Why do neatv pros run the pro-am class?

[Chico]

Hey guys Ive always wondered how come alot of the neatv pros run the pro-am class as well? I thought pro-am classes were for guys almost ready for the pro class. Im not complaining about it, it doesnt bother me its just something Ive always wanted to know. You dont see it happening at the nationals.

[rollie]

they get more ride time, and it gives the A class riders a chance to try there skill against the pro's. Most people in the NEATV series run 2 classes, with cody comming from texas, jasmin comming from quebec, and others traveling far its worth them running both classes

[Rootar]

Both classes pay money usually, plus contingency for both classes, etc....

ride time is good too but most of those guys are trying to earn their checks.

[Pappy]

Looks like Spader had a good day!

[ryan243]

Originally posted by Pappy
Looks like Spader had a good day!

Awesome to see he's back in action. I always liked him a lot

[Lasher]

Originally posted by Pappy
Looks like Spader had a good day!

I was sitting in front of his wife and son. All I heard during the race was "Go Daddy...Go Daddy...Go Daddy"

[lasher45]

Originally posted by Rootar
Both classes pay money usually, plus contingency for both classes, etc....

ride time is good too but most of those guys are trying to earn their checks.

He took a couple small spills, but it was awesome to see some old school riders out there.

[trompen542]

I don't think real pro's should be able to run with pro-am's it is for up and coming riders. I think the top 5 pro's are sandbagging the pro-am's money. I think the same thing is happening in the ama too.

[JH Racing]

The ama you cannot run pro-am unless you are out of the top 10 in pro which this year prob means you were planning on running pro-am anyway. It is just common practice to race both classes at the local level for more track time and the added money. TQRA both snapps, both millers,myself,Cam Reimers,etc we all run both classes it gives the a riders an idea if they are ready to move up or not that is what the pro am class was made for.

[trompen542]

So what is the average pro-am's motivation to show up at the races, when the top 5/10 places and the money is already gone. Pro is pro, and pro-am is a semi amateur class. Just because its common practice, doesn't mean its right, pro-am is a stepping stone to the pro's, not the other way around. I also believe it. keeps rider turn out down in the pro-am class, why spend their money to travel, when they can make money at a local race racing A

[blaster99]

I am one of the riders affected by the pros running pro am, I'm in a tough situation here. I won an A class championship last year in the New England series, and got 3rd in the other A class. I would love to move up to pro am, but why? Why would I race against guys like Dustin Wimmer, Josh Creamer, and Cody Miller and get absolutely smoked when I can still have competition in the A classes? I mean there is 7 legit pros that run pro-am. That leaves me with a 10th in pro-am on a good day if I get a good start and get lucky. I honestly feel like I have no where to go in the series. I don't want to hang around A class if I have already won an A class championship, but I don't want to move up to pro-am and get absolutely destroyed.

My solution is run 2 A classes and Pro-am on tracks I like. Its though because 6 motos a day is a lot of riding, yet I am not going to waste my money on riding pro-am all year getting smoked. I don't want to run just 1 A class because why drive all that way to only do 2 motos a day? I am in favor of separating the classes, but it's not like my opinion matters. I'm just another number to these guys.

[sexysilverado45]

I can see both sides here. It would be nice for a shot at the money, but it would be a motivator to get faster and beat those guys in the top 5 spots no matter what. It would be a tuff call.

[rageatvsupermom]

Well my opinion is and mind you it is my opinion....but it is no different than riders who want to race the Pro class that don't have the correct amount of points but still allowing racers to race it to fill the class.

There are faster riders in every class, and if you think you are beat before you even race then you are beat and what would be the point? How would racers know if they could race with the pro's if they never get the chance? Just because you won the PRO-AM championship does not mean you are fast enough or at their level, you race with faster racers to get faster not get mad because you get beat.

Right now the industry is struggling lets be glad these riders want to race and stay in the sport, lets don't push riders away.

