Rossier full race motor packagea huge success....

[craigmacphee]

FINALLY.....I was able to race my 09 Can Am ds 450x MX after laying down some serious cash on a full mod race motor this past winter.

I raced novice (Quad B) class last year and had some success but was never able to put it over the top. I constantly found myself racing against full built LTR's, Honda's, and YFZ's. I was able to hold my own but always felt I was at a disadvantage due to my limited build and lack of "useable" horsepower. Well, not anymore!

I had spent the fall months researching different engine builders and what they could do with the DS 450's. One guy never called me back or returned e-mails after telling me here to contact him directly. I was not impressed with the phone screening I was greeted with while trying to contact another engine builder after he also to me here to contact him. But, one quick e-mail to Rossier Engineering got me going in the right direction.

I sent an e-mail to Rossier's information account asking for general information about their builds. The next day I got a call from Charlie Rossier himself. The owner of Rossier. First of all, I was honored to speak with him directly. He never knew it, but I was a fan of his from way back when I raced PWC's. He and his wife were "the ****" on water, and their reputation as reputable engine builders definitely rang true with their results. Anyway, he asked me what I wanted to do and what my budget was.

My answer was simple. I wanted to have the ability to kick my buddies asses on their LTR's and money was no issue. I'm not sure if he thought I was serious or not right away, but I know that he treated me "right" from the start. I explained to him that I was a lot bigger than most racers, not as agile, and older. But, I was athletic, knew how to handle power, and understood the difference between dyno horsepower and useable racing horsepower. He and I shared a lot of similar interests, ideas, and philosophies. So we hit it off right away.

WE came up with a game plan and he tailored an engine package that he felt would be just right for me. He guaranteed me a blistering hard charging low-mid range horsepower machine with a very respectable peak horsepower gain. He promised to hand me a fully tuned package that was race ready from his door.

I took the motor out and sent it his way. With the holidays and a few delays, I was able to get my motor back and installed the first week of February. When I tried to fire it up, it was a rough runner, then a no go. I was dead in the water. I noticed I had a broken spark plug cap. I was leaving for a family indoor riding trip the next day so of course I was bummed. I called him at his shop and he said he would get a plug wire next day from BRP. I was going by his shop (11 hours from my home) so I figured I would stop by his place, install the wire, and get it dyno'd. Once at his place, we ran in to a few problems and could not get the quad to run properly. I left the quad there and continued to the Amsoil track with my family. We all had bikes to ride anyway, so we were not going to let it ruin our long weekend. Charlie kept in CONSTANT phone contact with me over the weekend and his diligence paid off. My inital problem with it not starting was that I had a cracked plug wire, then gooped up the spark plug threads with anti seize. He fixed that problem. Then it still was not running right. He was able to track the problem back to a bad crank bearing, and ultimately a cracked case behind the bearing.

After some hard work, favors, and future promises(to the guys he got favors from), Rossier was able to get my quad motor running and re-installed. Charlie and I have talked at length about how much of a pain in the *** a simple motor build had turned in to. HE always treated me like I was "a person, rather than just $$$ coming his way" and made me feel like my problem was of utmost importance to him. We had some problems along the way, and we both handled them professionally, with sound mind and forethought. Rather than wild pointing of fingers, we talked through them, found the REAL roots of the problems, and came up with REAL solutions. I maintained all along that I did not know a whole lot about these motors. He kept telling me not to worry and that he would make it right before I got it back. He promised I would not be disappointed.

My buddies LTR and Honda builds all came back from their respective engine builders. They were pumping me with all kinds of dyno numbers and getting me excited to say the least to get my quad back.

I get my quad back, get it all buttoned up, then had to leave town for work. F%$K ME! LOL. Now, let's fast forward 2 months. (Yes, I really get tied up with for out of town for months at a time)

I was able to run a few laps at my personal track last week. I had my new fox floats and was working on tuning them in. I was not running the motor too hard yet because I was still feeling it out and trying to get everything dialed in.

