly easy to see why they want to spinout and have problems with sidebite-they dont have any real tread there unlike the razrs and holeshots.

@Cody: Yea its been a long time coming lol. I just wish stuff wasnt that dang $$. Chances are Im gonna do everything but the wheels/tires and the arms for now. Im a bit sick of riding anyways right now too and need a break anyways.

[Stickman400]

I also found a crack in my intake boot (engine side) when I did my motor rebuild last year, I don't think it was all the way through, but I ordered a new one anyways. And I order damn near EVERYTHING from motosport nowadays. I rarely go to RM, DK or eBay. They have made so much money off me it's insane, but they have good products, great shipping and awesome customer service, so you can't really beat 'em.

[CJM]

Yea its one of those things I said F it, cause it will eventually go totally Im sure. So far motosport has made at least 200 bucks off me in the last few weeks. Shame they dont have a point system like RMATV or magic racing does lol.

Now where to get acid wash? No boat stores near me at all and no truck stops either. Im gonna go look at pepboys but I doubt they have anything either. I found some decently priced stuff on the net tho.

[Reece616]

Im glad I could help ya with the case saver idea... you gotta get some pics going tho.
Even if its with a phone Haha.
I'm trying to get my money together to get my stuff from coating but if you want to check out my build its here : http://www.hondaatvforums.net/forums/builds-projects-diy/17938-400ex-winter-overhaul.html

I was going to post it here too but got too lazy.

[HondaRacing83]

go gbc x rex all around, $240

[CJM]

Originally posted by HondaRacing83
go gbc x rex all around, $240

Too much bite. If you look at what most XC racers use-specially balance you notice its razr II front and razr rear.

Im not sure wtf you guys want to see pic wise. Its currently a jumble of parts strewn about a 5x5 spot in my garage. Ill take some when I reassemble it.

As for PC, got the PC guy to do it for 150 in gloss black. I felt 100 woulda been more fair but thats still a steal after I called several places. Had they a run on gloss black parts he said it would be cheaper but he doesnt have a run currently.

[quadmanw]

150 is definitely a steal. I just got my frame, swingarm, tie rods, and 2 motor mounts done for $250.. and thats a decent deal for around here.. I got textured black tho.. its more durable

[CJM]

Ill just be happy if it holds up for a good while. The PC from the factory is ok but crap compared to much else. Even the welds are subpar in some spots imho.

[quadmanw]

a gusset kit was a must.. lol. I had my own made and welded it in

[CJM]

Originally posted by quadmanw
a gusset kit was a must.. lol. I had my own made and welded it in

Im not to worried, I dont do any insane jumps at all so it should hold up fine. If I was doing 100ft table tops and such then yea lol.

[quadmanw]

I could do it cheap and I weigh 250lbs so what the he11 haha

[Stickman400]

Originally posted by CJM
Ill just be happy if it holds up for a good while. The PC from the factory is ok but crap compared to much else. Even the welds are subpar in some spots imho. I took a dremel and ground down all the splatter from the crappy welds from the factory, it looks pretty clean and smooth now. And I also bought a gusset kit from Bare Performance and welded it in, but I also huck my 400 over 80 foot tables about 20-30 times a day, so I think I need it.

[CJM]

Yea im like 190lbs, I ride sand which is forgiving and usually dont jump anything over like maybe 20-50ft at best. Most of my jumping consists of small stuff and doing step ups on near vertical walls lol..

Think ill grind down the crappy welds before I drop it off tomorrow tho.

[quadmanw]

sounds like a good idea.. lol

[CJM]

UPDATE

Will take some pics tomorrow during assembly.

Got my frame back from powdercoating, they did a really nice job. Gloss black, nothing special. I wanted a tough durable finish, coulda done a custom color but nothing imho really works with a red/black quad besides black or silver. I didnt bother doing the a-arms b/c Im going to buy +1s sooner or later.

I did make a custom plate to go over the 450r carb throttle sensor. I basically took some sheetmetal I had laying around, cut it to the shape of the sensor and put an O ring on there to seal it then used some washer to make it a wee bit higher as the end of the rod that controls the butterfly sticks out a bit into the sensor. Since Im not using the sensor Im sure it will be fine, really cleans up the carb nicely.

I also seem to have spent about 200 bucks alone in odds and ends, rubber bushings, various carb parts, etc. Still need a few more things.

Going to try and call jet tomorrow and see about revalving my rear shock for long travel with the GT Thunder XC link, then work on figuring out how to run a skidplate like the GTT and such. Need to also order a poly case saver (tried your method reece but the material I got is WAY to soft and I cant find anything else), also need to do the swingarm bearings and work on getting some new rear wheels and tires as well. The arms will be the last thing.

Phew this stuff costs ALOT of money! I really need to do a full tune up to my truck, timing belt/waterpump and get a rear axle but that cash is tied up in the sale of my F250 which I sold to my boss whom is STILL paying me. I guess I cant complain he now found it needs alot of stuff that we previously figured was fine.

Anyways, pics tomorrow during limited assembly.

[CJM]

Forgot to add:

Anyone used the sparks clutch kit? Im sure by now even tho the clutch feels fine it needs to be replaced and possibly the basket. I havent changed a thing since I bought the quad more than 5 years ago.

Its either sparks or OEM, read some BAD reviews about the tusk fibers swelling very badly for many people.

[quadmanw]

I was just talking to zeb400ex and gtt has em on eBay for $212... I didn't look yet tho man

[quadmanw]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/GT-Thunder-400EX-8-Plate-clutch-kit-ATV-MX-XC-/370494887292?pt=Motors_ATV_Parts_Accessories&hash=item564337557c&vxp=mtr

Can't go wrong with GTT

[Reece616]

That sucks that the poly you got wasn't right. I wish I could find out the hardness I have, it seems really good.
also, if you're replacing the swing arm bearings, I found its real easy if you freeze them over night, get it started with a 2x4 and hammer, and then get a long threaded bolt, 2 thick washers about the size of the bearing, and a nut for the bolt.
Using a socket wrench and an impact wrench you can pull it right in.

[CJM]

Sometimes thats just the way it goes.

Good idea with the swingarm bearings, I was gonna either find someone with a press or pound them in.

[CJM]

For the price the GTT kit looks better, comes with side gasket and a new pressure plate as well for only a bit more than the sparks kit. I think Ill nab it.

[Reece616]

Yea, it works great.
I first found it out by installing a steering stem bearing in my old 250ex.
It works great for that as well, and I plan to use the same method for my wheel bearings probly tomorrow.

[Stickman400]

Sounds like you're going through just about everything I did. I ended up spending alot of money on alot of small OEM parts, bolts and spacers from the farm store too.

[CJM]

Every rubber bushing is worn out pretty much lol. Dang things are not cheap either. But yea the whole build is $$$, I have so much vested in the quad already that it wasnt worth it to sell, thats why Im doing all of this.

I still really want to do the linkage and shock Stickman, just worry it will wind up like yours and be a problem.

[CJM]

YES! Scored that GTT clutch kit for 190. It pays to make offers sometimes!

