Aren's Long Travels [Archive]

Jnine

11-25-2002, 09:43 PM

Hello Guys:

You are right about the A-Arm drawing you found. That is actually one of our CAD Solid Model drawings, and it is a new A-Arm design. That was a little earlier version however, and the final design we are working on is even better. They will look pretty much like that however, and the price will be NO MORE than $600. I want to make them a little less than that even, but I AM NOT going over $600. There is absolutely NO REASON any "long travel" A-Arms should cost a penny more than the standard model. All they do is move the shock out, and they use almost the exact same amount of material. The only reason some companies charge more is because everyone else does. That P-s-es me off, and I can't wait to kick their butts with our new ones. We're also building a few things into these new arms that they will not be able to copy.

Anyway, I wanted to clear that up for you.

By the way, I just realized I have private messaging on this site, and If I didn't answer your email I'm sorry that I didn't realize it was there.

Talk to you later.

Mxbubs

11-25-2002, 09:57 PM

Originally posted by WarriorMan
Do you have any Spec's on them? They look very nice, and for the price it would be hard to buy something else.

No, I dont. I had to go undercover to find them. John's dog almost attacked me, I cant say how I came upon that photo.:D

No male studded balljoints? +3's with 19 shocks? For under
600$?

I do believe you are about to change the way we think of long travel cost, and kick some major competition butt.:)

Extremeracer167

11-25-2002, 10:05 PM

dangit, i just got my housers too!:grr If anyones interested there is a set of houser LTs for sale. lol $700 never mounted on the quad! haha

beerock

11-25-2002, 10:53 PM

Originally posted by Jnine
Hello Guys:

You are right about the A-Arm drawing you found. That is actually one of our CAD Solid Model drawings, and it is a new A-Arm design. That was a little earlier version however, and the final design we are working on is even better. They will look pretty much like that however, and the price will be NO MORE than $600. I want to make them a little less than that even, but I AM NOT going over $600. There is absolutely NO REASON any "long travel" A-Arms should cost a penny more than the standard model. All they do is move the shock out, and they use almost the exact same amount of material. The only reason some companies charge more is because everyone else does. That P-s-es me off, and I can't wait to kick their butts with our new ones. We're also building a few things into these new arms that they will not be able to copy.

Anyway, I wanted to clear that up for you.

By the way, I just realized I have private messaging on this site, and If I didn't answer your email I'm sorry that I didn't realize it was there.

Talk to you later.

Damn john, you just said a MOUTHFUL.

I hope other companies follow john, cuz its ABOUT TIME someone cut the *****.I predict a-arms will come down in price if you sell them at your proposed price.

KUDOS JOHN!

11-26-2002, 01:33 AM

Good looking product there very nice.

Is this a Real long travel 19" shock set up or the std length 16" with high misalignment joints?

The real travel is still more on the LT for 19" shocks than the high misalignment type for the 16" shocks.

Correct me if I am wrong but isnt it the advantage of LT that a longer stroke of the piston is used casue a longer shock is used in ths set up. The longer stroke is what makes them long travel not the amount of misalignment that the arm allows from usinng different mountings etc.

Correct me if I am wrong but I think the long travel arms that dont accept the 19" shocks are not truely long travel since this type of set up will be restricted by the amount of shock shaft travel.

Taco

11-26-2002, 09:19 AM

Will these A-arms be offered any any other widths? Dont forget the XC guys:D

Str8Wicked

11-26-2002, 10:01 AM

was there a website to visit?

quadman21

11-26-2002, 10:40 AM

All I have to say to John is...THANK YOU . I was reading the other post you had going where you spoke about your EX replace ment frame. It's about time someone out there sold these products at a reasonable price! $2600 for ROLL's LoboII front end is crazy. We all know it doesn't cost that much for the a-arms and shocks. So that's why I'm saying thanks. I believe you have the right philosophy. Just keep the little man in mind when you price your products. For so long companys like ROLL have overpriced their products and the little people have been left out. That's my input.

