Curtis Sparks Advance Timing Key

[TheChknhwk]

Has anyone tried this thing yet, it is only 15 bucks & here is the write up from his webpage:

Sparks Racing has found inexpensive, instant bolt on horsepower!

Our Ignition Advance Key simply takes the place of the stock woodruff key and advances the timing six degrees instantly!

What does that actually do? Well, it peps up the motor. Bottom end all the way through top end is increased.

Response from riders who have tried the ignition advance key has been awesome! This is a must have for every 400EX owner. The key simple to install and works well with stock 400EX's all the way up to a fully built 400EX. Not recommended for high compression or big bore motors because advanced timing does not seem to work well in these situations.

We even throw in a flywheel puller

thanks for the feedback ~ Hawk

[JhallettEX]

I just ordered one from C&D, I should have it either Friday or Saturday. I will let you all know what I think.

[Razorback]

ok, i'm not a gearhead. i don't like messing with the motor, although i am willing to learn. the only motor work i've done is adjusting the valves and rejetting the carb (although i don't know if that qualifies as motor work), so what is involved in installing this timing key?

[VegasEx'r]

I've got one. I'd say it's worth 15 bucks. It does make it tougher to adjust your valves (hard to find TDC, since the marks are off), and I think that the additional timing makes it hot enough that the engine needs race gas (50/50 mix). The biggest difference I remember from the stock key was that throttle response was better.

Razorback, as far as installing it, it isn't too tough. You need either an impact wrench or a friend to get the flywheel off. Remove the left side case sover, pull out the flywheel bolt, grease up the flywheel puller & crank it down (this is where the friend or wrench some in) until the flywheel pops off. Swap the keys & put it back together. I have done this to 2 quads. On one I bought a new gasket (like $20) for the case cover, the other time I was careful removing the gasket & reused it. Neither leaked, so I guess it'sup to you if you want to buy a new gasket or not.

[Razorback]

thanks for the feedback...

[DJFuzzyNut]

Is this something that can be done to a 300EX also or just the 400EX?

[Sparks425Ex]

Why is it harder to find TDC. What do you mean the marks are off?


I am going to install mine d I need to find TDC again or no?

[Sick0]

Does it move the flywheel.

[0240099r1]

yes it moves the flywheel but all you have to do is find TDC on comp. stroke we put one in my friends 400 and it slowed it down he was very upset and called sparks they said some 400's like it and some don't so we took it out and it runs better but it may help yours for 15 bucks i think its worth a try i'm going to try his to see if mine likes it . hope this helps..

[Drtridr18]

I like mine, well worth the 15 bucks, better throttle response and more snap, didn't notice it running any hotter, but that's just me, I like to run synthetic oil and change it often.

As for timing? Yeah the marks dont' line up, but go just a little beyond the mark, make sure all 4 rockers are loose which means they're on the base circle on the cam, you're ready to go.

[Sparks425Ex]

You are supposed to find TDC through the Spark Plug Hole. I don;t know how to do it but that is what the Direvtions say.


Somoen help me out with that. And what is teh ig ole Screw you get with it for. Where does it go? Any Pictures?

[cheetah]

Ok I have had mine sitting on my desk for a couple months and I think tomorrow I am finally gonna put it in. Does any one have a pic or diagram of the inside. I have never looked in there before and I am just wondering if there is going to be anything that could confuse me or throw me off.

Thanks.

[lilpoppy]

that big old screw that comes with it is the flywheel puller. You will notice that it will fit the threads perfectly in the middle of the flywheel.

[JDsBusa]

Dont wate your time putting them in, they suck. It went from me pulling my friend, to me getting pulled. They Suck!
Justin
But I would be willing to sell mine
Justin

[Sparks425Ex]

Prolly cause you are impatient and do not know how to use tools properly.Or did not have the correct tools.

Everyone has said that they love theirs and it had made a great improvment. I have riding on many quads with the ignition key in and there is alot of power to be gained just for 15 bucks.

Please don;t reply if you don;t have anything remotly constructive to share.

[MC80]

to find tdc what you want to do is pull your spark plug out and take a long screwdrive or punch and stick it in the hole. Get to your timing mark and then put the screwdriver in the plug hole. slowly turn the flywheel counter clockwise until the piston tops out. you'll feel it and that is when your piston is at tdc.
hope that helps you.

[JDsBusa]

Just giving my honest opinion, and to make sure that it was done right, I took it back apart, tried it again and.. Same thing. Its not complicated. Remove cover, flywheel, old key, install new with red pointing out, turn flywheel to left until it stops, now flywheel has new position and you now have 6 deg more timing, and boom instant 500hp for 15 dollars. But guess what it didnt work on mine. Took it out and went faster. Just call them and ask them have they had any complaints, on 400ex, and on raptors. I guess since you have the Sparks avitar you did get a little offended by what I said, but the truth hurts. If someone had muffler bearings, or powerband adjusters for sale on here would you want everyone to be quiet and let people who didnt know buy them, I would hope not.
Justin

[0240099r1]

hey nacs i think jds not trying to flame anybody and he's knows what he is doing your the one that don't know how the key works we have tried many different mods and like he said it did not work on his sure for 15 bucks its worth a try he just stated the facts on the key on his 400 just my .02..............

[FastHonda400ex]

JDsBusa,
How much would you sell your key and flywheel puller for? Let me know.

Thanks,
Doug

[Sparks425Ex]

Originally posted by 0240099r1
hey nacs i think jds not trying to flame anybody and he's knows what he is doing your the one that don't know how the key works we have tried many different mods and like he said it did not work on his sure for 15 bucks its worth a try he just stated the facts on the key on his 400 just my .02..............

I don't think he was either. And no he did not just state facts about his 400. He said they are junk and throw it away. I don't really take offense to anything bad said about Sparks. Yes i have had my engine done by him and I will never go anywere else. I don't think he hashad experience with them as engine builders. Their power is amazing.

I know how the keys works and I know how to install it I just do not know how to get the fly wheel off. But I do now. I had an idea but I didn't want to do anything until I was sure.

[Sick0]

How high is high compression? I'm going to 10:8 piston which isn't that high but is high enough. Will it work that high.

[JDsBusa]

I love there products, well there pipes anyway. I have the x4 and will buy and x6 in the future. But they key is trashed. I have cut it up in little pieces to help relieve frustration. LOL Na, I still have it, but I dont know what I want to do with it. It cost me too much to sell it for cheap, i would rather it set on the shelf and collect dust before putting someone else through what I have allredy learned.
Justin

[Sick0]

So it kill power

[yellow400rider]

so some people say it gave them better throttle response and others say its trash.:confused: ill b going down to sparks shop in jan to get my x-6 and am still confused as to wheter i should try it for $15 or not. anybody else have opinion on it??

[lilpoppy]

Ya just try it. It is only 15$ just give it a shot if it doesn't work then it wasn't a big loos. My friend just installed one on his and it works great. Just make sure you get a gasket ahead of time.

[JDsBusa]

Oh yeah, they rev quicker with them, and mat have given a little low end, but like I said it killed the hp. Since I did it, I have talked to a few others who said the same thing. If you are not worried about how fast you wheeler is, you will love it. Otherwise it isnt worth..15 for the key, 8 for shipping, 15 for the gasket, and your however much for your time. Make sure all your sufaces are clean before you install your flywheel, its so much easier if you scrape beforehand.
Justin

[lilpoppy]

Well I'm truely sorry it didn't work out for you dude but it has worked for a ton of people. Like sparks said some quads like it and some don't. We all know that two of us could buy two brand new quads and race them head to head right outside the dealers door and one of them will be faster. No two quads are the same so I say give it a shot man. You will notice that only one peoson is complaining in here and the rest say it works.

[Sparks425Ex]

JdsBusa:

How does it give ya more throttle response and maybe some more low end but decrease Horse Power?
I don't understand. Please explain.

[yellow400rider]

yeah i dont get what your saying??

[JDsBusa]

Not everything helps top and bottom. Like with drag cars, some who want mega hp, go dual dominator 1050 carbs, they help on the big end, but they kill torque down low. Likewise for torque they run one big carb. Same thing with cams you put a big cam in, and you will loose torque, but increase hp, do the opposite, you loose hp, but gain down low.Thats why everyone says do atleast a high comp piston when you do a cam. Same thing with ignition, most race ignitions start pulling timing, after a certain point. Like I said, if you are not worried about hp, you will love the thing. Other wise you wont like it. But Dont listen to me I am just trting to save you $30.
justin

[jgfarmsracer]

it's called a timing advance key for a reason

it advanes the spark so that as the piston is comin up on the compression stroke the plug is already sparking (giving the better throttle reponse) if your not getting a difference it MAY be in wrong
i put mine in and didn't hold the flywheel as i tightened the nut appearently the fly wheel went right back in the stock position, that could be why some of you are not seeing or feeling the difference
i did some testing against a buddies quad no difference,then after some checking timing marks we found that it had not changed a thing
pulled it all back apart took a little more caution putting back together then run it and what a difference

just a thought

[JDsBusa]

I did that twice, and then I took it out.
Not all respond the same.
justin

[yellow400rider]

JDsbusa: i was just wondering, it seems like its a bit of a pain to install so why not just leave it in??? u say u felt No diff at all which i understand but did it actually HURT performance? thanks

[FastHonda400ex]

JDsBusa,

But I would be willing to sell mine
So, how much do you want for your timing key and flywheel puller?

[JDsBusa]

It made no noticable difference on the bottom, the noticable difference was it killed the big end.
Justin
The price I would sell it for, you would be just as good to buy a new one. Help keep them in buisness, thats what they are there for.

[TrX465]

i tried this "key" i straight sheared it off...this was a while ago

[0240099r1]

:grr if (nacs) and a few others want to keep giving jd a hard time over this key deal and asking so many ? well thats fine we can keep answering them all we were trying to do is state what happened to jds 400 with the key installed jd has a great running 400 with a few mods including a CURTIS SPARKS pipe we love his products but jd and i race all the time everytime we change anything on our quads he went from pulling me 2 quads before the key to me pulling about 3 it did seem better out of the hole but i pulled back around him very quick all he did was put his stock keyway back in place and he was back to being in front again so i hope this helps some of you .............

[yellow400rider]

Originally posted by 0240099r1
:grr if (nacs) and a few others want to keep giving jd a hard time over this key deal and asking so many ? well thats fine we can keep answering them all we were trying to do is state what happened to jds 400 with the key installed jd has a great running 400 with a few mods including a CURTIS SPARKS pipe we love his products but jd and i race all the time everytime we change anything on our quads he went from pulling me 2 quads before the key to me pulling about 3 it did seem better out of the hole but i pulled back around him very quick all he did was put his stock keyway back in place and he was back to being in front again so i hope this helps some of you .............

yeah that does help and makes sense. but i just wish i knew why it did wonders for some and was so damn horrible for others :confused: