TRX vs. LTR 450 Power.

[TRXDresh]

First off, I am not trying to pick a fight with anyone, I just want to get your guys' opinion.

I have had 2 TRX450R's, an 04 and 05. I sold me 04 recently, and am in the market for a new bike. The Zuke looks real attractive, but I am concerned about the power output. I ride the gambut of styles that our sport offers. I race TT, XC, and occasionly I will ride MX. My new bike would be more of a playbike that could be raced on the XC or MX track. I have seen some postings from HMF that say the LTR makes 41-43 horsepower with the Cherry Bomb kit, Pipe, and Power tuning. I know that an 06 450 r makes 46hp with an HRC kit. I know that Horsepower isn't everything, but what do you guys think. Have any of you guys transferred from a Honda to the Suzuki? What are your opinions. I could get an 06r out the door for 5700. If I put an axle, a-arms, and the HRC kit, I would be around the same price as a LTR. I just don't know which one I want. If I go to the Suzuki shop, I lean towars the LTR. I rode a stock 06r yesterday, and now I am leaning towards it. Any help would be appreciated.

Also, how are the brakes on the LTR? I love the Honda's brakes. It is hard me to ride a Yamaha agressively in the woods because I do not like the brakes. Do the LTR's brakes compare?

[PrarieWolf]

This is an hosnest acount after having my LTR for a week, here goes.

after a 40$ investment in a cherry bomb w/ lid off and baffle removed. power edge is completely better than my buddys piped, filtered 05R which i've ridden quite a bit. we have raced in sand and dirt LTR wins by at least 4 lengths on a 500 yard drag.
tranny gearing is pretty similar. LTRs 1st is a little lower than the R, thats the only diffrence i can tell so far.
Handling isn't even close. LTR by far is the better handler of the two.
brakes are supprisingly pretty close. the R may have a very slight advantage but not much. very similar feel.
I would be a little worried about trail riding with this thing for one reason. the ground clearance at the swingarm is really low(set up for MX + 18" tires). if you come accross any rutted out trails you will get hung up on the swing arm. and if you do start dragging the swingarm then you would run the risk of screwing up your disc and sprocket, because there is not a ton of armor under the swingarm.
I had the same decision as you a few weeks ago. went with the LTR because I felt that there was more potental in this machine than the R. the EFI end is what sold me. but its all up to you. you almost cant lose both are great machines.

[quadfam4]

Have a '06trx w/hrc and a ltr. Have had the ltr in sand for about 7 days total. Other people that have ridden them both think that the '06 trx w/hrc kit has slightly more power than the ltr but everybody likes the ltr better because of the bike setup and power delivery. We haven't raced them together but I think the power on the ltr is deceptive. It has a very smooth and strong power delivery that starts just off idle and keeps going. No low speed motor clunking like the Honda and Yamaha. Of all our quads my wife & I prefer the Suzuki. Stock it's wide, stable, the lightest thumb throttle I've ever used and easy to ride.

[spudss]

Originally posted by PrarieWolf
This is an hosnest acount after having my LTR for a week, here goes.

after a 40$ investment in a cherry bomb w/ lid off and baffle removed. power edge is completely better than my buddys piped, filtered 05R which i've ridden quite a bit. we have raced in sand and dirt LTR wins by at least 4 lengths on a 500 yard drag.
tranny gearing is pretty similar. LTRs 1st is a little lower than the R, thats the only diffrence i can tell so far.
Handling isn't even close. LTR by far is the better handler of the two.
brakes are supprisingly pretty close. the R may have a very slight advantage but not much. very similar feel.
I would be a little worried about trail riding with this thing for one reason. the ground clearance at the swingarm is really low(set up for MX + 18" tires). if you come accross any rutted out trails you will get hung up on the swing arm. and if you do start dragging the swingarm then you would run the risk of screwing up your disc and sprocket, because there is not a ton of armor under the swingarm.
I had the same decision as you a few weeks ago. went with the LTR because I felt that there was more potental in this machine than the R. the EFI end is what sold me. but its all up to you. you almost cant lose both are great machines.


Good honest reply.. I feel the same way..

[TRXDresh]

It seems like if you put a set of A-arms and an Axle under an 06R, they would be too close to call, am I correct in assuming this? I have had such good luck with my Honda's, but then again, my dad has had good luck with his Z400. I feel lucky to be in the predicamat that I am in because a couple of years ago, the big decision was between the 400's. I can't wait till all the manufacturers have their 450's out. It would be awesome if the ATV side starts getting the development like the Motorcross bikes do. Another thing that adds to drama is that my friend/sponsor owns the Honda shop in town, and he would be upset if I rode anything other than red. Oh well, I am just excited about the possibilities. Thanks for your input guys. Keep them coming.

