gearing for super technical woods

[icanzu]

My buddy just got an 05 450R (first quad), and it was a total nightmare in the woods so we put a 13t sprocket on the front and it helped but not nearly enough.

I thought I had counted 38 teeth on the stocker so I thought going up three in the rear along with the 13t up front will do the trick. We need this thing to be a tractor in 1st and 2nd and able to lug with power through real technical stuff at slooooow speeds without having to constantly clutch or stall.

I run a 12/42 set up on my Z440 and its perfect. I'm not sure if they even make a 12t for the R nor that it would be necessary if we get the rear up. Only problem with the 41t in back is reduced clearance.

Any XC rider guys out there that could throw your .02 my way too?

Also I've got a thread for R parts needed in the Wanted section. Please look.

Thnx

[Scro]

I personally wouldn't go any lower than what the 13t will give you. Anything lower will kill your top end. A low end cam like the Hotcam Stage 1 will help alot.

[Quad Dude]

im in the same boat as you really missing my ex tractor gearing. just cant beat it.

[icanzu]

Originally posted by Scro
I personally wouldn't go any lower than what the 13t will give you. Anything lower will kill your top end. A low end cam like the Hotcam Stage 1 will help alot.

I understand about the top end. He really doesn't care if he can't go 80mph because he's going to be in the woods most of the time and wants the cheapest possible fix to his problem.....which the 13t by itself didn't fix

Is the stocker in fact a 38?

[OzLinc]

If it's super tight and technical then going up on the rear sprocket will just get your rear end hung up on something.

[JParisi48]

stock rear is 38, put smaller tires on it if you dont want a 41t, but i dont know how rough it is where u ride

[Sjorge450R]

cam it. The quad will wear him out so fast with a 13th and a 41th.

Stay with the 13 and then throw a CRF 02 or CRF 03 cam in there. They are both low end cams, but the 03 has a little more mid to it.

[icanzu]

Originally posted by JParisi48
stock rear is 38, put smaller tires on it if you dont want a 41t, but i dont know how rough it is where u ride

ROUGH! he's already running 20s which is as low as you'd ever wanna go. I and most of my buddies run 23s.

[icanzu]

Originally posted by Sjorge300EX
cam it. The quad will wear him out so fast with a 13th and a 41th.

Stay with the 13 and then throw a CRF 02 or CRF 03 cam in there. They are both low end cams, but the 03 has a little more mid to it.

I don't disagree about the cams, if he'll spend the clams. He's also needing a bunch of other stuff I've listed in the Wanted forum.

I'm not sure why the mechanical gearing to gain more pull at the bottom would "wear him out" The motor certainly has enough power doesn't it?

[snacob14]

GO FASTER

[Sjorge450R]

Originally posted by z thohoe
I don't disagree about the cams, if he'll spend the clams. He's also needing a bunch of other stuff I've listed in the Wanted forum.

I'm not sure why the mechanical gearing to gain more pull at the bottom would "wear him out" The motor certainly has enough power doesn't it?



I am saying that it will wear him out because of all of the torque that he would have from the super tall gearing.

[Scro]

Originally posted by Sjorge300EX
I am saying that it will wear him out because of all of the torque that he would have from the super tall gearing.

I agree. When you're geared that low, you're going to be shifting alot more. This will wear you out more than you think.

Another solution would be a Rekluse clutch. You will still have the lugging problem, but you won't have to worry about stalling it as much.

[mysticfalcon]

X2 on the Rekluse. They are the best thing for the super technical stuff. Not having to worry about stalling works wonders.

[Sjorge450R]

another thing is to just keep the 13th fron, 38 rear and 20" tires and just practice. When I am racing, I barley never stall. Once you learn how to feather the clutch you will never have the rpm's down low enough to stall. Also, have him turn his idle up alittle bit when he is on the trails, that will also help alot.

[Civicssuck]

Originally posted by Sjorge300EX
another thing is to just keep the 13th fron, 38 rear and 20" tires and just practice. When I am racing, I barley never stall. Once you learn how to feather the clutch you will never have the rpm's down low enough to stall. Also, have him turn his idle up alittle bit when he is on the trails, that will also help alot.


Agreed, just need to get to know your quad and then go from there.

I have one down in the front, stock rear, same 20" but little wider tires. But the 03 CRF cam (which i bought dirt cheap before it came more of a craze) with the HRC kit pieced together made a big difference too.

[HondaRaceReady]

Either flywheel weights or a trailtech +4 oz flywheel will make a big difference. It will be more like a 400ex like you want.

[Scro]

Originally posted by HondaRaceReady
Either flywheel weights or a trailtech +4 oz flywheel will make a big difference. It will be more like a 400ex like you want.

That will help, but it won't rev as fast.

[icanzu]

Man, you guys aren't big gearing fans are you? I've read all the above posts and definitely see the logic in all of them.

The only problem is that the ole' boy just doesn't have a whole bunch of $$$ to spend on things like a Rekluse :eek2:, or cams, or the fly wheel thing. So I figured that until he can afford good mods the low gearing would allow us to at least make it up a tech trail or two without all the waiting and stalling and riding it up for him stuff. :tired:

He just started riding a quad, like, two rides ago so I'm sure that once he gets the hang of it even geared as is, he should do better.