Michele

[trompen542]

Mrs Rage, You made my point exactly, how can an A rider moving up to pro-am class think that he can compete with 2 national pro champions, cherry picking in the pro-am class, riding factory (or really close quads) he isn't. Why even bother showing up? which leads to less rider count, in the lower class, and less families involved,less spectators, ect. why not keep the pro's in their own class, and use the money raised by bringing in more entries in the lower classes to pay the pro's, and let our sport grow up from the bottom up

[dennis45]

MAYBE THEY COULD DO IT LIKE NASCAR HAS, THE BIG GUYS CAN RUN THE NATIONWIDE CLASS BUT DO NOT GET POINTS FOR CHAMPIONSHIP OR POINT FUND. BUT ARE ABLE TO SEE HOW FAST THEY ARE AND LEARN FROM RIDING WITH THE PROS.

[rageatvsupermom]

NO I think you missed what I said, or tried to say....if you are going to give up before you tried that is sad. These guys did not get where they are by giving up.

There is not going to be a class for everyone to win, and the problem here is that if I can't win then I won't try.....most of the time riders feel they can race with the pros, and really have no business, now we have real pros racing in a class and now we have people upset they might get beat....it does not make sense to me.

Michele

[blaster99]

I can see where your coming from, you make a good point. But about being beat before you even race... Lets be real here, Im an a class rider. Im just not of the same caliber as the Fastest guys in the world. I would love to be, its Just such a huge step. You never know though... we will see how I stack up against those guys in about 3 weeks. I broke my collar bone first lap of the first pro practice at the first neatv race so I couldn't ride.

[trompen542]

blaster 99,I know its not fair, its just another example of the rich get richer, and the rest of us stay home. the real pro's have NO business in a pro-am class, it is the pro-am's stepping stone. it is like the lights class in sx, it wouldn't be fair letting RV2 ride in the lights class on his 450. Its the same thing, an up and coming A rider does not have the experience the equipment, or the money to compete against the factory pro's. that is what the pro-am class is for. hope you heal up, and don't hurt yourself trying to ride in an unfair competition. Also back to Mrs Rage, yes we have real pro's, at the series, and that is the class they should run. not the pro-am. The people are getting mad because they are taking the money, and contingency's riding in a class they don't belong in.

[Pappy]

ATV racing as a whole has some inherent flaws. The industry literally evolves around itself due to lack of interest and support from outside the core industry. It is a Bobcat chasings its own tail.....it almost has to do a backflip to catch itself.

This is why I do my job at the track and nothing more. It is way to easy to get wrapped up in something that isn't going anywhere it hasn't already been before. A real shame due to the amount of money, time, blood sweat and tears that goes into it all.

[rageatvsupermom]

Ok, now understand my confusion, because it did not seem to be a problem last year when it was just Cody Miller and who else rode last year. So now there are a few more and there is a problem, I would think that who ever is running the NEATV understands the rules and has probably heard this before and if the rule has not changed then there may be a reason. I would think that he/she would be the person to answer this question, and if there is a some merit to them not racing the PRO/AM class then they should not have been allowed to sign up for it.

My point is that don't cut yourself short, don't talk yourself out of racing with/against them, you may get more out of it than you think, maybe not the prize money, but there is always next race.

Michele

[trompen542]

hi Michelle, I think the problem is that with just cody, the real pro-am/A riders at least had a chance, he could crash, or dnf. Now with dustin,dunk,josh and cody all real pros, the top places have been filled. along any real chance they had of covering their expenses from their winnings. It is a big jump between an A/pro-am rider and a real pro, and only time in the pro/am class will help with that step. the other guys/real pro's already spent their time in the pro-am class, its time for a new set of riders to get that chance.

[Lasher]

In my mind there are two views to this.

Pro Rider view...
If pros are not allowed in Pro Am, then a Pro rider can only run one class at an NEATV event. That is not a good way to pull in pro riders.

Non Pro Rider view...
After being in front of the A class, you are basically moving up to Pro ranks, since most of the Pro class rides Pro-Am.

I checked the rule book and Pro riders cannot run any class below Pro-Am (30+ A allows pro riders if you dig deep in the rules).

