310 or 330 bolt on

[265 sleeper]

Alright same song dance . Trying to get a 310 or 330 bolt on . I want to get something that's can go to the dunes , flat land , and woods . Going c12 gas , esr 5 pipe 38 airstriker . Which one would be better suited for my riding theres a hundred dollar difference which won't break me . If I get 330 bolt on do they only have 2 over bores if so can I get it resleeved to make it a none bolt on cylinder for when I max my bores out . Trying to order ASAP so any info would help thanks

[RyanWsly]

If your buying one from sanders, get the PV. it smooths it way out if you want to set it that way, great for the woods.

[265 sleeper]

ThAnks but lookin at the non power valves . Less things to go wrong or mess up what port should I get I here a lot how there porting really not that good I have some one that can give me numbers to dial in when I slap my degree wheel on it . Just wondering what port should I get also I have a +4 stroker in bottom end

[RyanWsly]

the one I've been riding is a friends that I keep here, mine is down for the time being. his is a 310 PV, it also has a 38mm AS, and it delivers great power, the power band on his engine is almost as wide as my 450R. If I were buying one I would not even think about not buying the non PV version, but you know what you want and what you are going to do with it better then me. I believe he just gave them his application and they recommended the porting style, I have been impressed with what they sent him, could it be improved? probably. it works well with what they send you though. also I don't deal with big bores much, but with a +4 crank aren't you going to have to get a kit to match that? bolt on kits are for a stock length cranks. maybe there is something I'm not understanding though.

[265 sleeper]

Thanks for the info about the porting . I will be doing all my own porting so what they give me ill tweek if I have too . But would rather not have to port alot just takes to much time from precious riding that I can be doing . Bottom end is all together. the pipe still glued together just waiting on a decision for what cylinder to get

[methyman]

The problem with the 330 bolt on you don't have as many bores as the 310 unless the cases get opened up. You have to take the motor back apart to get the cases bored out to accept the bigger sleeve.

[wild250rman]

what kind of performance difference difference between the two is there?

[Ruf Racing]

Originally posted by wild250rman
what kind of performance difference difference between the two is there?

The 330 will produce more torque, than the 310.

[rsss396]

while the 330 that requires cases mods is the best the bolt on 330 is still a great cylinder.
Most people will not wear one past its last bore job and if you do you can have them nicacil'd when you are at the last bore.

330 is at least a bike length quicker than the 310 and if you throw a +4 crank in there it will be another bike length faster

[265 sleeper]

On the 330 bolt on can you resleeve it to the non bolt on sleeve . After the 2 bores are up .Or am I stuck with just a 2 bore sleeve

[250rice]

i got a esr 330 pv with trx9 port and trx9 pipe vvorce3reeds 38mm carb and the cr ignition its a long rod also no stoker just the factory 88 89 long rod it has the pump gas dome and with new rings it has 185psi maybe 190psi if you can kick good enough and it is hard to kick and if you use that +4 crank you better be careful anyway i mostly ride in the woods and even with the cr ignition it has lots of bottom end and mid top is crazy compared to a stock motor if your using the trx5 with a good bottom end port job and the +4 rod that thing is going to be like tractor even without a pv its going to have a lot of bottom end and the 330 from esr has 3 or 4 over bores iam thinking it was 4 because if i can remember right the guy at esr said that the 330 on the original bore was like a 319 or something like that and that the first bore its still was not 330 but the 2nd bore it is a true 330 than you have two more bores after that if my memory is correct but i would call esr first and you dont have to mode you case for the 330 only if you are useing the 86 short rod will you have to mode the cases for the 330 i woul go with the 330 with out a dought with or with out the pv but the pv makes it alot easyer to ride the power is a lot easyer to control i would use the esr to even though a lot of people dont like there port work i think it is nice i dont know a lot about porting but it looks as good or if not better than most that i have seen and they are not very exspensive and they no what they are taking about if you need help

[Grande Huevos]

esr 330 does have more then 2 bores. U can get them resleeved even after using them all up u do not have to nicasil. there porting is good its just not maxed out other wise they would b giving any jo blow that wanted to race against there team a better fighting chance make since? as for the stroker it will b a MEAN machine but wouldnt try porting it ur self at all, because when dealing w strokers it changes timing and it gets a little more scientific and only few people can actually do it to make the motor run right. I have owned both 310 and 330 and The 330 DEF produces more power then the 310 so if is power ur looking for and the extra 1-2 hundred bucks doesnt matter to u then i would with out a doubt hands down go 330. and the bolt on is the same power as the non bolt on the only diff is the casses have to b trenched to except the longer sleeve of the non bolt on which just makes it a little less likely to break a piston. How much IDK? This can also b done ur self or u can send it to the pros and spend couple hundo extra and not deal w the worries of Fn up! I have a 330,vforce 2s, 38 a/s, trx5 pipe, w esr 9 porting and its pretty sweet! The newer 5 pipe is a all round pipe not only bottom! My bike produces smooth power from top to bottom and pulls hard through all gears! When i rebuild i am going to send it to get some more extensive porting for a little more power but, I am perfectly happy w it the way it is!! I love it. I ride all terrains tight trails, fast open trails, dunes ,and mx and She never lets me down. I recommend calling around call ESR and speak w Eddie he is a great guy to do buiss w and he will talk w u as if u were his best customer. That goes along way in my book.

