GNCC/ Trail 400 ex ?'s

[qwad guy]

Hey guys im just starting to really get into actual racing and im looking to build a solid, reliable GNCC quad. Right now my 400ex has +2 A arms, Lonestar extended rear axle, DG nerfs, pro circuit slip on, Blingstart front bumper, and hot cam. What would you guys suggest for the next mods? This list is what I was thinking:

450R Front Shocks Racing triple rate conversion and re-valve
Stock Rear Shock re-valve and re-spring
Tinners Air Scoops
Hiper Dual Rear Bead locks
ITP Holeshot GNCC F & R Tires
Powermadd hand guards
HMF Slip On
K & N air filter
DID Chain X ring
C & D racing “dial a jet”


I am open to any suggestions, info, help! Thank you in advance for any help. I really appreciate it.

[powermadd400ex]

why would you want a hmf over a pro curcuit? other than the list looks good.

[qwad guy]

I was just doing some research and I was a lot of ppl thought that was the best exhaust for the 400 ex.

[powermadd400ex]

nah, i mean its a great pipe but imo the pro curcuit is much better. it has a better milder sound than the hmf as well.

[dang400ex]

I would suggest some type of belly skid and upgraded rear end protection. The thick plastic belly skid should work just fine. Other than that...your list looks pretty good.

Can we see pics?

I know my stock arms take a beating in the trails. Im scared to buy some housers because they'll get all scratched. Dont really care for A arm guards either.

[qwad guy]

Yea i was looking into some Pro armor skids. I will get some pics up soon.

Where do you guys get your parts? Any specific sites you use?

i would protect it with skids first, then go for the suspension upgrades. it will make a world of difference...

when you do the rear shock, or even fronts, send them to gt thunder and get his rear link to go with the revalve...

hipers are a good choice, but a little expensive and not "necessary", but now that i have them, i'll never have any thing else

i prefer the maier handguards over the powermadds, but they don't work with aftermarket levers so i am running the powermadds

air scoops, imo after having them, are more for looks than anything. i don't think they make that big of a difference

the dial jet is not actually made by c&d racing. it is a good concept if you know how and when to use it. i don't think it will actually eliminate the jetting process when adding an aftermarket exhaust or filter, but it should make it easier

as far as sites go...i use rockymountainatv, motosport and magic racing the most if i can't get what i want at the local dealer for a good price...but then again, i usually get a 25-30ish% discount on anything i buy from the dealer so that helps keep me going to them...

[katch26]

Originally posted by qwad guy


450R Front Shocks Racing triple rate conversion and re-valve
Stock Rear Shock re-valve and re-spring
Tinners Air Scoops
Hiper Dual Rear Bead locks
ITP Holeshot GNCC F & R Tires
Powermadd hand guards
HMF Slip On
K & N air filter
DID Chain X ring
C & D racing “dial a jet”

looks good, been said but Hipers are loot!, beadlocks def but maybe save the money on the hipers and spend it on skid plates. The hipers are sweet and depending on what your shop charges you to change tires they will pay themselves off fairly quickly, I paid 70 to remove and install 2 rears at the dealer and with Hipers I could have done them myself. The HMF is a great gncc pipe because it puts alot of the emphasis on the bottom/ mid. I dont know about the procircuit pipe but if you have a pipe I wouldnt buy a different one (again use that money somewhere else). I have the gncc and love them my only regret is buying the 20" rears....GET 21!. Dial a jet is a gimmick (it doesnt really replace a good jet kit) and its mostly to allow for quick jetting changes at altitude, most harescramble will be a set altitude or not enough to have a main change. Check with ither racers in your series about the +2's it may be to much if your running tighter courses.

[Flynbryan19]

As others have said, hypers are not neccesary. Spend the money else where. In my opinion beadlocks are not even neccesary. Nice yes, but not neccesary. If you already have an aftermarket exhaust don't waste the money on buying a different one.

Take your money saved and buy skid plates and have your shocks redone. With +2 a-arms I would recommend going to 4/1 offset wheels if you haven't already done so. +2's with stock offset wheels will be pretty darn wide for GNCC/XC racing.