[quadmanw]

Good deal man. I'm getting one next! Lol

[Stickman400]

If you raise your box up as far as you can like I did with the zip-ties then you shouldn't have a problem there. The only thing is that damn caliper, I still don't think it will clear the frame, even the stock one, unless you flip the carrier. You might get lucky though, who knows.

[CJM]

This is as far as I got today:

http://i41.tinypic.com/nmeu0h.jpg

Taking it apart was MUCH easier lol

[dxcody]

Now you have the fun part ,,, cleaning all the parts before you put them back on etc.. But

in the end you will love how it looks.

I can already tell its going to look sweet!

[400man]

yep, just take your time and make sure everything gets done right the first time. then go RIDE! :D

[CJM]

Yea I was cleaning up some of the bolts and stuff today. Dang sand is tough to clean off tho, when it becomes mud and bakes on its like glue.

[CJM]

So I got the swingarm bearings in, I epoxied the inside of the hole on the one side the bearing was being a pain and I gouged it a bit.

I decided I probably wont be going long travel right now. I may also put it back together and just ride it as is till the clutch goes out as Im sick of waiting for it to come (been over a week now??). Its amazing how the one I believe is stock is still holding up since i bought the quad years ago. Guess I just know how to shift lol..

In other news, as many of you may have read: Im seriously considering a 450r in my future. The good news is I am going to keep my EX. Ive spent way too much time, effort and money on it to let it go, but it just aint got the power I need anymore, Ive effectively outgrown it.

Probably by summer Ill have the cash for the 450. I have to do an axle in my pick up truck, brakes all the way around, need a timing belt and tune up as well. Thank god I can do most of this work myself but an axle is gonna set me back probably a G. 225k and I cant kill my toyota, but she has seen better days. Id like a new truck, but everything I find is way overpriced or somethings wrong with it and Im a VERY picky person when it comes to this stuff.

[dxcody]

I see the 400ex as more of a transition quad than anything if you ride very hard at all.

Epecially now that you are getting a little more comfortable on the 450's. I actually rode multiple 450's before i ever even sat on a 400ex, so a 400ex was a temporary quad for me from the get-go. Once you get used to those 450's.. nothing is ever the same.

I am going to buy another 400ex probably sunday. I miss my old one a little so i am going to try and get this really nice RUNNING 400ex as a straight trade for my z400 and in October when i turn 18... Guess who is going to get a co-signed loan for a 450R! Lol I can stick out a 400ex until then.

[CJM]

lol

Oh dont get me wrong, when i was going to buy a 450r originally like 5+ years ago they were still fairly new and WAY overpriced. I stole my EX (not literally you nitwits lol!) for 1500 bucks when they were still selling for 3k easy. So in total I probably have 2k into it, which imho isnt bad considering alot of the things I have done were just for me and not really needed for it.

Ive been needing more power for a long time tho. The old girl just aint powerful enough for me anymore.

[dxcody]

Well the way i see it is, Your probably not going to see a huge difference in power of your 400 now and a bone stock 450r. (04-05)

BUT if you go much further with your 400, then you really start to take away the reliability of the 400. So you may as well have a 450 anyways. The only thing you are really losing is dirtcheap parts and easy maintainence/rebuilds.

I have a buddy who is racing "A" class this year in MAXC and "B" class in GNCC, and he has Toby do all his motorwork for him on his 05 kicker 450r. (Toby= owner of MXP) And he let me ride his quad and its badas*. I think its a 480 or somrthing like that but its got the 13.1:1 piston in it and cam'd and all kinds of stuff.

After riding that, then hoping on a 400... Its just not even fun. seriously.

However it does make me wonder exactly how i could always keep up with him... :D

[CJM]

I wouldnt leave the 450r stock, Its gonna get a hi-comp piston and a cam as well as a few other goodies when I first get it.

[CJM]

Update:

Got the 450r carb on there, what a total pita. ZRs adapters good but imho could be a about 5mm longer cause getting the boot on it while ok it doesnt go on all the way too the ridge on the adapter. Just makes me feel its unsecure but im paranoid. Holy hell getting the carb into the boot on the head, I sanded it down and still had to use wd40 (thanks steve) to get it on there.

So I get it all on there and wtf now the plastics do not want to fit on. my fronts needed to be coaxed and turned out ok, but the rear doesnt want ti fit on right. I had enough of playing with it so I tried to fire it up.

Funny, it cranked just fine 20 mins prior when I filled it back up with oil and used the engine to circulate it. It starts up once, shuts down and now the solenoid just clicks. I checked the battery, thats fine, checked the rest of the wiring, then I checked the grounds and even jumped it to be sure, it took a dump on me. Jumping it directly to the starter works fine, put on the battery click, put ont he solenoid click..

On top of it all ill be spending tomorrow checking my float and float needle cause it poured gas out the overflow tube on the carb.

Im not a happy camper..

[quadmanw]

Sometimes I think why we even rebuild em.. Lol. I have a feeling this is gonna happen to me when I start to rebuild it this weekend, finally!

[Stickman400]

I am paranoid about that gap between the adapter and the air boot too. And it was a major PITA to get the whole assembly in the frame while keeping the carb. and airbox all together, had to wedge it all in there and make sure it all stayed tight and sealed, ridiculous. And I had to crank mine over forever to get it to fire up the first time after I got it all back together. It still needs choked even when its sitting in my shop thats 70 degrees inside, and that's with the 52 pilot. Idk what the hell im gunna do in the winter if I want to ride it. I guess ima have to rig up a choke lever.

Anywho it sounds like your solnoid took a dump, mine did that same thing, just up and quit on me. And no matter what I wiggled or tightened it just kept clicking until I replaced it.

[CJM]

Yea I got a friends solenoid to make sure mines bad, gonna do it today.

Did you have an issue getting the plastics to fit?

[Stickman400]

The rears I had to fiddle with a bit to get to clear the airbox since I raised it. Still haven't put the front ones on. Gunna wait until I put the a-arms on and get them all bolted up and the toe and everything set before I throw them on, that way the fenders aren't in the way.

[CJM]

Im sorry Im not much of a picture taker. Ill take some when I get a chance, but I been working diligently since sunday to get it read for this upcoming weekend.

Starter solenoid is good, damn wire to the starter was giving me a fit for some reason. I threw away the washers that were on it and use some metal ones. I also tightened up the stud on it too as it was a bit loose.

I have the entire thing about 95% together. I need to readjust the chain, even where it was before either its loosening up or I need to take alink out. Wonder if this has anything to do with the bearings being bad in by the pivot bolt and now they are all nice and new.

The carb runs excellent. I had to put a new float and float needle in, thankgod I have one coming and I had another carb someone else is having me work on that I took the float from. I was at 175/42 with my 400ex keihin, the 450r keihin I did 172/52 and 2.5 turns out the air/fuel screw. I got a little bit of a backfire on decel when engine braking but it might just be a small adjustment, it was much worse with the EX carb even with the a/f out 3 turns.

It runs excellent, with all my mods I can definitely feel the extra power, it revs better now, idles better and seems to have alot more balls.

