Smiley and the Outlaw

[TYLER329]

Is there any one good reason why no one seems to know why the Outlaw has been ditched in the pro class. I have an Outlaw, I like Polaris, I think Smiley is a great racer, but cut the bull what is going on? I am not saying that I could do any better, because I couldn't but come on! I want to know what the deal is. I have heard that the Outlaw isnt dialed in yet, well its not going to get dialed in if your racing a Predator. I am still all for Smiley but at least lets hear what is going on!!

[Octane]

Just because you dont see it on the track doesnt mean that Polaris isnt testing, tweaking and developing it at their own secret test tracks.
Personally, I think its too heavy to be competitive. The suspension and ground clearance are great, but its 100 pounds heavier than the 450s and about 50 pounds heavier than a Raptor 700R. As close as the competition is, 50+ pounds is a HUGE disadvantage.

[wolffie]

Originally posted by Octane
Just because you dont see it on the track doesnt mean that Polaris isnt testing, tweaking and developing it at their own secret test tracks.
Personally, I think its too heavy to be competitive. The suspension and ground clearance are great, but its 100 pounds heavier than the 450s and about 50 pounds heavier than a Raptor 700R. As close as the competition is, 50+ pounds is a HUGE disadvantage.


couldn't have said it much better myself. the Outlaw is a solid machine, but it needs to slim down a bit. i mean, all of us in this thread ride and enjoy the predator/outlaw, but when it comes to racing it is REALLY hard to compete with the 450's:ermm:

i know, i know, i know, racing ultimately comes down to the rider. but, assuming the riders are equal, the machine is the edge.;)

[05troyleepredXC]

Maybe they will have it "slimed down" when they put the ktm525 motor in it.

[TYLER329]

Yeah, I agree with you guys but why not just come out and say that they are still working with the Outlaw. From an outsiders view it totally looked like the Outlaw didn't work so they are going back to the Pred. I know it takes alot to be competitive in this class and I could see 10th or 12th place, but 18th, DNF. It just sucks and I wish that Polaris would lighten the thing up so that couldnt be the excuse anymore.

[Octane]

I really like my brother's '04 Predator but if I were buying a quad for racing Id still have to go with one of the 450s.
I think Polaris will perfect the Outlaw eventually, but by then will it be too late? :ermm:

[MAaudioX10]

Originally posted by Octane
I really like my brother's '04 Predator but if I were buying a quad for racing Id still have to go with one of the 450s.
I think Polaris will perfect the Outlaw eventually, but by then will it be too late? :ermm:

Too late for what? The outlaw is the only one of it's kind. The bike has a solid plateform but, your just naive if you think a first year bike will be problem-free.

Just look at what Polaris did with the Predator. Every year, there was an improvement. Samething with the outlaw. A lot of what is aling the outlaw this year will, more than likely, be improved upon in 07'.

The precious 450's are no different.....chit, from what I hear the r450 is having problems with the rear shock mounts breaking at the welds....talk to Jeramiah Jones....happened to him.

[Flynbryan19]

Although I have nothing to prove its fact, I heard that Smiley was having difficulty getting it to be stable enough at the level hes able to push the machine. It would actually make sense. The other riders(IE: Parton, Gallagher,Sroka,etc...) although MUCH better than I'll ever be are just not to the same level as Smiley. Maybe he really is just pushing the quad harder than its capable of performing.

On the flip side of that though......His last two races with the Pred haven't been up to par from last year either. Maybe he just hasn't come up with a good setup for his Elkas. From all the pics I've seen hes been a long time Axis man, and maybe hes just having a hard time finding the right combination.

[gbcap]

i think it is going to be hard for an IFS machine to be thrown around the woods like a sra bike. you can't powerslide it into the turns the same. the ride is prolly smooth as ****, but that doesn't give you performance.


as far as pulling it off the track to test? that doesn't make any sense. all the manufacturers use racing to test machines. so that is completely backwards, unless for some reason they are worried about poor finishes hurting the rep. IMO pulling it off the track is worse. makes people really wonder.

[Octane]

Originally posted by MAaudioX10
[B]Too late for what? The outlaw is the only one of it's kind. The bike has a solid plateform but, your just naive if you think a first year bike will be problem-free.

What I mean by "too late" is that will the Outlaw develop a repuatation as a slow, heavy trail quad and because of that it wont be a strong seller.
Polaris needs to have the Outlaw out on the track winning races NOW, not 1 or 2 years from now.
If someone is looking at the Outlaw for GNCC racing and sees that Polaris isnt racing it because they cant get the suspension to work right, why would they buy one?
If a team of Polaris engineers cant get it to work right, how is the average guy who races 1 or 2 weekends a month supposed to get it to work right? :confused:
I think the Outlaw is neat idea, but once again, Polaris really dropped the ball.

[Flynbryan19]

Originally posted by Octane
What I mean by "too late" is that will the Outlaw develop a repuatation as a slow, heavy trail quad and because of that it wont be a strong seller.
Polaris needs to have the Outlaw out on the track winning races NOW, not 1 or 2 years from now.
If someone is looking at the Outlaw for GNCC racing and sees that Polaris isnt racing it because they cant get the suspension to work right, why would they buy one?
If a team of Polaris engineers cant get it to work right, how is the average guy who races 1 or 2 weekends a month supposed to get it to work right? :confused:
I think the Outlaw is neat idea, but once again, Polaris really dropped the ball.

Although I agree that the outlaw does seem like it needs work for a pro-caliber rider, the results actually show that for the average joe to just below Pro the machine works VERY well. As I stated earlier the lower level riders(Don't take that in a bad way) seem to be adapting quite well to it. I just again think Smiley at his level(a level that you and I will probably never obtain) is pushing the machine beyond its limits. It will be a good weapon for the pros too. It may just take another year or two.....and a lighter version. ;)

[yamadog]

I walked by the pits before the race,and asked Matt Smiley why he wasn't racing it. He did not really want to answer it, just shrugged his shoulders and smiled and told me he was jsut going to try the predator today. (Good politics Matt) lol

He prbobaly got asked that allot.

You know he can't be negative even if he doesn't like it, or just hasn't got it where he wants it right now due to the backing and/or support of Polaris.

I am sure he will bring this machine out of the garage though and have it on the Potuim soon.

But Stephanie P. seems to have Her's running good.

but those guys are going to be fast on what ever you put them on anyway.

[MAaudioX10]

Originally posted by Octane
What I mean by "too late" is that will the Outlaw develop a repuatation as a slow, heavy trail quad and because of that it wont be a strong seller.
Polaris needs to have the Outlaw out on the track winning races NOW, not 1 or 2 years from now.
If someone is looking at the Outlaw for GNCC racing and sees that Polaris isnt racing it because they cant get the suspension to work right, why would they buy one?
If a team of Polaris engineers cant get it to work right, how is the average guy who races 1 or 2 weekends a month supposed to get it to work right? :confused:
I think the Outlaw is neat idea, but once again, Polaris really dropped the ball.

I don't think Polaris has a lot to worry about with the Outlaw. Like I said before, one of a kind bike. The Outlaw is one of the best riding sport quads, if not the best, out of them all.

I couldn't imagine why there are Polaris Engineers working on Elka suspension. If the suspension is the cause, hardly one to blame polaris. They didn't install those shocks.

The average weekend dirt pounder isn't going to fuss with all the crap the pros do. They get the bike, pipe it, filter, jet...minor suspension adjustments and, GO! That's it.

Is it the ultimate GNCC machine? Probably not but, you don't have to have a top GNCC win to have good product movement.

What I see is a company that has pretty much stayed out of the lime light (GNCC racing) for quite a while. They dove in, head first, with the Predator last year and got a respectable position. IRS on a sport quad has never been done before....so, I imagine this year is a tuning year. Getting to know the machine. Next year, I think it'll be the machine to beat.

[Big Chuck]

I got to tell ya, I have more energy, am faster and not beat as bad after the GNCC's this year, and that's saying alot for me. I am definately faster on it longer. I have had some small issues on it as I expected with a new model. It is completely different than the Predator barring the motor. I bought the 03 Predator when it 1st came out, sure there were issues to fix at 1st. I think that any new model will have some problems. I think it is going to take a while to get it to where it can handle a pro's abuse. They are hitting the track faster than you realize, beating it harder than most of us will ever. So give it some time, I don't think Polaris or Smilie is giving up on it. I know I'm not.

[TomDnSC]

Just think of all the driving skills perfected using the SRA suspension.

I think the IRS will take time to perfect the skills for the new driving style to take full advantage and speed that may be found by taking a different line.

To go fast you have to comfortable on your Quad. It takes seat time to acquire that confidence. Things happen so fast that the brain has to instinctively react to feedback from the Quad. Basically, you have to be able to go fast in your sleep.

Think of all the hours the Pros have spent on SRA machines. They will have to retrain their brains to get the most from the IRS.

I think a Utility Champ might have an easier time adjusting to the Outlaw.

[calds650]

Originally posted by TomDnSC


I think a Utility Champ might have an easier time adjusting to the Outlaw.

It will be just as hard for them to adjust because they will have to learn how to shift gears and use a manual clutch. :D

[bradley300]

i think his biggest issue is switching to the Elka shocks. i like elka shocks, but he's always rode axis and switching to the outlaw was a big enuff change. i'm not sure he had much of a choice since his team manager last year and this year got a job w/ elka over the winter. its just bad timing. he should have stayed on axis this year and go the quad dialed in, then switched to a new shock once he knows what feel he's trying to get with the shocks

[sharktailer]

the 1st race this year he rode axis, on the back for sure

[CHADHIX]

No he did not......... That was a picture of Stephanie Partons Outlaw in that photo you are probably thinking about. They said it was Smileys but that was wrong. He has been on elkas ALL year.