Rear Suspension

[cannondale27]

I got some nice Works for the front so thats good but I just couldnt swing a rear shock and stock has way to much damping for my daughter even with different springs.So I am making my own out of a old Viper snowmobile shock.I know I could get dimensions off a buddies Works rear but his kid also cracked the motor using that rear so I have been trying to figure out how to get most travel.

Upstroke is pretty easy and there is some to be gained there with limit in my eyes to point carb to airbox boot gets bent to far.

Downstroke is the one that has me kind of floored.Without looking at stockshock I made the new shock and it came out exactly the same as stock shock.The engine has a rib that hits the right bottom frame with anymore travel down.Now AFTER the engine hits there is alot more travel left.Is it safe to take advantage of this travel after engine touches frame?Has anyone modded the motor or frame to eliminate this contact?Where do the engine/tranny break from jumping?

[LT80]

Thye cases will crack/break at a angle (\) in front of the front sprocket.~~ fixable usually.
They also will break off the rear end mounting plate holes.~~ Scrap cases.

[cannondale27]

Thanks.Since they arent breaking anywhere near the motor frame contact I saw I think I am going to use some of that travel after contact.Its almost like it was designed to use the travel but they didnt because of contact.That wierd link on front of motor isnt doing anything much on downtravel until the engine hits frame then it moves.Still makes me nervous with motor touching frame but will take a look at buddies to see if his does with Works on back.

[cannondale27]

I looked and Works does not allow engine to contact frame just more up travel.Kind of a bummer to me since there sure is alot if allowed to hit.Must have had trouble if they arent doing it though.

[hawaiianbasshed]

wouldn't the spring have to compress alot to allow that much droop? and how much bump would it have with so much pre compression with a body short enough to fit properly and have bump AND droop.. I don't see too much more travel unless moving shock mounts to clear longer shocks I could be off. I didn't go look at it and I'm not the sharpest tool. but usually to make bikes long travel, longer shocks, arms and shock linkages are used? I have a rigged shock on our bike that I bought like this... it doesn't have a clevis mount, the axle bracket is drilled and uses washers and a coupling nut to hold it on a bolt...

its right behind the mount on the motor. I believe I can squeeze a slightly longer shock and a regular style one at that. but I'm just not thinking I wanna spend the money to do it lol.

[hawaiianbasshed]

it's just after 6am here right now lol. the light is from the flash. here's a closer look :D

[cannondale27]

Springs are easy to deal with as far as travel.The amount of uptravel is limited since you can only fit so long a shaft into the shock body before the shaft bottoms out.I agree not much to be gained at stock mounts but when there is so little every bit counts.I got more than the travel than stock shock and nothing is hitting anywhere.Just have to tweak rebound valving and experiment with springs now.Its not bouncing or bottoming on landings and is actually moving now.May try a bigger shock and relocating mounts like you did if this isnt enough but kid is happy so far.She is only 65lbs so it doesnt take much.Check out hers.Viper sled shock shortened and valved and fox bottle with a homemade clicker I got from a buddy in PA.Thanks for pics of yours.

[cannondale27]

Clicker can be noticed with me on it but I dont think she can tell difference in settings.She just wanted to ride instead of me playing with her shock:D

[hawaiianbasshed]

NICE

I don't understand shocks enough to build something like that :( do you have a spring compressor? and how do you pressurize the oil?

I'd like to get a good shock that would have more travel like a stock shock off another bike that would work even. I just want something better but minimum investment lol. I know I'll never get back what I have into it already so I figure why throw more money away... if I can soften it up and get more travel tho my kid would be able to use it more for jumps. currently it's not even realistic to jump it alot imo. yours looks useable :)

I bet your daughter wants to ride. my son watches me work on it all the time and pretty much just wants to ride it as well lol

[cannondale27]

Yes I am all set up for doing shocks and I have a Lathe and time.Had to learn it since way back I raced a Banshee and nobody could get it right for MX!
I really didnt look at other minis for a shock that would fit.Not sure if any do.I know the guys with predators the rear shock is too soft for most which is opposite the LTR which is way to stiff.I went this route simply because I couldnt afford anything offered and with the way kids grow and learn you are going to have
to constantly be changing settings to try and avoid bottoming and breaking.My kid has one more year on it and then it will get passed to her little sister if she doesnt want to stick with dirtbikes.So the LTR will be in family at least another 5 years.Its worth sticking $ into it for that for sure.I cant recommend any rear shock since all the racers I talked to still have issues eventually.Probably is just something you really have to keep updating since kids keep changing.I wish Fox made a Float shock since that would be easy to make adjustments as kid grew or went bigger would make it worth the cash.