And you OXC guys, I guess maybe you haven't ever ridden Chadwick. I race OXC...or did, and will agian...and I even run 23s with a 12/42 gearing there on a fully modded Z440 and I found it to be very helpful and haven't ever felt that shifting was a problem. In fact less clutching than ever. that's why I thought of it.

Who wants to constantly be twisting the motor to high revs when your going 5 or less miles/hr over big *** rocks on climbs with twisties? You can only do so much clutch feathering on that stuff before you fry it. When I started riding 5 years ago and learned there...and sucked...and had it geared too high...that's what I ended up doing.

Hey....maybe I need more practice too....:D

PS If one of you guys has a crf 2 or 3 for a good price, maybe I could talk him into buying it. His 450R is booooooone stock.

[Ruf Racing]

Sounds like you had all the answers, before you asked!:confused:

[4ABURN]

I have a 12 on my 06 for the woods works good for me!!!!

[snacob14]

well, has he taken the baffle out and the lid off? that will help with a little bit of bottom end. I think if he rides more he will get used to the gearing. Its just a matter of getting used to the bike. once he is used to it after say a few months, he can then mess with gearing. I wouldn't touch much until I had ridden for a while.

[SHIFTx450]

You need tolet him learn how to ride the 450 first before sending him into the technical stuff. Everyone in here darn right knows that when we all got our 450's, no matter how long we've been riding for, we all had to pretty much learn how to ride all over again. They're a totally different animal then anything else out there. My 06 is stock gearing, w/ 20" razr 2's, and i can crawl through anything if need be with no problems.. Just took some seat time to get to know her ;)

[icanzu]

Originally posted by SHIFTx450
You need tolet him learn how to ride the 450 first before sending him into the technical stuff. Everyone in here darn right knows that when we all got our 450's, no matter how long we've been riding for, we all had to pretty much learn how to ride all over again. They're a totally different animal then anything else out there. My 06 is stock gearing, w/ 20" razr 2's, and i can crawl through anything if need be with no problems.. Just took some seat time to get to know her ;)

Wow, I didn't know they rode that much differently from other cc bikes. Its gotta be the cams... It seems to me that those are set up stock leaning more towards MX. I can tell you for sure though, that no one I know on 450Rs riding in that terrain is using stock gearing.

I remember when I had to bail it out for him a few times, it took some pretty good revs to make enough power to get up those grades and over the shelf rock. Maybe I don't know how to ride it right either...

But still, you do have a good point. For him to learn on someones farm land though, isn't gonna teach him what he needs to learn about riding his quad. That's just plain to mindless. It would be nice if we had something somewhere in between ...

It cracks me up because I can remember when I had ridden a quad for the first time ever just 5 years ago in the same terrain. It was a LTZ400 with stock gearing and you could hear the thing screaming for miles, and a guy pulled up next to me and said "is this the first time you've ridden that thing?" and I admitted it was, and he said "you need to gear that thing down man":)

[quad2xtreme]

My wife runs 12/39 on her 2008 with an HRC kit. She does really well with it no matter the terrain. I have more trouble with it when I have to get her out of a jam. I am used to the 400ex in the trails.

[airmobile101]

First off, if its his first quad, then this should be expected. I know I wasn't a stellar rider in woods with a DVX400. I have plenty of bent spindles to prove it. And I know the 450r is way more of an animal in stock form compared to my DVX400. Nothing wrong with trying to adjust his gearing,but the bottom line he just needs stick time to get used to it. Practice makes perfect :D


No Chadwick for me since I have St.Joe and Wa****a in my back yard;)

[icanzu]

Originally posted by airmobile101
First off, if its his first quad, then this should be expected. I know I wasn't a stellar rider in woods with a DVX400. I have plenty of bent spindles to prove it. And I know the 450r is way more of an animal in stock form compared to my DVX400. Nothing wrong with trying to adjust his gearing,but the bottom line he just needs stick time to get used to it. Practice makes perfect :D


No Chadwick for me since I have St.Joe and Wa****a in my back yard;)

Yup, no doubt, the practice makes the rider. I couldn't agree more. I told him the same thing when he got frustrated. Like I said, I learned in the same place with a high geared Z and, well....my poor quad....lots of :cuss:ing.

Gearing down to a 13 on the Z in itself helped a lot though, and then as the riding got more and more technical the gearing continued to change more and more toward tractor.

Heard from a few guys who ride in St Joe. Is it similar to Chadwick? Always wanted to get down there and ride with some fellow addicts. :D

A buddy of mine called me and asked if I was riding in the Nov. 7th XC endurance race. Anyone have any info on that?

Oh yeah, one other thing. Someone on here...I think...offered me a 41t sprocket and for the life of me I can't find it again. And besides that, I haven't found a 41t for the 450R anywhere. Almost looks like they don't even make it...:confused:

[airmobile101]

The xc race is in Oklahoma if I recall.

[icanzu]

Originally posted by airmobile101
The xc race is in Oklahoma if I recall.

I heard it's a 3 hour endro. 2 riders per team allowed on 2 quads. I'm gonna check OXC. I think the details are listed there. Been to busy on this site..:)