CR250 ignition vs stock dyno runs?

[DanW]

Has anybody seen a dyno run of a 250R with stock ignition compared to the same thing with the CR ignition?

I keep reading about how much of an improvement the CR ignition is, but I never see any proof. $550 is an expensive upgrade without seeing something on paper about the actual improvement.

i alwasy wanted to see dynos of it too, i dont think their is much HP GAIN, but i know itll rev quicker and higher, but i dont think their is any horsepower gain

[fiveOnick]

I know a stock ignition will cause it to hydroknock and a CR runs great with alky, big difference. I would have saved alot more than 550 if I had switched sooner.

[DanW]

Originally posted by fiveOnick
I know a stock ignition will cause it to hydroknock and a CR runs great with alky, big difference. I would have saved alot more than 550 if I had switched sooner.

What is hydroknock?

[GPracer2500]

Originally posted by DanW
What is hydroknock?

I was wondering about that too.

[fiveOnick]

Compression of liquid, causes a similar sound of detonation but not the same.

[GPracer2500]

Originally posted by fiveOnick
Compression of liquid, causes a similar sound of detonation but not the same.

Can you elaborate on that condition? It's not something I'm familiar with.

What liquid is being compressed? What causes it? How is it related to ignition? Stuff like that....

thanks

[atvmxr]

if I had to guess hydrolock occurs when the plug intermittenly doesnt fire on the compression stroke and so the unburned mixture can start building up in the cylinder :confused:

If so having better igntion that will fire the plug EVERYTIME (thats alot of sparks at 6000rpm (100 per second)) would fix it. ;)

[kiesta00]

I think the main advantage of a cr ignition is a new ignition map for easier starting and better pull through the gears, and also gives a hotter spark for the maxed out high hp motors running alky.

[fiveOnick]

The stock ignition was simply not burning enough fuel. The motor never ran hot or preignited, it was another issue entirely. The piston cracked apart and all the porcelain came off the plug while the metal was not melted and entirely intact. I have talked to people who have ran nitro in various engines and describe a situation with all the same results as nitro knock or a compression of liquid not being combusted. I have experienced it on two different engines with two different stock ignitions. The CR has never had the issue. The stock ignition motor ran ok but after a weekend of abuse and sounding like a grenade it gave out. I would go CR all the way, I have a 2000 which is supposed to have a inferior curve to the 2001 and it screams.

[Kirt13]

Originally posted by DanW
Has anybody seen a dyno run of a 250R with stock ignition compared to the same thing with the CR ignition?

I keep reading about how much of an improvement the CR ignition is, but I never see any proof. $550 is an expensive upgrade without seeing something on paper about the actual improvement.
This is what I did and it will save you some $$$.
I bought a Nology coil and electrical system and a Dynatech CDI.
Total cost is about $250.
This made such a huge improvement on the starting and especially on the performance. It pulls through the gears harder and it stretches out the lower gears.
AND.....you keep your lights!!!

[fiveOnick]

You can run lights with a CR if you have a lighting coil added.

[mxduner]

so which is better nology or cr? performance/value?

[fiveOnick]

CR is the best setup, it is also the most expensive. Actually a CR with a Dyna box is the best, but its not made anymore and makes it even more expensive. I just depends on your tastes, most people that have had one would never run anything else, I do know that.

[86 Quad R]

Originally posted by Kirt13
This is what I did and it will save you some $$$.
I bought a Nology coil and electrical system and a Dynatech CDI.
Total cost is about $250.
This made such a huge improvement on the starting and especially on the performance. It pulls through the gears harder and it stretches out the lower gears.
AND.....you keep your lights!!!


i'd like more info on this nology/dynatech setup....

:D

[Kirt13]

Originally posted by 86 Quad R
i'd like more info on this nology/dynatech setup....

:D

Here are the websites. these are top of the line, tested, and they really work.
This set up will save you money and give you a MUCH better spark than the CR conversion. I believe that the Dyna Tech CDI has the same mapping as the CR or better.
I just put this complete set up on my 330R. Man.....what a difference!!
www.nologyhotwires.com
www.dynaonline.com

[86 Quad R]

thanks!! :cool:

[C-LEIGH RACING]

Originally posted by fiveOnick
The stock ignition was simply not burning enough fuel. The motor never ran hot or preignited, it was another issue entirely. The piston cracked apart and all the porcelain came off the plug while the metal was not melted and entirely intact. I have talked to people who have ran nitro in various engines and describe a situation with all the same results as nitro knock or a compression of liquid not being combusted. I have experienced it on two different engines with two different stock ignitions. The CR has never had the issue. The stock ignition motor ran ok but after a weekend of abuse and sounding like a grenade it gave out. I would go CR all the way, I have a 2000 which is supposed to have a inferior curve to the 2001 and it screams.