Dial-a-jet = gymick
air scoops = not worth it
K&N = I prefer a foam filter over a gauze design anyday, but thats just me
Powermadds = I prefer a bigger handguard(ie: Cycras) I have powermadds and wish they had better coverage, but am limited by my flex bars on what I can run.

[qwad guy]

Thanks a lot guys! Im gona go with what pretty much everyone said and ditch the hipers and the dial a jet and get some skids!

Thanks a lot to everyone who has commented! Any others welcome.

[qwad guy]

What would you guys suggest for:

F and R tires sizes and if I do go with other rims, what sizes? I am +2 front and rear.

Chain and Sprocket change? Or stick w/ stock?

[leasureryan]

I would do Holeshot HD's or Razr 2's in the rear. Better to have tread and not need it, then to not have tread and need it

[fauxamish]

I have tip to protect your a-arms without guards.

Take some clear plastic tubing and cut it length-wise down one side. Put it over the front of a-arm and ziptie it on. Might not look the greatest, but its lighter than guards and there is no place for mud to build up.

[qwad guy]

Originally posted by leasureryan
I would do Holeshot HD's or Razr 2's in the rear. Better to have tread and not need it, then to not have tread and need it

Thanks. What size would you suggest for the front and rear?

[Brauap]

UNI ;)

WB E-SERIES ;)

Dial-A-Jet :ermm:

Skids :)

PRM Summit Bumper :)

450R Shocks ;)

Pro Taper Pillow Grips :D ;) :)

I seen people with MSR (I think) handguards.. there pretty large.. and I also seen people with big ones that looks to be made of rubber.. dose anyone know where I could get it?

[Brauap]

Originally posted by qwad guy
Thanks. What size would you suggest for the front and rear?

Razr 2's if you have the $$$

ITP's wear like butter
Maxxis's wear like iron
(I have experience!!)

22" Rear 23" Front
for maximum ground clearence, but 20 rear 20 front should be fine.. I'm going with..

Razr 2 fronts 23"
Razr 6-ply Rears 22"

Back up set/spares
Razr 6-ply fronts 20"
Razr 6-ply rears 20"

[qwad guy]

Thanks a lot for that tire help! I like those razr 2's! I had the old ones on my last 400ex. What about rim size? And tire width?

[Brauap]

Stock wheel size.. (8" is for motocross and you can't get 8" 22"ers)

I think there is only 1 option for the 22" & 23" but if there are more than one, get the widest ones because think.. wider they are, more area they have to get traction!

Help FYI

i.e. :

22/11/10
Hight/Width/Wheel Size

Some times it is like this:

22/11.0-10

It can get confusing but there are always just 3 numbers and you just kinda have to look at it..

[katch26]

Originally posted by Brauap
Razr 2's if you have the $$$

ITP's wear like butter
Maxxis's wear like iron
(I have experience!!)

22" Rear 23" Front
for maximum ground clearence, but 20 rear 20 front should be fine.. I'm going with..

Razr 2 fronts 23"
Razr 6-ply Rears 22"

Back up set/spares
Razr 6-ply fronts 20"
Razr 6-ply rears 20"

20f/20r is not good and I dont even think they make 6 ply 20" front as it is a mx tire

[Brauap]

Originally posted by katch26
20f/20r is not good and I dont even think they make 6 ply 20" front as it is a mx tire Yeup! Your right, I think 21" is where 6ply starts?. Someone correct me if I am wrong please!

[Lonestar_R]

These are my opinions.

1. I will never run a K&N Filter. Buy yourself a UNI or Twin Air foam filter. Much better filter and keeps more dirt out than the K&N

2. Dial A Jet, Save your money. Buy a few jets and jet it yourself and not waste your money on a gimmick.

3 Air Scoops are a good idea. Not really for the air flow aspect but are good for supporting the front fenders if you get alot of mud caked to the tops of them.

4. Definately go with a set of 450R revalved shocks and a revavled rear. Best bang for the buck you can get. Have GT Thunder do your conversion and buy their rear link. You will never regret it.

