Cha Cha Cha Chino's Rebuild Part Deux

[Chino886]

Well, I am going to "officially" start the rebuild process today!

I am going to hunker down and try to get it down by the Monday (hoping that I have all of the parts)!

I am going to document what all I do, so if I make a mistake someone (Chad502ex) will see it and slap me in the back of the head and correct me!

I looked in the garage the other day and I have changed out so many parts this may take me a month.

Part Uno: http://www.exriders.com/vbb/showthread.php?threadid=284862

Wish me luck! ;)

[400exrider707]

good luck, cant wait to see it back in once piece again!:cool:

[Chino886]

That makes 2 of us! ;)

[Chino886]

Got the bearing in the cases today until I got halted to find out that I could not get the balancer shaft needle bearing out so I had to bite the bullet and order a new one. I also found out that the dealer ordered me a 05 oil pump driven gear when the rest of my $700 order was for an 06 so that had to be ordered also.

On a positive note, I got some PC work done by a good buddy of mine, turned out awesome, so I had to put my arms and shocks back on it.

A-arms before (bare)
http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00295.jpg

PEP springs before
http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00329.jpg

A-arms and PEPs back on the bike now, also switching from 06 hubs spindles, to 04/05 hubs and spindles.
http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00343.jpg

That's all for today's chapter of........."I don't know what the hell I am doing!" Stay tuned for more real soon! :devil:

[xsr_racing28c]

That front end looks sick!! Man whoever did those springs is the man....;)

[taino_racing]

good luck

[tar]

This ought to be good!!

[Chino886]

Originally posted by tar
This ought to be good!!

Hopefully I will be able to keep this interesting/amusing for all!

I hope that some will learn and some will laugh at my trials and tribulations in the rebuild process.

I should be able to have some updated pics tonight!

Still on the list for completion are:

Suspension
Motor
Seat Cover
Steering stem
Rear Hipers


I am going to tackle the seat cover and steering stem (brakelines, levers, and all that good stuff) tonight!

[TWISTED DINLI]

good luck. its lookin good so far.

[speedfreaksguy]

You better hurry up Chino. Ridin season is here....

[Chino886]

Yeah, Speedfreak, I hear ya!

I just want to make sure all the crankcase bearings are all in the right places! I heard that helps.......:p

[400exrider707]

Originally posted by Chino886
Yeah, Speedfreak, I hear ya!

I just want to make sure all the crankcase bearings are all in the right places! I heard that helps.......:p

Nope just a myth:devil:

[Honda#4]

Keep it comin Dave, love the PC job.

[Chino886]

Well, cha cha chino learned a valuable lesson in motor building on Tuesday, what comes out of the cases must go back in..........but take note where it came from ;) !

I got all the bearings out of the old cases about a week ago, found out I crushed some bearings and seals in the process so I had to order more. They came in, I go in the garage and totally forgot which hole, which bearing came out of:huh , so I tried to figure it out with the manual:eek:, no luck, so then I just went off of my ever aging memory.

So here is what I did, someone (chad502ex or Colby) or anyone for that matter, please let me know if a bearing is in the wrong place.

:chinese:

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00350.jpg

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00349.jpg

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00348.jpg

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00347.jpg

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00346.jpg











Oh, and 1 minor side note..........where the heck does this bearing go?:confused:

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00351.jpg

[coryatver]

my guess is its the steering stem bearing?

[Chino886]

Originally posted by coryatver
my guess is its the steering stem bearing?

You know what, you may be right, I sold the stem a while ago and did not check to see if the bearing fell out in to my stack of crap. Will check and update! :eek2:

[chad502ex]

interesting enough is that HONDA reversed the crank bearings where on the 04/05 years the load roller bearing is on the load side (but now requires a retrofit crankshaft collar), and the 06/07 had the radial bearing now installed on the clutch side....

[Chino886]

Originally posted by chad502ex
interesting enough is that HONDA reversed the crank bearings where on the 04/05 years the load roller bearing is on the load side (but now requires a retrofit crankshaft collar), and the 06/07 had the radial bearing now installed on the clutch side....

So are you saying I did something wrong :confused: :confused:

[chad502ex]

Originally posted by Chino886
So are you saying I did something wrong :confused: :confused:

I does not "APPEAR" that you had- just FYI.

[Chino886]

Originally posted by chad502ex
I does not "APPEAR" that you had- just FYI.

wheeeewwwwww.........good, you had me ready to shat myself! :eek2: :p :cool: :D

[400exrider707]

Originally posted by chad502ex
interesting enough is that HONDA reversed the crank bearings where on the 04/05 years the load roller bearing is on the load side (but now requires a retrofit crankshaft collar), and the 06/07 had the radial bearing now installed on the clutch side....

I believe the CRF motors are the same as the 06+ TRX's with the radial bearing on the clutch side. Did they originally switch it over to compensate for the extra load caused by two atv tires instead of a single dirtbike tire? Im assuming they switched them back once they figured out that the bearings were not holding up?

Could you put load bearings on both sides? Would there be a benefit/downfall to this?

[chad502ex]

Originally posted by 400exrider707
I believe the CRF motors are the same as the 06+ TRX's with the radial bearing on the clutch side. Did they originally switch it over to compensate for the extra load caused by two atv tires instead of a single dirtbike tire? Im assuming they switched them back once they figured out that the bearings were not holding up?

