Roll Design CRF Flat Tracker

[pinitatv]

I picked up this TT Roll Design 250r converted CRF a few months back as a project/fixer upper. It's 1 of only a hand full of TT chassis' that were ever built by Doug, rumor is that it once belonged to Keith Little.

Its a pretty clean conversion but I wanted to make a few things better.

Here are a few pictures of when I first got it.

[pinitatv]

Its a narrow front with a +4

[pinitatv]

The swing arm was a little hacked up to get the chain alignment close..

[pinitatv]

...and a little more hacking to make the motor fit

[pinitatv]

The motor was actually a little crooked in the frame so I fixed the lower left frame rail and remounted the entire motor straight.

[pinitatv]

The only way I could fix the chain alignment was to build a new swing arm so I made one and saved a few pounds over the modified Roll that was in it.

[89trx250r]

Everything I have ever seen you post is always awesome pinit im looking forward to seeing the rest of the pics as it comes together :)

[matt250r21]

Awesome job on the repairs.

[becci4]

This was Keiths frame I almost picked it up. I called Keith to ask about it and he said it was his.

[mx Eli]

ahh I was waiting for this jody,

with new powder coating this frame looks amazing, craftsmanship off the charts, nice guy to deal with too

[97Rocks]

I have seen it up close. SUPER NICE!! Someone will enjoy it. Hurry up somebody and buy it so pinit can finish my Laeger KTM!

[pinitatv]

THANKS for all the kind comments!!

Its always cool to see/have a "Pro" bike, I knew this one was probably special when I started taking it apart because all components were pretty light and there was a fair amount of Ti on the bike. Anyway its cool to know some of the history.

MrRocks, I haven't even put a for sale sign on it yet... Don't worry the KTM will be done before you know it.

Here's a custom exhaust I built for it, my own little bomb of sorts :D

[pinitatv]

Other than the exhaust on a hybrid it seems like the intake is always a compromise, never quite the right length or the right angle or the right amount to room for a big carb!!!! I made a few changes to the frame so I could put a big carb on the motor.

[protrax]

Looks Great Jody!

[mx Eli]

btw jody have you looked into doing the extra chamber off you exhuast header like the joe byrd edition dasa or baldwin pipes? I know what there called but dont know how to spell it haha.
ressonans chamber, ressanons chamber... forgive me

[pinitatv]

Yes I have one in the works right now, I'm building it for my wife's laeger CRF just to see how it works.

Here's a bigger bomb that I recently built for a laeger CRF.

[hontrx265r]

we have had both styles of dasa one with the chamber and one without on the dyno back to back, only difference is noise. Basically no performance gain behind that style. Not sure about the fmf style which seems better imo.

[FW_cArBoN]

Jody,
As always, your works in amazing! I can't wait to see the final product of this machine!

Keep it up buddy!

- Jason

[mx Eli]

Originally posted by hontrx265r
we have had both styles of dasa one with the chamber and one without on the dyno back to back, only difference is noise. Basically no performance gain behind that style. Not sure about the fmf style which seems better imo.

any decrease in noise without baffles and stuff is great. thats why jody's cans are so big and long, keep me updated on your work on the chambers, might be looking for somthing new for 2012:chinese:

[JOHNDOE83]

Nice work!!!!

That head pipe is BAD TO THE BONE!!!!

[pinitatv]

265r - You're right on the head pipes I don't think there is any performance to be gained in either the FMF or dasa, but what I'm after is a larger diameter core in my can. I've found that a larger core will help mid to top and over rev but the trade off is sound so if I can save 2db on the head pipe and make the core bigger in the end I'm making more HP.

The ice racing group I play with once in a while makes everyone meet 99db with their stuff even though our state laws says 96db. Once you start running big valve motors with big cams and more overlap they get louder automatically so that's what I'm after with my BOMBs and quite canisters.

[pinitatv]

Jason - thanks!!! I think I'm going to need a sticker kit for this before its done, what do you think?

Here it is starting to go together

[pinitatv]

I wasn't sure on the color but here it is Blue and Flat Black with white full bores.

