Honda 700EX

[joker11]

So....
when I bought my two new 07 TRX250ex's and two 07 trx90ex's....I noticed some other brand bikes that were 650s and I even think there was a 700.
Why are other manufacturers progressing to what most people ultimately want? More CCs....Sure...you can large bore a 400ex, you can bump up a 450r....but why would you when you could drive out of the dealership pulling some 700ccs that hell....you could bump up even more?
Why is Honda holding back? Not knowing anything about quads I bought for the name and reputation of reliability. So I am sure they could sell larger models.
Sorry if this does not belong in this section of the forum, but the 450r is the biggest Honda has on this forum.

Thanks for any insights.

[ghott]

Honda's big dog as far as sport quads are concerned is the 450R.

It is just as quick as a Raptor 700R stock thanks to its quick revving dirt bike derived engine, and light weight.

Its a MX bike...and can be used for dunes or the woods.

The 700 bikes are predominantly dune bikes, or woods bikes. They are not at home on a MX track...they sit up high, they don't rev nearly as fast, and they are much heavier. There suspension also lacks a bit when compared to the 450's.

The 700 bikes are nice, but not for MX...its kinda like comparing a luxury car to a sports car. The luxury car (700) is going to be fast, but its going to be big, nice, and comfy. The sports car (450) is going to be fast and handle better, but not as nice and comfy as the luxury car.

With all that said...the 700s are extremely nice...especially for woods rider and dunes. They are TORQUE MONSTERS...they have good usable torque everywhere...The new Raptor 700R especially. But, when compared to the 450s, which build power all the way up until about 10,000RPM, the Raptor 700 feels like its finished building power by about 6000RPM. The new Raptor also weighs only 400lbs!

I don't care too much for the Kawi 700 V-Force however. It isextremely heavy when compared to the Raptor 700, and the 450s. It is also uses a CVT automatic clutch tranny...I don't believe this is the best for transferring horsepower to the rear wheels. But...the Kawi 700 still has gobs of torque everywhere!

This is all my opinion...

[BALLER619]

well said.

[joker11]

So are racers the largest demographic of atv buyers?

[450rJam]

I dont know about racers buying most of the atv's but most of the atv's sold are of the race/sport version.

actually, ute bikes sell more than race/ sport bikes. you are asking a question that many have wondered for a long time...any answer is only speculation.

my thoughts have to do with the fact that you can get the best of both worlds with the 450r or the 400ex. they are not that far off performance wise than these big big bore 700cc machines. adding an extra vehicle ups honda's overall costs and lowers profits for them. if you have smaller cheaper machines that easily compete with the "big boys" why add the extra cost. again, that is only my speculation.

[CHEVYZ]

Pretty much what was said is how it goes... bigger is not always better. Hell, I have raced guys with 650EX engines on 400EXs and beat them pretty nicely with my 450rs.

Now, on the other hand, I have also seen 650s that rip! Depends on how you build them. Personally though, I don't think that Honda could come up with anything worth building that they could actually just get out and sell.

[dtmichau]

I agree with the postings so far. But I have always wondered....

With all the research and resources that were pulled to develop the Honda 450R, there's no doubt that it hangs with/is as fast as/ is faster than (whatever your experience has been) the big bore 700's. However, what if you took that same amount of time, research, and resources and dumped it into a large bore quad?

You would have one hell of a quad. Just my thoughts and .02

[Burl Swift]

Originally posted by dtmichau
I agree with the postings so far. But I have always wondered....

With all the research and resources that were pulled to develop the Honda 450R, there's no doubt that it hangs with/is as fast as/ is faster than (whatever your experience has been) the big bore 700's. However, what if you took that same amount of time, research, and resources and dumped it into a large bore quad?

You would have one hell of a quad. Just my thoughts and .02

That's exactly what Yamaha did with this new Raptor. And the work and effort shows, one of the nicest quads to roll off an assembly line.

Honda has just never really been interested in a big bore sport quad, I don't know why, it would been nice to see some competition on that side of the market.

[Flyin-Low]

Yeah, to put this simply... Honda just needs to build one massive trail quad, even if they dont they are still better than Yamajunk :blah: :D

-Martin

[400exrider707]

Originally posted by Burl Swift
That's exactly what Yamaha did with this new Raptor. And the work and effort shows, one of the nicest quads to roll off an assembly line.

Honda has just never really been interested in a big bore sport quad, I don't know why, it would been nice to see some competition on that side of the market.

Ha thats a joke. Most of our money that we spend on our quads actually goes to develop dirt bikes. Ever notice how they get all the technology and then it trickles down to us. (If we're lucky!) Sport bikes probably get a pretty good chunk of it too.:mad:

[MXracer16]

Originally posted by 400exrider707
Ha thats a joke. Most of our money that we spend on our quads actually goes to develop dirt bikes. Ever notice how they get all the technology and then it trickles down to us. (If we're lucky!) Sport bikes probably get a pretty good chunk of it too.:mad:

I dont believe that the dirtbikes had EFI first.