Could you put load bearings on both sides? Would there be a benefit/downfall to this?

your on track,.... the thought was that the increased load from the ATV would require a beafier bearing to distribute the loads across the roller surface created from extra rotating mass and traction to the ground load increase. One catch to using rollers on the load side is that these bearing are inherently sloppier and contain more side to side wiggle to them.

Doubt they switched them back on the new generation engines for durability reasoning, but more of an ease of manufacturing since they the setup already exists on crf engines...

[thump4863]

Originally posted by coryatver
my guess is its the steering stem bearing?

Thats what it looks like to me also. I just put a new one in when I rebuilt mine and it looked identical.

[400exrider707]

Originally posted by chad502ex
your on track,.... the thought was that the increased load from the ATV would require a beafier bearing to distribute the loads across the roller surface created from extra rotating mass and traction to the ground load increase. One catch to using rollers on the load side is that these bearing are inherently sloppier and contain more side to side wiggle to them.

Doubt they switched them back on the new generation engines for durability reasoning, but more of an ease of manufacturing since they the setup already exists on crf engines...

ahh ok. I have a few more thoughts, but we'll save it for another thread, dont want to hijack this one

Dave - Did you get a chance to see if the seat cover is going to work out for you or not? Your bike is going to look sweet after its completed. That front end is awesome.

[Chino886]

Originally posted by 400exrider707
ahh ok. I have a few more thoughts, but we'll save it for another thread, dont want to hijack this one

Dave - Did you get a chance to see if the seat cover is going to work out for you or not? Your bike is going to look sweet after its completed. That front end is awesome.

Post away in here................that way it is a one-stop shop for tech info (more from Chad than me)!

I will get that seat cover working tonight/tomorrow, one of my top priorities for the weekend.

Still waiting for a piston jet! :rolleyes:

[400exrider707]

Originally posted by Chino886
Post away in here................that way it is a one-stop shop for tech info (more from Chad than me)!

I will get that seat cover working tonight/tomorrow, one of my top priorities for the weekend.

Still waiting for a piston jet! :rolleyes:

Cool, no rush, let me know how you make out with it. The guy I bought it off of is being really understanding about it. Ill PM you sometime this weekend and talk to you about it.;)

[Chino886]

Originally posted by 400exrider707
Cool, no rush, let me know how you make out with it. The guy I bought it off of is being really understanding about it. Ill PM you sometime this weekend and talk to you about it.;)

sounds good!

[Chino886]

Motor is about 50% back together........ordered a new part Saturday for it!:devil:

I will update with pics and info later tonight!

Should be "brap, brap, brap" by this weekend! :p

[Chino886]

Wow, what a day!

Woke up around 8 AM, grabbed a cup o' joe and headed to the garage!

Everything went great today, I started off with a good mind set and everything just flowed.

I did not run into any kinks so that was good! I made a lot of progress and I can't wait till this weekend to finish up my project build. It has been down since Feb 17th, so 2 1/2 mos is plenty long. There is nothing like going into your garage and building your own motor from scratch. Kind of makes you want to beat your chest and hold you head high (as long as she runs), I am feeling really good about the build and I can't wait to finish it up. I decided to go with a different piston, so now I have 3 pistons that I am not going to use. I feel like J :lol:!

I got the stem in and the suspension all installed. The axle should be going in tomorrow. I still need to make adjustments to the front end as well. I need to install the front/rear brakelines too! I need to get a rolling chassis so I can take it out and give it a bath before I throw the power plant back in.

Well without further ado!
http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00366.jpg

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00365.jpg

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00364.jpg

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00363.jpg

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00362.jpg

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00361.jpg

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00360.jpg

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00359.jpg

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00358.jpg

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00357.jpg

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00355.jpg

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00354.jpg

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00353.jpg

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00352.jpg

And can someone tell me WTF this is:confused:

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00368.jpg

[chad502ex]

keep at it chino...

[Chino886]

Thanks Chad!

Do you know what the long rod in the bottom picture is?

[chad502ex]

Originally posted by Chino886
Thanks Chad!

Do you know what the long rod in the bottom picture is?

yup, its the clutch pressure plate push rod.

[Chino886]

Thanks!

Now I can push forward!

I just don't want to go on without knowing what something is and then find out I have to back up 5 steps!

[#8red]

D Damn Chino , now yer' a mech. also ??? good job buddy , nothin' like wrenchin' on yer' own .....and then riding it , knowin' it's done right !!! glad to see yer' dooin' good over there man

[Chino886]

Originally posted by #8red
D Damn Chino , now yer' a mech. also ??? good job buddy , nothin' like wrenchin' on yer' own .....and then riding it , knowin' it's done right !!! glad to see yer' dooin' good over there man

Thanks Bart, how you been doing?

[taino_racing]

chino, that looks great ,should feel proud of the autobuild up ha,ha. good luck,jr

[Chino886]

Originally posted by taino_racing
chino, that looks great ,should feel proud of the autobuild up ha,ha. good luck,jr

JR,

Thanks buddy!

I am really proud of myself, now I am just waiting for my piston to show up!:devil:

How you been? How's your 450R running?

[taino_racing]

great, working on my wifes 250ex now ,thanks for pics. by the way how does that bead buster work? saw it on one of ur pics. saw one at northern tool thought about buy one.

[Chino886]

Originally posted by taino_racing
great, working on my wifes 250ex now ,thanks for pics. by the way how does that bead buster work? saw it on one of ur pics. saw one at northern tool thought about buy one.

