HP ideas + Jetting

[project400ex19]

I am going to be installing a Wiseco 440 kit with 12:5:1, with a CT full exhaust system, a 04' 450R carb and Stage 2 Hot Cam. How many hp do you think I should be pushing. I was 26 hp stock and with a my pipe it was dynoed at 30. I just need to be competitive with a piped and cammed 450.

I already have just about everything possible done to my 400 besides the engine. So I just need engine mods now.

Thanks,
If you have any tips/ideas secrets let's hear them. Also If you guys have a place to start on my jetting that would be awesome too.

[boosted3g]

The only advise i can give is if this is going to be for competition use is to run a bigger cam and work the head some. Hope you have a good suspension to use that power you should be over 40.

[zrpilot]

I agree, put some $$ into a polish and port.

Race gas is going to be a must.

With mods like you suggested, you should be close to 40.

[AutoRoc]

If you are serious about every last bit, I'd look into a highly oxygenated fuel from VP. Something like CMP, DRT, or the new Q16 possibly. These require a few additional jet sizes because of the added oxygen content and it all adds up to more power. I'm going to try CMP in my 12.5:1 setup next. I'm also looking into portwork with larger valves to let this big engine breathe more. Also for reliability since my stock intake valves broke on me...:mad: Goodluck!

[project400ex19]

since it takes too long to name all the mods I have. I will name which parts are stock.

*Engine and oil cooling system
*Swingarm
*hubs (but were updated to 07)
*throttle perch
*Ignition system

Yeah I think that covers the parts that are stock.
I have a gusseted powder coated frame with Elka long travel up front and elka lt in the rear with lt linkage.

I know I'm going to have to run race gas. But getting VP might be extremely expensive. I might have to custom order it. I was thinking of running 110 or 114. we have a gas station up here that I can get it at the pump.

Do you think It is worth putting in oversized valves. I want to do port and polish. Should I send it to CT racing so it matches my exhaust or would I be getting ripped off? This is my very first engine build up so that's why I'm asking so many questions. I trust you guys b/c you have experience with 400ex engines.

Should I go to a Web cam or go to a Hot Cams stage 3?

[AutoRoc]

I actually don't have experience with these engines but I am a chevy guy..haha Bigger bore and more dispnacement naturally will want a larger valve to get air in and out of the engine, along with more efficient ports. Same concept of putting a larger carb on, etc,etc. I can't reccomend a shop for porting, sorry. Haven't researched enough yet.

An oxygenated VP fuel like CMP or DRT will make more power than a non oxygenated variety like you and I can usually get at some gas stations. It will definately run around $10/gallon roughly compared to Torco 110 which is around 5/gallon out here. It's a last resort for more power, obviously. Goodluck!

[project400ex19]

anyone have any ideas for port and polish? which company is good to deal with and reasonibly priced?

I may spoil her and run a VP fuel or something if I can buy it by 55 gallon drum or something. that's prolly like 500 bucks though. Does oxygenated fuel i cant think of the word...expire?(brain fart)

[project400ex19]

Originally posted by project400ex19
anyone have any ideas for port and polish? which company is good to deal with and reasonibly priced?

I may spoil her and run a VP fuel or something if I can buy it by 55 gallon drum or something. that's prolly like 500 bucks though. Does oxygenated fuel i cant think of the word...expire?(brain fart)

How is VP U4 93 octane....I had a buddy that used to run it. spendy stuff @ 65.00 for 5 gallon can.

[zrpilot]

Originally posted by project400ex19
anyone have any ideas for port and polish? which company is good to deal with and reasonibly priced?

I may spoil her and run a VP fuel or something if I can buy it by 55 gallon drum or something. that's prolly like 500 bucks though. Does oxygenated fuel i cant think of the word...expire?(brain fart)

Lotsa options for port/polish. If I were you, I'd talk to two people:

Chad502ex here on exriders or a fella named mixxer who spends time on another board (PM me for the name of the "other board")

[boosted3g]

Give chad502 a call or send hima pm. I had a 40 minute phone call with him on friday about porting and what i want to do with my engine. If you are looking for extreme power or want to think outside the box you must talk to him. If you run the same setup as everyone else you will make the same power as everyone else. That is where you must talk to chad.

[AutoRoc]

U4.2 from VP is an updated version with 102 octane and big oxygen. MS109 could also be used and it's unleaded(101octane). Fuel can get old but even the tech guys say they've seen fuel last a really long time(2-4 years) sitting after being cracked open and it still works good. 5/15/30/55 gallon cans are avaliable.

Thanks for the porting contact, guys...I just recieved my new stocker and it needs WORK!.:D

[honda8&3]

You wouldn't believe how much power is locked up in a stock motor. Get your motor ported and polished while being bored. You are going to need to run at least 93 octane and mix some race fuel in it. VP:cool: :devil:

[drew416ex]

Thumper racing does a great job. Its $325 for port and $80 to do valve work. They are fast too, got mine back in 9 days

[project400ex19]

thanks for all the info and input guys. keep it coming. what do you guys think i should run for a cam?

[drew416ex]

That depends where you want your power. Do you want it low to mid or mid to top? The more duration the cam has, the more mid to topend it has.

[project400ex19]

Originally posted by drew416ex
That depends where you want your power. Do you want it low to mid or mid to top? The more duration the cam has, the more mid to topend it has.

I see, I learn something new everyday. I have all the low end in the world now. But my mid to top kinda falls on it's face. So definately mid to top.

[drew416ex]

Then I say get the hotcam stage 3. If you go with a web cam then you have to get hardened rockers and hd springs and shortened guids if you go big enough. So now you have figure out how much you want to or are willing to spend.

[project400ex19]

I am planning on spending about a grand on my engine... i can get a 440 kit and a hc stage 2 for 300 bucks. Headwork is going to be about 600. oversized valves im not sure how much they cost or which ones are good.

[drew416ex]

Who is doing your head work? I got mine done at thumper racing and they did a fantastic job for $325 and put in oversized valves for $80. Here is a rough estimate on price for the webcam setup with short guides.

Guids- $80
Cam- $200-250 (cant really remember)
HD Springs- $100
Hd rockers- $215

Total- $595-645 roughly

For this reason, i would give the stage 3 a try.

[project400ex19]

here's a dumb question,
can I run oversized valves and not have to change my valve springs and retainers? or am I better off replacing everything at once?

[drew416ex]

Its a little added insurance to replace them but as long as the stock springs are good there shouldnt be a problem with oversized valves.

[project400ex19]

what brand and where is the best place to buy oversized valves?

[drew416ex]

I prefer kibblewhite. They are roughly $30 a piece. You can get them from dennis kirk or C&D racing. Most riders just get oversized intakes and keep stock diameter exhaust. i think it has something to do with back pressure so you still have some low end torqu e

[project400ex19]

Anyone have a 450ex or 465ex that's not stroked, all bore? Does it require a lot of case machining? Do your cases have to be split to do the case machining?

[drew416ex]

I dont have a 465 but i do know the case has to be split and the internals removed to have it machined.