[pinitatv]

A little more progress.

[judecrf]

great job as always jody .fine looking work .

[ryanowarrior]

What color blue is that ^^ that looks badass

[mx Eli]

still no chance of you coming down to our series? I'm trying to get get a small group to come up and race with you guys

[pinitatv]

I thInk the color is ribbon blue it's a standard sherwin Williams color.

Eli. I doubt I'll see any seat time this year, if I'm lucky maybe I'll get to go watch one or two.

[mx Eli]

haha I can see the ktm waiting in the back... those quads beg to be ridden! you ever get the mx setup quads out on the track?

[pinitatv]

Its far from done but I'm getting closer. it needs a new sticker kit/seat cover for sure.

Eli - Every time I walk by the KTM I think about getting it back on the ice but it won't happen this year.... The MXers are really just fast trail riders I don't like to fly, I like all four or at least two wheels on the ground at all times. :D

[mx Eli]

hahah trail riders :D flying is fun just gota get used to it, its gota be around time for the kids of yours to start trail riding? you ever want to see one of them win on a mx track let me know I would be honored to ride a pinit quad!

Also I heard bradys rubber quad finished, how it turn out?

[pinitatv]

No the kids are too little for any real riding yet the daughter is 2yrs 9mths and the little guy just turned 7 months so riding and racing are on the back burner at least for now.

Brady's quad turned out good I guess, he sent one pic but it wasn't very clear. Check out his stem and bars when you see it something he and I came up with, pretty trick and of course light

:D

[mx Eli]

Him and that light weight stuff hahaha I'm going to the dyno with him as soon as he gets the Walsh back together, I'll have to look that crazy thing over last time we talked it was getting closer to his 200 pounds goal:eek:

[woodsracer144]

I almost got that quad.. did you fix that drop rail or just leave it?

[89trx250r]

Didnt you see the pictures pinit made it look like it came from roll design themselves...And pinit said the motor wasnt in the frame straight so when he fixed it he also lvl'd the motor...

[woodsracer144]

that photo didnt load when i first loaded look at them... my bad.

[pinitatv]

I made the intake out of stainless steel to use a 250r filter but the tube that mates with the carb is 2.5" to adapt with the bored and tapered carb.

[malibuj]

Nice work on the intake/exhaust systems!
I've got some exhaust work to do myself on my 650 hybrid. Any chance you could tell me where you get your mandrel bends from?:D

[pinitatv]

Thanks

I've purchased the u-bends from Burns Stainless and Speedway in the past you just have to shop around because the prices have really gone up in the last few years. If you know what you need just google it and see what comes up. Good luck!!

[k10seibel]

Thanks for the PSI link, Jody.
This sure is look'n real good.

[laeger400]

As always very nice work. The roll crf looks great.

Jerry

[danhung11]

Looks very nice Jody, as always! What's the rear upper shock adjustment for? I did not notice that before...

[mx Eli]

Originally posted by danhung11
Looks very nice Jody, as always! What's the rear upper shock adjustment for? I did not notice that before...
adjust ride height without screwing up shock settings, also easier to get at then preload.

[troybilt]

Looks awesome Jody. Anxious to see what you come up with for graphics. Going to be sick quad... already is... That's a sweet adjustment for the rear shock, never seen that before.

[pinitatv]

Thanks Andy! If you don't get that PSI I have one for you.:)

Andy, Jerry, Dan, Troy I've seen and admire the work all of you guys do and I appreciate your compliments on mine...

If you take a close look at that shock mount you'll see I moved it to the right to accommodate the larger intake and still leave enough room for the exhaust, its all a pretty tight fit. This worked out great because I had to move the rear carrier housing on the swing arm to the right as well to make the chain alignment right.

The adjuster is really to help make ride height changes without lengthening or shortening your rear shock. This helps to keep it in the "sweet spot" 3/8-3/4 zps gap. This quad is intended for flat track and ice racing so the rear tires will very in height pretty significantly. With the quick adjust its pretty simple to make a major adjustment without changing your shock or its characteristics. I've seen Walsh do something like this only he put the adjustment on the swing arm instead.