[jfarrar30]

it will take more than an axel and arms to compete.you would need to go to long travel a arms plus get a good set of shocks to be in the same category.i had a set of axis on my last quad and the difference between thos and my ltr are small.so plan on putting about 2000 - 2500 in the front of the r to get it up to par.plus your axel and hrc kit.

if you are on a close budget and want the best bang for your buck i say ltr but if you wanna keep a friend and a sponsor that is gonna give you good deals and save money in the long run than go with the honda.

[Lightning]

Was in a oval race (first time) this weekend 2 LTR as well. dunno what was done to them. Pull well not as good as expected. but handles very well that can make up for any loss off power. For anything other than mx or oval racing I would say no. for me personally the front is not attractive but rear is good looking. But like most it will grow on me. Maybe own one in 2 -3 years when it has proven itself, could become the new benchmark in mx quads. To me its personal taste all three runners are good quads and up to rider input to make it a winner

[Jersey450R]

haha, i smoked a suzuki today. :macho

[motox450r]

you can ask any a class rider that has ridden or own's one and he will tell you that the stock ltr shocks will beat you up and down compared to axis shocks. lets be realistic now. if he doesn't he's lyin or don't know any better. quit dreamin farrar.

[BSTURDIVANT]

The LTR front shocks may be good for sand or mx but way oversprung for XC or trail! rear adjusts up nicely! Just take out all preload, and soften compression! GT Thunder has a link available also!
The throttle is way too quick- makes it hard to control!

[danny250r]

like anything the stcok shock will need tweeking. not compareable to axis etc right off the bat. but when dialed in, they can be as good as any. as far as hp goes here is a dyno pull of the trx w/ a 13:1 piston stage 2 cam full exhaust and filter set up against a ltr w/ cb and no lid or baffle and a yfz w/ cam mod full exhaust and filter set.

[danny250r]

here it is

[450rJam]

those are all so close, the rider and lines they pick would make the dif. and most likely trade wins back and forth.

[jb500ex]

when comparing too a trx compare the 06, it has alot more power then the 04 05. My 06 stock is as fast as my 04 with a 500 kit

[450rJam]

soooooooooooooo true

[quadfam4]

Was at glamis last weekend and ran my '06 honda w/hrc against my ltr. The suzuki hauled "a" through the whoops but slowly got caught about 3/4 up the hill. Sorry to say but could have been the 40 lbs I was spotting the other rider, and tire / gearing combos. I was having so much fun riding i didn't want to screw with swapping tires and stuff. I only go to the hills when our ride takes us there and I doubt that a hillshooter can get around the dunes with as much ease as that stock suzuki does.

[450rJam]

how far did you get in front before he honda started pulling on you ? where both running same paddles (straights)

[quadfam4]

He caught me about about 3/4 up the hill. My brother, riding one of my bikes (see list of my bikes) had 21-10-10 sand skate 1 play cut stock gearing - I had 20 10-10 6 paddle skat trak edge (vulcanized v paddle) and 1 tooth down in front - 13 from stock 14.

[450rJam]

man oh man that is quite the stable you have, 3 250R's and 3 450R's. and an ltr to top it off. sounds like good times forever. do you have pics of the 250r's on here ?

[quadfam4]

MY MOUNTS!

[quadfam4]

Other pics - my mounts!

[Ridin' Jesse]

The Power seems alot alike...I had the 450r before with a sparks pipe and jetted and now I have the LT-R with the cherry bomb and no baffle/lid...Id say that the LT-R seems to pull more. It def. has more botom end, and revs faster. The LT-R is a little snappier that the 450r too...Overall, I think that the LT-R has a little more power...The 450r def could hang with it, but the LT-R feels mroe powerfull for sure. I was on a straight away with a RM125, and he was in 5th pinned, and so was I and i was pulling him in the top end...He still had another gear, so he might have beaten me, but the LT-R Def. Pulls hard.

[DOHC]

i know for the crf450 bike wich is the same motor as the trx 450 the honda has 51hp and the suzuki has 48hp

[DOHC]

i know for the crf450 bike wich is the same motor as the trx 450 the honda has 51hp and the suzuki has 48hp

[450rJam]

that is one sweet herd of quads

[Ridin' Jesse]

Originally posted by DOHC
i know for the crf450 bike wich is the same motor as the trx 450 the honda has 51hp and the suzuki has 48hp

Umm..no..the TRX and the CRF motors are WAY different...the CRF is around 55 HP..the 06 that is..A 06 450r is around 37 or something I believe...those are just approximations though.

