XR600-650L ?? on fittment in 400ex

[Thumpin440ex]

I have did some digging , but still need some info.. I might have a chance to pick up a 600 or 650 wrecked bike.. What will need to be modded to get it to fit in the 400 ex frame?? I am fairly sure the front mounts, top mounts are the same.. The area around where the swing arm goes looks to be diff... Any info would be great... Thanks



John

[CJM]

I swear there was a build up in the hybrid section on putting a XR650 into an EX.

I recall they had to cut the top frame mounts a bit and mod them as well as some of the lower frame. I think they made the swingarm fit somehow too.

Cool project, keep us updated if you do it!

[Thumpin440ex]

I think that one here was using a 650R engine, which is diff then the 600-650L.. Hmmm.. Depending on the amount of modding I might do it, but do not want to be cutting my bike up completly, not to mention it has only been back together for a year, all the powder is too nice to grind and cut away.. LOL Def would be a bad *** bike, with a cam, a little head work..


John

[tayyo789]

The 650L would be the best if you want something easier to do, and have electric start which I can tell you is HUUGE with these big motors.
The 650R is the liquid cooled version, that I used. It out performs the L, about like a 450r would to a 400ex. However the conversion is far more extensive and difficult.
I've never seen anything good on an L conversion that would make me want to do it, based solely off pictures and info. It could be done, definitely easier than the R conversion is, but I'm only really knowledgable when it comes to the 650R.
If you wanted to do it, buy a spare frame. Even a wrecked one if it's fixable. Then you can play around with it and not worry about ruining a good frame. I actually used two when I built mine. One to mess with and figure out, and then one as my "final draft" so to speak.

If I were to do it again, I would still go with the R for performance reasons, and I've had some ideas of how to improve the design I have for things like the kick lever, and oil tank

[01boneless]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0YTOGIE_XXo

i know im awsome! lol jk :D

[tayyo789]

I've never really liked that guys conversion, there's so many better ways to do it. It seems like he just kinda "rednecked" it all together. Look up RustyATV on youtube and watch his 3 videos. He hasn't finished it yet that I know of, but he definitely has some trick ideas for some of the issues with the R conversion.
Most of the ones that I find use the Rekluse clutch, however I kept my conventional clutch. I also still have a foot activated rear brake, which I know RustyATV got rid of.

[CJM]

Excellent video tayyo, I been wanting for some time to do the XR650R into an EX-but I have seen the issues rusty had. Most noticeably the kickstart is an issue-I dont fancy the fact the kicker has such an insane range of motion in his videos.

Curious-what did you do to make yours work?

[Thumpin440ex]

Originally posted by tayyo789
I've never really liked that guys conversion, there's so many better ways to do it. It seems like he just kinda "rednecked" it all together.


I checked out Rustyatv's vids earlier last week. Both are neat as hell.. That dude (ausi) has another vid later on after he fixed the crappy intake tube, went over some other parts of the bike, it looks to be pretty legit to me..

Since you have done this what exactly needs to be cut to mount the engine? Machining spacers is not a big deal, as I have the equip to do it. So other then that, what is there to expect?? Can the stock tank stay on the bike? What is the issue with getting a intake tube to go on the carb? As for the radi, will the one out of the 650r fit into the 400? Thanks

John

[CJM]

In the other video the guy used a kawi 200 rad, Im guessing out of a bike?

[tayyo789]

My kickstarter isn't the most ideal setup, and probably has a lot to do with why I struggle starting it without perfect jetting. I welded another knuckle onto the stock one, spacing it out around the rear vertical frame rail, and it bottoms out on my footpeg. It only gets a little more than half of the stock travel, but is enough to get it to fire.
Motor mount wise, the only stock one is the swingarm. The stock 400 swingarm bolt bushings fit inside the bolt hole in the xr's case, so a stock bolt works with extra bushings. I had to dent one of the bottom frame rails, and make my own bottom mount completely. The front mounts, I cut out the frame rail that they connected to, and shortened them to put them back at a steeper angle, and replaced the mounting brackets on them to use the stock 400 aluminum mounting brackets. The top mount was completely replaced because the motor sticks up about 2 inches taller than the 400. I built similar ones that were just taller than the stock ones. I also built brackets for the rear mount to use aluminum ex brackets, but it isn't a necessary mount IMO. All of my mounts have spacers off the 400, machined down to fit approprietly.
With the way I did it, any gas tank I put on would on needs to be heated and formed to clear the top of the motor and carb. If I were to do it over, I would find a way to raise the top frame rail so a stock tank would be a bolt on.
I have a custom built radiator, but I played with a 450r radiator for a while, and it would work just as well, I just had to make 2 mounting tabs for the top, and one plate across the bottom with two holes and rubber grommets to accompany the dowels on the bottom of the radiator. I'm sure you could make the xr one fit, but I think its a two piece, so that would cause it's own problems, but I think it could be beneficial as well, leaving room for maybe an oil tank or something.
I built my own intake as well, out of some turbo pipe off an F-350, but it isn't satisfying me. I read a while ago that a stock DS450 boot could be bolted on, but I lost the thread. That would be ideal, however.

[Thumpin440ex]

Great info.. Yah that is a little more then I would want to do to my current bike.. Mite have to find a frame,do it rite, have it coated after it is done, just swap my stuff over to it..Do you know if the 650L engine is the same dimensions or mounting points of the ex engine?? I have yet to go check this wrecked bik out, so I am not sure if it is the L or reg 600.. If the price is rite, I might go for it.. Hell even that 600 engine would have to do circles around my 440 set up.. Decisions decisions LOL


John

[tayyo789]

They aren't the same as the 400, but the 600 and the 650l might be close. Right now, I'm trying to figure out a way to mate the 650R and the 700xx platforms together, to get the best of both worlds since the motor's are so similar. If only the 700 wasn't a center drive, I could use the bottom end to get the lower geared tranny and E-start, with the 686cc's as a starting point, with an xr head. Frankenstein for sure haha.
I would like to see you do the L conversion to compare it to the R, but I would also love to see your take on an R conversion, because there are so few out there. Either way, I'm following your updates!

[Thumpin440ex]

Yah thanks for the info.. I am sure that if I do this it will be a kinda long project. I just got a wild hair, after checking out some of the hybrids guys are doing.. Next thing I have to find out is are the older 600's the same hp as the later ones.. Seems to me it would be as it is a proven reliable set up.. I will keep the thread updated as I gather info, as it might help people who decide to try it later.. As far a the build, I am sure it will be very long hahaha



John

[tayyo789]

If you start the build, make sure you are committed. Take the time to do everything right, there's no rush if you're using extra parts. It took me a little over 2 years to build mine, with the last 6 months working on it heavily, and was still bolting stuff on when it was loaded on the trailer to go. It was worth every minute of stress though, I can tell you that

[Thumpin440ex]

I hear ya man. Trust me when I say I do my chit rite. I was not bread to be a hack lol..


John

[tayyo789]

You seem to have a keen attention to detail, I'm sure it'll be absolutely sick if you do it

[honda400ex2003]

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