5. I love the Holeshot GNCC's. They bite, slide and wear great. I have them on the rear of my 400EX now and when I wear my Razr 2 fronts out I will replace them with GNCC fronts. I would do a 20" rear GNCC and a 21" front

6. Find another set of handguards instead of Powermadds. For me they don't have enough coverage. Do a set of Cyra Pro Bends or Acerbis Rally 2's. Both are much more expensive than the Powermadds but well worth the money in the end.

7. Hipers are not neccesary, but they are nice. If you can find a used set go with them. Or just find a used set of aluminum beadlocks would be good for just getting started.

8. HMF, can't go wrong there. Find a full system and you will be golden. I love my HMF full system and them make loads of bottom end power and that is what you need in the woods

9. Do a good set of Skids. PRM makes the best in my opinion. a little more expensive but worth the protection they give. Go the Belly pan and the swingarm skid. And your choice of aftermarket front bumper

[2muchquad]

I think 20in rears are perfect for the harescrambles..at least around here in ohio.Anything bigger will put more load on the motor maybe even necessitating a gearing change.Dont under esitmate a good swingarm skid plate,that should be #1 before anything...trust me on this one:D Almost any aftermarket exhaust will be better than stock so your good there.Get some suspension and handguards and you'll be set.I have some 450er shocks on my 250r until my elkas get rebuilt and they are awesome with the +2 a arms i have on it.

[qwad guy]

Originally posted by Lonestar_R
These are my opinions.

1. I will never run a K&N Filter. Buy yourself a UNI or Twin Air foam filter. Much better filter and keeps more dirt out than the K&N

2. Dial A Jet, Save your money. Buy a few jets and jet it yourself and not waste your money on a gimmick.

3 Air Scoops are a good idea. Not really for the air flow aspect but are good for supporting the front fenders if you get alot of mud caked to the tops of them.

4. Definately go with a set of 450R revalved shocks and a revavled rear. Best bang for the buck you can get. Have GT Thunder do your conversion and buy their rear link. You will never regret it.

5. I love the Holeshot GNCC's. They bite, slide and wear great. I have them on the rear of my 400EX now and when I wear my Razr 2 fronts out I will replace them with GNCC fronts. I would do a 20" rear GNCC and a 21" front

6. Find another set of handguards instead of Powermadds. For me they don't have enough coverage. Do a set of Cyra Pro Bends or Acerbis Rally 2's. Both are much more expensive than the Powermadds but well worth the money in the end.

7. Hipers are not neccesary, but they are nice. If you can find a used set go with them. Or just find a used set of aluminum beadlocks would be good for just getting started.

8. HMF, can't go wrong there. Find a full system and you will be golden. I love my HMF full system and them make loads of bottom end power and that is what you need in the woods

9. Do a good set of Skids. PRM makes the best in my opinion. a little more expensive but worth the protection they give. Go the Belly pan and the swingarm skid. And your choice of aftermarket front bumper


Damn thats a great response right there. Thanks a lot for the info and taking the time to write it out for me.

[tri5ron]

The only things I would add, to the already listed items, is a Sparks advance key, and a CNC steering stabilizer.

[qwad guy]

whats the sparks advance key do? sorry for the noob question.

[tri5ron]

much quicker and improved throttle responce for super cheap price. you cant go wrong.

[Lonestar_R]

You are welcome. I would say go with a stick style stablizer before the CNC. I have a CNC and I don't think it works as well as the stick. And the stick is half the price.

[qwad guy]

Originally posted by tri5ron
much quicker and improved throttle responce for super cheap price. you cant go wrong.

kay thats what i thought. Thanks!

