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View Full Version : 2008 AMA PRO ATV Motocross Nationals #10 - Red Bud - Live Race Coverage



Admin
07-26-2008, 10:32 PM
The storyline was eerily similar to the past races on the 2008 ITP Tires/Moose Racing AMA/ATVA National Motocross Tour on Saturday at RedBud MX as Dustin Wimmer again set the fastest time in first-round qualifying. The event is Round 10 of the 11-round season. Wimmer (No. 191 Team MSR/Suzuki/Yoshimura/Pro Taper Suzuki), who merely has to finish second or better in the first Pro Moto, scheduled for noon tomorrow, turned in a time of two minutes, 18.746 seconds to top the speed charts.

Wimmer set his fastest time of the session on his final lap, after besting teammate Chad Wienen (No. 44 Team Rockstar/MSR/Suzuki/Yoshimura/Pro Taper Suzuki), who set a 2:20.195-minute lap. John Natalie, Jr. (No. 13 Warnert Racing Can-Am) was third quick, just five tenths of a second off of Wienen's pace.

"What can I say? My Suzuki LTR450 is just fast," said Wimmer, who set his fourth consecutive fast time this season. "The team has just been working so hard and I know, at every race, my equipment will be perfect. It's great to just show up, ride and set fast times right out of the box. It really helps my focus to know that my team has everything dialed in.

"I'm just having fun now," added Wimmer. "This is a dream I've had for many, many years and now it's coming true."

Michigan native Harold Goodman (No. 708 American Honda/Houser Racing Honda), Keith Little (No. 12 Team Monster Energy Kawasaki), Jason Dunkelberger (No. 19 East Coast ATV Racing), and Rocco Arno, Jr. (No. 101 Privateer Honda) qualified for tomorrow's finals through the Last Chance Qualifier (LCQ). Hunter Miller, Trent Kandel, Rich Stambach and John Ragon didn't qualify for the 20-quad field.

The RedBud National continues tomorrow with Pro finals scheduled at noon and at 3 p.m., as well as a full program of Pro-Am, Amateur, Youth, and Women's

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 10:01 AM
Hot laps underway

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 10:05 AM
Holeshot goes to Josh Creamer

quadracer707
07-27-2008, 10:06 AM
Lets get this party started!!!!!

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 10:09 AM
Creamer


Wimmer in 8th

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 10:10 AM
Creamer
Upperman
Goodman
Wienen

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 10:11 AM
Creamer
Upperman
Goodman

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 10:13 AM
Creamer


Byrd 5th

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 10:14 AM
Creamer stretching lead

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 10:15 AM
Creamer
Wienen
Gust
Byrd
Wimmer
Upperman
Brown
Goodman
SHumaker
Natalie

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 10:16 AM
Creamer
Wienen
Gust
Byrd
Wimmer

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 10:18 AM
Creamer drops to back

Wienen
Gust
Byrd
Wimmer
Brown
Upperman
Goodman
Natalie

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 10:20 AM
Wienen
Gust
Byrd
Wimmer
Brown
Upperman
Goodman
Natalie
Shumaker
Dunk
Lawson
Downen
Plante
Warnia
Arno Jr
Little
Gee
Baker
Miller
Creamer

hutchmx92
07-27-2008, 10:20 AM
What happened to creamer did he break down or wreck?

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 10:21 AM
Wienen
Gust
Byrd
Wimmer
Brown

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 10:21 AM
I think Creamer just broke down

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 10:22 AM
Wienen
Gust
Byrd

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 10:23 AM
Wienen
Gust
Byrd
Wimmer
Brown
Upperman
Goodman

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 10:24 AM
8 laps
Wienen
Gust
Byrd
Wimmer
Brown
Upperman
Goodman
Natalie
Lawson
Dunk

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 10:25 AM
Wienen pulling away

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 10:25 AM
Wimmer passes Byrd

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 10:27 AM
Wienen
Gust
Byrd passes back on
Wimmer
Brown

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 10:29 AM
Wienen
Gust
Byrd

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 10:29 AM
Wienen
BYrd
Gust
Wimmer
Brown

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 10:30 AM
White flag

JRP
07-27-2008, 10:31 AM
talking to shawn aka warnerade, he says weinen is stretching it out! 6-8sec lead and on cruise control! LETS GO WEINEN!!!