[DOHC]

Originally posted by Ridin' Jesse
Umm..no..the TRX and the CRF motors are WAY different...the CRF is around 55 HP..the 06 that is..A 06 450r is around 37 or something I believe...those are just approximations though.
o i thought the trx 450 had the same motor as the crf 450, my bad :o

[450rJam]

06 450r isnt same exact motor just shares alof of the same components and design

[Diedrich]

there not the exact same motors but the 06's are really similar..and a 06 450r has about 45 horses i do believe..i know it has way more than 37

[450rJam]

two places to measure hp, at the motor and at the rear wheels. motor is where factory measures (gives you highest numbers) the rear wheel measurement is lower because it takes into consideration all the power used to turn sprockets, tires, wheels,axles, etc. (they all subtract from motor numbers). thats why some stats are so dif. there are post everywhere about the changing factors of the dyno numbers. like altitude, tires, each dyno may be a little dif. there are alot. 06 hrc 450r seems to be around 48, most say "close to 50 hp", the dealership claimed it would be close to 60 hp. (they would say anything to seal the deal)

[danny250r]

sounds like to me all the current honda owners wont accept what reality is. the suzuki is faster and slightly more powerful when comparing dollars and hp. sure either one could be built faster than the other depending on how deep your pockets go. but everyone who has a ltr says the same thing over and over again,plus there was a real dyno sheet provided no funny stuff to it. if the ltr was say 5 hp or more than the rest i would say it was set up but it looks like a fair pull.

[450rJam]

use to be lt250r vs trx250r vs banshee, everyone knows banshee in straight line and trx250r on track and lt250r not too far back................now its ltr450 vs yfz450 vs trx450r but they are alot closer and result will be that each will push the others to new limits and as consumers we will be the winners by being able to purchase some of the best sport atv's ever offered
im not trying to throw water on this fire its just great to be at a point in my life to enjoy what is being offered. ok ok gas burns hotter than water and the honda will do as it has in the past and history will repeat itself............and there is a reason when someone says "R" its assumed that they are talking about the best ,highest quality,longest lasting,bad boy of atv's, its just that now it will be followed by the question is it 250 or 450 ? (I hope the others can keep up)

[ChrisSekerak]

Ok....let's compare.

Brand new Suzuki OTD maybe $7000 that's if your lucky.

I paid $6000 OTD for my 06 450r Honda.

Let's see I spent about $600 on an exhaust and the HRC kit. So I'm up to $6600 and still have $400 left.

A 06 LTR 450 will not compete with the 06 Honda I have. Key words will not. Yes the suspension might be a little better, but just the EFI and all the extra crap that is put on the bike, not even close to being worth it.

Just my opinion.

[jmoney45]

If you are talking on a track you are wrong. It's wider, lower, and probably almost as fast. I had a 450 and know how they handle stock. Once you widen it and lower it it will be a different story but on a track with stock tires and suspension you are at a big disadvantage.

[04TRX400EX]

First things first: I have not yet been able to ride any of the three 450's that everyone is constantly comparing. Therefore, my comments following are based off of what I have heard from dealers and friends that have tried all three ...

YFZ450: the undisputed champ of race quads, until the Suzuki came out. Previous model YFZ's were strictly race quads, but the '06's are much more trail friendly, with a smoother engine and better, more forgiving suspension. Stock hp is about 42-43. I do hear about some reliability problems here and there with Yamaha.

TRX450R: seems to have been always playing catch-up to the YFZ, until '06. The new engine mods have taken hp to about 46-47 and allowed it to actually beat a YFZ in a drag race. Downside - the suspension mods on the '06's result in a very stiff front end that needs some work. You cannot drive a R into the corners as hard because the bike won't plant itself. It wants to lift off the ground. It does have the strong surge of power though. I almost never hear about reliability issues with Honda.

LTR450: the easiest way to describe it is as a race quad. It comes stock with +2 arms and very advanced shocks, so it should handle better than the other two, and does. Power is smooth and long, putting out about 45hp. In a straight line, the LTR should beat all three, somewhat due to the fact that it hooks up better. On a track, it should win, because of race-type suspension right off the showroom floor. For trail riding, beware of ground clearance since it comes with 20's & 18's front & rear. The quad is brand new, so reliability is still a question. It may take a year to get the bugs worked out of the EFI and all that.


Everyone has their personal opinion. What you should consider is how they compare for what you will be doing with it - not just saying the Honda is the best cause Honda's are the best. Be subjective and open to opinions.

[MXracer16]

Originally posted by ChrisSekerak
Ok....let's compare.

Brand new Suzuki OTD maybe $7000 that's if your lucky.

I paid $6000 OTD for my 06 450r Honda.

Let's see I spent about $600 on an exhaust and the HRC kit. So I'm up to $6600 and still have $400 left.

A 06 LTR 450 will not compete with the 06 Honda I have. Key words will not. Yes the suspension might be a little better, but just the EFI and all the extra crap that is put on the bike, not even close to being worth it.

Just my opinion.

I guess I'm just really lucky, I got mine for $6600. Ha, you think it all has to do with engine. You may have a little bit more power, but the Suzuki has +2 A-Arms, add another $600 to yours. Then you have to figure in the the axle, another $300. All that extra $900-1000 isn't worth it for only $600 more? Give me a break. And the only thing youd have to spend on the Suzuki is the $40 for the Cherry-Bomb. 9 times out of 10, Id rather have a better handeling bike then one that doesnt handle, and has lots of power.

[motox450r]

guys what company is dominating the pro class right now. and their winning on a bike that is supposed to be less superior than the other two. we know which is best of the stock bikes. i wouldn't ride the suzuki stock if i bought one and there is a reason for that. if ya all want to talk stock that's cool. but serious riders are going to talk aftermarket. i wouldn't even want to ride in a all stock class either. that's just me though.

[danniheyj82888]

Originally posted by MXracer16
I guess I'm just really lucky, I got mine for $6600. Ha, you think it all has to do with engine. You may have a little bit more power, but the Suzuki has +2 A-Arms, add another $600 to yours. Then you have to figure in the the axle, another $300. All that extra $900-1000 isn't worth it for only $600 more? Give me a break. And the only thing youd have to spend on the Suzuki is the $40 for the Cherry-Bomb. 9 times out of 10, Id rather have a better handeling bike then one that doesnt handle, and has lots of power.

just wait until u have to spend money because its breaking down every other ride... that will add up fast. the 450r u wont need to do anything but change the oil for the next 10 years

[AceLtz]

Comments like that arent needed at all. No one knows if there are any reliability issues, people have only had them for a few months.

[ChrisSekerak]

I believe you are right....I do not like to compare stock bikes because I do not ride stock. I've had my 06 450r and have an HRC kit, pipe, filter and other odds and ends. The suspension is next to go.

The LTR450 are probably very nice.....but like that other guy said, let me know when your tranny starts going or the motor and shock mounts start cracking.


That $40 cherry bomb? you get what you pay for....that's all i'm sayin.

[Speed_MDS2]

You honda guys all act like the 450r is bullet proof. I looked in the 450r section, plenty of problems with them. Does this mean we should run around every forum screaming Honda sucks and 450r's are POS's? No. All the 450's are nice, ride whatever you want. And for every one ltr with tranny problems there's thousands with out.

[ChrisSekerak]

YEs you are right...all the 450's are excellent bikes. Honda's are bulletproof!!! jk I am a honda guy....I used to have a yamaha 2005 yfz450.

To each his own.

[quadfam4]

Nothing is bulletproof! I belong to an ATV riding club. Wide variety of quads, all makes models and years. On our last outing an '06 trx450r honda got towed back, motor stopped running because of a problem with the decompression valve. The trip before an '06 yfz was making engine noises and ended up getting an entire top end replaced under warranty. And these two guys take good care of their stuff. Nothing is perfect and depending on how they are maintained or lack of will have alot to do with their dependability. Not being a total wrench head and wanting to tear into my equipment every other ride I've found the closer to stock I keep my bikes (at least engine wise) the less problems I have. Changing oil, cleaning air filters every trip, regular chain and sprocket maintenance go a long way toward keeping a reliable ride under you.
As for the cherry bomb, it is a plug in module that accesses a Suzuki installed efi remap for running a stock muffler w/ baffle removed and airbox lid off. Same as rejetting a carb when modding intake or exhaust.

[motox450r]

i said from the git go that all these bikes are wound tighter than a golf ball. lol. they all have problems. i was just saying i think i'll stick with my honda for now. i have had a problem with my r but it wasn't honda related, it was hot cams, and they stepped right up and took care of me. nows there's a class company. wasn't sayin that the ltr was junk, because i know better than that. we'll see what 07 brings before i switch colors. i wish i could see some ltr's out where we have been riding though. they'll be out there soon though.

[spudss]

Originally posted by ChrisSekerak



That $40 cherry bomb? you get what you pay for....that's all i'm sayin.

And how much did your HRC kit run you?? Yeah so the cerry bomb gives more power than the HRC and for a lot less

[tone]

you need to look down the road you arent saving money buying a quad with a carb efi is the future youre 6000 dollar honda is worth 2500 in 08 good investment

[quadfam4]

The HRC kit really wakes up the honda. IMO motorwise the honda w/ HRC kit is slightly faster than the suzuki uncorked w/ cherry bomb plugin. BUT - go out and ride them both - the lt-r is much easier to control - faster through the whoops, much better overall handling. Stick two riders with same ability on both at the same time - I think the suzuki rider will come out on top -- If you are talking about racing. If not, hey - we're just having fun riding what we've got!!