[qwad guy]

Is this the stick style you were speaking of?

http://www.denniskirk.com/jsp/product_catalog/Product.jsp?skuId=583340&store=Main&catId=115&productId=p583340&leafCatId=11511&mmyId=6106

[tri5ron]

just thought you might lke to see what myself, and some others here had to say about the Custom CNC puck type,
and remember that "opinions are like ,.... **personel orifice's**,
(everybody has got one of their own).

here's an old thread...

http://www.exriders.com/vbb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=349366&highlight=steering+stabilizer

[katch26]

Originally posted by tri5ron
just thought you might lke to see what myself, and some others here had to say about the Custom CNC puck type,
and remember that "opinions are like ,.... **personel orifice's**,
(everybody has got one of their own).

here's an old thread...

http://www.exriders.com/vbb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=349366&highlight=steering+stabilizer

and remember the CNC one is only 200 shipped off ebay! Its only 185 shipped directly from him and it is rebuildable (not sure on the stick that you posted) but some arent.

edit: that particular one IS rebuildable

[qwad guy]

I guess im just starting to get confused with everything lol. I never knew there were this many parts out there. I just need to do some research and figure out what some things are for sure.

If you guys could help I dont really understand what these are and what the benefit is:


Steering stabilizer...where is this located and how does it exactly help?


What is a dual or triple rate converson on shocks?

Should i get this ^^ or just a revalve and respring?

[Brauap]

Originally posted by qwad guy
I guess im just starting to get confused with everything lol. I never knew there were this many parts out there. I just need to do some research and figure out what some things are for sure.

If you guys could help I dont really understand what these are and what the benefit is:


Steering stabilizer...where is this located and how does it exactly help?


What is a dual or triple rate converson on shocks?

Should i get this ^^ or just a revalve and respring?

Your stabilizer should be located low on your steering stem. Some people clamp one end to their frame then there stem, or some people like to mount it on their engine mount and their stem.

All triple rate springs are are 3 different springs. Say when you jump.. (this will be like in slow mo) the first spring compresses and then when that is done full it moves onto the second then the third (if you jump hard enough)

Its nice to have.. better ride.

I have heard if you get the 450R revalved for your weight and riding style, it can be just as nice (if not better) than aftermarket..

Also, 04-05 450R's are the softest of them all (compared to 06+)

does anybody run +2's and ride cross country and/or trails?

[Lonestar_R]

I had +2's on my old 250R and they were fine in the woods. And I ran them with stock Honda rims

[qwad guy]

Originally posted by SuicideMFNdoors
does anybody run +2's and ride cross country and/or trails?

I have +2's and ive been riding trails a lot. No issues.

[2muchquad]

i run plus 2s as well,i havent ran stock a arms in about 15yrs:devil:

Yeah Im leaning towards +2's.. I was gonna just get +1's but might as well go all out..right? You guys running the stock width axle too? Id hate to buy some pricey arms and then see them get all beat up in the trails.. but oh well

[lilyamaharacer4]

^^Most wont run +2 in the front with stock axle width in the back. Get an axle and dont look back

[Pipeless416]

^ i agree. it was a night and day difference from when i had +2 arms with the stock axle, and to when i got an extended axle.

[bry14661]

the last thing you wanna do for gncc is widen your fourwheeler. trails only need to be 54 inches wide. and you dont wanna be cuttin it close

[powermadd400ex]

my 400ex with +2 is only 48inches with stock wheels

^ thats what Im saying. After doing the meaurements its not even tha tmuch wider and plus you get a more stable ride Im sure. You can get a 4/1 offset and shorten the front up a little bit... correct?

[SPDSNYPR]

Originally posted by Pipeless416
^ i agree. it was a night and day difference from when i had +2 arms with the stock axle, and to when i got an extended axle.

Sorry for the newb question, but what is the advantage to the wider axle?

[Brauap]

Originally posted by SPDSNYPR
Sorry for the newb question, but what is the advantage to the wider axle?

The reason is to make it more stable.. you know how when crains make those things go out on the side onto the ground? Well, its kinda the same consept. They do it to make them widier and alor more stable, as with the axle. ;)

[qwad guy]

Hey guys what kind/ link chain and 13/39 gearing ? Brands of choice?

[m36indiana]

if your gonna run gncc check you width on the front, cant be any wider than 50 inches, i had +2 a arms on my 400 and some of the tight trail in gncc i wasnt able to get through, the most i would go is maybe +1, but i run +.5 to give myself more clearance.