I also removed the snorkel, it just gets in the damn away and I plugged it with an old spraypaint can lid. Works fine. I also formed the gas tank a bit to clear the carb with a heatgun and moved the plastic mounts on the front up about 1/4 of an inch to accommodate the carb.

Let it be known that ZRs carb adapter is good, I wish it were a slight bit longer by maybe 31/4 or so of an inch-I feel it would work better that way imho and also the outer ring needs to be slightly smaller by maybe a hair to make fitting the airboot on easier.

Otherwise she runs, Im happy as a clam. Still gonna buy a 450r tho lol.

[TheAwesomehonda]

Well I had similar problems with the 450r carb 1. I can't cold start it without the choke 2. The front plastic side panels can't be pulled down for enough to get those two bolts that screw into frame to fit 3. It just don't run that good with 180, 52.. There for i'm not using right now but I will work on it again in summer when it can start without the choke i hope. To get the intake that bolts to the head on I unbolted it from the head and forced it onto the carb with oil for lube and then it fit in ez and the intake boot went right on with the zrpilot adapter. caution it is hard to bolt the intake boot the the head with the carb on it. oh and i used zip ties for in place of the bolts that i coudn't get on.

[CJM]

I found that grinding the intake boot and the carb a little helped on the motor side. WD40 works wonders. The airbox boot still is annoying.

I had no problems getting it to run right, 3 pumps of the throttle it fires right up. I might modify the choke lever to work IDK.

[CJM]

PHEW! Found a missing nut, turns out it was to the lower engine mount!

[TheAwesomehonda]

Originally posted by CJM
I found that grinding the intake boot and the carb a little helped on the motor side. WD40 works wonders. The airbox boot still is annoying.

I had no problems getting it to run right, 3 pumps of the throttle it fires right up. I might modify the choke lever to work IDK. Ok and how do you have the hotstart pluged cuz i still think that may be my problem?

[CJM]

I bought the hotstart parts from honda, I put the plug piece in then I took the spring and put it in, then filled the nut thing that goes on top with gray rtv (what I had laying round. While it was still gooey I put it on and screwed it down right. No issues at all.

The rtv can clearly be seen coming out of the hotstart nut as well.

[TheAwesomehonda]

well i'm not sure if that could be my problem i just filled the hole with rvt then put in a bolt that i made to the right thread.

[CJM]

Welp pretty much done, just gotta play with the jetting a bit. So far Ive dropped down my main from a 172 on the Ex carb to a 170 on the 450 carb. 172 was much to rich, black fouled plug. Im guessing Ill wind up with 168.

Heres some pics as promised, I didnt put the bumper back on (need a new one but the stocker will do for now and I havent bought new a-arms yet):

http://i42.tinypic.com/35a54xd.jpg

http://i44.tinypic.com/13yl9ok.jpg

[jkosakowski]

How do those nerfs hold up i need a new pair and those are not to expensive and they have fat peg design.

[CJM]

I aint hurt them yet. About my only complaint is the bolts are kinda chinsey so I replaced them all with grade 8 stuff. Nothigns bent, broken or whatever since Ive had them. I like them b/c they solidly bolt to the pegs, subframe and front motor mounts.

[01boneless]

looks great marc!! got to be the fastest rebuild ever!

[CJM]

Thanks Bryson!

Im working on tuning the carb atm, it will start but its not all that easy. Im thinking I need to adjust the a/f screw a tad out maybe. Will see tomorrow.

Also got to put on some new rear brake pads and a few other things and Ill be ready for sunday.

[426kidz]

crazy how much better a painted frame can make a bike look great fast look man!

[powerbomb400]

Looks good CJM. I think that taking one all the way to the frame and then putting it all back together takes lots of patience. Looks like top notch rebuild. Will tomorrow be its maiden voyage?

[CJM]

Yea, really sets the quad off. Im still debating buying the a-arms I want, gonna do JD performance gullwings or do houser standards +1. Really also want to do the rear setup as well but thats when I got more time..maybe this summer.

Also will be buying a prm bumper for it, belly skid and grab bar in the next few weeks. Shame I didnt get the belly skid..might muck up the powdercoat now till I get one lol.

450r carb I think i got right, didnt have much time to mess with it. So far 170/52 and 2.75 out the air/fuel screw. I bought a 50 pilot today just for the heck of it tho incase.

[CJM]

To anyone whose interested:

-Most work on the quad has stalled for now. Im in the process of buying and putting in a new rear axle for my pick up truck.

-When I get some more cash the back is getting long travel, new bumper, grab bar and belly skid as well. I want a 450 but I think Ill be buying a friends 05 cheap so Ill have to see. If not I can wait for now.


-The 450r carb was SOOO worth it, even with some problems last week it was great when I was riding. Even my friend with a very worked 450r commented he was surprised how fast it was.

-To note about the R carb: Be careful installing it.

1. You need to make sure you grind the air boot (airbox) enough to fit it. This was a pain but necessary.

2. Jetting should be close to if not LESS than your EX carb. The carb pulls more vacuum, you need less fuel. Should you need to up to an insane jet check for air leaks. I was at 170/172 and now Im at 168. I have no air leaks and sealed the hotstart by putting in the plunger and spring and then filling the cap/nut with RTV and putting it on tight. No leaks, no problems. Im still a bit rich I think, but I will see after riding it. I rather be rich than lean.

3. You can remove the TPS sensor. I made a small block off plate but its not needed. The heater is also not needed, remove it or clip the wires.

4. WATCH out with part interchangeability! I thought the accelerator on the R carb was bad so I swapped it with the EX accel pump. THEY ARE NOT THE SAME! The Ex is like 1-2mm shorter than the R. Surprisingly alot of other parts are the same however.

5. I had problems with a lowend stumble. I thought it was jetting, but its not. Turns out since I was using the EX accel pump the arm wasnt touching it right. I swapped back and it still had a small bog and would often shut off when idling and you snapped the throttle or when riding in 1st gear and almost idling along. I bent the arm to rest on the accel pump, NO more issues at all. Throttle response is instant, there is no problem with stumble or shut off.

-I also installed the white bros CDI i got. So far it hasnt given me any issues cranking it over, if anything it seems to crank over instantly (could be I got the jetting right and the accel pump fixed right.. IDK). I also have a procom one coming just to see. I dont envision having any issues but Im going to carry the stock one just to be sure nest ride out. I honestly feel these things are mostly hype-but I would often run out of gearing and RPM too easily with the EX carb on there, maybe the 1000rpm extra isnt needed, but many it will help. I bought both of the cdi's cheap so its worth a shot in the dark.

The carb overall is VERY worth it. With the stumble and I believe my clutch slipping a bit I easily hung with stock 450s and even beat a slightly worked 05 (granted he cant shift well and weighs 50+ lbs more than me) but it spanked him.

We shall see what next week brings.

[dxcody]

Ok... I didnt wanna post this in the "What CDI should i buy?" thread for fear of starting a big argument.. But They said the CDI changes the timing curve a little. Just like the timing key. They say the timing key isnt reccomended for high compression pistons 11:1 and over unless your run 100+ octane and even then its not reccomended right?

