400s?

[cr977]

i have a 300 right now, i am going to finish out the season then atempt to move up, my 300 is fine, just not nearly enough power, i realize that you almost have to have a 450 to be competitive any higher than the c class. i am going to race harescrambles, but i am getting more and more interested in mx so that will to happen. my problem is that being 15 and going on 16, i need a bike that is reliable, since i am going to race on a minimum wage job, so if i end up with a bike i cant afford i am out of the hobby. so my question, what would you reccomend, i know the 400ex is the obvious answer, but what about a z400 are they reliable? my problem with the 400ex is that it is air cooled, and an air cooled engine has overheating problems when they get into the higher horsepowers. whereas a z400 or kfx400 can be bored to 440 and had some mods done to it and then it is up to par with a stock- slightly modified 450. a 400ex must have a big bore, pipe, filter, cam, and valves just to keep a 450 in sight, and then the suspension lacks where a kfx or z 400 can be raced with stock suspension. just my thoughts. what about you

[m.h.s.c.#527]

yea i have ridden both and race xc and yesterday i got on a kfx z 400 with just a pipe and it was a nice ride faxt it does sit a little high though

[07250ex]

my buddy has a Z400 it feels weird sounds weird to it was pretty quick though

[yellow400ex05]

Now saying the 400ex needs all that stuff just to keep a 450 in sight is a little bit out of line because a z400 would need equal mods to do so also., A well built 416 could keep up with a stock 450r. Now you wouldn't really have any more heat problems than a z400 if you have it jetted right , but you could get a bigger oil cooler for the 400ex.

I mean yes a built z400 vs a built 400ex the Z would have a little higher horse but not really much to brag about. Plus the after market world for the 400ex is endless and cheaper than it would be for the z400 in some ways. Plus the 400ex has a lower stance and IMO handle and corner better than a z400.

[m.h.s.c.#527]

i agree and the used stuff is out there too and it does hadle well but wih stock shocks im not sure

[Ghost-Rider]

I don't think you would have an overheating problem with the 400EX.

[Pipeless416]

alright, coming from somebody who has both, the z400 would be a much better base to start with unless you cant afford to upgrade the suspension. IMO the ex is leeps and bounds beyond the pre 05' z's in handling when comparing stock to stock. the z just sits too high and feels too soft for my liking. and the z can not be raced on stock suspension anymore than the ex can unless it has the newer shocks on it. however if you're going off of a minimum wage job id assume that you'll either have an 03 or 04?

[cr977]

Originally posted by Pipeless416
alright, coming from somebody who has both, the z400 would be a much better base to start with unless you cant afford to upgrade the suspension. IMO the ex is leeps and bounds beyond the pre 05' z's in handling when comparing stock to stock. the z just sits too high and feels too soft for my liking. and the z can not be raced on stock suspension anymore than the ex can unless it has the newer shocks on it. however if you're going off of a minimum wage job id assume that you'll either have an 03 or 04?

yea i am probably going to get an 03 04 model, i have a budget to get the bike for under 3000 so that makes it obvious a 450 is completly out of the question, i should have traded my rm for a 400 in the beginning, but oh well i didnt. yea it is a tuff decision, they are both great bikes but the z is more advanced, i mean the ex is a great bike but i feel like the z has a better chance against a 450 if it had suspension.

[Villageidiott83]

id sell u a used 06 model kfx if you lived anwhere near md. completely stock.

[jesseweaver]

how big can a 400ex or a z400 go on stock suspension?

[Villageidiott83]

how heavy are you? is it a flat landing? or a better question is how much punishment do you want to take when you land. haha. u can jump them well enough. shock mounts and frame mite take alil bit of a beating tho.

[oldskoolex400]

Originally posted by jesseweaver
how big can a 400ex or a z400 go on stock suspension?

about as far as your 300ex with ohlins....lol and the ohlins are probably gonna be smoother....stock 400ex shocks suck. they are pogo sticks. the newer z400s 05 and up i think? have piggybacks and are comp and rebound adj...they can be rebuilt also. if i was you id want a 400ex if u want reliability. u can upgrade the shocks later...and get a good amount of power out of the motor with minor mods

[cr977]

ok, well i weigh about 125 and i am about 5'5 with boots and growing. a pipe/silencer, and a uni filter with airbox removed, i am probly making 16-18hp is that right? not enough for me, i need around 27-32hp stock. so anyway, i would just like to know, which would be better i will do about 70%trails, 30%mx sand could be a rare possiblility. i think that ratio might become 50 50 or actually more mx than trails so the bike needs to be able to do both well. i also love to jump i dont do anything crazy just usually smaller flat landers

[jesseweaver]

how much would you have to invest in suspension and stuff to be able to do freestyle on a 400ex?

