Pappy and other Camera gurus

[fastredrider44]

I posted this here for more attention, but if it needs to be moved to the Photography section, please do so.

Yes, this is another one of "those" threads. I'm looking to buy a camera for my girl for Christmas. She's been coming to races and the regular ol pocket digital cameras with limited zoom and not being able to take a fast picture, or several pictures in a row has her wanting more. So, without breaking the bank, what should I look for. I'm not opposed to buying used either. She is by no means looking to become a photographer, but a better camera would be a fun toy. 1000 is the limit, 500 is about what I want to pay.

Since you can buy a used fourwheeler that is race ready and in great shape for the price of a new one, can this be done in cameras? Since you can't test ride a camera, what could I look for if I was to buy used? How old is too old in the camera world? Are they done by year or model number? Should i forget that and buy new?

Thanks in advance,
Chase

[Pappy]

I'd look at the Nikon d7000 or the canon rebel line. You should be able to get a "kit" for around your budget that should net her everything she needs to get her feet wet.

You can buy used, but the kits are well priced and yes, the technology goes pretty fast with camera gear but most of the new stuff is alot of gimmick and not alot of usable stuff that I would pay extra for.

Check out www.buydig.com & www.bhphoto.com

Do not buy from the fly by night online places

[miller821]

I can vouch for the D7000 being a great camera.. I'm actually starting to prefer it over my D200 due to its awesome High ISO for a DX camera... However the price for new is $1199 and used its still around $950... This leaves you right at your budget, but with no lens to even start taking pictures with... Here's a pretty good deal if your willing to spend about $700 over budget.

http://www.costco.com/Browse/Product.aspx?Prodid=11626926&whse=BC&Ne=5000001+4000000&eCat=BC|90607|83&N=4047261

For about $650, Nikon's D5100 has gotten some pretty good reviews as well. I've not personally used/held it, but here's a sample thread of some images:

http://www.nikoncafe.com/vforums/showthread.php?t=310015&page=3

The camera:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=&sku=764100&Q=&is=REG&A=details

[QuadJunkies]

Originally posted by fastredrider44
Should i forget that and buy new?

Thanks in advance,
Chase

Personally I would buy new - And with a warrenty. I have had to use mine a couple times and it paid for itself. Well worth the added price tag A trip to the Service Dept. can get pricey .:scary:

[sexysilverado45]

I dont wanna high Jack your thread but im wanting to buy a t1i t2i or a t3i where do those rank for the average user. I know you can find them the t2i for 400-600 with a lens on ebay.

[Pappy]

That line of Canon will be fine. If I was only shooting for myself, most of the basic entry level body's can easily pull images that rank with Pro gear. Get good glass, it is more important then the camera itself 99% of the time, as well as learning how to use the camera and basic photography.

Nikon should be releasing a new Pro and Pro-sumer body this winter. Havent decided yet if I will upgrade or just stick out another year with what I have. I will grab a D7000 or its new equivalent just for static shots and landscape work.

I work with people all the time that blame their gear and once I teach them a few basic things, they are amazed at their results.

If you are looking Nikon used, a D300s really is probably one of the best bodys made bar none. They are out there, just have to look the big camera sellers refurb or used departments over and watch ebay.

I pulled this image up from a shoot back in 2008 and image quality is on par with my $5500 D3. I used a d300 and still carry one daily!

http://kenhill.smugmug.com/photos/i-8BgQ5jw/0/L/i-8BgQ5jw-L.jpg

[fastredrider44]

I will definately look into the Nikons, and the Canons. Dad has a rebel so I'm kinda familiar with how they work already. I was looking at the cameras online, and the rebels have lots of letters and crap like Xsi, so it makes finding a particular camera hard. Are the Nikons the same way? Also, I noticed a wide variety of lenses available. Is there a lens I should try to get, or should I just plan on having to get two?

[QuadJunkies]

Originally posted by fastredrider44
I will definately look into the Nikons, and the Canons. Dad has a rebel so I'm kinda familiar with how they work already. I was looking at the cameras online, and the rebels have lots of letters and crap like Xsi, so it makes finding a particular camera hard. Are the Nikons the same way? Also, I noticed a wide variety of lenses available. Is there a lens I should try to get, or should I just plan on having to get two? any rebels going to work just fine. Im buying my son one for xmas for photography classes. A rebel was my first camera back when 8pix was pretty decent and some of my best photos still to date were off that camera. Pappy is totally right on glass. Glass is where its at. From there you will find your own reasons for wanting tp upgrade. Mine was sport lense capabilites and slower. Also focal points and my two combinations just didnt work well with one another. Also wanted a larger body and more FPS. Everyones different and everyones fit and feel are different. Theres alot of great equipment out there now.

