trying to fab dual HMFs

[Pipeless416]

hey guys.. weird question, but i'm wondering if anybody has a damaged HMF that they're willing to let go of and make a little extra money. i'm really trying to put together a custom HMF dual exhaust system, so i need another one.. oh, and don't start about losing power.. i have enough for trail riding. thanks!

[Stoke88]

Check ebay. I've seen a few on there.

[Pipeless416]

yea ive been watching for quite a while. no luck... at least for ones that are in my price range.. which isn't very much since this isn't needed, just wanted.

[burnthesnikle]

why duals?

[exrider12]

To be different and original?

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by exrider12
To be different and original?

exactly, i'd be the only person to have dual HMFs on a 400ex. oh, and i already have my battery in a custom aluminum airbox that i made.

[Ruby Soho]

i think it would be awesome

im thinking about doing duals on my 110. except i would have to have theheader split in 2 at the end, you have 2 exhaust ports:p

if i see anything ill send a link your way

HMF will custom make them for you if you wanted.

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by Ruby Soho
i think it would be awesome

im thinking about doing duals on my 110. except i would have to have theheader split in 2 at the end, you have 2 exhaust ports:p

if i see anything ill send a link your way

thanks man, i appreciate it. in all seriousness, i think im going to just cut stock headers where the two pipes meet, weld a small plate over the hole, weld little pieces that i can drill and tap, then put little heat shields on each side so it covers up the welded holes :p . i want to just torch them and bend to suit and weld mounting brackets for an HMF. then i'll cut the mounting bracket off the canister and weld it back on so it fits. sounds like a lot of work, but i got it all in my head and i need to do it before i graduate school and get into the "real" world next year. the real world includes no welders or machine shops that i have access to. :o

[Ruby Soho]

sounds like a solid plan.

i would definitely like to see pictures of it come together!

[Pipeless416]

and so it begins. :devil:

[Bryson#221]

Originally posted by Pipeless416
and so it begins. :devil:


It's a lil "rustic" :D

[Pipeless416]

lol it was 9.95.. a little elbow grease and it'll look like my current pipe..

[Bryson#221]

I gotta figure out some way to shine up my FMF header...it looks...old..and it's practically brand new lol.

..and I just spend the last 10 minutes trying to find a pic of it.

I was unsuccessful lol.

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by Bryson#221
I gotta figure out some way to shine up my FMF header...it looks...old..and it's practically brand new lol.

..and I just spend the last 10 minutes trying to find a pic of it.

I was unsuccessful lol.

i have an idea.. sell it to me... haha ive been looking for a powerbomb for the longest time.. i hear they help quiet it down a little. i don't need any tickets for sound on the wisconsin trails and i'm pushing it even with a quiet core.

[Bryson#221]

Uhhhmmm no mine doesn't quiet anything down. Hahaha. With the funky combo of my White Bros slip on and the FMF Powerbomb (which I have NEVER seen before- it's pretty uncommon), it actually makes it a lot louder. Mines WAY over the legal decibal. Luckily, at the place I am racing flat track this season, they don't have any regulations on noise.

[rob_990]

Originally posted by Pipeless416
lol it was 9.95.. a little elbow grease and it'll look like my current pipe..

that looks nice.did you coat it with anything or just sand it?

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by rob_990
that looks nice.did you coat it with anything or just sand it?

sanded, wet sanded, and polished with mothers.

[scuzz]

Originally posted by Pipeless416
sanded, wet sanded, and polished with mothers.


You my friend, have too much time on our hands.

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by scuzz
You my friend, have too much time on our hands.

thanks? i take pride in what i own. can't speak for everybody.

[scuzz]

Originally posted by Pipeless416
thanks? i take pride in what i own. can't speak for everybody.

No, I was talking about your post count.

Ahahahahahah

[Pipeless416]

right. because im one of those people that have 6000 after being registered for a year :rolleyes:

[scuzz]

Originally posted by Pipeless416
right. because im one of those people that have 6000 after being registered for a year :rolleyes:


Ah I'm just messing with you....

[Pipeless416]

and im in college with 5 less credit hours than im used to.. so yes i do have way too much time on my hands :p

[Bryson#221]

Whatever...who curzzz if you've got too much time on your hands even [[if]] you did. They're just jealous ;) That's what we're here for, right? To post? I've got too much time on MY hands cause I just sit at a computer at work all day! Proudly proclaimed.

that looks alot better with a clean pipe.. Is that a satin black on the frame?

[S.A.J]

just so's you know cutting the header with a torch dont work that pretty,it just baisicly melts apart,i guess its heat treated or sumtin cause i tried making dual strait pipes outa my stock header,as for the bending with the torch idk...i never finished though cause you gota remove the oil tank thingy up front to take the powerbomb header out its a pain!!! and i also know about the to much time on my hands thing,lol.we aint had realy any building jobs here for awhile so all i do is sit at home all day... need my 416 to sell cause i got a 450r in pieces waiting for parts to put back together but need the 416 to sell first to get the money for da parts,eh:ermm: oh well all is good still:) good luck with it btw

[brian76708]

im looking forward to seeing this its bound to look killer. how many credits are you used to taking i try to stay under 17 but this semester i got 14 ohyeahh .

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by S.A.J
just so's you know cutting the header with a torch dont work that pretty,it just baisicly melts apart,i guess its heat treated or sumtin cause i tried making dual strait pipes outa my stock header,as for the bending with the torch idk...i never finished though cause you gota remove the oil tank thingy up front to take the powerbomb header out its a pain!!! and i also know about the to much time on my hands thing,lol.we aint had realy any building jobs here for awhile so all i do is sit at home all day... need my 416 to sell cause i got a 450r in pieces waiting for parts to put back together but need the 416 to sell first to get the money for da parts,eh:ermm: oh well all is good still:) good luck with it btw

thanks for the advice. im actually going to go old school and try to use a hack saw, grinder, and dremel cutting wheel to cut it. then i'll just TIG weld new plates on and mounts for heat shields so i can hide the welded plates.



Originally posted by brian76708
im looking forward to seeing this its bound to look killer. how many credits are you used to taking i try to stay under 17 but this semester i got 14 ohyeahh .

thanks man.. it might be quite a while though since i need to find an HMF thats either damaged or really cheap.. easier said than done. as for hours, ive been taking 18 for the last 4 semesters, i work 10 hours a week, and i have meetings all the time since im president of my hall. now i have 13 credit hours :blah:

[tri5ron]

Mike,
Sounds like a cool little project, I'll be intrested to see the results.

a little old school tip,(read, Old Fart's trick), for the bending process.
First off, be very careful trying to heat and bend. the objective is, of coarse, to bend without kinking the pipe.

Naturally a mandrel type bender would be optimum, but probably not accessable. So whats a DIY mechanic to do ???

Well, an old timer once showed me how to bend a pipe/tubing, by hand, without kinking it.
We were actually custom bending brake lines for an old hot rod, (much smaller diameter than a head pipe), but the theory and application should be the same.