LOL! I will have to watch out what I show when I take pics from now on! Just kidding! It was the best $20 I ever spent, even took tires off of OEM rims in 10 mins from start to finish.

More pics coming soon!

[Chino886]

If everything goes as planned, I should be breaking it in this weekend, my piston is ready to be picked up.

[xsr_racing28c]

Me too!! I think I finally might have time to get my 450r out and ride it for once. All I need to do is re-mount some mx tires and cut a chain for it.

On the bright side, the YFZ is almost together also, so Dave, you and I may be getting our quads together right at the same time.. Only thing is mine has been apart for about 5 months longer..hehe

~Jay:devil:

[Chino886]

I'm about to throw the motor and the street and shoot it.
Got everything installed in the frame and when i went to put the front sprocket on and tightened it, it would not spin freely in Neutral.....

GRRRRRRR:grr:

[chad502ex]

Originally posted by Chino886
I'm about to throw the motor and the street and shoot it.
Got everything installed in the frame and when i went to put the front sprocket on and tightened it, it would not spin freely in Neutral.....

GRRRRRRR:grr:

bummer chino. that kinda sucks.... you'll havta split the center cases back open.

[Chino886]

Originally posted by chad502ex
bummer chino. that kinda sucks.... you'll havta split the center cases back open.

well that sucks, I have not even filled it with fluids and now I have to buy new gaskets already.............Grrrrrrrrrrr

Chad, what do you think it is?

[400exrider707]

Originally posted by Chino886
well that sucks, I have not even filled it with fluids and now I have to buy new gaskets already.............Grrrrrrrrrrr

Chad, what do you think it is?

Your case gaskets should still be usable....

It's hard to say without seeing it/feeling it though. I would start by checking out the clutch side, though I doubt thats it, it is just a lot easier to look at than splitting the cases.

[chad502ex]

could be the shift fork drum improper alignment with the dogs on the forks, or your tranny pack is not installed correctly.

good luck.

[400exrider707]

Dave, I notice on the org you posted that the shaft indeed does spin freely without the sprocket on it, but once you put the sprocket on, it doesn't?

[chad502ex]

Originally posted by 400exrider707
Dave, I notice on the org you posted that the shaft indeed does spin freely without the sprocket on it, but once you put the sprocket on, it doesn't?

what? are you kidd'n? chino is pulling one up on ATVRIDERS.com by malinforming us? LOL!

[400exrider707]

Originally posted by chad502ex
what? are you kidd'n? chino is pulling one up on ATVRIDERS.com by malinforming us? LOL!

Maybe he was just embarassed to post such information where all could see... hahaha. I dont go on the org but once a month if that, and I rarely post, but I did happen to catch that tid bit of info. I dont know if it means anything or not. How embarassing would this be if it was in gear while he was trying to spin it? Are you sure you're in neutral dave?:p

[Chino886]

No, no, no, fellas, it was in neutral. When the sprocket is off, it spins freely with 2 fingers. When the sprocket is on and tightened up, it will not move without significant force.

No embarassment here, just frustration. Sorry if I left out that minor detail. But I will be going back in to the motor I know that for sure!

[Sjorge450R]

Originally posted by Chino886
No, no, no, fellas, it was in neutral. When the sprocket is off, it spins freely with 2 fingers. When the sprocket is on and tightened up, it will not move without significant force.

No embarassment here, just frustration. Sorry if I left out that minor detail. But I will be going back in to the motor I know that for sure!

you got oil in there?? My 300 wouldnt spin the shaft until I had oil in there.

[tar]

Originally posted by Sjorge300EX
you got oil in there?? My 300 wouldnt spin the shaft until I had oil in there.

I would deffinately try that instead of tearing your motor apart again!!

[400exrider707]

Dave, before you tear into that thing, there is something odd going on. How on earth will it spin freely with the sprocket off, but as soon as you put on the sprocket and tighten it down, nothing.... something doesn't make sense here... :chinese:

[Chino886]

Originally posted by 400exrider707
Dave, before you tear into that thing, there is something odd going on. How on earth will it spin freely with the sprocket off, but as soon as you put on the sprocket and tighten it down, nothing.... something doesn't make sense here... :chinese:

I don't know, that why I am am perplexed.

It seems as though when I tighten it down that it pulls the shaft too tight on the wall or some chit, not allowing it to spin when the sprocket is on.

Well, I am going to work on my buddy's YFZ and then tear my motor apart. I am hosting my little sister's grad party this weekend so the chances of me having time to mess with my motor is slight to none.........:mad:

I am going to tear it apart as I am second guessing my work now.

I don't want to start break in and hear a clunk clunk sound.

[Honda#4]

Is there any play with the shaft if you push and pull on it just with your hand and not the sprocket.

Maybe you tightened the sprocket bolts to much?

[chad502ex]

putting a sprocket on causes that?


only thing that comes to mind is that the tranny pack thrust washers wasn't installed correctly causing the sprocket to pull the countershaft outward thereby binding it towards the left side centercase... it's difficult without witnessing the problem first hand.


good luck.

[Chino886]

Originally posted by chad502ex
putting a sprocket on causes that?


only thing that comes to mind is that the tranny pack thrust washers wasn't installed correctly causing the sprocket to pull the countershaft outward thereby binding it towards the left side centercase... it's difficult without witnessing the problem first hand.


good luck.