SO my question is, is it OK to run a aftermarket CDI with a built motor if you wish to run a CDI?

Just a curious question.. I dont mean for people to take it the wrong way it just crossed my mind.


BTW: I think the black frame looks amazing and cant wait to see what you have in store for later.

You did a great job and as stated by Bryson, in record time too! lol

Glad it went so smooth for you minus the few little things you ran into.

[CJM]

I would guess it would affect it negatively. But then again I think it was pipeless who ran the +6 key with 11:1 and no problems. Either way I dont think the CDI advances (if it even does) the timing enough to worry about. We shall see I guess.

Thanks for the complements, its a fun build and imho totally worth it. Getting it all back together in record time is no sweat. I worked at it for at least 8 hours one day and 6 another and mostly had it finished.

[Pipeless416]

i should have added that i do run a base gasket and an oem thickness head gasket as well.

[CJM]

Interesting to know pipeless.

I still feel that with the cam Im sure Ill be fine. Dynamic vs static compression.

[Kwadrider04]

Question about shocks. I have a 400 similar to this one and I have just ordered some 2006 trx 450 shocks and haven't received them yet but. I have heard there is some minor grinding that must take place to bolt them up did you have to do this?

[quadmanw]

Yeah you'll have to grind the tops down just a little so you can like the holes up to put the bolt in. It's not hard at all. Takes a few minutes. You'll see when you go to put them on

[CJM]

Either you grind the shocks and make them worthless in my eyes should you ever want to sell them. Or you take a cold chisel or a heavy flathead screwdriver and knock off the welded on nut on the brackets. Then buy a carriage bolt 1.5 inches long, a nylock nut and regular nut. Take the carriage bolt, put it in from the underside where you knocked off the welded nut, put on the regular bolt and a washer then put the bracket on, then the nylock nut. You also have to relieve the bracket a bit on the shock mount with a dremel. Takes a whole 2 mins per side with a cutting wheel, its like 1/8 off.

In other news I wasnt very impressed with the white bros cdi. To me it didnt seem to do much if anything except maybe it revved out that extra 1000 rpm. It was about 35F-45F today and I had no issues starting it either.

As far as the quad goes, the 450r carb is nice but I did notice a loss in lowend power as many have noted. I also noticed I can rev out 1st and 2nd WAY to easy, however 3rd and 4th are a powerhouse. I will either have to live with it or go down another tooth in the rear sprocket. Im already at a 37T so a 36T might be the key.

[Kwadrider04]

It doesn't really matter on shocks they will not b removed. If I sell the quad the only reason would b to upgrade to a 450 and then I would not need the shocks

[CJM]

Still, destroying the shocks so they fit didnt sit well with me.

[Kwadrider04]

Yea I don't really like it either but would rather do that than take a chance on losing strength integrity of my frame so they will fit

[CJM]

Your taking off such a minute amount of the frame its pathetic. My friend and I have had it done for 2 years now at least and so far nothing has broken cause of it.

http://www.exriders.com/vbb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=187613 see number three, that little spot he says to grind the shock I cut off with a dremel in 5 mins.

[Kwadrider04]

Alright thanks you are a huge help on everything! Lol

[CJM]

Quite welcome.

[CJM]

Just ordered the following:

-PRM baja bumper
-PRM belly skid .190 (maybe I went overboard lol but it wont bend or break!)
-PRM desert grab bar
-TM design works chains lider

I have the GTT XC skid already, tell ya what that dang things SOLID!

Also pickedup a GTT XC link and reworked XC rear shock from pepshocks (forum member) for a good price. They are used but not abused.

Ill post some pics sunday if it rains and I get a chance to work out some measurements for the shock/link. I hope it goes smoother than stickmans setup did.

[01boneless]

Originally posted by CJM
Just ordered the following:

-PRM baja bumper
-PRM belly skid .190 (maybe I went overboard lol but it wont bend or break!)
-PRM desert grab bar
-TM design works chains lider

I have the GTT XC skid already, tell ya what that dang things SOLID!

Also pickedup a GTT XC link and reworked XC rear shock from pepshocks (forum member) for a good price. They are used but not abused.

Ill post some pics sunday if it rains and I get a chance to work out some measurements for the shock/link. I hope it goes smoother than stickmans setup did.

nice marc it will look awsome with the new bumper and grab bar!!

[CJM]

Im stoked I bought them Bryson. I honestly really wanted to do the a-arms but the price at PRM for the chains lider I need is cheaper than anywhere else, so I said F it and bought everything I wanted.

Now I just wonder if Im gonna need the 450r rear caliper for clearance. If so I got a problem b/c the axle nuts gonna hafta be cut off-I tried everything and it wont budge. Rad axle lock nut I guess if that happens.

[01boneless]

yea should look awsome man. and ive had to cut off seized locknuts befor not fun!!! heat dident help so i had to get it off some how lol i hope you have good luck with that link :ermm:

[CJM]

Nothing my dremel cant handle, I done worse lol.

[01boneless]

hahah ill admit i prolley use my dremel and 3-4 cutoff wheels a week!

[Stickman400]

Good luck. And I think you may get lucky with that caliper. On my setup it was either leave the stock caliper and have the caliper hit the frame and not get the full travel or put the 450R one on and gain the travel back, but move my airbox up and still get REALLY close to contacting the frame. I think if a person wanted to do it right you would have to chop the subframe up and change it around, but that's a bit overboard for a link and shock.

[Ruby Soho]

post more pictures man!

[CJM]

Update:
Shock, link and GTT skids on.. I adjusted the ride height of the shock and made it pretty high as well! But, the ride height is lower period. The seat itself is at least 2 inches lower and is gonna take some getting used to I guess. I dont know how much more I can adjust it, but it still seems quite soft so I think I have alot to play with. The height at the swingarm from the ground is really good imho, its not all that much lower imho, maybe an inch.

I clearanced the frame using a bottle jack from my pick up :D the 3lb sledge didnt do much. If anything I pushed it to far, but it seems ok. The airbox believe it or not doesnt seem to contact really with anything, its barely touching the swinger, but its bottomed out more than the shock has travel. I did put a 1/4 thick nut ion the back bracket for the heck of it tho.

I moved the exhaust over maybe another 1/4 of an inch at most. The caliper looks like its touching it in the pics but it isnt.

The GTT skid is very nice and strong, but even with my 36T sprocket I had to add some washers to get it away from the brake rotor and sprocket. I dont have the chain slider yet but Im going out tomorrow and will be fine Im sure, it doesnt rub too much. Im going to buy something at the hardware store to make a 3/16 spacer out of and use some longer bolts if I have to. Right now its shimmed using washers I had laying around.

Also in funny news I didnt realize like forever that my linkage and dogbone were backwards! The dogbone was on the frame and the linkage was on the swingarm. I kept trying to put it together with the GTT link and was like wtf its binding and wont go on right. Then I looked at stickmans thread for pics and realized my error. Funny thing is its been this way forever I think since I bought the quad like 7 years ago! That or I was careless with the rebuild 2 months back.