This past weekend was race weekend. Saturday was practice and Sunday was race day. I had my boys and wife all wanting to practice on their bikes. My sons KTM 50 was having trouble. I got that fixed. Then I tried to fire my quad up. I look and my key was on, and had been left on. F%$K ME again. Battery was smoked. I tried to find a battery at 3 dirrent dealers. No one had one, but all 3 could have my one by Tuesday. ...that story gets old, but i still had options. I called my buddy (who I race against) and ask him if he had any ideas. He checked his local dealer and they had 26 of them in stock. I was in, but I would not be able to get the battery and install it until race day. I was going in to this race with one hour on this motor, new suspension, and complete package. Not smart by any means, but it was my only option at this point.

Race Day...

Installed the battery and it fired right up. I'll skip the part about getting my boys bikes ready for their (5) classes they were racing.

Since I had to be back to work the next day (yesterday) and I was only racing for a $15 trophy, my game plan was to take it easy, while giving the motor a good faith (yet take no chance effort. I was going to be happy with a mid-pack holeshot then work my way through the pack as I could. I have traditionally had a problem with starts and crashing and was not going to take any chances.

The gate drops in front of me, and I sling shot out of the gate. I quickly notice I am at least a bike length in front, and still have about 100 yards to go. Remember I was not going to push it too hard at first, but, I set myself up for a good first turn and pull off a very respectable holehot. The rest of the race was history.

After the first moto, the pressure was on for me to back it up with a good 2nd moto. The gate drops and it was ON! This time I committed to a full on launch and it was AWESOME. I quickly pulled out in front and never looked back. This quad was exactly what Charlie Rossier had promised. I ended up taking my first ever 1st place at this track. The next quad was a minute behind me. Granted, I was not racing pro, but I was racing in the same class I raced last year at the same track where I would traditionally place 2nd, 3rd, 4th, etc.... but only first in one moto before.

The build....

14.25:1 piston built specifically for Rossier, cam grind package built specifically for Rossiers motor design, Rossier's custom porting and polishing, Rossier's free air kit with KandN, PCIII tuner, Rossier full exhaust package, larger injector, custom race ECU, MRX 01 race fuel, and I am sure some other things I forgot, but that is the jist of it.

Positives so far...

Rossier went step by step with me along the way to make sure I was in total agreement with everything they recommended. He custom tailored this package for me.

They stood behind their work and went the extra mile to make sure it was right before I raced it. They did not leave me with a problem waiting to happen.

It is fully capable of launching my fat *** to the front of the pack in the holeshot and keeping me there once I get there.

Strong puller from start to finish. I have not found any flat spots in this build whatsoever. I know what to look for in something like this as I have ridden and raced machines my entire life. If it is weak somewhere I would feel it.

Negatives so far....

None. I am an optimist by nature, but also a realist. The motor build is still a new build to me and time will tell of its long term durability. So far so good! :)

I would be willing to answer any e-mails (craig@bigmacwind.com)or pm's if anyone has any questions. More to some as I get to further test this machine. My next race is not until July 13th. Hopefully i will be able to log more hours on it before then. I am working out of state trying to pay for my families racing habit. LOL

[ml450r]

Sounds awesome, Charlie is a great guy and knows his stuff.

[TNT]

They must a done something right that was the longest post I seen you write. :D

I have not dealt with Rossier other than run thier pipe but am impressed by the write-ups i've read on the DS of thiers. They seem to pay great attention to detail and support am's. They and BCS would be my two choices for motor work.

Just curiuos what is thier take on epoxing down the intake port?

[craigmacphee]

Not sure what their stance is on the epoxy, but I can tell you their head did not look like any other typical head I had ported. When I looked inside the ports and saw the epoxy, I thought WTF is this? Then Charlie assured me that I had the right head and to give it a chance. I did, and I am now a believer. It seemed like it was 1/3 full of epoxy. Anyway, I know he would be more than willing to talk business and concepts with you if you wanted specifics. He always allowed me any time I needed to get the answers I needed.

[RobRacing]

The epoxy is used to make a "high velocity" which makes the air rush into the cylinder faster. I have read a lot about this and it's the way to go to make bottom and mid range hp. I had a rossier exhuast on my 450R and loved it. I was looking at their site for the mods they can do to the DS and from your review they seem to know what they are doing.