smith

11-26-2002, 11:04 AM

Arens doesn't have a website yet, but don't worry, word has it that he has the ball rolling and it is being designed and laid out as we type!
As for the shock locations...you don't have to have tubes bent in every which direction to make a "long travel" shock work right. I'm sure if he's laying it out on the computer that it'll work out right. In fact, some of the long travel set ups have the shock mounting points quite a ways off from where it should be. Ever see a front shock that's bent like a bananna? That's the result of the shock being located in the wrong spot many times.

forum

11-26-2002, 11:19 AM

so are yours true long travel?? Why isn't the shock mount lower like the pro trax or houser a arms? or bent to lower the mounts like on hermanns or Lobo 2's. will these babys be ready for January cause thats when elka says there elites will be ready and i wanna have them at the same time if i can.

Dave400ex

11-26-2002, 03:18 PM

Man if he is going to sell true 19" long travel a-arms for under $600, he will sell a ton of them. I may have to save for those and some long travel Elka's next winter. I would love to get the Frame and A-Arms at once though. Arens is going to change the Chassis pricing world.

QuadTrix6

11-26-2002, 03:29 PM

you got to apreciate that companies take the time out to come and post on the site. i feel like i find out the latest info on products here...o wait i do :eek:

Jnine

11-26-2002, 03:31 PM

Hello again:

I agree with you guys about the cost of this stuff compared to what you are getting most of the time. I got into this business because my brother and I wanted a frame, as well as a few local guys, but they were so damn expensive even then. And I had a good job! Fotunately I had the design tools to do my own for the bunch of us, and thats how we got started. Anyway, I understand that they have some pretty substantial input costs, and they have to keep the lights on at the shop. I would think all of us here realize they have to make a little bit to stay in business, and I don't blame them for that part, but with some of these guys prices..... GIve me a break! I KNOW how much it costs to make the stuff, and although we are probably more efficient than anybody else, (more CNC parts, Lasering 1000 or more brackets at a time, buying volume tube from the mills...) we probably have much lower input costs. Thats just being efficient. If they can't be more efficient, that's too bad! I would rather make & sell a LOT of parts to the average guys than to only make a couple parts for a wealthy guys. I know who I'm going riding with on the weekend!

I have noticed that some of these companies have started sneaking up the price of their steering columns as well, and everybody seems to be following along. I've got bad news for them... We're going to lower it a little, and include the new bar clamps as well. Thats why my A-Arms are going to be about $575/$600 MAX. I would love to put some pressure on those guys. In some ways, that feels a little bit like racing to me, and I want to win!

Talk to you later.

JA

Jnine

11-26-2002, 03:33 PM

I suspect some of these guys aren't really listed as a business. They come and go pretty quickly. Unfortunately some people should never put a welder in their hands again.

JA

racerx573

11-26-2002, 03:54 PM

I remember you saying in a previous post, that the Laeger's t-pin system is the only "true" long travel set up, or something along those lines.

My question is, how will these compare to the t-pin??

Tommy 17

11-26-2002, 04:13 PM

Originally posted by Jnine

I would love to put some pressure on those guys. In some ways, that feels a little bit like racing to me, and I want to win!

JA

all i have to say is its about freakin time!!!:macho

mcgusto

11-26-2002, 06:55 PM

I like thuis guys attitude. If he is serious about this product, and serious about practical pricing......he is going to have a huge following of new and even return customers! I am very interested in his product and his attitude of "buyer-seller" relationships.

Taco

11-26-2002, 07:02 PM

Originally posted by Jnine
Hello again:

I agree with you guys about the cost of this stuff compared to what you are getting most of the time. I got into this business because my brother and I wanted a frame, as well as a few local guys, but they were so damn expensive even then. And I had a good job! Fotunately I had the design tools to do my own for the bunch of us, and thats how we got started. Anyway, I understand that they have some pretty substantial input costs, and they have to keep the lights on at the shop. I would think all of us here realize they have to make a little bit to stay in business, and I don't blame them for that part, but with some of these guys prices..... GIve me a break! I KNOW how much it costs to make the stuff, and although we are probably more efficient than anybody else, (more CNC parts, Lasering 1000 or more brackets at a time, buying volume tube from the mills...) we probably have much lower input costs. Thats just being efficient. If they can't be more efficient, that's too bad! I would rather make & sell a LOT of parts to the average guys than to only make a couple parts for a wealthy guys. I know who I'm going riding with on the weekend!

