450 vs. 505

[One_Bad_400]

just curious on how much more power the 505 has then the 450? stock vs. stock?!? is it worth it?

[Quadevil]

about 2-3 horses and a little bit more torque, according to the dyno's i saw.

[ltr311]

Im guessing more around 1-1.5whp if that.

Same exact motor
One is 450cc
One is 477cc. That big of a jump in displacement is unually good for around 1whp 1ftlb.

My opinion is this. If you need a 450 to run the class you wanna race, get it. If that doesnt matter spend the extra 300 for the faster machine.

[mxraptor149]

I got a chance to ride both these machines at one of the KTM Ride Experience events at Crow Canyon on the big mx track.

The 450 power hits pretty hard on the top end once you get around 9,K rpms. It keeps revving and doesn't seem to lose power on the top, which translated into an ideal ride for hitting the big jumps out of the tight corners at Crow, and not to mention that's good for pulling holeshots.

The 505 is a lot smoother and definitely has more low-end power. The 450 might wear you out faster (if you're not prepared) and the 450 seems a little better suited for extremely technical tracks.

[KTM120]

at least you got to ride both... i paid the 20 bucks to find out that u could only ride the 505 on sunday because the 450 was blown up on sat.... but the 505 sure does rip!!!!!

[k4f5x0r]

^^so much for reliable :devil:

[andrew450r]

it said in atv sprot that they both have the same peak horse power. the only differnece is wen the power comes.

[Quadevil]

Originally posted by andrew450r
it said in atv sprot that they both have the same peak horse power. the only differnece is wen the power comes.

Nope, it's clearly the opposite.
The 450SX and 505SX have almost equal power curves but the 505 has 3-4 more peak hp.

[ltr311]

Originally posted by Quadevil
Nope, it's clearly the opposite.
The 450SX and 505SX have almost equal power curves but the 505 has 3-4 more peak hp.

My guess is there will only be about 1.5whp difference between the two. Ill be doing some comparisons before the end of the months. Brad is buying a 450 and we will compare it against my 505.

My sx bone stock with silencer out did 50.5whp 37ftlbs. I bet the 450 will do 49whp. We will see.

[bbrad mulvey]

Ya, it will be VERY interesting to see how this all plays out:) We should have 450vs 505 by the end of Feb at the latest.

[andrew450r]

Originally posted by ltr311
My guess is there will only be about 1.5whp difference between the two. Ill be doing some comparisons before the end of the months. Brad is buying a 450 and we will compare it against my 505.

My sx bone stock with silencer out did 50.5whp 37ftlbs. I bet the 450 will do 49whp. We will see.

that is so awesome. a bone stock 450r makes about 34, that thing must be some wild ride!!

[04TRX400EX]

They're definitely a lot of fun, but can be a handful if you're not holding on tight enough, especially when trying to grab the clutch lever to change gears. As others have said, the 505 makes about 1.5hp more than the 450 thanks strictly to a slightly larger bore. Both quads are very fast but the 505 will give you a little bit more power in the mid-range of the curve where the 450 loves to be revved and ridden hard and high. Proper jetting fixes the lack-of-low-end problem on either. The only reason I went with the 450 is so I could run a 450 class and not have to jump into the "open" one.

[BlaineKaiser450]

Originally posted by andrew450r
that is so awesome. a bone stock 450r makes about 34, that thing must be some wild ride!! but with a Dasa, filter, no airbox lid, and jetting you can be at 50 too

[andrew450r]

Originally posted by BlaineKaiser450
but with a Dasa, filter, no airbox lid, and jetting you can be at 50 too

still, the ktm is stock.

[NE450Rider]

Originally posted by andrew450r
still, the ktm is stock.

still, look at the price tag ;)

[RATPACK Z400]

If the hps are true thats way better deal than the honda,the suspention alone is almost worth it then you have 50hp stock,get some mods and put it in the mid 50s .I want one!

[Quadevil]

Originally posted by NE450Rider
still, look at the price tag ;)

Still, that justifies why ktm is far superior to a TRX in every aspect. Well worth it :)

[yfz450_28]

i have both the ktm 450sx and 505sx, simular power output jut the cank is lighter in the 450 thats why it revvs farther, the bore also makes a diffrence on the bike, 505 is more bottom end power but with baldin cam th 505 is retarted fast his cam helps with a few HP and lets it revv faster and longer

[deathcorefan2]

Originally posted by Quadevil
Still, that justifies why ktm is far superior to a TRX in every aspect. Well worth it :)
better but compare the prices, im sure you could have any 450 that fast and that well handling for that money.
almost 12 grand?
most 450s are 7 to 8. that leaves 4 to 5 THOUSAND for improvements.

still KTMs are sick.

