Future ATV's

[03pete]

Not too long ago, people were racing the 250 2 stroke, before it moved to the 450 4 stroke. Since then, ATV's have been constantly improved. Everything from better suspension and frames, to fuel injection; But my question is, whats next? Will something come out that is better than a 450? something else that will dominate the race track?

Post your Opinions.

[k4f5x0r]

direct injection is what im guessing is next. after that im guessing to see some really crazy idea's coming. carbon fiber quads higher cc motors etc. just some idea's i had :p

[250r rider 88]

i dont see anything changing as far as the 450 not being the premier machine, not unless the bike side of the sport was to change, which i cant see happening, but who knows just have to wait and see,

[mooseracerX]

I don't want to get this off track but how did they just decide one day that 450's are where it's at? I mean is there something about the power to weight or something else?

[250r rider 88]

i think so, back when they were racing the 500cc 2 strokes they were considered a handful and i just think cramming a bigger 4 stroke motor into the aluminum frames would just be alot for any rider to go out and handle for 30 min+2 on the outdoor tracks, i think the 250 and 450 mesh well with their frames and make the best power to weight ratios

however it was noted awhile back that if they could have the Cr500 2 stoke motor in a newer frame like the CRF450 some would prefer it over the 4 stroke, basically because the cr500 is a little bit lighter of a motor i believe (correct me if im wrong)

[631kfx400]

trx5000 canuter injection hovercraft compatable:devil:

Originally posted by 250r rider 88
however it was noted awhile back that if they could have the Cr500 2 stoke motor in a newer frame like the CRF450 some would prefer it over the 4 stroke, basically because the cr500 is a little bit lighter of a motor i believe (correct me if im wrong)

its been out for years lol If you could control a cr500 around the track and beat crf450 you must be insanly good because they took 3 riders and tested it they took like a pro then a A class rider then like a average rider and the crf450 put in faster lap times on from all. The power is just too uncontrolable for a track even being in a crf frame and all new technology goodies. Basically that bike was made for crazy hill climbers or open racing like in the desert.

[mooseracerX]

Originally posted by 631kfx400
trx5000 canuter injection hovercraft compatable:devil:
With bold new graphics.

[coryatver]

you can get a cr500 in the newer chassis from service honda. 9,000 bucks though
http://servicehonda.com/images/07_500af.jpg

[907Rider]

Originally posted by coryatver
you can get a cr500 in the newer chassis from service honda. 9,000 bucks though
http://servicehonda.com/images/07_500af.jpg
Dont forget the service honda kx500!
http://i424.photobucket.com/albums/pp330/Jarred27x/leftwb6001.jpg

[ProspectorJim]

carbon fiber frames maybe?

[250r rider 88]

carbon fiber frames are a ways off i would say, carbon fiber is great at absorbing vibration because of how it is made, so i do not doubt it could handle the vibration, or the stress, i dont know there is jsut something about riding on a carbon fiber frame that worries me, and if it cracks you would pretty well be screwed i would think, i think can-am is on to something with that pyramidal frame design and i would think we would see a newer frame design like that before a carbon frame

[ProspectorJim]

Yea I was thinking after aluminum frames were stretched to their limits that carbon fiber frames would come in. Maybe built in sections like the ds450 frame so if one part brakes you can replace it.

[Drewltr450]

titanium frames. Direct injection, Diamond fire spark plugs stock. Quick shifter (like on the sportbikes).

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by Drewltr450
titanium frames. Direct injection, Diamond fire spark plugs stock. Quick shifter (like on the sportbikes).

id imagine carbon fiber frames before titanium. i was always under the impression that titanium flexes too much and can offer some really squirrelly handling. carbon fiber frames would be ridiculously expensive though.. imagine 50 quadtech hoods :eek2:

If they could put rotary technology into quads that would be insane.

Look at the rx7's. Those little 1.3L sons a biches are fast.

It would make a great high-rpm race motor.

Either that or refined 2-strokes. E-tec already has it down.

With modern fuel injection and lots of refinements, they got 2-strokes burning cleaner then 4-strokes and still producing more power per displacement.

I also see spring shocks as a thing of the past and factory quads coming with air shocks similar to fox float designs.

Carbon Fiber frames, if they can make it strong enough.