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 10:31 AM
Chad Wienen takes the win, Joe Byrd finishes second, and Doug Gust rounds out the top 3 for moto one.

AtvMxRider
07-27-2008, 10:32 AM
GO WIENEN!!!!!!!!!!!!

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 10:34 AM
Moto one

Chad Wienen
Joe Byrd
Doug Gust
Dustin Wimmer
Pat Brown
Josh Upperman
John Natalie Jr.
Harold Goodman
Jeremy Lawson
Russell Shumaker
Jason Dunkelberger
Cale Downen
Jasmin Plante
Rocco Arno Jr.
Keith Little
Greg Gee
Sage Baker
Cody Miller
J. Warnia
Josh Creamer

hutchmx92
07-27-2008, 10:35 AM
Man wimmer is just playing he could have won this no problem but doesnt need to to bad for creamer i was routin for him

atvracingfan
07-27-2008, 10:46 AM
yea finally chad gets the win!!! bad breaks all year.
creamer - i was pulling for him too, maybe his bike broke down?
looks like shumaker did the best in 10th for the kawasaki team.

ccmuscle22
07-27-2008, 10:47 AM
Heart breaker for Creamer. Sounds like it was his.

were out here in Washougal WA for the AMA outdoor nationals. Should be a very good.

Looking forward to moto #2.

Look for Hetrick rider Kyle Bard to hopefully wrap up the 450B title as well today.


Thanks for the great coverage as usual.

Christian
TEAM MXN MotoX Nutrition
www.motoxnutrition.com

CADWELL
07-27-2008, 11:58 AM
Any Pro-am coverage??

Cody Gibson?
Nick DeNoble?
Thomas Brown?

etccb
07-27-2008, 12:30 PM
Originally posted by buttmusk
Any Pro-am coverage??

Cody Gibson?
Nick DeNoble?
Thomas Brown?
It is on the live timing and scoring right now.
gibson
brown

hutchmx92
07-27-2008, 12:31 PM
livescoring isnt working it stopped at lap 3 there done by now

offspring22
07-27-2008, 12:35 PM
The live timing and scoring rarely works for us. Write to the AMA about it!

JRP
07-27-2008, 12:37 PM
brown went 1-2
gibson 2-1

so i guess gibson took the overall also!!! He should of won both motos but he faded a little in the first moto. I think kyle bard crashed out of the 450B race in the 2nd moto. Still looking to see who won though!

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 12:47 PM
Wimmer has secured the championship for the year!!:macho

quadgeek631
07-27-2008, 12:54 PM
is the next moto at 3pm?

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 12:59 PM
Yes 3:00

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 12:59 PM
Hot laps finishing up

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 01:01 PM
Atvriders.com holeshot for moto two goes to Byrd

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 01:02 PM
Byrd
Little

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 01:04 PM
Byrd
Little
Natalie
Goodman

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 01:05 PM
Byrd
Little
Natalie
Goodman
Shumaker
Wienen
Lawson
Gust
Wimmer
Brown

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 01:05 PM
Natalie gets around Little for second place

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 01:06 PM
Byrd
Natalie
Wienen
Little
Goodman

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 01:08 PM
Byrd
Natalie
Wienen
Little
Goodman
Shumaker
Gust
Wimmer
Lawson
Brown
Warnia
Plante
Arno Jr.
Creamer
Baker
Upperman
Gee
Dunk
Miller C
Downen

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 01:09 PM
Byrd
Natalie
Wienen
Goodman
Gust
Little
Lawson

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 01:09 PM
Byrd
Natalie
Wienen
Goodman
Gust
Little
Lawson
Wimmer
Creamer
Warnia

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 01:10 PM
Pat Brown drops to the back