I have noticed that some of these companies have started sneaking up the price of their steering columns as well, and everybody seems to be following along. I've got bad news for them... We're going to lower it a little, and include the new bar clamps as well. Thats why my A-Arms are going to be about $575/$600 MAX. I would love to put some pressure on those guys. In some ways, that feels a little bit like racing to me, and I want to win!

Talk to you later.

JA
so will you offer different widths of aarms? I know some XC guys would love this as well:D

Mxbubs

11-26-2002, 07:32 PM

Steering stem prices are a RIPOFF now days. 300$ for some, give me a brake. Its just 4130 chromoly, with a little welding, and 2 pieces of rubber.

trx400ex

11-26-2002, 07:46 PM

i saw in one of my catalogs, a roll design stem, with a 450$ price tag:o

Jnine: what do you think about the roll design lobo 2 aarms?

mcgusto

11-26-2002, 09:34 PM

honestly though, how many riders that are not sponsored or rich can afford some of these prices????? I think that if all of these companyies where a little more reasonable, they could easily raise sales and proffit. The average rider wants to improve his/her riding experience, but at what cost?$3000, $4000, $5000 or more!!!! This is rediculous!

I want to know when these arens are going to be available, and what lenght shock I need?

Extremeracer167

11-26-2002, 10:10 PM

companies raise prices for one reason. Less work and more money! They dont want to do more work for the same amount of money.

forum

11-27-2002, 08:20 AM

i agree chassis prices are to high but are now coming down to a more realastic level. But the shocks usualy arnt sold for to much. It takes alot to build a shock and build it right. Therefor I do not see that companies are ripping us off when it comes to shoccks. at least not to too much. Although axis is a little high. the rest are reasonable. pep tcs elka. all very close in price.

11-27-2002, 08:47 AM

Therefor I do not see that companies are ripping us off when it comes to shoccks. at least not to too much. Although axis is a little high. the rest are reasonable. pep tcs elka. all very close in price. No flame but are you sure your thinking your not paying too much or at least overpaying :)

I think you realized that shocks are way expensive for quads right after you said there not ripping us off. LOL

Damn are shocks overpriced for this stuff. I know people into other motor sports (mini ovals drags etc) that buy their stuff at least 1/2 of what we do. This isnt garbage either and it seems they have more choices in springs also.

I am thinking as the demand grows larger companies that can controll costs better will be bringing us better and less expensive products.

I suspect some of these guys aren't really listed as a business. They come and go pretty quickly. Unfortunately some people should never put a welder in their hands again.
Your right there, and though I prefer to deal with a small local business I have seen problems just like your saying too many times.

one question though, if the pic is accurate will the top rod end mounts be a weak link in the arms? If you remember my posts from the frame thread you know I think that this isnt a bad thing either if it is.

Hopefully something inexpensive gives in a collision rather than twisting the frame.

And what length shock fits that set up?

Thanx

Jnine

11-27-2002, 06:14 PM

Hello again guys:

I think the last person was asking me if the pic fo the A-Arms was accurate. The lower A-arm picture is very accurate, but the upper will look a little different. The upper will look more like a traditional A-Arm with the adjustment on the end, but it will have a few surprises for you as well. It will offer something new that nobody else has seen in A-Arms before. I'm not sure where the person who pasted that design file photo got it from, but it weas an earlier design. Thats why the top is going to change a little. Eventually part of the top A-Arm will be a forging as well. (Thats a clue!)

I have not seen the Doug ROll A-Arms you are mentioning, but I'm sure they look good. Doug is actually a pretty good craftsman and he builds some nice stuff, but damn you have to want it bad to cough up that kind of change!