[huntertaylor98]

Originally posted by pinitatv
Thanks Andy! If you don't get that PSI I have one for you.:)

Andy, Jerry, Dan, Troy I've seen and admire the work all of you guys do and I appreciate your compliments on mine...

If you take a close look at that shock mount you'll see I moved it to the right to accommodate the larger intake and still leave enough room for the exhaust, its all a pretty tight fit. This worked out great because I had to move the rear carrier housing on the swing arm to the right as well to make the chain alignment right.

The adjuster is really to help make ride height changes without lengthening or shortening your rear shock. This helps to keep it in the "sweet spot" 3/8-3/4 zps gap. This quad is intended for flat track and ice racing so the rear tires will very in height pretty significantly. With the quick adjust its pretty simple to make a major adjustment without changing your shock or its characteristics. I've seen Walsh do something like this only he put the adjustment on the swing arm instead.

I'm wondering if you can do that for motocross

[pinitatv]

I'm sure it could be done for mx too with a little more gusseting of course.

How often do you change your ride height?

[mx Eli]

Originally posted by pinitatv
I'm sure it could be done for mx too with a little more gusseting of course.

How often do you change your ride height?

it depends mostly on the track, but not as much as you do in flat track, it'd be overkill in my opinion

[yfzttracer76]

This thing is awesome. You do really good work I've seen some of your other builds and everything really is top notch. Good job man

[dustin_j]

Originally posted by pinitatv
I've seen Walsh do something like this only he put the adjustment on the swing arm instead.

Do you happen to have a picture of Walsh's setup? The build is looking great!

[pinitatv]

This is the best I can do for you, enter this item number in ebay 280793584799 look at the last picture of the swing arm.

[dustin_j]

That's interesting, thank you for sharing. I'm excited to see more updates on this build :D

[pinitatv]

So I think its one of the last pieces of the puzzle. I have a PWR rad I'm going to put walsh like shrouds on, here are the mounting pieces just need to finish up the shrouds and its ready to go!!

[pinitatv]

I got the rest of my radiator parts today so I quickly put it together tonight. I have some tweaks to make on the next few but it turned out pretty good I think.

[pinitatv]

Here's another

[jerorski]

pmed ya jody

[pinitatv]

I have it almost complete just a few finishing touches

[pinitatv]

Here's another

[pinitatv]

with front fullbores

[jjohns5]

Looks great Jody, think I'm going with white fullbores on my build also, I will be in contact to grab those blue Hardkor hubs off of you soon...

[jjohns5]

Pm'ed on the Hubs

[gtilley45]

Originally posted by huntertaylor98
I'm wondering if you can do that for motocross

My Walsh has the adjustable front shock mounts and my shock guy told me that you didn't want to rely solely on that to adjust ride height because you're only moving the shock up or down. So for example...if you lower the ride height this way, the shock will still have all the same settings and travel so you'll be bottoming out too much.

[danhung11]

Originally posted by gtilley45
My Walsh has the adjustable front shock mounts and my shock guy told me that you didn't want to rely solely on that to adjust ride height because you're only moving the shock up or down. So for example...if you lower the ride height this way, the shock will still have all the same settings and travel so you'll be bottoming out too much.

That's a good point Grant. Did your shock builder mention at what adjustment should the measurements be taken? I will be at this stage soon, and was curious to know before I ordered shocks. I was thinking it should be in the middle position, but didn't want to assume... Thanks for bringing this up.

[gtilley45]

Mine had exactly 1" between the shock mount and the part of the frame it goes through if that makes any sense....which is pretty much right in the middle. We had the eye to eye length of the shocks, then put the quad on a stand to measure extended length, then took the shocks off and let the frame sit on 2x4's front and rear so the frame is 1.5 inches off the ground to get the compressed length and went from there. He said my front shocks were almost the same spec as one of the front ends (can't remember which) for a yamaha. And we actually had to do the same kind of measuring for the rear compressed length. At first Custom Axis said they couldn't build a shock with the PRS because the compressed length wasn't long enough. But we got some measurements and was able to make it work.