He showed me that when you use a semi stiff wire, (similar to the wire, in a wire feed welder), (about .030 dia.), and you wrap it tightly around the pipe to be bent, with no gaps/spacing between wraps, (like an UNSTREACHED Slinky toy), this will help to support the overall circumference of the pipe, as you bend it.

The wire resist's the pipes desire to kink.
Of course, the greater the radius of your bend, equates to least likelyhood for a kink.

now as you begin the bend, the wire will begin to seperate on the outside radius of the bend. (like a slinky, ready to go down the stairs)
You may need to bend a little, then unwrap and re-wrap the wire, then bend a little more.

With a pipe the size of a headpipe, it way help to use some heat too. BUT, make sure your are using a "rosebud" type tip, and not just a welding tip at a neutral flame setting. (you'll want to spread the heat evenly, which will be easier accomplished with a rosebud over a welding tip.

I've never tried this method on a pipe/tubing as large as a headpipe, but it worked suprisingly well on smaller diameter tubing, and as I said before,.. The same theory, and physics should apply.

Sorry for the rambling explanation, and I hope it makes sence. Sometimes it is alot harder to explain in text, than seeing it demonstrated.
This is one of those times where a picture is worth a thousand words, but I think you catch my drift.

good luck, and be sure to keep us posted.
(I'll keep an eye out for a used HMF for you)

Ron

[tri5ron]

hey mike,
just another thought here...

You do know that you can post a "Wanted" ad on craigslist, right?

[davidw2155]

Originally posted by Pipeless416
and im in college with 5 less credit hours than im used to.. so yes i do have way too much time on my hands :p

I know how you feel, I thought I was supposed to be busy at college or something?? After I finally got a place of my own (Dorms = Suck) I brought my 400 up here so I could do some custom fab work on it.

[Pipeless416]

thanks for the advice ron, thats exactly what i was looking for. ive had a few professors tell me that instead of mandrel bending, i can also try filling the pipe with sand and it should have the same effect as the wire method. i have access to a full production lab whenever i want, so i think i'll use your method (seems a lot cleaner.) i've got my eyes on a used hmf already, so once i get one i'll just bring my subframe down with the other pipe and get the mounts welded on. i also need to reverse the mounts on the actual pipe.. time to fire up the TIG welders! heres a question for everybody: DMC alien pipes have the same length headpipes for their dual exhaust design, correct? ive read 1X10^9 times that this eliminates the lean spike that can occur on these engines (thanks DMC-400EX :p .) does this mean that since i'll be using identical header lengths on each side that it will have the same affect?

[drillteamleader]

It should, but keep in mind that diameter plays a part as well. If both pipes are Identical, It should work well.

[scuzz]

Originally posted by tri5ron


Well, an old timer once showed me how to bend a pipe/tubing, by hand, without kinking it.
We were actually custom bending brake lines for an old hot rod, (much smaller diameter than a head pipe), but the theory and application should be the same.

He showed me that when you use a semi stiff wire, (similar to the wire, in a wire feed welder), (about .030 dia.), and you wrap it tightly around the pipe to be bent, with no gaps/spacing between wraps, (like an UNSTREACHED Slinky toy), this will help to support the overall circumference of the pipe, as you bend it.

The wire resist's the pipes desire to kink.
Of course, the greater the radius of your bend, equates to least likelyhood for a kink.

now as you begin the bend, the wire will begin to seperate on the outside radius of the bend. (like a slinky, ready to go down the stairs)
You may need to bend a little, then unwrap and re-wrap the wire, then bend a little more.

With a pipe the size of a headpipe, it way help to use some heat too. BUT, make sure your are using a "rosebud" type tip, and not just a welding tip at a neutral flame setting. (you'll want to spread the heat evenly, which will be easier accomplished with a rosebud over a welding tip.

I've never tried this method on a pipe/tubing as large as a headpipe, but it worked suprisingly well on smaller diameter tubing, and as I said before,.. The same theory, and physics should apply.



Example:http://www.traileraid.com/traileraid/images/products/22703.jpg

Originally posted by Pipeless416
thanks for the advice ron, thats exactly what i was looking for. ive had a few professors tell me that instead of mandrel bending, i can also try filling the pipe with sand and it should have the same effect as the wire method. i have access to a full production lab whenever i want, so i think i'll use your method (seems a lot cleaner.) i've got my eyes on a used hmf already, so once i get one i'll just bring my subframe down with the other pipe and get the mounts welded on. i also need to reverse the mounts on the actual pipe.. time to fire up the TIG welders! heres a question for everybody: DMC alien pipes have the same length headpipes for their dual exhaust design, correct? ive read 1X10^9 times that this eliminates the lean spike that can occur on these engines (thanks DMC-400EX :p .) does this mean that since i'll be using identical header lengths on each side that it will have the same affect?

haha.
Yeah, that was part of the design of the exhaust. read a couple places and someone else said in the dyno's that it had MUCH less of a lean spike.

if you even need me to ill get dimensions. like pipe dia. or what have you.

[Pipeless416]

thanks man. shouldn't be needed since im just working with the stock headers. :) the header i bought will be here tomorrow.. then its chopping time! as far as the rest goes.. lets just say its probably coming together quicker than i hoped for.. ;) stay tuned.

[powermadd400ex]

wow, ive always wanted a dual exhaust but they are to freakin expensive!
should look wicked when its done.
hey pipeless, heres a proposition for ya,
if i supply all the materials, and you name a price for the labor,
will you make me a set? :p :blah:

[Pipeless416]

haha we'll see how this one works out first

[deathcorefan2]

Originally posted by powermadd400ex
wow, ive always wanted a dual exhaust but they are to freakin expensive!
should look wicked when its done.
hey pipeless, heres a proposition for ya,
if i supply all the materials, and you name a price for the labor,
will you make me a set? :p :blah:
DUDE SHUTUP I WAS GONNA ASK

lol i was really.

PM sent to you Pipeles, i need help with something and you know a lot. lol

[Pipeless416]

returned :cool:

[deathcorefan2]

Originally posted by Pipeless416
returned :cool:

back at ya.

wow they need a new way to alert you when you get a new message, i had like 5 i have never read, :mad: :grr:

[buster024]

I'd love to see a before and after dyno on your bike to see how much it really decreased (if any) your power.

[Pipeless416]

ya know im actually not concerned about losing power anymore, because after thinking about it, im still using the same diameter head pipes. also HMFs aren't all that restrictive, so i don't know if it will really change at all :confused: possibly more on the top end when exhaust really starts flowing? the problem is a) no money to dyno and b) no dynos around me lol. i'll let you know how the seat of the pants power is. the thing im hoping for the most is HMF sound with lower db's. twice the absorbing surface area, double the packing, and two quiet cores should help. i don't mind being the guinea pig on things.

[stringbean]

Just keep us posted buddy!

I want pics of the progress from beginning to end ;)

[Pipeless416]

an HMF is on the way.

[krt400ex]

Originally posted by scuzz
No, I was talking about your post count.