Heres a question for all of you.... What color should these A-Arms be? I like the red or black lower arm, and a black chrome powder coat upper.

JA

Tommy 17

11-27-2002, 06:20 PM

john i suggest offering the a-arms at a lower price un poweder coated... mayb take 20$ or 30$ off them... bc alot of people powder coat the a-arms differnt colors such as lets say lollipop red or baby blue or lime green...

but stand colors sale a red that matches the hubs of a 400ex, a silver vain, and a black a-arm... thats what most people buy...

trx400ex

11-27-2002, 06:35 PM

Originally posted by Jnine

I have not seen the Doug ROll A-Arms you are mentioning, but I'm sure they look good. Doug is actually a pretty good craftsman and he builds some nice stuff, but damn you have to want it bad to cough up that kind of change!

Heres a question for all of you.... What color should these A-Arms be? I like the red or black lower arm, and a black chrome powder coat upper.

JA

Heres a pic of some, i bought some because i got a good deal, but nothing like what your offering...

for color i highly suggest a non powdercoated option with a lower price, because youll never get every color that every guy wants, and alot of guys will want chrome....but then there will be people that dont know where to go to get stuff PCed so you should offer basic colors for them...red..hammertone gray...black..personally i hate silvervien BC the finish last for about 10 minutes of riding..

I just want to say your doing a good thing and i will try to run one of your frames next year whenever they come out...i know youve made at least one more customer

Dave400ex

11-27-2002, 07:05 PM

Just make sure and offer a Chrome top. I like the hammertone gray, dark blue, red, black, and silvervein.

Mxbubs

11-27-2002, 09:11 PM

Jnine said

"I'm not sure where the person who pasted that design file photo got it from, but it weas an earlier design."

HeHeHe..........makes you wonders.:D

d-14 rider 27

11-27-2002, 10:35 PM

im assuming the upper arms will be aluminum if your talking about them being forged, so i would like to see them offered in bare aluminum so it can be polished. also have you ever seen red silvervein? herrmann does this color, it looks pretty sweet

mcgusto

11-28-2002, 02:41 AM

I would say that you should offer color options if you can afford to. There are a lot of potential customers that will walk away from a product if it is not the exact product they are looking for....especially if it doesnt match their quad's color theme.

400exBro

11-28-2002, 04:52 AM

I think you should offer what coulor you would like to have the a arms..

some of use are not able to send our stuff to kenny to get it power coated, and it is a lot of money to do it up here, that is why you should be able to chose between different colours...

Jnine- will you be making long travels for the cannibal,.,..,.,

thanks

Bro

Pappy

11-28-2002, 07:59 AM

forum

11-28-2002, 08:07 AM

bro if you want anything powdercoated talk to me. My buddy used to work for one and i can get stuff done pretty cheap. around 150 CAN for a frame any colour you want. Youl have to do the sand blasting tho.

What type of joints are you using in the end? same type as herrmann??

muff

11-28-2002, 08:45 AM

wow, I really like jnine's attitude here, this is the kind of thing our sport needs, I've wanted to get LT a-arms but the prices have been to high for me

will you be offering other width a-arms? like +1 LT cause around here the trails are tight

cdale20

11-28-2002, 12:36 PM

i think you get what you pay for as far as a-arms go. as for what these look like, i can't see how they are going to be long travel and actually handle good. being that the lower a-arm is staight, tells me that it either uses a 16" shock or the shock mount is moved out towards the wheel. the fact that it seems as though he will use spherical bearings and king pins instead of ball joints is a step in the right direction. if he makes it so that it uses a 19" shock, then the shock mount on the a-arm will be moved out towards the spindle, by doing it this way, it changes the shock angle. when the shock angle is chaged in this way the bike will tend to roll in the corners and tosses you around in the woops. this is the reason why there is a bend in the roll's and gibsons, and the shock mount is below the a-arm on the housers and leagers, so they can put a longer shock in without changing the shock angle too much.

i agree that 600 is a great price for a long travel a-arm, but i kind of think that this isn't going to be what it is being built up as. sure roll's, leager pro-trax and gibson's are expensive but they are worth every penny. i think that the fact that these a-arms are 600 bucks is good, but i wouldn't go comparing it to race tested long travel stuff until they can go head to head on the track......

