Dual Exhaust vs HMF PLZZZ HELP!!!!

[mattg324]

ok so i am getting a new exhaust and i am looking at the HMF Bill Balance Pro series Carbon Fiber, i tihnk u get it. but yes either that or this dual exhaust. the dual exhaust gives 6-6.5 HP increse. i want to know if the HMF BIll Balance will have more horse than that. i would love to have a dual but i want power not looks. please help!!

[EX LONERIDER]

ok, look at it this way. between the CF pipe and the duals.... wich is gonna be seriously lighter? keep in mind weight free's up HP. if the CF pipe weighs close to nothing and the duals weigh 5 lbs more.... the 0.5 HP you would have gained from the duals now goes to push that weight. ( numbers used as an example)

[almostred434]

i agree with lonerider but i have the HMF sport series and i can vouch that i gained a very very noticable difference from it but i think the duals look good but CF in my opinion is so much nicer looking

[Ace Sixx]

Dual exhaust on a single-cylinder engine makes as much sense as wiping before you poop.

[EX LONERIDER]

haha, both previous points well validated.

as you stated however, you are going for power and not looks.... the answer in this point to your question would be the CF pipe.

[mattg324]

ahahaahahhahahhahaha lmfao you got a point everyone. thanks especically to lonerider. i see what your saying. does anyone know how much horse is in the HMF BB CFS?

[400ex_rider13]

Originally posted by Ace Sixx
Dual exhaust on a single-cylinder engine makes as much sense as wiping before you poop.

Hahahahaha, that's so funny. It has to be put in someones's sign lol So I put it in mine.

[gpd005]

I bought a 400ex a couple years ago that had the LTE duals on it and it was cool. It looks good but I sold them and got an HMF sport and it made just as much power and cost a whole lot less! Here's a picture of the old 416!
http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d131/gpd005/quad.jpg

[Chin_Chilla]

Originally posted by Ace Sixx
Dual exhaust on a single-cylinder engine makes as much sense as wiping before you poop. I don't think you have a clue on what you are talking about... read this thread...

http://www.exriders.com/vbb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=304031

Duals making more power than a single... Can't beat looks AND performance...

EDIT: It may be a different quad... but it's SINGLE CYLINDER...

[400ex_rider13]

Originally posted by Chin_Chilla
I don't think you have a clue on what you are talking about... read this thread...

http://www.exriders.com/vbb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=304031

Duals making more power than a single... Can't beat looks AND performance...

EDIT: It may be a different quad... but it's SINGLE CYLINDER...

WOW!! 0.31 more power than the single, I'm so impressed. Honestly I would never put duels on any quad, other than quads that are already duel. Seriously, I could buy a full Sparks for the same or less amount of money, and probably gain alot more power.

$0.02

[EX LONERIDER]

yea.... .32 HP is gonna make up for that extra tubing i guess. :rolleyes: either way, its personal reference. i will admit, they do look trick but its more on the asthetical end of it rather then performance.

to validate the point of duals on a single cylinder tho, KTM runs duals on some of their 640's tho its more an issue of balancing out the bike and letting that 12:1 compression and 4 huge *** valves flow. so yea.... for that application its valid.

as for the 400ex... its unnecessary.

[JOEX]

IMO there's very little real noticable power difference between most aftermarket pipes until you get into fine tuning a machine which means more than finding the right jet. It's about combining ALL the right components and machining for a specific type of riding style.

I also agree that the LTE's are more for looks and being a little different which is what alot of people say they what their quads to be.

What do you all think about the $50 billet gas caps?

[EX LONERIDER]

Originally posted by JOEX


I also agree that the LTE's are more for looks and being a little different which is what alot of people say they what their quads to be.

What do you all think about the $50 billet gas caps?

:macho yup

[Ace Sixx]

Originally posted by Chin_Chilla
I don't think you have a clue on what you are talking about... read this thread...

http://www.exriders.com/vbb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=304031

Duals making more power than a single... Can't beat looks AND performance...

EDIT: It may be a different quad... but it's SINGLE CYLINDER...

So running a dual exhaust over a single exhaust gained a paltry .31 horsepower. That's quite impressive.

Now let me ask you this: Have you heard the saying "Less weight=more power"? I'm sure you probably have, but lets break it down a little bit.

I don't know if the 450 used in the dyno tests was an R or an ER, but for the sake of this argument, we will go with the lighter R model. Let's say that with the single exhaust, the quad weighs in at Honda's claimed dry weight of 357 pounds. Of course you can't run a quad with no oil, coolant (in this case) or gas, so let's add a full tank of gas at around 6 pounds a gallon (depending on the grade). We are now up to 375 pounds. Add 1.4 quarts of oil @ ~ .87 grams per mL and that's ~ 2.5 pounds of oil. We are now up to ~ 377.5 pounds.