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 01:11 PM
Byrd
Natalie
Wienen

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 01:12 PM
Byrd
Natalie
Wienen
Goodman
Gust
Wimmer
Creamer
Lawson
Littlle
Warnia

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 01:12 PM
Byrd
Wienen
Natalie

atvracingfan
07-27-2008, 01:13 PM
i wonder what happened to shumaker he was riding at the top for awhile there now he's back in 19th

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 01:13 PM
Byrd
Wienen
Natalie
Goodman
Gust
Wimmer
Creamer
Lawson
Little

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 01:14 PM
Byrd
Wienen
Natalie
Goodman
Gust

JRP
07-27-2008, 01:15 PM
weinen is gonna win! his lap times are 2seconds faster than everyone else! he just knocked out a 2min 16sec lap time!!!
GOOO WEINEN!!!!

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 01:16 PM
Byrd
Wienen
Natalie
Gust
Creamer
Wimmer
Goodman

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 01:18 PM
Byrd
Wienen
Natalie
Gust
Creamer
Wimmer
Goodman
Lawson
Warnia
Little
Upperman
Arno
Dunk
Gee
Baker
Miller C
Downen
Shumaker
Plante
Brown

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 01:19 PM
Byrd
Wienen
Natalie
Gust
Creamer
Wimmer

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 01:20 PM
Byrd
Wienen
Natalie

CADWELL
07-27-2008, 01:20 PM
Warnia is putting Europe on the map!!

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 01:20 PM
Byrd
Wienen
Natalie
Creamer
Gust
Wimmer

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 01:22 PM
Byrd
Wienen
Natalie
Creamer
Gust
Wimmer
Goodman

JRP
07-27-2008, 01:22 PM
creamer is pushin hard for a top 3! lets go creamer!

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 01:23 PM
Byrd
Wienen
Natalie
Creamer
Gust

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 01:24 PM
Byrd
Wienen
Natalie
Creamer
Gust
Wimmer
Goodman
Lawson
Upperman
Warnia
Dunk
Little
Gee
Arno
Miller
Baker
Downen
Shumaker
Plante
Brown

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 01:26 PM
Creamer is all over Natalie

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 01:27 PM
Byrd
Wienen
Natalie
Creamer

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 01:29 PM
Byrd takes the win, Wienen takes second, and Natalie takes the third position

TALS
07-27-2008, 01:32 PM
:(

CADWELL
07-27-2008, 01:32 PM
Any pics of the live coverage?

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 01:33 PM
Moto Two
Byrd
Wienen
Natalie
Creamer
Gust
Wimmer
Goodman
Lawson
Warnia
Little
Upperman
Warnia
Dunk
Gee
Little
Arno Jr
Miller
Baker
Downen
Shumaker
Plante
Brown

07-27-2008, 01:33 PM
Thanks for the information, we really appreciate it. Good race.

esr250r86
07-27-2008, 01:37 PM
Thx for the coverage :)

Johnny & Monica
07-27-2008, 01:37 PM
Overall
Joe Byrd
Chad Wienen
Doug Gust

cook65xc
07-27-2008, 01:39 PM
Originally posted by Johnny & Monica
Overall
Joe Byrd
Chad Wienen
Doug Gust

:macho :D

LTR450_#67
07-27-2008, 01:58 PM
Way to go GUST for getting on the podium again!!! Good to see Chad is back.

yam450_53
07-27-2008, 02:12 PM
not happy to see byrd winning...

very happy to see chad in 2nd though! GO WIENEN !!!

offspring22
07-27-2008, 02:48 PM
What is Wimmer's overall?

Warnerade
07-27-2008, 07:53 PM
Creamer was definately putting out the best laps this weekend...but I have to say, I'm glad his bike broke down in the first moto and glad he had a bad holeshot. Hes no better than Byrd as far as I'm concerned anymore...

I was definately shooting for Weinen on this one.

