425ex vs z400

[voges]

i have a 2000 400 ex with a 425kit and a tc racing mx cam
i have a FMF powercore 4 with k&n and precharger with no lid
stock sprockets and 20' tires. (jetting is good)
the other guy had a z400 with a yoshi pipe and a k&N filter everything else stock
we draged on a gravel road and we were side bye side the hole way till i got to 5th gear and out of my low end, then he pulled away from me!

I am very impressed with my set up it runs great and is very realiable. there is only one thing i dont like i have to change oil so often.

i raced a raptor we were on a paved road and from a rolling start i was in 2nd he was in 1st he killed me get me on a pravel road and from a standing start it will be a lot closer.

next thing im getting is air scoops and one of those oil resevoirs that have the holes in them.
what do you guys think?

[bansheeguy77]

i think theres something wrong with your quad.....

[ChadEXer]

Definately something wrong with your quad,,or your riding:(

[Tommy 17]

theres def somethin wrong with ur quad then... i have the same cam less of a bore and no pipe and i'm runnin right with stock raptors... never saw a z to line up with yet but i can't wait till i get a chance...

i beat 125s with 20s and 16t sproket...


i don't change my oil that often with my cam i do use synthetic oils though...

[TRX250EXER]

I highly doubt you are hanging equal with a stock raptor, but anyways a Z400 piped are claimed to be quicker than a stock raptor. just by piping a Z400 you get a very good boost unlike on a 400ex where you only get a couple horsepower adding a pipe to a stock motor. And yoshi has the best pipe out for the Z400 right now cuz they have spent so much time with it. the Z is already stock for stock like 5 hp more than a 400ex. and I do remember on the DRZ400 dirtbike just by putting on a yoshi would increase it like at least 10hp on a dyno. I dont think the quad would have the same increase but I would give it at least another 5hp. and with the K&N I wouldnt doubt it if that motor and the crank was at least 15hp more than a stock ex. Now just how much hp you expect from all the internal mods you have done to the EX I dont know but I could see where the Z got him. especially when its 95% rider and 5% machine. Tires and gearing play a big effect too. they also were on gravel. some tires dont hook up as well on gravel even while cruising, not just off the line i mean. But some people need to stop being so brand loyal and give other companies some credit. The Z400 is a great quad with a great motor. not a surprise its the hottest thing on the market right now. not trying to get anything flaming but some people need to admitt that there are machines better than their precious 400ex's. And that its not a honda. honestly Im sick of people comparing everything to the 400ex. granted the motor is great and was ahead of its time when it came out. But now its behind its time. we are now in the time of liquidcooling engines and some even feul injected etc. I love honda and all but some people need to admit some things. hopefully honda fires back with something else that will kill the Z. Like the crf450 or something. 6 more days and honda is supposed to release some info on their new line up!! the count down is on......

[nakomis0]

Yup, theres nothing wrong with the guys quad. 400ex are just slow turds. The z400 feels slow to me too, but its faster than a 400ex for sure.

As for the cooling mods you plan to do, the scoops arn't going to do anything except look cool, and if you wanna get technical slow you down slightly.

The larger oil tank is a good idea, But I think an even better idea would be that FST oil cooler, it taps into your head and throws oil on the cam and its only 150 bucks.

[bansheeguy77]

250exer u sure u know what your talking about or do u just read dirtwheels? go check out dynos on the yoshi pipe. u will not gain 15 hp from a filter and pipe....cause then it would have over 50hp....yoshi claims 50 from their 450 z400 motor....the z might gain 3-5 hp from a pipe but thats it...raptors are not that fast. z's and 400s aint fast either but still. im sure tommys bike can keep up with one. u want a fast bike get on a 2 stroke....o and yes the 400ex motor is outdated u got that right....scoops will help with cooling....

[TRX250EXER]

nope. I remember a article or a site about the DRZ400 dirtbike that it was so detuned that when you add a pipe and filter it added like 12hp. A guy at a local riding area with the bike said the same thing. that at the crank it was pushing like 48hp or something around that, cant remember exact numbers. Dont know if it is true but it is what everyone claims. especially the loyal suzuki owners. (I have one of those in my group and he was telling me this same thing). I kinda doubt it too. But still, thats why I said I wouldnt be surprised if it increased it that much. And I really wouldnt be surprised if a piped and jeted Z has the same power as that man's 425ex. 400ex's dont seem to take effect to mods as much as other motors. They come pretty hopped up from factory, my .02. the z400 is pretty detuned. kinda like the raptor motor. mod them and they "wake up". all im saying is its really hard and takes a lot of money to "wake up" a 400ex motor.
Yeah I know dirtwheels exagerates **** a lot (why I never ordered their subscription,lol). But doesnt mean everything they write is false either. I think they are still a great mag. And I think a 400ex is still a GREAT machine. just not the best!