[bry14661]

Originally posted by powermadd400ex
my 400ex with +2 is only 48inches with stock wheels

oh wow didnt know that. thanks for clearing that up, i assumed youd be much wider than that. If your only 48 wide ide just do it the cheaper way and get the offset wheels. Besides you CAN BE 50 inches wide but you dont wanna be. width is good but ill tell you first hand you dont wanna be slowin down everytime you get to a tight spot cuz you gotta line it up perfect you wanna hammer down and know you got room to spare.

[powermadd400ex]

yep, and its rides like a night and day difference bewteen the +2's and stock a arms.
the series i race has plenty of ltrs and ltrs are 49inches stock and they place quite well. so i kno ill be just fine.

My question is with +2s, how long should your axle be? +1 +2?

[redteamgo2000]

im suprised no one has said this yet. if your gonna run beadlocks i'd only do the rear as its taking most of the beating since it just follows where you point the quad. also since gncc is multiple long laps, i suggest getting a set of tire balls. they eliminate the possibility of a flat ruining your race. all the pros run tire balls. heres the link to check them out.

http://www.tireballs.com/atv.html

as for the gncc racing enjoy man its tons of fun. pretty rough on the body but fun none the less. hope that helps you alittle.

[fauxamish]

Or if you are cheap, you can use "noodles" (those pool things...) There was a thread on here about noodling.

http://exriders.com/vbb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=354343&highlight=noodle

Maybe not as good as tire balls, but definetly cheaper. You take a noodle and cut it to the width of your tire and put a bunch in there, like tire balls.

I think I want to try +2 a-arms and 4:1 wheels to make a XC type 400ex. This would make it 46 or 47" wide correct? Does anyon make a +1 axle or is it only +2? I want to be able to fit between tight spots

[coryatver]

+2 is WAY to wide even with offset wheels for a gncc quad. Don't get normal skid plates get a sprocket guard and rotor guard setup or you will be left hung up on the ruts while the competition pulls away

[BossHogg420]

where do they sell them i always here about them but never see them forsale

[coryatver]

gt thunder or lonestar but on the 400ex you will need to weld on some tabs to your swingarm for the rotor guard to bolt on.

Originally posted by coryatver
+2 is WAY to wide even with offset wheels for a gncc quad. Don't get normal skid plates get a sprocket guard and rotor guard setup or you will be left hung up on the ruts while the competition pulls away

+2 a-arms and 4:1 is the same as +1 a-arms and 3:2. +1 a-arms and 4:1 is the same as stock. Most GNCC quads are 46-47" wide. +2 a-arms and 4:1 wheels should put me in that range

[coryatver]

It will probley work ok for flordia but up here in pa guys with +2 are bottle neckers. Catch a tree once and you will be wishing you went narrower an inch doesn't sound like much but it is a huge difference.

[qwad guy]

noob question!!

What do the 4:1 and 3:2 mean when talking about the rims?

[fauxamish]

It is the offset of the wheel. Your front wheels are 5" wide. 4:1 means that the center part of the wheel is 1 inch from the outside of wheel and 4 inches from the inside. You would have 4 inches going back over the hub/rotor/spindle. 3:2 means that the center part that attaches to the hub is 2 inches from the outside and 3 inches from the inside.
Over all, 4:1 is 2 inches narrower than 3:2.

If you ran with +2 arms and 3:2, you would be at 48". If you ran with 4:1, you would be at 46" and it would handle better.

[qwad guy]

wouldnt 3:2 and 4:1 be the same width then? I dont understand how they would be diff when they both add up to 5?

From what i make of the previous post it is like this...the 4 (from 4:1) and the 3 (from 3:2) is the inches from the inside. And the 2 and the 1 are the distance in inches from the outside?

Am i understanding this right?

[Brauap]

They bolt of at differnt widths.. 4:1 means where you stick the hub threw the wheel is 4 inches in (correct me if I am wrong!) and 3:2 means it bolts up 3 inches on each side thus making it 1 in. wider on each side..

Stock is 4:1 right?