[LTRracer4]

as time goes on the restrictions will get worse which will rule out the idea of these crazy power motors.

id like to see a 250 class of quads. I think if all the companies could make a race ready 250 that was light and easy to mod, then we could have pro and lites, and have 125 a b c and 250 a b c at the local races.. i think tracks could make alot more money that way, every serious racer that wanted more then one moto a day, and just every rider who didnt want a full 450 would buy one so it would be good for the manufacturers.

think of how crappy carbon fiber would be. The carbon fiber quadtech uses is low grade low tech stuff. Go look at a lemans car or a real race cars carbon fiber parts completely different and probally 100 times stronger and way more expensive. The bad part would be if something broke you cant weld it or drill it or probally shave or modify it. havent seen this mentioned

VTEC!!! lol having variable valve timing on a quad would make them scream throughout the RPM range. EFI and frame sections bolted to me seems the way of the future. EFI for sure but the DS frames that idea is genious if you break a section. 2 strokes are a thing of the past they cant even make as much power as the 4 strokes now. How it used to be like 125 2 stroke vs 250 4 stroke or 250 2 stroke vs 450 4 stroke they cant even compete with the 2 strokes anymore because they advanced and figured out the 4 strokes more.

[bluebaron]

How about small turbos. And what about suspension? Maglev? haha. a NASA 450 for $1,000,000,000 ha

Carbon fiber frames? thats so 2013, get with the new carbon nanotubes. They're the strongest and stiffest material currently known;)

[pro-rider46]

i can see down the road 500s replacing the 450s, like the same concept as the 450s but just slightly larger displacement. maybe get into chromoly frames. thats all i see for a while

[Yippie-Ki-Yay]

I think in the far future (around 2020) Honda will put new raced inspired graphics on all thier quads! In 2040, honda will add fuel injection to the 450r, and in 2050, they will improve the 400ex's shocks! Looking forward to the next 49 years!!!:D

[csr250r]

Atvs of the future will probably have amazing suspension, lighter, more powerful, better handling.

I agree that a 250 new fourstroke class of quads would be sweet. If they were light enough and had a legit 5 speed dirtbike liquid cooled motor, not some air cooled underpowered thing. and some better suspention.

[Quad18star]

With the way things are going with the environment , you may one day see Flex Fuel machines or bikes that are "greener"

[mooseracerX]

Originally posted by FoxHondaRider
think of how crappy carbon fiber would be. The carbon fiber quadtech uses is low grade low tech stuff.

If you noticed that they are just Fiber glass. I have one sitting right here.

[Pipeless416]

Originally posted by FoxHondaRider
think of how crappy carbon fiber would be. The carbon fiber quadtech uses is low grade low tech stuff. Go look at a lemans car or a real race cars carbon fiber parts completely different and probally 100 times stronger and way more expensive. The bad part would be if something broke you cant weld it or drill it or probally shave or modify it. havent seen this mentioned



thats why it would need to be separate pieces like the ds frame.. of course it wouldn't be flimsy carbon fiber like a quadtech hood. thats for looks only. carbon fiber is in many cases just as strong as a mild steel, but much lighter.





Originally posted by mooseracerX
If you noticed that they are just Fiber glass. I have one sitting right here.

do you even know the difference :huh that is a very untrue statement.

I would like to see Toyota start up with their own line of bikes and quads. Electric things arent too far away. It will take away from the fun not having a rumble behind you but electric motors are pretty darn quick for their size and would rape. But the fun factor of no sound mayb a whine is lame. I cant imagine races and riding areas silent it would seem so boring like a world with no noise

[ProspectorJim]

Originally posted by FoxHondaRider
I would like to see Toyota start up with their own line of bikes and quads. Electric things arent too far away. It will take away from the fun not having a rumble behind you but electric motors are pretty darn quick for their size and would rape. But the fun factor of no sound mayb a whine is lame. I cant imagine races and riding areas silent it would seem so boring like a world with no noise

maybe they could make electronic rumbling noises like those bicycles that look like dirtbikes:p

I believe there is a company working on electric quads. I remember seeing something about a utility quad that was electric powered. It could only go like 30 mph though.

Theres a couple problems with electric quads and why they won't go into production, at least not in the near future.

One being weight. Batteries and electric motors are heavy. I guess if you want a race quad with utility weight.

