building up motor.

[bigbad400]

at what compression should i use race fuel, i want to build a 416 0r 426 motor out of spare stuff and wondering what all should i get, a 10:1 or 11:1 obviously gaskets, i dont need hd studs right? do i need to redu the valves at the same time? i was thinking of going to something better but i need to do this on a budget.

how would you build a reliable 416 or 426?

[jcs003]

i would rcommend JE 12.5:1. the HD studs are a must and the valve work is necessary. you can build an extremely reliable motor if done right that will produce a ton of usable power. high octane fuel will be needed, but worth it.

at 11:1 i believe you need high octane on an EX...

[RIDEREDson]

Does anyone know how much of a power difference is bewtween a 11:1 and 12:1 416? Just wondering if its worth running race gas?

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by jcs003
i would rcommend JE 12.5:1. the HD studs are a must and the valve work is necessary. you can build an extremely reliable motor if done right that will produce a ton of usable power. high octane fuel will be needed, but worth it.

at 11:1 i believe you need high octane on an EX...

11:1 will still run on premium pump gas with no problems

[jcs003]

Originally posted by Pipeless416
11:1 will still run on premium pump gas with no problems

wasn't sure. haven't ran pump since 2000 in my EX.

[bigbad400]

Originally posted by jcs003
i would rcommend JE 12.5:1. the HD studs are a must and the valve work is necessary. you can build an extremely reliable motor if done right that will produce a ton of usable power. high octane fuel will be needed, but worth it.

at 11:1 i believe you need high octane on an EX...

i want to run pump gas and i dont want to do hd studs unless need be, i just want a simple piston job if possible, i cant afford valve work, but a piston kit with gaskets is like 175 shipped for 11:1 416. that would be great if i dont need anything else. plus i cant affor 4.65 a gallon at the local race shop or airport for race fuel.

im asking what is a necessity for a simple 11:1 416 or 426 rebuild. remember im throwing this together from a spare motor so i can have a race motor when i go to the track. i want cheap but reliable.

thanks pipeless thats what i wanted to hear, octane booster is a hell of alot cheaper than race gas.

[jcs003]

Originally posted by bigbad400
i want to run pump gas and i dont want to do hd studs unless need be, i just want a simple piston job if possible, i cant afford valve work, but a piston kit with gaskets is like 175 shipped for 11:1 416. that would be great if i dont need anything else. plus i cant affor 4.65 a gallon at the local race shop or airport for race fuel.

im asking what is a necessity for a simple 11:1 416 or 426 rebuild. remember im throwing this together from a spare motor so i can have a race motor when i go to the track. i want cheap but reliable.

thanks pipeless thats what i wanted to hear, octane booster is a hell of alot cheaper than race gas.

if you want reliable...stick to stock. if you want a RELIABLE built engine you got to spend some money. a 416-426 is nothing. the higher compression is where the power is. if you want a stock motor to run better for you. get a timing key or whatever the inexpensive options are. good luck.

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by bigbad400
thanks pipeless thats what i wanted to hear, octane booster is a hell of alot cheaper than race gas.

n/p. now i'm going to tell you something you don't want to hear: if you want reliable, get the studs. ;)

[flyboy1294]

Originally posted by bigbad400
plus i cant affor 4.65 a gallon at the local race shop or airport for race fuel.

Dang man, I pay $6.99 for my stuff. I'd kill for those prices ;)

[bigbad400]

your opinion is yours, i already have a good motor i want a extra one with all the same stuff i got in my sig but 416 or 426 with 11:1 comp. im sure it will beat my stock motor, im sure it will smoke the ltz and the others that i race and thats all i need. is the hd studs a must for 10:1 or 11:1 is valve work a must for 10:1 or 11:1 i have a cam and if i do valves i gotta do rockers and if i do that i gotta get a cam made for hardened rockers and its a never ending process. is that what im looking at or can i build a good motor without all that stuff. il get to it in the future, when and if i ever go to a 460 or 500 big bore. (prolly buy a 450 if i get that far)

[bigbad400]

ok you talked me into the studs..... what about the rest. valves rockers cam and such. i really cant see doing all of it unless its that important.

[Pipeless416]

when i just rebuilt mine, i lapped the valves, and replaced all the valve springs. stick with the cam you have, but if you really want it to shine, pick up a stage II. you won't need hardened rockers for either one.