[NE450Rider]

Originally posted by deathcorefan2
better but compare the prices, im sure you could have any 450 that fast and that well handling for that money.
almost 12 grand?
most 450s are 7 to 8. that leaves 4 to 5 THOUSAND for improvements.

still KTMs are sick.

X2. I would love to have one if i had the money, believe me....but where i have money to save up, i can mod mine easily to compete with the ktm or any other race ready quad out there. plus honda and ktms have proved best for reliability, so either one is a great choice....

just my .02

[Quadevil]

Originally posted by deathcorefan2
better but compare the prices, im sure you could have any 450 that fast and that well handling for that money.
almost 12 grand?
most 450s are 7 to 8. that leaves 4 to 5 THOUSAND for improvements.

still KTMs are sick.

KTM 450SX
http://www.magicracing.com/2009-KTM-450SX-ATV_p_5276.html (Link)
Michigan.
Want more links to sites that are selling for around 10 grand?
https://www.ktm-parts.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=K&Product_Code=09450SXATV&Category_Code=FEAT (Link2)

Ok but let's say the 450SX costs 11K. That is 4g more than the cheaper 450's.

The thing is you are forgetting that the KTM is not only faster. How about comfort, ergonomy, build quality etc?

So you have 4G to spend in improvements. You'd have to buy:
- 2 shocks for the front and 1 to the rear
- axle
- steering stem
- 4 wheels
- 4 tires
- swingarm
- nerfs
- tether switch
- a-arms
- handlebars
- air filter
- exhaust
How much in here? 4g's? lolol

And then you have to get your motor done to keep up with the SX. At least 1500 to 2000?

AND in the end, you'd still end up with a heavier TRX = more fatigue and would not be faster than the SX. KTM also as chromoly frame and a lot of other small things that make work on it a lot easier.

[NE450Rider]

Originally posted by Quadevil
KTM 450SX
http://www.magicracing.com/2009-KTM-450SX-ATV_p_5276.html (Link)
Michigan.
Want more links to sites that are selling for around 10 grand?
https://www.ktm-parts.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=K&Product_Code=09450SXATV&Category_Code=FEAT (Link2)

Ok but let's say the 450SX costs 11K. That is 4g more than the cheaper 450's.

The thing is you are forgetting that the KTM is not only faster. How about comfort, ergonomy, build quality etc?

So you have 4G to spend in improvements. You'd have to buy:
- 2 shocks for the front and 1 to the rear
- axle
- steering stem
- 4 wheels
- 4 tires
- swingarm
- nerfs
- tether switch
- a-arms
- handlebars
- air filter
- exhaust
How much in here? 4g's? lolol

And then you have to get your motor done to keep up with the SX. At least 1500 to 2000?

AND in the end, you'd still end up with a heavier TRX = more fatigue and would not be faster than the SX. KTM also as chromoly frame and a lot of other small things that make work on it a lot easier.

why u gettin so defensive? i love the ktm's, it would be my second bike if i could afford it, but i can't, and there are no places around here to take it if i needed help with it and parts would be a royal p.i.t.a.........

im happy with what i have and i cant complain at all.

plus, whats the fun of a race ready bike? no customization to make it unique without spending a fortune.....

[deathcorefan2]

Originally posted by Quadevil
KTM 450SX
http://www.magicracing.com/2009-KTM-450SX-ATV_p_5276.html (Link)
Michigan.
Want more links to sites that are selling for around 10 grand?
https://www.ktm-parts.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=K&Product_Code=09450SXATV&Category_Code=FEAT (Link2)

Ok but let's say the 450SX costs 11K. That is 4g more than the cheaper 450's.

The thing is you are forgetting that the KTM is not only faster. How about comfort, B]egronomy , build quality etc?

So you have 4G to spend in improvements. You'd have to buy:
- 2 shocks for the front and 1 to the rear
- axle
- steering stem
- 4 wheels
- 4 tires
- swingarm
- nerfs
- tether switch
- a-arms
- handlebars
- air filter
- exhaust
How much in here? 4g's? lolol

And then you have to get your motor done to keep up with the SX. At least 1500 to 2000?

