porting ???

[lee31]

I was wonderng if anybody knew anything about porting a 05 450R. I see alot of people have veno, doning there work. My question is i know a engine machineist pretty good he has worked on a few atv's. Mostly does bigger perfomance stuff like diesel trucks and mustangs. I am wondering if people like venom are porting atvs pretty much like cars knocking the burrs off and polishing them up or are they doing something diffrent ????

[AZTRX]

Try calling venom.

[chad502ex]

try calling someone whom has a flowbench and can repeat flow from the entire camshaft lift from low lift to high lift, not just hog open a port where the peak torque on the majority of ^^^^ builds starts above 8000 rpm... a porter without a flowbench is like a carpenter without a tape measure- sure the carpenter may be able to build a house, but not the same house dimensionally without the tape measure.....


there are plenty of builders whom own a flowbench that can help you.

good luck.

[Elduner]

I would not waste a penny with Venom.....


Try calling Dasa or Rage.


I run DASA port work and let me just say that it speaks for it self.... Yeah the wait is a little longer but thats because quality over quantity. Plus if you want some venom porting you could find them on Ebay no a days..... lol

Real builders/porters don't have to use ebay to promote there work....

[Rulz]

Send your head to JH Racing here in Oklahoma. He has a local guy "Bo" who does not advertise, that ports TRX and CRF heads for a alot less than DASA and RAGE and you won't see much or any performance difference. I believe he currently is charging around $275 but don't hold me to that. While he's at it, he'll mill the head .020" for around $60.

JH - 918-371-0101

[beany]

I've heard of a guy... Think his name is Chad, many people on this site can tell you about his work! Just a thought, he may even be part of this thread???

[sandmanblue]

Originally posted by Elduner
I would not waste a penny with Venom.....


Try calling Dasa or Rage.


I run DASA port work and let me just say that it speaks for it self.... Yeah the wait is a little longer but thats because quality over quantity. Plus if you want some venom porting you could find them on Ebay no a days..... lol

Real builders/porters don't have to use ebay to promote there work....

So apparently, if you advertise on eBay, then you can't be taken seriously???

Oooookkkkaaaaaayyyyyy.......

Glad to see you're happy with the DASA porting, now where are the dyno sheets on it? It sure would be a great way to show how much power your making. I mean, since everyone seems to point toward DASA, there would surely be some dyno data to base your opinion on, right?


BTW - there have been several Venom 501 builds that are producing upwards of 62 hp and more - AND doing that without harsh cams like the Web 208. Not just on one dyno either... Backed up by a few. Oh - and these were Dynojet dyno's - just so you can compare....

Even my mild 477 which only had the little HotCam2 and a quiet White Bros E2 slip-on ran 54.5 hp with a very wide powerband after Venom porting and piston. It gained 7 hp with just 27cc's, 2 points of compression and the porting.

Plus another guy in my town just ran a 450cc Venom ported build that is at over 58 hp - again, on a Dynojet dyno...

Maybe, the ppl that don't recommend Venom just have an axe to grind?

Unlike a lot of people here, I actually measured the results and have data to back it up.

[pro-rider46]

Originally posted by sandmanblue
So apparently, if you advertise on eBay, then you can't be taken seriously???



i dont believe he ever said that.

[Elduner]

Originally posted by sandmanblue
So apparently, if you advertise on eBay, then you can't be taken seriously???

Oooookkkkaaaaaayyyyyy.......

Glad to see you're happy with the DASA porting, now where are the dyno sheets on it? It sure would be a great way to show how much power your making. I mean, since everyone seems to point toward DASA, there would surely be some dyno data to base your opinion on, right?


BTW - there have been several Venom 501 builds that are producing upwards of 62 hp and more - AND doing that without harsh cams like the Web 208. Not just on one dyno either... Backed up by a few. Oh - and these were Dynojet dyno's - just so you can compare....

Even my mild 477 which only had the little HotCam2 and a quiet White Bros E2 slip-on ran 54.5 hp with a very wide powerband after Venom porting and piston. It gained 7 hp with just 27cc's, 2 points of compression and the porting.

Plus another guy in my town just ran a 450cc Venom ported build that is at over 58 hp - again, on a Dynojet dyno...

Maybe, the ppl that don't recommend Venom just have an axe to grind?

Unlike a lot of people here, I actually measured the results and have data to back it up.


Chuck your 477 pulled 54.5 with a BIGBORE and Venom porting and HC2... nothing to brag about thats for sure... If you where so happy why didnt you go the same route?

All I will say is we will meet at Glamis this year sometime and let the bikes do the talking.... I dont need to post numbers to make my bike seem like a runner....

I will say that I have seen your 511 run and by all means .. I was not impressed AT ALL!!!!

