al-zarqawi dead as a mofo!

[Pappy]

Looks like his number is up!

http://home.peoplepc.com/psp/newsstory.asp?cat=news&referrer=welcome&id=20060608/4487a0c0_3421_1334520060608-876427675

[250R-Dee]

It's about time!! Hopefully we can find the rest of the fanatics who are making the big decisions!!:mad:

whos that?

[ATV Father]

Originally posted by Pappy
Looks like his number is up!

http://home.peoplepc.com/psp/newsstory.asp?cat=news&referrer=welcome&id=20060608/4487a0c0_3421_1334520060608-876427675

:D :D :D :D :D :D :D

It is about time!

who cares anymore, I mean seriously this whole Irag situation is gettin really old lets get out of Iraq and just let them be, or wait lets get out of Iraq and drop one of our HUGE atomic bombs we have... We got all mad at Iraq for having weapons of mass destruction look at us.. I mean HOLY CHIT we could probably blolw up the whole world with out weapons... I hope we are gettin close to the end of Iraq I have 2 cousins who have been over there and not been home for about 3 years now! they both told my aunt they dont think there will be an end, ever because it is so out of control... this won be the end the terrorist he trained will do something and its gettin stupid and pointless for them to do anything to us... we basically rule Iraq even though they have a president they still obey our military rules..

[ATV Father]

Originally posted by 11crash11
who cares anymore, I mean seriously this whole Irag situation is gettin really old lets get out of Iraq and just let them be, or wait lets get out of Iraq and drop one of our HUGE atomic bombs we have... We got all mad at Iraq for having weapons of mass destruction look at us.. I mean HOLY CHIT we could probably blolw up the whole world with out weapons... I hope we are gettin close to the end of Iraq I have 2 cousins who have been over there and not been home for about 3 years now! they both told my aunt they dont think there will be an end, ever because it is so out of control... this won be the end the terrorist he trained will do something and its gettin stupid and pointless for them to do anything to us... we basically rule Iraq even though they have a president they still obey our military rules..

STFU - We are still in Germany and WWII ended when? My friends that have died over there have died to set the people free. There are only a few that are the resistence. Know wtf you are talking about.

[Pappy]

who cares:confused:

thats a great way to think while we have boots on the ground on hostile forgien soil.

history will show that this was the right decision, and as far as al-zarqawi, he got off easy. that was the same SOB that cut the throats of americans on video. he deserved to die a death slow and painful. i personally would like to see a few marines have a football game with his skull.

[Mxjunkie]

Hell yeah one less human being thats lower then whale chit off this planet! They should of f'in beheaded him

And for the guy who said who cares, I have friends that have fought over there and alot of them are going back. It's kinda hard thinking if they will come back or not..

STFU - We are still in Germany and WWII ended when? My friends that have died over there have died to set the people free. There are only a few that are the resistence. Know wtf you are talking about.

haha, I think you should know what your talking about.. I have 2 cousins over there how havent been home in 3 years, they both said its gettin rediculous and for what pappy said actually I do care its good we kill him I am happy for that but Im sayin who cares that we are even over there this is the only progress we have made in about 6 months.. and ATV father if u know SOOOO much about the war with Iraq and everything when did we invade Iraq?? how many Americans lost there lives over there to Iraqis??

[Pappy]

This is not the only progress we have made.


And exactly how long does it take to set up a functioning government...I know it took the good old US of A alot longer then a year.

I wish they would send me over there, I would die for the chance to be part of this. I would also love to be the first grunt over the Iranian border, or Syrian border....GET SOME HOORAAAA:macho

Its kinda weird all the soldiers are wanting to get out of Iraq I bet you guys didnt know over 100 soldiers have commited suicide while being in Iraq... hmm I wonder why? you guys have no Idea what the Iraq situation is so dont even talk about.. my family has pretty much all grown up around the military and I am considering going to the Marines when I turn 21 because thats what age my cousins were when they entered the Army, the guys in Iraq arent even as excited as you guys are! the ones who killed him are but the others are prolly just wishin lets get the hell outta this place.

[Trevor]

Good Keep them comming!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Pappy]

Yeah, your the only one who knows, or who has family there. I reckon my brother has been in Iraq or the middle east more then the states the past 8 or 9 years. One of my very good friends has been deployed since 91 and keeps going back or getting reassigned so he can go back.

MY hope, you carry that attitude to the island, I am sure a D.I. will set you straight;) I have a feeling you will join the 8000 others who joined the military then decide fighting is not your bag. There is always canada:o

And exactly how long does it take to set up a functioning government...I know it took the good old US of A alot longer then a year.


who was breathing down our backs to start a government...?? exactly

[Pappy]

Originally posted by 11crash11
who was breathing down our backs to start a government...?? exactly

LMAO! I think argueing with you on this issue is a mute point.

LMAO! I think argueing with you on this issue is a mute point.


maybe, Im still gettin my point across

[daiglea]

Originally posted by Pappy
Yeah, your the only one who knows, or who has family there. I reckon my brother has been in Iraq or the middle east more then the states the past 8 or 9 years. One of my very good friends has been deployed since 91 and keeps going back or getting reassigned so he can go back.

MY hope, you carry that attitude to the island, I am sure a D.I. will set you straight;) I have a feeling you will join the 8000 others who joined the military then decide fighting is not your bag. There is always canada:o

Hey Pappy, Just remember that other people have pride in theire country. We might not be a military force like the US. But don't be an *** about it.

[NorCalRacer]

Originally posted by daiglea
Hey Pappy, Just remember that other people have pride in theire country. We might not be a military force like the US. But don't be an *** about it.

He was not insulting Canada just saying that is where American draft dodgers run.

[Pappy]

No, you are making yourself seem uneducated on the history of our country, and you obviously have no first hand expierence of what it takes to gear up and sacrifice for your country. What I have garnered from your posts is that you are yourself scared that you may be called to duty if you have what it takes to join our military.

Your cousins indeed may feel there is no point in the work they are doing, but the man on the first floor seldom see's as far down the road as the man on the top floor so thier opinion of what is being done while insightful, hardly can be used as a basis of arguement to shut the whole Iraqi campaign down.

As far as the United States government in its early days, we did indeed have someone breathing down our necks, from other nations interests to our own citizens who wanted a working government in place. If you think our military is applying pressure on the newly formed Iraqi governemnt you are correct, only for the purpose of getting thier job done so they may indeed return home.

Our miltary has a job to do and they are doing it. We also have troops in Korea, Pakistan, Afghanistan and several other areas around this globe defending freedom for those that can not defend themselves. If you do not understand why some of our citizens sign up for this, maybe you should consider a career other then the military. I for one am proud of them and support them fully.

[Pappy]

Originally posted by daiglea
Hey Pappy, Just remember that other people have pride in theire country. We might not be a military force like the US. But don't be an *** about it.

I wasnt bashing canada, i was merely using that as a reference. I believe south america is where alot of todays deserters have been running to.

[Quad18star]

Another one bites the dust !!!!

Any new progress been made in Afgahnistan lately ?? Seems over the last little while , all the attention was switched over from Osama in Afgahnistan to WMD in Iraq . :confused:

As Daiglea said , Canada might not be a military force , but then again we don't have 300 million people to choose from ..... but we still have men and women fighting on foreign soils .

Side note ..... over the weekend , Canadian authorities broke up a Terrorist ring of 17 men in Southern Ontario . They had 3 tons of fertalizer and other bomb making equipement . They had planned to attack various Government buildings and other places of interest in Southern Ontario very soon . They're all behind bars awaiting trial . One of the terrorist said he had planned to storm Parliment Hill , take hostages and behead our Prime Minister . They are all muslims but come from respectable backgrounds .

[derekhonda]

Originally posted by 11crash11


maybe, Im still gettin my point across

No, you are not. You are an idiot and your points do not make sense. We did just what you are telling us to do (again) in the first Gulf War. "Lets just pack up and leave them in shambles. Shoot a few more missles over there and lets get the hell out!!!"

Look what happened? 10 years later, they blow the **** out of one of our most prominant buildings and then boom, we are right back over there to finish it up. Learn your history man.

[Pappy]

Not much coming out of afghanistan. This is a global war, it is not going away and it will take EVERY country getting involved to slow it down. Notice I did not say stop...you will never stop it.

I would also say that once we finally get a handle on the middle east, we will be deploying to other areas to hunt down the terrorist organizations. fact is, the terrorists can use what ever they like to rally thier cause, if you fixed one issue they will drum up another one.

[Pappy]

Originally posted by Quad18star
Another one bites the dust !!!!

Any new progress been made in Afgahnistan lately ?? Seems over the last little while , all the attention was switched over from Osama in Afgahnistan to WMD in Iraq . :confused:



Id lay money that the WMD's that everyone knew saddam had went to syria, and iran and are scattered in a number of countries by now.

Pappy, you know what, bashing me about how Im not strong enough to be in the army is not really upsetting me I could care less if a moderator called me strong... I have a 2nd team Missouri All State football hangin up in my room right now that tells me Im strong, I play all 3 sports and have gotten at least all district in all 3 that tells Im strong, I have been on the B honerroll my whole high school years that tells me Im strong academically, so dont tell me Im not strong enough to go to the army, I garuntee you I am twice the man most people on this website are..

[derekhonda]

Originally posted by Pappy
Id lay money that the WMD's that everyone knew saddam had went to syria, and iran and are scattered in a number of countries by now.

Pappy, in one of my classes at school there was a 24 year old who had just served a tour in Iraq and he had pictures of a weapons truck they discovered. We were having a discussion about whether or not to pull out of Iraq and my school is about 80% left wing (some very left wing) and he basically stood up in class, told them if they havn't been to Iraq to shut the **** up, we are needed there, for the most part we are welcomed there, and he'd bring in pictures of these weapons Sadam doesn't have. It ended the discussion. Damn hippies...

[initall]

Originally posted by 11crash11
LMAO! I think argueing with you on this issue is a mute point.


maybe, Im still gettin my point across





Guys we are arguing with someone that can't spell. So I really doubt his factual knowledge on this topic. If he can't take the time to look over his spelling that tells me he has not looked fully into the events of the Middle East.

[derekhonda]

Originally posted by 11crash11
Pappy, you know what, bashing me about how Im not strong enough to be in the army is not really upsetting me I could care less if a moderator called me strong... I have a 2nd team Missouri All State football hangin up in my room right now that tells me Im strong, I play all 3 sports and have gotten at least all district in all 3 that tells Im strong, I have been on the B honerroll my whole high school years that tells me Im strong academically, so dont tell me Im not strong enough to go to the army, I garuntee you I am twice the man most people on this website are..

Hahahahaha.....

I think he is talking more about being mentally strong, bud.

"I can play football really well. Therefor, I would excel in the army" -11crash11

[Quad18star]

Originally posted by Pappy

I would also say that once we finally get a handle on the middle east, we will be deploying to other areas to hunt down the terrorist organizations. fact is, the terrorists can use what ever they like to rally thier cause, if you fixed one issue they will drum up another one.