Yup, that is why I am going to tear it back down. I don't want to just keep the sprocket loose, that would cause the sprocket to back it self off over time and cause a huge problem.

I also don't think it is a lubrication problem as the sprocket shaft spins freely when I don't have the sprocket on.

I also don't want to see if it runs, cause from everything that I have tried, something is out of alignment to cause this. It probably would run, but how long is the question! I would rather nip this problem in the but now while I can to prevent a BIG problem.

Complete disassembly/assembly will be documented.

Stay tuned for more Shade-D Mechanic! :p

[Honda#4]

Good Luck Dave! Something that you need right now.

[speedfreaksguy]

Can you shift it through the gears with the sprocket off?

[Chino886]

Originally posted by speedfreaksguy
Can you shift it through the gears with the sprocket off?

Yes sir, no problem shifting gears that I have noticed. I am not sure what it going on.

[400exrider707]

Originally posted by Chino886
I am not sure what it going on.


Bad kanooter valve:o














:p

[Chino886]

Originally posted by 400exrider707
Bad kanooter valve:o














:p

I'll replace the kanooter valve and put on a bigger Pink Power band and a new double muffler bearing and see if it helps! :devil:

[400exrider707]

Originally posted by Chino886
I'll replace the kanooter valve and put on a bigger Pink Power band and a new double muffler bearing and see if it helps! :devil:


So uh.... is it running yet?:chinese:

[Chino886]

Originally posted by 400exrider707
So uh.... is it running yet?:chinese:

I could not find my left handed socket set so I could not get started :p !

Will start tonight with my right hand socket set! :devil:

[Chino886]

Well, got the topend off and the bottom end out of the frame.

I got the left side case off also.

Pics will be coming soon.

[sunco]

My 04' locked up, a member said Rod or crank bearings. I see you did that. So when I get more info as to what is exactly wrong. Where should I be buying my parts? I downloaded a service manuel for the 04' . Will that give me enough info as to how to take it apart & reinstall?

[Chino886]

Hey Sunco,

Sorry to hear about your motor locking up!

If you are going to do it, there is plenty of help on forums and in the manual. Make sure you take good notes of where everything goes and how it is lined up. Pictures help a great deal. Just remember, don't force things in, they will fit!

As far as ordering parts, find out what you need first and then place one big order from one place so you can save on shipping. I have heard that Service Honda has some of the best prices out there.

You will need some special tools too.

Good luck and if you need any help, don't be afraid to ask! I am tearing mine apart for the second time. :mad:

[N300exJ]

My engine let go for a second time as well. I think this will be the last time though im gettin rid of this thing....

[Chino886]

Originally posted by N300exJ
My engine let go for a second time as well. I think this will be the last time though im gettin rid of this thing....

Mine did not let go a second time, just error during reassembly.

I think I may have found the problem, will post with updates tomorrow as I have some more wrenching to do. :)

[sunco]

Thanx - youall found me on another thread in reference to my issue. I have an extended warranty for my quad so I'll put the stock stuff back together & take it to the dealer. The one I got it from said bring it in & the one closest & where I got a 250 ex for the sun they said 2 weeks before I get to bring it in. I think I'll take it to where I bought it. Good luck to me - & thanx you all for the advise & help. I'm learning as I go along. Sometimes its best to let the people do what they do best. Or if you paid for it then they owe you to fix it. HONDA FIX MY QUAD !!!

[Chino886]

Okay, so I split the cases last night to find the problem.

It was the Countershaft bearing. There are two set plates that hold the bearing in place. The two set plates have a beveled side and a flat side. Guess I installed them flat side up instead of beveled as it is supposed to be. It caused the gear that is supposed to be against the bearing to rub on the bolt heads.

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/oops1.jpg

Fixed the problem, sprocket spins freely now.


It is amazing how much faster the tear down went the second time :eek2: , now I just have to throw her back together.

I just can not start rushing things, that is how I made the mistake last time!

Live and learn!

Cha cha cha chino :chinese:

[400exrider707]

Glad you found it. It's crazy how something so small and insignificant can make that much of a difference!

[Chino886]

Originally posted by 400exrider707
Glad you found it. It's crazy how something so small and insignificant can make that much of a difference!

Yeah, talk about tight clearances :huh

[Honda#4]

Yea but Dave making mistakes is part of learning, they are a part of common life. Glad you found your mistake so fast, now get that think running.

[taino_racing]

it takes a real atver to accept a mistake was made! most of us wont accept we made a mistakes ,much less, let every atver know!but finding the problem by yourself must have been most gratifing. my hat of to u. good job!

[Chino886]

Originally posted by taino_racing
it takes a real atver to accept a mistake was made! most of us wont accept we made a mistakes ,much less, let every atver know!but finding the problem by yourself must have been most gratifing. my hat of to u. good job!

Yeah, I know what you mean, most would blame it on something else, but I have nothing to hide! I am not trying to sell my services or anything like that! I am human, I make mistakes..........:devil: I am glad that I made this mistake so next time I am in there, I know to pay closer attention!

[Chino886]

Almost back together................

Long holiday weekend, misplaced dowel pin, and kicker installed wrong..............

All reasons for extra time! :devil:

[400exrider707]

Originally posted by Chino886
Almost back together................

Long holiday weekend, misplaced dowel pin, and kicker installed wrong..............

All reasons for extra time! :devil:

I did the same when I did mine, had everything done motor in and couldn't put the kicker side case cover on because I couldn't find one dowel. LAME!

Ok go go gadget get if fixed. :blah:

[sunco]

I'm back- I talked to the dealer today & he said my crank was welded to the rod. They haven't heard back from Honda to see if its covered. Dealer said this happens from not enough oil. I said I did have enough oil in it - I always do 3 things before I ride
Air Pressure , gas & oil. So now I wait
:( I sure hope they cover this - man

[Chino886]

Getting closer, still waiting on the dowel pin to come in at the dealership.

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00472.jpg

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00473.jpg

Sunco, it does not sound like the Dealership you are working with is in your corner! They are putting the blame on you already!:grr:

[400exrider707]

Originally posted by sunco
I'm back- I talked to the dealer today & he said my crank was welded to the rod. They haven't heard back from Honda to see if its covered. Dealer said this happens from not enough oil. I said I did have enough oil in it - I always do 3 things before I ride
Air Pressure , gas & oil. So now I wait
:( I sure hope they cover this - man


You are not the first person to have a rod bearing failure, it happens a lot.


Dave - you know as soon as you get it back together that other dowel pin will show up right?:rolleyes:

[sunco]

I'm still hopeful. Thanx Maybe today will bring good news:)

[sunco]

dealer still waiting on honda - even called the district guy. I said I need it for fathers day trip & I'd like to have it back before to ride 1st. He's gonna finish taken it apart - then he starts telling all the parts it needs - I said fix it - add the HRC kit & new oem clutch. Figured it would help both of us out. Anyway fix it 1st & then worry about the paper work Cause either way I would like me bike back.

[sunco]

oil pump has shaving in it. Dealer says he can't find a factory defect. He's @ 1800 already & I have to add
HRC $300
clutch $-----
Gears in trans are hammered $---------

He's gonna call back - my guess is he's gonna be @ $2500 by the time he's done.

What to do
Have him put it in a box & give it back. Pay tear down fee. Go buy a new one from someone else.

Tell him to warranty it & I'll buy a new one from him.

Suggestion ? I'm sick & I wanta puek. All this is rider error? I had oil in it!

[Chino886]

Well had a good weekend!

Motor started! I started the break-in process and noticed the tube under the water pump is leaking coolant. I have read that this the a seal failure.

Any ideas? Is there a recommended way to drain the coolant as I just poured fresh coolant in there?

[Sjorge450R]

Originally posted by Chino886
Well had a good weekend!

Motor started! I started the break-in process and noticed the tube under the water pump is leaking coolant. I have read that this the a seal failure.

Any ideas? Is there a recommended way to drain the coolant as I just poured fresh coolant in there?

to drain the coolant you just loosen the bottom bolt on the water pump on the right side of th emotor. It will go EVERYWHERE!!! then when you fill the radiator back up, fill it up to the neck of the radiator, then start her up, let her run for about 2-3 min then hit the gas WFO like 3 times real quick, turn it off and then fill the radiator back up to where its supposed to be. Once the level stays at the top, top your ressivor off.

[xsr_racing28c]

Dave,
Sounds like everything is going well with your motor.. I've been waiting for a voicemail but nothing has of yet :mad: ...LOL

Hit me up tommorow tell me how it went!!

~Jay

[Chino886]

Originally posted by xsr_racing28c
Dave,
Sounds like everything is going well with your motor.. I've been waiting for a voicemail but nothing has of yet :mad: ...LOL

Hit me up tommorow tell me how it went!!

~Jay

You might want to check your phone again!

you should of had one!

[Chino886]

I am just working on break in right now and did not feel like putting all the plastic on. I still have to bleed the brakelines, install the nerf bars as well!

I also need to figure out why the F*&@ the little "tube" is leaking on the bottom of the water pump! Don't feel comfortable riding it like that!

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00481.jpg

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00485.jpg

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00484.jpg

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00483.jpg

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00482.jpg

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00480.jpg

[400exrider707]

Verrr Niiiice High five! (In borat voice)


Seat cover looks like it worked out good for you, quad looks good, now get some plastic on the dang thing.

[Chino886]

Originally posted by 400exrider707
Verrr Niiiice High five! (In borat voice)


Seat cover looks like it worked out good for you, quad looks good, now get some plastic on the dang thing.

Plastic, what plastic? I am converting it to a drag bike!

The plastic is NOT black! ~ borat

[Honda#4]

Dave man I'm glad you finally got it together Looks Great!!! I wouldnt even put the plastics back on Dave looks great without them LOL!!

[Elduner]

Chino you know Im digging the no plastic look... lol


Bike looks sick.... I think your leak may be a seal problem on the pump... I dont member what it looks like in there... But I know mine did the same thing..... I even took the 3 bolts out to see what it was... Once I reinstalled everything it stooped leaking... don't know what cause it but I think that I may have installed something wrong...

Good luck bro.

[Chino886]

Thanks Duner!

I knew you would like the no Plastic look!

Now if i could only shave some LBs off of her fat butt to make her go fast!

I have ordered the new seal to see if it is the seal!

Hope it works!

[IMSROLL450R]

Hey Dave i got back from the dunes and pulled the seat off and the air filter was layin in the box again. Full of sand. It wasnt runnin bad or smoking so do you think I can just change the oil a couple times and be ok till I rebuild??????? That 14:1 is lookin mighty enticing right now!!!!! Let me know whats up with this weekend. I will be ready by then hopefully.

[400exrider707]

Originally posted by IMSROLL450R
Hey Dave i got back from the dunes and pulled the seat off and the air filter was layin in the box again. Full of sand. It wasnt runnin bad or smoking so do you think I can just change the oil a couple times and be ok till I rebuild??????? That 14:1 is lookin mighty enticing right now!!!!! Let me know whats up with this weekend. I will be ready by then hopefully.


Ouch. I would definitely change oil as much as possible, also take the carb off immediately and clean it very well. Luckily when this happens a lot of dust and dirt gets stuck in the carb.

[Chino886]

Originally posted by 400exrider707
Ouch. I would definitely change oil as much as possible, also take the carb off immediately and clean it very well. Luckily when this happens a lot of dust and dirt gets stuck in the carb.

No worries 400exrider707, I will be cleaning the poop out of his bike!

[400exrider707]

Originally posted by Chino886
No worries 400exrider707, I will be cleaning the poop out of his bike!


This is the exact reason we made our own billet rings so we could clamp the filter down really hard. I had one filter fall off before and that was on my EX. Still ran it all MX season, just used a little bit of oil is all:rolleyes:

[IMSROLL450R]

Hey Dave what night would be good for me to bring it up????? I'm gonna clean the filter and everything tonight as soon as I get off of work. I can even come tonight. Let me know man. thanks.

[Chino886]

Originally posted by IMSROLL450R
Hey Dave what night would be good for me to bring it up????? I'm gonna clean the filter and everything tonight as soon as I get off of work. I can even come tonight. Let me know man. thanks.

I pmed you!

[Chino886]

Got about another 2 hrs on the "break-in" and she will be ready to rock!

[400exrider707]

Originally posted by Chino886
Got about another 2 hrs on the "break-in" and she will be ready to rock!


How do you break in your motors? Mine are considered ready to rock as soon as they've reached operation temps.:chinese:

[Chino886]

Originally posted by 400exrider707
How do you break in your motors? Mine are considered ready to rock as soon as they've reached operation temps.:chinese:

Well, I know there are several schools of thought on this and I have tried several of them! I am trying a different one after seeing used pistons from different methods of "break-in"!

This one process take the longest, but the piston looks the best! With the short skirts on my piston, I want to ensure even wear on the piston!

The process involves heat cycles, work hardening, etc...........basically "massaging" the piston to work! :devil:

[400exrider707]

Originally posted by Chino886
Well, I know there are several schools of thought on this and I have tried several of them! I am trying a different one after seeing used pistons from different methods of "break-in"!

This one process take the longest, but the piston looks the best! With the short skirts on my piston, I want to ensure even wear on the piston!

The process involves heat cycles, work hardening, etc...........basically "massaging" the piston to work! :devil:


Well explain it to me! This is why I asked because I am curious to learn!:blah:

[taino_racing]

he is not going to give up his speed secrets!

[Elduner]

Motoman style is the way I like to break mine in....

[Chino886]

Originally posted by Elduner
Motoman style is the way I like to break mine in....

Yeah, I did the last top end that way!

I am just trying something different! I will try anything once! :eek:

[Dave400ex]

I'll sometimes have a little bit of coolant leak out of that tube as well. I notice it on my skidplate. Not much, just like it comes out when it's really hot. My coolant level is always the same. I didn't think a little coming out was a big deal mine does it a little bit every ride, maybe your's is more then what I'm thinking...

[Chino886]

Originally posted by Dave400ex
I'll sometimes have a little bit of coolant leak out of that tube as well. I notice it on my skidplate. Not much, just like it comes out when it's really hot. My coolant level is always the same. I didn't think a little coming out was a big deal mine does it a little bit every ride, maybe your's is more then what I'm thinking...

Nope, less than 1 drop on 10 min idle session, but I like to be safe rather than sorry! I just got this baby back together and that is the last thing I want to do!

Thanks for the reply!

[Dave400ex]

Well that might be about right, it's just hardly at all I'll notice some on my skidplate but has never been a problem.

[mx825]

man, i haven't been following this thread but chino, that quad is sick!
i hope everything works out well!

[Chino886]

Originally posted by mx825
man, i haven't been following this thread but chino, that quad is sick!
i hope everything works out well!

Thanks MX825!

Well, I got to finally "ride" it tonight! I got to ride it "lightly" for 10 mins and boy let me tell you about the smile on my face! Can't wait to see what it will do when I am done breaking it in!

Woohoo! :devil:

[IMSROLL450R]

sounds slow.........I would sell it......

[Chino886]

Originally posted by IMSROLL450R
sounds slow.........I would sell it......

Yup!

I think I am!

[400exrider707]

Originally posted by IMSROLL450R
sounds slow.........I would sell it......


Shhhh! I'm slowly buying it piece by piece... he hasn't caught on yet.:p

[Chino886]

Originally posted by 400exrider707
Shhhh! I'm slowly buying it piece by piece... he hasn't caught on yet.:p

Just buy the whole dang thing and be done with it!;)

I will even let you test drive it before you decide!

