rings?

[01boneless]

ok guys my 400 is smoking like a 2 stroke the smoke is light blue and its also burning oil. i thinking rings or valve seals? also last time my uncle changed my oil for me (i dident have time) and he used cheap dollar store oil would that cause it. my jetting is 158 main 38 piliot uni filter fmf slip on and no lid and i have a stock bore 11:1 piston. i got it cooling down from runing in 3rd pinned for a plug chop.

[honda400ex2003]

im thinking its time for some rings lol. im sure the plug chops helped out though too.

what would make you think that it is jetted wrong? any recent changes to your setup or issues with it running poor? what did the plug look like?



steve

[01boneless]

i dont think its jetted wrong i just through that in their lol the plug is tan with a little grey and a little black lol its good lets put it that way haha so rings?

[honda400ex2003]

i was just curious to find out why you did it lol.


yup, time to get the next ring over and give it a hone. so your piston size +.5mm. esp if it is all the time as described above.

steve

[01boneless]

whats a hone lol will i have to buy a new piston? also the rings were replace in march but i have put 150- 200 or so hours on it since

[honda400ex2003]

wont need a new piston unless your cylinder is scored up bad. that would depend on how it looks after being tore down. 90% of the time it is just nice to get a piston and go bigger anyway so the piston and a bore instead of just rings and a hone.

you are looking about 200 for a piston and bore, about 80 or so to get a hone and rings.

a hone just cleans up the bore to accommodate the new rings, it puts the cross hatch pattern back on to seat the rings properly.

im betting that a hone was not done when the rings were replaced last. if the rings were done without a hone they are toasted and need to be replaced.

steve

[01boneless]

of corse when i think about it the mechanic did not hone it last time lol so ill just the following?

fresh hone
rings
head and valve cover gasket

also how bout the dollar genral oil lol

[honda400ex2003]

thats what you will need list wise. around 100 bucks should cover that stuff.

as long as it was regular motor oil is ok. oil is pretty much oil, some are a bit better than others but they all come out of the same pipe.

oil alone wont make a machine burn rings, maybe overheating it or something like that would but oil by itself wouldnt cause a problem. esp with it being relatively new oil.

steve

[01boneless]

how hard are rings to put on and what is staggering rings mean? the reason i want to do it instead of my mechanic ( call me crazy) but i like to know that the work has been done not half ***** and just through together like i want locktight on valve cover bolts no silicone gasket sealer or stupied stuff that the mechanic leaves out lol

[CJM]

Its rather easy. Staggering the rings is just making sure the gaps in them arent all in a line-otherwise they leak.

The piston should provide instructions on how to properly gap and file them to fit.

As for honing, its SUPER easy. You get a bore hone, they make 2 types: 1. A cylinder with some abrasive balls attached to it on wires 2. A spring loaded arm driven type with abrasive pads (one I like to use). Just put in a drill, use some oil and go to town. This article explains it well: http://www.ehow.com/how_4727370_hone-cylinder.html

[01boneless]

i figure the shop can hone it for me but i was reading my manual and what im worred about is the bolts that hold on the cylender do they strip out easy?

[honda400ex2003]

id def have a shop do the hone, it is much easier than buying imo. the head nuts and bolts arent bad as long as you pay attention to them as you take them out.

steve

[01boneless]

Originally posted by honda400ex2003
id def have a shop do the hone, it is much easier than buying imo. the head nuts and bolts arent bad as long as you pay attention to them as you take them out.

steve

ok i think ill try it if you guys promise to help me out along the way lol:blah: also ill be carful with the head bolts im used to the valve cover bolts lol

[CJM]

One thing you will need to buy is a good torque wrench. Sears sells some pretty good ones, get a 3/8 drive one.

[honda400ex2003]

def get a torque wrench, it will be a life saver down the road when doing it.

you will be surprised how easy it is when you start getting into it. get a dl of the service manual and read through it every night for a week and print off the top end section to learn how to do it. the cam chain stuff is the hardest and once you get it figured out, really isnt bad. just line up all of the marks and tighten it up.

we made good moral support lol
steve

[01boneless]

ill try it guys!

[honda400ex2003]

get the dl manual out of my sticky. all of the torque specs are in there also.

steve

[01boneless]

ok have a 11:1 wiseco stock bore piston will stock replacement rings work or do i have to buy wiseco rings? also the shop is goning to hone it for free for me

[CJM]

You need wiseco rings. I bought mine at dennis kirk.

[400EXRAY]

Not to hijack this thread, but My ex is in the same boat. It smokes a bunch and eats oil faster than a fat kid eats oreos. On top of that I have no idea if the engine has ever been modded or not. Should I just take it appart to see what I'm dealing with, and how do I tell what the bore is? I'm hoping all it needs is new rings/possibly valve seals. what are the other possible things that would allow oil to get burned up and expelled through the exhaust? Finally, when you guys talk about filing the rings to fit the piston, what exactly do you mean? what part gets filed?

[CJM]

Originally posted by 400EXRAY
Not to hijack this thread, but My ex is in the same boat. It smokes a bunch and eats oil faster than a fat kid eats oreos. On top of that I have no idea if the engine has ever been modded or not. Should I just take it appart to see what I'm dealing with, and how do I tell what the bore is? I'm hoping all it needs is new rings/possibly valve seals. what are the other possible things that would allow oil to get burned up and expelled through the exhaust? Finally, when you guys talk about filing the rings to fit the piston, what exactly do you mean? what part gets filed?

1. Starting a new thread would be a good idea

2. If its burning oil chances are it needs rings or if its really bad a bore and a larger piston

3. The rings if not seating right or worn out will allow the oil to pass thru and burn out the exhaust. What basically happens is the rings wear out or the cylinder sleeve the piston rides in wears-this creates a gap for oil to pass thru and burn up.

4. Filing the rings means putting the rings in the cylinder sleeve. Then you take a feeler gauge and measure the gap. Usually theres a chart that comes with the piston you use and you determine what the gap is supposed to be. Then you file them to fit. Its rather simple actually.