[265 sleeper]

Thanks for the info as far as the porting I'm very capable to port my self I don't have a degree wheel on my wall for nothing . When porting a cylinder I prolly take them on/off like 20 times making sure everything is correct . One degree can mess up everything . Shoot .020 is a lot . I'll use a sheet of loose leaf paper .004 thick to get my port timings correct or get my duration correct even my squish . I'm prolly going with the 330 hundred bucks more not bad at all for more tq .

[265 sleeper]

Alright just called esr they said not to run a bolt on 330 with a stroker . Reason piston not being supported on the down stroke by the sleeve . I understand the reason but is it true does anyone else running bolt on 330 with a stroker of any kind please advise just order 310 impatience I can call and change order

[265 sleeper]

Ok ,this sucks really wanted a 330 but went with the 310 . The 330 bolt on is for a non stroker motor or it's what they claim . I know of a drag racer in my area and he uses 330 bolt on with a +5 stroker for 3 years now with no problems but hope ill be happy with what I'm getting . If not ill prolly sell the 310 ported for a + 4 stroker to get the 330 and port it my self .

[wilkin250r]

I'll be honest, I've never built a 330 with a stroker, but this was indeed my understanding. In order to make it a "bolt-on" cylinder, they had to sacrifice the bottom of the cylinder sleeve. Otherwise, you would need to bore the cases to get the 330 to fit.

Now that's not the end of the world with a stock stroke, but with a stroker crank, you're pulling the piston down further at BDC, and now you don't have the bottom of the sleeve to support the piston that far down.

[bobizzle]

i would get the 430 stroke it to a +8mm and run it on alky and spray it. that is my opinion. that or go with a 310 big bre for a stock cylinder. just got to find a way to keep the keep the head gasket from blowing.

[wilkin250r]

Originally posted by 265 sleeper
Just wondering what port should I get also I have a +4 stroker in bottom end

And this phrase makes me a little nervous for you.

You said you were going to do the port work yourself, so you may know already, but this phrase makes me think perhaps you DON'T know. When a cylinder is ported for a stock stroke, it generally cannot be used with a stroker crank, the transfers have already been cut too high. Since the stroker crank changes all the timing, the only thing you can do to bring everything back to the proper relationship is to cut the exhaust even higher (because you can't ADD material to the transfers to bring them back down). You're only option is a drag port.

If you're going to get a cylinder, whether it's 310 or 330, either get it unported and port it yourself, or make sure whoever is doing the porting knows you have a stroker crank and can port it accordingly.

[bobizzle]

me and 265sleeper are partially familiar with porting. i know a little knowledge about something is a bad thing, but luckily we have a person who helps us on porting questions. he has been building motors for himself and others for a while.

technically you don't have to cut the timing at a drag port. all you have to do is move the bottom of the cylinder upwards, ie. spacer plate, base gaskets, etc. that way you move the cylinder where the piston is at bottom of transfer ports at BDC. move the degree wheel up to TDC and back down to see degree of exhaust and transfers. then cut from there.

hard to explain through type, but a lot of math and taking the cylinder off and on to get it where you want it.

[265 sleeper]

Originally posted by bobizzle
i would get the 430 stroke it to a +8mm and run it on alky and spray it. that is my opinion. that or go with a 310 big bre for a stock cylinder. just got to find a way to keep the keep the head gasket from blowing. Well the day you come up with the cash to fund that build I will certainly build it intill then ima stick with my slow 310 . FYI I got the cases for that build to even a frame.

You can stick with your very fast 265 ill stick with my newly perchased 310 (wishing I had a 265).

As far as my porting skills they are great . Now as far as what numbers run great on a esr cylinder not great at all . Like bobizzle said got a friend that will guide me through what numbers to run the rest is up to me . I'm getting a virgin unported 310

[Grande Huevos]

sounds like like u and bobbizzle should open ur own shop! unless u have ported hundreds even thousands of cylinders ur not going to get it anywhere near what a pro "esr" could give u. Good luck and please post some dyno readings when ur done so we can all see how it turned out!

