Hinson clutches

[Gregjy]

O.k. so I am DONE fighting clutch issues! What is the deal with Hinson stuff? Is it really all that much better? I don't understand how there basket is special or there pressure plate? Fibers I could see maybe different compounds or something. I can not keep a clutch in my R!! Like one trip to the dunes and she is toast since my motor upgrade. Which is a PT 300 with mid to top end awesome porting. I need help figuring this stuff out. I am also running cr500 springs in her too. Can someone help me understand? :confused:

[LONG-ROD]

Not possitive but the hinson has port hole for better oil flow threw the clutch, and it is billet, what oil do you run in the lower end. and is the clutch fully dissengaging, sorry can't spell. that could be the problem.

[trx250rforlife]

i wouldent run the cr 500 springs on the curtist sparks website they say there not stiffer

[Gregjy]

They FEEL stiffer! I am just running 10-40 in there? Should I run something else? It is disengaging from what I can tell.

[leager-n-ky]

Do you have any problems going from first gear to neutral, while the bike is running? If you do, then it is Not disengaging. Try bel ray gear saver, I have always had good luck with that.

[Gregjy]

Nope it shifts just fine.... Eats fibers like crazy though...
Could it just be too much power for stock type clutch? I did do an update to the 88 89 style clutch...

[LONG-ROD]

Not sure how a clutch not fully disengaging would cause it to not shift to nutreal, MIne does not go into neutral while running, I thought it was due to the cushions on the back of the basket going bad.

[LONG-ROD]

This might sound stupid but you do have installed right, with fiber, metal, fiber and so on.

[Gregjy]

Yeah its all installed right. Not stupid ? you never know....LOL...

[leager-n-ky]

If you are stopped, and you drop it into first gear, then try to go back into neutral, and it goes up into second, your clutch is not fully disengaging, when you have it adjusted correctly, you will be able to put it into neutral with no problems,

[LONG-ROD]

sorry I read your post wrong, I thought you meant ingageing, I think that is what his problem is, his clutch is not engageing completly. like he can let out a lot of lever before it wants to move

[rustyATV]

Originally posted by Gregjy
Nope it shifts just fine.... Eats fibers like crazy though...
Could it just be too much power for stock type clutch? I did do an update to the 88 89 style clutch...

Are you using OEM fibers on OEM steel plates?

[Gregjy]

Not now. I have EBC's I believe.? I am trying to figure out if I need to go all out Hinson? It will shift just fine. But when I am on it hard it will start to slip every time.

[rustyATV]

I had an issue where I mixed one brand fibers with another's steels (I think OEM fibers on EBC's steels), and the steels got scored and warped. Someone then told me that you shouldn't mix brands. But if you're using the same all the time, then scratch that thought.

[Aceman]

Originally posted by Gregjy
They FEEL stiffer! I am just running 10-40 in there? Should I run something else? It is disengaging from what I can tell.

Are you running an oil meant for wet clutches? One that doesn't have friction modifiers in it?

Does your clutch cable have slack in it when the lever ISN'T pulled in?

I've always been under the impression stock fibers/steels were the way to go. I'm also running the stiffer EBC springs in mine too.

[2-330s]

hinson makes great stuff. but i have found the stock metals and fibers don't fade as much. they are what i went back to after trying alot of others. the cr 500 springs are softer don't use them.

[cdrookie]

http://www.*********.net/trx250rforums/index.php?showtopic=1202

don't know if that link will work or not...

guess not... trx250r dot net

[Gregjy]

Link not working. What is there that you want me to look at?

[cdrookie]

c-leigh's recomendations for clutches...

[deathman53]

Fix for 250R clutch,
Remove 1 of the 250R steel plates & replace it with one 400EX steel plate.
New set of SOAKED fiber plates, dont make any difference in brand, high priced or cheap as dirt no difference at all.
Set of CR 500 springs
The aluminum washers that go under the transmission drain bolt on a 250R engine, use one of those on each clutch spring bolt, under the bolt, NOT down in the presure plate.
If the basket is grooved real bad, wouldnt hurt to file it some, get some of the cup shape out of the groove.
After you have done this mod & have the 89 clutch update, probably wouldnt hurt to get another bearing flat washer for the rod end at the presure plate to take up some of the extra clearance there because there will be some & then an EASY pull clutch lever.
Easy pull lever, why, because after the mod & you ride like normal on an MX track comming out of a corner in the wrong gear & start to fan the clutch lever to make the engine pull, about a lap & those left hand fingers will be through, gone, give out.
When you do this mod, clutch plate slip & replaceing fiber plates are over.
Been using this mod for years on a bunch of 250R engines & all report back with the same results.

[cdrookie]

^^^^^^^^^ deathman posted it...

[jhtrx250r]

I know some one asked you earlyer, but I did not see a response
what type and weight trans oil do you run?
I used to get a semi syn oil at work that smoked my clutch fibers on a stock motor

I went back to running the correct oil Honda gear oil (red bottle)
80w in my 57hp 310 pv motor with OE honda clutches and steels in a wiesco basket 89 clutch rod update and never had a problem

make sure you have the right oil !

[dove]

i just run putoline light gear oil in mine and never had any problems,if you are using a 10/40 semi synthetic thats probably whats wrong,your not supossed to run any type of synthetic oil in your trany unless the plates are compatible(some 4 strokes are)because the oil is slippier.stick to a light gear oil and you should be fine

[All250R]

Your problem I'd be willing to bet a few bucks are the CR 500 springs. CR500's ran 6 springs and are significantly shorter than TRX springs. If you dropped in CR500 springs without a shim, you weakened your spring tension to way below the replacement spec for TRX springs. There is no reason your clutch fibers and oil should be giving you that much grief.

Here is a rank of springs in terms of length, coil diameter and overall weight/density:
88-89 TRX springs
Barnett TRX springs
86-87 TRX springs
CR 500 springs

Again, length, diameter and weight (combined "score") are the highest in the 88-89 TRX springs; CR 500 springs are way last place. You'd need 6 or some thick spacers to gain any benefit from them.

[86 Quad R]

i betcha its the combo of cr500 springs and the type oil your running. most oils now are with slip modifiers and will smoke a clutch.

i personally run OEM steals, ebc clutches and 88-89 springs with the washer spacer and pj1 "clutch tuner light" but run the same setup on the other bikes using Dextron tranny fluid with NO issues. been doing this for years.

btw if ya want a quality basket for a fraction of the cost look into the PE. motosports has them w/free shipping.

[8686]

OEM OEM OEM

[leager-n-ky]

I am wondering if the basket has grooves worn in it, and causing the plates to hang up, look at your clutch basket when you take it apart, and see where the ears on the fiber plates stick up out of the basket, see if the basket has grooves worn in it.

[rustyATV]

Originally posted by 86 Quad R
i personally run OEM steals, ebc clutches and 88-89 springs with the washer spacer and pj1 "clutch tuner light" but run the same setup on the other bikes using Dextron tranny fluid with NO issues. been doing this for years

What got you away from using Honda Gear Oil?

[LONG-ROD]

So whats the best oil to run in the motor. I ahve been running some 85 wt maxum oil,, is there something just as good I can pick up at walmart or something?

[86 Quad R]

Originally posted by rustyATV
What got you away from using Honda Gear Oil?

i've never really ran honda gear oil. i started out using the pj1 or maxum when i first got my R about 10-12 years ago and started using auto tranny a couple or three years back when we started playing around with dirt drags.

[2-330s]

i use 0w40 amsoil in the winter and in the summer honda gear oil

[LONG-ROD]

So I can just trow some gear lube from walmart in it, what weight, and will this be fine in the sand, and dirt, is it good for crank seals?

[rustyATV]

Originally posted by LONG-ROD
So I can just trow some gear lube from walmart in it, what weight, and will this be fine in the sand, and dirt, is it good for crank seals?

I would imagine you'd want to be more selective than just any gear oil. Maybe look for something that says it's safe for limited slip differentials, as those have friction plates much like a quad's wet clutch.

[LONG-ROD]

ah, right on rusty.

[LONG-ROD]

Rusty, I am not sure that a car has any kind of friction plate in the diff. ??????? , I guess some might

[Gregjy]

Thanks guys for all the info. I have ran 10-40 for years with no problem. Not saying it is right I just have had no problems till I put this topend on it and started running some good power. I have a hinson basket on the way and will put it in when it gets here with a new clutch. As far as the 500 springs being weaker? They seem stiff as hell next to the barnett or oem springs??? The Basket being grooved, I won't know till I pull her back apart. To tell you the truth I was never sure what a grooved basket looked like till I started researching this problem so I will have to look. I will run a different oil in her when I put it back together this time also.

[rustyATV]

Originally posted by LONG-ROD
Rusty, I am not sure that a car has any kind of friction plate in the diff. ??????? , I guess some might

See "Clutch Type"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limited_slip_differential

[LONG-ROD]

Interesting Rusty, learn somthing new everyday, thanks for the link.

[All250R]

Originally posted by Gregjy
Thanks guys for all the info. I have ran 10-40 for years with no problem. Not saying it is right I just have had no problems till I put this topend on it and started running some good power.

Honda calls for 10-40wt motor oil. As long as there are no modifiers that aren't good for a wet clutch, it should not be the reason for massive slippage of new disks.


Originally posted by Gregjy
As far as the 500 springs being weaker? They seem stiff as hell next to the barnett or oem springs???

Some breeds of them at least are significantly shorter than TRX springs. The coil diameter has the potential also to be thinner than 88-89 springs. You have to look yourself to see if that's the case with the ones you bought. New 88 springs are 48mm. If it doesn't cure your problem, it's at least one area to knock off your list. It's known that CR500 springs often run with a shim. Take a peek.