Ahahahahahah


his post count? lol look at mine hahaa. btw, your head pipe is beautiful. i had mine polished up too, but it has like a blueish tint to it...was sexy looking

[250x_kyle]

lets see some of those bad boy tig welds .... :)

[Pipeless416]

well i talked to the grad assistant in charge of open lab hours since my schedule will not work with them.. hes staying late for me on monday so i can start cutting and welding the new/old headpipe i bought. sorry guys, you won't see anything until at least monday evening..

[Pipeless416]

well i finally got some lab time... only enough to cut the header i have here, and to mess with the amperage on the welders. heres a crappy cell picture.. the cut off piece just has some holes in it from practicing... this stuff is so thin that even 50 amps shoots right through it! so some cutting and a few tungsten tips later.. this is what i have. still no other HMF though.. i check the mail every half hour :blah: :ermm:

[deathcorefan2]

looking good, keep em coming.

[Pipeless416]

HMF is here! i'll snap some more pictures when i get the mounts cut off.

[Pipeless416]

i got some more shop time and i got the mounts cut off using a small cutting wheel, and i actually had to cut about 2 inches off of the entire canister and the core to make it match the 12 1/16" canister on an actual 400ex HMF. next time i might just use a lathe to take off the old welds that i couldn't cut off. i'll take some more pictures of how it is now when i go home for the long weekend.. because right now its costing money to send the pictures to my email from my phone :o

[rob_990]

that looks really clear if thats coming from a phone

[Pipeless416]

the last two are from my phone. pretty big difference when the lighting isn't ideal haha.

[deathcorefan2]

wow i cant wait till this is done.

your definitely gonna have to get a sound clip:devil:

[Bryson#221]

YAY! You got it!!! :D :D :D

[buck440]

is that a 400ex hmf?

[BlasterEaten250]

I think he said it came off a raptor. Doesn't really matter since he cut off the mounts anyway. So mike, when are you gonna make me some duals:D

[Pipeless416]

maybe if you buy another e series.. lets see how mine works first haha. to everybody else.. we're gonna rig the pipe to my subframe just for a foreshadowing..

[Pipeless416]

heres a few pics :)

[Pipeless416]

just to get an idea..

[Pipeless416]

this is going to require some serious bending :scary:

[Pipeless416]

it'll be evenly spaced with the other one once i move the rectifier.

[Pipeless416]

represent yo. thats all for now!

[ThreeDollaBills]

Hey man if you need a true 400ex HMF. I might be selling mine in a couple of months. If that one being off a raptor makes a difference that is. Mine is polished aluminum though. Just let me know.

[Pipeless416]

thanks for the offer, but i basically made a 400ex slip on lol. all i have to do is weld the bracket on the opposite side so it can mount on the left side of the subframe. i wasn't picky because i would have to do this either way.

[400ex28]

Is the end cap different on the raptor hmf?

[Pipeless416]

i had the cap powdercoated on my other HMF.. the new one will be getting the same treatment once i get the mount welded on at school. the tip needs to be cleaned up as well.

[400ex28]

oh i see... well, good luck with it.

[Exrider434]

thats gonna look realllll good, props for bein the first one to make your own!

[hypersnyper6947]

Originally posted by Pipeless416
it'll be evenly spaced with the other one once i move the rectifier.

Nice dude now all you need to do is sell the idea to HMF and make a little coin
:D

[Pipeless416]

if it actually quiets it down while making the same power i'll shoot the idea over to them :)

[Pipeless416]

my project is going to have a little break :(

[billyboy93]

y?????

[Pipeless416]

now i need to focus on my completely pulled headstud.

[Exrider434]

WTF happened!?

[tri5ron]

Originally posted by Pipeless416
now i need to focus on my completely pulled headstud.

Ouch, that sucks,...
hope you can retap it bigger.
may have to fab up your own stud, but I'm sure your capable of doing it.

good luck, and I'm very interested in the end results.
I would LOVE to be getting the higher performance of my Big Gun, but at decible levels near stock. That would be awesome.

I'm not one who necessarily subscribes to the common belief that louder is safer. in my opinion, Louder means more problems, more trail closures, more complaints.

fast and quiet= Stealth
I like Stealth.

Whoosh vs. Roar............. give me Whoosh!

[deathcorefan2]

WOW SICK, JUST SICK.

i want that bad. lol

make a business making these. you will make tons, just from people on here. lol just have them supply the pipes and charge for shop work.

lol you would make BANK.

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by tri5ron
Ouch, that sucks,...
hope you can retap it bigger.
may have to fab up your own stud, but I'm sure your capable of doing it.

good luck, and I'm very interested in the end results.
I would LOVE to be getting the higher performance of my Big Gun, but at decible levels near stock. That would be awesome.

I'm not one who necessarily subscribes to the common belief that louder is safer. in my opinion, Louder means more problems, more trail closures, more complaints.

fast and quiet= Stealth
I like Stealth.

Whoosh vs. Roar............. give me Whoosh!

i think i might just make my own HD studs on a lathe.. :devil: that would be fairly easy IMO.

[Pipeless416]

well, i'm ready to go back to school.. :o

[Pipeless416]

i have a lot of work cut out for me..

[Pipeless416]

somehow mine looks like this more often than not. im always tinkering.. :p

[bigd's ex]

Probably tear it down & put it back together with your eyes closed huh !!!!! LOL

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by bigd's ex
Probably tear it down & put it back together with your eyes closed huh !!!!! LOL

fortunately and unfortunately haha

[Pipeless416]

since i figure this gets a decent amount of views, i'll just post this in here. ive been looking at different materials to use for new head studs and i narrowed it down to 440 stainless in a 5/16 (just guessing diameter) 24" rod. i chose the 440 for its temperature properties. any thoughts on this? heres the link to what i want. http://www.speedymetals.com/pc-1533-8274-516-rd-440c-stainless-steel-cold-finished.aspx

[Pipeless416]

well i didn't get as much done as i had hoped today. i got all the mounts cut off though. no turning back now! :ermm: :p

[deathcorefan2]

caint wait for this man!!!!
it will be sick!!!

[Pipeless416]

haha thanks man. i hope to have the mounts welded on the pipe and on the subframe by next week... then powdercoating!

[deathcorefan2]

Originally posted by Pipeless416
haha thanks man. i hope to have the mounts welded on the pipe and on the subframe by next week... then powdercoating!

are you getting pappy to do it?
what color?

[Pipeless416]

if i could afford the shipping i would, but theres a place thats only about 5 minutes away from here that does good work. plus, they gave me a huge discount on one of my class projects, so ive been slowly bringing them everything that i can fit in the trunk of my girlfriends car :D

[deathcorefan2]

Originally posted by Pipeless416
if i could afford the shipping i would, but theres a place thats only about 5 minutes away from here that does good work. plus, they gave me a huge discount on one of my class projects, so ive been slowly bringing them everything that i can fit in the trunk of my girlfriends car :D

so you diddnt answer..what color lol:D

[Pipeless416]

my bad.. the subframe will be satin black and the HMF will be gloss black to match the other side.

[deathcorefan2]

Originally posted by Pipeless416
my bad.. the subframe will be satin black and the HMF will be gloss black to match the other side.

oh so your only doing one..
i would do both in candy red..
SWEEEEET.