I have dyno'd my bike a while ago and my numbers where a TAD bit more than yours... lol ... and remember all I run is a Baldwin 14.1 with a little milling here and there along with some of Dasa's porting fed by a 43.2mm FCR and a little over the counter HC3.... I'll let you be the judge when we meet.... Last time at Pismo I ran some Venom builds that plain out choked! Not impressive when they are getting there arse handed to them from a stock 03 predator... lol Tell you what if you beat my brothers Predator I will run your 511 with my little stock bore... is that fair? Race gas is expensive............ :macho

[pro-rider46]

Originally posted by Elduner
Chuck your 477 pulled 54.5 with a BIGBORE and Venom porting and HC2... nothing to brag about thats for sure... If you where so happy why didnt you go the same route?

All I will say is we will meet at Glamis this year sometime and let the bikes do the talking.... I dont need to post numbers to make my bike seem like a runner....

I will say that I have seen your 511 run and by all means .. I was not impressed AT ALL!!!!

I have dyno'd my bike a while ago and my numbers where a TAD bit more than yours... lol ... and remember all I run is a Baldwin 14.1 with a little milling here and there along with some of Dasa's porting fed by a 43.2mm FCR and a little over the counter HC3.... I'll let you be the judge when we meet.... Last time at Pismo I ran some Venom builds that plain out choked! Not impressive when they are getting there arse handed to them from a stock 03 predator... lol Tell you what if you beat my brothers Predator I will run your 511 with my little stock bore... is that fair? Race gas is expensive............ :macho

haha. video tape that, and make sure you email it to me, haha

[beany]

AHHHH!! What happened??? Started simple and now:confused:

[chad502ex]

Originally posted by beany
AHHHH!! What happened??? Started simple and now:confused:

beany, chucky-cheese boy aka sandmanblue is simply a putz!

It's amazing to read how he slaps down ATVRIDERS on .org everyday and the moderators here do nothing about him causing daily trouble with the members here.. I don't get it! Sooner or later the mods have to start reading his post history and ban this pumpus-***

[pro-rider46]

i have to agree, sandmanblue, does create a lot of problems with other members, and i have only read one time he made some since, didnt put down anyone, and had factual info. but other than then he has stirred up trouble in A LOT of threads and ruins them, he especially hunts down chad and causes him grief. the forums will be okay until sandmanblue joins the discussion, if he was eliminated the problems should go away, if you go through his post you can cleary see that he is the instigator and causes the problems.

sorry to the mods if you find this trouble making.

[TURBO-530R]

Originally posted by sandmanblue
So apparently, if you advertise on eBay, then you can't be taken seriously???

Oooookkkkaaaaaayyyyyy.......

Glad to see you're happy with the DASA porting, now where are the dyno sheets on it? It sure would be a great way to show how much power your making. I mean, since everyone seems to point toward DASA, there would surely be some dyno data to base your opinion on, right?

Unlike a lot of people here, I actually measured the results and have data to back it up.


Well my then Dasa porting Dyno numbers just cool you off I have Dyno jet numbers.
But now I have DRG Porting and does it Rock.

[buck naked-r]

Originally posted by TURBO-530R
Well my then Dasa porting Dyno numbers just cool you off I have Dyno jet numbers.
But now I have DRG Porting and does it Rock.

what kind of gearing your running on that thing ?

i see your almost at 100mph

[TURBO-530R]

15-36 matt showed 106 mph on his Dyno when he had it at rousch creek. i run 1/4 mile with it that is why it is geared to fly.

Jim

[sandmanblue]

ElDuner - frankly - you don't have a clue do you? You're comparing runs I had that were "BIG BORE" to yours? My 477 wasn't a monster - never said it was. It was a whopping 29cc's bigger. Plus it had a crappy pipe, stock carb, stock intake and a smaller cam (HC2). It was a very mild build... I hope yours puts out more... Question is how much? Why won't you post up the runs? I did. What are you afraid of?

And you've seen my 511 run where? On ONE vid that was taken at 8000 feet - where you've never been - and have no clue about how hard it is to run where the vid was taken because you've never been there? Your long history of hating Venom and making up stories to state your claims says it all. I haven't even run my 511 on a dyno. You have no idea how it runs...... Yet, you dare to tell everyone about it. :rolleyes:

Something you don't have bud, INTEGRITY - go look it up.

Besides - I'm not trying to brag about MY 511 build. It has little to do with anything here.

Pro-rider -

I see people selling crack "so to speak". They SAY it's not crack, but it looks like it, smells like it and they can't/won't prove it's not crack.... Should I let everyone sit there in ignorance and not question it themselves? Think about.that.



Chad - it's spelled POMPOUS.... Do I have to keep correcting you????

Just because you want to have a monopoly here and not allow anyone to question your biased, self-glorifying posts, doesn't mean it's going to happen.

The day you can answer simple questions with data (not theoretical technical talk designed to make all the ppl here oooh and ahhh at your great wisdom) will be the day that I won't have to call you out as a pretender. Just answer the questions.