If the Pro gate was full (or needed qualifiers) then I could see the need for non-top ten pro riders being allowed to run pro-am. But the gate is not full for either Pro or Pro-Am classes.

4 stroke A, I believe had qualifiers this past race. Also, top 3 "A" class riders do NOT have move up, unlike lower classes. Which leads me to this question...

What is really the difference of the 4 stroke A champion from last year running the A class again, different than a Pro running Pro-Am? (No offense blaster99, just making a point).

[rageatvsupermom]

I do understand that, but most of the series that have the pro am class use it as a in between class from the A so that it is not such a culture shock when they do this is no different than if there was not a Pro Am Class. Like I stated earlier getting discouraged is not the way to be, everyone has to work their way up some will get there and some won't.......that is racing....some have more talent than others regardless of the money, it is life and we have to learn to make it work or give up. And I would hate for anyone to give up.

Michele

[trompen542]

Well, then this is just my opinion, why have classes at all, why not just have 1 big class, and at the end of the day, who ever finishes 1st wins. That is the way we did it in the 60's and 70's, and it worked great. But then again we ran 3. 40 minute motos, with 40 riders on the gate. in 10 qualifiers. that would make the riders faster, and only 3 would place. Hmm the promoters would love this. more money for them.

[blaster99]

Howard, the neatv president wants 2 classes for the pro riders to race in. There is just no more time in the day to add another pro class. No pros are gonna come to race a 10 person pro class that only has 100% payback. We already talked to him about it. I wouldn't say its unfair, its just kinda tough for the few guys like me. It is what it is I guess. Whatever they do in the future there will always be issues. Im glad we are discussing this rather than why did they cancel neatv.

[woodsracer144]

in the series i take part in you can run open and pro and a and b, you cant run pro and a or b and c.

[rageatvsupermom]

Originally posted by blaster99
Howard, the neatv president wants 2 classes for the pro riders to race in. There is just no more time in the day to add another pro class. No pros are gonna come to race a 10 person pro class that only has 100% payback. We already talked to him about it. I wouldn't say its unfair, its just kinda tough for the few guys like me. It is what it is I guess. Whatever they do in the future there will always be issues. Im glad we are discussing this rather than why did they cancel neatv.

I do understand your point, as with racing it is hard for a few to find a perfect place in the class structure, some racers are just in between classes and I think that all promoters have had to deal with that dilemma, some people get so discouraged that they quit, and my point is that you apparently have talent and skill so don't let the pro's running that class deter you from racing that class,go out there and use the experience as a positive one and learn from some of the best.

Good luck!!!!!!!

Michele

[insaneracin2003]

Originally posted by rageatvsupermom
I do understand your point, as with racing it is hard for a few to find a perfect place in the class structure, some racers are just in between classes and I think that all promoters have had to deal with that dilemma, some people get so discouraged that they quit, and my point is that you apparently have talent and skill so don't let the pro's running that class deter you from racing that class,go out there and use the experience as a positive one and learn from some of the best.

Good luck!!!!!!!

Michele
Amen

[blaster99]

Thanks!! That's the plan! :cool:

[quad2xtreme]

Originally posted by blaster99
Thanks!! That's the plan! :cool:

I'd probably pick 1 A class to focus on and then run the other in Pro am. You will get the best of both worlds. 6 motos is a bit much when running pro am. It would be one thing to run 4 A motos and then 2 B motos. You are doing it the other way though.

Everyone moving up has to pay dues. You can split and have the best of both worlds while you get even faster. Even moving from pro am to pro class is no walk in the park. At some point, you get caught in the mix.

[honda250xman]

Mark, I'm not hating at all but if A class up there is like A class at the nationals, they don't pay out anyway. So what would be the real loss? 20 bucks? If you dropped one of your A classes and ran one A class and the ProAm class you would even up in money, and possibly slip in the top 5 and get your money back. I understand the money issue, as i had to give up the sport completely and sell out due to the lack of funds.


