Might be trading in my 400EX

[MtnEX]

I don't like this idea so much really... but I'd be lying if I said I haven't been heavily considering the option.

I've been developing some backup options in case I decide not to do the internal buildup.

I really hate to though because I won't get near what I already have in it... due to the add-on accessories... and many of those items will be to buy again... which I'm not looking forward to that much.

I wish Honda had a new much meaner version of the 400EX that all my stuff would bolt on. But they don't. This has even left me wondering if my NEEDED items like my PRM skids, bumper, etc would fit a 450R since they are similar?

Anyways, you guys know I'm an eastern woods rider...
My current list of findings is pretty long still...

'08 Suzuki LTZ 400
'08 Kawasaki KFX 450R
'08 Polaris Outlaw 450 MXR
'06 Polaris Outlaw 500
'08 Polaris Outlaw 525 S
'08 Yamaha 700R


I also found an '06 TRX450ER and an '07 YFZ450.
But I'm really not sure it's practical or possible to gear either one down enough for the tight woods.


You guys are EX boys too... so what do you think?

[racerdan24]

Have you given or riden the 700XX a thought???? I see you had the 700 R in your list.

Outlaw 525 IRS for sure. Fast as f#%k and the IRS and suspension package feels like a dream in the woods.


Raptor 700 is my 2nd choice.

of those, the only one i would consider is the raptor...

i wouldn't even consider a polaris,even if you were to give it to me...but a few people have luck with them...

my thoughts on the 450's, and this is considering them all similar with never having been on the kawi, is that they are not really a good "casual" trail machine...i think you'll be running into the same "gearing" issues with any of them that your would the 07 450er.

now back to the raptor...it will feel very tippy compared to your 400ex...it sits way higher adn is really not nearly as comfortable if you love the feel of your ex...

you aren't gaining a whole lot going to the z400...it has a little more tihs, but not enough to justify a trade...

my suggestion would be to pm lonestar_r to see what has been done to his 400ex...i know there is a 426 kit in it and he is very happy with it for these pa trails...he had an 06 trx450er and an 'zuki ltr450...although i have not ridden his ex yet, he says it is very comparable to both the 450's, but has the good stuff from the ex...

[scuzz]

*cough*700xx*cough*

Originally posted by speedyquad
i wouldn't even consider a polaris,even if you were to give it to me...but a few people have luck with them...


See that's a very ignorant statement.

I myself absolutely despised Polaris for a long time. Absolutely hated them and swore I would never own another. But even I must admit that Polaris is finally getting their crap together.

The outlaw has already proven itself as a great quad and won countless shootouts against the 700xx and the raptor. The KTM engine is fast and powerful, and the fox suspension package with the IRS tops it off as one of the best trail quads built.

Not to mention it's the same dry weight as the raptor even with the IRS.

They have a few small flaws, but thats any quad. With the outlaw, the plastics are usually just painted on the black ones and the plastics bolts arent the greatest, but nothing that hurts the structural integrity

ignorant no...it is the way i feel about them...

i was giving MY OPINION...which i am allowed to have an allowed to state...are they getting better, yes, thanks to ktm and using ktm engines...that solves the engine probs...polaris still has a problem with attention to detail and quality with the rest of their components...for me, all of the polaris machines i have been on have been as uncomfortable and ergonomically incorrect FOR ME as you can get...


i wasn't telling him not to get a polaris, but more saying that i would never ever ever ever ever own one...

as far as the shootout go...it is not about who wins, but about what is said about each machine in the shoot out and how it applies to the end user...i never read the winner of the article...just the information that preceeds it...

[powermadd400ex]

ill have to agree with speedyquad on this one.
polaris has ripped us off, and we will never own another. only when i witness a polaris take the abuse me or my buddies give it and hold up to the abuse, will i then consider an outlaw as a future quad, but not until then.

rappy, i like em. pretty fast, but tippy. make sure you get the raptor with piggyback shocks and not the pogo sticks.

Z400, dont trade. i can surpass my buddy with Z no problem. dont get me wrong, theyre great machines, but like speedy said, not enough to justify a trade.

i say get the kfx. although ive never ridden one, they are geared much lower than many other 450s which make it better for tight trails.

[rcatvrider]

I have never seen a shootout where the polaris irs won over a raptor 700. I'm not degrading them as the only polaris's I would ever own would be the new outlaws. Your best bet is to try out a few. Having ridden a few of your shoices I can tell you that most of then feel way different than a 400ex.

[deathcorefan2]

my polaris took abuse.

outlaw 525s or IRS.

still the best woods quad you can buy.