Turbo 530R. It's good to see that you're making good power. What are the details of this build? Cam? Compression? Piston? Carb? Should I guess that you're running a Web 208????

[Elduner]

Originally posted by sandmanblue
ElDuner - frankly - you don't have a clue do you? You're comparing runs I had that were "BIG BORE" to yours? My 477 wasn't a monster - never said it was. It was a whopping 29cc's bigger. Plus it had a crappy pipe, stock carb, stock intake and a smaller cam (HC2). It was a very mild build... I hope yours puts out more... Question is how much? Why won't you post up the runs? I did. What are you afraid of?

And you've seen my 511 run where? On ONE vid that was taken at 8000 feet - where you've never been - and have no clue about how hard it is to run where the vid was taken because you've never been there? Your long history of hating Venom and making up stories to state your claims says it all. I haven't even run my 511 on a dyno. You have no idea how it runs...... Yet, you dare to tell everyone about it. :rolleyes:

Something you don't have bud, INTEGRITY - go look it up.


Do you know what Integrity means?

Here I searched it for you....

in·teg·ri·ty /ɪnˈtɛgrɪti/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[in-teg-ri-tee] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–noun
1. adherence to MORAL and ethical principles; soundness of moral character; honesty.


Yup I cant stand Mixxed nutts.... Why cause he is a snake!

ohhhh dont you remember you sweat sig back in the days that read something like.... Venom/KBR working there VODOO.... lol thats right.... vodoo is all you got cause your entire build was a joke! not to mention your dealer over the counter pipe! lol

I am who I am and I have never bowed down to no one!

Funny how your mad at Chad cause you say that he gave you bad advise.... If I remember right it had to do with the cam tower rocker arm.... But there you where so smart and all .... What did you do? GO BUY IT!!!! lol Why dont you hate venom for giving you that sloppy port work that dies mid hill? lol

But I dont have a clue?

What do I gain by posting numbers? Are you not programmed to question everything other than Venom? If venom pulls those numbers its fine... cause it was done on a dynojet... but anything else oh that Dyno reads High or that Dyno reads low.... Like KMS Dyno reading low... lol Always an excuse when it comes to your guys builds... So I guess my dyno reads high.... lol

Let me know when your heading out to Glamis and lets line them up and do some comparing.... Now that you have a more radical build than my itty bitty stock bore... I'll make sure to take a camera and beer... what you say? Thanksgiving?


Remember I am who I say I am...... I have ALWAYS stood for what I believed.MORAL

[chad502ex]

Elduner, your awesome but you better "PROVE" it!! LOL!!

nevermind- I know your awesome, nevermind- you think your awesome, you better PROVE IT!

Now, if I didn't know you were awesome, I could either ask your friends for their "facts" about you being AWESOME, or have you PROVE it yourself. But, if you didn't need to prove your AWESOME, i wouldn't be demanding that you PROVE it especially when I know your "references" can validate the PROOF....




Elduner, didn't you know that you owe us all to PROVE yourself by posting your dyno information just for the snakes slither on? LOL!

What is the only thing that will hang out with snakes? other snakes- catch my drift?

where there's snakes, there's venom, where there's venom, there's antivenom,...:D I need to make that my new quote...

[pro-rider46]

chad that sounds like a good idea. lol, antivenom

[TURBO-530R]

Originally posted by sandmanblue

Turbo 530R. It's good to see that you're making good power. What are the details of this build? Cam? Compression? Piston? Carb? Should I guess that you're running a Web 208???? [/B]

I am glad you asked,
This motor was designed and built by Chad back in December 04
It was setup for me to run with my turbo.
It was a 530 with 9 to 1 compression 208 cam Dasa porting as Chad was not doing porting at this time.99mm bore 4mm stroke and I had the DRG tapered bore FCR carb and Dasa pipe. This bike all motor ran 7.4 in the 1/8 mile and mid 11 s in 1/4 mile
I will bring the bike out later this year as I am waiting on turbo part.
Thanks for asking. Jim

[buck naked-r]

Originally posted by TURBO-530R
15-36 matt showed 106 mph on his Dyno when he had it at rousch creek. i run 1/4 mile with it that is why it is geared to fly.

Jim
looks almost alike...i just changed the plastic today...it was red

http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o101/buck450/2006_0103Image0004-1.jpg

http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o101/buck450/2006_0103Image0005.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o101/buck450/2006_0103Image0010.jpg
i run 16/39/37-36///mostly 39 with 18"tires that measure in at 18.5

[chad502ex]

Originally posted by TURBO-530R
I am glad you asked,
This motor was designed and built by Chad back in December 04
It was setup for me to run with my turbo.
It was a 530 with 9 to 1 compression 208 cam Dasa porting as Chad was not doing porting at this time.99mm bore 4mm stroke and I had the DRG tapered bore FCR carb and Dasa pipe. This bike all motor ran 7.4 in the 1/8 mile and mid 11 s in 1/4 mile
I will bring the bike out later this year as I am waiting on turbo part.
Thanks for asking. Jim

I can't wait to see your new turbo run on my new head..