Let me know if you need pics. I've got a bunch and can get more if anybody needs them.

[danhung11]

Thanks Grant. I was referring to where your adjustments were set, haven't crossed that bridge with my current build.

BTW Jody, any final pics of this bad boy? :D

[pinitatv]

Well here's the sort of final product, but still missing a few cosmetic items.....

gtilley

Your shock guy is right, there is a sweet spot I try to run on my PEP shocks its 3/8"-3/4" zps. You can lengthen and shorten a shock internally if need be, its easy to do at home but on race day its a lot of extra crap to bring along and play with. I like to make these types of "major" adjustments in the shop. On race day the adjustable towers are great for fine tuning without messing with your zps too much.

[pinitatv]

And its for Sale on EBAY

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=190675993182&ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1555.l2649#ht_578wt_1182

[gtilley45]

I agree. But then again, I have Fox front shocks so all I have to do to adjust ride height is adjust my air pressure.

[hontrx265r]

Not going to get all into shock setup, but remember gtilley, which I think you know but even though you change your ride height. Your extended travel/droop will not change. Which is what jodys talking about I think. I'm in the process of doing this on my axis pro airs (shortening the droop by limiting it internally) this will basically help hold the bike to the ground, but does shorten overall travel.

[gtilley45]

Originally posted by hontrx265r
Not going to get all into shock setup, but remember gtilley, which I think you know but even though you change your ride height. Your extended travel/droop will not change. Which is what jodys talking about I think. I'm in the process of doing this on my axis pro airs (shortening the droop by limiting it internally) this will basically help hold the bike to the ground, but does shorten overall travel.

Oh yeah, I know exactly what you're saying as long as we're using the same terms. By "droop" do you mean the difference in the length of the shock when I'm on the quad with ride height set and the extended length (quad off the ground) of the shock? Or something completely different?

[Lasher]

On my Walsh with adjustable front shock towers, I was told to set the quad on 2x4s with the shocks removed and then adjust the towers to the compressed length of my shocks.

This would allow the shocks to bottom out before the frame hits the ground.

[ryanowarrior]

Was u referring to removing the springs on the shocks ^^ that's the process I use

[gtilley45]

Lasher-that's what I did too. That and removing the springs would both work wouldn't it?

[dustin_j]

The problem with only removing springs is that the bottom out bumpers will not give you a true bottom out condition. Depending on the durometer, bottom out bumpers can compress more than you would imagine.

[ryanowarrior]

True ^^ I always tried to allow 1 1/4- 1 3/4 for the bump stops and/or add spacers under them to adjust on those measurements

[Lasher]

I was not talking about removing the spring, but the whole shock.

Here is my son's Walsh sitting on the 2x4s...

[gtilley45]

That's what I did.

Hey Lasher, how hard was it to get Rath to make those nerf bars and was it crazy expensive?

[dustin_j]

Originally posted by Lasher
I was not talking about removing the spring, but the whole shock.

Here is my son's Walsh sitting on the 2x4s...

I agree that this is the correct method, I was just pointing out issues/differences with removing springs only. What do you use for extended frame height? I have been using 12" for MX and XC.

[Lasher]

Nerfbars - I called Rath and placed an order. Not hard at all. I think they were in the $300+ range, with monster pegs. These are really nice and might sell the AC nerfs on my Walsh 250r and buy a set of the Rath.

Ride height, I think we are down around 7.5 inches to 8 inches range. Not sure, don't remember the exact numbers.

For the extended I did nothing. I used the 2x4s to set the shock tower height for compressed. I let the length Custom Axis built to their specs as the extended. Never checked to see how high the frame is when fully extended.

[jjones60]

Originally posted by pinitatv
And its for Sale on EBAY

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=190675993182&ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1555.l2649#ht_578wt_1182

I haven't even looked at ANY quad-related things since I drove home from Wisconsin last year. Now, I wish I hadn't, it makes me really miss that bike.

Thanks for not being too harsh about its condition when you got it. It was obviously nowhere near your standards.

Great job on the rebuild, I'm really impressed.