Anyways YES I took SOME pics..
Finished
http://i43.tinypic.com/2eal6ag.jpg

Redneck ingenuity
http://i42.tinypic.com/359e6f9.jpg

Airbox clearance
http://i41.tinypic.com/34hjnyt.jpg

Sprocket distance from subframe
http://i41.tinypic.com/2e2qkd3.jpg

Caliper clearance to exhaust
http://i41.tinypic.com/13zvh5j.jpg

[01boneless]

nice man looks like it came together pretty smooth!

[CJM]

You missed the 2 hours I spent trying to figure out why the link and the dogbone wouldnt go together right lol.

I spent the first half of the morning getting forum members 440rdr1 440 running good. All it took was a 180 main and a 52 pilot and she was off once we got it to stop flooding. Somehow the thing was actually running on a 118 main he told me when it finally did start yesterday! Your welcome btw bro, try and come riding with us next week!

[Stickman400]

Did you set the sag on the rear shock? That makes a huge difference in ride height. And did you flip the carrier? I'm assuming you didn't since you didn't mention it. Also I thought I had everything clearanced on mine but after the first few rides my exhaust still rubbed my caliper, and I already have it spaced out 1/4", but since my exhaust is sideways it binds it when you space it out so it pivots inward and messes everything up.:rolleyes: Looks good though.

[CJM]

Trust me I adjusted it alot by myself. Having an extra hand would certainly help since I cant measure it for myself while on the quad.

What I can say is its about an inch or so down on the adjuster nuts already (exposed threads an inch I should say). Its difficult b/c the old shock had very little real adjustment there.

[440rdr1]

Originally posted by CJM
You missed the 2 hours I spent trying to figure out why the link and the dogbone wouldnt go together right lol.

I spent the first half of the morning getting forum members 440rdr1 440 running good. All it took was a 180 main and a 52 pilot and she was off once we got it to stop flooding. Somehow the thing was actually running on a 118 main he told me when it finally did start yesterday! Your welcome btw bro, try and come riding with us next week!


hey man thanks again, i tested out the starting with no choke this am when it was around mid 40's and all it took was 2 pumps before cranking and it starts right up! i hope i can make it next time you ride, did you go today

[CJM]

I went today, wasnt worth it due to the rain. Cold, wet, nasty and talk about mud. I did get to test my long travel linkage and shock and it seemed very good, just gotta adjust it more.

We spent the better part of the day at a friends house fixing his yfz (its screwed but at least we know now).

Im happy your quad starts up and runs good now. Gonna go next week if its nice out if I can.

[TheAwesomehonda]

Originally posted by 440rdr1
hey man thanks again, i tested out the starting with no choke this am when it was around mid 40's and all it took was 2 pumps before cranking and it starts right up! i hope i can make it next time you ride, did you go today I happy to hear that your quad is running good with that carb. I just didn't have any luck starting it in the cold weather.

[440rdr1]

Prolly bc of the 118 main jet LOL. CJM knows his shat, had it running and riding in 1hr after ripping te carb apart

[TheAwesomehonda]

Originally posted by 440rdr1
Prolly bc of the 118 main jet LOL. CJM knows his shat, had it running and riding in 1hr after ripping te carb apart NO i was running a 52 pilot and 180 main but the pilot jet was really long and that may have been my problem and plus my plastic didn't sit quite right.

[CJM]

Originally posted by TheAwesomehonda
NO i was running a 52 pilot and 180 main but the pilot jet was really long and that may have been my problem and plus my plastic didn't sit quite right.

FYI: The longer pilot doesnt matter, I have both and it makes no difference.

So update:

Going out tomorrow if its nice to get the rear shock dialed in some more. But I think it needs heavier springs. The preload is literally set 2 inches down if not more and it still feels too soft. Ill have to see exactly tomorrow tho.

[TheAwesomehonda]

Originally posted by CJM
FYI: The longer pilot doesnt matter, I have both and it makes no difference.

So update:

Going out tomorrow if its nice to get the rear shock dialed in some more. But I think it needs heavier springs. The preload is literally set 2 inches down if not more and it still feels too soft. Ill have to see exactly tomorrow tho. Oh I didn't know that i thought it may make a difference but i guess not. I forgot do you have stock springs on the rear shock?

[HondaRacing83]

He has Eibach springs if I am correct

[CJM]

Yea they are eibachs from derisi. No amount of adjusting today really helped. The springs are just to soft.

The preload is pretty much maxed out and it still is soft. Rebound and compression are set properly but I bottom out to easy.

Gonna hafta put the stocker on and rework the shock.

[Stickman400]

Have you tried turning the preload in (CW)? That will make your spring stiffer.

[CJM]

Originally posted by Stickman400
Have you tried turning the preload in (CW)? That will make your spring stiffer.

Dude its down like 2 inches, Im not sure I have any more adjustment...and its STILL soft.

[Stickman400]

O, for some reason I thought you said you backed it all the way out and said it was still too soft, which is the wrong way to begin with. But yea, if it's that far in and still too soft then you need a heavier spring.

[CJM]

So i found an oil leak :(

I had taken off my clutch cover and redid the clutch. Everything seemed fine, but I noticed a small leak towards where the oil lines are.

Cleaned it off numerous times but I didnt find the exact spot b/c I didnt want to take off my new belly skid. Removed the skid and I found the leak, its the small drain plug under the oil lines on the case.

It has a copper crush washer on it that is probably worn out. So I sealed it up with some rtv and put the bolt back on. If that dont work Ill hafta track down the washer and hope it seals. 2 cent part coulda ruined my day!

[Stickman400]

That's a stupid check bolt too. I have NEVER used that to check the oil, it's a waste of time when you have a dipstick. Sure it tells you if you have fluid in your clutch, but if there isn't any on the dipstick then chances are that you don't have any in your clutch. Glad to hear you found it and it was something simple.

[Reece616]

After I put my quad back together I had an oil leak from one of the oil lines (that's what I thought you were gonna say.)
I checked it and the o-ring was fine, so I just threw another one on and it solved the problem.
(I dunno why I bothered telling that Haha)

Anyways, how does ur belly skid mount?

[CJM]

Its a PRM skid and mounts using several very nicely shaped adapters specific to the EX frame in design. It also uses special locking nuts of some sort as well. For the money im quite happy.

[TheAwesomehonda]

Originally posted by Stickman400
That's a stupid check bolt too. I have NEVER used that to check the oil, it's a waste of time when you have a dipstick. Sure it tells you if you have fluid in your clutch, but if there isn't any on the dipstick then chances are that you don't have any in your clutch. Glad to hear you found it and it was something simple. Sorry your wrong man.. That oil bolt does have a good use.. If your oil pump isn't working or your oil line is plugged. Oil is going to the tank and keeping that full but then there is none in the motor and you remove the bolt see that and save your motor before it runs tight.. Honda was thinking when they did that.

[CJM]

Also replaced the o-rings on the lines, I used a 12mm ring last time and squished on an 11mm ring-no more leaks.