Both you and I were very happy to see my flowbench data on my new ported head I gave you vs your "old" head flowrates.:macho

[sandmanblue]

Originally posted by TURBO-530R
I am glad you asked,
This motor was designed and built by Chad back in December 04
It was setup for me to run with my turbo.
It was a 530 with 9 to 1 compression 208 cam Dasa porting as Chad was not doing porting at this time.99mm bore 4mm stroke and I had the DRG tapered bore FCR carb and Dasa pipe. This bike all motor ran 7.4 in the 1/8 mile and mid 11 s in 1/4 mile
I will bring the bike out later this year as I am waiting on turbo part.
Thanks for asking. Jim


Those are pretty impressive numbers for a 9:1 motor. Thanks for sharing the data. This is the kind of stuff that helps the people in this post that are looking for good info.

Chalk one up for a DASA ported motor that made very impressive power. Credit is due here. If you have data on the DRG head on this same motor, that would be good too.

Now if we can ignore the babblings of those without data and stick to things like this, the people might find some good info in this thread after all....

[sandmanblue]

Originally posted by Elduner
...........

Let me know when your heading out to Glamis and lets line them up and do some comparing.... ......

October 27th and the wknd BEFORE Thanksgiving.


I'll be happy to line up.... But what's this going to prove? Even after I win, what's the point? Bragging rights? That isn't important to me, I'm not in high school anymore (been over 25 years now) - so what do I have to prove? Nothing really. But it will be fun and we'll post the vids. Frankly, it might be a good race, unless you're too drunk or can't ride worth a darn....

You CAN ride, can't you?

[Elduner]

Originally posted by sandmanblue
October 27th and the wknd BEFORE Thanksgiving.


I'll be happy to line up.... But what's this going to prove? Even after I win, what's the point? Bragging rights? That isn't important to me, I'm not in high school anymore (been over 25 years now) - so what do I have to prove? Nothing really. But it will be fun and we'll post the vids. Frankly, it might be a good race, unless you're too drunk or can't ride worth a darn....

You CAN ride, can't you?


Oh I can ride....

there we go... What's it going to prove? What does that mean? My bike is not a dyno queen.... I'm not trying to make excuses already. You talk about all this proof and honesty........ This is where you really find out what you got! not on the dyno and not on a internet forum. Just make sure you get some plugs cause my stock bore with my LOUD dasa pipe :D can get loud when your back there.... lol

I think its gonna be a good race... And I don't drink when I drive... I like to party when im out there but I don't jump on my quad and endanger myself or people around me. So lets just say I can hold my own.

[sandmanblue]

Originally posted by Elduner
Oh I can ride....

there we go... What's it going to prove? What does that mean? My bike is not a dyno queen.... I'm not trying to make excuses already. You talk about all this proof and honesty........

Excuses? Correct me if I'm wrong... 1 - this thread wasn't about my motor versus anyone else. I don't need to boost my ego by building the biggest baddest thing my money can buy. It's for ME - not to impress anyone.... 2 - I'll post any data I have - with no excuses...... 3 - You know very well that with me on it, you have about a 100 lb advantage. You better do well. If you don't, then....... hmmmmmm..... But, that's what the fun will be.... finding out if a 250 lb guy like me on a full weight quad with a motor built by me, and using parts that aren't showcased to be the best in the world, can get up a stupid sand kill faster than a little guy like you with a motor that you claim to be sooo bad.....

I guess we'll find out if you can make it. So what date would you prefer?

[honda4life72]

ok venom doesn't make good power? ever heard of chuckie creech , pro tt racer who is running in the top five with a venom motor makin 56 horse power on a stock bore , i've seen serveral races he has run and the fully built venom motor always runs good , venom is the only compony i will let do any work to my motor . dasa is over rated :rolleyes:

[buck naked-r]

Originally posted by honda4life72
56 horse power on a stock bore , i've seen serveral races he has run and the fully built venom motor always runs good , venom is the only compony i will let do any work to my motor . dasa is over rated :rolleyes: [/B] a stock bore

I DON'T THINK ITS A STOCK BORE......480

and i pulled more power with my backyard build

there is some things and people thats over rated but its not dasa

so fare NO ONE has made the power he has with a stock bore bike

[criminalpoet]

Originally posted by chad502ex
try calling someone whom has a flowbench and can repeat flow from the entire camshaft lift from low lift to high lift, not just hog open a port where the peak torque on the majority of ^^^^ builds starts above 8000 rpm... a porter without a flowbench is like a carpenter without a tape measure- sure the carpenter may be able to build a house, but not the same house dimensionally without the tape measure.....


there are plenty of builders whom own a flowbench that can help you.

good luck.

Listen to this guy! I have been using 1 Dir Racing for years for all of my motor work and they have never given me anything but the best! They have an inhouse flowbench as well as an inhouse dyno. Everything they do is precise and exact and they even warranty their motors.

[honda4life72]

Originally posted by buck naked-r
a stock bore

I DON'T THINK ITS A STOCK BORE......480

and i pulled more power with my backyard build

there is some things and people thats over rated but its not dasa

so fare NO ONE has made the power he has with a stock bore bike no its a stock bore 450r , running 112 gas , go to the org and look in the venom section , he has dyno sheets to prove it , he runs the pro and pro production classes so it has to be a 450 ,

[sandmanblue]

Originally posted by honda4life72
no its a stock bore 450r , running 112 gas , go to the org and look in the venom section , he has dyno sheets to prove it , he runs the pro and pro production classes so it has to be a 450 ,

In addition there buck, the spread of the powerband is very wide on that motor. It's using a relatively mild cam (no Webs for a mixxer motor). If you overlay the power vs rpm of that motor to a lot of the high peak power 450's, you'll see that the high peaks are shorter duration and come on later in the rpm band...

Doesn't somebody here have a sig that says something about making power FIRST....?????

A lot of ppl that simply look at peak numbers are going to miss out on a HUGE part of motor building. If you can make a wide powerband, the motor will be much easier to ride fast. You want the build to be as easy to ride as possible - not peaky like a two stroke.......

[chad502ex]

i popped back into this thread to read more in hopes that ppl could be adding constructive criticism, and found NOTHING more than sandman blabbering ..... typical from him.... just blabber,... nothing from him to ever prove cause he has nothing to test which is why he wants everyone else's data!! I mean why doesn't sandman ever posts technical instead of his opinion? Is that because he really doesn't know how to explain in technical terms?

I have the dyno stored of the Chucky 450R stock bore you are referring of.. I've heard from other racers that he gets blown away too on the straights... its his talent getting him under the top 10 racers, not his engine.. if anything his builder is holding back his potential to be podium racer imo. it doesn't even deserve the time of day posting the lazy venom tq.. this is what i was talking about where mixxers builds are real soft on torque up to 8000 rpm... making a peak 56hp is real easy to do with hogged porting, but his tq #'s fell as a result... overlap that dyno graph on any other stock bore build and what you'll see is lazy venom acceleration up to 8000 rpm....

[Elduner]

Originally posted by sandmanblue
Excuses? Correct me if I'm wrong... 1 - this thread wasn't about my motor versus anyone else. I don't need to boost my ego by building the biggest baddest thing my money can buy. It's for ME - not to impress anyone.... 2 - I'll post any data I have - with no excuses...... 3 - You know very well that with me on it, you have about a 100 lb advantage. You better do well. If you don't, then....... hmmmmmm..... But, that's what the fun will be.... finding out if a 250 lb guy like me on a full weight quad with a motor built by me, and using parts that aren't showcased to be the best in the world, can get up a stupid sand kill faster than a little guy like you with a motor that you claim to be sooo bad.....

I guess we'll find out if you can make it. So what date would you prefer?


I will be at Dumont for Halloween weekend... and then I will come to you at glamis for Thanksgiving.... I don't know the exact dates for glamis.... Not my preferred riding spot.. But if you wish it it will come... lol

And your right this isn't about who has the baddest motor.... But when Venom gets brought out I get disgusted because his work is just a joke/hoke! I have seen a couple venom builds from people that are not in his buddy club and lets just say those machines fall short when it comes to dragging. Look what he did to Blackie.... another person that protected John until John back stabbed him..... Chuck if you only really knew some of the horror stories..... Its sad... Venom is just that Venom that comes from snakes.... John=snake! he Doesn't care who he steps on to get what he wants!

I have only ran Boone porting before my Dasa and the only reason why I ran Boone porting was cause at one point in time I use to think John was true! But now that time has passed the only reason John use to recommend Boone was cause he knew that Boones inexperience only made him JOhn shine.... SAD! IF only people could read people a little better they would know...

Im not here to attack anyone... I wanna race... thats what I do and thats what I have fun doing...

Just so its clear my build is built by me... Dasa has done my porting and such but everything that I have on my machine is cause its what I have tested to work for me... no one has touched my bike other than myself. It's also my back yard special.


So lets race and then go back to camp and have a beer and talk poop... lol

[honda4life72]

Originally posted by chad502ex
i popped back into this thread to read more in hopes that ppl could be adding constructive criticism, and found NOTHING more than sandman blabbering ..... typical from him.... just blabber,... nothing from him to ever prove cause he has nothing to test which is why he wants everyone else's data!! I mean why doesn't sandman ever posts technical instead of his opinion? Is that because he really doesn't know how to explain in technical terms?