Define what you mean when you say "diploying to other areas" . Do you mean sending in US troops into other countries or ....??

sorry I forgot June 8th was suck up to the moderator day... :confused: whoops... hey what word did I misspell there Huckleberry Finn??

[Quad18star]

Originally posted by initall
Originally posted by 11crash11
LMAO! I think argueing with you on this issue is a mute point.


maybe, Im still gettin my point across





Guys we are arguing with someone that can't spell. So I really doubt his factual knowledge on this topic. If he can't take the time to look over his spelling that tells me he has not looked fully into the events of the Middle East.

LMAO .... the guy forgets one letter and he's labelled as not fully knowing the "factual knowledge" of a topic . WOW !!!!!:rolleyes:

[Pappy]

Originally posted by 11crash11
Pappy, you know what, bashing me about how Im not strong enough to be in the army is not really upsetting me I could care less if a moderator called me strong... I have a 2nd team Missouri All State football hangin up in my room right now that tells me Im strong, I play all 3 sports and have gotten at least all district in all 3 that tells Im strong, I have been on the B honerroll my whole high school years that tells me Im strong academically, so dont tell me Im not strong enough to go to the army, I garuntee you I am twice the man most people on this website are..

You wouldnt make a pimple on a Marines *** son. Id have you for 5 minutes and you would be crying for your mom. Talk is cheap, call me from the island, until then go look at your plaque on the wall, I will go look at the flags that draped my Father and Grand fathers coffins, both of which never played college ball, but both served honorably for thier country. If you dont get it, you wont get it until you've expierenced it for yourself.

This thread was about a terrorist being killed, not about you or your half cocked opinions on this war.

[derekhonda]

Originally posted by 11crash11
sorry I forgot June 8th was suck up to the moderator day... :confused: whoops... hey what word did I misspell there Huckleberry Finn??

No, but pappy happens to be a smart man and I find myself agreeing with a lot of the things he says, and the war in the middle east is one of them. My cousin too happens to be in Iraq, I was just talking to him on aol this is what his away message said when he left:

"breakin news Al -Zarqawi is DEAD!!!!! hell yea ....."

This is a real motivation boost for the soldiers over seas man.

However, before you do form such a strong opinion on a subject, I do suggest you research history a little.

[Pappy]

Originally posted by 11crash11
sorry I forgot June 8th was suck up to the moderator day... :confused: whoops... hey what word did I misspell there Huckleberry Finn??

Noone has to suck up to me, I am fully capable of debating you on any subject by myself, except "idiocy" which you seem to have me on.

If you want facts thats fine, but do not come after me if you start loosing control of your "point"

[Quad18star]

Ken , check out the question I asked on the previous page ..... just incase you passed it by without reading it ..... just curious to see what you think .

[Pappy]

Originally posted by Quad18star
Define what you mean when you say "diploying to other areas" . Do you mean sending in US troops into other countries or ....??

I think alot will depend on this upcoming election in 2008.

The war on terror will be a huge issue, and it could take things in directions that noone can forsee.

I personally feel the war on terror will scale down in a few years and it will become something you read about when they find them, no matter where that will be. Special OP units are being trained right now for unconventional missions in counties we know terrorists are hiding in. (not that they werent before, but specific missions etc)

I also see some big changes coming in the middle east, especially if we can get Osama. Ofcourse Ho Chi Min died and the Vietnam war continued, but I believe this is a different time. The problem is with this fundementalist movement is that we are fighting beliefs, religious beliefs. And from the past, this is the type of battle that has been fought for centuries, not just years. You kill a man and let his son carry on the fight kind of thing.

yah I bet he was on AOL.. what was he doin carryin his labtop in his hand and typin at the same time while hes gettin shot at... :confused: .. sure... I bet he called you on the telephone to didnt he??

[Slinky]

Being phsycally strong and having a good academic background is definately not what Pappy was talking about. The biggest strongest guy would mean nothing if he didnt have the mental streght to stand up to what goes on over there.(hence i doubt i'd ever make it in the military)
I've had friends over in Iraq, 2 had their humvee hit with an RPG but luckily came home with minor wounds.
I also know a few guys that are trying to get back over to Afgan and Iraq...not all soldiers wanna come home, its only the small portion that the news glorifies.
When i talk with people that have been there and see how much the majority of Iraqi and afgani people thank them and appreciate what their doing, it shows that we are over there for a reason. Dont always believe what the news tells you....

[initall]

Garuntee X2
Hangin
Blolw

at a glance that is what I found





"LMAO .... the guy forgets one letter and he's labelled as not fully knowing the "factual knowledge" of a topic . WOW !!!!!"


That was a real dumb response from you Quadstar

I labeled him based off of his posts. I was merely making an observation based off of his spelling.

[Pappy]

Originally posted by 11crash11
yah I bet he was on AOL.. what was he doin carryin his labtop in his hand and typin at the same time while hes gettin shot at... :confused: .. sure... I bet he called you on the telephone to didnt he??


My brother has called from Iraq several times, and sends my mother emails on a regular basis.

LMAO .... the guy forgets one letter and he's labelled as not fully knowing the "factual knowledge" of a topic . WOW !!!!!


No jok I mean tis is relly starten too pis me of.. I mean stop the bulsht and dont tipe stuped thingz, Im going too cry if you guyz dont quite saying i cant tipe :chinese:

[JRP]

Originally posted by Mxjunkie
Hell yeah one less human being thats lower then whale chit off this planet! They should of f'in beheaded him

And for the guy who said who cares, I have friends that have fought over there and alot of them are going back. It's kinda hard thinking if they will come back or not..

[Pappy]

Originally posted by 11crash11
No jok I mean tis is relly starten too pis me of.. I mean stop the bulsht and dont tipe stuped thingz, Im going too cry if you guyz dont quite saying i cant tipe :chinese:

You want to get back on topic with some facts to bolster your point or have you decided that your point is not as well recieved as you want to think it is?

[TheX1992]

Originally posted by 11crash11
yah I bet he was on AOL.. what was he doin carryin his labtop in his hand and typin at the same time while hes gettin shot at... :confused: .. sure... I bet he called you on the telephone to didnt he??

Even I can prove you wrong on this one. I talk to a few of my buddies who are in Iraq right now. They have a few computer lounges they can come to once every couple weeks. They get mail, talk on the phone to you, internet, everything.

You really need to look into your facts before you say something so stupid like you just did.

seriously guys Im gettin so sad becuase you guys are mouthin me, just knock it off. I am about to cry.. I mean you guys are just so hardcore and I cant handle it anymore, If I fought u guys u would kill me in a fight, by the way... pappy, you cant say if u fought me you would win... you have 14,000 post you spend your time on this website not in the weightroom... or on the internet doin wennie exercises dont count...

[Quad18star]

Originally posted by Pappy
I think alot will depend on this upcoming election in 2008.

The war on terror will be a huge issue, and it could take things in directions that noone can forsee.

I personally feel the war on terror will scale down in a few years and it will become something you read about when they find them, no matter where that will be. Special OP units are being trained right now for unconventional missions in counties we know terrorists are hiding in. (not that they werent before, but specific missions etc)

I also see some big changes coming in the middle east, especially if we can get Osama. Ofcourse Ho Chi Min died and the Vietnam war continued, but I believe this is a different time. The problem is with this fundementalist movement is that we are fighting beliefs, religious beliefs. And from the past, this is the type of battle that has been fought for centuries, not just years. You kill a man and let his son carry on the fight kind of thing.

Seems to be working already . Like I said in an earlier post ... 17 suspected terrorists were caught over the weekend . The authorities were tracking these men for the last 3 years before they stepped in and dismantled their ring . The men had purhased 3 tons of fertalizer off undercover RCMP officers .... it had only taken 1 ton to do the damage in the Oklahoma bombing . It was suspected that they had wanted to hit the CN Tower , the Canadian Stock Exchange , Parliment Hill and Queens Park ( government buildings) . It was a collaboration between different Canadian and US authorities that put a stop to it .

Now I agree with this type of terror ring dismatling , but I would not agree with having armed troops from another country walking through the streets searching for terrorists .

[Pappy]

Once again, you side step the fact that you wanted a debate on this issue, you can not stand behind your issue so you come after me on a personal side.

I never said I wanted to fight you, and I am glad you think that I am weak or in some way unable to properly defend myself. This is the thinking of a fool. Your feable attempt to sway opinion has backfired, your attempt to make me appear weak will fail and truthfully, I am not the one hiding behind a computer. I will try and not take what you post personally, infact you do not even rate enough to make me chuckle at your stupidity.

Now, with all that said, once again I give you the oppertunity to change your direction and debate your "point" in a way that is more fitting for open discussion.

I have more respect for my enemies that stand and fight and die for thier cause then I do for some of our own citizens who cower behind the freedom and safety our military affords and who are too damn chicken to do anything besides run thier gums about an issue they are too afraid to tackle.

:eek: wow pappy 14,124.. post theres a new erotica website that you have to do some wennie exercises on if youd like.. Im guessing 14,125 will come after the wennie smacks right??? its lunch time Ill be back in a bit.. :blah:

[Pappy]

Originally posted by Quad18star


Now I agree with this type of terror ring dismatling , but I would not agree with having armed troops from another country walking through the streets searching for terrorists .

I think that you are correct. The biggest mistake our government has made IMO is that when we do place our military on the ground, it tends to gain the opposite effect then what we had envisioned. (Korea, Vietnam, Mogodishu, Beirut and the list goes on) The only way our military works is to let them do what we train them to do, kill with extreme predjudice. Unfortunatley, we as a society can not take that and slap the cuffs on our military. IMO, if you are not willing to allow them to do what needs to be done, then find another way.

You can not scare fundementalists, they are radicals and will stop short of anything they feel can do harm to us or our country. And when that fails they will seek targets that have little way of defending themselves (hotels, schools etc)

[derekhonda]

Originally posted by 11crash11
seriously guys Im gettin so sad becuase you guys are mouthin me, just knock it off. I am about to cry.. I mean you guys are just so hardcore and I cant handle it anymore, If I fought u guys u would kill me in a fight, by the way... pappy, you cant say if u fought me you would win... you have 14,000 post you spend your time on this website not in the weightroom... or on the internet doin wennie exercises dont count...

At this point in time I'd stomp your face in too. Not only are you fully retarded, you are ignorant too, the worst kind. And I am going to delete my cousins screen name, Yes he is on aol, he has a computer in his barracks and he gets on in his downtime to talk to his family, friends, and girlfriend. You don't wanna believe me, thats fine.

[Pappy]

Originally posted by 11crash11
its lunch time Ill be back in a bit.. :blah:

I dont think so....

[derekhonda]

HAHAHAHAHAHA

[sickmojave]

Originally posted by Pappy
I dont think so....