As for that bolt saving you should something get clogged-I very much doubt that you could save your engine by pulling that bolt and realizing no oil comes out. By that time the motors already gonna be fried and knocking like crazy. So yea, sorry thats not the reason its there.

The reason it exists-to drain off the clutch side when you need to get in there so you dont spill whatever oils left in it when you take the cover off.

[TheAwesomehonda]

Sorry which one are we talking about?? b/c i was talking about the one on the clutch cover right by the oil lines.

[CJM]

Thats the one dude, its a drain.

Trust me, by the time you realize your oil system is clogged the engines fried.

[TheAwesomehonda]

Wrong again CJM.. I was reading the manual and noticed that they say when you change/check your oil level. You should check it with the dip stick and pull out that plug and make your it up even with the bottom of the hole. If they wanted it to be used to drain out extra oil they would have put it at the bottom of the cover.. Look at it man its about in inch up from the bottom of the cover, so tell me how much oil will come out of that hole...

[Stickman400]

:rolleyes:

[CJM]

http://www.straferight.com/photopost/data/500/medium/double-facepalm.jpg

So your just gonna quote the manual pretty much? Unless the atv is on its side oil will come flowing out like crazy from that hole. Hence it being nothing more than a drain plug. Manual be damned. The manual isnt always right, trust me on that one.

Go ahead and remove it and tell us what happens.

[Reece616]

I'm just gonna say I agree with both of you.

If you had some assumption that you had an oil feeding problem, pulling that bolt should tell you that oil isn't getting to your motor properly.
However, like CJM said, most times, your engine will probly be past the point of no return before you decide to pull that bolt.

I had a problem last year with mine where I had a terrible noise from the top end. I replaced the timing chain and tensioner, checked valves, and it was still there. I was thinking maybe the motor wasn't getting oil up there, so I checked the bolt and it was pouring out so it must have been... (the problem ended up being the decomp. mech on the cam)

The manual does say it's a check bolt, but I would guess most have never even bothered (so kind of pointless) also, when I took off my RCC, I just used the drain on the other side to get the oil out haha

[Reece616]

Also,
I was asking about the skid, and I realize it's too late since ur done with the tear down, etc., but I needed a skid, and I bought one on ebay that didn't have mounting hardware so I had to come up with my own. I used conduit hooks from lowes with some SS nuts and bolts, but I hated it.
As a solution, after I had a bare frame, I welded in some brackets, drilled and tapped them, and then had it coated. It's now SUPER easy to put on and take off the skid.

Just throwing that out there to anyone who may be in the same boat.

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i255/Reece616/welding04.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i255/Reece616/standingUp.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i255/Reece616/skidOn.jpg

[CJM]

I like that skid a bit better, mines a bit too wide in some spots-but it also protects the a-arm mounts and such as well-so thats the trade off.

[Reece616]

I'm sure (if you hadn't just PCed you frame) you could rig something up very similar.

I like the skid, it seems to be good.
Apparently, it's a Honda Racing skid, I cant really find them anywhere, but I got it for about $50-60.

[CJM]

Originally posted by Reece616
I'm sure (if you hadn't just PCed you frame) you could rig something up very similar.

I like the skid, it seems to be good.
Apparently, it's a Honda Racing skid, I cant really find them anywhere, but I got it for about $50-60.

Thats not bad at all. The PRM one was 100 bucks. What i do like is all of the mounts either use existing frame mounts or the other side is a solid piece of AL that goes between the frame and skid. Its very solid and def worth the cash.

As for the PC, I kinda wish I had done a different color as black shows everything-but should I mess it up its EZ to touch up.

I ever do another one I think Ill do red or blue or something.

[dxcody]

Red frames always lookbadass.

Im thinking about doing mine Red w/ white everything else and do little things blue. Like Block off plate, throttle cover, levers, etc.

Or White frame, black plastic and do little things red.


Not sure yet. Wont be until winter before i do that though probably.

[CJM]

Whatever I get next Im thinking silver plastic with black frame or red/black plastic with silver frame maybe.

Course theres also the idea of an orange plastic/black or silver frame.

Thats it, I need to be one of the only people on earth with an orange 450r lol.

[TheAwesomehonda]

Originally posted by CJM
http://www.straferight.com/photopost/data/500/medium/double-facepalm.jpg

So your just gonna quote the manual pretty much? Unless the atv is on its side oil will come flowing out like crazy from that hole. Hence it being nothing more than a drain plug. Manual be damned. The manual isnt always right, trust me on that one.

Go ahead and remove it and tell us what happens. Ok well after doing some testing i found out the answer to this disagreement. So if your motor is cold and you unscrew that plug the oil will come draining out. But if your motor has been riding for awhile and is warm the oil will not come draining out at all. I trying this on both my ex's but i also found that on the 01 which is beat and probobly has a worn out oil pump even if it is warm and you take out the plug in about 10 secs the oil will come out alittle. So if you warm up your quad for awhile and pull that plug the oil will come draining out as fast as it can?

[CJM]

My motor was totally warm and it came out easily, same as when it was cold.

Now back to my build please?

[TheAwesomehonda]

Originally posted by CJM
My motor was totally warm and it came out easily, same as when it was cold.

Now back to my build please? Hmm interesting man. b/c my 01 does that a little to.. Probobly just a worn oil pump.

[CJM]

Went for a ride today. I swapped the dual rate shock that was too soft with the GTT link for my stocker. Lesson learned, you REALLY should not run a stock shock and a GTT linkage. Everything cleared my exhaust when I checked and set it all up, but of course the axle aint gonna clear. I now have a decent sized dent in the exhaust from when I went over a jump...

Considering all options Im wondering if a longer swinger woulda been a better choice..hmmm Gonna try the dual rate shock I have and the stock link just to see tho.

Also I cant figure out why but the quad has plenty of power but man my gears go by WAY to fast. 1-2 go by super quick even with the 36T rear sprocket and 3-5 are so so. I can easily max out 2nd climbing a hill I used to have plenty of more throttle for. Infact I often must swap to 3rd. Maybe its the white bros cdi..dunno thats the only change engine wise besides the carb. Engine is tip top, just adjusted the valves, compression is great and no oil is burning or anything.

Anyways just thought Id update anyone interested.

[dxcody]

Thats my problem as well Marc, i just hate climbing hills and i think 90% of it is because my 2nd gear is so slow.

I think it raps out at like 15MPH.. It seems slow to me. but could just be me.

I like to hit hills at a decent speed. But i also like to have to low end gearing for those spots where you dont have any runs at hills.

Idk.. I guess im just weird.

[CJM]

My gears just pass by way to quick it seems. IDK.

[Stickman400]

Hmmm, mine still feels about perfect, maybe a tick slow, but not THAT bad. Your trails must be totally different from mine. And that sucks to hear about the exhaust. I'm getting pissed that my Big Gun won't clear the caliper keeps rubbing the mount where it's welded to the muffler. It's gunna rub the weld enough and break the exhaust some day, I know it's going to. Then I'm gunna buy a different pipe.