I was in 4th gear just putting along and got to mid-RPMs (that's all I can give it for now) and it wanted me to look at the clouds!:eek2:

[400exrider707]

Originally posted by Chino886
Just buy the whole dang thing and be done with it!;)


Not a fan of the 06 transmissions....;)


So you're doing like a dealer recommended break in? What fun is that?:ermm:

[Chino886]

Originally posted by 400exrider707
Not a fan of the 06 transmissions....;)


So you're doing like a dealer recommended break in? What fun is that?:ermm:

06 trannies work fine, unless abused with poor choice of fluid in my opinion.......................OR too much power!

I know of one guy that had tranny failures, but he also runs a 20 shot of NOS!

My ears are all fine and I have a 35 HP bike!:devil:

PM me your email and I will detail the break-in process I am using! I don't want to start a huge debate on break-in processes!

[Chino886]

I am about fed up with this bike!

I am tired of wrenching on it and not being able to ride it!:mad:

I think I developed a tranny problem now that I have added some HP to the monster!

Going to have to tear her down again! Getting some unwanted false neutrals!

:mad: :grr:

[400exrider707]

Originally posted by Chino886
06 trannies work fine, unless abused with poor choice of fluid in my opinion.......................OR too much power!




You're eating your own words now dave! Sorry to hear about the problems bud:ermm: Im assuming this is too much power in this case though!?


My buddy's 05 just started having major false neutral problems this past weekend... he cant even do an entire straight away on the track without hitting the false neutrals.


I have heard more than one person mention sending the gears and forks to rage ATV for some process though no one seems to know what it is...:confused:

[Chino886]

Originally posted by 400exrider707
You're eating your own words now dave! Sorry to hear about the problems bud:ermm: Im assuming this is too much power in this case though!?


My buddy's 05 just started having major false neutral problems this past weekend... he cant even do an entire straight away on the track without hitting the false neutrals.


I have heard more than one person mention sending the gears and forks to rage ATV for some process though no one seems to know what it is...:confused:

Yes, I think it is the additional powerload now on the tranny, I am running the highest compression piston that I know of made (baldwin) and HRC with P & P.

I think the tranny needs an update!

I have no problem eating my own words, as long as I or someone else learns from them!

[400exrider707]

Originally posted by Chino886
Yes, I think it is the additional powerload now on the tranny, I am running the highest compression piston that I know of made (baldwin) and HRC with P & P.

I think the tranny needs an update!

I have no problem eating my own words, as long as I or someone else learns from them!


Chad sells his own custom 15:1 piston....


I never thought that the added power was what caused the gears to have that false neutral, they dont seem to gring or anything.... just get stuck in between gears.

[Chino886]

Originally posted by 400exrider707
Chad sells his own custom 15:1 piston....




you are correct, I only know of 1 DRG piston in an 06 machine and I think Chad backcuts his gears also!

[400exrider707]

Hmmm, I know I've hit the false neutral back when my 05 was stock too, so in my experiences power has had nothing to do with it, it seemed to be much more random, and now the quads in our group that get the most abuse and seat time are starting to do it more and more, so it seems to just be a wear/use thing. I dont know, I sure would like to know what is going on though. My buddy is having his 05 brought in today to a buddy of ours to tear apart, so hopefully I find something out... Sorry to hear about the string of bad luck dave, but once you get this figured out you should be sitting on a pretty sweet/fast machine.

[IMSROLL450R]

whats wrong with it now Dave??????? U gonna be busy every night this week?

[sunco]

http://www.exriders.com/vbb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=305054

could u guys advise me?

[Chino886]

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00494.jpg

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00493.jpg

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00492.jpg

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00491.jpg

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q272/chino886/DSC00490.jpg

new nerfs, pegs, stem should be coming soon!

Will get more pics once I get her cleaned up!

[IMSROLL450R]

lookin good dave!!!!!!!!!!! I tried adjusting the idle and thats not it. Its the switch inside the thumb assembly. It will run as long as that little pressure switch isnt touched buy the thumb lever but as soon as you let go of the lever and it touches that switch it shuts it off. Why would that be????? It didnt do that before we had the carb off and maybe its because its now clean and able to work properly but I cant figure it out. Let me know whats up. You gonna be around su casa tomorrow night??????? Ill give you a call.

[400ex_rider13]

Looks awesome!

[Honda#4]

Lookin great Dave!!!!

[400exrider707]

Dave clean that hog up! She needs a good bath! Looks good though.

IMSROLL450R - what switch are you referring to? Do you have a different throttle housing on your 06R?

[IMSROLL450R]

Originally posted by 400exrider707
Dave clean that hog up! She needs a good bath! Looks good though.

IMSROLL450R - what switch are you referring to? Do you have a different throttle housing on your 06R?

No its a stock throttle. If you take the cover off of your thumb throttle assembly theres a little red button switch that the thumb lever on the inside of the housing touches when the throttle is closed. As soon as i let go of the throttle and it touches that little button switch, The bike shuts off. Not a sputter or anything just flat out shuts off. Why would that switch shut it off? It didnt happen till after me and Dave had the carb off and totally cleaned it out, (he did an awesome job), but the first time i started it after the cleaning, it did that. Theres somethin Im missing and it will be easy when I figure it out. Let me know what you think. Dave had a few ideas that im gonna try.

[400exrider707]

Well it might be some sort of safety shut off switch, or a throttle position sensor!? Im not sure to be honest, my 05 doesn't have this. Maybe its shorting out somehow? Personally I would cut the wires back down under the hood and leave it at that, do you know if the switch is normally open or normally closed? If its normally open then just cut the wires back and tape off the ends, if its normally closed, then cut the wires back and splice them together.... thats just what I would do, and some people are against cutting wires on their toys so its up to you. Find out what the heck it is cause I want to know now.