[CJM]

Depends on just how fast you need and want to go imho.. Depends on the woods, the trails I go to the 400ex is fine on, anything faster even if it did handle better wouldnt help you much.

Look at it like this:

You already customized your ex alot, you wont ever get what its worth unless you find the right buyer. Then you wil buy whatever else you want and have to start all over.

Couldnt you just do some cams and bore to a 416 with a sparks key? Me, I like leaving stuff stock due to reliability and parts, but for those who want more that would be the setup I choose.

[brian76708]

Originally posted by powermadd400ex
ill have to agree with speedyquad on this one.
polaris has ripped us off, and we will never own another. only when i witness a polaris take the abuse me or my buddies give it and hold up to the abuse, will i then consider an outlaw as a future quad, but not until then.

rappy, i like em. pretty fast, but tippy. make sure you get the raptor with piggyback shocks and not the pogo sticks.

Z400, dont trade. i can surpass my buddy with Z no problem. dont get me wrong, theyre great machines, but like speedy said, not enough to justify a trade.

i say get the kfx. although ive never ridden one, they are geared much lower than many other 450s which make it better for tight trails.


yea i would have to agree with these two on the Polaris every one i know who has one has had nothing but problems with them. I would go with the raptor 700 people say there tippy but its easy to get used to and i don't think its that bad anyways exp the 700. My dad has the 660 and they are known to be even more tippy but i never had a problem. I think they are great trail quads to less maintenance then the 450s and there still really fast and they are geared good for trails so you can lug around on them to if you want to. id say there cheaper to maintain to then the 450s, just about as fast, better in the woods and it will have all the power you will need.

[250x_kyle]

if your looking for a woods bike i woudl talk to tc racing about the tc xc cam they have it makes some amazing power along with new valves and springs and a high compression or bore. my buddys quad all our ripped on tight trails.

[MtnEX]

Originally posted by racerdan24
Have you given or riden the 700XX a thought???? I see you had the 700 R in your list.


Originally posted by racerdan24
Have you given or riden the 700XX a thought???? I see you had the 700 R in your list.

Obviously I'm a Honda liking guy, so I have considered the 700XX.
I dig the looks of it and the idea of it. I just don't like that it is bigger and heavier than my Polaris.

I have a very good price on one, and I'm tempted. But I'm afraid I'd regret it because of the weight.

[rob_990]

i would rather get the polaris over the 700xx.

dont get a z.

id go with the kfx or the raptor.

[scuzz]

KFX's sound great but would be my personal last choice.

[MtnEX]

Originally posted by speedyquad

you aren't gaining a whole lot going to the z400...it has a little more tihs, but not enough to justify a trade...



Originally posted by powermadd400ex


Z400, dont trade. i can surpass my buddy with Z no problem. dont get me wrong, theyre great machines, but like speedy said, not enough to justify a trade.

To trade for a Z400 would not be for just the sake of trading... but instead, an option besides putting more money in my EX and going internal. Like trading for a leftover new 400EX or Z400... I should be able to do that for no more than a couple thousand I think... and with the Z400, have a slightly better machine all the way around that's brand new all the way around. Not a lot more money.

But yes I absolutely see how a few hundred more above that buys me a 'real upgrade' from my 400EX.

[brian76708]

Originally posted by MtnEX
To trade for a Z400 would not be for just the sake of trading... but instead, an option besides putting more money in my EX and going internal. Like trading for a leftover new 400EX or Z400... I should be able to do that for no more than a couple thousand I think... and with the Z400, have a slightly better machine all the way around that's brand new all the way around. Not a lot more money.

But yes I absolutely see how a few hundred more above that buys me a 'real upgrade' from my 400EX.

idk once you go internal your kinda stuck with your machine. im doing a 416ex and so far it has cost me around $600 which isn't that bad but now i have put enough money into my quad that i could have gotten a used 450 or 700 but im happy with my 400 and cant wait to try it out after the build.

[sprayedgt]

Originally posted by scuzz
*cough*700xx*cough*

I second that opinion:D Compared to a Raptor 700....well there really is no comparison. IMO THE best ATV if you do rough, rocky, rutted, eastern trails. I hardly ever ride my 400EX anymore since I got the 700xx.

[scuzz]

Originally posted by sprayedgt
I second that opinion:D Compared to a Raptor 700....well there really is no comparison. IMO THE best ATV if you do rough, rocky, rutted, eastern trails. I hardly ever ride my 400EX anymore since I got the 700xx.


Which EFI programmer do you have?

How do you like your exhaust?