[deathcorefan2]

Originally posted by deathcorefan2
oh so your only doing one..
i would do both in candy red..
SWEEEEET.

btw you should send pics to HMF and tell them to make it :devil:

they might put your pic on their site or something...
also send it to dirtwheels and other mags, you will deff. get a spot.

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by deathcorefan2
oh so your only doing one..
i would do both in candy red..
SWEEEEET.

the regular HMF was just powdercoated last fall. i'm possibly considering white on the subframe though... just a thought.

[stringbean]

Definately not!
Either do it yourself... Or patent it when you are done.
I would not give credit to HMF for it...
If they wanted it I am sure they could have made it.

There is a company that already makes them but they are 700 a set.

Originally posted by deathcorefan2
btw you should send pics to HMF and tell them to make it :devil:

they might put your pic on their site or something...
also send it to dirtwheels and other mags, you will deff. get a spot.


Nice to see you have made progress.

[deathcorefan2]

well at least send it to a mag, and show it off.

[Pipeless416]

got the mount welded on today

[Pipeless416]

worst TIG weld ever lol. i guess its true that if you don't use it, you lose it. i guess i can't complain much with that being my first weld after not welding for a year or so..:p at least its strong.

[Pipeless416]

last for now.. im working on getting the mount welded to the frame, and finding a way to rubber mount it... probably just fab up mounts like the other side. as for the head studs, i ordered the roll form tap last night for $3. :D

[Bridgewater]

dude thats looking sick bro haha.

[Honda#4]

Lookin good Mike keep up the progress.

[Pipeless416]

thanks guys. this is A LOT more work than i ever imagined.. im gonna try to get some lab time tomorrow to get the mount welded to the subframe. i have a new HMF badge on the way as well. i'm still trying to figure out what i'm doing on the head studs.. i could just fork out the $60 for them.. but i already got a roll form tap for $3 thats just a little bit different tolerance than the one gt thunder uses.. which is $25 from the supplier or $40 from gtt. i just need to figure out what material is common for head studs.

[tri5ron]

Originally posted by Pipeless416
thanks guys. this is A LOT more work than i ever imagined.. im gonna try to get some lab time tomorrow to get the mount welded to the subframe. i have a new HMF badge on the way as well. i'm still trying to figure out what i'm doing on the head studs.. i could just fork out the $60 for them.. but i already got a roll form tap for $3 thats just a little bit different tolerance than the one gt thunder uses.. which is $25 from the supplier or $40 from gtt. i just need to figure out what material is common for head studs.

Hey Mike,
Just saw your post and thought I'd do a little checking for you.
I called a buddy of mine who is a Aerospace Engineer, Race Car Driver, and all around Do-it yourselfer, like us.

He is highly specialized in Material Reviews, and evaluations, so he knows his stuff...

Anyway, He said that it's not as important about witch particular steel alloy is used, as it is the actual manufacturing process.

more specifically to Head Bolts, and the manufacture of them, He said the threads must be ROLLED, and not cut/turned on a lathe.

cutting/lathe turning, actually CREATES stress risers, in the material, on a microscopic level, and therefore impedes the structural integrity of the material.

as opposed to ROLLING the threads into the "Parent Material", actually RELIEVES any stress risers in said material.

He also suggested that you read a book called
Carol Smiths Guide to Nuts Bolts and Fasteners.

it is part of Carol Smiths series of "to Win"books,...
"Race to win", "Build to Win", etc.
(They wouldn't let him call the fastener book "Screw to win"), LOL!

Hope this is useful to you, and keep up the progress, it's looking good!

Ron

[Pipeless416]

thank you for all the information Ron. i really appreciate it. this confirms my concerns about thread forming. i have the roll form tap that i need on the way, and i've been trying to research cold forming exterior threads for the actual threads with no luck.. does an actual roll form die exist?

[Bryson#221]

Atta boy Mike...lookin good! I don't know how you manage to get all that done with school & all. Hurry up and finish that thing!!!! :D

[Pipeless416]

nevermind on the thread rollers.. i found them and they all seem to be in the $250+ range..:eek2: .. i may just buy the gtt studs. im wondering if i can get away with cutting threads and just replace the one pulled stud..? the soft aluminum in the head will still be cold formed threads and the stud will be some grade of stainless steel.. so im wondering if it would be able to handle the stress. seems its not worth doing it if its not the right way though.. and ashley, i told you.. im working on it! lol

[250x_kyle]

Originally posted by Pipeless416
worst TIG weld ever lol. i guess its true that if you don't use it, you lose it. i guess i can't complain much with that being my first weld after not welding for a year or so..:p at least its strong.

its very true. gotta keep your welding skills up to date. GTAW is deffinately a welding process you must stay bruched up with. looking good though

[Pipeless416]

got some more progress. heres part of the mount being bent into shape. this is where the rubber pieces will go, just like stock.

[Pipeless416]

heres the mount welded on.. it still needs the back side. my cell phone doesn't like dark pictures.

[Pipeless416]

thought i'd just take a few shots of the lab i escape to every second i get. heres the welding stations.

[Pipeless416]

shot down the back wall.

[Pipeless416]

and heres the best picture i could get of the entire place. again, sorry for the cell phone quality pictures.

[BlasterEaten250]

Nice, ive always wondered what the lab down there looked like

[Pipeless416]

you can apply here in two years brandon..:)

-another update: i just ordered gt thunder heavy duty head studs.. $60 is cheaper than $300 for a thread roller..

[Pipeless416]

its getting there...

[Pipeless416]

they look uneven in the last picture.. don't worry though.. they're not :)

[Honda#4]

Looking good.

You show HMF how to build exhaust:D

[honda400ex2003]

That is awesome man keep us updated and keep up the good work, steve

[ngates788]

that exhaust looks sick man.. cant wait to see the finished product!

[Exrider434]

wow! really shows what a little ambition and hard work can do.

lookin good, cant wait to see it done!

[Pipeless416]

thank you for all the kind and motivating words everybody! not sure if i mentioned it, but one more little mount and its off to the powdercoaters. satin black on the subframe and gloss black on the hmf canister and end cap. tips will get the polishing treatment.

[stringbean]

I want to hear the finished product!
Dude you have done a awesome job... From a idea to almost a finished product! Its great man! Way to move on a great idea.

[chevys&honda$]

Originally posted by stringbean
I want to hear the finished product!
Dude you have done a awesome job... From a idea to almost a finished product! Its great man! Way to move on a great idea.



X2^^^

[billyboy93]

Originally posted by chevys&honda$
X2^^^

X3

[Pipeless416]

i'll have a couple pics for you guys after i fail my physics II test. :chinese:

[Pipeless416]

i received the gt thunder head studs today.. these things sure look like they were turned on a lathe. maybe the harder material they're made out of don't require turned threads..? anyway.. $75 dollars later.. haha :blah: i guess its still cheap insurance. i just wish i would have gotten at least one sticker :mad:

[Pipeless416]

heres a side by side comparison to a stock stud. look how much more thread depth there is! if these things pull i'm building a hybrid. :scary:

[Pipeless416]

couple shots of the finished mount.

