what to do to keep up with 450's

[revikan]

I'm gonna tear down my 400ex next winter and rebuild it. I'm wondering what mods you think I should to do to keep up with 450r's and yfz's. Most my friends are gonna have them and Im a supporter of the 400. What big bore kit do you think would be good yet still reliable?

[mod440ex]

the easiest would be to sell it and buy a 450, but if you intent on keeping the 400 go with a 460 or even 500 kit. i had a 440 kit in mine and i could keep up with stock 450. i had just about everything done to mine from filter to pipe and everything in between. i dumped alot of money into mine and i bought a new kfx 450 and put a slipon and efi controller and it would smoke my 440 on track and trails. there is just so much more power to get out of a 450, you maybe able to keep up with stock but more than likekly they wont stay stock forever.

[gcart2]

Originally posted by mod440ex
the easiest would be to sell it and buy a 450.
x2. if u want reliability dont build up a 400 past A 426. BUY A 450.... U CAN FIND A NICE BIKE RACE READY FOR 5G. FOR 3G U CAN FIND A NICE STOCK 1.

[EX LONERIDER]

do a simple 440 kit like the one in my sig... then gear yours down some. it'll pull harder off bottom if thats your main concern. 450's will be quicker but being they are a high rev high output MX type motor, they will wear out faster then your 400. with more power comes more wear and tear.

if blowing the doors off your buddy's bikes is a big deal, go hybrid. ktm sx 525, kawi kx, or honda cr 500 motor... that kinda power is hard to match.

[z400quad]

a 440 kit gives you enough power to keep up with all the 450s while saving you the cash it would cost for a bigger less reliable kit.

[mod440ex]

Originally posted by EX LONERIDER
do a simple 440 kit like the one in my sig... then gear yours down some. it'll pull harder off bottom if thats your main concern. 450's will be quicker but being they are a high rev high output MX type motor, they will wear out faster then your 400. with more power comes more wear and tear.

if blowing the doors off your buddy's bikes is a big deal, go hybrid. ktm sx 525, kawi kx, or honda cr 500 motor... that kinda power is hard to match.


like he said more power means less reialbility. the 450s are built to withstand the extra power they put out. the 400 is going to lose some reliability when you start punching it out, and if you do it the right way(bore and stroke)your are going to be looking at a lot more money.

if you do decide to go with the 440 kit i have an edelbrock de 440 carb off my old ex.

[4everhonda]

I have a 406 that in a all out drag stays neck and neck with a stock yfz 450.... I mean like photo finish!!

[vett_09]

Originally posted by 4everhonda
I have a 406 that in a all out drag stays neck and neck with a stock yfz 450.... I mean like photo finish!!

Umm, no.

[mod440ex]

the rider on the yfz must not be very good, because a yfz should be able to wax you all day long. i got spanked several times by yfzs, and i had a badass 440

[davetheslave]

Yeah, You'll need atleast a 440 with all the good stuff to go with it, just to hopefully keep up with a 450. check my sig, I have all that done, and when I drag with my buddies yfz, I cant get my front tires any further forward than his back tires when racing. You could do it with a 465, or 500. But you might as well just get a 450 if you gonna go in that deep.

[XXXRACER165]

Originally posted by mod440ex
the rider on the yfz must not be very good, because a yfz should be able to wax you all day long. i got spanked several times by yfzs, and i had a badass 440

Hmm thats weird, cause I can SMOKE Piped YFZ's with my 440EX!

[REDRIDDER]

YEAH RIGHT:grr:And my ex will keep up with a stock CBR600RR in a 500ft drag.But if you claim that to be true lets see you race it on video and the YFZ not sand baggin it lol...

[mod440ex]

Originally posted by XXXRACER165
Hmm thats weird, cause I can SMOKE Piped YFZ's with my 440EX!

and like i said the rider must not have been very good.how far did u race

[REDRIDDER]

face it no ex will keep up with a 450 cause if it does the money you spent on to get it their you should of just boughten a 450.Oh and if you can prove it(video) people would probably believe you and myself i would like to see a race between a modded ex verses a stock 450.LETS SEE IT...:p

[mod440ex]

like i said earlier i had an 02 440 w/ 12.5 comp, edelbrock carb, ported polished head, k&n, stage 3 cam, hmf full system, nology hot wire and racing coil. i now have an 08 kfx 450 with slipon and efi controller and the kfx could spank the ex stock so i cant imagine what it would do to now.