Another being power. Just like any other electric appliance, without being plugged into something it will slowly get less and less powerful.

The beggining of the trip would be fun, but the end would be like riding a 90cc

[mooseracerX]

Originally posted by Pipeless416
do you even know the difference :huh that is a very untrue statement.
Oh yeah I just looked it up. My bad. The difference would be that one has strands of glass and the other would have strands of carbon, right?

[gcart2]

Originally posted by ProspectorJim
maybe they could make electronic rumbling noises like those bicycles that look like dirtbikes:p

I believe there is a company working on electric quads. I remember seeing something about a utility quad that was electric powered. It could only go like 30 mph though.


mythbusters did it.

[ProspectorJim]

Originally posted by gcart2
mythbusters did it.
when did they do that?

They arent that heavy. At my uncles company they designed an electric motor for a quad that has like 23HP or something and its the size of my forearm. They made an electric quad and they are working on cars.

[ProspectorJim]

found it, its just jamie hyneman who backs this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dpRdSLaLaFs

but this definately isn't the same one that I saw.

Well utility quads are a different story. Weight isnt as big a issue and I see it being a HUGE hit with hunters because its so quiet.

[RATPACK Z400]

in the near future we will see all the brands coming out with 250 4-stroke racequads and suzuki will have a new sport 700 to battle the rap,kawi,honda 700,s should be interesting to see!

[ikas]

I think like the raptor will get a alternative model whit a turbo kit :D

[ikas]

I think like the raptor will get a alternative model whit a turbo kit :D

Originally posted by DMC-4OOEX
If they could put rotary technology into quads that would be insane.

Look at the rx7's. Those little 1.3L sons a biches are fast.


rx7's are fast, I'll give you that. But the reliability side of those rotary engine's are little to none... more favoring towards none.

[1fastR]

turbos-new artic cat snowmobiles have them

a.b.s. braking systems

traction control

drive by wire

its all coming, I remeber a few years ago people saying atv and dirtbikes will never have fuel injection.

[ikas]

Originally posted by 1fastR
turbos-new artic cat snowmobiles have them

a.b.s. braking systems

traction control

drive by wire

its all coming, I remeber a few years ago people saying atv and dirtbikes will never have fuel injection.

Its two companies that make turbos for atvs here in sweden for the raptor and thundercat :D

[BludgerDB]

Originally posted by gcart2
mythbusters did it.


Another Electric/Green Machine Link (http://www.discoverychannel.ca/shows/episodedetails.aspx?eid=6595&sid=6338)

Originally posted by Nova
rx7's are fast, I'll give you that. But the reliability side of those rotary engine's are little to none... more favoring towards none.

That was mainly the 1st and 2nd gen rotaries. Rotaries have a ring-type thing on each corner of the rotar. They couldn't find a way to keep them from wearing down too fast the the "rings" would wear down super quick. Plus they had some other issues.

By the 3rd gen they fixed a lot of the problems and found a much better "ring" material that holds up much better. Most modern rotaries will easily last 100k +

a 250cc rotary would probably haul @ss

jet engines

[ProspectorJim]

whistle tips that go wooooooooh woooh!

[brian76708]

Originally posted by ProspectorJim
whistle tips that go wooooooooh woooh!

its like an alarm clock says bub rub

[mandrewlt250r]

Originally posted by FoxHondaRider
think of how crappy carbon fiber would be. The carbon fiber quadtech uses is low grade low tech stuff. Go look at a lemans car or a real race cars carbon fiber parts completely different and probally 100 times stronger and way more expensive. The bad part would be if something broke you cant weld it or drill it or probally shave or modify it. havent seen this mentioned

VTEC!!! lol having variable valve timing on a quad would make them scream throughout the RPM range. EFI and frame sections bolted to me seems the way of the future. EFI for sure but the DS frames that idea is genious if you break a section. 2 strokes are a thing of the past they cant even make as much power as the 4 strokes now. How it used to be like 125 2 stroke vs 250 4 stroke or 250 2 stroke vs 450 4 stroke they cant even compete with the 2 strokes anymore because they advanced and figured out the 4 strokes more.