11-28-2002, 04:23 PM

will you set up a distribution system thru a dealer.....like the quadshop? just trying to figure out whats going on here, most well known suppliers sell thru a distribution network not direct.
OK heres a tissue to wipe that brown stuff off ya nose :)

i agree that 600 is a great price for a long travel a-arm, but i kind of think that this isn't going to be what it is being built up as. Interesting thought and I was thinking to myself if this product would compare to the other so called long travel 16" set ups and not the 19" ones. Maybe John can clear this up.

Pappy

11-28-2002, 04:43 PM

Originally posted by 440EX4me

OK heres a tissue to wipe that brown stuff off ya nose :)

no kissing up...just at the price he is qouting i cant imagine them going thru any dealers. im not familiar with how he does business.....do you get stuff direct from him or thru a dealer?

Jnine

11-28-2002, 07:51 PM

Hello again guys:

I'll try to answer a bunch of the questions....

COLOR: I really hate to do the "vein" colors because of cleanup. Everyone of those little veins is a pocket for dirt that makes it harder to clean them up. The bottom will almost certainly be red or black (and maybe bare if a guy wants it that way) The top arm will be a silver / chrome look. Can't use actual chrome on this part however....

DEALERS: I don sell many of my other parts through dealers and directly to the riders, and these A-Arms will be the same way... Both dealers & direct.

BALL JOINTS: Nobody else will have this ball joint because it was designed for this A-Arm and nothing else. Nobody else owns this design, or can manufacture it. I was tired of the damn car joints. They have limited travel which is extremely important for the longer travel A-Arms, the quality of the auto joints is usually pretty poor, (Some test softer than ALuminum) the studs actually stretch, the seals are usually not capable of high angular movement without moving away from the stud, and everybody likes to copy your design and use the same parts! That won't happen with this joint

Talk to you later.

JA

Jnine

11-28-2002, 08:28 PM

Hello again guys:

I read the post about getting what you pay for. With the A-Arms on the market right now, I don't think the riders ARE getting what they pay for, but lets take a look...

You were quesitoning the shocks to be used for a long travel setup and if it would effect the ride. Actually you would be correct in assuming that an ordinary ball joint would not allow for extra travel, but that is the automotive joint everyone else is using. We have a joint designed EXCLUSIVELY for this A-Arm design and not something else that we pirated for this project. Therefore, when we layed everything out in the CAD Solid Model we knew the design would work. I know we are the only company doing anything even close to that. If any of the other guys even know their ball joint load & angular constraints, and could calculate the anlges & loads the A-Arm was capable of I would be amazed. That takes some engineering knowledge, and most of them can only copy!

Also, you mentioned how this design might effect the shock action and cold cause roll. Again you are right in questioning this and you would be correct if we were not working with any suspension company. We are sharing all of our design data with the guys from ELKA, and since they have all that math data they will be able to calculate the variables, and design their shock setup to match. It's not that hard really. I know some of the other guys like to bend the a-arm to accomodate their ball joints limited range.... They have to, but some of them make it even worse with their solution. We have designed a way around that. We're pretty thorough actually, and thats why we do design & prototype work for some of the factories. I NEVER release a product until I am completely comfortabe with our design. I would rather let the sale go than to send out a part that was not our best effort at the time. I KNOW this one is a winner, and it can work at the price I listed.

Heres the question...... What has changed on A-Arms in the last few years? Everybody used to charge around $500/$600 for a set of A-Arms, but now they are pushing $800 to $1000 for some. Did the cost of something go up that much? It's the same design they used from the beginning.

They use: car ball joints, car heim joints, car pivot bushings, and a little bit of steel, just as they have since day 1. Are we building cars or quads? Why so damn expensive now?