Now lets talk about coolant. I'm not familiar with the 450R at all, but I saw on this forum somewhere that its radiator holds ~ half a gallon of coolant, so I'll just use that number. Water alone weighs 8.33 pounds per gallon, so we'll just divide that by two to get just over four pounds, which will suffice here. That brings the total weight of the quad up to ~ 381.5 pounds.

Of course someone will have to be on the thing to operate it. What does the average adult male weigh? According to the National Center for Health Statistics, the average weight for an adult male in the United States is 189.8 pounds. I'll just round it up to 190. That gives us a total weight of machine and rider at 571.5 pounds.

So, the dyno chart for the single exhaust maxed out at 40.81 HP. Divide 40.81 by 571.5 and you get a HP to weight ratio of 0.07141:1.

Now we'll add the other exhaust. What do you think that can and header pipe weighs? Beats me. Sparks Racing claims their full system weighs 6.5 pounds so lets go with that. Now we have a machine and rider that weighs 578 pounds, but we are now pumping out a whopping .31 more ponies, bringing the new HP total to 41.12. Divide 41.12 by 578 and our new HP to weight ratio is--what's this?--0.07114:1. Well what do you know? It went DOWN.

Granted, there is not hardly any difference there, but there was NOT an overall performance gain by adding the second cannister--it is actually a detriment when you run the numbers. I think that your "between the legs" testing meter must be all in your head.

I stand by my original statement and will be happy to retract it should I be proven wrong.

[TYayo420]

ooooh boy 3 poounds more for a second exhaust...oh boy really slowing him down, especially if its a trail rider, ppl are so dfamn picky about weight...did ya know, a lil more weight over the tires, helps gain tracion, especially in a holeshot, less spinning...man 3 poounds lets throw a fit over it lol

[Ace Sixx]

Originally posted by TYayo420
ooooh boy 3 poounds more for a second exhaust...oh boy really slowing him down, especially if its a trail rider, ppl are so dfamn picky about weight...did ya know, a lil more weight over the tires, helps gain tracion, especially in a holeshot, less spinning...man 3 poounds lets throw a fit over it lol

Yeah, I'm sure that is why all the top racers are running a dual exhaust setup. :rolleyes: If they were the cat's ***** everyone would be selling them and/or running them on their machine.

If you like how they look, then by all means blow your money on a setup.

BTW, 3 pounds? Get real.

[EX LONERIDER]

hey ace, you make a very good stat and more then accurate enough point. i wont argue that. i think the point of this question originally was aimed at the "more bang for the buck" ideal.

given whatever the stats come out to, "ideally" the single is a better choice over the duals.

on the other hand, ace makes a very hard to beat argument over the power to weight ratio and stats of the power gains. :D

[Ace Sixx]

Well, perhaps my original comment was uncalled for. I just don't believe that there is any point to having a dual exhaust on a single cylinder machine.

People like things that look cool, though, and we all have different tastes. Me? I prefer that whatever I bolt onto my machine to actually have a purpose or some type of advantage over the piece it replaced. A lot of times both form and function can be improved with a single part.

The original poster obviously wanted a performance advantage. In this case he should opt for a single exhaust.

[mattg324]

i am very impressed with your insight actually Ace. thanks. i do understand what your tlaking about, dual does look cool but ur freinds wont see it if u cant pass them. jsut the BB will be better anyway. i think around 200-300 dollars less too so ill be good with keeping that extra money on other things i need. thanks everyone, i appreciate it.

[krt400ex]

Originally posted by Ace Sixx
Dual exhaust on a single-cylinder engine makes as much sense as wiping before you poop.


but its not a single pipe into 2. the ex has dual exhaust ports and dual pipes that convert into one.

[EX LONERIDER]

Originally posted by Ace Sixx
I prefer that whatever I bolt onto my machine to actually have a purpose or some type of advantage over the piece it replaced. A lot of times both form and function can be improved with a single part.

The original poster obviously wanted a performance advantage. In this case he should opt for a single exhaust.

so very true. function over form. anymore, alot of "upgrade" parts are really no more of a performance gain over what you have and because of the blinggy effect of some parts, they are sold based on how good they look. i also prefer function over form tho some nice form never hurt.

[TYayo420]

thats what im saying theres 2 exhaust ports, so 2 exhaust pipes will not be bad, itd in turn be good if not better, but some ppl have there mind set on something and can see it anyway but there own.

[mattg324]

no what woudl be sick, putting lights around the bottom of ur quad hahah. jsut like accent color.

[krt400ex]

Originally posted by mattg324
no what woudl be sick, putting lights around the bottom of ur quad hahah. jsut like accent color.


wouldn't last very long though with the dirt, rocks and mud

[Kaleigh]

I heard the duals make alot less db's then single and make about the same amount of power..