[Chino886]

IMSRoll450R:

Questions:
1. Do you have a tether? If so, check the ground
2. Is your on/off switch turned to the on position, switch it a few times and then turn on
3. Make sure you did not jar anything look while doing your front end switcharoo!
4. Fix it before I get back in town
5. If nothing else, unplug the throttle till I have time to look at it!

[IMSROLL450R]

It HAS to be that switch I would bet my arm that if I just unplug it, it will stay running. Its not like a bad connection anywhere or a short or other switch. That little button is just flat out stoping the spark. I'll figure it out. Thanks for the suggestions. It will be runnin by the time yu get back Dave even though we would have to get balloon tires to ride after the 8000 inches of rain.

[IMSROLL450R]

Ok so if you eliminate that switch it absolutely wont start. I'm goin crazy I rode the track all day yesterday without taking my thumb off the throttle. I have to fix it. I wonder if I need to adjust the throttle cable somehow down on the carb to keep if OFF that button when I let go. I'll dig back into it again today.

[IMSROLL450R]

Pretty sure I got it. Honda calls it the Carburetor Switch # 48 in the picture. The little pin on the face of the switch was broke off. When you let off the throttle the wheel that your cable is attached to is supposed to push that switch. I think that when I let off the thottle that switch wasnt working so it pushed the switch up on the handlebars but not the one in the carb and somehow that tells it to shut off. Im ordering the new one now so we'll see in a few days.

http://i161.photobucket.com/albums/t219/IMSROLL450R/Carburetorassembly.gif

Heres a pic on it laying in the sink its the switch with the spring on it that goes to the idle adjust.
http://i161.photobucket.com/albums/t219/IMSROLL450R/DSC02054.jpg

Wow what a whorebag. Im tired of workin on this thing.

[Dave400ex]

I just cut and soldered that safety switch together. Although your's is the first problem I have heard with it, you won't have anymore future problems. Plus I put an 05 throttle on mine...

[400exrider707]

Like I said before if its normally closed, then take the wires off and connect them together... that would get rid of the problem all together.

[IMSROLL450R]

Originally posted by 400exrider707
Like I said before if its normally closed, then take the wires off and connect them together... that would get rid of the problem all together.

That should work AFTER I replace the switch in the carb but I tried eliminating the switch up on the throttle and it wouldnt even start then. Maybe it will after I replace the broken one but if it works when I fix it I'll probably just leave it alone. Is there any other throttle that I can use that gets better leverage with the lever? My wrist always hurts from pushing it because I broke it once and now it always starts hurtin. What other thumb levers can you get that are longer?

[400exrider707]

Originally posted by IMSROLL450R
That should work AFTER I replace the switch in the carb but I tried eliminating the switch up on the throttle and it wouldnt even start then. Maybe it will after I replace the broken one but if it works when I fix it I'll probably just leave it alone. Is there any other throttle that I can use that gets better leverage with the lever? My wrist always hurts from pushing it because I broke it once and now it always starts hurtin. What other thumb levers can you get that are longer?

You should be able to eliminate the switch no matter what is going on inside the throttle housing. I've heard the 400ex/300ex thumb throttle is a nice improvement, and there is also a spring kit you can buy for FCR's to make them easier to use.


How did you try eliminating the switch before?

[IMSROLL450R]

Originally posted by 400exrider707
You should be able to eliminate the switch no matter what is going on inside the throttle housing. I've heard the 400ex/300ex thumb throttle is a nice improvement, and there is also a spring kit you can buy for FCR's to make them easier to use.


How did you try eliminating the switch before?

I will look into getting one of those but I know that as is right now if you eliminate that switch you can kick it for days and it will not start. I hope that other switch fixes it.

[400exrider707]

Originally posted by IMSROLL450R
I will look into getting one of those but I know that as is right now if you eliminate that switch you can kick it for days and it will not start. I hope that other switch fixes it.

I disagree, I dont think you did it correctly, thats why I am asking what you did to "eliminate" it.

[IMSROLL450R]

Originally posted by 400exrider707
I disagree, I dont think you did it correctly, thats why I am asking what you did to "eliminate" it.

I unhooked the wires at the throttle and hooked them together. Technically that would only complete the circuit and definitely make it NOT start just the same as killing it when the button was pushed. The only way to make it actually run would be to unhook the wires which would simulate and open circuit and would be the same as the switch Never being closed. So no, hooking the wires together and eliminating the switch will not work.

[400exrider707]

Originally posted by IMSROLL450R
I unhooked the wires at the throttle and hooked them together. Technically that would only complete the circuit and definitely make it NOT start just the same as killing it when the button was pushed. The only way to make it actually run would be to unhook the wires which would simulate and open circuit and would be the same as the switch Never being closed. So no, hooking the wires together and eliminating the switch will not work.

Ok thanks for clarifying it for me. So then why cant you just unhook it and leave the wires unhooked from each other? What exactly is the purpose of this switch, to shut it off it it gets stuck WOT?

[IMSROLL450R]

I think after i put the new switch in the carb I can just unhook the one on the throttle and it will work. It wouldnt shut it off if it was wide open throttle because it touches the switch when you let off or when the throttle is completely closed. I dont really know what the purpose for the switch is other than to tell something that the throttle is closed.