[AceLtz]

So much crap about whos faster. Thier all about the same yet people start getting thier panties in a wad about them. I took the ltr just because the a arms and axle. Other wise i probably wouldve bought a honda or yfz. Dont start threads named "450r vs ltr power" your asking for people to start getting mad.

[Punk'd]

Who cares.. I have a 04 450r and I smoked a suzuki at a race lastweek.

[quadfam4]

Originally posted by Punk'd
Who cares.. I have a 04 450r and I smoked a suzuki at a race lastweek.

ARE YOU OLD ENOUGH TO SMOKE???!!!

[duneflyer1]

I have ridden both, and the 06 450r, in sand (Glamis) is a much better ride. I also smoked a couple of LTZs in sand drags consistantly. It comes down to where you are going to ride. If there are whoops, jumps and tight turns invoved, you may be better off with the ltz, but I would recommend waiting at least a year, you have to let the bugs get out. I would do it on any new bike. I have always ridden red, so I am sure there are some bias there, but to me, the honda the way to go. Right now, I ride a CRF hybrid, with a stock motor, with custom axis all around, and it is better then all three, and I only paid 6000 for it :devil: That would be the way to go.

[quadfam4]

If you got a new 450 honda with all those mods for $6000, you got a great deal! But if you got the bike only and paid extra for the mods, well then... I own the different bikes we're talking about and everyone that has ridden them says the l-tr is a very nice ride compared to the others, in power, handling and suspension. I don't race anymore so I don't need to build a bike that can get the holeshot and through to whoops the fasted. As dozens of others have posted previously, you can easily sink several thousand more into any machine to build it to whatever capability you want. My preference is to get something I can keep close to stock for ease of maintenance. I don't care to ride something obnoxously loud. I got tired of chasing all the mods on my first 250r. Had a ds-650 when they first came out for about 6 months, easy plush ride if your going slow - but what a pig. Had a '99 400ex for about 6 years, very stable and dependable. Got the 450's for more performance but I don't expect them to be as low maintence as the 400 ex.
Power and performance costs, how much time and money do you have???!!!

[duneflyer1]

I bought it as its set for 6G. But remeber its a CRF motor, not a TRX, I didnt mind riding the ltz, and, like I said I wouldnt mind owning one, for the right price, and not a first year model, just like I wouldnt buy a first year 450r. But I was born with a honda and will take a lot to change that. :cool:

[AL Elks]

Originally posted by duneflyer1
I bought it as its set for 6G. But remeber its a CRF motor, not a TRX, I didnt mind riding the ltz, and, like I said I wouldnt mind owning one, for the right price, and not a first year model, just like I wouldnt buy a first year 450r. But I was born with a honda and will take a lot to change that. :cool:

It's not a "LTZ". It's a "LTR". Two different quads.

[TRXDresh]

I was not starting this thread so that people could get mad at each other, I just wanted to know the facts. I have seen a dyno sheet on an 06 R with HRC that made 46 HP. I also saw a dyno sheet on a LTR that made 42-43 HP with a Cherry Bomb and full exhaust. Is that true? I know for a fact that the Honda's dyno sheet was correct because I was standing there when it was on the dyno. I can get A-arms and an Axle for $1000, and I would think that the bikes would be too close to call. I know the LTR has long travel from the factory, but is the suspension good enough to not warrant aftermarket shocks? I just think when you lay down an equivalent amount of money at both dealers, you will get very similar bikes.

[Baracudaaa]

Look at the thread with the new dyno results. With pipe and c/b his best pull was 48hp , and that is without the Yoshi PIM installed, which might be good for another 1 or 2 hp.

[AceLtz]

I talked to yoshi and they said that the PIM will barely give any more hp. 48hp is still great though. :D Rossier also dynoed thier exhaust vs the yoshi and got 48hp also.

[jmarion]

I've had my ltr for about 2 weeks now and raced it yesterday for the first time in a hare scramble. I have been a diehard Honda owner for years and have an 04 450r. The ltr doesn't seem to have quite the hit of the 06 450r that my neighbor has, but the power is very smooth. (it doesn't feel underpowered at all, just smoother) I have the CB with mods, but need to regear due to going to 20in rears. 2nd is way too tall with larger tires. This should make a big difference in the low end. During the race I had no trouble passing other 450's in open sections.

-----------

We did a couple of runs this weekend and I was slightly ahead of his 06 Honda with the HRC kit and full HMF exhaust. That being said we did not have a chance to switch bikes.

As for handling, the stocks are incredible on the ltr. The springs are much larger and the rear is a lot softer. (with much of the preload removed and compression about 3/4 on the soft side) The ride is much more like my neighbors 06 450r with Elkas than my 04 450r with stock shocks. Hope this is helpful.

[quadfam4]

Originally posted by TRXDresh
I was not starting this thread so that people could get mad at each other, I just wanted to know the facts. I have seen a dyno sheet on an 06 R with HRC that made 46 HP. I also saw a dyno sheet on a LTR that made 42-43 HP with a Cherry Bomb and full exhaust. Is that true? I know for a fact that the Honda's dyno sheet was correct because I was standing there when it was on the dyno. I can get A-arms and an Axle for $1000, and I would think that the bikes would be too close to call. I know the LTR has long travel from the factory, but is the suspension good enough to not warrant aftermarket shocks? I just think when you lay down an equivalent amount of money at both dealers, you will get very similar bikes.

Yes, you can buy middle quality a-arms and axle for $1000. Then just bolt up your old shocks and go for a lousy ride. Quality suspension (just a-arms and shocks) cost alot more than a grand. BTW I just saw a dyno sheet with a uncorked LT-R @ 48 hp.

Quality A-arms and shocks front and rear will cost you $3000+. You get what you pay for.

[TRXDresh]

So are you saying that the suspension on the Suzuki is comparable to $3000 suspension? Are you going to put on other shocks and arms? Are we comparing apples and oranges. I just don't want to spend 1200 more dollars if I am going to have to upgrade the suspension anyway. I have Elka shocks and JB all the way around and I love them. Are the stock Suzuki units going to be better than regular travel aftermarket arms with stock shocks.

[quadfam4]

$1000, $1200, $3000 - you keep changing up :confused:. The LT-R stock is a real nice ride - no need to dump a chunk of change in it. Nuff said!!! :p

[TRXDresh]

$1200 is how much more I would spend on a LTR than a TRX. $1000 is how much I could get a set of decent arms and an axle for. The $3000 number came from a guy on here telling me that is what I would have to spend to upgrade the TRX. I know some of you guys don't like numbers, but they are our friend. Your eagerness to respond has outweighed your responsibility to verify the facts.

[ChrisSekerak]

My suggestion for suspension set up for either bike are the PEP big bottle fronts and Elka Rear with dual linkage.

[JIMTED79]

Originally posted by quadfam4
Yes, you can buy middle quality a-arms and axel for $1000. Then just bolt up your old shocks and go for a lousy ride. Quality suspension (just a-arms and shocks) cost alot more than a grand. BTW I just saw a dyno sheet with a uncorked LT-R @ 48 hp.

So if this guy spent $3000 on suspension for his honda you think the stock LTR is comparable? YEAH RIGHT

[fmfracing5]

i have one thing to say and one thing only, you honda guys are comparing your 450rs with the hrc kits(im not shure what they run but i know its alot more then a cherrybomb) to an ltr450 with a cherrybomb 40$ and baffle removed priceless) talk about power when your putting a stock maching basically to an hrc 450r

[TRXDresh]

an hrc kit is $250, which is still cheap for the amount of horsepower you gain. I think that these power up kits seem to put them in the same ballpark. Yes, the CB is only 40 dollars, yet an HRC 450R is still 500-1000 dollars cheaper than a cherry bombed LTR.

[AceLtz]

That difference in price, in my opinion, is well worth the upgrade in suspension. The Arms, Axle, and better shocks are why its around $750-$900 more.

Everyone needs to really stop this war on whose fastest. I dont care how any of you feel but here are the real facts. Stock machines, the ltr is the fastest. I dont know by how much but its at around 45hp just with the CB. i dont really care about your personal experiences racing another ltr because it doesnt matter. HP numbers for HP numbers the LTR has the advantage by a little.

I think thier all great machines and i wouldnt mind owning any of the three 06's. They all have thier ups and downs.

450r- reliability, VERY clean engine and easy to work on, good ride and great smooth power.

yfz-pretty much same as 450r but honestly, a little more power.

ltr- little more pricey but has better suspension, and a SLIGHT power advantage.

Any of you willing to argue this just need to give it up and accept the facts for what they are. In the future honda and yamaha are probably going to step it up and out do suzuki. Theres always going to be a bike that has the "new" parts and is one step ahead of the rest. If there wasnt a bike with an advancement what would the other companies have to beat? When every company adds some good things to a new machine its a gain for everyone because all the other manufacturers are going to match it. all im saying is that the whole argument honda vs. suzuki vs. yamaha is pretty stupid. Pcik your bike, whichever it is, and be happy with it.

[jb500ex]

Originally posted by AceLtz
That difference in price, in my opinion, is well worth the upgrade in suspension. The Arms, Axle, and better shocks are why its around $750-$900 more.

Everyone needs to really stop this war on whose fastest. I dont care how any of you feel but here are the real facts. Stock machines, the ltr is the fastest. I dont know by how much but its at around 45hp just with the CB. i dont really care about your personal experiences racing another ltr because it doesnt matter. HP numbers for HP numbers the LTR has the advantage by a little.

I think thier all great machines and i wouldnt mind owning any of the three 06's. They all have thier ups and downs.

450r- reliability, VERY clean engine and easy to work on, good ride and great smooth power.

yfz-pretty much same as 450r but honestly, a little more power.

ltr- little more pricey but has better suspension, and a SLIGHT power advantage.

Any of you willing to argue this just need to give it up and accept the facts for what they are. In the future honda and yamaha are probably going to step it up and out do suzuki. Theres always going to be a bike that has the "new" parts and is one step ahead of the rest. If there wasnt a bike with an advancement what would the other companies have to beat? When every company adds some good things to a new machine its a gain for everyone because all the other manufacturers are going to match it. all im saying is that the whole argument honda vs. suzuki vs. yamaha is pretty stupid. Pcik your bike, whichever it is, and be happy with it.

the shocks are not better, the width helps with the handling. None of the companies have great stock shocks and the new suzuki is no different.

[Renagade]

I ride with a couple of friends . They have an 04 450r, and 05 450r cammed and piped. my ltr stays right beside them 3/4 throttle. They are really no match . Both of them are going to sell and buy ltr's.

[AL Elks]

Originally posted by jb500ex
the shocks are not better, the width helps with the handling. None of the companies have great stock shocks and the new suzuki is no different.

I have to disagree. The shocks are AWSOME. They are mu;ch better than my friends 450r. These things soak up whatever you throw at them and I weigh 210lbs easily. I can kick myself in the rear for not building the suspension on my Z prior to motor mods. It has tons of motor but absolutely no aftermarket suspension.

[mcattack]

I picked up my LT450R yesterday and was also worried about ground clearance. It setting side by side with an 05 400EX have the same ground clearance Because the brake rotor and spocket is so much smaller than the one on the 400EX






LT450R
Yosh system
cherry bomb

I think the steering and suspension geometry on the LTR is near perfect. I am not so impressed with the stock shocks(or any stock shocks), and I have adjusted them. I think some PEP ZPS and some Walsh LT A-arms are the best money spent on the quadracer.

[TRXDresh]

So are you guys planning on buying new arms in the future, or could you get away with putting a set of aftermarket shocks on the stock arms? That would be a huge advantage.

I am sure you could, the problem is the ball joints are non-replacable or adjustable on the stock arms so when they wear you will buying new arms anyway. Besides I want long travel and spherical bearings instead of ball joints.

[TRXDresh]

What stipulates a suspension system being long travel? I thought the LTR had Long travel suspension out of the box.

Std travel front shocks usually 16-17"(LTR 17"), Long travel 19-20" shock. When running a Zero preload sag system long travel allows the bike to sit low and still have plenty of USABLE travel. Same for LT rear shock and linkage. For MX long travel feels and performs better all the way around to me. You get what you pay for, in most cases.

[bwamos]

Originally posted by TRXDresh
What stipulates a suspension system being long travel? I thought the LTR had Long travel suspension out of the box.

Here's a copy of a post I made a couple months ago. Might help some.



The term "Long Travel" came about because moving the shock out further toward the wheel causes the shaft to travel further when the suspension is moving. Aka a Long Travel shock. As a result of moving the shock out, and the incresed shaft travel a longer shock body is required.. but that is a result, not the cause.

An 18" long shock with 3" of shaft travel is not a LT shock. However, an 15" shock with 6" of shaft travel is a LT shock.

For example.. if you have a 300ex. and you put a set of shocks on it that are 18" long (much longer than stock), raise the upper mount to accomidate and use the stock a-arm mountling locations it is not an LT system. It is just a big arse fugly shock doing nothing more than a stock length shock does. Full shaft travel of about 3 inches.

Now if you take a shorter length shock, say 15 inches and drop the upper mounts back down closer to the stock mounting locations, and move the lower shock mount out closer to the wheels, your shock shafts travel can increase (to about 6"), thus a long travel shock.

That's what a LT system is supposed to be. Simply moving the lower mount closer to the ground only reduces ground clearance. You have to move it closer to the wheels to make it an LT system.

Droping the mounting point on many of the arms like Leagers, Walsh, etc.. is for ease of fabrication and design. They bend the tubes, place a mounting tube on the bottom of the tubes, and weld them together using a pair of gussets. It's quicker, cheaper, and stronger than drilling a hole through the arms, and inserting the mounts there. It's also stronger than putting them in top since tesnile strength of steel is MUCH stronger than crush resistance. It's good sound engineering and manufacturing, but that alone is not what makes it a Long Travel system.

So, in conclusion the LT-R has about the same amount of shock shaft travel as a Roll design LT system, and several other systems, so if they are considered LT, then the LTR should also fall into that catecory. It's not quite as far into the LT range as say a nice set of Walsh arms are though since their lower mounting point is much closer to the wheel/ball joint.

[450rJam]

IMO the ltr with cb and no sparky and no lid is the first step everyone takes, its not stock but its not all "aftermarket modded"
the 450r w/hrc is about the same thing, its the first step (usually taken before the quad leaves the dealership).
its like when everyone compairs the 250r and what ever.
it would be the rare thing to find a stock one.
it will be rare to find a ltr w/sparky and lid and cb added
not saying they are not out there but its not the norm.
I do think next year the suzuki will be improved, if not performance wise it will be altered to increase dependability
(frame/axle/trans)
now how long will it take honda/yammy to get efi?
maybe they can all 3 learn from each other and we the consumer
can get the baddest atv's yet to be offered.

[goldrims04]

Originally posted by danniheyj82888
just wait until u have to spend money because its breaking down every other ride... that will add up fast. the 450r u wont need to do anything but change the oil for the next 10 years i put 10 -15 hours aweek on my ltr since i got it month ago no problems i used to have a 04 honda but it got stolen i am happy it did even know it costed me 8000 dollars the suzuki is great and reliable and i f i still had my honda i would talk crap about to ltr too so i hear what u r saying its just part of the game

[goldrims04]

Originally posted by AL Elks
I have to disagree. The shocks are AWSOME. They are mu;ch better than my friends 450r. These things soak up whatever you throw at them and I weigh 210lbs easily. I can kick myself in the rear for not building the suspension on my Z prior to motor mods. It has tons of motor but absolutely no aftermarket suspension. ihave to agree with u the shocks are great i run xc and weigh 280 and they perform great and what i always say if you are used to paying or having 2000 to 3000 suspension setups then stock wont cut it so jump on the band wagon and buy the best name cuz thats what most people are doing

I am addicted to my lt-r.. I also own a 2006 450R and I bought it from PROCYCLE... www.procycleusa.com It is in Columbia, Missouri... thats where I bought both atv's... I walked out the door with a white 2006 LT-R450 and a matching helmet for $6,700...the helmet cost me $$120.00.. 2 months later I wanted another atv for stunts and practice bike so I went to PROCYCLE and bought a black 2006 TRX450R and walked out the door with another matching helmet that cost $$110.00 and walked out the door for just $$5,350.00... So far I have raced the lt-r twice and finished in 2nd place and 4th place in MX races, I bought a yoshimura Pro Series Carbon Fiber full system for around $620.00, Yoshi cherry bomb for $39.95, removed air box lid and was race ready.. It took me A **** LOAD OF MONEY ON MY 450R..(read my sig)... and with the 450R I got 1st place, and 3rd place... and I spent easily $2,000 more on accesories for the 450R!! but I love both my babies

[quadracer3]

yall honda boys say what you want ,i pulled the holeshot on a 05 480 honda and two o6 hondas on my ltr ,i think all the new 450 motors are very close so wouldn't down any of them its not all about the bike the rider has alot to do with it.

[450rJam]

you pulled a 480 your proof rider can make the difference.
congrads, the ltr isnt a punk and like you said neither are the other 450's.
I do wonder how far they will or can go before they pull the reins back. a 600r ? a 750ltr? a yfz888 ?
I wonder if they will ever get to the point where you can buy a 60hp stock atv..........I think it will get nuts then back off a little
for woods riding the new 450's already have more power than you can use in some parts of the trails.

yall honda boys say what you want ,i pulled the holeshot on a 05 480 honda and two o6 hondas on my ltr ,i think all the new 450 motors are very close so wouldn't down any of them its not all about the bike the rider has alot to do with it.


that is true, I always pull on the holeshot on Yammi's and 450R's.. lt-r's have great torque though and that gives them the holeshot power, and th fuel injection doesent hurt.

[450rJam]

primetime#3 = primetime#12
funny how you reply to only same posts mr. 12 does
torque is only one part of the mixture.
on holeshot none is bigger than the rider.

[Phills450r]

my friend just bought a new 05 Honda450 2 days ago and a guy at the track just bought his LTR450 2 days ago also... the honda was out running him every race... of course mine is stock with the honda stepup kit and i was eating him up.. as far as the suspension goes... LTR > Honda

im just explaining how it was happening when i raced.. :)

[mxmike17]

Man I smoked my 6yr old on his DRX 50 yesterday:devil:

[suzuki_ltr_stud]

lol, ya I smoked a TRX90 on my lt-r and spit in his face after the race, not to mention he was 5.. but still a win is a win.

[mxmike17]

Originally posted by suzuki_ltr_stud
lol, ya I smoked a TRX90 on my lt-r and spit in his face after the race, not to mention he was 5.. but still a win is a win.


Thats what im talking about:D