Thank You :devil:

[Quad18star]

Originally posted by initall
Garuntee X2
Hangin
Blolw

at a glance that is what I found


"LMAO .... the guy forgets one letter and he's labelled as not fully knowing the "factual knowledge" of a topic . WOW !!!!!"


That was a real dumb response from you Quadstar

I labeled him based off of his posts. I was merely making an observation based off of his spelling.

And I was just making an observation based on what goes on around here a LOT .

From what you quoted from the guy , there was 1 spelling mistake and you labelled him as not knowing everything about a subject . How many " well respected" people on this website make spelling or typing mistakes .... yet they don't get jumped on for it . So cut the guy some slack ...... if he's wrong with his facts , prove him to be wrong with credible facts .... not say that he doesn't know what he's talking about cuz he spelt a few words wrong .

Like Pappy said , this subject is about 1 less terrorist on the planet , so we'll return to that .

And don't worry , I'll cut you some slack cuz you spelt my name wrong .... it's Quad18star , not Quadstar !!!;)

my ip is 64.251.129.88 and 64.251.140.153

[Pappy]

Its hard folks, you shut them down then you have 3 threads complaining that you ban someone because they dont agree with you. I love a good debate, on the issues and I am open to all views. I can not walk on water so by logic I have not figured out all the answers to everything:p

[Quad18star]

Originally posted by Pappy
Its hard folks, you shut them down then you have 3 threads complaining that you ban someone because they dont agree with you. I love a good debate, on the issues and I am open to all views. I can not walk on water so by logic I have not figured out all the answers to everything:p

The only person around here to know all the answers is Wilkin .... and I'm sure he can walk on water , but doesn't want to put all of us to shame just yet . :p

[300exOH]

I think it's awesome they got al-zarqawi. One more for the good guys. I think the military still has a looong road ahead of them though. I agree things will probably calm down over there after a while but I think it will be at least a couple more years. I could see al-zarqawi's death causing a big uprising from al-queda(sp). I just hope the elections in 2008 don't screw up our current miliary plans. We don't need some new pres. to come along and start withdrawing troops before the job is done.

on a side note- I can't believe this 12crash12 kid thinks that sports/good grades in high school qualify him to be a marine. I don't think he'd last five minutes. The first time he lipped off to the drill sgt. he would find out just how much of a man he is...or isn't.:macho

[Pappy]

Alot of the terrorists in Iraq are being given up by the Iraqi people, maybe now that they got this dipchit more will be willing to expose others. Fear is a powerful weapon, and you can bet, just like in other insurgencys that the terrorists have fear on everyones minds(thats what they do:p )

Id like to see Osama be next, it would not stop it all, but it would be a good sign that the leadership is being sucked dry of its money and control.

[derekhonda]

plus he'd be violating the don't ask don't tell policy.

[300exOH]

Originally posted by Pappy
Alot of the terrorists in Iraq are being given up by the Iraqi people, maybe now that they got this dipchit more will be willing to expose others. Fear is a powerful weapon, and you can bet, just like in other insurgencys that the terrorists have fear on everyones minds(thats what they do:p )

Id like to see Osama be next, it would not stop it all, but it would be a good sign that the leadership is being sucked dry of its money and control.

I agree finding Osama is one of the keys to ending this thing. I thought I heard that the special op's were looking for him in another country..maybe Afghanistan?

[Pappy]

I think he is moving between Pakistan and Afghanistan, or he could be in a completely different region of the world. Finding 1 man is a hard task in these countires....too bad Clinton did not take him out when he had the chance:ermm:


I know the world over is targeting these guys, that still doesnt make me sleep well at nights, I would prefer an end with results.

[300exOH]

It is a bit of a needle in a haystack. They have some pretty rough terrain over there and many places to hide. I just have to wonder who is nuts enough to harbor this idiot in other countries.

I think it would've helped if Clinton had taken him out but I don't think it would've prevented things.

I too would like to see the situation resolved but it could be a long time the way things look. It's a bit scary but I feel pretty safe here in the states knowing we have the best trained military in the world. I'm not in any hurry to travel abroad though.

[Pappy]

Oh im not scared inside our borders, I just do not like the thought of the bombings abroad. Alot of innocent folks dying over this, and being the type of war it is, noone can see it comming.


I honestly think that if the citizens of this country would toughen up, and send a strong message to the world that we will destroy you period, alot of this nonsense would stop.

I had a lady a few weeks back comment to me how scared she was seeing the protests in Iran on the TV. I informed her that those protests had been state organized and run on thier national TV for the last 25 years every friday after their prayer.

I wonder how the citizens of some of these countries would react if they saw 500,000 Americans on TV burning thier flags and leaders like they do and chanting death to all Iranians:confused: Or went to websites where they saw some hard core folks taking care of a terrorist?

What they get to see is Americans downing our leadership, our Military and just about anything negative they can find or make up. If they would allow it, I would be first in line to take my 45 and send the brains of a terrorist flying on the TV, then I would take a crap on the Quran just to piss them off even more. I know two wrongs dont make a right, but it seems like the way we have been doing things is getting us to our goal ever so slowly.

Fill the field with soldiers and the war becomes a different story. Chasing these peckerheads through the streets one at a time will not win us anything.

[300exOH]

Yeah. It's sad to see all the innocent people die. Especially when its a school or anything to do with children. I for one am sick of these idiots putting down our gov't while hiding behind our flag. Our system isn't perfect but it's all we have. People need to stand up and support our military even if they think the war is wrong. They are getting much better treatment than they did after vietnam though.

I think maybe we should remind them of Hiroshima and Nagasaki. We need do to prove to them that we aren't playing around. I wouldn't have a problem with taking out a terrorist at all. I could use some target practice.:scary:

[popo]

Originally posted by 300exOH
Yeah. It's sad to see all the innocent people die. Especially when its a school or anything to do with children. I for one am sick of these idiots putting down our gov't while hiding behind our flag. Our system isn't perfect but it's all we have. People need to stand up and support our military even if they think the war is wrong. They are getting much better treatment than they did after vietnam though.


Good point. What's also sad....when an American solider is brought back and laid to rest, there's fricking whack groups that to go out and protest at the funeral.

Than demand Police presence to protect them. Bulllll chit!

[Quad18star]

Originally posted by 300exOH
Yeah. It's sad to see all the innocent people die. Especially when its a school or anything to do with children.

I think maybe we should remind them of Hiroshima and Nagasaki. We need do to prove to them that we aren't playing around. I wouldn't have a problem with taking out a terrorist at all. I could use some target practice.:scary:

Dropping a bomb like that dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki will only cause what you said in the first part of your reply to be sad .

More innocent people would die as opposed to those that chant " Death to America" . There might be a few thousand radicals out there that want nothing more that for themselves to destroy the rest of the world , but there is also hundreds of thousands of people in those countries that are applauding the efforts made by military personel . A prime example of that , was when US troops pulled down the statue of Saddam Hussein.

[edltz]

Hell ya its bull****,thats just empowering the enemy,we really need to just let the marines do what there trained to do,and not let them think they will be court marshalled for upsetting a terrorist!!! I dont know you pappy but im right with ya

[rbgnwa45]

Originally posted by Pappy
There is always canada:o

That's funny :p . I don't know much about the situation in Iraq, but to reply to someone that said why don't we just nuke the whole damn place.... Innocent people, idiot. People live in poverty over there, and have no control over their government, so they are not to blame. If you want a good perspective of American soldiers in Iraq, there is a good show on A&E, I forget what it's called, but many death's were caused by counter intelligence. So they killed al-zargawi (I still don't know who that is), but there's still a lot more terrorists out there. These countries are governed under merciless radicals and I believe it is everybody's duty (who has the power to do so) to help. I'd just like to put in that, I'm all for the US and what they are doing, but I don't like when people (especially soldiers?!) make racist comments and call the Iraq's towelheads etc...Just because you are fighting someone different than you, doesn't mean you have to be ignorant to the religion for which they stand for. I'd say it shows fear, ignorance, disprespect & all that. Let's have some class people.

R.I.P to all those who have died in the bull****.


HUU RAAAA!!!

[ak_stick]

Originally posted by 11crash11
Its kinda weird all the soldiers are wanting to get out of Iraq I bet you guys didnt know over 100 soldiers have commited suicide while being in Iraq... hmm I wonder why? you guys have no Idea what the Iraq situation is so dont even talk about.. my family has pretty much all grown up around the military and I am considering going to the Marines when I turn 21 because thats what age my cousins were when they entered the Army, the guys in Iraq arent even as excited as you guys are! the ones who killed him are but the others are prolly just wishin lets get the hell outta this place.

You little Punk. You have no idea the living conditions, working conditions, or life of the soldiers over here, the stress, heat, and everyday sacrifices here would eat you alive. Dont try and pull the suicide card, people commit suicide at home all the time at home too.

Ofcorse we all want out of Iraq, it sucks being away from home for a year, away from your husband/wife, girlfriend/boyfriend, sons and daughters, and friends and family. These are sacrifices that you have no knowledge of. Dont try and tell me why I (yes I'm writing this from Iraq) want to come home. Because you dont understand the half of it.

Big woo you've grown up around the military, that doesn't mean jack. So did I, and it did not ammount to beans when I joined the military. Why wait till your 21? Afraid you might get called on if you join at 18? You come see me when you've been out of basic for 6 months to a year and you start to understand the military life. Untill then, dont try and blow any smoke up my rear about how your so in tune with the military way of life.

[300exOH]

Originally posted by Quad18star
Dropping a bomb like that dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki will only cause what you said in the first part of your reply to be sad .

More innocent people would die as opposed to those that chant " Death to America" . There might be a few thousand radicals out there that want nothing more that for themselves to destroy the rest of the world , but there is also hundreds of thousands of people in those countries that are applauding the efforts made by military personel . A prime example of that , was when US troops pulled down the statue of Saddam Hussein.

I didn't mean to say that we should drop any nuclear bombs on Iraq. I just meant that we need them to understand that we are that serious about disbanding the terrorists. We have many other weapons at our disposal without using nukes. I think our military is doing a good job at avoiding killing the innocent. There have been a few but for the most part it has been minimal compared to other wars.

[300exOH]

Originally posted by popo
Good point. What's also sad....when an American solider is brought back and laid to rest, there's fricking whack groups that to go out and protest at the funeral.

Than demand Police presence to protect them. Bulllll chit!

That just pisses me off when I see these liberal idiots protesting the war at a soldiers funeral. :mad: I can't think of anything more disrespectful. They are lucky some of the soldiers families haven't hunted these people like dogs. As far as I'm concerned they are no better than the terrorists. If they are so unhappy with our gov't maybe they should spend a few years in the middle east and see how happy they are.

[edltz]

hey ak_stick thanx for what your doing:D

[Quad18star]

Originally posted by 300exOH
I didn't mean to say that we should drop any nuclear bombs on Iraq. I just meant that we need them to understand that we are that serious about disbanding the terrorists. We have many other weapons at our disposal without using nukes. I think our military is doing a good job at avoiding killing the innocent. There have been a few but for the most part it has been minimal compared to other wars.

Alright thanks for clearing that up .... just the wording in your reply had made it seem like you thought that dropping a nuke would solve the problem .

Personally, I think that these radicals are well aware that the military efforts put forth by other Nations are serious , but it has been drilled into the minds of these people for generations that they must fight and kill anyone that does not agree with their mindset . Look at what they are doing on a daily basis ..... they are not only targetting military personel , but they are attacking their own people because they don't agree with eachother .

It has been a war between themselves for centuries and now that other nations are becoming involved , it's become a war between Nations , especially against the USA because you guys have the largest presence in their homeland .

I agree that the military is doing a good job at making sure the least amount of civilian lives is taken ... war is war and innocent people will unfortunately be killed , but I think that if a nation was to deliberatly drop a bomb or use any type of weapon knowing that it will kill more innocent people than radicals , they would be frowned upon by the rest of the world .

[ak_stick]

It is not a war between nations, but rather a war between cultures. Death and violence is the only thing these animals understand, that is why people like zarqawi and saddam take charge.

They are not a civilized culture, and we cant treat them or fight them as one. They dont function that way. The only way to fight them is the way they fight.

[300exOH]

Originally posted by Quad18star
Alright thanks for clearing that up .... just the wording in your reply had made it seem like you thought that dropping a nuke would solve the problem .

Personally, I think that these radicals are well aware that the military efforts put forth by other Nations are serious , but it has been drilled into the minds of these people for generations that they must fight and kill anyone that does not agree with their mindset . Look at what they are doing on a daily basis ..... they are not only targetting military personel , but they are attacking their own people because they don't agree with eachother .

It has been a war between themselves for centuries and now that other nations are becoming involved , it's become a war between Nations , especially against the USA because you guys have the largest presence in their homeland .

I agree that the military is doing a good job at making sure the least amount of civilian lives is taken ... war is war and innocent people will unfortunately be killed , but I think that if a nation was to deliberatly drop a bomb or use any type of weapon knowing that it will kill more innocent people than radicals , they would be frowned upon by the rest of the world .

Yeah. Sorry about that. I don't want anyone to think that I think nukes are the answer. It was kind of an incomplete thought. Sometimes my fingers get ahead of my brain.:o

You're right that their mindset is part of the problem. If someone doesn't agree with them then they think they must die. And the worst part is that it's for religious reasons.

I think the fact that we can't just drop some bomb on them is part of the problem too. We would lose a lot of allies if we did. The terrorists know we can't just bomb them so they just keep doing what they're doing.

[Pappy]

Originally posted by rbgnwa45
Just because you are fighting someone different than you, doesn't mean you have to be ignorant to the religion for which they stand for. I'd say it shows fear, ignorance, disprespect & all that. Let's have some class people.

Actually, for a soldier it is perfectly normal to dehumanize your enemy and using phrases is all a spin off of that mind set. It does seem to help at the time thinking you just put a bullet in the head of a raghead, rather then dwelling on the fact that you just took a human life.

The gloves come off in combat, and i would love to see a squad of Marines laughing about waxing a few "Enemy Combatants" then I would watching the negativity they show now. And as far as I am concerned, those fighting us deserve nothing more then a size 10 boot print on thier ***. How they get there means NOTHING to me.

[<DRS>GPF]

Although El-Zuccini was an arse, there are worse things than death for people of his nature..

I for one wouldnt have informed the world he was killed.. the fear of the unknown is a powerful ally..

If the hadnt informed the media, but let rumors fly, imagine what insurgents might think.. " what else have the coalition forces done but not yet reported.." is all they'd be thinking...
scared for the things they arent sure of, itd mentally undermine their effort.

if you truly believe that removing Saddam was the right thing, then what about N Korea? Iran? Serbia? Where do you think Saddam's and Bin Laden's funding started from? (not the stock market i assure you..)
Serbian's were slaughtering Kosovans in a genocide fashion.. it was being reported and ignored by the US, who found it in their heart to save kuwait and saudi arabia even after the news of serbia's atrocities..
US "peacekeeping" forces didnt set foot in kosovo until kuait was "liberated".. they even had the nerve to tell the US to get out by a certain date because of their religious holiday..
the UAE is not our friends, but ur govt. wont stop kissing up to them.
Like said earlier, history will tell.. hind-sight is 20/20..

and before you come and beat me up about "what do I know".. I know alot..
Ive walked the wall to keep the wolf at bay.. Ive had a scoped gun pointed at me with a finger on the trigger, Ive held my friend as he breathed his last breath and ive done and seen things that are forever burned into my conscience, unable to be forgotten..

all for my country and the freedom to tell you about it..

Ive got a brother, 3 cousins, 4 very close friends, and a host of aquaintences from commanding general's down to the lowly privates that are there.
2 "kids" from my little town of 3K have been sent home to be buried from this mess..
alot of good the medals were to the grieving parents and family.. thats not to say that they arent proud of their son's contributions to this country, as am i.. but this is the right fight for the wrong reasons..

he11, im a walking pit of controversy, eager to tell you how much you dont know about me..

i will tell you that if you come into my backyard and attempt to instill your beliefs upon me, i will do anything it takes to keep my children free of mind..

many insurgents in iraq are al qaeda, many just want the US and friends to leave and are doing as i would expect any proud american to do if we were infiltrated..

the welcome wagon has left iraq and it was empty..

this whole Iraq situation should be over in 3-5 years my brother is over there and he told my dad in a postcard that all thats left to do is set up there government and a armed forces group for them... my mom was in the army and she was the person that ran into the line of fire and picked up dead bodies and brought them back with her and confirmed them dead in action or some missing in action... she died in Iraq in September 2004 and our family all misses her ...

[Pappy]

Originally posted by <DRS>GPF


if you truly believe that removing Saddam was the right thing, then what about N Korea? Iran? Serbia? Where do you think Saddam's and Bin Laden's funding started from? (not the stock market i assure you..)
Serbian's were slaughtering Kosovans in a genocide fashion.. it was being reported and ignored by the US, who found it in their heart to save kuwait and saudi arabia even after the news of serbia's atrocities..
US "peacekeeping" forces didnt set foot in kosovo until kuait was "liberated".. they even had the nerve to tell the US to get out by a certain date because of their religious holiday..
the UAE is not our friends, but ur govt. wont stop kissing up to them.


You could add Cambodia, Lybia, Kenya, Lybiria and a host of other nations to the list that we decided was not worth getting involved in. And if I am not mistaken, our role in Serbia was on request from the UN?

eh...the UN...talk about a joke in itself.

[Dupontster]

Here's what this thread is all about....enjoy...

off the subject. but I do not understand how the states can go to war with a country, with the intent to kill. and the mission being to remove saddam. THEN they catch him, and dont kill him?? what gives? they kill all these people and reak havoc on a country to get this man, then once they got him they take him to a court witch he does not even acknowldge, to try him for crimes witch his also does not acknowledge with laws he does not acknowledge.

pump him full of truth syrum

[F-16Guy]

Originally posted by Dupontster
Here's what this thread is all about....enjoy...
I see his head is still attached to his neck:mad: :mad: :mad:

[MOFO]

Originally posted by F-16Guy
I see his head is still attached to his neck:mad: :mad: :mad:

Thats what I was thinking. This a-hole got off easy... quick and painless. :grr:

[Pappy]

I havent had a chance to watch the news to see the video of those two wonderful 500 pound bombs hitting the house that SOB was in. I think it should be played ever hour on the hour for about a week!

hey momma zarqawi....looks like your son is on a slab. Your lucky I cant get to him or I'd skull **** him for the fun of it:macho

[300exOH]

Originally posted by Pappy
I havent had a chance to watch the news to see the video of those two wonderful 500 pound bombs hitting the house that SOB was in. I think it should be played ever hour on the hour for about a week!

hey momma zarqawi....looks like your son is on a slab. Your lucky I cant get to him or I'd skull **** him for the fun of it:macho

LMFAO! :devil: Tell em how ya really feel.:eek2: :D

[250R-Dee]

FYI - 11crash11 is the guy who supposedly ordered a Custom Mustang with Viper exhaust (http://www.exriders.com/vbb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=236559)

I have (6) cousins and more than (50) friends in Iraq right now so I want this situation to end as soon as possible. BUT I also want this situaition to have a decisive ending that will lead to a stable Iraq and not another terrorist filled haven. The only problem is there are other terrorist havens nearby and here in asia. I have also lost more friends than I care to mention. RIP - Semper Fidelis!

Here are some facts that some people do not realize or even care to acknowledge:

Some the innocents are NOT so innocent because they willing serve as human shields. They think they will become martyrs if they die protecting their beloved terrorists. Many innocent people are killed by insurgents in attempts to bully the locals into not turning them in or just to wreck havoc. These people have been fighting for so long that they most of the fanatics have no idea why they are fighting. They only know hatred for people who do not think the same as them because that is what has been taught for more years than I would like to count.

Is this squirmish going to change the mindset of the diehard fanatic? NO, but their percentage of the population will be much smaller. Can we fight all of the civil wars going in the world right now? Hell NO!! Why doesn't France send some people over to nasty areas in Europe? Because they are too busy fighting their own internal strifes and eating croissants. Why does the US have to be the world police? Why does the US have to help rebuild so many other nations?

Do I know the answers to my questions? YES, but I'd like some of people to ponder them for a while.

I will not start with the media and their one-sided polictical agendas that are getting our service members and civilians killed!

That's all I have to say for now because I am getting a bit too fired up right now:devil:

[crday98]

Originally posted by 11crash11
I am considering going to the Marines when I turn 21 because thats what age my cousins were when they entered the Army, the guys in Iraq arent even as excited as you guys are! the ones who killed him are but the others are prolly just wishin lets get the hell outta this place.
1. you are pissing and moaning about our military fighting a war yet you are going to join it??? you are the typical jackoff that joins the military to play army with no real intent of actually going to war and fighting for our country!! if you were, you wouldn't have said the idiotic things you said.

2. what gives you the right to speak for our troops fighting over there???? how do you know the guys in iraq aren't as excited as we are? have you been there??? i have two very close friends that were over there for 2 years. because of all the anti-war cry babies over here, i asked them "do you really feel that we need to be over there?" they both said "ABSOLUTELY!" and they both have no negative feelings about returning to iraq!

your best bet is to stop posting. you keep digging yourself deeper and deeper and appear to be losing more brain cells each time you post!

[<DRS>GPF]

Originally posted by Pappy
I havent had a chance to watch the news to see the video of those two wonderful 500 pound bombs hitting the house that SOB was in. I think it should be played ever hour on the hour for about a week!

hey momma zarqawi....looks like your son is on a slab. Your lucky I cant get to him or I'd skull **** him for the fun of it:macho


lol.. pappy, i think youre holding back..



ya know, they said he was alive when US troops got there..

i wonder what he was thinking...

"OW that hurt... thank allah help is here.. oh wait.. OW OW OW OW OW OW OW OW..........." *click-click* "OW OW OW OW OW OW OW OW....."

so we attack a country that didn't have one terrorist on the planes, which is iraq for those of you that don't know what i'm referring to, you'd think for someone that hates us so much(saddam) he'd be able to find a crazy buddy or nephew wanting to die(no pun intended) to be on one of those planes?( saudi arabia had 15 by the way, we don't seem to have a problem with them...hmmm that's a mystery) we have a un inspector saying there's no weapons!(there were chemicals, we knew that because we gave them to them to fight iran..you know enemy of my enemy is my friend) saddam says we don't have bombs we don't have bombs(which somehow we haven't found?)...but guess what we attack anyway....that's fine we're the big bad u.s. ...cool...what i don't get is we have another nut in korea saying yea i got bombs what are you gonna do about it!!!??? and we do nothing....explain please!!


for those of you that may and try to some how turn what i'm saying..hold up...i'm not saying the u.s. isn't the greatest country on earth, i'm just saying it could easily be better...and also i have a 23yr cousin who i held as a baby over there so don't try that angle either...every time i talk to him i tell him we don't need a hero over this bull! please come home safe..a sidebar- i recently got married..and you can ask my wife, i said over and over again i wish jarrad(my cousin) was here, so obviosly this isn't something i take litely, to be one of the greatest days of my life, and my mind waunders thinking about a young man fighting and possibly dying for what a think to be some rich peoples cause...

SO NOW WHO WANTS TO DEBATE?! warning if you start be prepared because you will lose! you are not talking to some uneducated 14yr old!!(no offense young peeps) bring it!!;)

I think that the U.S. is in the fight in Iraq is that is what the people want. 240 million people vs 1 president. I think that you want to keep the citizens happy so you fight a war they want fought. I admit, most of those citizens don't want the war anymore, but at the beginning of it..They did. It's harder than you think to withdraw from a war especially Iraq. Look at what Bush's father did in the 90s when he was in Iraq. He left them, and 10 some years later, they're still angry. Bush might be getting a little richer because of the war, (oil), but the war is mostly to change Iraq to democratic and to enable it so the citizens can live in peace. Your cousin knew what he was getting in to when he signed up for the army, and so did everyone else. And if you tried preventing him from joining, you have all the right in the world to want him back.

[Pappy]

Originally posted by lerch


SO NOW WHO WANTS TO DEBATE?! warning if you start be prepared because you will lose! you are not talking to some uneducated 14yr old!!(no offense young peeps) bring it!!;)

Id be happy to debate any issue with you, but only if you recognize facts and not opinion.

Originally posted by MrMan
I think that the U.S. is in the fight in Iraq is that is what the people want. 240 million people vs 1 president. I think that you want to keep the citizens happy so you fight a war they want fought. I admit, most of those citizens don't want the war anymore, but at the beginning of it..They did. It's harder than you think to withdraw from a war especially Iraq. Look at what Bush's father did in the 90s when he was in Iraq. He left them, and 10 some years later, they're still angry. Bush might be getting a little richer because of the war, (oil), but the war is mostly to change Iraq to democratic and to enable it so the citizens can live in peace. Your cousin knew what he was getting in to when he signed up for the army, and so did everyone else. And if you tried preventing him from joining, you have all the right in the world to want him back.

of course we all wanted to go...when we were being fed lies about trying to obtain(saddam) enriched uranium and nuclear weapons...when we found out the truth we(about half of the country now) obviously thought attacking an innocent country was wrong! i'm not asking anyone to withdraw...like i said i'm inteligent...withdrawing would make the situation worse, that's obvious. what i'm saying is lets be honest with ourselves; we attacked a defenseless country. and for what? that's what i would like to know, because it sure as hell wasn't nukes!! and i always waundered and was as ticked off as anyone else when we didn't go into baghdad the first time...but bush senior and the people around him were intelligent...he didn't want the american military to be a occupying/police force...so he chose the lesser of 2 evils and hoped saddam had learned his lesson and just left him in power.

NEXT!!

[Pappy]

You used the term "innocent" refering to Iraq. Wasnt it Iraq that was in violation of over 18 U.N. resolutions?


Wasn't it Iraq that had a terrorist training camp outside Bahgdad with a 757 in it that was being used to train terrorists?


Wasnt the 55 pound artillary shells found in Iraq, that failed to detonate a weapon of mass destruction? It had teh capability to kill more then 10,000 if fired in a populated area and by the U.N.'s definition of a "W.M.D" they were W.M.D.?

Zarqawi was in iraq a full year before this started, maybe that was just coincedence?

[Pappy]

"Fed Lies"

Interesting that more then the USA's intelligent agencies reported that Iraq was involved in WMD's and terrorist activities. You cant feed a lie that you believe to be accurate. It negates the lie. Prove they knew the intelligence was faulty and that they had prior knowledge of these facts and your point has merit.

[Pappy]

BTW...you all will love this..lmao

http://www.jefflindsay.com/snippets/wmd.shtml

Originally posted by Pappy
"Fed Lies"

Interesting that more then the USA's intelligent agencies reported that Iraq was involved in WMD's and terrorist activities. You cant feed a lie that you believe to be accurate. It negates the lie. Prove they knew the intelligence was faulty and that they had prior knowledge of these facts and your point has merit.

i'll tell you what when i join the cia or the nsa i'll sneak that paper work out and post it here on exriders...but something tells me that wouldn't even be good enough...hey if blind faith in the president and the people he has around him lets you sleep at night you're a lucky man, because that doesn't work for me...like who's intelligence agencies other than ours? are you talking about russia...yea how much do you think putin got to say that? if i remember correctly russia was one of the original countries along with france(don't worry i know they're p u s s ies) that didn't think we should go in... then they change their minds all of a sudden...can you say ching ching$$$ if everyone else thought it was such a good idea where are all their troops? let's see the congo has 8 guys there, japan i think sent 14, um australia sent 25 guys i think...oh and england sent a couple thousand...gee i waunder why they sent so many, oh ya they would be speaking german if it wasn't for us that's right...and let's not forget tony blair needs a job after the next election...i'm sure he will be some sort of ambassador to somewhere for some insane amount of money..(can you say cronyism?)

are you serious when you say you don't think the government lies?

[Pappy]

Ok..so much for an intelligent debate. I will provide you with enough proof that the WMD scare tactic was a farse to a point.

http://www.americanprogress.org/site/pp.asp?c=biJRJ8OVF&b=24889


Now with just about every intelligent person knowing that we wouldnt walk in and find a trail of biohazard stickers leading to nukes, the mistake the Bush administration made was playing that card to the end. Infact, that is what people are doing now but in reverse. Cry we did not find anything until your blue in teh face, it makes no nevermind.

As an American who watched as our country fell under terrorist attack on 09/11, I am proud someone had the balls to take the fight to them. Them being anyone, repeat ANYONE who could pose a threat. I feel they should not have stopped in Iraq, Iran, Syria and a host of other nations should still be smoldering....but hey, thats just me:p


Bush should have stood on the ruins of the WTC and looked the camers dead in the eye and stated..."We are coming....and someone will pay". No BS ...no partisan politics....flat out destruction would rule the day.

And I couldnt agree more about North Korea, but I have stated it before, China has them on a short leash.

Originally posted by Pappy
You used the term "innocent" refering to Iraq. Wasnt it Iraq that was in violation of over 21 U.N. resolutions?


Wasn't it Iraq that had a terrorist training camp outside Bahgdad with a 757 in it that was being used to train terrorists?


Wasnt the 55 pound artillary shells found in Iraq, that failed to detonate a weapon of mass destruction? It had teh capability to kill more then 10,000 if fired in a populated area and by the U.N.'s definition of a "W.M.D" they were W.M.D.?

Zarqawi was in iraq a full year before this started, maybe that was just coincedence?

if they were in violation of so many resolutions why didn't the u.n. think we should go in? hmmm that's a mystery? and what sanctions were they...um spitting on sidewalk...um..no public urination...let's see another i think was no walking down dark allies after 10pm...

[Pappy]

Originally posted by lerch
if they were in violation of so many resolutions why didn't the u.n. think we should go in? hmmm that's a mystery? and what sanctions were they...um spitting on sidewalk...um..no public urination...let's see another i think was no walking down dark allies after 10pm...

You can research it if you'd like, but two of the major UN nations that opposed military action in Iraq (France and I cant remember the other one) were found to be financially involved with Iraq and weapons programs that themselves were in violation of UN resolutions. I am going off memory here so dont hack my head off if I am incorrect on the small details.


And I doubt you will find "spitting on the street" in any resolutions, infact I would bet that under Saddams rule you would be killed:D

My personal view is that the UN is a corrupt organization, like many if not all governmental organizations. But I did not see the UN doing much to stop alot of bad things in the world so I dont lend them much clout. What was that food for oil scam that they busted the President of the UN and his son over again? Yep...I will follow thier advice for sure:o

ok i also am going off memory now..the only reason given for attacking iraq that was actually a violation of a un sanction. was that we found guided missiles that could go up to 110 miles as opposed to the 94 allowed by the u.n....now( and don't misinterperet what i'm saying, because i know saddam was a dirtbag) you have to remember because they are an issue now, that iran is an immediate neighbor of iraq and they want that property....bad!! so how was iraq supposed to keep them out with missiles that only go 94 miles? and i'm sure you're intelligent enough to agree that iran taking over iraq would not be a good thing for the world/middle east(israel)...

Originally posted by Pappy
You can research it if you'd like, but two of the major UN nations that opposed military action in Iraq (France and I cant remember the other one) were found to be financially involved with Iraq and weapons programs that themselves were in violation of UN resolutions. I am going off memory here so dont hack my head off if I am incorrect on the small details.


And I doubt you will find "spitting on the street" in any resolutions, infact I would bet that under Saddams rule you would be killed:D

My personal view is that the UN is a corrupt organization, like many if not all governmental organizations. But I did not see the UN doing much to stop alot of bad things in the world so I dont lend them much clout. What was that food for oil scam that they busted the President of the UN and his son over again? Yep...I will follow thier advice for sure:o

your right the un is corrupt, and guess what we own it!! we by far give the most money and make all the decisions for that organiztion...we also hand pick who leads it...

[Pappy]

Dont think I dont know alot of what the american people were told was total BS.....


But....IMO....we should have been in Iraq and Iran long before 2003. Look past the politics and look at what they HAVE recovered. The training camps, the money trail to people, and counties who support terrorism. I personally think alot of Iraq's WMD's went to Syria and Iran before the war. I think that is a main reason behind Irans bulldog approach to the world lately, Saddam did not have the nuts to use it, Iran will.

