06 Case Saver didnt save it :(

[wanna_be_ridn]

Hey all i was riding today and hit a lil step down jump and when i landed my chain came off and binded up between the front sprocket and a chain guide, after bout 30 min walk back home we got the truck and went down picked her up and when we got home 2 of the 3 bolts that hold on the case saver were broken including the mounts that hold them on, the bottom 3rd bolt that holds on the case is broken and it broke about 1/4 of the way around of a shaft that holds ur shifter on and is leaking oil, heres a few pics please if anybody knows how to fix this or has had this happen before let me know please...
http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c113/sik450r/case4.jpg (http://photobucket.com)
http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c113/sik450r/Case2.jpg (http://photobucket.com)
http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c113/sik450r/Case1.jpg (http://photobucket.com)
http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c113/sik450r/casesaver.jpg (http://photobucket.com)
http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c113/sik450r/casesaver1.jpg (http://photobucket.com)

[quad2xtreme]

that just sux!

I plan to call Daryl Rath tomorrow. He specifically told me about some product I should use to make sure my chain doesn't come off. His Competition ProPegs come with an extra aluminum mount when you use this other product. I wasn't too worried about it before but now looking at your case, geez.

/Jon

[wanna_be_ridn]

ya i just hope that this dont mean i will hafta get a new case.

you may be able to split the cases and drill/tap the holes, I have seen this happen before, your definently not the only one :(

[yamablaster24]

To better my chances of this not happening, was your chain properly tightened, or did a rock or something get in the sprocket and de rail it, or something else? I really hope this cant happen to me because i would be out of riding for a long time. I do tighten mine properly after every ride tho...

[450r51]

just buy a GOOD case saver and this wont happen.

[redrider410]

Did u say that the case cracked where your shifter shaft went into? From what I know, there was a problem with the design on the 04 and 05 model 450Rs. The front sprocket is located in a poor position which causes the chain to lift off of the sprocket when you punch the throttle.
If you cracked the case where the shifter shaft is located, you dont need a whole case, only the segment on that side.
There is no real way to stop the chain from popping on the 04 and 05 model 450r's, some of the pros were running 3 or 4 different chain guides and sliders to try and minimize the threat of popping a chain, but it is not completely full proof. The 2006 models were not supposed to have the same problem as the older models.

[redrider410]

this has happend to me before during a race at broome tioga...my chain usually always pops on a straight away when im heavy on the throttle. If i can remember, the whole job was around $600 to replace the case segment with the support for the shifter shaft. Lost Creek Cycles fixed that for me.

[redrider410]

Also, they are saying to adjust your chain a little tighter than usual, have someone adjust it for you while you are sitting on the bike, adjust it to the normal tension only have your body weight on the suspension of the bike.

[One_Bad_400]

to me.... the case saver did save it... thats whats thats made for... its made to screw up so it dont screw up your case... i'd be happy that thing broke like that... adn didnt smash your case...

[wanna_be_ridn]

well it did crack the case, where the shaft that ur shifter goes in there is a flange around it, it broke 1/4 of that off around that seal and now leaks oil, and yes my chain has always been checked before every ride and was tighten.

[redrider410]

the only thing I can think of is to run a swingarm chain guide. Check your upper swing arm chain slider also, it may be mangled from ure chain popping, change it to better your chances of not popping it again. I havent had any luck with that swingarm chain guide, but i know alot of people that love it.

I thought that honda relocated the front sprocket for 2006 so that there wasnt a frequent chain derailing problem...After you fix your case, just make sure it is adjusted perfect and try and after market chain guide.....TM design makes a good one for the 450R...

[desratt]

hahahaha look at that green shag carpet....hahahahah

you should have had your sister hold the case saver instead of your dirty crusty old hands.

[450rrider69]

hey desratt is ryan able to fix this or does he gotta get the new case?

[desratt]

I believe he will try to take it in for warranty on friday. see what they say. he works out of town on the weekdays. and the nearest dealer is 120 miles away.
yea we live in bfe , thats why there is so much riding here.


nearest mcdonalds is 93 miles away.

[Pappy]

Originally posted by 450r51
just buy a GOOD case saver and this wont happen.

ummm....what would a better case saver do that the stock one did not:confused: the enertia from the chain broke the cae, the case saver looks in good shape:p

[desratt]

he was just getting ready to buy a better case saver.

[KEVIN]

call noss and get there case saver it even goes around your shifter! buy a pep chain roller it goes on your rear subframe!!and like already posted get a tm designs chain roller cant beat it!!!!!!!!!!!

[quad2xtreme]

Originally posted by KEVIN
call noss and get there case saver it even goes around your shifter! buy a pep chain roller it goes on your rear subframe!!and like already posted get a tm designs chain roller cant beat it!!!!!!!!!!!

Can you post a close-up shot?