[florentino]

thats good to know. just let is know how many hours that motor will last.
as far as the holeshot its all in the rider.
i dont know what kind of tracks you run but out here in the dirt bike tracks motor a stock motor with a pipe is all we need.
put some vids on a helmet cam that would be. cool.
as far as the batt the yamaha yfz 450 and the ds batt is the same
i always swap batts back in forth.
i love the power in the can am stock is all a need. any more and it will make me tired. what kind of tracks are you running.

[craigmacphee]

I race on an outdoor motocross track. There are 400+ dirtbikes and 20 or so quads that care on it. It's fair to say they cater to dirt bikes but the track is a wide open one with 2 long straights, lots of big table top jumps (for safety) and 16 turns. Most of the turns are not banked berms, but usually one track rutted from the dirt bikes. I like when the experts go before us because it helps smooth our the single tracks by the time we get around to the gate. If you ran a stock pipe and motor there, you more than likely would get smoked by the guys that have big money in their motors. You can say the starts are all in the rider, and that is true to a point, but I can tell you that last year I ran basically a stock motor with their race ecu and motoworks pipe and struggled with my starts. I think my reaction time is good, but having to make that one extra shift when my buddies could over rev a bit seemed to help them out quite a bit. Time will tell on the durability, but as of now, I am extremely pleased. Craig

[craigmacphee]

Thanks for the heads up on the battery Florentino. I learned my lesson at this last race and that is that I will always have a fully charged "spare" battery in reserve for both mine and my wife's quad so we don't ever find ourselves scrambling on race day again.

[florentino]

Originally posted by craigmacphee
I race on an outdoor motocross track. There are 400+ dirtbikes and 20 or so quads that care on it. It's fair to say they cater to dirt bikes but the track is a wide open one with 2 long straights, lots of big table top jumps (for safety) and 16 turns. Most of the turns are not banked berms, but usually one track rutted from the dirt bikes. I like when the experts go before us because it helps smooth our the single tracks by the time we get around to the gate. If you ran a stock pipe and motor there, you more than likely would get smoked by the guys that have big money in their motors. You can say the starts are all in the rider, and that is true to a point, but I can tell you that last year I ran basically a stock motor with their race ecu and motoworks pipe and struggled with my starts. I think my reaction time is good, but having to make that one extra shift when my buddies could over rev a bit seemed to help them out quite a bit. Time will tell on the durability, but as of now, I am extremely pleased. Craig
i have some vids in you tube so you can see my holeshots. there is about 10 things that you can change on your holeshot.
#1 make sure your motor is not too hot. i halways turn mine seconds before the start. this will help the cluch grip better. i got this from supercross tricks

#2 pick a good line. if your bike is not that fast you will have a better chance on the inside cause they will have to go around you.

#3 lean to the back not the front. try to pop a small wheelie 6 inches is a good #.

#4 take of in second gear. never first

#5 take a look at the dirt bikes and see their lines.

#6 the shifter has to be in the upwards position to you can shif real quick. i see i lot of guys having a hard time cause ot that.

#7 hole shot tires are the best for a holeshot.

#8 tire presure has to be the same on both tires. i always lower tire pressure on moto 2 cause i gets hot and dry.

#9 if the track is really dry you want to raise your suspencion at the gate to get more tracion. if you are doing whelies the pust on your shocks to lower the fron end.
corect me if i an wrong on my tips

#10 i always beat at least one pro on the holeshot too bad i am old. at 31 with a wife and a new born and drinking corona before the race day its not easy. but i just finish a chanpionship and won in my class and i race 3 bikes in the series. and ltr ds yfz 450.
for being all stock on the ds other then a pipe and bad frame i did real good. i love to can am power. i just have the frame

[ZX11]

Originally posted by craigmacphee
14.25:1 piston built specifically for Rossier,

Another point and you could run diesel fuel and disconnect the spark plugs ;)

[craigmacphee]

I know its got a crap load of engine braking when I let off the gas going in to a turn. The high compression makes for some serious down low power!

Don't know about diesel fuel or not, but we have been researching running E85 corn gas with a different injector. About as much power as our $24 a gallon race fuel and it only costs $11 for a 5 gallon can.

[Thumpin]

Its just Killing me to know how many ponies and torque your DS is making? If you never got it dynoed what did Charlie say you would be pumping for a ball park figure?

