250r vs 450r.

[fox17]

im considering getting a 250r in the future but i was wondering are they as fast as a 450 and do they handle as good as a 450?

[elchankoblanko]

The 250r can be made faster and handle wayyyy better then a 450 the only downside is the cost. Powerwise you will probly need a bigger bore with a powervalve like a 330. That and all new suspension can really start to add up.

[fox17]

thanks. how did you get that woody 250R thing under your name?

[iamjasyn]

This topic is the debate of the last 3 model years... My opinion is obvious, but I can tell you that my ported stock cylinder beats 450r's up sand hills usually with little trouble and is plenty reliable. Top end jobs I can do in my garage in a couple hours with basic tools - minus professional honing.

I don't understand the cost comment because to do this, I put a pipe, carb, reeds, head and porting on it and no extra moving parts to worry about maintaining or breaking. Some people are really getting frustrated with the reliability of modified 450R's. To make a 4stroke that puts out 2stroke style power is a highly strung motor and it WILL cost you more to maintain that style of 4stroke (for example, see the Piss on Honda thread and links in the 450R section). If you want super reliable and cheap buy a 400ex, not a 450R. Personally, I have no desire to buy the new crazy 4stroke. Even if it wasn't a money pit, I still don't like it as much as a well tuned smoker.

My suggestion is if you get a 250R though is don't buy a POS. Buy something close to stock that hasn't been raced and abused and then you'll just maybe want to upgrade small things like bearings and seals. By the way, I discovered recently that simple car wax on a stock frame made the unscratched parts seriously look brand new... Shiny red looks hotter than shiny silver. Tha'ts another thing. They don't put money into the small things anymore. That cast swingarm looks like *** compared to the shiny 88-89 swinger, hell even the 86. You can't even see my friend's 400ex headlight when I turn my stock hallogen on. It's kinda sad.

[csr250r]

i rode both when i was gona buy my quad this summer and i went with the 250r. 250rs handle better and i like their powerband tremedously more. if u would have posted this in the 450r section you might have some totally different oppinions but i had the choice and i still went 2 stroke.

[deathman53]

I have a crf450r in a 250r style frame and atc250r with 310pv, cr ingition and a host of goodies. The 4 stroke makes alot of torque, the 2 stroke is arm ripping mid and top end hit and there is low end also, but not as strong due to a top end carb and pipe. I am really bent on what motor I preffer. The 4 stroke is deffinetly easier to ride and I can ride it longer and seams to be more foregiving if you ride it a gear too high out a corner.
Basically the 2 stroke you will be revving it high and slipping the cluth some on corners, the 4 stroke you can run it a gear high in corners and let the torque pull you forward. It matters what you preffer. I happen to like both, the 2 stroke has a stronger more defined hit and the 4 stroke is just a big pull off of bottom. I like both, so you got a non-biased opinion here. The 2 stroke is far easier to rebuild the motor(even though you have to do it somewhat more often) and its cheaper to do also. The 4 stroke you have valves, cam, cam chain and related stuff with the valve seals to worry about, the 2 stroke- reeds. The 4 stroke is higher maintence.
The new 4 strokes require alot more maintence than the air cooled 4 strokes. The 4 strokes have alot going on inside the motor, the 2 stroke you have the piston, rod and reeds. I am more inclided to go with a 2 stroke as the cost of rebuild are cheaper and almost anybody can rebuild them without problem. Chassis parts are about the same, the 450r sits higher than a 250r.
Another thing to think about is, in a few years you will have to search for chassis and motor parts, while 4 stroke stuff will be around for awhile.
2 strokes are a dying breed as the pro-production rule and almost banning of the 250r in all pro classes. Sadly, I think if you are gonna build a bike, a 450r is a better choice as more stuff will be around for future replacement and repairs. 250r parts are disappearing fast, Honda is discontinuing them as they have a "new" bike, a new generation to buy their stuff and sponserships of pro riders and what wins of sunday sells on monday. For many years the 250r was the only racing chioce, thus no factory sponserships. But now with the big 4 making 450's, they are competing with each other and it didn't help any with almost complete banning of pro's racing 250r's, so its each manufacter's 450 against each other.

deathman....great post!