/Jon

[red&black191]

yeah thats what i was gonna suggest i use the pep upper chain roller & it works real good

[aroracer72]

Adjust your chain as tight as you can WHILE putting enough wait on the back end to bring the swingarm even with the engine...then tighten it as tight as possible while still having a little tiny wincy slack. You should never be able to take a chain and smack it up and down ...that means too lose...and you should have some slack....because no movement will break your chain or break your master link.
CHAD

[KRMit]

This happened to me today too. A buddy of mine was riding it slowly up a hill and the chain broke. It broke all the case saver mounts like yours and cracked the stator cover. It also bent the shift shaft. I'm real dissapointed with Honda on this.

[DirtDevilBT]

Ok first off this happens all the time on every bike or quad out there.

second, a good case saver is one that protects the case, it is meant to take the abuse even if the bolts break.

Third, you guys that suggested the Noss Machine case saver before me---u suck cause that CS is the best out there. I too have it and you can get it through Bluetraxx.com. Noss Machine is one of the whatumacallits on the site.

Forth, chains shouldn't just break. If you run without a skid plate like some pros do than you are chancing it breaking. If you lube the chain properly every time you go out helps prevent such a thing.

The best way to tighten a chain is with the use of a winch strap. Strap the hook to the grab bar and the other hool around the axle. Winch the strap down until the shock bottoms out. This will be the point where the rear sprocket is farthest from the front sprocket. If you tighten the chain up as far as possible with you just sitting on it, the chain can become even tighter when you jump the quad; especially when it bottoms completely out.

My cousin has an 87 warrior that has a million hours on it, well you get the point, and it still uses the original chain.

[KRMit]

The chain was adjusted properly and I had lubed it before running for the day. The guy that was riding mine had just gone through a section with gravel before it happened so our theory is that a rock got between the sprocket and chain and broke it. It's a freak thing but all we can think of as he wasn't riding hard at all.

I'm dissapointed in Honda for not having things a little beefier in that area. The guy was either in 1st or 2nd gear when it broke. It completely ripped off all 3 mounts for the case saver. Those mounts could have been made a little stronger. I'm not upset it mangled the case saver, that's what it's there for. I'm just irritated that now I have to fix all this other crap.

[Jonas]

Originally posted by KRMit
The chain was adjusted properly and I had lubed it before running for the day. The guy that was riding mine had just gone through a section with gravel before it happened so our theory is that a rock got between the sprocket and chain and broke it. It's a freak thing but all we can think of as he wasn't riding hard at all.

I'm dissapointed in Honda for not having things a little beefier in that area. The guy was either in 1st or 2nd gear when it broke. It completely ripped off all 3 mounts for the case saver. Those mounts could have been made a little stronger. I'm not upset it mangled the case saver, that's what it's there for. I'm just irritated that now I have to fix all this other crap.

Had anything been modded on your quad- skid plate, chain guides, case saver, axle, etc.???

[KRMit]

Originally posted by Jonas
Had anything been modded on your quad- skid plate, chain guides, case saver, axle, etc.??? The only thing I've changed related to that would be the removal of the swingarm skid plate and the addition of an axle. I don't see where the axle could make a difference though. The chain breaking isn't what bothers me though, that sorta stuff happens. I'm just dissapointed with what little good the case saver did.

[quad2xtreme]

anyone know why we haven't switched to belts like many street bikes. Just curious. Does it rob power or the belts aren't strong enough? Can't imagine this would be the case as street bikes have way more hp and torque and are shifting on pavement. hmmm...?

/Jon

[Lonestar_R]

I just bought a Noss Machine Case saver and it is by far the nicest case saver.......for 28 bucks I think it will have to protect more than the stocker ever will

[911]

i just looked at the noss case saver and besides it going over the shifter this thing will do no better than the orig. it's still going to break the top bolts right out of the case:( i ordered a nac's for my 04 and it actually fits right allong the entire side of the case so if it derailes the case saver won't move and the chain will go out the bottom (hopfully) this is by far the best iv'e seen but they don't make 1 for my 06 yet. when they do i'll get one;)

[DirtDevilBT]

The Noss CS is very beefy and the largest amoung savers. I also like the way it sits against where it mounts, the bolts go into the saver and seems to hold it tight against the case. I remember looking at the nacs and the Tim Design (or whatever it's called) but couldn't find it for the 450r, only the crf. I'm happy with mine but sometimes I wish these things would allow me to use the stock plastic chain gaurd.