The only reason 2 strokes are not being developed is cuz there dirty and companies have no reason too make them better. there being outlawed. if they could keep making them 2 strokes will **** on 4 stroke and im sure in the future they will make a come back if they get cleaner

[Jersey450R]

Originally posted by LTRracer4
as time goes on the restrictions will get worse which will rule out the idea of these crazy power motors.

id like to see a 250 class of quads. I think if all the companies could make a race ready 250 that was light and easy to mod, then we could have pro and lites, and have 125 a b c and 250 a b c at the local races.. i think tracks could make alot more money that way, every serious racer that wanted more then one moto a day, and just every rider who didnt want a full 450 would buy one so it would be good for the manufacturers.


did u see the Apex 250? Thing looks sweet!

[yam450_53]

My take on it is that you will definitely NOT see a comeback of the 2 strokes, although I would like that, it's just not gonna happen... I love the idea of carbon fiber frames and titanium, but keep in mind those are top-end materials and veeery expensive, highly doubt they will be used on big production lines. CC's will stay 250 and 450, don't know why everyone thinks it will go up to 500... bigger is not always better, and 450's are already a handful. I think the base designs will pretty much stay the same, at limit can-am style, but the technologies will just keep getting better and better, especially suspension. Electric motors? maybe... in utility quads, now imagine nascar with electric powered cars... yeah that's what I thought, not gonna happen. My 0.02$

Originally posted by yam450_53
now imagine nascar with electric powered cars... yeah that's what I thought, not gonna happen. My 0.02$

that would ruin it so bad no more ground shaking and hearing that sweet sound coming off the turn almost alien before they roar past you. I dont even think they could use electric running 180+MPH for a few hours the battery would drain in the 1st few laps going that fast. Drag racing they have done it with motorcylces and all but after a pass or 2 they need to recharge it.

[gcart2]

Originally posted by FoxHondaRider
that would ruin it so bad no more ground shaking and hearing that sweet sound coming off the turn almost alien before they roar past you. I dont even think they could use electric running 180+MPH for a few hours the battery would drain in the 1st few laps going that fast. Drag racing they have done it with motorcylces and all but after a pass or 2 they need to recharge it.

i think if they were to switch to electric they would go welll over 200, that is if the car can handle it.

[scuzz]

Originally posted by 250r rider 88
i dont see anything changing as far as the 450 not being the premier machine, not unless the bike side of the sport was to change, which i cant see happening, but who knows just have to wait and see,


This may have been covered already (I haven't read all of the pages in this thread yet) but the 650r engine is lighter than the 450r.

Originally posted by gcart2
i think if they were to switch to electric they would go welll over 200, that is if the car can handle it.

they can already go well over 200mph but they have restrictor plates. Notice on Daytona you might see 190mph thats with restrictor plates and a 2.5 mile track. Then look at a short track where they dont run restrictor plates and the cars will get to the same speed on a tiny track. Bill Elliott set the Daytona International Speedway track record in 1987, running 210.364 mph, just before restrictor plates were introduced to the sport. It was so dangerous when they crashed the cars would just fly up in the air. Thats in 1987 going that fast and the cars are faster now let them run without restrictor plates they will probally be hitting 225mph which is nuts to go that fast and be inches from another car. The COT the cars they currently have are much safer and have more downforce so I think they could handle the higher speeds of hitting 200mph

[brian76708]

Originally posted by FoxHondaRider
they can already go well over 200mph but they have restrictor plates. Notice on Daytona you might see 190mph thats with restrictor plates and a 2.5 mile track. Then look at a short track where they dont run restrictor plates and the cars will get to the same speed on a tiny track. Bill Elliott set the Daytona International Speedway track record in 1987, running 210.364 mph, just before restrictor plates were introduced to the sport. It was so dangerous when they crashed the cars would just fly up in the air. Thats in 1987 going that fast and the cars are faster now let them run without restrictor plates they will probally be hitting 225mph which is nuts to go that fast and be inches from another car. The COT the cars they currently have are much safer and have more downforce so I think they could handle the higher speeds of hitting 200mph

this is why nascar is the wwe of racing

Originally posted by brian76708
this is why nascar is the wwe of racing

most NASCAR fans are crash fans haha just watch to see the crashes. it is such a redneck sport the crowd of people are fun though

Nascar has to be the lamest, more boring sport created on this planet. I think it's just an excuse for people to get drunk.

I mean honestly.. 200 laps of an oval?