[Pappy]

Lenses are like shocks. PEP versus stock.....Kit vs Prime
I carry 2 main lenses at the races, a 17-35 and a 70-200...both Pro Glass (Prime)

Those allow me to catch just about everything. I prefer fixed focal length but you cant always get where you want at so many locations that a zoom is a must have, for me anyway.

Most carry a 24-70 but on my D300's crop the 17-35 gives me a more usuable zoom range for podium work. If I need wider I put it on my D3.

I'm not up on the Canon monikers per model of Rebel. The Nikon series are all D and then carry a numerical assigment. I got to play with a D7000 thats omeone handed me at a race and really liked it and the reviews i've seen have been mainly positive. You pick your brand and roll with it. Ive shot Nikon since the 80's....Harlen (Admin) shoots Canon and they are all but equal, except that his have seen the repair shop alot more then mine LOL! Canon is a bit cheaper on lenses, available at more retail locations (Best Buy) and offers cheaper and faster service work.

[QuadJunkies]

Im sure that has alot to do with all the travel he does putting alot of miles on his cameras. Not saying yours doesnt lol but you know what i mean.

Thats another reason why i upgraded. DUST and water. I wanted a camera more tightly sealed.
i wish i could play with the new canon that just hit the market. Super sick fps !

Im buying another lense this spring.... pondering on a 24-70 but i have an 11-17 so maybe ill try a 17-35 if canon has them.ill have to research that.

[miller821]

Like said by Pappy and QJ, great lenses can make or break your photos... I'd personally recommend holding off on more expensive glass until you know what Focal Length you will be needing... Play with your camera with just a kit 18-55 and 55-200 or 70-300 for a while... Nikon offers some great primes for static shots at cheap prices... My 35 1.8 and 50 1.8 both only cost $365 together and are priceless when it comes to indoor or group shots. A great 70-300VR can be found for about $350...

How familiar with SLR's is she?

[fastredrider44]

I hate this. I'm having to google what the crap yall are talking about.:confused: But I'm learning, and trying. As far as SLR... If I understood that correctly, she's probably not as familiar with them as I am. I can use dad's rebel to get the job done when needed, but I'm not sure shes ever done much with a camera like this. Coming up, she has some photography class in school, also another reason I was thinking about getting her started. I know the class requires a specific camera, but maybe the knowledge from one camera will transfer over.

Also, this is a G/F. Not wife, therefore the 1000 cap, and thats way more generous than I feel like I ought to be. Shes cuttin in on my race fund. I already told her not to be expecting me to sell any toys for a ring.

[QuadJunkies]

DOH! Im Sure that went over real well lmao!

[fastredrider44]

Originally posted by QuadJunkies
DOH! Im Sure that went over real well lmao!

Haha, and she thought I was kiddin!

So I'm looking at new but I found this on craigslist. Any thoughts?

http://evansville.craigslist.org/pho/2704720525.html

http://clarksville.craigslist.org/pho/2677241383.html

[fastredrider44]

No thoughts? I was looking at new and was taking a close look at the Canon Rebel T1i. Any thoughts on those?

[miller821]

I have no experience with canon or their prices so i can't say... If you buy used, i like to buy from fredmiranda.com in the buy/sell forum... Compare your prices around and make sure its a good deal.... That same forum has a review section at the top thatp reviews almost all cameras and lenses too.

[fastredrider44]

Ended up buying a T2i from BH photo. Most expensive Christmas ever cause thats not all she has coming. I hope I've never expected to top this. :o

[Pappy]

She will be happy!

[QuadJunkies]

Originally posted by fastredrider44
Ended up buying a T2i from BH photo. Most expensive Christmas ever cause thats not all she has coming. I hope I've never expected to top this. :o

I ended up buying my son the T3 for Christmas.
ALMOST bought him the t3i but i had to have some camera goodies for myself this year. Lol

He scored all my old lenses so im sure he will be content for abit. I wished they all had more focal points and more fps but im sure he will like it.
Congrats! Shes fonna luv it im sure! :)

[rinconrider]

you will love the canon! I have an xti and love it. takes great pictures for just using the 18-55 lens for everything. I have a stationary one that i run filters on too but I havent used it in a couple of years.

these new cameras that canon has are really nice. I cant believe 18 mpix is common now... I remember when my xti at 10.2 was pretty much the top of the line for fps and mpix. :( they dont even have it listed any more. its a sad day for the xti...

might be time for an upgrade in the spring if i can sell my xti. I didnt realize the t3i was only 900 bucks :O great deal on a camera like that. the problem is, getting any reasonable price out of my xti with camera prices that cheap.