I don't think Big Gun spends very much $ into R&D for their exhaust pipes on anything other than the 450s. Every one that I have bought has had some kind of fitment issue.

[CJM]

Trails I can easily max out 5th gear if I want to in spots. We also have wide open areas, jumps, etc. Gonna try the stock CDI and see what happen as this reminds me of the procom CDI I tried-you made like ZERO power till you revved it to near the redline! The WB CDI is def better but not great. As for the exhaust-not a huge deal b/c its just a lexx slip on and they are cheap-but it does annoy me. I think Ill try a motoworks if I decided to buy a new one.

As for the shock, I was shocked that it did that. IDK anymore its really annoying me I cant seem to get this setup to work. Is the linkage not meant to jump at all whatsoever or something? Wonder if I shoulda gotten the MX linkage?

[Stickman400]

Did you have Dustin re-work the rear shock or did you just buy that new one and slap that on there? I had Dustin re-valve mine and it worked perfectly, even on my 70' table, didn't bottom out or anything.

[CJM]

I just bought it. Im debating to see if the one I bought is setup for the linkage (he said it was I could swear it) or not. Cause otherwise Ill send the stocker to Dustin and keep the dual rate if it works with the stock link.

[TheAwesomehonda]

Are you really toping out in fifth gear on trails? b/c thats like over 70 mph.

[CJM]

Originally posted by TheAwesomehonda
Are you really toping out in fifth gear on trails? b/c thats like over 70 mph.

You betcha, in some spots there are long straight stretches. Believe me, if I ran a GNCC I think Id do well-thats pretty much the riding we do-very fast trail riding and dunes/jumps.

Guys I usually ride with are very experienced riders, we all been riding for years.

[TheAwesomehonda]

Originally posted by CJM
You betcha, in some spots there are long straight stretches. Believe me, if I ran a GNCC I think Id do well-thats pretty much the riding we do-very fast trail riding and dunes/jumps.

Guys I usually ride with are very experienced riders, we all been riding for years. Well that sounds fun!!

[CJM]

Originally posted by TheAwesomehonda
Well that sounds fun!!

It is, wouldnt trade it for anything.

[Stickman400]

I'd just send that dual rate to Dustin and have him re-valve it. Anything around 200lbs. and you need the dual rate anyway. It sounds like it's in need of a rebuild or re-valve anyway if it was tuned for the link and still bottoming out.

[Stickman400]

Also make sure you set the sag properly when you get it back. I know when I got mine back from Dustin I slapped it on and tuned the compression and my first ride out it felt REALLY soft and almost un-useable. Then I set the sag properly and it was a whole new bike. The shock won't use it's full travel if it's half-way bottomed out when you are just sitting on it.

[CJM]

Just got info from the seller, he says he cant remember if it was done for the stock link or GT link :(

[440rdr1]

Originally posted by CJM
You betcha, in some spots there are long straight stretches. Believe me, if I ran a GNCC I think Id do well-thats pretty much the riding we do-very fast trail riding and dunes/jumps.

Guys I usually ride with are very experienced riders, we all been riding for years.


ill vouch for that, he deff rips on the trails...he left me in his dust - LITERALLY haha (too dry to follow).

[CJM]

Originally posted by 440rdr1
ill vouch for that, he deff rips on the trails...he left me in his dust - LITERALLY haha (too dry to follow).

Sorry it kinda happens lol.

My friend Julio wanted to know how the dust tastes btw :D

[440rdr1]

Originally posted by CJM
Sorry it kinda happens lol.

My friend Julio wanted to know how the dust tastes btw :D


yeah next time ill bring a respirator haha.

tell Julio his exhaust smells like a weed wacker and his dust tastes like shat! lol


btw, i only clipped 2 trees with my rear axle... the trails where wider than i expected - i grew up trail riding at my house in pa

[CJM]

Originally posted by 440rdr1
yeah next time ill bring a respirator haha.

tell Julio his exhaust smells like a weed wacker and his dust tastes like shat! lol


btw, i only clipped 2 trees with my rear axle... the trails where wider than i expected - i grew up trail riding at my house in pa

Ive lived without some kinda respirator for years lol. I swear thats one of the dustiest days I have ever been out there in all the years I been going.

Julios exhaust smells like candy lol, its the benol oil he uses, u ever lose him u can follow the smell lol..

I think the The wheels you got have less backspacing than stock (least the fronts, they seem to stick out less) b/c you should be around 48-49 and as measure we got what like 47. Rears probably 49. If I do bother to buy them, Im doing +1 on the front, which should do me fine.

[dustin_j]

Your issues are not related to the GTT XC link, they are related to using the wrong shock setup for the link and your weight. Based on your measurements, I'm sure the dual rate shock you have is setup for the stock link; definately not setup for a GTT link. It sucks that the seller told you wrong on what linkage it was setup for! Your stock spring is too light for your weight with the GTT linkage. The spring rate needs to be increased for your weight, as well as a revalve for your weight and the spring. As stickman mentioned, once the shock is setup for your weight and the linkage, it works well for jumping also.

The difference between linkages is just for tire size. I would recommend NOT running a GTT link until you get your shock setup for it, as it'll be too soft with the shocks you have. I also recommend that people check for clearance before using aftermarket suspension components. Modifications often need to be made to allow for the optimized and increased wheel travel.

You can try the dual rate with the stock link, but you'll still have the famous Honda "bucking." The GTT link with reworked shock will work a ton better than a longer swingarm with the stock linkage and shock.

[440rdr1]

your right, i lost you guys a few times in the dust and honestly smelt my way to find you like that 1 time the tree jumped out infront of me :devil: haha.

yeah next time i hope its not as dusty...ive never had my boxers get dusty from riding before haha (and before any1 chimes in...yes it was only dust!)

[CJM]

I kinda figured that Dustin, I just wanted to give it a shot to see what it was like more than anything else.

I think Ill be sending you the shock next week-just want to mount up the dual rate and see what its like with the stock link cause Im not sure which shock I want to redo.

@Chris:
Yea that dust was hell man. Hopefully 2 weeks from now its warm again cause thats the next time Im going.

[dustin_j]

Originally posted by CJM
I kinda figured that Dustin, I just wanted to give it a shot to see what it was like more than anything else.

I think Ill be sending you the shock next week-just want to mount up the dual rate and see what its like with the stock link cause Im not sure which shock I want to redo.


I understand completely; no harm in trying. I mainly wanted to make the point for other people who may be reading the thread, to prevent confusion with respect to the GTT linkages. You'll love the linkage once you have a shock setup for you!

[CJM]

Just thought Id update this:

Quads running fine. Had a few small issues like:

-PRM belly skid mount near the rear brake kinda eating into my case bolt b/c it sticks out a bit and no matter how I put it on it contacts it. I had to engineer a solution with a different bolt from the hardware store.

-Oil leak from the oil lines on the case. I changed o rings and it worked for 1 ride. Gave up and bought the oem o rings and dowel pins since its only 10 bucks.