Our design uses parts strictly designed for the ATV. In fact, we even are forming our own pivot bushings for this part, and the entire package will be the best A-Arm package on the market. I'll put them up against anything else, no problem. .. .And we'll do it for a more reasonable cost, so do you actually get what you pay for? Don't confuse cost for quality! This industry is famous for high prices that do not match the finished product quality. Our parts WILL fit.

If it makes anybody feel better however, I would be glad to accomodate them by charging them the extra $250

JA

11-28-2002, 09:22 PM

Jnine, dont take this wrong but you need to give up the shock length sooner or later :)

I think I agree with all the concerns with the travel but am seriously still not 100% on the weakness of "all" the others and like I had said earlier and this is especially true for rec riders there does need to be a weak link some place.

I do like your dedication and intended integrity (something a lot of people in this industry are very lacking) and believe what your saying but if all the extra travel is thru higher limitations of the joint to spindle mounting and not from a longer stroke from a longer shock will it be as plush? (Yes this is a question :) )

thanx again

Jnine

11-28-2002, 10:44 PM

Hello Guys:

I can give you the shock length, but I have to check the design file to be sure. Most of the shocks people are using for long travel actually measure approximately 18 1/2", but it's kind of like the way they call motors 250cc, although it may be 243cc or something close to that. Anyway, I'm pretty sure Andrew had it setup for something close to the 19" as well.

Can't remember the shorter shock, but it is the standard length one. I'll check tomorrow though.

JA

Taco

11-28-2002, 11:11 PM

Originally posted by muff
wow, I really like jnine's attitude here, this is the kind of thing our sport needs, I've wanted to get LT a-arms but the prices have been to high for me

will you be offering other width a-arms? like +1 LT cause around here the trails are tight

How about this?

Juggalo

11-29-2002, 11:24 AM

john, i have a question for you- why are you not using the gull wing design in your a-arms like roll,hermann, and gibson use? is there a downside to making the bend in the arms as appossed to the straight long travel arms (such as housers or the ones your designing). i'm just wondering what the difference is..is the bend just not nescisary? i'm switching to a long travel front end soon and i was going to go with a merrell extreme set up (they have some special tie rod ends too and i was wondering if you knew anything about that) but you made a really good impression on me because you take the time to answer our questions and get ideas from us, plus i especially like the fact that you really care about us and price your products very well. now i'm seriousley considering buying your front end but i'd just like to know the difference.

Extremeracer167

11-29-2002, 11:44 AM

Mr. Arens,
When u say that Elka is working with you for shocks. Does this mean that your design, if the way stated b4, that Elka shocks are going to be the only ones that will work with these arms. I might be picking up the wrong idea. But if im not, i personally wouldnt buy your arms. See im a Axis boy myself. And i am not afraid to put out th Extra cash for a proven product. And Axis is workin on somthin new, that will blow everyone else away. I prob. will never buy elkas, just becuase my friend had problems with his, and sold them about 3 weeks after he had them(just didnt like em) So is this what your saying? That if you change the lowe shock position Elka will be the only one who makes a proper setup for your arms?

Dont get me wrong, i love this whole idea, and im not trying to question anything u are saying, just wanted to know about the elka thing. Thanks ALOT!!!!

d-14 rider 27

11-29-2002, 11:52 AM

What John is saying, is that he is sharing all the design info with elka, and that the elka/arens combo will be valved perfect, you would still be able to have someone else build you shocks, its just the elka will know exactly how to build the shocks. i will be getting elkas too when i switch to arens, which im still a little leary about elka, but if i dont like them, theres always ebay and i can get a set of peps

trx400ex

11-29-2002, 12:50 PM

Originally posted by Extremeracer167
Mr. Arens,
When u say that Elka is working with you for shocks. Does this mean that your design, if the way stated b4, that Elka shocks are going to be the only ones that will work with these arms. I might be picking up the wrong idea. But if im not, i personally wouldnt buy your arms. See im a Axis boy myself. And i am not afraid to put out th Extra cash for a proven product. And Axis is workin on somthin new, that will blow everyone else away. I prob. will never buy elkas, just becuase my friend had problems with his, and sold them about 3 weeks after he had them(just didnt like em) So is this what your saying? That if you change the lowe shock position Elka will be the only one who makes a proper setup for your arms?