The best thing for you to do would be to step up your training game and just go from there. I personally know what its like to have all the fast guys at the track. I've raced with the Casey Martin's and Aaron Meyer's and people like that. But I was never "beat before it started" and I have hung with Casey and even beat Aaron. So I would say go give it your best shot. If all you have to lose is 20 bucks then you are in better shape than a lot of us out here.

To Trompen and Rage, I see both of your points very well. I agree with both to an extent. ProAm should be the gate way to the pro class, however it is PRO-am keyword being pro. Everyone's job is to go out an win, and to be as fast as they can be. Top guys will only make you faster. And if being able to race two classes gets more people to a race then so be it. They have to make money just like the rest of us. Just because they do their "job" better than you doesnt mean to not go. It's just like going to work and someone being quicker or a little smarter, just quit? No way! Or going to school. Just because you arent the smartest or have honors doesnt mean you should just not show up. So both of you are right, respectively.

And good luck Blaster 99, be thankful that you can still get out there and race!

[motofreak2772]

I can see how letting pros run two classes would make more come, but honestly I think it is pushing more pro-am riders away than anything. I'm just saying that I don't think many pro-am riders will travel across the country to lose a race, or have to race a lower level class to win. I understand Rage's "don't cut yourself short" idea, but if I was a pro-am rider who wanted to test myself against real pro's I would just sign up for the pro class along with the pro-am class a couple times. That's why the top 10 deal works, it gives the pro am guys a chance to test the waters in a pro class without having the same guy win both classes.
The pro's are only doing both classes for the money so why not take half of the pro-am's awards and add it to the pro classes purse, then put the top 10 rule in and let the pro-am riders battle it out for the left over money that way they still have some motivation to race. I bet if they tried this their pro-am class will grow, and in turn will bring in more money.

[trompen542]

X2

[reconmaster]

be glad you still can race race the pro am to work on getting faster!
im paralyzed and for the most part get my *** kicked in the c classes when i made the trips for nationals...if i make one neatv this year same story i know this comin into a race so i just look to haul *** as much as i can hope for the best result possible and beat a few able bodied racers in the process...that being said if i ever win a non drag race i and most ppl will be screamin holy crap and ill be happier than a pig in mud

take the positives out of racing pro am your racing with elite racers and learning there pace

[rageatvsupermom]

Originally posted by motofreak2772
I can see how letting pros run two classes would make more come, but honestly I think it is pushing more pro-am riders away than anything. I'm just saying that I don't think many pro-am riders will travel across the country to lose a race, or have to race a lower level class to win. I understand Rage's "don't cut yourself short" idea, but if I was a pro-am rider who wanted to test myself against real pro's I would just sign up for the pro class along with the pro-am class a couple times. That's why the top 10 deal works, it gives the pro am guys a chance to test the waters in a pro class without having the same guy win both classes.
The pro's are only doing both classes for the money so why not take half of the pro-am's awards and add it to the pro classes purse, then put the top 10 rule in and let the pro-am riders battle it out for the left over money that way they still have some motivation to race. I bet if they tried this their pro-am class will grow, and in turn will bring in more money.

I do understand your point, but why should just about everyone else have another class to race but the pro's only have one? Really how many pro-am riders is it turning away.....if it was 20 or so then I would say it was a problem, the pro am class last year was not a full gate from my understanding, it now has more riders. That is what a promoter wants is full gates. Like I said earlier we had people wanting the 150 point rule to go away so anyone can race with the pros, now many people have that option and now it is a problem. I guess some can't be happy no matter what.

Michele

[Lasher]

For Walden (round 1)

Pro class had 10 riders
Pro-Am class had 15 riders.

Out of the 10 Pro riders...
8 riders ran the Pro-Am class
1 rider only ran the pro class
1 rider also ran the 30+A class. (allowed by NEATV rules)

NEATV does not sit on their hands if a rule needs to be changed. I am sure Howard would do something if the Pro-Am class had a full gate.

As far as contigency money...the 30+ B/C class did not have enough riders to qualify for contingency money (10 riders min) and for most of last year, both 30+ B/C and 40+ missed out on cash.