As quoted by a comedian
"And he's making a left turn! And another left turn! And another left turn! Did you see that left turn?!"

Originally posted by DMC-4OOEX
Nascar has to be the lamest, more boring sport created on this planet. I think it's just an excuse for people to get drunk.

I mean honestly.. 200 laps of an oval?

As quoted by a comedian
"And he's making a left turn! And another left turn! And another left turn! Did you see that left turn?!"

ever been to a race? i doubt it, theres no way if you were at a good race you would be saying that.

Originally posted by FoxHondaRider
ever been to a race? i doubt it, theres no way if you were at a good race you would be saying that.

Ive forced myself to watch it on TV and I live literally right next to the pocono race way. Its right up the road from me. I went once.

I hate it. Even with crashes its boring as hell.

Originally posted by DMC-4OOEX
Ive forced myself to watch it on TV and I live literally right next to the pocono race way. Its right up the road from me. I went once.

I hate it. Even with crashes its boring as hell.


road races = queer unless its F1. i cant stand watching stock cars road racing wheres the drafting and stuff. come to daytona and i bet you change your mind

Originally posted by FoxHondaRider
road races = queer unless its F1. i cant stand watching stock cars road racing wheres the drafting and stuff. come to daytona and i bet you change your mind

I hate nascar period. I different size oval wont change my mind:rolleyes:

And regular car racing I can care less for also. F1 is alright but the main type of racing I watch on TV is drifting, motorcycle racing, and supercross.

I catch atv supercross/xc on every once in a rare while.

[mandrewlt250r]

Originally posted by DMC-4OOEX
Ive forced myself to watch it on TV and I live literally right next to the pocono race way. Its right up the road from me. I went once.

I hate it. Even with crashes its boring as hell.

I hate when those f***ing races come to town so much traffic and crap. Where do you ride? ever been to lost trails?

[trick250r]

Originally posted by FoxHondaRider
Bill Elliott set the Daytona International Speedway track record in 1987, running 210.364 mph, just before restrictor plates were introduced to the sport.

unless im mistaken, that was the race he came back from a few laps down and won... under green.

sorry for all of you guys that think nascar is a redneck sport but i think its pretty awesome that one turn of a bolt or even a 1 or 2 lb. difference in tire pressure can change a cars lap time by a dramatic amount.



anyways, back on subject, i read a while ago that when suzuki came out with the ltr500 that it was pushing it and several other comanies decided that a sport quad shouldnt go much bigger than that. as far as the titanium frame idea, didnt the pros way back try out titanium a-arms? they didnt break but they bent easier than steel.

Originally posted by mandrewlt250r
I hate when those f***ing races come to town so much traffic and crap. Where do you ride? ever been to lost trails?

I know. Cops everywhere also.

So you live in brodheadsville? Im in effort literally right near Turkey hill on 209.

We ride a couple places. Theres a pit behind the church next to the turkey hill thats fun to screw around in but it gets boring after a while.
Then down the road from my house up the mountain, theres a couple powerlines we ride on with trails off the sides.

The only other place we ride at locally, or close, is marshalls creek. Theres a pretty big pit behind the Mr. Z's plaza that is pretty fun to ride in and has some good trails.

We heard of lost trails and my friend goes there all the time but ive never actually been there. Been wanting to for a while but since my grades aren't that great I haven't been allowed to ride.

[Pipeless416]

man this thread took a dive since nascar was mentioned. :rolleyes:

Originally posted by Pipeless416
man this thread took a dive since nascar was mentioned. :rolleyes:

yeah, it did get pretty off track.

mandrewlt250r just pm me

[scuzz]

Originally posted by FoxHondaRider
most NASCAR fans are crash fans haha just watch to see the crashes. it is such a redneck sport the crowd of people are fun though



You should see a dirt track race. It's 4x the drama in the stands.

[03pete]

I would like to see motorcycle engine HP in ATVs stock someday. Like a R1 engine on a quad off the showroom floor.

[tri5ron]

here ya go...
http://www.atv-in-china.com/images/products/21469/Concept_Quad_ATV800cc_.jpg

[powermadd400ex]

Originally posted by tri5ron
here ya go...
http://www.atv-in-china.com/images/products/21469/Concept_Quad_ATV800cc_.jpg

yuck, i think i would ride a spyder or something but not that :ermm: