Drr 70 dyno test snyder pipe

[SMS]

This is a dyno test of 70 drr with technagas pipe vs snyder

[hotquads1]

Hi Shawn, thanks for sharing the dyno runs , which line on this graph is which pipe ? They appear same color .
thanks,
marc

[SMS]

techna gas pipe is the bottom line 42 and sms pipe is top line make alot better mid to top power and torque. I have not had a metra kit pipe to test on dyno but gary I know is working on it soon so maybe I can get with him and get the metra kit pipe sent up to test on dyno. While he can test it in real life application. i think it is good to keep in mind dyno results and realife factor to see how it performs. If we find that it can be improved it only makes it better for all of us.

[bulldogfallon]

We purchased a crank dyno that was fitted to a CVT cover, so we can help pitch in on the results soon. :)

Our new shop is taking up a lot of time....sanding and stripping floors, painting, etc

Once it is set we will be able to do some in house testing and also real life testing with our Mycrhon4.


Got the goodies...just lacking the time to use them right now

Thanks for your help

Shawn

[hotquads1]

Shawn, have you got any dyno info on the stock 70-50 DRR pipe ? I just wondered how it looked on a graph , where it made power (rpm), what rpm does it fall off and stop pulling?
thanks,
marc

[SMS]

ya I do I will se if I can dig up some dirt this weekend

[QuadJunkies]

I didnt know they still made the Technigas pipe anymore... We had that pipe along time ago -complete waste of a pipe .

Its cool to see dynos on the minis! Id like to see a variety of all the pipes.

[SMS]

Ya they still make them for mini quads. I like them for the 50cc it seems to work real good, but they do have a short life span due to the quality being made outside the USA. They have great acceleration for the 50cc. I will dig up some more runs this weekend. Bradley is here from IN. We are making air box for raptor 250. Later

[QuadJunkies]

We couldnt even get that pipe to move up hill in our driveway on our 70 E-ton. LOL :p

I remember seeing the pipe testing, I thought Gary posted it , but I cant find it now.

Unless something better comes out before next year, I think the 250 is what we will be upgrading to in 2010. :) They sure seem to run good!

[SMS]

Not sure about the eton sounds weird. Bradley300 says he likes his 250 alot, it is nice and smooth.

[QuadJunkies]

Yeah we took off the Tech pipe and put on a WRH and it was like night and day difference.that was a few years ago before we bought the DRR.

Tell Bradley I said hello :)

[jread14]

Originally posted by QuadJunkies
We couldnt even get that pipe to move up hill in our driveway on our 70 E-ton. LOL :p

I remember seeing the pipe testing, I thought Gary posted it , but I cant find it now.

Unless something better comes out before next year, I think the 250 is what we will be upgrading to in 2010. :) They sure seem to run good!

The Technigas pipe is actually a great pipe. You just have to adjust your clutching for it. It likes the higher rpms and if your clutch is engaging too early then you will not see the benefit of the pipe.

Hey Shawn how about the Koso pipes i have two of them now 1 st generation and the brand new one. Have you done any testing on these pipes on a 90? Just wondering what they produce. thanks Toby

[machwon]

Originally posted by jread14
The Technigas pipe is actually a great pipe. You just have to adjust your clutching for it. It likes the higher rpms and if your clutch is engaging too early then you will not see the benefit of the pipe.

I agree, we use the Technigas on a 50 as well. Clutching and jetting were crucial to getting it to run great.

[SMS]

I do not have any koso pipes here at this time if you would like to send me the pipe and a note of what you want it tested on. I will be happy to do the test. Rember it may take a week to get to it but I will do it. Ship the pipe to
Snyder Motorsports
8303 Cleveland RD
Wooster, OH 44691
866-345-5443

[SMS]

We won the 50cc championship for the CRA series with the Technagas pipe this year. It worked really well, customer was very happy.

Great job on the Championship!!!! Keep it up. Nice SMS.

[SMS]

Thank you very much

[bradley300]

Originally posted by QuadJunkies


Tell Bradley I said hello :)

hello! :D

If you have any questions w/ a raptor 250 i can help!

[QuadJunkies]

Originally posted by bradley300
hello! :D

If you have any questions w/ a raptor 250 i can help!

I may just do that!;)

[hotquads1]

Originally posted by SMS
ya I do I will se if I can dig up some dirt this weekend

hi shawn, did you ever find anything on the DRR pipe ?

[SMS]

here is drr 50 test I will print the notes for theese runs as well

[SMS]

here are notes

[SMS]

Here is a local guys 90 I built before and after. Before all stock with stock pipe.
The after has snyder pipe, filter on snorkel tube 28mm pwk 140 mj 45 pilot 2nd clip on needle, sms intake & sms cylinder porting

I will do a direct bolt on replacement test next time I get one. This is what I could dig up, I have thousands of runs and I could have been more organized this year.

[SMS]

If you guys want somthing tested send me what you want me to test. I'm open for anything right now why I have time. I do have some parts here to work with also.
you can send parts to
Snyder Motorsports
8303 Cleveland rd
Wooster, OH 44691

[dirttrack86]

Can someone please explain to me what lines go to what on the first graph ? Sorry for not understanding it, but I'm a little slow. :)

[SMS]

The graph with 3 lines are a comparison of 50cc engines. The notes of the 3 engines tested are below it. Their is a number next to the graphs and a number next to the notes that corraspond to each other. The last graph is of drr 90 stock compared to a built. You can call also I would be happy to go over them with you as well 866-345-5443 mon-fri10am-6 pm closed wensdays sat10am-2pm

[hotquads1]

Thanks Shawn, I notice you use the MPH more often than RPM, so I assume you are not blocking the variator, do you find this info more beneficial ? The RPM range in which all pipes work best "make power" is most interesting to me , it allows me to port accordingly to that target, on the other hand it seems the mph would be good data to judge CVT set-up. I have never seen any dyno charts with the stock DRR 50 pipe refering to rpm, and if my experience is correct the transfer timing of the stock L/C 50 DRR is too high for the pipe to run its best. The dyno runs are very interesting and I do appreciate you sharing them with us .
marc

[SMS]

I do ddo the lock up first then I do what you have seen here. I look at mph more than any other spec. mph verse time is the most important to me not hp or torque when it comes to rear wheel on a cvt. In lock up I look at toque and hp.
Grism motor have the base cut also to lower the transfer ports and he raises the exhuast to get more blow time that is what most are trying to achieve. That is good in theory it makes more hp but it does not necassarily make you go faster. If you lower the cylinder and raise the exhuast it will make more hp on that cylinder with stock crank that is true. The other problems are if you run to much blow time and to high of a exhuast you don't have the low end pull and this cuases cvt parts to wear fast and hard to tune. That is my opinion only. If you want to try somthing port it the normal way your tsr soft ware tells you and slowly raise the transfer ports @.2mm at a time I think you will be suprised. I hope this helps

[hotquads1]

I would like to have TSR but it is not compatable with Vista system computors. I understand is comes in handy. Do you know what TSR would suggest ? These current cylinders are 142 on main transfers and exhaust is around 176, so we have ex timing for 8000rpm and transfer timing for 12000 rpm.

[SMS]

I have it on my old pc it works good xp after that it gets to be a pain. I couldn't get it to work on vista either lol. I will run the degrees when I get a chance, but it seemed to me it only gets you so far.
Get me the measurements in mm from
from tdc to bdc?
tdc to top exhuast?
tdc to top of transfers?
stroke ?39.2
bore of engine you want?40
exhuast width?

I will run it on tsr and give you results if you want to?

[hotquads1]

thanks for the #'s.
marc

[SMS]

I enjoyed talking to you and I think I may build a stock 50 for my son for this year. Maybe we can find some way to make that pipe work to our advantage some how?

[machwon]

From what I've seen the stock DRX pipe likes 9200 rpm, the technigas pipe likes 10,200 rpm on the 50's. From there I try to port the motor to run at that rpm and then clutch it to run at that rpm all the time possible. The piped and stuffer motor runs seem low to me. I just run a stock 06 air cooled last week that put down 4.2 hp and it was only clutched with a change in gaskets and a 17 pilot.