Dont get me wrong, i love this whole idea, and im not trying to question anything u are saying, just wanted to know about the elka thing. Thanks ALOT!!!!

hey man, what is axis workin on thats new? if you dont want to say here you could just pm me..thanks

Chef

11-30-2002, 11:03 AM

Originally posted by Jnine
I know some of the other guys like to bend the a-arm to accomodate their ball joints limited range.... They have to, but some of them make it even worse with their solution.

JA
/\=\/

Originally posted by Juggalo
john, i have a question for you- why are you not using the gull wing design in your a-arms like roll,hermann, and gibson use?

He had already answered your question juggalo, He wont need to make the bend because his ball joints and other bearings will have the travel needed for it.

Juggalo

11-30-2002, 11:17 AM

i gotcha..

Sparks425Ex

11-30-2002, 11:32 AM

So does anyone have a pic of a real a arm instead of a CAD drawing.

bongwater200

11-30-2002, 07:53 PM

Someone mentioned that moving the lower shock pivot farther out makes the quad have more body roll. This is not true. The main factor in body roll has more to do with the relationship between the inner lower pivots ( on the frame ) and the outer pivot. ( the lower ball joint ) The closer you can keep these joints to level, the less body roll you will have. This is why you see some arms with the lower shock pivot below the plane of the lower arm. This lets them use a longer shock while keeping the lower a-arm relatively "flat" with the ground.

Also..... moving the lower pivot outward also puts more strain on your shock shaft, so if you have these "long travel" arms, you better make friggin-A sure that your lower pivots are nice and free or you'll be seeing bent shafts!

Someone also mentioned that all of these arms use the "same materials". Don't be so sure of that! Unless you have some metallurgical prowess and/or a hardness tester, you don't know WHAT you have. I know for fact that some of the manufacturers out there ( no names mentioned ) are using MILD steel or a lower grade of chromoly. I will tell you, however, that ALL ARENS products use nothing but the finest grade of material. If he tells you that your arms are 4130, you can bet your grandma's douchebag that it IS 4130.

Enough said for now.

PB

Dave400ex

11-30-2002, 08:43 PM

Really none of us will know how good these A-Arms are, how they hold up, and what they are capable of until they are for sale and guys start buying them. From the sounds of it, I think Arens will have a A+ product and I am ready to see the final design.

forum

12-03-2002, 03:35 PM

I talked to elka yesterday about my sponsership, I also asked him about them working with arens and what legth/type of shock would be used. Yann told me after asking someone else, that they are the standard Long travel shock measuring in at 19 inches (actualy he said 19 3/4 i think im not sure 3/4, 1/4 somthing like that) but its the same as any other Long travel shock. or maybe i didn't understand him right.

Bean

12-03-2002, 08:19 PM

products use nothing but the finest grade of material. If he tells you that your arms are 4130, you can bet your grandma's douchebag that it IS 4130.

Enough said for now.

PB [/B][/QUOTE]

this guy is a genuis, LMAO, grandma douchebag, hahahah

Mxbubs

12-04-2002, 05:55 PM

My grandma douching....hhhhmmmmmnnnnn.........I never thought of that, and for good reason!:eek: :eek: :huh :huh

beerock

12-04-2002, 08:51 PM

Originally posted by Mxbubs
My grandma douching....hhhhmmmmmnnnnn.........I never thought of that, and for good reason!:eek: :eek: :huh :huh
ewwwwwww

im gonna go barf now.....:blah

440ex kid

12-05-2002, 06:21 PM

So when are these LT arms gunna come out?

Dave400ex

12-05-2002, 07:22 PM

I was going to ask the same thing...