AND in the end, you'd still end up with a heavier TRX = more fatigue and would not be faster than the SX. KTM also as chromoly frame and a lot of other small things that make work on it a lot easier. [/B]
all quads fit different people differently.
so you cant really count comfort ergonomics. + to be race ready you dont NEED all of those things.

[Quadevil]

Originally posted by NE450Rider
why u gettin so defensive? i love the ktm's, it would be my second bike if i could afford it, but i can't, and there are no places around here to take it if i needed help with it and parts would be a royal p.i.t.a.........

im happy with what i have and i cant complain at all.

plus, whats the fun of a race ready bike? no customization to make it unique without spending a fortune.....

I'm sorry if i was a bit harsh but i'm not trying to be defensive. I'm just trying to show people that you can't build a better quad with the money that you save from buying another one. Yes maybe you can make it as fast or a bit faster but overall, if you don't change other things, the KTM simply is better.

I understand and agree with you on the customization. Is always nicer to customize it yourself.
The thing here is: KTM built quads for the track, for pilots who want to save money, having a race ready atv from the box. And in that, they succeeded.


Originally posted by deathcorefan2
all quads fit different people differently.
so you cant really count comfort ergonomics. + to be race ready you dont NEED all of those things.

I can agree partially with you on comfort and ergonomics but you really can't say that the stock suspension in the TRX gives you more comfort than the stock suspension in the SX or XC, WP or Ohlins. C'mon...

Yes, you are correct, you don't need all those things to be race ready. BUT you need all those things to be competitive. Try to take a TRX with 55hp, with stock tires, stock wheels, stock swingarm, stock shocks, stock steering stem and go head to head with an SX on track to see where you are going.


I understand what you guys are saying. Everyone should buy the quad that fits him/her better. KTM SX/XC were made to compete and that is where they are the best.

More, ktm is the true race ready quad because it's the only one with tether switch. Can Am in the DS450 X MX said it would bring but they took it out.

[NE450Rider]

Originally posted by hondarider11
The 450r is not 50 hp with a dasa and a filter like someone said earlier. Mine is like at 45 with a hrc cam full pipe jet and filter.

thats correct. good porting will put it over 50 easy

[NE450Rider]

Originally posted by hondarider11
The only porting I could see that adds 5 hp is probably like porting in a pro quad but if you think about it pro quads have like 60 hp. Correct me if I am wrong on that. If a stock 450r put out 50 with a pipe jet and filter then you would have to be nuts to put another like 5k into the motor to get a pro motor for 10 hp. I think the new ktm is sick and is the best 450 out but I will never get one becuase I don't see me keeping my honda 450 for much longer.

thats y i said a good port, like rage, dasa, or racers edge. all 3 of those are the top dogs and could easily put you in the 50 range. hell my '05 i had with 12.25 venom, venom port, hc2, k&n, and yoshi exhaust hit 49, and thats not even the best porter BY FAR

[RATPACK Z400]

the yfz,Ltr can be as bad ***** as the ktm with the money saved ,the only quads I see not able to compete in price is the trx,outlaw,kawi450,cause of the width factor.most your 450 quads are about the same hps as each other some slightly more than others.you put 1500-2000 grand in the motor of the yfz,Ltr,trx and there raged apes.but the trx will need a-arms and swingarm too thats alot more money in comparisen.ktm wins in price agains,t trx450,outlaw,kawi450! Thats just what I see .I want a 505sx real bad!

[2 fast for you]

Originally posted by RATPACK Z400
the yfz,Ltr can be as bad ***** as the ktm with the money saved ,the only quads I see not able to compete in price is the trx,outlaw,kawi450,cause of the width factor.most your 450 quads are about the same hps as each other some slightly more than others.you put 1500-2000 grand in the motor of the yfz,Ltr,trx and there raged apes.but the trx will need a-arms and swingarm too thats alot more money in comparisen.ktm wins in price agains,t trx450,outlaw,kawi450! Thats just what I see .I want a 505sx real bad!

even then a stock suspension yfz or ltr wont be able to hold a candle to a ktm. the suspension on the ktm will own just about every other quad made i dont really know about the can-am mx version. you dump 4000 into a yfz then race an sx that has a pipe and see what happens.

[ALAMX37]

Originally posted by NE450Rider
X2. I would love to have one if i had the money, believe me....but where i have money to save up, i can mod mine easily to compete with the ktm or any other race ready quad out there. plus honda and ktms have proved best for reliability, so either one is a great choice....

just my .02

You cant buy good shocks and a-arms and an axle for 4 grand much less work your motor.
This arguement is retarded. Ask anyone who has ever built a mx bike from the ground up your looking at closer to 20 k than 12.