I may not fully agree with how the current administration decided to get us into Iraq, and I am not fully satisfied with how they ...yet again...fought a limited war. But I am 110% behind going after terrorist nations, and that includes North Korea. I can not change policy or dictate it, but I can damn well support our soldiers and the job they have in front of them to do. They are not fighting Iraqis, they are fighting egyptians, syrians, iranians ...all terrorists in one form or another. And I would prefer it be fought there then here(In a way, I would like nothing better then to get a little piece of this thing).

I listened for over 6 hours yesterday of the debate on the latest crap going on at the capitol and it amazes me how we are the strongest nation in the world. Our representatives are pretty much all wack jobs:p

[Pappy]

Originally posted by lerch
your right the un is corrupt, and guess what we own it!! we by far give the most money and make all the decisions for that organiztion...we also hand pick who leads it...

Actually I believe the person heading the UN is in some form of rotation.


And when do we NOT always give the most? lol

Originally posted by Pappy
Ok..so much for an intelligent debate. I will provide you with enough proof that the WMD scare tactic was a farse to a point.

http://www.americanprogress.org/site/pp.asp?c=biJRJ8OVF&b=24889


Now with just about every intelligent person knowing that we wouldnt walk in and find a trail of biohazard stickers leading to nukes, the mistake the Bush administration made was playing that card to the end. Infact, that is what people are doing now but in reverse. Cry we did not find anything until your blue in teh face, it makes no nevermind.

As an American who watched as our country fell under terrorist attack on 09/11, I am proud someone had the balls to take the fight to them. Them being anyone, repeat ANYONE who could pose a threat. I feel they should not have stopped in Iraq, Iran, Syria and a host of other nations should still be smoldering....but hey, thats just me:p


Bush should have stood on the ruins of the WTC and looked the camers dead in the eye and stated..."We are coming....and someone will pay". No BS ...no partisan politics....flat out destruction would rule the day.

And I couldnt agree more about North Korea, but I have stated it before, China has them on a short leash.

hold on..we all were affected by 9/11..i assure you, me just as much you, but lets not mix things up here...that was osama(which by the way him is still alive and running around) and his peeps...and like i said before, none of them planes had iraqis on them...so why the attack on iraq? listen open your mind for a second here...osama and saddam hated each other..osama is a diehard muslim..diehard...saddam was into boozin' and bangin' chicks...trust me they weren't working together...think about this now. if you're a dictator and want absolute power, you don't let a couple of guys in from al queida, because before you know it there's a whole lot a guys from there in your country and the next thing you know you are no longer the guy in charge/alive! look up afghanistan...they let those guys set up camp next thing you know they owned the country...no that wasn't saddams bag...don't you waunder why dictators only have relatives and such in all the high positions? it's because that's the only people they trust! and they even cut their heads off from time to time...so trust me saddam and al queida were not working together...saddam was alot of things but he wasn't stupid...hey like i said read between the lines don't swallow that crap rove, cheney and rumsfeld spew out....who by the way are the ones leading the country it ain't bush. he's not nearly as smart as those three guys...he's just along for the ride...

hey don't misunderstand me on this...i support our soldiers also, and the best support i can think of is not sending them in harms way for no good reason...for what... so we can eliminate saudi arabia's competition or make haliburton a ton of money...or what ever the REAL reason is that we're there....i also agree that we need to fight terrorism...but when you attack a country and the people fight back, how are they terrorist? hey if mexico(and this is just an analogy for the idiot that's gonna chime in and say mexico would never attack us we kick their butts!) attacks us and we fight back or our english friends come and help us defend our country...does that make us/them terrorists? we as americans need to get off of our self righteous christian soap boxes...just because we have better bombs and guns than them that doesn't make us more right...look up the word bully if there is any confusion on how we get to call ourselves right...

[fireblade954]

Do you believe that these types of situations are only specific to this war?

It is too bad that the American culture has changed a politically correct society.

Where would we be if America decided to just say the hell with it in WWII? We are facing a similar situation to WWII. Instead of Hitler, we have fundamental Muslims wanting to take control. The media doesn't cover that aspect. A goverment official gave a speech on CSPAN about their goals. Yes, these Muslim groups have golas and long term at that. They want to destroy the US and their influence and spead the religion of Islam.

[JIMTED79]

Hey PAPPY just curious were you ever in the military? From the way you talk I sure hope so otherwise you make a he11 of a cheerleader, how you would love to go over there but have not. Don't get me wrong I think that you are stright on the war for the most part. Talk about our troops over there defending our country from terrorist yet we have open borders that are suppose to protect americans from terrorist. What do you think about more people dieing from murder each year in the USA than solders in the war sense it started not to mention poverty in the USA. You feel its so important to fix another country, what about ours? What are your thoughts on this PAPPY?

[Pappy]

Lerch, answer me why zarqawi was in Iraq a full year before we invaded if saddam and osama did not have the same goal in mind. two folks that are at opposite ends of the spectrum can become very good allies when a common goal is in sight. Just food for thought.


JIMTED...my views on the border is simple. CLOSE THEM. My view on our countires poverty....send not one dime overseas until every child in America is fed, clothed and housed.

I do see America's role in the world order however, but I would still have things at home fixed before I spent billions in aid packages to counties that have been ruled by dictators for decades. This is one reason why we have the Jihad, the vast majority of Muslims see us as crusaders out to conquer and shove our influence on them. While I could give a rats *** less if a country vanishes due to civil war or being over ruled, I still know that I do not want to take over the world or change anyones religous beliefs....do you?

Using the military to protect our shores has backfired, no matter how many ground battles we may have won. The more we try and help the worse we are percieved. Or did we lose?

We won the cold war by bankrupting our main adversary but allowed another to rise (China)

We have spent untold millions in aid to have not those very people be willing to assist us when we feel we are rightous. (See Lerch's comment on our allies support)

Heck, you can throw the bible and the apocolpyse in there as well, we are in the middle of a war based on ideology not ground. How can you win that war without destroying every person who opposes you? Are we as a civilized society willing to kill infants of parents who believe they are rightous and thier cause as just as ours? Are we willing to murder millions upon millions only to create more that will rise to fight us? Isnt that what the end game of all of this is?

Is it about oil? Is it about territory? Is it about 1 man?

Throwing all that junk out there one can run circles around what is right and wrong. Imagine being one of the countires leaders having to decide all this. I am glad I dont have that job.

This country was founded on principles, but has our society changed to the point where we can afford the level of complacency to not retaliate when our blood is spilled on our own soil? I do not think true americans are ready to give that up, infact I know they are'nt because our soldiers carry that fight every day. I do think that enough of the country has become so comingled that our beliefs and histories are faded and no clear feeling of the ties our forefathers held reverently exist today. Can you name 10 friends that you know would die in the next 5 minutes for thier country without hesitation?

Think back to world war 1. A country called upon its sons who for the most part were uneducated, poor, and had no idea of the war in europe. But they went, they fought, and they died defending YOUR freedom. Are you willing to relinquish thier sacrifice? I am not. The same holds true for those that perished fighting to establish this country. Thier blood paved the way for you and I to sit here and freely discuss any issue we may chose, including the short comings of our leadership. Some people still hold these ideals high, and will fight to defend them at all costs, while it seem for the past 30 years we have been leaning towards allowing those rights and freedoms to be lessened. I am no great scholar for sure, but I think about alot of this almost every day.

Even I have bashed the French, who came to our fledgling nations aid and helped us defeat the british. It doesnt sound so billy badazz when you think of things in a more historical sense.


Sorry for the book, yall just got me to thinking

:p

Where would we be if America decided to just say the hell with it in WWII? We are facing a similar situation to WWII. Instead of Hitler, we have fundamental Muslims wanting to take control. The media doesn't cover that aspect. A goverment official gave a speech on CSPAN about their goals. Yes, these Muslim groups have golas and long term at that. They want to destroy the US and their influence and spead the religion of Islam. [/B][/QUOTE]

whoa whoa whoa...though i apprecciate your opinion, i completely disagree. this is in no way like WWII, and besides america would be fine it's the rest of europe that would be speaking the deutch...and ever hear of pearl harbor? we were attacked by the japanese(yes we were attacked on 9/11, but that wasn't by iraq. so why do we attack them?) and germany was taking over europe..iraq wasn't attacking anybody! who would they attack and with what? we wiped out their airforce and army in the first gulf war(unless they cloned an army of boba fetts also) they didn't have anybody to attack with and they sure didn't train any decent pilots in that short a time? the reason they didn't have a real army and no airforce because it never recovered from the first time we wiped it out! so we basically attacked an unarmed country, sorry but in my book that's cowardice to attack a defenseless country...and saddam is in no way a fundamental muslim..like i said he was a party guy...he didn't believe in that crap anymore than you or i do, he was having to much fun...and in WWII there was politicians taking leave to enlist and sending their kids to fight, movie stars, athletes.. because it was a real cause...this isn't , i don't see bush or any politicians sending their kids to the front to die for this righteous war...maybe because they all know its baloney! you know maybe if bush actually fought in combat, and seen what really goes on, he maybe would have thought twice about sending someone else's kid to be killed or mamed for something that we're still not clear on....what is it this week...oh we did the right thing because saddam was a bad guy...ya no kidding well there's about dozen bad guys leading african countries( don't worry we won't attack any of them, haliburton can't make any money rebuiling an infrastructure of dirt roads and grass huts!well maybe if oil is discovered in one of them..) there's another bad guy in iran, n. korea,(by the way we won't attack either of these countries because guess what they have real militaries and will fight back, so bush and his cronies want nothing to do with that chit) hell there's even a bad guy leading a country 90 miles off our coast(castro in cuba dummies) i don't see us attacking them bad guys...hmmm another mystery?

[Pappy]

You keep trying to impress folks with mention of haliburton and Bush, but where is your comments on the leaders that have ignored the issues you prize so much?

We could run back though the past 6 or 8 presidents and try and figure out which one to blame...another mystery or more hype with less substance?


As for your comment that only europe would have been impacted...that is by far the most ludicrous thing i have seen you type. Japan had an atomic bomb that was mere days away from being tested when we stuck first.

Germany was actually on par with us in regards to its atomic weapons program and infact was further ahead in its jet propulsion technolgy. Did they teach you history or just nancy drew books in school:p

[Pappy]

Yeah saddam was a party guy...just how many innocent defensless people did he murder while he was in power?

we were attacked by the japanese(yes we were attacked on 9/11, but that wasn't by iraq. so why do we attack them?) and germany was taking over europe..iraq wasn't attacking anybody! [/B]

So you want to wait until they DO attack us? Yeah, no thanks.

[Pappy]

Originally posted by MrMan
So you want to wait until they DO attack us? Yeah, no thanks.

I think Lerch is a betting man. He would take the odds that he will remain safe as long as the united states is not proactive in seeking out those who wish to do our country harm.

And what other companies Lerch were capable of doing what haliburton does at a moments notice? Or is that a mystery too:p

[Pappy]

Originally posted by lerch
hell there's even a bad guy leading a country 90 miles off our coast(castro in cuba dummies) i don't see us attacking them bad guys...hmmm another mystery?

Your intellectual prowess is running at 110% You are digging a hole that haliburton couldnt supply with your rhetoric. If we put a skirt on you we might be able to pass you off for a news woman on NBC:D Winning a debate against 14 year olds...ummm...I know a few 14 year olds that have a far better chance at providing a better basis for debate then what you are attempting.

Its been fun, but I can only take so much of someone who claims intelligence then fails to back it up. Have fun with the 14 year olds, they are right up your alley.

good night

Originally posted by lerch
hell there's even a bad guy leading a country 90 miles off our coast(castro in cuba dummies) i don't see us attacking them bad guys...hmmm another mystery?

What do you think the Cuban Missile Crisis was all about? Good thing we had a good president then, or we probably would of lost half or more of the US.

pappy the book was a good read, i think fundamentaly we're in agreemant; as for al zarqwi i don't know why he was there...maybe he was stroking saddam a little to get him to cave, maybe the info you're getting is false or a little askew, what i do know is our government has some good spin doctors(i.e. rove) and i've noticed that once something is carefully mentioned in the press it suddenly becomes fact!! i am no way shape or form calling you liar. but one thing i do know and that is saddam was not sharing power....come on not one iraqi on any of the planes? don't you think saddam could find one guy wanting to make that righteous blow? but lets say this for arguments sake; ok zarqwi was there, is that really a reason to attack and kill(whether on purpose or not) all those innocent iraqis, and beside that get our people killed...come on...we could have easily sent in a strike force and took them out at any time. what would saddam have done? thrown stones at us? come on! our goverment throws so much crap out there to try and keep people confused and off balance about this topic!
i greatly appreciate the sacrifices made by the many in the past and the ones who are making them now. but i guarantee they did it and are doing it because they want to make sure this country is free, and make no mistake one of those freedoms is to question the reason our government is willing to put those very brave people in harms way?

another thing, and this is when i no longer believed the reasons given about why we were in iraq(and please if someone can explain it please do); about a week into to the attack on iraq..why no nukes dropped, why no chemical weapons used on our troops? if saddam: hated us so fiercely, had no care for his own people, had all these wmds, and was a fundamental/radical muslim(meaning he gets 40 virgins when he dies etc...) why didn't he go out in a blaze of glory and take as many of americans with him as he could? nothing to lose right? i don't get it and i no longer believe in it...i just hope every one of our brave people come home safe...:(

[Pappy]

LOL...here a 2 replies for ya:D

1) Saddam was a poser muslim. LOL


2) Seriously...IMO the reason you did not see an Iraqi on the planes was probably self preservance. Id be willing to bet Sadam was in on it, either thru helping in any way or allowing terrorists to flow in and out of Iraq to train or be harbored etc. Any thing that would link Iraq and 9/11 would mean an invasion and Saddam liked power more then he did the fact of dying and getting his share of them 40 virgins. If he wanted to be a fighter he wouldnt have been hiding in a spider hole only to be drug out like some crying *****.

And I agree, why wasnt the WMD's deployed if he had them. Maybe he thought the war would be limited and no ground engagements would lead to his over throw. Hard to say. get me in his cell with a pack of smokes and my 45, Ill get him talking....:devil:

In any event, I would still like to pump a few holes into the now bloated and rotting zarqawi:o He would be good and ripe to start sending pieces to a few folks...like his mom, the king of saudia arabia, maybe even a finger to fishhead charlie in North korea..and you know I would send atleast an intestine to Iran:devil:

Originally posted by MrMan
What do you think the Cuban Missile Crisis was all about? Good thing we had a good president then, or we probably would of lost half or more of the US.

that was with kruschev not castro. castro just gave the soviets a place to park 'em, and believe me jfk didn't want to go to war, he'd fought in WWII, he knew the ugliness of war...hey next time don't bring a knife to a gun fight...

my knowledge of history is actually quite extensive...if the germans would have had any pilots left to fly those jets they had, we may have lost WWII, trust me i know of guys like oppenheimer and such (or was he one of the hardy boys?)as far as japan attacking...i'm still waundering if fdr actually knew it was coming, and kind of let it go because he no longer wanted to practice isolationism like the rest of the government at the time,(that's from the nancy drew mystery "sitting on our hands") he knew it was time to get in there and fight and so did the rest of the world....but the countries we were going after then, were attacking other countries, and were not defenseless. and the only people that agree with us on this one are bought and paid for...with my tax money!!

as far as haliburton(lets not even get started on them, they have been caught quite a few times now gouging/grossly overcharging, one was for 125 million), i'm not quite sure who else could have done the job, because if memory serves me, this was the first time in recent history our government had a contract like this that was given out without a bid...i guess the competition will not be stepping forward any time soon, so i don't think we'll be finding out who they could've been. and in the mean time mr. cheney can keep collecting on those stock options he has.(everyone of course knows he was a high ranking haliburton official before he was president....oops i mean vice president...quite the coincidence huh?)

and can someone please explain the exact criteria of the attack on iraq, because it seems to change constantly(as i've seen on this thread even...man are bush's guys good at what they do)!! he had nukes, no he was in on 9/11..nope, then it was he was a bad guy( that one is true, but attacking a country because its led by a bad guy, let me re-iterate, there is like 25 other countries with that criteria, and i don't see bush and his ring leaders in any hurry to attack any other "bad guys") god people can you do more than just regurgitate everything bush's cronies say, and actually just think for yourselves with the evidence in front of your faces!

hey i would love to believe in this fight(and i did at one time), as would everyone else that opposes it, i mean come on do you think this great country really has half the people in it disagreeing because we're "hippies"...or is it because they have chosen to no longer to listen to b.s. coming out of these bozo's mouths?

i don't propose to know everything, but i do know this; my cousin, your brother, his uncle etc... are not in iraq for any of the reasons given for being in iraq!!!

and pappy my direct responce to saddams killing of defenseless people, we do it all the time, but we don't use to words like killing, we like to call it "collateral damage" has a nicer sound, don't yo think? yeah sure he gassed 'em we just blew them apart with bombs. sorry hypocrasy/self righteousness/ego-centrsim is my biggest problem with this great country right now! as long as we practice those 3 things we can not be a respected leader in this world!
as far as "rethoric" i choose to call it theory, because obviously these guys(and what they say means it's no longer rhetoric i guess) aren't gonna release anything that makes them look like warmongers, or even something that makes them look wrong, so for the blind followers(not you per say) what they say is the gospel....and by the way i noticed a couple of shots in there that could be construde as low blows(you know the skirt thing and such) let's try and keep the gloves up! :D (hey how'd you like the nancy drew "sittin' on your hands" thing?)
hey i'm liking this..... i'll be back later...

[Pappy]

Lerch, your contadicting yourself with regards to WW2. You claimed that if we did not get involved only europe would be speaking german.

If we had not been involved, those pilots you speak of would have been more in number, higher in skill and flying aircraft that the united states would not have had anything comparable to fight them with. The Axis forces would have surely built up an even larger military force with the weight of its atomic program to support them. Stopping in Europe would have been just to catch thier breath..lol

I do not see logically how you can say we should not get involved and without reasoning say the war (ww2) would have ended at europes borders. The war was damn near global before we entered it!

And what fool picks a fight with someone they know has the ability to knock thier block off? The line was drawn and it ran though Iraq and Afghanistan. As I stated earlier in the thread, how they got us there means ziltch to me, as long as we are eliminating terrorists and terrorist nations I am behind it.

LOL...and I am not defending Haliburton for the sake of defending them....but name me 1 other company that has not been accussed of overcharging the govenment or making mistakes with regards to military contracts? They are the whipping boys for the media and the democratic party, it is only logical that they will bare the brunt of the beef. When I see someone using them to blame for this or other wars it cracks me up, you all give them far too much power and control.

Our cousins are in Iraq to kill, let them. The rest is politics.

[Pappy]

Originally posted by lerch
i'm still waundering if fdr actually knew it was coming, and kind of let it go because he no longer wanted to practice isolationism like the rest of the government at the time,(that's from the nancy drew mystery "sitting on our hands") he knew it was time to get in there and fight and so did the rest of the world....but the countries we were going after then, were attacking other countries, and were not defenseless. and the only people that agree with us on this one are bought and paid for...with my tax money!!



While i agree FDR surely had prior knowledge of the attack on Pearl Harbor, I find a stark similarity to what your above posted statement offers.

One could argue that the Bush administration knew that if left unchecked, the middle east would grow into a stronger region of the world with nuclear weapons that could at some point in the near future lead to thier use on other nations in the region and quite possibly supply terrorists with the nuke they want so badly to detonate on american soil. Where would Iran, Iraq & Syria be at this point in time if we had not overthrown Iraq and put a military force readily available for further action in that region? The lessons learned in WW2 could be used to support this arguement, but it would be hard to keep people focused on the differences of that era and this one as we still are in the middle of fighting and things change constantly etc.

Did Lybia not hand over its nuclear weapons program due in large part to the invasion of Iraq? Could there be some reasoning behind invading Iraq to show that we meant business without invading a country that could set off a small scale nuclear conflict in the region? My problem with that is the show of force doesnt work with that region, they thrive on it. They need to have people like Lerch screaming that we are wrong, congrats, you are empowering our enemy.

so you are agreeing that we are just a bunch of bullies?

hey just because you can beat someone up doesn't mean you should, what just because someday something "could" happen..if that's the case lets go get n.korea, iran etc.....yea i know kill all the "towel heads" got it..real intelligent...but when they kill back we cry foul!(here's where you look up the word hypocrite)

i am far from empowering any enemy, bush and and the gung ho gun toters are because of the attack of an innocent and unarmed muslim nation(iraq). i hope you realize that by doing so we've justified(in their minds) exactly what they have done! and are doing!

9/11 happened because of the backing of israel and sticking our noses in middle east. and again it has been proven( though cheney and rumsfeld tried hard) iraq had nothing to do with 9/11!

where does america get this arrogance? because we can beat other people up? why do we as americans forget that other people cry, and have their lives destroyed when their loved ones end up as "collateral damage"? i guess if they ain't american they don't have mothers or brothers that weep for them....oh right only we have this right to mourn our loss...the self-righteousness is astounding! i mean come on we find ways to justify killing women and children! you know what i mean..."oops that one went a little to the right, my bad." come on...
i know git-r-done..don't question why we're killing innocent people...just kill them all then we'll just assume they were guilty....got it...as long as your not the one or one of your sons going...i know pappy your gung ho...are you willing to send cody to die for what we may find out later to be for oil...gosh i hope not! i saw the mention of democrat, so by your coment i'm assuming you to be republican? you know it seemed easy for the republicans to start this war, probaly because they knew(because they are all born rich) that their sons wouldn't be the ones fighting it...some poor kids would be that don't have fathers that give alot to campaign funds...

yea libya handed something over...was it nukes? for what? money, food we'll never know, we're only privy to the info that makes them look good...there had to be something good in it for khadafi because the word libya hadn't been mentioned since some "wag the dog" incident in 80's...i don't remember them being a threat to anyone in recent history....