[blankenship]

I am sorry i know i may be torn apart by some people pn this forum for the but if you are going to get anything go with the raptor 700r i have a friend that has one i ride it all the time (well when ever he will allow me) through trails and on a track a few time and they are great but like posted before ge thte gas shocks or you will regret it in the long run but the reppy is great loads of power and very well balanced they might fell as if they will flip cause they are higher and have very plush suspension but they wont flip just rip great quad if i had the 10g to buy a new quad it would either be a raptor 700r or a banshee 22 and they are still great

[sprayedgt]

Originally posted by scuzz
Which EFI programmer do you have?

How do you like your exhaust?


It's a PCIII. I love the Yoshi exhaust. It's a RS2. I was going to fit a RS3 carbon fiber slip on from a 400EX but didn't have the time. I will never even consider buying any other brand of exhaust. The best quality out there. I've used them on every single street bike I've had from a CBR600F4i, GSXR 750, R1, and a Ducati 1098.

[scuzz]

I have the same one...just not installed yet.

[MtnEX]

Originally posted by sprayedgt
I second that opinion:D Compared to a Raptor 700....well there really is no comparison. IMO THE best ATV if you do rough, rocky, rutted, eastern trails. I hardly ever ride my 400EX anymore since I got the 700xx.

No kidding?....

Maybe I should think twice then.

I've been afraid of the weight, the 11" rear wheels and how Honda did with the cornering manners on the IRS.

My Polaris Sport 400 is way faster and more comfy in almost every situation over my 400EX... but I'd be lying if I said I can't tell it weighs almost 100lbs more than what I'm used to. I can feel the weight.

[rcatvrider]

Being a rocky eastern trails rider I can also appreciate irs for around here. I sat on the 700xx at the shop and thought it felt pretty nice. You guys are making me want one now.

Heres my opinion on pros and cons of each quad.

Raptor 700
Pros- Power, reliability, suspension (gas shocks) looks
Cons- Tippy at times

Outlaw 525 IRS- Power, reliability, fox suspension components, looks, IRS
Cons- Some cheap hardware in a few places, plastic mounts

700XX
Pros- Power, seating position
Cons- Suspension not as good as other two, weight, more body roll then outlaw

This doesn't go to everyone, and im not saying this is all true, but I think some of you are saying 700xx because its a honda.
Im not saying its a bad bike, they're nice, but I think theres some room for improvement.

Personal opinions, thats just mine. Dont want anyone to take offense to it.

[Ruby Soho]

Originally posted by DMC-4OOEX
Heres my opinion on pros and cons of each quad.

Raptor 700
Pros- Power, reliability, suspension (gas shocks) looks
Cons- Tippy at times

Outlaw 525 IRS- Power, reliability, fox suspension components, looks, IRS
Cons- Some cheap hardware in a few places, plastic mounts

700XX
Pros- Power, seating position
Cons- Suspension not as good as other two, weight, more body roll then outlaw

This doesn't go to everyone, and im not saying this is all true, but I think some of you are saying 700xx because its a honda.
Im not saying its a bad bike, they're nice, but I think theres some room for improvement.

Personal opinions, thats just mine. Dont want anyone to take offense to it.

why do you push your opinion so much on everyone?

have you ridden and compared each one in different places and such?

most everything you say is based on other peoples opinions, reviews and other stuff posted online.



honestly mtn, i would try to test a few out and compare them yourself, there is no other way to tell if you want to make the switch

Originally posted by Ruby Soho
why do you push your opinion so much on everyone?

have you ridden and compared each one in different places and such?

most everything you say is based on other peoples opinions, reviews and other stuff posted online.



honestly mtn, i would try to test a few out and compare them yourself, there is no other way to tell if you want to make the switch

Ive ridden a raptor 700 and a outlaw, but never rode a 700xx. Only sat on one.

I just feel if Honda took another year, and fine-tuned everything they couldve had a flat-out beast

[sprayedgt]

Every bike has room for improvement. If they didn't there would not be any aftermarket. The 700xx is great and don't let the mags sway your opinion in it. Unless you have spent some time riding one you have no idea how they really act and feel. The suspension IMO is far superior to the Raptor for the riding I do. You can slide it out just like a SRA bike once you get some seat time on it. Weight is really not a concern. The extra 100 or so lbs it has on the 700r and 525IRS is made up for with the extra hp it has on both of them. 14 more than the 700r and 6 more than the 525.