[davetheslave]

Ive beaten piped 450's with mine. But the riders were no good. It definatly comes down to the rider. Cause I've won against 1 450, than lost to it when riders where changed.

[XXXRACER165]

W/E guys. I got my dad and two other guys to back it up. We were at the dunes, he even had paddles on. I had my old Razrs on, we drag raced from a rolling start till we topped out. Thats that!

[gcart2]

Originally posted by REDRIDDER
face it no ex will keep up with a 450 cause if it does the money you spent on to get it their you should of just boughten a 450.Oh and if you can prove it(video) people would probably believe you and myself i would like to see a race between a modded ex verses a stock 450.LETS SEE IT...:p

x2.. its just the way it is. u can bore a 400 to a 465 and still it would be a close race. the 450 is a race engine and the 400 is a trail engine.... now for all the ppl who say im wrong... the 400ex was built around what?.... a trail bike. and xxxracer.. u r a horrible liar... first no 1 believes u then u say u had old razrs??? how dumb r u. go put ur head in a hole

[REDRIDDER]

Originally posted by gcart2
x2.. its just the way it is. u can bore a 400 to a 465 and still it would be a close race. the 450 is a race engine and the 400 is a trail engine.... now for all the ppl who say im wrong... the 400ex was built around what?.... a trail bike. and xxxracer.. u r a horrible liar... first no 1 believes u then u say u had old razrs??? how dumb r u. go put ur head in a hole lmfao...^^^^^

[XXXRACER165]

Originally posted by gcart2
x2.. its just the way it is. u can bore a 400 to a 465 and still it would be a close race. the 450 is a race engine and the 400 is a trail engine.... now for all the ppl who say im wrong... the 400ex was built around what?.... a trail bike. and xxxracer.. u r a horrible liar... first no 1 believes u then u say u had old razrs??? how dumb r u. go put ur head in a hole

Why don't you make a little visit to my neighborhood and I'll prove it.

[mod440ex]

its so easy to tell someone that u will wzx them when you know they arent going to show up. lets see how far away are you from him, kinda retarded to have him come all the way there to smoke you.:D

[XXXRACER165]

There won't be any smoking. Just super glue:devil:

[CHEVYZ]

I have the 440 kit with all the works in mine, and I think that it does pretty decent up against most 450s. Depending on the terrain and (more importantly) rider, it can actually just edge out my HRC 450r sometimes. But it isn't necessarily faster, it is just a circumstance type thing.

No matter what you do to the 400EX, the 450 is going to be a faster bike with only a few mods. You can beat them, but I would be willing to bet that their bike would be faster still.

I would say to give up on making your 400EX a money pit and get a 450..but that it just my opinion. If you can't beat 'em, join 'em!

[casey_lamm]

or just be happy you have one of the best trail bikes every built and go have fun on the trails.

I know modding and tweaking is some people forte, but I have a friend that does nothing but gripe about his...if he would stop tinkering with it and go ride he would like it alot more.

Dyno's are great, but getting on them in the woods too me is far better...but he would rather sink 1000 bucks and get his thrill but watching the hp and torque increase on a computer.


Originally posted by CHEVYZ
I have the 440 kit with all the works in mine, and I think that it does pretty decent up against most 450s. Depending on the terrain and (more importantly) rider, it can actually just edge out my HRC 450r sometimes. But it isn't necessarily faster, it is just a circumstance type thing.

No matter what you do to the 400EX, the 450 is going to be a faster bike with only a few mods. You can beat them, but I would be willing to bet that their bike would be faster still.

I would say to give up on making your 400EX a money pit and get a 450..but that it just my opinion. If you can't beat 'em, join 'em!

[casey_lamm]

also there is something said for reliability. I have had my bike for what 3 mths 4 tops...and haven't had any major issues...just stuff im learning about with the bike.

In that amount of time he has gone through head gaskets. Changed the carb 2x, rejetted many times... and never gets any seat time.

WHY?



Originally posted by casey_lamm
or just be happy you have one of the best trail bikes every built and go have fun on the trails.

I know modding and tweaking is some people forte, but I have a friend that does nothing but gripe about his...if he would stop tinkering with it and go ride he would like it alot more.