Pro am was probably the best race I've seen all year

AtvMxRider
07-27-2008, 08:05 PM
Originally posted by Warnerade
Creamer was definately putting out the best laps this weekend...but I have to say, I'm glad his bike broke down in the first moto and glad he had a bad holeshot. Hes no better than Byrd as far as I'm concerned anymore...




:confused: What do you mean?

Warnerade
07-27-2008, 08:10 PM
definately got the "im too good to walk on the same grass as you are" feeling from him. Not getting into details...but hes a little *****

other than that, it was a great weekend lol

ikuzus450
07-27-2008, 11:19 PM
so you say the proam race was the best.... explain please. i love watching cody gibson, he really has no fear!!!!!!!

Warnerade
07-27-2008, 11:21 PM
seeing him and thomas go at it nice and clean. All I needed to see to consider it the best race I saw this weekend.

hsr
07-28-2008, 08:26 AM
Where will gibson end up next year, pro class? Heard he's already had some offers...

elementryder
07-28-2008, 09:21 AM
Originally posted by hsr
Where will gibson end up next year, pro class? Heard he's already had some offers...

im pretty sure the word is he has signed with kawi but thats just what i hear

mx3mom
07-28-2008, 11:01 AM
Warnerade, I wouldn't take it personal. I got the same kind of treatment from Thomas Brown this weekend too. He is as friendly as can be away from the track though. He used to come around and talk to us and stuff but now its a different story. I think that the factory support thing may have something to do with it. Even though, its common to see Weinen,Wimmer, Natalie, & Lawson out watching races and talking to everyone, maybe the company policies are different. I try to look at the picture from both sides but sometimes its just a little fuzzy looking when it don't suit me. lol

I wish all these guys the best and hope that lucking into factory support doesn't change them too much. As far as Cody Gibson....just have to wait and see. Good luck Cody #40, and if you get to where you don't speak to me... I'm gonna kick your butt! See ya at Loretta's

quadracer707
07-28-2008, 11:53 AM
You people have to rememeber with the pro's this now is there job. Iam good friends with one & when I go to the nationals I hardly see him or talk to him. Everybody thinks they have to stop & talk to everyone they see, It really is tuff to do, I know he try's his best but when you blow motors & try getting new deals started for next year, it doesn't leave you that much time, That is why they have autograph sessions.
I have seen this pro have to walk by people that want to talk & it really bothers him, that he cant & you can here people saying OH now his is to good to talk to us. They still have alot to do besides getting on quad & ride!! Yeah without us the fans were would the pros be understandable, & most of them (the pro's) no this.
When you have bad qualifying as an amatuer you know how you feel, & we are only racing for a $10.00 trophy. Iam sure there are some real jerks out there but remember, put yourself in there shoes, most of the time things aren't going good for the pro's, there is only one 1ST PLACE. I have seen pro's give amatuers there spare goggles, used race tires even outfits to guys. So please refrain from some of the he Sucks, cant ride, doesn't deserve it hasn't paid his dues, etc. unless you have been there done that. These are very talented riders that I have seen 1st hand take stock quads with suspension & eat up local guys at tracks that have decked out motors.
This is my opionion, & take it for what it is worth

Ken

Warnerade
07-28-2008, 12:06 PM
Originally posted by quadracer707
You people have to rememeber with the pro's this now is there job. Iam good friends with one & when I go to the nationals I hardly see him or talk to him. Everybody thinks they have to stop & talk to everyone they see, It really is tuff to do, I know he try's his best but when you blow motors & try getting new deals started for next year, it doesn't leave you that much time, That is why they have autograph sessions.
I have seen this pro have to walk by people that want to talk & it really bothers him, that he cant & you can here people saying OH now his is to good to talk to us. They still have alot to do besides getting on quad & ride!! Yeah without us the fans were would the pros be understandable, & most of them (the pro's) no this.
When you have bad qualifying as an amatuer you know how you feel, & we are only racing for a $10.00 trophy. Iam sure there are some real jerks out there but remember, put yourself in there shoes, most of the time things aren't going good for the pro's, there is only one 1ST PLACE. I have seen pro's give amatuers there spare goggles, used race tires even outfits to guys. So please refrain from some of the he Sucks, cant ride, doesn't deserve it hasn't paid his dues, etc. unless you have been there done that. These are very talented riders that I have seen 1st hand take stock quads with suspension & eat up local guys at tracks that have decked out motors.
This is my opionion, & take it for what it is worth

Ken I gave credit to creamer where it was needed, he was by far putting out the best laps this whole weekend. It has nothing to do with the fact that he didnt stop and talk to me. To be honest, I'd prolly walk away if he tried.