There are 3 common front offsets for your 400ex. They are 2:3, 3:2, and 4:1. What these numbers mean is the measurment of the rims. The first number is the inside measure of the rim in inches and the second number is the out side measure in inches. The rim offset will not affect shock valving. It will not affect shock valving because the pivot points of the a arms are not changed and the leverage ratio stays the same. This means it will not bottom out any easier.

2:3 Offset - This offset is 2 inches inside and 3 inches out side. This will give the 400ex the most width out of the others. It adds stability but causes more push in the turns and much more bump steer plus it will put more stress on parts like tie rods, spindles, hub studs, bearings, ball joints, and puts some on the upper a arm. A basic definition of bump steer is anything that changes the direction of steering of a tire other than from the driver/riders input. This bump steer is caused by the extra leverage the rims have on the handlebars. Also the offsets change the steering axis inclination (SAI). Stock rims are designed to work with the spindles to give the proper SAI to rim relationship so when you change offsets you change the SAI. So i would not reccomend 2:3 offsets.

3:2 Offset - This offset is 3 inches inside and 2 inches out side. This is the most common offset and easiest to find. It adds one inch to a 400ex total. It eliminates almost all the bumpsteer from 2:3's but there is still a little. It is also very close to stock offset where the quad was designed to be. I would recomend this offset.

4:1 Offset - This offset is 4 inches inside and 1 inch out side. This is usually only used on 400ex's with +3 a-arms to stay under 50 inches. This is not that common unless you go with the hyper rims but you can find it if you look. This is also close to stock offset but you will lose an inch when running it. 4:1's corner better and handle all around better then other offsets because it gives the right steering axis inclination (SAI). Stock offset is about 4:1 and the spindles are designed to have the right SAI with that offset. What SAI means is that if you drew a line thru the center of the ball joints while looking at them from the front, it should hit the ground at the same place a line drawn straight down thru the center of the rim does. This is why the spindle is made with the top ball joint closer to the frame than the lower joint. If you change the offset of the wheels these two lines no longer intersect at the ground. The more the difference the more the leverage that the tires have against you (the handlebars) when any size bump is hit. This leads to more bump steer. Changing from a 4:1 to 3:2 rim adds one inch of leverage to the SAI. A 2:3 rim which many people use to widen the front adds two inches of leverage and more bump steer. Also a steering dampner is used to help this bump steer. A steering damper trys to compensate for the bump steer by making the leverage push against it. People with wider offset wheels will notice a bigger improvement from a steering damper but it is still a helpful modification to any quad. So a wider quad does not always handle and perform better then a narrower one. So a 4:1 wheel gets the SAI where it was designed to be with the spindle to give you better contol. This better control can easily overide the advantage of a wider front for cornering so wider is not always better. Hopefully i have helped some others. Thanks!

[Brauap]

Originally posted by FoxHondaRider
There are 3 common front offsets for your 400ex. They are 2:3, 3:2, and 4:1. What these numbers mean is the measurment of the rims. The first number is the inside measure of the rim in inches and the second number is the out side measure in inches. The rim offset will not affect shock valving. It will not affect shock valving because the pivot points of the a arms are not changed and the leverage ratio stays the same. This means it will not bottom out any easier.

2:3 Offset - This offset is 2 inches inside and 3 inches out side. This will give the 400ex the most width out of the others. It adds stability but causes more push in the turns and much more bump steer plus it will put more stress on parts like tie rods, spindles, hub studs, bearings, ball joints, and puts some on the upper a arm. A basic definition of bump steer is anything that changes the direction of steering of a tire other than from the driver/riders input. This bump steer is caused by the extra leverage the rims have on the handlebars. Also the offsets change the steering axis inclination (SAI). Stock rims are designed to work with the spindles to give the proper SAI to rim relationship so when you change offsets you change the SAI. So i would not reccomend 2:3 offsets.

3:2 Offset - This offset is 3 inches inside and 2 inches out side. This is the most common offset and easiest to find. It adds one inch to a 400ex total. It eliminates almost all the bumpsteer from 2:3's but there is still a little. It is also very close to stock offset where the quad was designed to be. I would recomend this offset.