Dyno's are great, but getting on them in the woods too me is far better...but he would rather sink 1000 bucks and get his thrill but watching the hp and torque increase on a computer.

[Wheelie]

I don't understand why everyone thinks a 450 is untouchable.

My 440 has no problem keeping up with piped 450's. I'm still running the stock carb and only a slip on.

My buddy has a 05'R w/full exhaust, no lid, filter and 1 tooth smaller sprocket on the front. My 440 pulls his 450 in every gear and top speed. Mine is running the the stock 15/38 gearing BTW.

I've raced several 450's and all the results are the same. A 400ex can be made to run, reliably.

My .02.

[mod440ex]

its amazing how there seems to always be someone out there who is just that badass of a rider he could even keep up with funny car in a drag race:D . i had a 440 with just about everything done to it, and the only way i could beat a 450 was if it was all stock, had a crappy rider, and every other ffactoring condition was going my way.

i agree that the 400 is probably one of the best trail bikes out there. dont get me wrong i think that my new ride does just has good, plus i have reverse.

[gcart2]

Originally posted by mod440ex
its amazing how there seems to always be someone out there who is just that badass of a rider he could even keep up with funny car in a drag race:D . i had a 440 with just about everything done to it, and the only way i could beat a 450 was if it was all stock, had a crappy rider, and every other ffactoring condition was going my way.

i agree that the 400 is probably one of the best trail bikes out there. dont get me wrong i think that my new ride does just has good, plus i have reverse.

x2. 400's are great.. they are fast fun barely any maintenance.. be happy or get a 450.

[mod440ex]

Originally posted by XXXRACER165
There won't be any smoking. Just super glue:devil:


ummm.... what?

[H_W]

Originally posted by Wheelie
I don't understand why everyone thinks a 450 is untouchable.

My 440 has no problem keeping up with piped 450's. I'm still running the stock carb and only a slip on.

My buddy has a 05'R w/full exhaust, no lid, filter and 1 tooth smaller sprocket on the front. My 440 pulls his 450 in every gear and top speed. Mine is running the the stock 15/38 gearing BTW.

I've raced several 450's and all the results are the same. A 400ex can be made to run, reliably.

My .02.

Let me just say that if your 440 with the stock carb and a slip on can keep up with piped 450's, take that thing to a museum as it is a one of a kind. I agree that a 400ex can be made to run reliably, but it will need to at least have a full exhaust to even think about keeping up with a piped 450. If your 440 is pulling your buddy's 450 in every gear, then his jetting is all screwed up or you are the best darn drag racer to ever live.

[XXXRACER165]

Meaning I'll stick right to his side the whole time we drag race

[REDRIDDER]

why dont you just shut everyone up and make a frigin video of you drag racing a 450r with out the 450r sand baggin it lol....."Originally posted by mod440ex
its amazing how there seems to always be someone out there who is just that badass of a rider he could even keep up with funny car in a drag race . i had a 440 with just about everything done to it, and the only way i could beat a 450 was if it was all stock, had a crappy rider, and every other ffactoring condition was going my way.

i agree that the 400 is probably one of the best trail bikes out there. dont get me wrong i think that my new ride does just has good, plus i have reverse. " I musy agree untill xxxRACER165 proves us all wrong.

[mod440ex]

thank you. like i said the 400 is a good bike but there are so many better and faster bikes out there

[1965 honda]

i race against 450rs all the time, i get beat alot but its only by half a quad. (3 ft max) i dont think 3ft is getting smoked. 1/8 mile drag by the way. i dont think any 450 is worth the hype some of you give it. 10% quad / 90% rider:huh

[casey_lamm]

Just so yall know...I raced a yzf 450 this morning and blew his nerfs off! :) Had him in all gears and at the finish (approx 1/8 mile field) He was behind by 3 seconds.


oh did I forget to mention he stalled it at the start :)

[400exrapes]

sometimes i see dyno charts and articles where a 440 produces maz 40.1 horsepower with eldebrock carb and the 450s are at 39? i think if there was a high compression 450cc kit for the 400ex that it would bejust liek all the 450's

[mod440ex]

Originally posted by 400exrapes
sometimes i see dyno charts and articles where a 440 produces maz 40.1 horsepower with eldebrock carb and the 450s are at 39? i think if there was a high compression 450cc kit for the 400ex that it would bejust liek all the 450's

well its not, a 450 is a race motor meant to rev up high and make power the entire way.