His attitude wasnt the best during his autograph session either, but like I said...it had nothing to do with that, I just figured that because his motor blew first moto.

xtreme 250x
07-28-2008, 12:52 PM
I have seen Creamer at a local race and is more than happy to stop and talk to the local racers. I am sure that the bigger you get the more presure on you to be in race mode the whole day. I am sure Byrd Creamer Gust you name the pro They are different people off the track
Just my opinion

randyIL
07-28-2008, 04:51 PM
It was a great ProAM race, full out from start to finish on a really rough track.

The weekend was great with alot of great ATV races.

This was Cody from moto 1.

randyIL
07-28-2008, 05:20 PM
Here is Cody crashing into the trees.

Just kidding.

This was the huge jump in the Pro/Pro-Am section.

randyIL
07-28-2008, 05:41 PM
Here is Chad hitting that big uphill (he hit it on his 1st attempt).

Warnerade
07-28-2008, 05:43 PM
no he didnt. try second attempt

randyIL
07-28-2008, 05:49 PM
Your right...technically second....he rolled over it and pulled over to check something out...I did not count that as an attempt...but as you say...technically that would make it his second attempt.

You do have to agree though, he was the first to try it.

Warnerade
07-28-2008, 07:03 PM
oh im not debating he was the first to try it, I figured it was gonna be him or creamer hucking it first for sure. You see gibsons heel clicker over that thing?

hsr
07-28-2008, 07:10 PM
Are we talking about laroccos leap here?

Warnerade
07-28-2008, 07:21 PM
Originally posted by hsr
Are we talking about laroccos leap here? no, this year the pro quads ran the pro section that the AMA pro dirtbikes run. There is a huge step up and 2 steep *** off camber turns. I tried you tubing it, but couldnt find anything

blakefoote
07-28-2008, 10:06 PM
do the quads do the leap? i figured gibson would try it lol

Warnerade
07-28-2008, 10:26 PM
with how the run at the leap is, its impossible on a quad.

randyIL
07-29-2008, 09:28 AM
From this pic you can see the 2nd off camber by the Monster tower.

The huge step-up is to the right of the off camber. There was another left turn off camber after the step-up.

I have alot of video, but I'm too retarded and do not have the time to figure out how to get it on u tube.

Hey Warnerade, were you the winner in Open A & 2nd in 16-24 ??

Warnerade
07-29-2008, 09:40 AM
no thats one of my best friends, Brandon Jones. I woulda been racing in those classes but I got a broken wrist

randyIL
07-29-2008, 10:17 AM
Oh, he's pretty fast !!!

We had a friend in that class too, so I got to watch Brandon kick some butt.

Do you give him a run for his money when your healthy ??

I beleive this was Saturday's motto start.

Warnerade
07-29-2008, 11:20 AM
I honestly couldnt tell ya if I'd give him a run for his money or not lol. We've only ridden together twice this year, the one time I was on my practice bike and he was on his race bike and I couldnt even keep up. The second time I was on my race bike and he was on his practice bike and I pulled pretty good on him. At Ballance MX this year before I got hurt, my lap times were about 2 seconds slower than his and it was my first time on my new race bike...I wish I coulda got used to it and rode with him before I got hurt. He spanked me all the time last year, but I got a lot faster over the winter

Always next year though.

randyIL
07-29-2008, 11:42 AM
Getting hurt sucks !!!

Good luck with the recovery and next season.