[craigmacphee]

It was just over 50 peak but had 38lbs. of torque. It makes most of its power in the mid-upper mid range. If you are looking for peak horsepower numbers only (you can make the dyno say whatever you want it to say) you will be disappointed. It was not designed for peak horsepower that RARELY gets used on a track.

Believe me, I have a legitimate 75HP fully guilt Raptor 700 and I know what fast and quick are. My Raptor is FAST as hell on top end and can handle its own down in the quickness category. But, with the stock swingarm, it's a bear to control.

With this Can Am build, it is controllable, but will pull like a SOB when you squeeze the throttle. It is NIGHT and DAY different over the racer package set up I had last year.

[florentino]

Originally posted by craigmacphee
It was just over 50 peak but had 38lbs. of torque. It makes most of its power in the mid-upper mid range. If you are looking for peak horsepower numbers only (you can make the dyno say whatever you want it to say) you will be disappointed. It was not designed for peak horsepower that RARELY gets used on a track.

Believe me, I have a legitimate 75HP fully guilt Raptor 700 and I know what fast and quick are. My Raptor is FAST as hell on top end and can handle its own down in the quickness category. But, with the stock swingarm, it's a bear to control.

With this Can Am build, it is controllable, but will pull like a SOB when you squeeze the throttle. It is NIGHT and DAY different over the racer package set up I had last year.

thats it. and how many dollars did you spend??

[craigmacphee]

Yup that's it. What do you think it should be? You are not one of the guys that thinks that cutting the pink wire, adding a race ecu, and adding a slip on REALLY makes 51 Rear Wheel HP are you?

And....It was a lot of $$$

[florentino]

Originally posted by craigmacphee
Yup that's it. What do you think it should be? You are not one of the guys that thinks that cutting the pink wire, adding a race ecu, and adding a slip on REALLY makes 51 Rear Wheel HP are you?

And....It was a lot of $$$

come on . you have to tell how much money so we can conpare and see if its worth it. and you know that the more horsepower the less realiable it will be.

to be honest thats all i need pink and a pipe. my motor has run perfect and i want to keep it that way. so i have just started to take the can am apart, just to remove the gas tank takes a million hours not sure if i will replace the frame or make one. pics soon

[craigmacphee]

You will have to call Rossier to find that out for yourself. We had it broken down in three different bills. One for the build, one for parts, and another for labor. Some of the stuff he did was not typical of a build do to some problems we had. I guess the bottom line is that I do not know how much was did as a favor, how much I paid the long dollar for, and how much was additional in labor.

[DnB_racing]

Originally posted by craigmacphee
Not sure what their stance is on the epoxy, but I can tell you their head did not look like any other typical head I had ported. When I looked inside the ports and saw the epoxy, I thought WTF is this? Then Charlie assured me that I had the right head and to give it a chance. I did, and I am now a believer. It seemed like it was 1/3 full of epoxy. Anyway, I know he would be more than willing to talk business and concepts with you if you wanted specifics. He always allowed me any time I needed to get the answers I needed.


http://mototuneusa.com/thanx.htm

check this link it will describe the epoxy port job

[florentino]

Originally posted by craigmacphee
You will have to call Rossier to find that out for yourself. We had it broken down in three different bills. One for the build, one for parts, and another for labor. Some of the stuff he did was not typical of a build do to some problems we had. I guess the bottom line is that I do not know how much was did as a favor, how much I paid the long dollar for, and how much was additional in labor.

hey how is the bike running?

[craigmacphee]

The quad is holding up strong. It has been everything Rossier has promised me. So far I am 6 for 8 on holeshots and have won 7 of 8 motos. I am having some sort of electrical issue going on but it don't have anything to do with the motor build.

[craigmacphee]

Flor...

Here is a link to a video I posted on youtube. It's of my first moto on the new motor. You will see that I stalled it in the 4th turn and I think 3 or 4 guys got by me before I got it restarted. At that point I was not used to the high compression motor and actually stalled it in the next moto too. If you see what looks like other quad ahead of me in the race (way ahead of me) they are either lappers or the tail end of the expert class that left before we did. It was a double gate drop.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EeOnASSDHH0

Hope you like.