[265 sleeper]

But even what the professional sell you for porting isn't even their best work . Why sell something that can beat them in a race . What they sell is a generic porting . Like I stated I have someone that will help me out . For him winning first place in drag racing a 370 at planet sand ima stick with what he tells me to port. He does all his own porting builds bikes as well . He's also told bobizzle he will help us out intill we beat him in a drag racing . When that happens no more help from him Lmao . If I had a dyno I would but if they do have one around here they want to much to run it . Not worth the time nor the money to dyno a 310 . What a non drag 310 may push out what 55-60 HP . Not that big in numbers but I would dyno a puma or sabertooth .

[bobizzle]

i cant wait to stick my brand new porting tool in that virgin cylinder and open her up.

but also, we will admit we are not pro. we both will admit it, but what i can say is that the 310 stock cylinder that 265 did have was ported at like 185 exhaust duration. broke out the degree wheel. it was a super hard bike to kick. did some measurement and found that we needed to raise the exhaust port. less compression and easier to kick, with all our numbers.

anyway. done talking about how we may not be pros. we some good ole boys trying to get a edumacation in motor building and have some fun.

and i/265 will probably not dyno this bike. dynos are not a fully accurate reading of running the bike on land. they run leaner and will produce more hp than you will see while riding it for fun. if he does put it on a dyno, then i will be highly surprised.

[265 sleeper]

Originally posted by bobizzle
i cant wait to stick my brand new porting tool in that virgin cylinder and open her up.

but also, we will admit we are not pro. we both will admit it, but what i can say is that the 310 stock cylinder that 265 did have was ported at like 185 exhaust duration. broke out the degree wheel. it was a super hard bike to kick. did some measurement and found that we needed to raise the exhaust port. less compression and easier to kick, with all our numbers.

anyway. done talking about how we may not be pros. we some good ole boys trying to get a edumacation in motor building and have some fun.

and i/265 will probably not dyno this bike. dynos are not a fully accurate reading of running the bike on land. they run leaner and will produce more hp than you will see while riding it for fun. if he does put it on a dyno, then i will be highly surprised.
X-2 to that

[bobizzle]

hey, i have a lil trick to get a noticeable amount of extra hp, gotta do some extra ish, but it may well be worth it.

gotta get that cr ignition also.

[265 sleeper]

We are going to have to get together on that trick . 310 tomorrow hopefully after a long night of porting I can ride ether Saturday or Sunday . Been 2 years since I got to really ride her. Can't wait for that ARM pump

[bobizzle]

Yo. Ya needa take off sat. I'm staying home Fri and changing my water pump. May stay home this weekend instead of going to the camp. I might put that 330 on my bike. Riding past ya on a wheelie flicking ya off. And more than half *** racing.

[265 sleeper]

Don't make put my dukes on when racing . My dukes add like 40 cc to my motor when wearing them . You might have to put it on to win or we can switch bikes when racing and it might even out (on your 265)
Or I can pull out the true sleeper the blaster lol spank the 330 .

[265 sleeper]

Originally posted by bobizzle
Yo. Ya needa take off sat. I'm staying home Fri and changing my water pump. May stay home this weekend instead of going to the camp. I might put that 330 on my bike. Riding past ya on a wheelie flicking ya off. And more than half *** racing.
Can't take off this Saturday if I'm going to the dunes memorial weekend

[265 sleeper]

Well cylinder came in everything looks good .their is a lot of meat to take out slapped her on the bottom end didn't have time to mess with it just lookin at port lay out I had to work so bobizzle is taken down all the port timings . Ima see if bobizzle will upload the pics I took of the cylinder maybe some pics off the bike . I'm glad my lil bro crank bearings didn't come in for his blaster . I would be stuck build his motor tonight instead of mine

[bobizzle]

hey sleeper, pics never came through e-mail. will be heading over now and looking at port timings and piston height. gotta drill hole in degree wheel and do a few other things before i can degree it all out.

[265 sleeper]

Well didn't start till late last night on porting . I start at 12 last night had to get some different bits to get in the corners . But tonight ima start on port timings . Should be able to ride tomorrow .

[265 sleeper]

Well went run the 310 yesterday after all the oil in the bottom end was cleared out I was able to start tuning . Still not correct yet but getting close to it ran out of gas yesterday . Getting more gas today . But boy when she wasnt boggin she was flying it was like alky on a stock cylinder . "Jack jack it feels like im flying " " fly rose fly " jack, I am flying . "Come on let's go my lips is chapped.

[265 sleeper]

Well went tune her in today .found out yesterday that my pulse gen was dirty sanded her down reset my clearance and she started to idle and not bogg anymore . Started to race bobizzle 265 and walked on him . If I didn't spin from 1st to 3rd I would have the jump on him but I play catch up and walk past him . Side by side in 5th and 6th just leaves him .

[bobizzle]

gunna have to see.