View Full Version : 06 ti ex. valve problem
KrazyKeith
01-13-2007, 02:28 PM
I adjusted my valves a few weeks ago and my one intake valves was real tight so I put it back in spec and now a couple weeks later its tight again. It is so tight I can see wear on that lobe that isnt on the other lobes. I was wondering if anybody else has had this problem and what to do to fix it??:? I was thinkin bout just gettin another valve and change it. What is causing this?? I adjusted again today and had to use the smallest hotcam shim in the kit.
first....
i would ditch the hotcam shims.... oem is my preference...
second..
its rare to have a exhaust valve move up and or cup on the 06's... usually if anything the ti intakes will.. are u sure u dont got the exhaust and intake mixed.... just making sure.
if putting the oem shim in doesnt help than its too late and u will have to replace that valve... doing so will require a valve cut...
nd removal on the head of course from the engine....
imo... if u were to do this... get all new valve and start fresh... will set u back around 200 bucks or so... or about less than 90 for a valve with cutting.
-lumi
KrazyKeith
01-14-2007, 04:09 AM
sorry for the mistake it is an intake valve. I have read on here that the hotcam shims are softer or something?? I havent seen any damage on the shims if the shims were failing I beleive the valve would loosen not tighten and the shims look fine. I would use oem shims If they were easier for me to get I wouold but dealers are far from here and I have a hc kit already so untill I see failure for myself Im gonna use what I got. I am gonna just change the valve and a new piston while Im at it. Im thinkin either the 14:1 baldwin or just keep it on pump with a wiseco not sure yet though. Is there any chance of head damage? This machine only has about 50-60 hours why would this happen.
BSTURDIVANT
01-14-2007, 06:37 AM
We saw a guy loose his uni filter- ate up both intake valves from dirt!
ricks450
01-14-2007, 08:48 AM
not dissin oem shims are anything. never used them much but i have been runing H/C shims the whole time and havent had any problems. the way these machines are built if you get any wear in the vavle seat or valve it self, the vavle clearances will tighten up like yours is doing so i would pull the head off and see if theres any wear in there. it sounds like valve has a problem it self not the shim. its kind of weird that, thats the only lobe messed up. most of the time its a lack of oil that messes them up. something is causing to much friction on the lobe. how does your lifter look? its kind of hard to tell not seeing it, if you know what i mean.
yea krazy ketih... its most likely u got dirt in ur filter... with that little hours ur valve should have been in spec..... what air filter u running lid no lid?
there shoudltn be no damage to the head....
but u will need a recut of the seats on the head to get the dirt off and fix them
and new intake valve......
imo i like the sotkc 12:1 because the 91 and 93 octane gas i could run... but if u can get race gas go to 14:1......
not too much of a problem here.... but of course something with the air filter has led to this so i would recommened fin out what happen or keep up on the filter service more before it happens with ur new build
good luck man...
-lumi
KrazyKeith
01-14-2007, 06:44 PM
I use a uni filter. I keep it maintained very well, clean and oil every ride. I am ordering the parts tuesday and should have it back together by the weekend. I rode hard today on the coal hills in the rain. Now its startin to smoke. Well have to see what it looks like when I tear her down. I was wonderin if maybe the spring could be weak?
what r u revving at..
-lumi
ricks450
01-14-2007, 07:44 PM
i seriously doubt it because all the spring needs is enough presser to get the valve back up so the will close. all the spring needs to do is get the vavle back up in enough time so the piston will not hit the valve. thats why its better to have a spring that is easier to compress so that you have less friction. which leads to less heat and wear. which equels more horse power. so as long as the spring is strong enough to keep the valve from floating and hitting the piston your fine. your spring would have to not be expanding all the way back up for it to keep it from closing. but thats not your problem. its getting tighter so its pulling the valve all the way up. its pulling it beyond where it needs to.
BSTURDIVANT
01-14-2007, 07:52 PM
Replace both valves while you're in there!
ricks450
01-14-2007, 09:53 PM
Originally posted by lumi
first....
i would ditch the hotcam shims.... oem is my preference...
second..
its rare to have a exhaust valve move up and or cup on the 06's... usually if anything the ti intakes will.. are u sure u dont got the exhaust and intake mixed.... just making sure.
if putting the oem shim in doesnt help than its too late and u will have to replace that valve... doing so will require a valve cut...
nd removal on the head of course from the engine....
imo... if u were to do this... get all new valve and start fresh... will set u back around 200 bucks or so... or about less than 90 for a valve with cutting.