OCCRA288

12-06-2002, 08:00 AM

Bubs,
You might have got that pic from Nac's catalog/website???

Mxbubs

12-06-2002, 03:27 PM

Originally posted by OCCRA288
Bubs,
You might have got that pic from Nac's catalog/website???

You been spying on my puter?

Dave400ex

12-06-2002, 06:31 PM

How would Nac's have it when Arens haven't even put out the LT arms yet? I will have to look now...

OCCRA288

12-07-2002, 03:34 PM

they look like the Arens A-arms in my Fall Nac's catalogue.

Dave400ex

12-07-2002, 07:04 PM

I looked in the new Nac's catalog and didn't see that picture anywhere. Oh well I just hope they are out soon so guys can start giving some feedback on them.

Jnine

12-07-2002, 08:34 PM

Hello guys:

The photo you see is pretty close to how they will look, but we are making a few upgrades to those as well. You'll like the new ones, but they probably won't be ready until February. Remember, I never build just one of anything. I'll do 150 sets min. to start with.

I've got a nerf bar for you to check out next week, and another surprise coming as well.

Talk to you later.

JA

Dave400ex

12-07-2002, 08:35 PM

Keep up the good work. I am really liking what I read...

forum

12-08-2002, 11:47 AM

feb!!! damn i don't no if i can wait that long! can i get some prototypes from you?? ill addvertise them at the toronto motorcyle show when I bring my atv there. then again the elka elites might not be done then either. grrrrrrr. dammit.

BadA$$440

01-10-2003, 05:02 PM

keep us informed. Im also intrested i what he has to offer.

dezertfreak

01-11-2003, 07:47 AM

hey trx 400ex, my guess would be that axis is working on an internal bypass shock, which would revolutionalize quad shocks

Juggalo

01-11-2003, 12:10 PM

would you care to explain an internal bypass shock to us?

mx440#55

01-11-2003, 03:24 PM

Hey John...any chance we can get a date when the long travel arms will be available?

Sick0

01-11-2003, 05:29 PM

Is the internal bypass shock any thing like the edelbrock shocks for trucks.

dezertfreak

01-11-2003, 09:57 PM

in the pic the shock on the right is the bypass, it is an external bypass. an internal bypass is the same basic concept just internally. an internal bypass looks just like a normal shock, like the one on the left.
all shocks are velocity sensitive meaning the faster you try to compress the shock the more internal resistance you would have
a bypass is a position sensitive shock meaning hte position of the piston in the shock body in relation to the bypass tubes determines the valving
for example:
say your going fast down a flat dirt road, (your quad would be at normal ride height) and in all probability would have lots of up travel in the shocks so the shock piston will be more towards the bottom of the shock body.
lets say you hit a big steep bump the front wheels begin to compress very quickly to absorb the impact of the bump and the shock shaft begins to travel upward.
the shock feels this quick movement and resists with lots of force- but instead of a regular shock where all of the oil is forced through the piston, a bypass diverts the oil through the bypass tubes (which are adjustable for flow)
because not all of the oil is forced through the piston, the shock doesnt push back nearly as hard and the shock cycles upward without alot of fuss.
now because this is a big bump the piston keeps speeding up the cylinder until it passes the entry point of the first bypass tube.
now as the piston continues to travel upwards, the oil must now pass through either the piston or the remaining bypass tube.
therefore the shock will get much stiffer at this point because its harder for the oil to get past the piston.
as the piston races past the final bypass tube all of the oil is forced through the piston and the shock will get much stiffer once again.
so after all that you have a shock that has very light compression in the beginning of the stroke, medium compression in the middle of the stroke, and hard compession at the end of the stroke( to keep from bottoming)
they are also set up for exactly the same way for rebound (the red valve on the bypass tube)
the blue valve is compression
the reservoir is the one with the big blue and white sticker

now who is confused- this kind of shock has been around a while and is used extensively on trucks and buggiesrace-dezert.com/skunkz/penhall/26.jpghttp://race-dezert.com/skunkz/penhall/26.jpg