-R carb is finicky. All summer long and fall it was ok with a 168m, rode 2 weeks ago and it was about 45F and it was lean enough to cause me some issues. I go out again swapping in a 170 and taking a 172 and 175 with me just incase.

-Plastics were nice. Were being the opportune word. They are pretty scratched and beat up now. Cant complain I paid 100 for them.

-GTT link works well. Dustin and I had to go to quite a heavy spring designed for a 250lb + rider. I still think we coulda gone higher. Really wished I had done +1 arms and redone the front shocks. Currently shocks are to hard and as Dustin put it "causing the rear to feel to soft" It still works ok tho.

-Biggest news is the 400 has taken a backseat to my 04 R that Ill be rebuilding this year. Ive pretty much reached what can be accomplished with the 400 and will be doing the R up and probably riding it more. Plans for the R are 12:1 piston, stage 2 HC, full exahust and port work. Might do a BBK IDK.

But yea, the ol 400 still lives and can hang with the 450s. In a recent ride thanks to my aggressive riding style I mostly had no issue dragging with them. They are faster but all are modified BBK setups. A stock 450 stands no chance.

[Blodg]

I enjoy reading your stuff but had to chuckle when you bagged and labled everything (as I do) but then were missing a motor mount bolt after assembly LOL.

I was thinking of going to the XC rear link but it sounds like a pain to get right and I am pretty happy with the stock rear shock.

[CJM]

Originally posted by Blodg
I enjoy reading your stuff but had to chuckle when you bagged and labled everything (as I do) but then were missing a motor mount bolt after assembly LOL.

I was thinking of going to the XC rear link but it sounds like a pain to get right and I am pretty happy with the stock rear shock.

Ya misread it. I put the bolt on and I didnt tighten it all the way and it fell off lol.

XC setup is kinda tough. 400 is tough setup as well b/c there isnt much love for them anymore. I had to do it all over again Id try revalving/respring the shock and put a longer swingarm on it.

450 is much easier. So long as you use the 06+ swingarm you can choose from about 10+ different setups. Ill be running an ARSFX setup on my 450 one day.

[Stickman400]

I'll be doing the same kinda engine setup on my 450 this winter also. Got the 400 done, now time to rebuild the 450 and tinker with it. I'm gunna take some things off the 400 and 450 and have them powdercoated to spruce things up abit also.

Good to hear you didn't have too many problems with everything. I think I got lucky with Dustin re-valving my rear shock after I dealt with everything else when I installed that GTT link at the begining of the year. He only valved it once and it was perfect.

[dustin_j]

As CJM stated, you really need to correct front and rear when going to an XC link. The goal of the XC link is to correct the rear progression (bucking), and move your wheel travel to allow 12" frame height at full extension and 1.5" frame height at bottom out. This is to make sure you can fully utilize all your wheel travel, and allow a lower ride height to aid in cornering with the tall tires.

The XC link should really have a disclaimer that the front shocks need to be corrected at the same time. CJM bought the XC link since he runs 20" rear tires (like the site says), but planned to keep the 450R fronts stock. However, the 450R fronts are too stiff and a little long; which counters the XC link. If you want optimal XC suspension performance from a 400EX, and you are getting suspension built for both front and rear, then do not hesitate to get the XC link. Otherwise, the MX link would actually be a better compromise since using it with taller tires would keep you around stock height while still removing the "bucking" feel of the stock 400EX link. I hope this is helpful to others.

CJM: I'm glad it's still working well; I don't blame you for putting the 400 on the back burner. They're great quads, but the 450 is a different animal :macho

[CJM]

Thanks Dustin. I wish I had done the front setup but thats for another day now that I got the 450 to do. Ive pretty much reached the pinnacle of what the 400 can be anyways.

@Stick: I think your light enough it works. Trust me I tried even the supposedly setup shock for the link the guy sold me and it didnt come close. I like a rather stiff setup anyways but the fronts still way to stiff with the R shocks. In the end Dustin is right-I probably shoulda done the MX link but its a bit late now.

Right now basically the rear will buck under extreme whoops sections if I really hammer it. I kinda counter this by leaning back as I go and keep on the throttle. But its still nowhere near ideal. Front is bouncing me back everytime I hit.

[Blodg]

I know the consensus is that the 450R front shocks are too stiff on the 400EX but mine feel great with no mods! I went full soft on the compression setting and backed off the preload and they are fantastic for fast trail riding. I do think they would be better with a revalve/and dual or triple springs but they work so well for me I can't see spending a couple hundred dollars or more to have them reworked. The rebound is perfect and I never get bucked or bounced from the fronts. Of course the fact that I weigh 220 lbs may have something to do with it. :D

[CJM]

Originally posted by Blodg
I know the consensus is that the 450R front shocks are too stiff on the 400EX but mine feel great with no mods! I went full soft on the compression setting and backed off the preload and they are fantastic for fast trail riding. I do think they would be better with a revalve/and dual or triple springs but they work so well for me I can't see spending a couple hundred dollars or more to have them reworked. The rebound is perfect and I never get bucked or bounced from the fronts. Of course the fact that I weigh 220 lbs may have something to do with it. :D

Your weight might help ya, my friends close to 300 and finds his fine.

For the riding I do in the sand pits and woods by me with alot of whoops it can get rough.

[CJM]

Apparently it would be that time again. Time to rebuild the engine it seems.

I have no idea how many hours really, rough guesstimate is approx 100hrs or better. I tend to never get more than a year outta them, I think its the fact I run all out all the time basically-the sand is unforgiving.

She starting to smoke and has been burning a bit of oil as of recently. Might get away with re-ringing it but I very much doubt it.

Going to keep running it as Im focusing on R&R my 450r. Guess Ill stop when it smokes like a 2 stroke. Not sure what Ill do, still have a 416 piston laying around but a stock hi comp setup imho might be better. Dang big bore pistons are heavy and create vibration!

[atvrider13]

Not sure what Ill do, still have a 416 piston laying around but a stock hi comp setup imho might be better. Dang big bore pistons are heavy and create vibration! [/B] I always thought the same CJM , but was quite suprised when i saw this the other day. 89mm piston weighed less than a 86mm
http://www.jepistons.com/Catalogs/Powersports/ATV-UTV/Honda/trx_400ex.aspx

[CJM]

Originally posted by atvrider13
I always thought the same CJM , but was quite suprised when i saw this the other day. 89mm piston weighed less than a 86mm
http://www.jepistons.com/Catalogs/Powersports/ATV-UTV/Honda/trx_400ex.aspx

That is strange.

I will say the 426 vibrates like no other it would seem and I have no crank play. 416 was fine too. Heavier piston causes more vibration.

I stuck to wiseco for the cheapness, JE might be a better idea next time. Still dunno if Im even gonna bother right now, rather build the 450 up.

[atvrider13]

I never had a JE piston either. I always have ran Wisecos. I had a 426 piston in mine a few years back and it never vibrated. I actually liked the power delivery better than the 440.

[CJM]

Yea IDK the machine has a distinct vibration for awhile now. I wonder if its the tires, I havent really tried to figure it out tho.