[mod440ex]

Originally posted by 1965 honda
i race against 450rs all the time, i get beat alot but its only by half a quad. (3 ft max) i dont think 3ft is getting smoked. 1/8 mile drag by the way. i dont think any 450 is worth the hype some of you give it. 10% quad / 90% rider:huh


there is only so much a rider can do. i agree if u have a crappy rider on a 450 and a great rider on the 400 it will probably win, but if what you saying is true a pro on a 250x could outrun a 450????:ermm:

[1965 honda]

Originally posted by mod440ex
there is only so much a rider can do. i agree if u have a crappy rider on a 450 and a great rider on the 400 it will probably win, but if what you saying is true a pro on a 250x could outrun a 450????:ermm:
im pretty sure you dont know me well enough to judge me.
i ride very well just to let you know. i also am able to keep up with 450 quads in the trails and up the hills on a 400. i didn't need to compensate by buying a faster quad. maybe if i raced i would have diffrent opinion. but 70 mhp is fast enough in the trails for me.:p

[mod440ex]

i agree that a good rider on a 400 can keep up with a 450 in the woods, but im pretty sure you havent hit 70 in the woods

[1965 honda]

Originally posted by mod440ex
i agree that a good rider on a 400 can keep up with a 450 in the woods, but im pretty sure you havent hit 70 in the woods
your 100% right thats why i dont see the point of a 450 in the woods.:eek2:

[casey_lamm]

which is why i got a 400...all i do is ride logging trails and stuff.


Originally posted by 1965 honda
your 100% right thats why i dont see the point of a 450 in the woods.:eek2:

[yamahamx14]

If you want to beat 450's then just become a better rider. In anything other then a drag race success is 90% rider. Put a pro on a 300ex and a beginner on a 450, and the pro will still come out on top. I mean I've beaten stock 450's with my stock 400 on an mx track before only because it comes down to how you ride the quad. Don't get me wrong anything other then a track or tight trails, I would have gotten killed on my 400. If you are going to rebuild your 400ex to keep up with 450s then I would suggest doing a 440 stroker kit, mild porting, new cams, and a nice full exhaust system, and while your in there you might as well replace the valve train, too. Also, make sure you got some real good suspension on it.

[jaspurx]

You guys crack me up ( some of you ) this argument is as old as the 450`s are.

To whom it may concern: if the ex`s can truly compete with the 450`s , then why did all the major manufacturers build 450`s? Some may say to make more money. Of course , the factories SPENT a lot of un-necessary money to build 450`s in that case?

They built 450`s because racers wanted quads that are faster than 400`s , and the manufacturers had to build a quad that would finally unseat the 250R from the kings throne!

Look , the 400`s are good quads , I still ride and race mine. But there is a reason the 450`s were built. The consumer wanted a new breed of race quads.
Sure Doug Gust can take a modified 400 and beat 450`s , oh yeah , that does not count because it was a 450 when they were done modifying it. And Doug Gust also went to a 450.....ummmm..why?
Just put 3 brain cells to work and it can be figured out!

Do you stop along the road with a baseball bat to to beat up on road kill? I ask because this debate is already a dead subject , and yet people bring it back to life , just to beat it dead again!

[mod440ex]

very nicely put

[REDRIDDER]

MAN i wish my ex would keep up with a 450r lol...the R is a racer the ex is a fast trail quad.Were are all vidoes on the exs beating a 450r lol...im not convinced yet.

[Wheelie]

My next trip to the sand, I'll see if I can get one of my friends to take some footage.

[400exrapes]

well if the 400ex cant beat a 450 then its time to whip out the ILL crf250r to spank it

[Honda4lyphe]

Wow, some of this is like saying "My cabbage patch kid can take chuck norris!!!"

Guys you gotta face it, it it was the equal rider on a 440 vs a 450r the 450r would pull away everytime, the 440 would give a great run but from the statistics it just isnt happening.

[Acid Motorsport]

I can Beat 450's easy.

FIRST : My ex is a 500 from FST

SECOND : In a MX race it's 70% rider 30% machine, in a drag race it's 20% rider 80% machine.

[mod440ex]

yours may be the one exception i actually believe.