[Pappy]

First off, I know first hand no american soldier revels in the fact that civilians get killed. You may blame washington, but your words hurt those behind the weapon who do have morals and are forced to walk a blurry line when called to do so. I have seen woman and children in pieces so please, be very careful how you bring them into a debate no matter how badly you wish to use them to bolster a position on the leadership of the country.


I have stated long before you ever ventured on this site my opinions on American policy and how it has shaped the hatred thrust on us. In any event, I will still back my country if called to do so and I have also stated I would shoot the first anti war SOB that dared to get in my way. Infact I would prefer to shoot them as I borded my plane headed for harms way. Maybe that is the difference, I am willing to do while others are willing to only talk. Talk is cheap in a combat zone, no matter how rightous being 8000 miles from danger may make you feel. I do belive that those who critize openly due more harm then good and it very well could cost your cousin his life. How would that make you feel? An egyptian partisan reads over and over how americans hate bush and the war and he decides to get involved in the fight based of this constant message he recieves from those such as yourself that fade back and forth with words that some can interpret as anti american, or anti governmental. That very insurgent may be compelled to pick up an AK47 and could be aiming on your cousin with the words fresh in his mind how we at home feel.

Being you are so profound and versed in history, you will acknowldge that anti war and anti governmental actions by citizens inside this country fueled the Vietnamese to fight on years longer then they self admit they wanted to. It is a catch 22 for sure, but i will look any returning soldier in the eye and know that I gave no support to our enemies cause....can you say the same?


And you are smart enough to realize the difference between speaking up against a leadership you disagree with and crossing the line into the realm of anti americanizm. And this isnt directed personally, one need only to listen to any news channel to hear it just as our foe's do. When an elected official is on a news channel calling our leader corrupt and inept, there is a serious problem.

And to correct you, 9/11 was supposed to be in retaliation for our troops being based on Saudi soil, but just like the leadership you like to call liars and such, the terrorists could have just made that up, all they needed was a reason, they had the means.

[Pappy]

Originally posted by lerch
yea libya handed something over...was it nukes? for what? money, food we'll never know, we're only privy to the info that makes them look good...there had to be something good in it for khadafi because the word libya hadn't been mentioned since some "wag the dog" incident in 80's...i don't remember them being a threat to anyone in recent history....

who actually cares why they handed them over if the invasion of Iraq compeled them to do so, or money & food helped thier decision. Libya hadnt been mentioned so thier nuclear program somehow means less to world safety...

North Korea is posturing to recieve better programs and backing from the superpowers but you are fast to use them to ask why we have not invaded them. Liberals tend to wash out the line between fact and fiction and you seem to be trying your best to pursuade people to that area, in which I havent seen many here jump onboard and agree with your views.

[Pappy]

Originally posted by lerch
we're only privy to the info that makes them look good...

Just like the majority of americans are privy to the info that makes us look bad.

hey i notice that you're quick to say what i say has no basis, are you ready to agree that you're just regurgitating what bush's cronies are saying and hope you believe...seems to me they(and you also) do a fine job of of making that line of truth and non-truthes a hazy one...and by the way i was allowing you to help yourself when i asked if it was nukes that libya handed over...no it was not it was drawings and designs that's it, libya was no more of a threat to us or anyone else for that matter...unless throwing pics of bombs has the same effect...i guess with all the bad press bush has gotten that would seem like some sort of victory...

[Pappy]

LOL....that hole is getting deeper. Whenever I offer you a chance to rebut you try and swing the issue to a personal opinion debate. My positions have been stated, and you have not swayed my opinion in the least, nor others I have a feeling.

I have offered you several directions for you to really grab ahold of the issues and you always return to the same BS that I would expect from a liberal. We will have to agree to disagree.

I answered your view on Libya posted above. In return I got the bash bush liberal response....go figure.

you gave me your view...on libya ok, well i gave you the facts they had no weapons, just drawings and designs...i assumed you looked that up and have no rebuttal...and the agree to disagree, well we've been down that road before...famous last words...so like i asked earlier are you willing to send one of your sons to die for what some day we find out was for oil, or some mans ego? or do you have enough money to send them to school so they don't have to maybe join the military to help pay for college....

[Pappy]

My son is standing right beside me, he answered it before I could. If his country calls he will be there. And I would be damn proud. Ofcourse he added that he would like to pop you in the mouth and he thinks your a discrace to your country, but he is only 13 so I informed him that a difference of opinion is a way of life and it shouldnt be taken seriously, especially on the net. he added something about fighting with a retard and walked away:p

[fastrider450r]

Originally posted by Pappy
My son is standing right beside me, he answered it before I could. If his country calls he will be there. And I would be damn proud. Ofcourse he added that he would like to pop you in the mouth and he thinks your a discrace to your country, but he is only 13 so I informed him that a difference of opinion is a way of life and it shouldnt be taken seriously, especially on the net. he added something about fighting with a retard and walked away:p


way to go im proud to hear what you said Cody!!!and well said Pappy

i just want to say that you have great points on all of what you said.:macho :macho

also i have already signed up for the marines and will be leaving for boot camp as soon as i get out of high school next year, and if i have to go over to irag, so be it.
i will go over with pride and will fight for my county and everyone who lives in it, even the liberal panzies who dont think ahead about the real world because i care about my country and am thankful every minute that i live in such a great nation.

:macho

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Pappy
[B]My son is standing right beside me, he answered it before I could. If his country calls he will be there. And I would be damn proud. Ofcourse he added that he would like to pop you in the mouth and he thinks your a discrace to your country, but he is only 13 so I informed him that a difference of opinion is a way of life and it shouldnt be taken seriously, especially on the net. he added something about fighting with a retard and walked away:p

now pappy i'm sure you explained the part about where "son you know you could actually be dying for saudi arabia because they didn't like the competition for oil" or did you say "you know mr. bush didn't like the guy saddam because of something he said, so he doesn't mind sending other peoples kids like you to die." of course at 13 he has no real grasp of what death is(pick up a child psychology book sometime, now understand there probaly isn't gonna be any pics of guns or quads in there so you might have a little trouble following) so i have no problem excusing a young person for some of the silly things they say....and you really should teach him that it is politically incorrect to use the word retard...its mentally challenged...i think this is probally the last time i will respond to this post because i see the suck ups are starting to respond and i refuse to have a battle of wits with un-armed people....one last thing though i'll have to ask treebasher the next time you're gonna be around rausch or something i think you might wanna meet me before you go a little far with the insults..because you know my difference of opinion doesn't make me a bad person...this is gonna be where you probally say something derogatory about me because i actually stood up to you, and spoke my piece, and didn't join the "blow smoke up pappy's butt club" no offense to you, but i'm sure you can reconize it when it happens....later

*note- i noticed in your[sons] statement the exact thing on what we differ in opinion on, you say we're fighting for our country, and i say we are fighting for a couple of our leaders over grown egos and that is ashame that young people had to, and will be dying for that..:ermm:

[derekhonda]

Originally posted by lerch


*note- i noticed in your[sons] statement the exact thing on what we differ in opinion on, you say we're fighting for our country, and i say we are fighting for a couple of our leaders over grown egos and that is ashame that young people had to, and will be dying for that..:ermm:



I guess everyone has an ego except you.


i think this is the last time i will respond to this post

YAY!!

[QUOTE]Originally posted by derekhonda
[B]I guess everyone has an ego except you.



my ego doesn't get people killed....unless of course it's some wanna be mall cop steps up to me....then i could easily make an exception....;)

like i said the suck ups are starting to respond.........

[derekhonda]

Originally posted by lerch
[QUOTE]Originally posted by derekhonda
[B]I guess everyone has an ego except you.



my ego doesn't get people killed....unless of course it's some wanna be mall cop steps up to me....then i could easily make an exception....;)

Haha, you just like to toss out "ego this" and "hypocrisy that"...still didn't know if you found that mirror to stare at?

Oh, and by the way...if that was a threat that was weak. And just like your post above...you too better know whose on the other end of the computer before you start tossing out sentences like that.

[Pappy]

LOL...Lerch, people will respect a 13 years old opinion more then they will your self professed intellectual, over intelligent attitude. Id rather die in a war for oil then live for your type of ideology.

And I doubt you have what it takes to do anything to anyone, even a poor rent a cop just doing his job keeping the mall clear of teenie boppers. Atleast if I threaten someone it will involve an issue worthy of a threat. I think you just showed your true colors, and they may just be pink and blue:chinese:

I asked him about the mentally challenged and he said..and I qoute..."I know the difference, a mentally challenged person dont have a choice, but this guy Lerch is a retard because he does know better, he chooses to act retarded" unqoute.

Go send a dollar to Diane Fienstien and Hillary Clinton to make yourself feel better! We will send off another box of goodies for our troops in Iraq and Afghanistan:D

[Pappy]

Originally posted by lerch
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Pappy
[B]this is gonna be where you probally say something derogatory about me because i actually stood up to you, and spoke my piece, and didn't join the "blow smoke up pappy's butt club" no offense to you, but i'm sure you can reconize it when it happens....later



Absolutley not, you are showing everyone your position on the issues and its fine. Its just your using what you see as others support as sucking up to me and I dont think anyone but you really cares..lol. If that is what it takes to make yourself feel like a man...then thats your issue. Infact, I feel pretty confident your real issue is with me, and that is cool, I could careless either way. I will log off knowing I have another liberal worrying about us gun toting quad riding rednecks. Mission Accomplished, or will this add to your trumped up drama that you seem to want:D

[Pappy]

Originally posted by lerch

[B]one last thing though i'll have to ask treebasher the next time you're gonna be around rausch or something i think you might wanna meet me before you go a little far with the insults..

LOL.....why wait, jump in your car and come on over tonight

84 Chase Lane
Hedgesville WV
25427

It should take you about 2 hours. Bring a friend if you feel you must.

[Mxjunkie]

Originally posted by Pappy
My son is standing right beside me, he answered it before I could. If his country calls he will be there. And I would be damn proud. Ofcourse he added that he would like to pop you in the mouth and he thinks your a discrace to your country, but he is only 13 so I informed him that a difference of opinion is a way of life and it shouldnt be taken seriously, especially on the net. he added something about fighting with a retard and walked away:p



Cody's my damn hero!

Lerch.. anyone ever tell you the best of you ran down your moms leg when your dad made you?

Originally posted by Mxjunkie
Lerch.. anyone ever tell you the best of you ran down your moms leg when your dad made you?

i believe it goes, the best part of you ran down the crack of your mommas ***** and wound up as a brown stain on the matress.

[Mxjunkie]

Originally posted by the gangsta
i believe it goes, the best part of you ran down the crack of your mommas ***** and wound up as a brown stain on the matress.


Bahaha... Never herd that verison of it before that's a good one! :macho