[Pipeless416]

.

[Pipeless416]

in the picture above, i added another small mount to the pipe, since the header won't have much support from the exhaust ports.. being theres only one mounting point in front now.

[Pipeless416]

mounts just like stock :) as well as getting a nice little gusset on that side.. well, thats all for now. off to the powdercoater! hopefully i'll have a few updates on the actual head pipes soon.

[billyboy93]

which way u runnin the head pipes

[Pipeless416]

hopefully i'll route it the same way the other side is routed.. behind the frame rail. i'll just have to reroute the crankcase breather. i think the headpipe is going to be the biggest obstacle :ermm: . anyway, i'll at least be able to get you guys some pictures of the finished product from the subframe back next friday or saturday. i need to get these tips polished up and head studs installed. i forgot i need another quiet core. this project is getting expensive. anybody want to donate? :blah:

[billyboy93]

ill donate 150. opps i ment $1 50 cents. jk if i could i would

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by billyboy93
ill donate 150. opps i ment $1 50 cents. jk if i could i would

hey, if 15 other people did that.. i'd have a new quiet core lol. jk :p

[scuzz]

Excellent work!

I had a friend who *attempted* this...but it didn't come out anywhere near as nice.

I can't wait to hear them.

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by scuzz
Excellent work!

I had a friend who *attempted* this...but it didn't come out anywhere near as nice.

I can't wait to hear them.

thank you thank you thank you. :) im pretty pumped to get it back from the powdercoater. im about to drill and tap the holes for the new head studs.. probably try to start bending the pipe too. this should be fun :ermm:

[scuzz]

Hey, how'd you do on your physics test?

[Pipeless416]

i answered one of the questions "this problem makes me sad:( " hope that answers your question! haha.. alright lab time.. then time to enjoy the 75 degree weather.

[Ruby Soho]

your using a stock 400 header and re bending it right?

im wondering if it would be easier for you to just start with a new pipe instead of working out all the bends in the stock one that aren't needed? and by new pipe i mean a straight new piece, not a header haha

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by Ruby Soho
your using a stock 400 header and re bending it right?

im wondering if it would be easier for you to just start with a new pipe instead of working out all the bends in the stock one that aren't needed? and by new pipe i mean a straight new piece, not a header haha

yep, i actually worked on it a little bit today. i have a ton of pictures. the bending actually went better than expected. still kinked a little bit, but the diameter there is still much bigger than the exhaust port section.

[Pipeless416]

i made my own valve spring compressor because im poor haha

[Pipeless416]

heres another shot of the hydraulic pipe bender.

[Pipeless416]

.

[Pipeless416]

heres a shot of the valve seals which are being replaced. this could solve many peoples "oil burning." i also cleaned up the ports a little.. the exhaust ports are blinging.. :cool: .. i also removed all the head studs except one that is very very stuck. might need to heat it up.

[Pipeless416]

heres the pipe as of now. yes the giant hole still needs some work, but its pretty straight now and i'll be able to bend it how i need. those are about the worst parts in the picture. not bad.. i tried using the wire method.. seems almost as if the tubing is too thick for that to work correctly. i ended up packing the pipe with sand.

[Pipeless416]

i worked on polishing the tips last night :D thats all for now!

[Bryson#221]

NOOOOOOOOOOOOO LIFE.



:D :D :D

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by Bryson#221
NOOOOOOOOOOOOO LIFE.



:D :D :D

life is for people who have time. the past couple of weeks i have run out of that.. hence the reason im not talking to you all day anymore haha

[Ruby Soho]

nice progress.

i made my own valve spring compressor the exact same way.. :D

[Pipeless416]

:mad:

[Ruby Soho]

what happened?

[Brauap]

Originally posted by Pipeless416
heres the pipe as of now. yes the giant hole still needs some work, but its pretty straight now and i'll be able to bend it how i need. those are about the worst parts in the picture. not bad.. i tried using the wire method.. seems almost as if the tubing is too thick for that to work correctly. i ended up packing the pipe with sand.

wtf happend?

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by Ruby Soho
what happened?

the tap shattered when i was forming the threads for the studs. last hole too..

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by Brauap
wtf happend?

uh thats from bending the pipe. i'd say it came out pretty unscathed for what it went through. most will be hidden anyway.

[Ruby Soho]

Originally posted by Pipeless416
the tap shattered when i was forming the threads for the studs. last hole too..

ouch!:scary:

[Pipeless416]

tell me about it.. BUT, i stopped at the local honda dealer and got 2 new xr400 cometic top end gasket kits for $5! haha. the jug is at a machine shop now... hopefully they can drill out the tap with a carbide tip and not charge me out the @$$. i still can't believe that happened.

[Ruby Soho]

wow 5 bucks! you scored.

yeah hope they can get that going for you.

hows the header coming?

[Pipeless416]

the header will be on hold until after spring break (which is next week.) i want to be able to get the engine going again, and then since i'll have it all home i can line it up how i want. its going to need a few tweaking bends here and there. then i just need to weld the plates over the holes and make heat shields. i also need to order a quiet core and a new HMF badge.

[jcs003]

Originally posted by Pipeless416
tell me about it.. BUT, i stopped at the local honda dealer and got 2 new xr400 cometic top end gasket kits for $5! haha. the jug is at a machine shop now... hopefully they can drill out the tap with a carbide tip and not charge me out the @$$. i still can't believe that happened.

it would be better to have the tap EDM'd out. it will cost more but you will know the head is not damaged. you have to use a special tap drilling tool to remove a tap. it has pyramid-type geometry that breaks the tap up into little bits and it can walk off center.

[Brauap]

Originally posted by Pipeless416
tell me about it.. BUT, i stopped at the local honda dealer and got 2 new xr400 cometic top end gasket kits for $5! haha. the jug is at a machine shop now... hopefully they can drill out the tap with a carbide tip and not charge me out the @$$. i still can't believe that happened.

Go to Lowe's, I think it is, and buy one of those drill bits to get stripped or snaped bolts out.. it works EXTREMLY WELL! For about 20 bucks, you get about 7 different sizes from real small to about 1/4 in.. and you can do it yourself! And you drill it in, it has opposide threads that still cut but it will drill the bit out.. if that doesn't work, flip it out to the E-Z out side and it will come out..

[jcs003]

Originally posted by Brauap
Go to Lowe's, I think it is, and buy one of those drill bits to get stripped or snaped bolts out.. it works EXTREMLY WELL! For about 20 bucks, you get about 7 different sizes from real small to about 1/4 in.. and you can do it yourself! And you drill it in, it has opposide threads that still cut but it will drill the bit out.. if that doesn't work, flip it out to the E-Z out side and it will come out..

will not work on a thread tap. thread taps are harder than drill bits

[Pipeless416]

well i called to get an estimate.. he said its going to be a pita to get out and he didn't have a figure because it will be based on how long it takes. that does not sound good.. :ermm:

[jcs003]

i hope it works out for you. in my engineering/machining career i have had to remove a couple of broken taps and it is no fun. looks like you are on the same path as a engineering student.

remember calculus is the solution.