[rageatvsupermom]

Originally posted by Lasher
For Walden (round 1)

Pro class had 10 riders
Pro-Am class had 15 riders.

Out of the 10 Pro riders...
8 riders ran the Pro-Am class
1 rider only ran the pro class
1 rider also ran the 30+A class. (allowed by NEATV rules)

NEATV does not sit on their hands if a rule needs to be changed. I am sure Howard would do something if the Pro-Am class had a full gate.

As far as contigency money...the 30+ B/C class did not have enough riders to qualify for contingency money (10 riders min) and for most of last year, both 30+ B/C and 40+ missed out on cash.

That is my point it really does not look like it turned to many away...hopefully everyone can find a happy medium and continue to race and not let this hamper them.

[blaster99]

Pro am would have had 17 but due to practice injuries.... :mad: haha oh well. Me and another one of my friends crashed in practice and couldn't race. Still I understand where you guys are coming from. If us a class guys were missing out on qualifying because there was a full gate of pros there would be a problem, But at least we all qualify

[motofreak2772]

Originally posted by rageatvsupermom
I do understand your point, but why should just about everyone else have another class to race but the pro's only have one? Really how many pro-am riders is it turning away.....if it was 20 or so then I would say it was a problem, the pro am class last year was not a full gate from my understanding, it now has more riders. That is what a promoter wants is full gates. Like I said earlier we had people wanting the 150 point rule to go away so anyone can race with the pros, now many people have that option and now it is a problem. I guess some can't be happy no matter what.

Michele
The pros should only want one class, because at the end of the season there should only be one pro champion. You don't want a guy saying who cares if you won pro, I won pro am(with all the same pros in it) so I'm just as good as you. I know it doesn't really matter and I'm sure all the riders still look at the pro class as the main one to win anyways but I'm just saying.
I guess you're right with the turning people away thing. I don't live up there so I don't get to see the actual turn out and the affects. I was just imagining the situation.

[blaster99]

Originally posted by honda250xman
Mark, I'm not hating at all but if A class up there is like A class at the nationals, they don't pay out anyway. So what would be the real loss? 20 bucks? If you dropped one of your A classes and ran one A class and the ProAm class you would even up in money, and possibly slip in the top 5 and get your money back. I understand the money issue, as i had to give up the sport completely and sell out due to the lack of funds.


The best thing for you to do would be to step up your training game and just go from there. I personally know what its like to have all the fast guys at the track. I've raced with the Casey Martin's and Aaron Meyer's and people like that. But I was never "beat before it started" and I have hung with Casey and even beat Aaron. So I would say go give it your best shot. If all you have to lose is 20 bucks then you are in better shape than a lot of us out here.

To Trompen and Rage, I see both of your points very well. I agree with both to an extent. ProAm should be the gate way to the pro class, however it is PRO-am keyword being pro. Everyone's job is to go out an win, and to be as fast as they can be. Top guys will only make you faster. And if being able to race two classes gets more people to a race then so be it. They have to make money just like the rest of us. Just because they do their "job" better than you doesnt mean to not go. It's just like going to work and someone being quicker or a little smarter, just quit? No way! Or going to school. Just because you arent the smartest or have honors doesnt mean you should just not show up. So both of you are right, respectively.

And good luck Blaster 99, be thankful that you can still get out there and race!

I completely missed your post until just now, The A class does not pay out, but Can-am pays out $750 for each class to win. That's another reason I want to run the 2 A classes.

[XriDeORdiEX27]

just finished reading this entire post and heres my thoughts.

i believe michelle asked im sure there is a reason why pros aloud to race both pro and pro am. well i am very close with the presidents son and i have talked about this issue with him. my suggestion was to have the pro and pro am class's in neatv similar to the nationals. a pro class (maybe 10 laps in neatv insted of 8) a pro am production (anyone from pro can also ride this it would be 8 laps, and pro am unlimited riders can ride this. then pro am unlimited (6 laps no pros aloud) his answer was that it has been talked about or considered, but they dont have the pro/pro am numbers to do that. in other words we dont have a full gate of pros or pro am riders at neatv anymore.