4:1 Offset - This offset is 4 inches inside and 1 inch out side. This is usually only used on 400ex's with +3 a-arms to stay under 50 inches. This is not that common unless you go with the hyper rims but you can find it if you look. This is also close to stock offset but you will lose an inch when running it. 4:1's corner better and handle all around better then other offsets because it gives the right steering axis inclination (SAI). Stock offset is about 4:1 and the spindles are designed to have the right SAI with that offset. What SAI means is that if you drew a line thru the center of the ball joints while looking at them from the front, it should hit the ground at the same place a line drawn straight down thru the center of the rim does. This is why the spindle is made with the top ball joint closer to the frame than the lower joint. If you change the offset of the wheels these two lines no longer intersect at the ground. The more the difference the more the leverage that the tires have against you (the handlebars) when any size bump is hit. This leads to more bump steer. Changing from a 4:1 to 3:2 rim adds one inch of leverage to the SAI. A 2:3 rim which many people use to widen the front adds two inches of leverage and more bump steer. Also a steering dampner is used to help this bump steer. A steering damper trys to compensate for the bump steer by making the leverage push against it. People with wider offset wheels will notice a bigger improvement from a steering damper but it is still a helpful modification to any quad. So a wider quad does not always handle and perform better then a narrower one. So a 4:1 wheel gets the SAI where it was designed to be with the spindle to give you better contol. This better control can easily overide the advantage of a wider front for cornering so wider is not always better. Hopefully i have helped some others. Thanks!


Yea.. what he said! :chinese:



But, yea, very nice right up, Fox! Do you know the stock ?:? ?

So will a 4:1 on stock a-arms make it narrior?
Also, with hearing all the steering advantages, does this make it better for xc/hs?

[coryatver]

the standard xc racing size is +1 a-arms and 4:1 offset wheels

Originally posted by coryatver
the standard xc racing size is +1 a-arms and 4:1 offset wheels

which makes the front end about 44" wide just 1" more than stock. IMO not worth it when 3:2 wheels although wont handle as great will make it the same width. Thats why I suggested +2 and 4:1 wheels because XC 450's are around 46-47" wide. You will get 46" wide with +2 and 4:1 wheels making it slightly wider than the rear. 11" wide rear tires make it even less were talking about a half inch so call it your front and rear are even. I cant seem to find it but I made a thread on what was better a wider front, wider rear or even. Wider rear was not better and was said to make things more rough. I have seen a few hill climb quads with stock rear ends and really wide fronts, most MX i see are about even.

[Lonestar_R]

I run +1's with 4+1 Hipers on mine. And the rear I have a stock axle and 4+5 Hipers

[Brauap]

When you talk about the 450s being 46-47'' wide.. is that stock?

Yea, hillclimbers have wide front ends and narrow(er) rear.. my dad said it's supposed to help a whole lot with climbing.. and I believe it! I was wondering.. (totally off topic!) for hillclimibing something real high hp, why not add weights to the front to keep it down? And what does wider front ends have to do with it?

OK back to XC/GNCC! :blah:

Originally posted by Brauap
When you talk about the 450s being 46-47'' wide.. is that stock?

Yea, hillclimbers have wide front ends and narrow(er) rear.. my dad said it's supposed to help a whole lot with climbing.. and I believe it! I was wondering.. (totally off topic!) for hillclimibing something real high hp, why not add weights to the front to keep it down? And what does wider front ends have to do with it?

OK back to XC/GNCC! :blah:

facotry XC quads like the DS450XC is 46.5" stock. Stock 450r is 46.3" wide and a lot of XC racers add +.5 or +1 a-arms and 4:1 wheels. I look at it as if pro XC racers and average joe XC racers have it 46(stock)-47" wide and the 400ex stock is only 45.5" wide you have room to work with because if they fit then you can go more and still fit. +2 a-arms could also make a versatile quad if you hade an axle thats adjustable. Just have 3:2 wheels and adjust the axle wider and bam you have MX or dune quad thats a little wider. Now if you keep stock wheels on and +1 a-arms you should be just a little under even with the rear. But I say why limit yourself to always having stock whees when all aftermarket wheels are 2:3, 3:2, 4:1