[ckasper18]

Honda looks at the big bore narket all the time they study the sales and profit margin before building anything if the raptor 700 cc macjines were selling and yami could not keep them in stock honda would market one but the sales just are not there.Honda has several machines built and tested but wont be released due to the fact they wont sell enough of them tp make it profitable for them.Honda is there to make money and they are very choosy which quads dirt bikes and even the motorcycles they will build and release to the general public.I have worked at a dealership for 30 years and honda has some really cool stuff they have built and tested but they are never released.We were cleaning out dads attic the other day and found some really cool stuff that honda never released even a robot

[jtjpilot]

It's a business thing really. why would they want to throw a 700 on the market when they are still making millions on the 400's and 450's? I think it is safe to say that Honda and all the rest of the companies out there have future plans for bigger CC mx quads. There is no reason for them to put them on the market yet because the world is still at awwhh over the 450's. It's like the computer world. Computer Manufacturers keep building faster machines, well of course they are not going to build the ultimate FAST machine and throw it out there when they are still making millions on the current new machines. It's all part of their plan....I'm sure Honda, Yamaha and Suzuki have already built say a 500/700/1000 mx quad but they are going to wait to put it on the market until people get bored of the 450's.

that's my 2 cents on the subject, it comes down to money and future security of the manufacturers.

[roundsy]

Originally posted by jtjpilot
It's a business thing really. why would they want to throw a 700 on the market when they are still making millions on the 400's and 450's? I think it is safe to say that Honda and all the rest of the companies out there have future plans for bigger CC mx quads. There is no reason for them to put them on the market yet because the world is still at awwhh over the 450's. It's like the computer world. Computer Manufacturers keep building faster machines, well of course they are not going to build the ultimate FAST machine and throw it out there when they are still making millions on the current new machines. It's all part of their plan....I'm sure Honda, Yamaha and Suzuki have already built say a 500/700/1000 mx quad but they are going to wait to put it on the market until people get bored of the 450's.

that's my 2 cents on the subject, it comes down to money and future security of the manufacturers.

yea they probably have those size of quads and are waiting for the right time to release them but they are most likely not for mx because cc class regulations, unless they create bigger classes of course

[jtjpilot]

It's just a matter of time before there are bigger classes. Remember when the pro's were racing the 400's? Now its the 450's. A few years from now you won't be able to find a pro rider using a 450, they will be racing the new quad (whatever size that might be)

[scottwvu]

I can't answer WHY.....

But I believe Honda should come out with a big-bore quad. Make it different....like, to compete with the new Outy Renegade. Tell me you would not want an 800EX....:scary:

[450rJam]

For most rec. riders the 450r with a few mods is more power than you can use in most cases.

The only place you can really open them up is in the sand or drag racing.

In the woods and trails around here, if you grab a couple gears you better be on both brakes hard or your making toothpicks.

is there a reason for a big bore if you can do everything with a smaller bore (and its lighter and faster)

I have rode my friends 700 rappy and raced alot of v-force and 660 rappys and they are great quads but the only thing they had that my 450r didnt was reverse. (If honda made a large bore I wouldnt buy one)

[MaxxRPM]

Why should Honda build a big bore when the 450R compares to the 700R in performance?
..........because even though the 450s run with the 700, they are working alot harder to do so. The 700s motor is not a high revver and they didn't have to go skimpy on engine mechanicals to keep the weight off so they could rev more. Therefore, chances are that the big bore will last longer and need to be rebuilt less often...............This is just a generalization, I don't know if its actually true or not but one would think so.

[honda4life72]

ok beleive it or not my bud has a raptor 700 with a yousi pipe on it and soem mods to the motor. and my 450r is stock right now and i beat him ever time in a drag race.... and about the woods raceign i ran in the 450 class with a 250ex and was wining in the wodds but when i got to a straight away they burnt me and i fell to like 15th lol:mad: :mad:

[400exrider707]

Originally posted by MXracer16
I dont believe that the dirtbikes had EFI first.

Neither did quads, sport bikes have had it for quite some time. To be honest the EFI doesn't really surprise me. Its a fact that a carb'ed machine can be tuned more exactly than an EFI machine ever could be (why nascar still uses carbs) also EFI has been tested on nearly every single 450 dirt bike. I dont know how many of you guys read any bike mags, but nearly every manufacturer has a near production bike being tested with EFI. That includes Honda too!!! Also its not like EFI is that great of an R&D area anymore. You can buy stand alone kits to convert your carbed 450R to EFI.

[froggyboy88]

Originally posted by honda4life72
ok beleive it or not my bud has a raptor 700 with a yousi pipe on it and soem mods to the motor. and my 450r is stock right now and i beat him ever time in a drag race.... and about the woods raceign i ran in the 450 class with a 250ex and was wining in the wodds but when i got to a straight away they burnt me and i fell to like 15th lol:mad: :mad:

can he ride? A stock 450 shouldnt beat a 700 past 3rd gear or so.

[450rJam]

Im guessing the rider is diff. also.

a modded 700 will have no problem showing a stock 450 where the finish line is.

(with equal riders)

trade rides for a few drags and see whats up.