[XXXRACER165]

Probably about 2-3 Grand

[cr977]

Originally posted by cr977
ok, well i weigh about 125 and i am about 5'5 with boots and growing. a pipe/silencer, and a uni filter with airbox removed, i am probly making 16-18hp is that right? not enough for me, i need around 27-32hp stock. so anyway, i would just like to know, which would be better i will do about 70%trails, 30%mx sand could be a rare possiblility. i think that ratio might become 50 50 or actually more mx than trails so the bike needs to be able to do both well. i also love to jump i dont do anything crazy just usually smaller flat landers

anyone?

[oldskoolex400]

Originally posted by cr977
anyone?


what are you asking? lol

[Ghost-Rider]

Originally posted by oldskoolex400
what are you asking? lol

Answer to his first post.

[Mc. Muffin]

Keep in mind that the KFX/Z400 has weak frames.

[cr977]

Originally posted by Mc. Muffin
Keep in mind that the KFX/Z400 has weak frames.

are they known to break bend? what types of riding would do that to them, or is it just random hard wrecks HAVE broken frames.

alright, coming from somebody who has both, the z400 would be a much better base to start with unless you cant afford to upgrade the suspension. IMO the ex is leeps and bounds beyond the pre 05' z's in handling when comparing stock to stock. the z just sits too high and feels too soft for my liking. and the z can not be raced on stock suspension anymore than the ex can unless it has the newer shocks on it. however if you're going off of a minimum wage job id assume that you'll either have an 03 or 04?

if i where to get a z or kfx 400 pre 05, is there a cheaper alternative to elkas? i was thinking mabe there is a 450 with suspension that fits the z or kfx?

and also, i am not doing freestyle, i am doing some mx and alot of harescrambles.

[oldskoolex400]

if your on a budget...just get the 400ex and be done. end of story.

[400exstud]

Originally posted by Mc. Muffin
Keep in mind that the KFX/Z400 has weak frames.

They HAD weak frames. They fixed it on the new ones. It is something to keep in mind if you are looking at an old one, though. Just think to yourself, "Am I really going to ride this thing hard enough to break the frame."

You want 27 - 32 hp? Both machines fit that. Both can be modded to go well above those numbers.

I bought my 400ex for reliability. I have had no problems with it. That was 5 years ago. Nothing mechanical has gone wrong (only the voltage regulator from riding in iron-rich water).

Latey I have been looking at the new 450s. They are pretty sweet but to me reliability it #1. I think that this winter I am going to do a mild 416 build (10.8:1 comp, stage II cam, HD timing chain) just to freshen it up. It should provide just enough power that I won't need a 450. $500 vs $6000 is not a tough call in my mind. Who knows it will probably still be more reliable and trail friendly than a 450.

[cr977]

alright, i see 400exs goin for 1800-2300 all the time in what appears to be really good condition, there is a 440ex with alot of mods the guy wants 2000 for it it is an 01, i would jump on it if i had money, i still have to sell my 300 so i probly wont get a new bike until around october or november if i am goning to get one it is not positive that i will, i still need to convince my parents i need a 400 instead of a 300 they said no way to dirt bike and no way to 450 so i guess 400 is the only option, the 400ex seems like a good bike i think i am going to go for one of those unless i find one heck of a deal on a kfx400

[Bender]

The early Z400's had a non removeable sub frame like the 400EX, the Z400's with the bolt on sub frame are the newer stronger ones. But you can always buy a gusset kit fairly cheap if you get an older frame Z.
Z's are known to be a lot more mod friendly than a 400EX, easier and cheaper to get HP.They rev up a lot faster too. The newer Z's have much better suspention than the early ones and the 400EX.
I'm a Honda guy at heart, but the Z is just a better deal than the EX. I have both.
In the wood's it doesn't really matter though. If you take care of your quad, it'll be reliable no matter wich one you get, Imho.

[Hyperwarrior22]

go with 400ex bulletproof man