I have taken so many great pictures with mine that it is hard to get rid of it. I can put it on auto if I want and just point and shoot or i can go Time value and lighten them or darken them when i want. I usually use that to make sun sets and such go faster lol.

she will love it!

[QuadJunkies]

This is the first time my son got to shoot an action shot with his new Canon T3 this past wk end .
For him just learning and using this in Photography class ... its perfect.. if he was to take it out in the dirt on a regular basis.. I would not have bought it for that purpose -If used regularly. It takes really good photos.. but feels way too light and flimsy for what I would want. I can tell its not a more air tight sealed camera also . The lense is "OK" for a kit lense but thats about it .Good glass is spoiling . lol
It will do the job for most on a first camera..Im going to buy a dual battery grip to make it easier to hold for better hand footing for him . Slower camera.. Im just guessing at about 3 fps. motors abit louder . Reminds me of my old Rebel XT but the lense feels much more lighter than my kit lense was with my Rebel .
Im curious how long the battery lasts ...
I gave him a couple of my older lenses to play with . This was shot with the 70-300 4-5.6 lense I think ? I havent used it for so long I forgot . LOL
Like I mentioned, Its not what I would buy for me personally, but a great first camera ! :)

I love watching my boy get all animated when he shoots. Hes digs this stuff like his Mamma
:D

[QuadJunkies]

..

[fastredrider44]

Well, she's wanting to start taking it to races. What do i need to know about lenses cause the kit lens obviously isn't going to cut it for any real action shots unless she's right up on the action.

[QuadJunkies]

Originally posted by fastredrider44
Well, she's wanting to start taking it to races. What do i need to know about lenses cause the kit lens obviously isn't going to cut it for any real action shots unless she's right up on the action. hands down 70-200 2.8
But you will pay well over a grand for it.its worth every dime.
pappy...do you ever take a 400 to the track?
Thats one lense i dont think ill ever afford :p lol
Would come in handy for desert for truck racing .

[Pappy]

I use a 300 2.8 at many events

[MichaelS693]

Pappy knows his cameras:D

[bbender85]

Originally posted by QuadJunkies
hands down 70-200 2.8
But you will pay well over a grand for it.its worth every dime...

so what kind of price range am i looking at for a step or two down in speed then? is there much available in an f/ range between the 2.8 and the 4-5.6 pics QJ posted? bought my wife a camera for christmas too and we're kindof in the same boat.


gawd this forum kills my bank. :huh

[Pappy]

The 2.8's will set you back no less then $1600 or so new..used is always an option. A 5.6 will cost 1/2 of that....I suggest setting back some cash and searching used.

[bbender85]

so theres really no intermediate step between the two then?

[fastredrider44]

Yall are killing me. I though the lens would at least be cheaper than the camera. :o

[Pappy]

bbender, not really. You go from run of the mill to prime and your wallet gets emptied period. If you are shooting static stuff, you can do just about anything with a $400 lens that you can with a $2000 lens. When it comes to sports, low light and other stuff, thats where the better glass pays for itself.

44.....my one body costs $5500, my biggest lens $6000, thats alot of $$ getting roosted in a corner LOL

[fastredrider44]

Originally posted by Pappy
bbender, not really. You go from run of the mill to prime and your wallet gets emptied period. If you are shooting static stuff, you can do just about anything with a $400 lens that you can with a $2000 lens. When it comes to sports, low light and other stuff, thats where the better glass pays for itself.

44.....my one body costs $5500, my biggest lens $6000, thats alot of $$ getting roosted in a corner LOL

At least you get a little kickback from shooting. All it's doing is costing me. :grr: But shes happy, so ya know, I'm happy. We ran a race in the rain this weekend and I saw all the photographers had their cameras wrapped up.

What does the 2.8 and 5.6 mean?

[Pappy]

The numbers represent the largest aperature opening of a lens. Prime lenses range from f1.2 to 2.8 which allows the maximum light into the film or onto the sensor. It also limits the depth of field. Shooting wide open (at say 2.8_ will get you the blurred background effect...but that also depends on focul length and distance from subject blah blah blah LOL

[bbender85]

ok, i've been digging online ever since i read this thread lol.

image stabilization: is it make-or-break for tele applications, even for shooting moving objects as in moto? i see some Sigma 2.8 tele's for reasonable (the models without IS).

[Pappy]

image stabilization is not used by myself or Harlen and many others when action is concerned. I would prefer to NOT have IS or VR equipped lenses.