I have the dyno stored of the Chucky 450R stock bore you are referring of.. I've heard from other racers that he gets blown away too on the straights... its his talent getting him under the top 10 racers, not his engine.. if anything his builder is holding back his potential to be podium racer imo. it doesn't even deserve the time of day posting the lazy venom tq.. this is what i was talking about where mixxers builds are real soft on torque up to 8000 rpm... making a peak 56hp is real easy to do with hogged porting, but his tq #'s fell as a result... overlap that dyno graph on any other stock bore build and what you'll see is lazy venom acceleration up to 8000 rpm.... ok honestly all you do on here is say how better your stuff is then anyones esles , show me a dyno sheet with one of your builds making 56 horse power on 112 or more , you say crap about builders , u need to back it up

[chad502ex]

Originally posted by honda4life72
you say crap about builders,.........

actually, there is only one builder i say crap about- its mixxer. the others are just trying to make a respectable living doing what they know how to do best..

and do I need to back up my proof? no, I've been doing that for years- see my post count posting technical side of engine dynamics?... if you had any of my builds you wouldn't be asking for proof cause chances are I've already provided it to you. some of my customers were even given the proof they need right after i built the engine. My Pro riders have all the proof too... you and sandman can wave the venom pom-poms all you want, but its ppl like sandman that have ruined the way for others posting the information for others to gain up on.... we'll see mixxer falling flat on his second business attempt shortly after he runs out of things to mimmick with no technical tools in his shop... you keeping playing with snakes sooner or later you'll get poisoned by him. I've seen it with so many of his customers that dump his engine work on eBay to recover lost money...

for the longest time I didn't see the big deal about posting the power obtained... now, I understand why other builders DO NOT post their information... first, posting their Pro build power curve on the internet shows the other racers how much power is needed to win, and second it teaches everyone all the combinations...

I've got two tests that I was going to post that could help the ppl easily and very cheaply make additional power,... the more and more i think about it, the more i've decided to not post the information for ppl like sandman. Instead, I'll offer the information up to every one of my customers for free.

[250r4life]

Originally posted by sandmanblue
Excuses? Correct me if I'm wrong... 1 - this thread wasn't about my motor versus anyone else. I don't need to boost my ego by building the biggest baddest thing my money can buy. It's for ME - not to impress anyone.... 2 - I'll post any data I have - with no excuses...... 3 - You know very well that with me on it, you have about a 100 lb advantage. You better do well. If you don't, then....... hmmmmmm..... But, that's what the fun will be.... finding out if a 250 lb guy like me on a full weight quad with a motor built by me, and using parts that aren't showcased to be the best in the world, can get up a stupid sand kill faster than a little guy like you with a motor that you claim to be sooo bad.....

I guess we'll find out if you can make it. So what date would you prefer?

i find it interesting the sandman backs away from the drag now, when a few months ago he was so pro for it...


Originally posted by sandmanblue
250r4life -

a) the challenge was for your 250R. That IS what we have been discussing, right? Lining them up to run is exactly the best way to end this ridiculous discussion. If it's not your idea of fun, then let's drop it. I still would enjoy the track time and a few starting line drags.




Originally posted by sandmanblue


See you at Glamis - or rather, you'll be seeing my rear end there... Have a nice day ;)


Originally posted by sandmanblue


How about you come out and show me how bad those POS antiques you supposedly own actually run? The two local kiddies can come out to Speedworld. And that other wimp jasn will have to get his mommy to drive him to Glamis. I'll be ther over the 1/20 wknd. And again in Feb and March. If you pukes have what it takes, bring it on!

Put up or shut up little boys.

We'll bring vid cameras and post links to the races right here on this site. I can't wait to embarrass the f out of you.

Do you three have any balls - or is it all just a big show? Can you ride, or do you suck? I think it's the latter.

I'll put my money on every single one of you turning out to be complete puss wannabees that won't show or will make excuses about why they won't/can't meet this challenge.



i am still hoping to get in on these drags with my stock engined- YFZ...

[sandmanblue]

250r4life - let's not start a pattern of dragging up old posts - you've got a few I could use too, but what's the point?

I have not backed down from a race. Matter of fact, I think ElDuner and I have more in common than this thread would lead one to believe. I have no personal beef with him at all. I really hope we can meet up this season - just for grins.

[Elduner]

Originally posted by sandmanblue
250r4life - let's not start a pattern of dragging up old posts - you've got a few I could use too, but what's the point?

I have not backed down from a race. Matter of fact, I think ElDuner and I have more in common than this thread would lead one to believe. I have no personal beef with him at all. I really hope we can meet up this season - just for grins.


I agree about not having beef.... I dont either... Just something about racing big bores that makes me horny I guess... lol


I plan to be at glamis a lot more this season than prior seasons... our riding group has changed a little... so Im sure we are going to bump into each other...

[250r4life]

Originally posted by sandmanblue
250r4life - let's not start a pattern of dragging up old posts - you've got a few I could use too, but what's the point?

I have not backed down from a race. Matter of fact, I think ElDuner and I have more in common than this thread would lead one to believe. I have no personal beef with him at all. I really hope we can meet up this season - just for grins.

you can bring up whatever old post of mine that you like...

i would actually be interested to see what you would go fishing for...

i dont have anything personal against anybody on here(including sandman), and would love to meet up and race the hill with everybody... however, maybe after your latest engine failure you will be a little more hesitant to try and clown on me for grenading my 2nd gear...

[Aceman]

So much hostility in the 450r forum, I knew there was a reason I tried to stay outta here...........

[honda4life72]

Originally posted by chad502ex
actually, there is only one builder i say crap about- its mixxer. the others are just trying to make a respectable living doing what they know how to do best..

and do I need to back up my proof? no, I've been doing that for years- see my post count posting technical side of engine dynamics?... if you had any of my builds you wouldn't be asking for proof cause chances are I've already provided it to you. some of my customers were even given the proof they need right after i built the engine. My Pro riders have all the proof too... you and sandman can wave the venom pom-poms all you want, but its ppl like sandman that have ruined the way for others posting the information for others to gain up on.... we'll see mixxer falling flat on his second business attempt shortly after he runs out of things to mimmick with no technical tools in his shop... you keeping playing with snakes sooner or later you'll get poisoned by him. I've seen it with so many of his customers that dump his engine work on eBay to recover lost money...

for the longest time I didn't see the big deal about posting the power obtained... now, I understand why other builders DO NOT post their information... first, posting their Pro build power curve on the internet shows the other racers how much power is needed to win, and second it teaches everyone all the combinations...

I've got two tests that I was going to post that could help the ppl easily and very cheaply make additional power,... the more and more i think about it, the more i've decided to not post the information for ppl like sandman. Instead, I'll offer the information up to every one of my customers for free. why pick on mixxer all the time , just drop it and let him go his way and you yours , if some don't want u to build there motor but wants mixxer to , let it be , you sound liek you pick on mixxer cuz you can't do the same as he can

[450rJam]

bench racing is gay............................
crap or get off the pot

overlap the dyno runs and post video's of the races but please stop feeding us full of crap, this thread was over when someone
decided to take a jab at venom and turn it to an argument.

there are people out there that climb the lader on achievement
and others who simply try to knock others off the lader

who do you think will climb higher ?

[chris46250r]

Originally posted by 450rJam
bench racing is gay............................
crap or get off the pot

overlap the dyno runs and post video's of the races but please stop feeding us full of crap, this thread was over when someone
decided to take a jab at venom and turn it to an argument.

there are people out there that climb the lader on achievement
and others who simply try to knock others off the lader

who do you think will climb higher ?

I agree 100%. Let me say this first. I dont want or need any motor work done by anyone mentioned in this thread, not because I think they are bad at it, I just dont need any. So with that being said, I'm not on anyones side. Chad you sound like you might know what you are talking about but I'm not nor should anyone else base that on your post count. It should be based on facts such as pictures, dyno runs, statements from your customers, wins, you know, things like that. Now mixxer sounds like he might know just as much. Keep in mind I dont know squat about porting, flowbenches, 13:1 to 14:1, squish, squash and crap like that. So someone like myself, and there are far more like me than those that know all this stuff, is gonna have to pick thier builder based on facts and proven data. Thats all the more reason to post up good usable data and dyno runs and keep posting them until your tired of posting or people say quit posting Chad we get it. But you seem more interested in disproving mixxer than proving yourself. My friend, if you can prove that you are the best, you have already disproved everybody else and didnt have to act like a kid to do it. You say all of your customers know the facts, well what about us potential customers? Or do you have enough customers already and just piss on the rest of us? So, I hope this aint pissed anyone off. But I do hope its got some people thinking.

[chad502ex]

Originally posted by chris46250r
I agree 100%. Let me say this first. I dont want or need any motor work done by anyone mentioned in this thread, not because I think they are bad at it, I just dont need any. So with that being said, I'm not on anyones side. Chad you sound like you might know what you are talking about but I'm not nor should anyone else base that on your post count. It should be based on facts such as pictures, dyno runs, statements from your customers, wins, you know, things like that. Now mixxer sounds like he might know just as much. Keep in mind I dont know squat about porting, flowbenches, 13:1 to 14:1, squish, squash and crap like that. So someone like myself, and there are far more like me than those that know all this stuff, is gonna have to pick thier builder based on facts and proven data. Thats all the more reason to post up good usable data and dyno runs and keep posting them until your tired of posting or people say quit posting Chad we get it. But you seem more interested in disproving mixxer than proving yourself. My friend, if you can prove that you are the best, you have already disproved everybody else and didnt have to act like a kid to do it. You say all of your customers know the facts, well what about us potential customers? Or do you have enough customers already and just piss on the rest of us? So, I hope this aint pissed anyone off. But I do hope its got some people thinking.

you bring some logic to the table here.... I don't disagree with your thoughts.. here are mine...