[tri5ron]

Mike,
Bummer on the broken tap, but I've dealt with alot of them.
How much of the tap is stuck in the hole?

Is it flush to the surface , or is it down deeper?

If it IS down deeper, how far down is it?

Can you see any of the Flukes,(the little gaps between the cutting threads) on the tap itself?

Would it be possible for you to post a pic of it?

Usually when a tap breaks, it is because you tried to turn it too far, before reversing it to make the relief cut. (I'm sure you already know this). (I'm also assuming that you did have the hole drilled to the proper size, BEFORE using the tap)
This means, that it is now bound up, with the shavings of the newly cut threads, in the flukes of the tap.

How far, (1/8, 1/4, 1/2, turn), clockwise, did you go, before you backed it up for the relief cut, resulting in the broken tap?

Sometimes it is possiblt to get the tap jarred loose, (or at least not bound up), by vibrating it. So if there is a way for you to tap on the outside of the material with a ball-peen hammer, or with a drift punch, (being very careful to not do any damage to the casting), or possibly using a air hammer/rivet gun, (again VERY carefully, and lightly), you may be able to knock it loose enough to then use something like an icepick to reverse it out of the hole.

also a little heat from a propane torch will expand the parent material, and may assist in getting it free from the bound/stuck condition.

But be VERY CAREFUL trying any of these methods, and dont get impatient. it takes some time and patience to get it out without doing more harm.

and above all, DO NOT try to drill it out. as a previous poster said, the tap is made from VERY hard tool steel, as is almost impossible to drill out while staying on center. (and even if you did stay on center, you'd go through 50 bits trying). i've wore out over a $100 bucks worth of drills, just trying to get one broken bit/tap out.

with 26 years in Aircraft repair, I've done many of these.
Usually when another mechanic would have it all jacked up before they called my team to come save there ***.

It is NOT easy to do, and I have literally spent 20 -30 hours trying to get a single broken bit or tap, out of million dollar parts and assemblies.

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by jcs003
i hope it works out for you. in my engineering/machining career i have had to remove a couple of broken taps and it is no fun. looks like you are on the same path as a engineering student.

remember calculus is the solution.

construction management :blah:

Ron- with roll form tapping, there are actually no chips, as there is no cutting involved. i still backed it out about half a turn ever 2 turns. the problem came when i was done with the actual tapping and i was backing it out. i should have still had about .2 inches until i bottomed out.. it was actually very strange how it felt. there was basically no pressure on the tap and it just got stuck, all the way in, about half an inch down. my professor actually had to dodge the shrapnel :eek: :p . i finally forced a guesstimate out of the machine shop employee that will be working on it tomorrow. he said it shouldn't take more than an hour at $58.50/hour. i told him to call me if he knows for sure that he will go over that, because if he does i will just get a used jug/ new top end kit and a bore. i'll keep you all posted. only a few more days until my powdercoated parts are done! this got expensive very quickly..

[jcs003]

sorry but i assumed from your posts you were in engineering. anyways keep up the good work.

i wouldn't recommend form taps unless its aluminum. just my experience.

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by jcs003
sorry but i assumed from your posts you were in engineering. anyways keep up the good work.

i wouldn't recommend form taps unless its aluminum. just my experience.

no problem, i started in engineering and then decided i didn't want to transfer from here. also, the areas that needed to be drilled and tapped are aluminum.

[bigbad400]

i know how you feel man i just broke off an e z out in the frame front bumper mount, new bumper is becomming expensive. ez outs are too hard to drill too, i have cobalt bits and they dont bite at all. i think i can have the plug cut out and just weld a new plug in and tap it and thread it. but pain in my *** anyways.

[Pipeless416]

well i have an update. the machine shop employee thats working on my cylinder said its really not looking good for me. i also just missed my chance on a cylinder that went for $50 on ebay. :( this was definitely an unexpected turn that i can't afford right now. he said to call him back tomorrow morning for the status.

[honda400ex2003]

sorry to hear that man, good luck anyway. steve

[jcs003]

if your machinist can't get it out the bacic ways, get a shop with an EDM (electro discharge machining) to get it out. another option is to find a shop with a vibration table. this sometimes works.

[Pipeless416]

yea ive been thinking about that. the problem is that i can't see putting much more money into this when i can get a new used cylinder with a new 440 sleeve for about $100 more than im already spending. im considering all my options now. ive got about 4 hard years on this bore and piston already... i might just call and tell him to stop working on it and just pay for the time he has spent already.

[jcs003]

i see what you are saying. since you are a student it usually is best to go the economical route.

[Pipeless416]

well fellers, i ended up finding a freshly bored and honed jug with a new 416 11:1 piston kit for about what a new piston costs by itself :) it was almost time anyway.

[tri5ron]

good to hear.
So you going to have it up and running tonight ?
we're waiting to hear the results, ...

Where's the video ???
Where's the sound clip ???

come on now, no more slacking.
lay off the bon-bon's and soap opera reruns, and get to work !
LOL!
(honestly though, i'm glad you havent tossed in the towel, Looking forward t the final tests of your project)
Ron

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by tri5ron
good to hear.
So you going to have it up and running tonight ?
we're waiting to hear the results, ...

Where's the video ???
Where's the sound clip ???

come on now, no more slacking.
lay off the bon-bon's and soap opera reruns, and get to work !
LOL!
(honestly though, i'm glad you havent tossed in the towel, Looking forward t the final tests of your project)
Ron

haha, should have the engine back together and running by mid next week. i'll still have the whole stock header since the other one isn't quite ready. this will allow me to do before and after decibel readings on video. however, both silencers will be mounted, so you'll see the final product except the finished headers probably saturday!

i don't give up that easily :muscle:

[Bryson#221]

LOL. Ron's fiesty! He wants results and he wants them NOW! ...Well, I think we all do. Did you pull that sucker out of the machine shop yet? ..Pay your dues? I wouldn't want to be the one to foot that bill. Hope your latest purchase will do the trick!

Get er done :blah:

[Pipeless416]

i just called at 7 am this morning to tell them to stop working on it and then called back at 9:30 when the guy that was doing it was supposed to come in. he said its not coming out and he doesn't charge for what he can't fix :) . i'm still going to give him something because he was very understanding and easy to work with. i can't wait to get this new cylinder and top end in.. then i have to break it all in :o :p .

[jcs003]

Originally posted by Pipeless416
i just called at 7 am this morning to tell them to stop working on it and then called back at 9:30 when the guy that was doing it was supposed to come in. he said its not coming out and he doesn't charge for what he can't fix :) . i'm still going to give him something because he was very understanding and easy to work with. i can't wait to get this new cylinder and top end in.. then i have to break it all in :o :p .

glad things are working out. can't wait to see the finished exhaust. it should run better with the increase in cross sectional area of your exhaust, your bottom end may suffer a bit but, you can make up for it with cam timing. getting increased air flow to the intake will also help.

[Bryson#221]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Pipeless416
he said its not coming out and he doesn't charge for what he can't fix :)


EXCELLENT :D :D :D

[tri5ron]

Originally posted by Pipeless416
he said its not coming out and he doesn't charge for what he can't fix :) . i'm still going to give him something because he was very understanding and easy to work with. .

Sounds like a good honest shop.
Do some thing nice for the shop, and they will never forget you, and will always be willing to help you out.

Call back to the owner, and tell him that lunch for the whole shop is on you, and that 2,3,4, (however many are needed), Pizza's will be delivered for lunch tommorow.

I garauntee that everyone in that shop will be very happy to see you come in the next time you need a little work done.

(it's ALWAYS good to be friends with a machine shop)

[Pipeless416]

parts are back from the powdercoater! sorry, still not mounted on the quad yet haha.

[Pipeless416]

the holes for the end cap rivets aren't in yet, so the cap is just kinda sitting in there.

[Pipeless416]

3

[powermadd400ex]

Originally posted by Pipeless416
parts are back from the powdercoater! sorry, still not mounted on the quad yet haha.

get to work danggit!! :D

looks great man

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by powermadd400ex
get to work danggit!! :D

looks great man

the rest of the quad is still 4.5 hours away till tomorrow! lol i'm working on it!

[tri5ron]

Originally posted by Pipeless416
the rest of the quad is still 4.5 hours away till tomorrow! lol i'm working on it!
Sounds like a Bon-bons and Soap Opera, whiney excuse to me...
:blah: :blah: :blah: :blah: :blah: :blah: :blah:

[Choppers]

the third pic says "set rules with your partner about sex lide".lol

[Choppers]

the third pic says "set rules with your partner about sex lide".lol

[Choppers]

the third pic says "set rules with your partner about sex lide".lol

[Choppers]

the third pic says "set rules with your partner about sex life".lol

on the wall

[chevys&honda$]

holy quad post

[bigbad400]

crazy the things people notice...oh..uh keep up the good work pipeless, great thread!

so got any ideas for the next great project??? what about a dual sparks, start asking for donations, you can put it on mine to test it. :D


i might need to go to a 440 or 500 to make that useable, but that would be so sweet looking!!!:eek2:

[stringbean]

Fine job so far pipeless. Keep it up... I am looking for another R4 at the time. Damn man it looks great so far!

[Pipeless416]

thanks again guys. i've got something for you.. a ton of pictures! :)

[Pipeless416]

2

[Pipeless416]

3

[Pipeless416]

side shot with the airbox i made a while ago just sitting in there. the aluminum airbox i made is too dirty to put in pictures :o :p

[Pipeless416]

i have a lot of pictures

[Pipeless416]

sorry about the quality of some pictures.. i forgot to eat when i got home.. so i was running on an empty stomach. kinda shaky. :ermm:

[Pipeless416]

this is what i was talking about up there^^

[Pipeless416]

extra close up

[Pipeless416]

^^ that angle makes them look weird. don't worry, they're level and even ;)

[Pipeless416]

last one.. did i mention HMF is sending me a new badge for free!? i have actually regained faith in human beings after working with the guy at the machine shop, and after dealing with HMFs customer service.

[powermadd400ex]

powerade only does so much huh? :p

she's looking sick man

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by powermadd400ex
powerade only does so much huh? :p

she's looking sick man

its aldi brand :( .. but thanks! haha

[tri5ron]

hey Mike, looking nice!

and don't worry about the pic quality,...
if I just shake my head back and forth while looking at them, they look FINE !!!

LOL!!!

[Yippie-Ki-Yay]

You MUST dyno that think when your done!

[Honda#4]

DAMN! now thats killer. Question though the pic you took of the pipes from the top view the right pipe has no or doesnt appear to have rivets holding the can on, you repacking it?

[krt400ex]

that thing is sssexxxyy :D

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by Honda#4
DAMN! now thats killer. Question though the pic you took of the pipes from the top view the right pipe has no or doesnt appear to have rivets holding the can on, you repacking it?

yep, theres still no packing in it yet, and im waiting for the badge to come. also, i have to drill the 3 holes for the end cap side since thats the side i cut down. i still have to figure out a way to route the pipe.. the starter is making that very difficult.

[hypersnyper6947]

good job man they look awesome

[stringbean]

Great job man! :devil: Looks killer!

I want to hear it!

[rob_990]

SICK!!

[scuzz]

Ugly.



Kidding!


Nice work so far...

[coryatver]

looks good now the hard part with the header. I have no idea how you are going to pull that off keep us updated!

[bluetrx]

hey i just came across your thread, it looks really good and its nice to know im not the only one who hits speed bumps on every project. if it makes you feel better think of the carnage that might have insued running that motor with only three good head studs.

i do want to encourage you to bend that new head pipe out of a new piece, i know its expensive ($116.78 for three feet at the link below) but it would come out much more professional looking its just not possible to un-bend tube and have it come out looking good. everyone who sees the two cans on your bike is going to want to take a closer look at the whole system and that pipe wont be mostly hidden from view when its being looked for.

so thats my two cents. great job and i wont be offended if you dont take my advice because of the expense.

i will be offended if you dont take my advice because you think its a stupid idea.:)






www.onlinemetals.com%2Fmerchant.cfm%3Fid%3D55%26st ep%3D2

[Dathon Lawler]

hey, where did your clutch go??? i don't see it in this pic. so what kind of paint did you use on the motor. plain and simple i wanna do that to mine.lol. is this a "just finished" pic. or does your motor paint and head pipe always come that clean?

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by Dathon Lawler
hey, where did your clutch go??? i don't see it in this pic. so what kind of paint did you use on the motor. plain and simple i wanna do that to mine.lol. is this a "just finished" pic. or does your motor paint and head pipe always come that clean?

that was a just painted and polished pic.. before i ever put the clutch cable back on. i'll tell you this though.. painting it is not worth it. the cases are powdercoated now.

bluetrx- thats a great idea, but i just don't have the funds right now. i wasn't expecting a new cylinder and top end kit :o

everybody else- thanks for the compliments. the badge should be here soon. the pipe bending might not be as bad as i feared... i can get a pretty straight shot if i rotate the midpipe the right way.

[hypersnyper6947]

What if you get a mid pipe or header from one of the companies that makes duals, that should be a good start.

[CK1999.400ex]

hey man that is looking so good !!!!! i wish i had some more room in my shop and some more expensive tools ... and i could come up with alot of extra goodies ... it really looks good ... like it was made like that from the factory ...


GREAY JOB KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK

we will have to get together some time for a week end ride !!!

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by bluetrx
everyone who sees the two cans on your bike is going to want to take a closer look at the whole system and that pipe wont be mostly hidden from view when its being looked for.
.cfm%3Fid%3D55%26step%3D2[/url]

ps- i've already decided i will kick anybody in the face that tries to get too close of a look. ;)


Originally posted by hypersnyper6947
What if you get a mid pipe or header from one of the companies that makes duals, that should be a good start.

i think that would be pretty expensive.. i'm trying to do this on a 5 year olds budget haha

well everybody, i'm getting pretty jerked around on this new cylinder and piston kit. thats all i'll say since its still an ongoing process. on a lighter note, i did get the free HMF badge and a bunch of stickers.

and thanks chris, it means a lot.

[tri5ron]

Mike, been thinking about this a bit and was just wondering about the possibility of running the head pipes in the original stock position, but instead of them coming together into a single tube on the right, maintaining a dual tube set up.

then crossing over to the left HMF. I was looking at my bike, and maybe with a little work on a custom airbox, you might be able to find room to do it.

I realize that the left pipe would end up being longer than the right pipe, but since we are talking about a single cylinder engine, it may not be so critical to maintain equal pressure in both pipes.

maybe some more seasoned exhaust pro's could chime in on that idea.

but if it IS that critical to maintain a near equal pressure, then keep the two into one pipe design, and then split it back into two. one for the left, and one for the right.
that way it should act the same as an equalizer tube on a dual exhaust system used on cars/trucks.

just a thought,and probably alot of other things I'm not considering that would play into it. Rear shock clearance being one of them....

[jcs003]

Originally posted by tri5ron
Mike, been thinking about this a bit and was just wondering about the possibility of running the head pipes in the original stock position, but instead of them coming together into a single tube on the right, maintaining a dual tube set up.

then crossing over to the left HMF. I was looking at my bike, and maybe with a little work on a custom airbox, you might be able to find room to do it.

I realize that the left pipe would end up being longer than the right pipe, but since we are talking about a single cylinder engine, it may not be so critical to maintain equal pressure in both pipes.

maybe some more seasoned exhaust pro's could chime in on that idea.

but if it IS that critical to maintain a near equal pressure, then keep the two into one pipe design, and then split it back into two. one for the left, and one for the right.
that way it should act the same as an equalizer tube on a dual exhaust system used on cars/trucks.

just a thought,and probably alot of other things I'm not considering that would play into it. Rear shock clearance being one of them....

it could make a difference for the reason temperature of exhaust gasses is important in the scavanging processes. one pipe being longer will cool faster when it hits the muffler. it may not make a difference persay, but keeping it consistent would be the best approach.

the dual exhaust on a car would use an x-pipe or H-pipe to balance pressure between the two banks of a V-type engine to allow back pressure in an exhaust system to maintain a consistent frequency of exhaust pulses on both banks. (hope i worded that correct)

[Ruby Soho]

Originally posted by tri5ron
Mike, been thinking about this a bit and was just wondering about the possibility of running the head pipes in the original stock position, but instead of them coming together into a single tube on the right, maintaining a dual tube set up.

then crossing over to the left HMF. I was looking at my bike, and maybe with a little work on a custom airbox, you might be able to find room to do it.

I realize that the left pipe would end up being longer than the right pipe, but since we are talking about a single cylinder engine, it may not be so critical to maintain equal pressure in both pipes.

maybe some more seasoned exhaust pro's could chime in on that idea.

but if it IS that critical to maintain a near equal pressure, then keep the two into one pipe design, and then split it back into two. one for the left, and one for the right.
that way it should act the same as an equalizer tube on a dual exhaust system used on cars/trucks.

just a thought,and probably alot of other things I'm not considering that would play into it. Rear shock clearance being one of them....

do you mean something like this?

http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb229/charlieukusa/PB070645.jpg

[tri5ron]

Originally posted by Ruby Soho
do you mean something like this?

Bingo !

[Ruby Soho]

im going to do that on my 110.. after i do everything else because its purely a bling factor.

its going to be identical to the image i posted above.

i thought about it on the 400, and it may be possible but i think his best bet is to have someone take a photo of the LTE dual on their 400 and see where their header runs on the left side and copy that route

[honda400ex2003]

yup, that would probably be the easiest. I wonder if the LTE site has a shot of it from the side also a thought though. It is looking really good. I would definately do to pipes, one on each side though instead of the 1 into 2 type like the pic above. It would look way cooler with 2 pipes. Just my .02 though, take it or leave it. Keep up the good work, steve

[Pipeless416]

i've been looking at it for quite a while today on my brothers quad.. i don't think it would be possible while still having shock travel clearance. i think my best bet is bending the pipe i have, then maybe down the road having a custom exhaust company make a replica with mandrel bent pipes.

anyway, since this thread is giant, i'll just keep using it for what im working on currently.. you guys might be surprised lol.

[Pipeless416]

i was just going to touch up the frame...:p

[tyman2395]

now what are you doing lol this is a pretty good thread tho

[honda400ex2003]

Is that why the 400 is down to the frame? What are you working on now. I would stick to getting one thing done at a time. Just my .02, steve

[Pipeless416]

mess...

[Pipeless416]

sorry about the yami poster :o

[honda400ex2003]

yup:p you got a mess, steve

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by honda400ex2003
Is that why the 400 is down to the frame? What are you working on now. I would stick to getting one thing done at a time. Just my .02, steve

its ok, i can put these things back together with a blindfold haha. besides, its going to be a while till its up and running again..


Originally posted by tyman2395
now what are you doing lol this is a pretty good thread tho

since most of the engine was out and i couldn't do anything, figured i might as well get the rest of it looking nice again.. it needed it.

[honda400ex2003]

Nice, I wish I could get my motor out all the way. The pin is stuck in right now and I don't want to mess with it. i would like ot respray my frame gray again. It is fun to be able to put it all back together in like 45 minutes or so isn't it. :p steve

[Pipeless416]

yes sir it is lol. i don't even have to label things anymore.. i was really going to just let it sit while i waited.. but them i realized there was no way i could do that. :blah:

[honda400ex2003]

I have the itch but no money or time. Steve

[bigbad400]

i also would love to pull mine all apart and pc the frame but thats kinda pricey. i love the thread, and you seem like a very intelligent person, i have learned alot from this thread and hope to see the end result soon. i think it would look sweet to use a dual pipe all the way to the back, but you would need to run the left one on outside of frame rail, cant see it working any other way. the ds650 pipe made by luney tuned is like that, splits at the motor and runs duals all the way back, that also is a 2 into 1 pipe. but i love your idea too, the dual HMFs sticking out weather dual pipes or not still is a bad *** idea. and should sound awsome. im on a tight budget too but if i had the money id buy a couple sparks pipes and send em your way.

[BlasterEaten250]

Update on the frame, shouldn't be much longer till its back together. my brother also said supposedly the cylinder was sent yesterday

whatd yall do sp it?

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by hondarider661
whatd yall do sp it?

yep, probably another year and i'll have it powdercoated. it was just looking pretty rough after 4 years of abuse.

[tri5ron]

Mike,

My daughter, Cameron, knows that this is one of the threads that I have been following, and it is one that she see's when she is sitting in my lap in the evenings.

She is going to be VERY disappointed in your choice of color, and I'm just going to have to tell her, that you have some explaining to do.

just thought I'd give you the heads up.
LOL!

[Pipeless416]

i didn't see any pink paint at menards! lol

Cameron- maybe you'll convince me to put some pink grips on next :p

[Which 450?]

This is one of the best threads ever. someone said they were gonna do something, and actually did it!!! Well documented at the least!!! I cant wait to hear it!!! One of a kind...