[SMS]

Please try to rember not all dyno read the exact same. That is why we doing a comparison. I also am not saying mine is right and your guys is wrong, I'm saying they very. I do have a Dyno jet roller dyno, so it is not a cheap piece either. I have found that the same dyno can vary up to 10% and even more if you are not all on the same settings my dyno is calculated in sae settings.

[machwon]

I have the dynojet roller as well with the latest winpep 7 software. Here is some more comparison and typical of what I see on a stock DRX50, 3.8-4.0 HP with a std cf. It also shows a stock apex 90 putting down 10 I believe.

http://www.exriders.com/vbb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=306340&perpage=13&highlight=drx50%20dyno%20runs&pagenumber=1

What do you typically see on a stock 50 if the piped and stuffer runs are not low?

[hotquads1]

Bob , on the air cooled , if your target is 9200, for the shifting point , where would you like to see the transfers and exhaust timing ?
marc

[SMS]

I usually see a good result with the technagas pipe not some other pipes maybe the pipe that was used was not that good.
The biggest thing I seen with the technagas is how much faster it accelerated but to my memory around 4.5 -5hp
That is the only stuffer motor on a 50 I have tested it was a customers engine not mine .
I have seen a few good running 50 with cylinder kit 21mm carb and technagas pipe runs 5-6hp
we also have a set of 16'' old tires we stick on every mini when we dyno I hope this helps

[SMS]

I also noticed that the run you are talking about had a 16mm mikini carb maybe that has somthing to do with why it seems so low.

[bradley300]

Shawn's a good guy and loves trying new things on his dyno. nothing like hearing a 70cc mini peg 15 grand on the dyno and live to run again! lol

[machwon]

I've been getting 5.5-5.7 on a limited stock version internal mods only (porting & head mod) and 16mm carb. The technigas pipe only got a couple tenths but the 1200 rpm extra really makes it pull on top. After about 75 feet in our field with the same motors the technigas pipe version pulls away due to the extra rpm. I've been meaning to get higher engagement, were only hitting 6800-7000, the pipe seems to start good power around 7500 rpm and up. I have a hit clutch to try just haven't gotten there yet. I'm also doing a production 50 soon and will likely try a cylinder other than stock air cooled, ignition and a bigger carb. I know the Technigas pipe has way more potential, just by how its signal changed the jetting in the stock carb. Perhaps the pipe likes the bigger carbs as well. I'll definitely be posting up some more info as I get the motor build done.

[jread14]

I ran the pe 20 carb on our 50 with the technigas pipe with great results

[SMS]

I set the stall towards 8,000 with the hit clutch and alot depends on clutching and the ramp curve on how it all plays out. I have found that to really see what I have I have to lock the variator if not the clucthing could even be off. If this makes any sense I think it is the way to test the engine side with a dyno then tune the clutch to what you find out from having the variator in the lock up.

[SMS]

I'm doing more testing on pipes and 70cc kits this week I will have some more runs to post

[machwon]

Here's a 70 with an MK pipe and silencer. For final runs we reworked the porting/head and switched from a 21 oko to a 24mm keihin w/v-force reeds.

[hotquads1]

Hi Bob,
I assume the porting resulted in an increase in RPM thus making the extra HP,(if I am assuming correctly) could you post the RPM that each run peak occured ? by the way 12 HP out of the 70 and MK pipe is impressive.
thanks,
marc

[machwon]

Hi Marc, I need to fix my previous post. There have been no port timing changes to the cylinder, other than adding thickness to the base gasket which resulted in raising both the exhaust and transfers the same amount. Most of the gains came from the head which we tightened up the squish, raised the compression and reshaped the combustion chamber. This was also one of the older MK cylinders with the gold head. Yes, I think getting up toward the 6 tq and 12 hp was great and still kept the RPM in 10-10500 range.

I also have a newer MK 70 cylinder with the 1-piece head I'll probably start working on next week and maybe have some numbers on that cylinder soon as well.