[stocktires]

Omg....someone reads Dirtliars like the bible here :rolleyes:
You do need to wake up and start thinking for yourself a lil'

Both quads dont have extreme racing motors at all. Both are pretty mild 400cc motors. Both are purty close in performance from the specs. But the Z seems much more capable of handeling mods (liquid cooling, DOHC motor)

A stock z400 WILL NOT produce over 30hp (Someone pulled 48hp out their *****). And if the quad had a very de-tuned exhaust, it still couldn't produce more than 5hp with an aftermarket pipe (The 400ex sometimes only gains 1 hp from some exhausts). The 400ex is definatley de-tuned (cam, head gasket) but not a whole lot. But thats not "HOPPED UP" kid.
Im with bansheeguy77 N/D.
Kid, your numbers dont add up thats for sure.
A crf450f motor produces roughly 50hp, and the Z is nowhere clost to the performance of a crf.
Everything you say seems to be GUESSING, but o well

[TRX250EXER]

do some research guys. most people and companies are getting an average of 7 or 8 hp gains on their dynos from just adding a pipe. this is what ive read not guessing. AND no it didnt come from dirtwheels. what is so darn hard to understand that it is possible to get that much out of a stock motor by doing air flow mods. some people are so stubborn and will only believe what they want. sorry I put in my .02. some of it was a little guessing cuz I forgot EXACT numbers.

P.S... I tired of people calling me kid! lm 20yrs old and legally im an adult. Might not be as old as you old tymers or have been around as long but that doesnt stop me from throwing in my two cents and what I have heard. later:)

[stocktires]

old tymer? hahahahahaahahah, sorry dude, "KID" is just an expression for me, its like saying "dude". I'm younger than you though.

Its just very, very hard to believe that a quad gains 20+% horsepower for an exhaust and filter. 2-strokes barely gain that from a pipe, silencer, and filter!!!
Im just a person who likes real facts, not what somebody heard from their cousins, aunt-T's, brother-in-law's mother kinda thing.

[Guy400]

stocktires, I agree with almost everything you said except for "a stock z400 WILL NOT produce over 30hp". GT Thunder dynoed their STOCK Z400 (http://www.gtthunder.com/dyno400z1.html) at 33.3hp at the rear wheels. Typical 400EX's are only putting out about 27-28hp at the rear wheels.

Now, about the Yosh pipe making 12hp-----wrong. This sounds like the mysterious CT Raptor pipe making 50hp on the dyno. DirtWheels is able to make these claimed horsepower numbers on their bikes but when tons of Raptor owners ran out and bought the same setup none were able to duplicate DW's numbers. Maybe the rest of the country sucks at tuning and the mag experts are tuning wizards. Besides, the Yosh website already states that with their 450cc bore kit and other goodies they're at 46hp at the wheels. Do we really think that Yoshi's going to advertise their $2500 kit that makes 46hp if all the Z owners really need to do is buy their $600 pipe for 50hp?? Read between the lines.

Does the Z400 respond well to mods? Undoubtedly. Check out GT Thunder's website and you'd be impressed. With their intake kit, their exhaust and a set of their cams they got 41hp out of it. That's pretty good considering they're still running stock bore and there's no port work. The Hetrick 440EX they had put out nearly identical numbers but you're talking a 440cc versus stock bore, that equals better reliability.

[TRX250EXER]

yeah and thats at the rearwheels, I was talking about crank. I think it was CT that said there pipe gave the Z an extra 8 ponys. dont know if that was at wheels or crank I suppose the crank. And the yoshi would at least give it that much cuz a lot of Z owners in suzuki boards are claiming that thats one of the best pipes out. yoshi has spent a lot of time with that motor. and yes the dirtbike at the crank can easily push 50hp with few mods. Do some reading. you might be surprised on how close in numbers the performance is too the crf. the crf will still stomp it no prob, i will admit that. but the DRZ is still a good performance bike in its class too. And until honda gets off their ***** and put the crf in a quad frame the Z will be the hottest thing selling in its class. the 440 class or whatever it is. actually thats what im holding out for. cuz Id be all over it.

[stocktires]

Thats what I dont like about HP numbers

Yea, the z (drz) motor is great, i know that. I not sure if I'll be the best selling 400cc machine in the long run though, but prolly with be. There's just so many people that are Honda freaks. HP figures are useless in my opinion, wayyy to easy to tamper with and Its not the very thing to measure a motor's power with alone.
If you don't see a new quad from honda on their 2003 release date, buy the Z.
Typical EX's put out around 25-26HP. But HP matters to much on elevations and temp and all kinds of stuff, so HP figures are useless unless all dynoed from the exact same machine on the same day

[TRX250EXER]

TRUE VERY TRUE.

But im really hoping on honda's release date that there will be a new sport quad that is liquid cooled and DOHC and the works.

Sorry bout all the agueing I started. I know my numbers prolly arent correct but that wasnt really my point. Actually I was just kinda sick of people dissing the Z just because it wasnt a honda. I love honda too but I guess Im not as brand loyal as the rest. Suzuki has always come in second in my book. Yamaha will always be at the bottom tho, lol

[stocktires]

Im not brand loyal, Buy Honda makes some nice quads.
O yea, I hope a New Honda would be 5 valve also and the quad wouldnt be over 370lbs (kick start, no reverse).
But different people want different things

[ESR250R]

well were not racing TT are we. torque stats are as big of a factor when racing mx as hp stats. and with suzuki having the DOHC motor i will almost guarentee that the 400ex has alot more torque than the suzuki. if u guys wanna drag race all the time and worry about whos quad is faster BS then y dont u just buy a banshee, port it, throw a set of T5's on it. why do u think when ppl race 250r's that they dont put a 330 kit on there quad and port it for all top end. they would rather keep it at 250 and powervalve the motor. sure the 330 will put out alot more horsepower but the powervalve will pull better and wont wear u out as fast.