[bigbad400]

Originally posted by flyboy1294
Dang man, I pay $6.99 for my stuff. I'd kill for those prices ;)

gas is only 2.12 a gallon here too, 20 miles south is 2.69 i guess i got a cheap location its always .50 cents more not too far away.

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by bigbad400
gas is only 2.12 a gallon here too, 20 miles south is 2.69 i guess i got a cheap location its always .50 cents more not too far away.

dang its $3.00 for regular here lol. like 3.19 for premium. chicagoland sucks.

[flyboy1294]

Originally posted by bigbad400
gas is only 2.12 a gallon here too, 20 miles south is 2.69 i guess i got a cheap location its always .50 cents more not too far away.

Premium here is about $2.85 I think... The funny thing is this is a very rural area. I guess they jack up gas prices because they know people who are here to see the lake will pay it...

[bigbad400]

ok thats better, still costly but not too bad, i have two identical motors now so all i have on my sig will be in the other motor as well, but im leaving one alone. i thaught i got myself into another $1000 project here and i cant afford it, were still looking at $400. (machine work is free) in piston kit valve lapping and springs, hd studs... and now that its gonna be apart im thinking a good port and polish are a must since its free (not FREE but extremely cheap, i rebuilt a chevy 355 for the head machinist next door, it now has 600+hp on the dyno!!)

[bigbad400]

thanks alot guys the only thing im gonna have different is the 450r carb on the big motor, so i should be able to throw in the race package in like 35 min, thats my goal. appreciate the help now i gatta order piston hd studs and valve springs, gaskets. and in 7-10 days ill be putting it all together. thanks again

[RIDEREDson]

Originally posted by RIDEREDson
Does anyone know how much of a power difference is bewtween a 11:1 and 12:1 416? Just wondering if its worth running race gas?

?

[nakomis0]

IMO its not worth it. See my sig. for the motor work I have, everythings listed no HD studs, but I'm sure its a good idea. 43hp and no problems for 8 yrs.

[Wheelie]

I've been running stock studs for over 3 years without any problems with 11.3:1 compression.

BTW--I get 105 octane out of the pump for 1.60/gal.:macho

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by Wheelie
I've been running stock studs for over 3 years without any problems with 11.3:1 compression.

BTW--I get 105 octane out of the pump for 1.60/gal.:macho

i think that can be partly attributed to your cooler head temps. the studs typically pull when the engine is running hot. the aluminum gets too soft and byebye threads. :(

[RIDEREDson]

Should I use my powers for good or evil?

Guess noone knows or Im really invisible.

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by RIDEREDson
Should I use my powers for good or evil?

Guess noone knows or Im really invisible.

that was a totally necessary post :rolleyes:

[RIDEREDson]

Originally posted by Pipeless416
that was a totally necessary post :rolleyes:


A man can't get no answers on this forum. I miss the good ol' days when the forum was poppin with knowledge.

[honda400ex2003]

im sure that there is more power to be had with the 11 but do you actually tell a difference iam unsure. i think they are close but i have not raced any 11:1's to find out iwht the same stuff done. maybe in few weeks i will find out when i go ride with honda#4. He has 11:1 with a stage 2 and i have 10:1 with a stage 1. otherwise our motors are pretty much the same. different porting maybe, different exhaust, and some other small stuff. i have the stuff in my sig. steve

[bigbad400]

what about laping the valves and new springs like pipeless said? my valves and all that are good, new cam, ne crf timing chain, why mess with that stuff? i can see new springs just to make sure there closing all the way but why lap them? is that really necessary?

i already ordered a 10:1 416 i ordered the gaskets. now im wondering about the studs still, if its due to heat that they pull then why is that 440 of nakomis0's not pulling them? a 11:1 440 should get hotter than mine will even with a spal fan. so what im thinking is bigger oil cooler instead of HD studs. i dont like the sounds of a hot motor, so instead of making it stronger and forgetting about the heat ill just make it stay cooler.... anything wrong with that or am i misconceived. what else besides a spal fan will help it to run cooler? i use mobile one full synthetic oil already, i cant afford to much crazy stuff?

what oil cooler do you use and what all did it take to set it up right? no problems with burning up my oil pump with a larger capacity cooler?