For me to mention my post count was not to imply that I'm a post slut posting BS, I was implying that for years I've been posting dynos, posting engine build threads, tech talk discussions on strokers, blueprinted crankshafts, piston design, porting, carb boring, flow discussions, ignition 3d programming, volumetric efficiency, thermal efficiencies, camshaft profiling, modeling, knock frequencies, tuning intake/exhaust lengths, pictures, explanation of engine dynamics, helping others, showing designs, and if your post count is high too chances are you've would have read many of my posting over the years...

here's the thing,... many builders do not want to post because there are many that only surf the boards to bash,... I think we all realize that... so instead of proving my worth with dyno proof in public forum (again I provide that to my customers and did that before my company) I prefer to talk about the technical side here for the members to learn... how tired would we all be if I posted dyno run after dyno run of what I could do saying "look at what I can do"? or.... spend available time with the members over the years talking tech talk and building some knowledge base... are you saying you would prefer just dynos saying "I did it" or is it more helpful for the members to be discussing how or what "I was able" to do? I enjoy talking about the technical side of engine dynamics... as with all builders, my customers whom pay are the ones who gets the proof. Before the start of my company, I boasted dyno runs,... been there done that.... If I had a penny for all the members who have taken the time to type a PM to me to say thanks, I'd be rich.. This is what motivates me to continue to talk tech because there are more that learn from it, than the ones like sandman and a few others beating the discussions down.

as for the "piss on the rest of the customers" comment,.... that's not my thoughts,.... I think its obvious that I talk tech so that "customers" whom get ready to spend cash on their engines hopefully has some background information to relate to "a" builders lingo and not be totally oblivious... it wouldn't be very good for a customer to go to a builder and say I have seen a dyno posted on a forum making 60hp- what can you do to get me there?.... I would prefer to educate, so hopefully, during our many forum discussions the "customer" makes the clear decision to use me- if not- so be it, at least they have taken some infomration along from me that will help them dealing with the snakes that only want your cash...

[chris46250r]

Chad I agree with you also. The main thing I want to express is that you or anybody else with good technical information to please post for the rest of us but on the same subject do not down any other builder. If you have comments on other builders do it in another thread if thats what you feel you have to do. In my opinion if you have nine paragraphs of good useful information and one sentence about the negative side of another builder you have said nothing.

[NOS_350x]

Wow can i have that portion of my life back? That was a big waist of time reading all that. All it was is "my bikes faster," "no its not" "prove it" "no you prove it"
Gay if you ask me.

But my question is, Where i live it seems like there is a TON of sparks engines but sparks isnt even mentioned? Is curtis realy not that good or what?

[sandmanblue]

Originally posted by NOS_350x
Wow can i have that portion of my life back? That was a big waist of time reading all that. All it was is "my bikes faster," "no its not" "prove it" "no you prove it"
Gay if you ask me.

But my question is, Where i live it seems like there is a TON of sparks engines but sparks isnt even mentioned? Is curtis realy not that good or what?

I suppose you'd have to find one of those Sparks motors in your area and ask the guy if he has run it on a dyno. I don't doubt that Curtis has made a lot of fast motors. I hope there are ppl here that can show what their Sparks motors have done - rather than just say "it's fast"... which isn't worth a whole lot......

[wppracing]

I can say that my quad is fast as $hit and pulls like a tank
stock bore and stock carb.

Is this what you want to see.........

[GIXXER1KR]

The thing that gets me the most is we all know that not every customer gets the same build.Im sure if i sent my motor to a big name company and spent a ton it still wouldnt compare to there favorite customers or sponsored riders!!!Lets face it we all cant be winners.And the more i read and bashing i see from site to site it makes it harder for me decide who to send my motor too!!!!!!!!!:devil:

[Kilabanshee]

Originally posted by wppracing
I can say that my quad is fast as $hit and pulls like a tank
stock bore and stock carb.

Is this what you want to see.........

Brian thanks for that post haha! :p :D

[250r4life]

its going to be a high of 81 degrees, with a low of 64 next friday in yuma... we're thinking of making a night run and riding till saturday morning... anybody else gunna be there to race the hill?

[sandmanblue]

Originally posted by wppracing
I can say that my quad is fast as $hit and pulls like a tank
stock bore and stock carb.

Is this what you want to see.........

Exactly my point.

Brian has been up front with all his testing. Nothing hidden there. I can't find fault with any data he has provided.

If more people just provided info like this, we wouldn't have any arguing....

Thanks Brian.

[sandmanblue]

Originally posted by 250r4life
its going to be a high of 81 degrees, with a low of 64 next friday in yuma... we're thinking of making a night run and riding till saturday morning... anybody else gunna be there to race the hill?

Huh????

Sep 21

Sunny
94°/69° 10%

Sat
Sep 22

Sunny
97°/71° 0%

That's from Dune Weather (http://www.weather.com/weather/tenday/USCA0126?from=36hr_topnav_undeclared)