i am also one of the riders also in that position. i came off last year winning over half the A class races i raced in starting half way through the season due to shoulder surgery which put me out for the 1st half. i was faced with the decision as well, do i race 2 a class's again or pro am and 1 a class? well a fracured wrist at round 1 has now put me back in both a's due to not riding for weeks (out of shape and not at my fastest cuz of being injured) im a strong believer that riding with faster people gets you faster but going from A to pro am is a very big jump. i have my thoughts and feelings i just wish it didnt have to come down to after winning A class's at every round i would move up to A and maybe not even see a top 10 depending on rider numbers. there is only so much training you can do. its not all that, its also the teams, machines, track side support, and just the support in general that the pros have that we dont which keeps us from being up to their pace as well. i think everyone can agree you can train your heart out and be naturally talented in this sport, but if you dont have lots of money, or support it is definatly hard to do, and to run with some people who have what you dont (factory support, crazy amounts of money, fresh bike at every round and so on..)

[400grl]

Coming from the West Coast, I don't understand why the Pros are allowed to run Pro-Am, either. I would think the easy solution would be to allow the Pros to run Pro-Am, but don't score them. This will keep the Pro-Am riders who AREN'T pro's still interested in the class, and will give the Pro's the track time they are looking for.

[Pappy]

Like I posted earlier...chasing one's tail....


Its about the $$...no its about the love of the sport...no its about the $$.....

[blaster99]

They don't have the numbers because they let all the pros from past years move to A class!! Travis Spader won 4-stroke A this weekend by a mile.... I want to know who in their right mind would make local A class riders race against Travis Spader. 4 time national pro champion... It doesn't make much sense to me, especially because one of the 4-stroke A motos was Spader, Danny Lewis and Justin Hoffler, 1,2,3. all top pros a few years back that they let bump down to A class. It is frustrating, but I guess I will see if I can run with them in a few more weeks. Maybe I am complaining for nothing. Even If I run with them or beat them, it still doesn't seem fair to the guys in mid pack. Being injured sucks... I get all fired up haha

[honda250xman]

to my knowledge spader hasnt raced a sanctioned race in a few years, thus allowing him to be able to run an a class. and collect that 625 bucks for winning A class. like stated about its all about the cash

[blaster99]

he makes 900 for winning A class! and yeah 2 out of the 3 pros who run A class now are on can-ams. All about the money is right!!

[bimcgo1]

Heres one for you. How about the guys that won B classes last year and have to move up to A.They have to race against the A champs and national guys that are sandbagging.So does it give them a fair shot,I know it will make me faster. I love to win like everyone else,but thats the way its always been and will be.If a peson has to win all the time to be happy ,they should just play with themself

[Delaware152]

I honestly don't see the big deal about Spader running a classes. The last time he raced a quad was 2006. He is now I believe 38 and has a wife and son not to mention a business and is expected to be at work on Monday morning to support his family. He is racing this series to have fun and obviously trying to make some money why he is racing. I wouldn't say he won any of the classes by a mile. He is still very fast but he is killing the starts and getting out front makes life alot easier. I don't understand the comment about all the guys sandbagging at neatv. I guess when somebody shows that people don't know and they do well they are automatically sandbagging.

[Pappy]

Using "Sandbagger" is an excuse for those that cant or wont put forth the effort to be competitive in the class they are shooting for. Those that have talent and put forth the effort and are legal to run a class are labled sandbaggers...man that tail chasing keeps going round and round LOL!

You can bet that 99.9% of the folks here would run a class for money and be danged pressed to train hard to get that cash, thats what it is there for!

Like stated, you are either in it to win it or for the fun aspect....maybe once you get good enough to be competitive at the top of the class you can do both:p

If a rider is eligible for a said class, then there really is no issue beyond going out and beating that rider!

[Lasher]

At Walden I was sitting in front of Travis's wife and son, who yelled "Go Daddy...Go Daddy!" the whole time.

Since I started racing NEATV in 1999, they have always made the top 3 move up the following year. But you cannot tell some one they have to run pro after the A class.