[Aughtx]

Originally posted by Honda86
deathman....great post!

It should be made a sticky

[bwamos]

They are both equal in their own right IMHO.

I love the 250r though. They are most certianly more fun to ride. And if you're not riding for fun.. then what's the point?

[fox17]

thanks for all the replys. o btw what is the diference from a trx250R and a atc250R?

[Aughtx]

Originally posted by fox17
thanks for all the replys. o btw what is the diference from a trx250R and a atc250R?

The Trx has one more wheel.:D

The engine on the 85 and 86 atc is the same as the 86 trx but will fit all trx years. The 87-89 engine are long rod where the 85-86 are short rods.

[fox17]

thanks for clearin that up for me.

[1986370r]

Originally posted by bwamos
They are both equal in their own right IMHO.

I love the 250r though. They are most certianly more fun to ride. And if you're not riding for fun.. then what's the point?

If this was a serious question... you should be shot....

[WareRacing]

LOL!!!

[fox17]

well i dont pay attention to 3 wheelers.

[deathman53]

it uses the same motor as a trx250r does, I happen to like trikes better.

deathman- if you could post up some pics of your ATC....by reading th mods in your sig it sounds pretty impressive....id liek to see it :cool:

[deathman53]

I have some older pics, but it hasn't chamged much

http://www.pictureposter.allbrand.nu/pictures/deathman53/250r+4-12.JPG.html
http://www.pictureposter.allbrand.nu/pictures/deathman53/250r+4-1.JPG.html
http://www.pictureposter.allbrand.nu/pictures/deathman53/me+at+chatts.JPG.html

There are changed things, those pics have a different motor, different swinger. it now has turf tamers. Those pics might be with the 330 on it.

here is a real old one too, it has the 330 on it, stock tank, 38 a/s, esr atc-5 pipe
http://www.pictureposter.allbrand.nu/pictures/deathman53/330r+8-15.JPG.html
I can do 60 foot jumps in it and can do some crazy stuff, my 200x is pretty impressive too. no pics of the 200x are current right now.

[deathman53]

http://www.pictureposter.allbrand.nu/pictures/deathman53/Cap0014.jpg.html
http://www.pictureposter.allbrand.nu/pictures/deathman53/Cap0013.JPG.html
http://www.pictureposter.allbrand.nu/pictures/deathman53/Cap0006.JPG.html

[Aughtx]

Nice trike! Are those fast trekkers on the rear? Those pics remind me of when I was racing a tecate on my warrior. He had me of course but all of a sudden he locked up the brakes and put it sideways I was like wtf then I realized we forgot about the pond in front of us. We both stopped 10 ft short of going swimming.

[deathman53]

yep, fast trekkers. I like them as they turn very good, but i'm becoming attached to turf tamers, the fast trekkers will stay in case they wil work better.

[iamjasyn]

Three wheelers are fun! They're fun to corner! Those pics bring back memories. Kinda makes me want one again. I never got the hang of jumping them though. I'd always land crooked and about kill myself. I notice you didn't post pics of the landing either though. haha :)

[450rJam]

I bought a 450r and kept my 250r for about a year after.................
then it was just not getting rode at all so I went back on what I said I would never do...........I sold it
the 450r is alot faster than my 250r was, but handling ?
haha not even on the same planet, the 250r was 10X better in the corners.
they are both great racers and alot of fun.....
I dont think the 450r will rule for 20+ years as the 250r did.

[deathman53]

I can land the jumps well, I don't know why I don't have any pics of lanidngs? I'll have to get some pics of landing. I like trikes better than quads. I do have a trx250r I'm buildng and I'm gonna build one for woods riding too.