[Quadevil]

Originally posted by ALAMX37
You cant buy good shocks and a-arms and an axle for 4 grand much less work your motor.
Ask anyone who has ever built a mx bike from the ground up your looking at closer to 20 k than 12.

True. Once again, people tend not to see the "big picture" that is, for the price KTM is unbeatable considering everything it offers from the show room...

Now if everyone has the money to pay up front, that's a different story...

[RATPACK Z400]

The ktm is a good deal for the money But the yfz450/ltr450 with the extra 4 grand are about the same ,cause with extra 4 thousand you could get shocks that are better and port/valve /clutch mods /high compression mods for the 4 grand so there par if not better, IMO just brand name and reliabilty are factors on choice of the three IMO.those IMO are close in what you can get for the same money the honda,kawi,outlaw, need more money to get them where the yfz,Ltr,ktm are for racing MX.

[2 fast for you]

ya you can better stuff than a stock yfz but it is still not as good as a ktm. a good port is 500
axel 300
bead locks and tires 1000
nice set of a-arms 1500
shocks 1500
hi comp piston 250
cams 400
intake 150
pipe 500.
if thats all you do you might be close but you are at a much higher price. plus you havent acounted for the quality that ktm puts into their bikes from the show room. will your race bike have a warante??? i wish mine did

[Quadevil]

Originally posted by 2 fast for you
ya you can better stuff than a stock yfz but it is still not as good as a ktm. a good port is 500
axel 300
bead locks and tires 1000
nice set of a-arms 1500
shocks 1500
hi comp piston 250
cams 400
intake 150
pipe 500.
if thats all you do you might be close but you are at a much higher price. plus you havent acounted for the quality that ktm puts into their bikes from the show room. will your race bike have a warante??? i wish mine did

Missing good handlebars, steering stem, nerfs, killswitch...

[2 fast for you]

exactly i just built my yfz and i just put six in my bike and got beat no problem by a stock ktm last weekend

[heartattack01]

It has everything to do with the rider not the quad. I have an 06 YFZ 450 with Houser a arms and PEP 8-click shocks I got for dirt cheap. I went up against a KTM 450SX AND a 505SX at my last race and I wiped the floor with both of them and they both had the FMF/KTM hardparts exhaust along with a couple other little things. The next race though another rider on a 450SX that was STOCK kicked MY ***. I am another advocate of the KTM, I'd love to own one but it's just not gonna happen. ANYONE can take ANY of the 450's and make them as badass as EITHER of the KTM's for the same price in my opinion. It all depends on your taste and if you have the cash to pull it off. Also I've ridden BOTH KTM's and I AM impressed. The 450SX reminds me alot of the YFZ, it has a power hit that will definitely make you tighten your grip. The 505SX is a lot like the LTR in my opinion. It has amazing power that just seems to never end but it just doesn't quite have that snap that the 450 does. They're great machines and as I already said if I had a chance I'd get one in a heartbeat but I still take pride in the fact that I can take my "sub-par" quad and massacre the elite of the quad world.

[2 fast for you]

well what about the guys tha race the stock class

[heartattack01]

Originally posted by 2 fast for you
well what about the guys tha race the stock class

Oh no doubt in the stock class they're awesome. At that level it's all rider still. At my last race 2 DS450 MX's and an LTR came out ahead of the one 450SX rider. Either way that's still a fine line, the production classes are only a drop in the bucket. Overall as soon as you start getting into classes that allow mods you can easily build a quad that can keep up with and/or beat the KTM's for the same price. Yes they're awesome quads, yes, they have an advantage for sure. But it doesn't make them super quads. I don't care if you have 65HP and every mod under the sun and the whole freaking KTM factory trailer in your pit, if you can't handle the machine I'm still gonna beat you. Sorry, I don't mean to offend anyone on here. I'm just tired of hearing from people that just because their machine is orange and says KTM, that automatically means they're faster and they're going to win.

[2 fast for you]

i agree with you it is all about the rider and not the bike. but when you start off with an superior bike you have the advantage when you start building it up

[Foxstar45]

not necissarily. A bike that starts out like a KTM possibly has less room for improvement than a bike that costs less like a DS or TRX that has lots of room from improvent. $ for $ a KTM might only be on par with a YFZ TRX or DS. But i'm not expert