[hawaiianbasshed]

I gotta measure ours and see what would fit length wise... if you do a rigged setup like mine I'm sure a float for some kid atv would work lol

[hawaiianbasshed]

what spring rates did you find work best for the kid? in pounds per inch would really help me lol. here's my thread. I figured maybe the general mini section would be better... basically I want to try a pitbike shock in the rear with adjustable preload and rebound but can't decide which spring rate to go with... thinking I want the softness for alot of general riding but stiff for jumping. but then again because they're pit bike shocks maybe I'd need the stiffest to even be any bottoming resistance for jumps...

http://www.exriders.com/vbb/showthread.php?s=&postid=3975513#post3975513

[cannondale27]

Ever hear of a tender spring?Its a spring that is used just to keep the retainer in on a fullsize quad.With stock resprung shock I posted that tender spring was what was doing the majority of the work.Its only a little bit more than 1/8 dia wire.I had those higher rate springs kick in about 1/4 before bumpstop touched.Reason why is the dampening of stock shock is very heavy.This new shock I havent settled on springs yet but shock dampening,hieght wanted,rider wieght and how its used are all going to affect the spring choices.Unless you have alot of springs around to try I think you would be better off just getting a shock made for the LT80.

[hawaiianbasshed]

I was thinking if the entire shock is only $75 shipped I could get the same shock model and length/stroke with different springs say, 250lb, 500lb and 1000lb springs and see which I liked better and decide from there what to run for what weight rider accounting for jumps. super cheap way to get better shocks on the bike imo. so would still probably be stiff but something a little better than stock... adjustable rebound is a big plus and some are adjustable compression...

[cannondale27]

I am guessing its more in the 150lb or slightly less range that I have on there now and that Works runs in the rear.250lb is about what most full size quads run with a aftermarket shock.According to this calculator spring on there now is 104.You have your mount moved though.This should help though.

http://www.gtthunder.com/coilsprate.htm

[hawaiianbasshed]

what about this pitbike shock? I mean, if all we need is a super soft spring these should work right?

http://www.tboltusa.com/store/fox-racing-air-shock-50-p-57.html?osCsid=01ca3f305250ad32f86321a251a09dcd

[cannondale27]

The Fox air shock would in my opinion be the best shock to use and would actually save a guy $ in long run since you wont have to ever buy springs.Revalves are cheaper than springs.Now find one that fits and is proper travel and length.Might be worth giving Fox a call maybe they have something for us.

[hawaiianbasshed]

pretty sure the pitbike one would be close... the 10.6-11" fast ace pitbike shocks all had between 2 and 3" travel and length works too... so imo the standard pitbike shocks would be perfect fit.

I'm considering getting my son a worked 07 dinli 90 w/ Maximum rpm national motor and elka's all around w/dual a-arm LT front :D we'll see... seems like a better setup all over that bike. but I'm hoping to ride it once all the new parts go on and see if I can actually get it do be rideable... ie slide well and rip more.... just need to get it dialed in better and decide from there if I want to keep messing with the LT80 lol

[cannondale27]

Its tough deciding but think of all the fun that kid can have for the quad you already have.So what if it cant be jumped or handle as well.Kids need to learn effort and you cant learn that if failure isnt part of it.Either way speed costs $.No way around that.

[hawaiianbasshed]

yeah, he has alot of fun on his current bike. but I ride it sometimes and know how crappy it corners and such. knowing how bikes CAN ride I don't want to unecessarily hold him back lol.

IF I want him to race competitively in MX I think he needs a better bike for MX. selling the LT only means less outta pocket to get a better MX bike (my buddy said they'd do $1,000+ my LT80) their bike originally ran them $13,000 from max rpm in 07 I believe... plus it has one of those eton motors which parts are alot cheaper for. with the long travel and all that jazz, it'd be a better candidate for a yz or rm motor in the future as well :D

I believe in the long run the LT80 will possibly last longer. but he won't need to stay on the LT80 and my daughter I'll probably get an LT50 or kfx50 for from a buddy of mine... then move up from there. we'll see, it should be a totally different bike when I'm done with it :D well, not really but I could pretend lol.

IF we keep it, I'll get the clutch and portwork done on it :D soon as he can handle more speed. but I think a better handling bike is alot better of a plan... no real upgrade to the suspension since it's already long travel w/elka's unless I decide to run floats lol motor is fully built... even has 1 off billet rims lol got nice nerfs w/large pegs and kickups and heel guards

[dunatic]

rear shock from a Yamaha badger works excellent too

[hawaiianbasshed]

I guess I'll look into that :)

[KAWIRYDER]

Is there an affordable after market rear shock that I could buy? Or is that Yamaha badger shock really work?