[racerdan24]

i have to ammend my previous post on the 700....i have ridden one before going with the 400 i bought in aug....Seat position nice, power good, reliability??? kind of early to tell on the 700 but it IS a honda,tippy at times...yes. IRS which is nice......Here comes the BUT's!!!
Aftermarket parts- not alot that i saw....maybe more now
To do any sort of work yourself- On the rear of it( ex. chain and drive right in middle of IRS)....could be a potential nighmare for average mechanic...
just my opinions......

[MtnEX]

Originally posted by Ruby Soho
honestly mtn, i would try to test a few out and compare them yourself, there is no other way to tell if you want to make the switch


That's the problem I think... here it's not like other things... you can't try them out. So you are limited to what someone else has that is also willing to let you ride it.

None of my buddies have any of these quads... so I can't try them.


I tell ya... I'm kind of frustrated with this... but at the same time I'm glad we have these kind of sport quad choices again. I remember a time when things were very flat and dry.


Also, deep down I am also bummed about the prospect of not owning my 400EX anymore. I can honestly say that if I trade it, everything but the engine heat and lack of reverse will be sorely missed. Don't know if I'm too spoiled or too old... LOL. But I sure do wish I would have bought this quad new in 2000 and enjoyed it all these years up to now.

I sort of wish I could use it for the base of a hybrid build... and put some dirtbike engine in it... wish I had the space and time to do SOMETHING with it... hybrid build, 416 kit, something....

[hypersnyper6947]

keep it and mod it

I love my ex its fast and handles better than any quad i have ever ridden. I love it and it seems you do to, so keep it and mod it, then it will be like a whole new quad for you.

[lilyamaharacer4]

For trail riding i have ridden the 700xx and its the cadillac of quads IMO. They are pretty snappy and the only thing that i really didnt care for about them was the weight and how tippy they were when turning and sliding. Other than that its not really a bad quad.

[hypersnyper6947]

Originally posted by lilyamaharacer4
For trail riding i have ridden the 700xx and its the cadillac of quads IMO. They are pretty snappy and the only thing that i really didnt care for about them was the weight and how tippy they were when turning and sliding. Other than that its not really a bad quad.

i guess it depends how you ride trails but that sounds terrible to me. I think turning and sliding is a pretty big part and i hate that tippy feeling it really slows you down.

[lilyamaharacer4]

Originally posted by hypersnyper6947
i guess it depends how you ride trails but that sounds terrible to me. I think turning and sliding is a pretty big part and i hate that tippy feeling it really slows you down.

I absolutley agree with you, when sliding it around it felt like i was going to go over every time. I just couldnt trust it. And when on off camber stuff i really dont see where the irs was i felt like i was gonna go over easier on it than my 400.

[MtnEX]

Well, all I have accomplished so far is that I marked off the Raptor 700R and the Outlaw 525 IRS.

I can't find either at a reasonable price that is close enough to me also.

All I found was one '08 700R... but it was the gray one with the red frame. I think it's a good looking quad, but at the same time I think it's not my style, and I haven't found a graphics kit to change my mind.

It looks like a "custom" where as I always go for the 'factory-racey' look. Yamaha Blue / Honda Red / Suzuki Yellow / Kawasaki Green.

I'll put it this way... out of all the quads... when asked, my own wife picked the Bill Ballance special edition YFZ450... because that's the one she could most see me riding. Factory colors, race graphics, nerfs, etc... that's what she's used to seeing.

I know... it's probably stupid not to consider a 700R because of colors..............

[ThreeDollaBills]

Well man. I'm not going to be bias or anything. Here's what I know.

I have a 400ex and love it. It's paid off so I won't ever sell it. If I want something different then I will have 2 quads... not something else and sell my EX. It's a keeper.

Now on that list of quads you had at the top. I HAVE rode a 07 YFZ 450. I liked it a lot. I actually liked it more than a 450R. It's really not that bad of a bike. Pretty quick (not trying to raise competition here so all you fellas out there settle down), and it also isn't bad in the woods. My buddy would fly around the trails like cake. With stock suspension he didn't have problems flat landing jumps or anything.

Just some insight on the Z450. It's not a bad quad to consider. I haven't road any of the others so I have nothing to say about them.

[Gibson]

Just my opinion, i'd go with a 450.

I've ridden an 07 YFZ450 with a GYTR slip-on and a K&N and its the fastest quad i've rode and it handles the best all around

I've ridden an 08 KFX450R With a DRD slip-on, a power commander, and a 15 tooth front sprocket and its just as fast as the YFZ but it's steering is too twitchy and light for my liking

I've also rode an 08 LTR450 with a cherry bomb and the spark-arrestor removed and it was also as fast as the yfz, and it was the best handling for high speeds and open trails, but it was too wide for most trails

My brother has a Stock 04 TRX450R with the spark arrestor removed and it's pretty close to all of them. it's fast, handles good through the trails, and is the most comfortable.

Either way, you cant go wrong with a 450, and they're not too high geared for trails like people say they are. But i say go with a YFZ.

[ThreeDollaBills]

I mean I love my Honda. But if I had to choose strictly from your list. I would choose the YFZ450 hands down.

[hypersnyper6947]

Originally posted by ThreeDollaBills


I have a 400ex and love it. It's paid off so I won't ever sell it. If I want something different then I will have 2 quads... not something else and sell my EX. It's a keeper.



Yup me too, or if i get the itch for more power maybe do a hybrid my 400ex frame.

[MtnEX]

Originally posted by Gibson
Just my opinion, i'd go with a 450.

I've ridden an 07 YFZ450 with a GYTR slip-on and a K&N and its the fastest quad i've rode and it handles the best all around

But i say go with a YFZ.


Originally posted by ThreeDollaBills
I mean I love my Honda. But if I had to choose strictly from your list. I would choose the YFZ450 hands down.

Well.... I came from a modded YFZ450 to a 400EX. The mods were not my doing, and the more you guys make me think about it, the more I start to think maybe it was the mods I was unhappy with and not the YFZ itself.

It was too wide, too stiff, had no low speed bottom end, and a lousy turning radius. Out in the open it was great... but in the tight woods it was a lot of work. No low speed lugging ability and too much/too high strung in these areas.... and you couldn't take off with it anywhere without some tire churn.

It could have been the mods... they could have been focused more towards top-end (pipe selection, gearing, etc). But in the end, I did not have the stock parts and it was also too wide at around 50". It was going to cost too much to try it another way.

But I have kept the YFZ450 and TRX450 stock quads on the list. What I had in mind was "if" I were to get either I'd maybe drop a tooth in the front and leave it stock or do mods focused on LOW-end.

I've gave them less thought though because the others have reverse.
Not that I'm not still considering them though.

[MtnEX]

Well, I left out yesterday with my 400EX on my trailer to go make my trade...

To tell the truth, I was having trouble stomaching the idea from the moment I finished trailering it for the trip. But I pushed on and left out.

Well, on my way it just never did sit exactly right with me and I actually ended up turning back for home. Unreal.

On my way back I met my wife in passing and we pulled off to chat. I explained and she encouraged that I just take the pressure off and go "look" some more.

So I did go to two dealers not too far away where I knew they should have many of what I was looking for (just priced too high).


Of what I looked at today.... ohhhhhh how I WANT a KTM 525 XC!!! I just can't stomach the investment with the economic uncertainty that exists today. I'm convinced it's worth the price... I'm just uncomfortable with spending that much.

[MtnEX]

Past the above posting, I did accomplish getting my head screwed partially back on straight and I now have a "buying plan" worked out in my head.

I got to actually 'tire-kick' on many of the quads I'm considering all in one day. So I have a ranking in my mind at least now.

I have pretty much narrowed it to the KFX450R and the LTZ/KFX/DVX 400... with the possiblity of a Raptor or Outlaw.

I'm still loaded and ready for morning, and I plan to pass through 3 dealers tomorrow.

All prior to considering my trade....

- the Honda dealer has shot hardest for my business with his quote on a 450R. But I am kind of unsure about wanting the 450R.

- the Kawasaki/Polaris dealer falls in second with 2 great quotes on leftover models... a KFX400 and a KFX450R.

- third is the Yamaha dealer who is promised to deliver a great quote on a 700R.


Overall, I am disappointed because I have a local dealer I like... who's prices are just way-way too much.


For the record though, I have to say that I kicked the tires on an '09 KFX450R and I have to admit that everything "just felt right" about it.... except the seat (how's that for irony?). So the leftover I'm going to see in the morning looks like the likely candidate.


But it obviously is not going to be easy to trade me out of my 400EX (even more than "I" thought). I've even considered just buying a new quad and selling my EX later, just in case I decide I'm not in love with my new selection.... I can take it back!!! So anything could happen, and if none of them work out, I don't think I'll be all that disappointed.

Originally posted by MtnEX
For the record though, I have to say that I kicked the tires on an '09 KFX450R and I have to admit that everything "just felt right" about it.... except the seat (how's that for irony?). So the leftover I'm going to see in the morning looks like the likely candidate

lol, me and everyone else I know who looked at/rode a kfx450 said the same thing. The ergonomics and everything.. it feels "right"