We'll see you next year at Sunset & RedddddBudddddd.

reconmaster
07-30-2008, 01:12 AM
i know harlen got pics of me but did anyone else get pics or vids it was my 1st race in almost 2 years i was runnign the #31 yfz in open c, 450c and industry class. i didn't make the mains for open c and 450c but still had the best experience ever

randyIL
07-30-2008, 09:46 AM
Oh yeah, I got some footage of you. I filmed ( video ) some of the last chance qualifier.

In fact, I isolated on you a couple of times.

I beleive I got you at the start, the holeshot, and the rest of the front section ( 2-3 laps ) up to the back section. I was filming in the stands by the holeshot, so I did not get any footage through the woops and larrocco ( spelling ? ) leap.

I have not replayed any video yet, so I'm not sure of the quality. It should be OK, but until I see it, I don't want to give false hope that it is theatre quality.

If you want, I can download it on a dvd and send it your way.
Send me your address. If you do not want to put your address out on the forum, just email it to me at randy.davis6@honeywell.com.

I was going to take a few pics, but I didn't know your # ( you were riding so good, I couldn't find you ) until it was too late.

Also, there was a film crew ( they had Moose vests on ) in the stands at the time and I told them about you ( while the announcer was also saying a few words about you ), but I don't know if they shot any video.

reconmaster
07-30-2008, 10:03 AM
i was riding the #31 yfz but my numbers 19

motoxgirlx3
07-30-2008, 06:03 PM
Does anyone have any information on how the boy was who crashed hard on sunday in i believe it was schoolboy junior and his name was Spencer
I could be wrong but i think thats the class and his nameee
thanks so much for any info i saw the crash and he has been in my prayers

Ellingsoc26
07-30-2008, 09:19 PM
yes i remember that they sat there for about 15 mins before they got him out of there idk what the deal was but alot of ppl were really pissed off about it

motoxgirlx3
07-30-2008, 10:10 PM
yeah that was bad
but i did some searching and found one of the local sites from where he lives and it says he has a broken back and severe concussion but thats about all they know right now

lemondropracing
08-02-2008, 06:57 AM
what's the story on the ********* that got caught in someone's trailer at red bud ? i heard he got locked up and that he was a doing the whole series. is this our thief from highpoint and everywhere else???? who is he ? where's he from?

LT80
08-03-2008, 08:00 AM
Originally posted by lemondropracing
what's the story on the ********* that got caught in someone's trailer at red bud ? i heard he got locked up and that he was a doing the whole series. is this our thief from highpoint and everywhere else???? who is he ? where's he from?

Ya, more info please...Inquiring minds want to know. :)

quadracer707
08-03-2008, 08:45 AM
While we were @ Pleasure Valley a lady came screaming down to her husband to turn his golf cart around there were people going thru there trailer while he was watching races, although I never heard of anything the rest of the day I was hoping they caught them.
Close the trailer then beat the **** out of them, then call security

Ken

randyIL
08-03-2008, 09:16 PM
There appeared to be a commotion at the Kawasaki tent soon after the pro 2nd moto. After a little while, I did see a cop walking a guy out of the pro section ( in handcuffs ). A Kawasaki guy was jawing at him too. While this is totally unofficial....I was told that the guy was stealing stuff out of the pro tents while the pros were racing.

Ironically, before the 1st moto, I took some pictures of the pros at the line and while I walking back to the track to watch the race I noticed there was no-one in any of the pro tents. I thought to myself, why don't they have someone stay at the tent, because it seemed it would be real easy for someone to take some items.

Apparently this guy thought the same thing and acted on it.

Whether he was stealing from the amateur areas, I haven't heard anything. Unfortunately, there always some jerks out there.

smiley67
08-06-2008, 02:08 PM
The guys are from Argentina, but are staying in Colorado. One of them races. I believe that they were taking items from both the pros and amatures. They run a business selling used gear and stuff. I guess that they had a hotel room full of things that they had taken over then weekend. I know that they spent at least one night in jail and that the judge let them out of $5000 bail. The arresting officer figures that they have went back to Colorado by now.