-lumi dang! you say the ti intake will cup. that sucks i wouldnt want those in bike. what is it caused from? it sounds like there soft or to thin for the spring presser. or is it they get to hot from incorrect fuel mixture or do they just do that in time?
BSTURDIVANT
01-15-2007, 05:35 AM
Originally posted by ricks450
i seriously doubt it because all the spring needs is enough presser to get the valve back up so the will close. all the spring needs to do is get the vavle back up in enough time so the piston will not hit the valve. thats why its better to have a spring that is easier to compress so that you have less friction. which leads to less heat and wear. which equels more horse power. so as long as the spring is strong enough to keep the valve from floating and hitting the piston your fine. your spring would have to not be expanding all the way back up for it to keep it from closing. but thats not your problem. its getting tighter so its pulling the valve all the way up. its pulling it beyond where it needs to.
This is true to a point- if you are running with the green wire cut,
a weak spring will let the valve float or rebound off the seat. This valve chattering on the seat will excellerate wear!
Imagine that everytime the valve closes, it slams the seat 10 to 20 times from float! The cam closing ramp is designed to close the valve easy to minimize failures and only once per cycle!
yea that was gonna be my further explanation^^^....
there isnt many ways to cupa valve.... the most common being letting dirt threw the air filter.... the dirt gets embedded onto the valve seat and starts destroying everything little by little...
not sure what cause this on ur part...
but there cup and they will need changing. :( u can go with kw ss valve i have heard alot of people like them.. and they dont have the same wear properties as the ti valve....
the thing is ti valve have a hard coating on them... once this coating is destroyed the valve tend to cup fast....
ss valve work very well with ti valve seat..... more heat transfer.
but ferrea and kw make good ones threw the experiences i have heard....
good luck
-lumi
KrazyKeith
01-15-2007, 02:55 PM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by lumi
[B]what r u revving at..
All I do is hillclimb and drag race. Close to the limiter all the time.
that can have something to do with it... but not imo the issue..
do u have the stock box and limiter?
hard to see the answer just gotta ask questions ... :)
how many time have u shimmed....
-lumi
Rich250RRacer
01-15-2007, 03:23 PM
To clear things up here, the intake valves are oxide coated. This is a hard surface coating to prolong valve and seat life. Under this coating is much softer material. When dirt enters the motor, it wears the oxide coating off of the valve, exposing the softer material. This soft metal will deform and cup causing the tightening of your valves. I'm a Honda diehard, but I just had an '04 YFZ in my shop for some basic maintenence and a clutch replacement. The guy said the valves had NEVER been touched and this thing has alot of hours on it. All five valves were right on spec. Yamaha must be doing something right, I've never heard much about valve issues like I do on the Honda or the Z400.
ricks450
01-15-2007, 04:20 PM
Originally posted by BSTURDIVANT
This is true to a point- if you are running with the green wire cut,
a weak spring will let the valve float or rebound off the seat. This valve chattering on the seat will excellerate wear!
Imagine that everytime the valve closes, it slams the seat 10 to 20 times from float! The cam closing ramp is designed to close the valve easy to minimize failures and only once per cycle! you r exactly right but your talking about overreving the factory spring that was not attended for that. thats why i said as long as your spring isnt floating then your fine. if your over reving the spring at a higher rpm then it will stand up to. then you need to get a stronger spring.
ricks450
01-15-2007, 04:24 PM
Originally posted by Rich250RRacer
To clear things up here, the intake valves are oxide coated. This is a hard surface coating to prolong valve and seat life. Under this coating is much softer material. When dirt enters the motor, it wears the oxide coating off of the valve, exposing the softer material. This soft metal will deform and cup causing the tightening of your valves. I'm a Honda diehard, but I just had an '04 YFZ in my shop for some basic maintenence and a clutch replacement. The guy said the valves had NEVER been touched and this thing has alot of hours on it. All five valves were right on spec. Yamaha must be doing something right, I've never heard much about valve issues like I do on the Honda or the Z400. thats what i was looking for. makes good sence
KrazyKeith
01-15-2007, 04:33 PM
Originally posted by lumi
that can have something to do with it... but not imo the issue..
do u have the stock box and limiter?
hard to see the answer just gotta ask questions ... :)
how many time have u shimmed....
-lumi
I cut the green wire
I put in the hotcam~no shimming needed all was within specs
Then shimmed and all were alittle out~noticed that tight valve~
Checked all again and the bad one was tight again~went with the smallest shim and it was just a little loose. Rode yesterday all day and havent checked it yet. i'm tearin it down Thursday or friday night I'll let you know whats up
thanks for all the help
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