I don't run a Can-Am but I almost want the contigency to stop. I race for fun and when big money like Can-Am is putting up makes racing more serious. Don't get me wrong, love that companies are giving back to the riders.

It is just that $$$ makes people grumpy (not directed at anyone in particular just a general statement about racing overall)

[Delaware152]

Originally posted by Pappy
Using "Sandbagger" is an excuse for those that cant or wont put forth the effort to be competitive in the class they are shooting for. Those that have talent and put forth the effort and are legal to run a class are labled sandbaggers...man that tail chasing keeps going round and round LOL!

You can bet that 99.9% of the folks here would run a class for money and be danged pressed to train hard to get that cash, thats what it is there for!

Like stated, you are either in it to win it or for the fun aspect....maybe once you get good enough to be competitive at the top of the class you can do both:p

If a rider is eligible for a said class, then there really is no issue beyond going out and beating that rider!

Very well put. When I first decided that I was going to run NEATV this year and later found out I would be racing against Spader I knew things just got alot tougher. I have been lucky enough that after 2 rounds I have won a couple motos and an overall against him. There are alot of fast guys racing in that series in all classes and like mentioned above is because of the contingency. Thanks to Can Ams program is the only reason I am driving up there along with alot of others. I am having fun but it's alot more fun with the chance to get some money back to pay for the weekend.

[bimcgo1]

My comment wasn't to pick or call anyboby names,I LIKE running against the fastest guys out there.I'm just pointing out to a couple guys here who were last years champs in A that they are doing the same in A that they complaned about the Pros doing in pro-am.I't dont matter to me,thats why we have officials.NEATV is a great series,with alot of great riders.

[Pappy]

I wasnt aiming my comments at anyone in particuliar, just stating how I hear and see things.

When we went to locals last year, Cody would run C class, same as the Nats. When he beat the class bad, and was in the hunt for the overall they called us sandbaggers. He COULDNT run any higher class due to the rules. It was his first year racing a 450 as well. The same is true for this year, we run B at every venue as per the rules. He could have possibly run B last year but he needed to start where most folks start out at.

It has to be hard, trying to accomodate the Pro riders and keep the advancing riders content. While I agree, you get faster running with faster riders, knowing you dont have a prayer is a big let down....but then again, we arent talking a local series, the NEATV is a PREMIER series and one of my favorites to follow.

I agree also with maybe some form of points deal where by the pros that run pro am arent eligible for class points, maybe that is the way it is, I did not check the rulebook. I cant argue against Spader, he has been out of the mainstream long enough that he, IMO is eligible to run any class he is legal for, and for that matter as long as the rules are followed it is fair game for any rider or class.

As for the contingency money...well...again, money tends to change everything. No one likes to have every dime they earn go into something only to face what seems like impossible odds.....but thats exactly what those before you faced and they made it!

[rageatvsupermom]

Amen Pappy...money and competition changes some people.....some like competition and look forward to it, others what it easy. I feel for all promoters, they have a hard job for sure.

[SRH]

ive sandbagged before i guess you could say...but figure this out

2007 i ran b class locally and would win fairly regularly...then raced atva in c class...won the class was about 3 real c riders and local a and b riders ....raced c class in wpsa...barely qualified got 16th overall....my buddy who runs A class locally raced b and couldnt qualify....

is it sandbagging if you still get your *** kicked?

[Pappy]

Billy, only when you are concerned LOL

[Lasher]

I have been around NEATV for so long that I forget that others (like Pappy) consider it a premier series. To me, it is still my local race series and the only one I have known. (Did race nationals when they came to Southwick).

All I know, it is cool as heck that so many big names are racing the series. Whether in Pro or 4 stroke A. We missed round 2 and will also miss round 3. But I cannot wait to get on the track.

Oh...I do not know about the last round, but at Walden all three of the 4 stroke classes (A,B,C) had qualifers. Been a long time since I saw that.

[SRH]

Originally posted by Pappy
Billy, only when you are concerned LOL


lol