One other thing to add to this, on a gas engine the carb is providing a misty fume type of supply to the engine & on a alky fueled engine the carb is suppling more of a spray of condenced fuel, around 4 times more fuel, maybe not that much but you get the point.
Its not hard to see with the misfire of the old stock ignition how quick the fuel build up (hydroknock) can happen in the cylinder with the alky fuel. Its going from an ignition fired engine to a compression fire, like a diesel or the RC nitro engines.
The spark plug parts exposed to the cylinder bore was acting like a glow plug in a RC nitro engine.
Neil

[fiveOnick]

Yes this is the conclusion I have came to, others told me to jet richer that it was simply my in ability to jet that was the problem. When infact it was not, the richer it was jetted the worse the condition became. After destroying one motor I finally equated it to what the problem was, if I had purchased the CR intially I would have save quite a considerable amount of money.

[kiesta00]

Originally posted by Kirt13
This is what I did and it will save you some $$$.
I bought a Nology coil and electrical system and a Dynatech CDI.
Total cost is about $250.
This made such a huge improvement on the starting and especially on the performance. It pulls through the gears harder and it stretches out the lower gears.
AND.....you keep your lights!!!

So I take it you bought the non programmable version? just curious about the timing curve of the non programmable version, is it like the CR? did you remove the lighting system from your bike? I've heard different opinions about the reliability of the dyna ignition...dont know for sure though. I'm about to switch my ignition out also, and don't want to pay $550 for a CR ignition if I can buy something cheaper that does the same thing.

[Kirt13]

Originally posted by kiesta00
So I take it you bought the non programmable version? just curious about the timing curve of the non programmable version, is it like the CR? did you remove the lighting system from your bike? I've heard different opinions about the reliability of the dyna ignition...dont know for sure though. I'm about to switch my ignition out also, and don't want to pay $550 for a CR ignition if I can buy something cheaper that does the same thing.
If you go the same route I did (Nology system with Dyna CDi non-programmable) it is better than the CR. You have the same curve with the CDI and much better spark with Nology, You keep your stock lighting system. Also, you save about $250 by not getting the CR kit. If you want lights with the CR you have to pay even more for the light kit.

[fiveOnick]

Better than a CR, I dont think so. Spoken like a person who has never ran one. I would say its good for the money but its not OEM honda quality stuff up to modern technology.

[Kirt13]

Originally posted by fiveOnick
Better than a CR, I dont think so. Spoken like a person who has never ran one. I would say its good for the money but its not OEM honda quality stuff up to modern technology.
How do you know what I've ran??
I used to have the CR kit from ESR. It's too expensive for what you get.
If you like the CR set up better that's alright. It's not bad at all. Just not enough bang for your buck.
With the set up I'm using now you get the same timing curve and much better spark. It's $250 cheaper....how can you argue with that?
Oh yeah....you keep your lights too.

[fiveOnick]

Used CR setups can be bought for around $300 pretty easily, I paid that for one thats basically new. I would trust a used CR over a new dyna anyday. Dyna has had lots of problems with the TRX model stuff, not with anything else though. You cannot make up for the flywheel either with a dyna, its not possible. That tiny flywheel revs extremely fast in comparison to the stocker. Bottom line is its the basis for the best ignition you can buy for a 250r, yeah its expensive and maybe you cannot justify it for the price but it is still a better system.

[Kirt13]

Originally posted by fiveOnick
Used CR setups can be bought for around $300 pretty easily, I paid that for one thats basically new. I would trust a used CR over a new dyna anyday. Dyna has had lots of problems with the TRX model stuff, not with anything else though. You cannot make up for the flywheel either with a dyna, its not possible. That tiny flywheel revs extremely fast in comparison to the stocker. Bottom line is its the basis for the best ignition you can buy for a 250r, yeah its expensive and maybe you cannot justify it for the price but it is still a better system.
Everyone is entitled to their opinion. I'm not going to argue with you and ruin this thread.

[kiesta00]

I read on the dynatek's website that you have to retain the voltage regulator in order to give the cdi 12volts...well my bike doesn't have any of that, so I guess the dyna system is out of the question

[Kirt13]

Originally posted by kiesta00
I read on the dynatek's website that you have to retain the voltage regulator in order to give the cdi 12volts...well my bike doesn't have any of that, so I guess the dyna system is out of the question
That's only on the programable CDI. The non programable CDI is a direct plug in.

[86 Quad R]

kirt,

i'm a bit confused as to which unit/setup from Nology's site should i purchase(the one you mention). should i just call them and tell them what i have and have them reccommend?

[Kirt13]

Originally posted by 86 Quad R
kirt,

i'm a bit confused as to which unit/setup from Nology's site should i purchase(the one you mention). should i just call them and tell them what i have and have them reccommend?
Definately call them.....they know about the TRX250R and have the complete set-up for it. They also have their own spark plugs.

[jas250r]

i switched awhile back from a stock trx with a jansen coil to a 2000 cr setup, bada**. who needs a headlight? this is on a stock 80 over motor. Throttle response is awesome. used to get beat by yfz's with exhaust and cam mod, now i can pull on my wife's all day. with a buddy riding of course.