KRMit---- come on man. You honestly don't run with a swingarm skid plate? I'm sorry but you were asking for it. Honda didn't screw up on anything, every quad comes with thin case savers and most need to be updated. The saver is just that, a CASE saver, it doesn't matter what saver you use howver, it will either rip the bolts out or bend them making the holes oval. As long as the chain doesn't rip a hole in the case, count you blessings.

quad2xtreme---The belt idea is good but they do still use chains on street bike though. I could only guess that running through lots of water, mud, and sand might take a heavy toll on a rubber belt. Other than that, I dunno. Maybe they like the return business of broken cases.:ermm:

[Jonas]

Similar to what Dirt is saying. When people say that stock Honda stuff sucks because look what happened to me. A stock 450r has alot of things on it that will prevent this from happening. When we, including myself, go and change the bike from stock we are taking a chance. The stock skid plate has a chain slider built into it which does it's part in keeping the chain on along with many other things. When you change out your stock axle for an aftermarket one there are things that can go wrong there also where the chain can come off, bind up, and then break. When you take off the stock countershaft sprocket cover and case saver this could also cause things to go wrong. When someone tells me that they keep their chain adjusted regularly, measure it for wear over time, and kept the bike stock as far as the sprockets, axle area is concerned, then I will be listening when they say their chain broke. Like I said, I will be probably changing some of this stuff out myself, but is something goes wrong I won't be wining at Honda.

[quad2xtreme]

ok, this is just a pet peeve. Why do people insist on telling you about their solution and post a picture of their bikes from so far away you can't see anything? At least post a picture of some hot model since it is just as relevant but even more interesting.

If you are going to talk about your setup then go take a close-up. Leave the graphics out unless that is the purpose of the picture.

/Jon

[BSTURDIVANT]

Al the 450's '04 to '06 have the same problem- the case saver is mounted on spindly nubs that stick out on the main case! I have seen 4 or 5 '06 cases broken from just the chain slapping the saver and not even coming off! The lower mount breaks into the
shift shaft oil seal every time! Poor design from Honda!
The only cure is to get a case saver that goes all the way against the stator case to spread the load of the chain whip.
The good ones are wider and go all the way against the case!

just another example of the so-called "case saver" destroying a case!!

i feel that, yes, these "case savers" help somewhat..........but, basically they only work one time. after that, you have no mounting holes left, because they are ripped out.

i think the name "case saver" needs to be changed to something else.

[Z-135]

I have about 28 XC races and about 10 motocross races on my stock chain with no problems. I run a prm rear skid plate with stock case saver. I know you motocross fans don't run a rear skid plate maybe that is the problem. My 450r is setup for XC, I only do the motocross for fun.

[KRMit]

DirtDevilBT, did you completely not read either of my posts?? Let me state one more time that I don't blame Honda one little bit for the chain breaking. The fact of it is the stock case saver doesn't protect anything if your chain breaks (regardless of cause). I chose not to run a skidplate for various reasons so if the chain comes off or breaks it's my fault, but the case saver is still supposed to protect the case. Otherwise it should just be called a "shiny metal thing" instead of a "case saver".

BTW, what the heck does an aftermarket axle have to do with a case saver?

[DirtDevilBT]

Originally posted by KRMit
DirtDevilBT, did you completely not read either of my posts?? Let me state one more time that I don't blame Honda one little bit for the chain breaking. The fact of it is the stock case saver doesn't protect anything if your chain breaks (regardless of cause). I chose not to run a skidplate for various reasons so if the chain comes off or breaks it's my fault, but the case saver is still supposed to protect the case. Otherwise it should just be called a "shiny metal thing" instead of a "case saver".

BTW, what the heck does an aftermarket axle have to do with a case saver?

lol, I read what I read. I saw that you were dissapointed in Honda but that's how all bikes come from the factory like. I like the "shine metel thingy" idea, makes sense. The rear axle will only affect the chain if it does not line up striaght with the front sprocket. The skid plate is something needed though, I only run without one in the sand. I couldn't help but defend Honda cause Honda ain't here. When you don't run a skid plate and complain about that stupid shiny thing not working, it seems a little *** backwords. That's all, even if the chain would have broken with the skid plate.

The best "case saver" to come out of the factory is the Warrior / Raptor 350. There is one built into the case. However, once that is broken your done with case savers. I don't think they are replacable.

[E.POWERSPORTS]

Not to get overly anal, but Honda calls it a drive chain guide and a drive sprocket cover, other people call it a case saver. The drive chain guide is to keep the drive chain on, obviously. The sprocket cover to keep crap out of the front sprocket.

[KRMit]

To be honest this is my first new bike so I can't really compare the case saver on it to other bikes'. If other companies' case savers are of this poor quality then shame on them too. I like Honda and am still very happy with my 450r, I just think this is one area where they could have done better. I had to recently remove my skid plate to accomodate the new linkage or it would still be there. Speaking of which, does anyone know of a good one that won't get in the way of the aftermarket linkages?

It's hard to believe how many times the chain broke on my Banshee without damaging anything without a case saver. Dumb luck I guess.

[911]

i run a gt link on my 06 and cut out the stock skid for the link. i also run a tm desighn guide. for this i had to take the stock guide off the bottom of the skid cut a chunk off the out side AND drill a hole on the inside of it to acomadate one of the bolts. it only took about 20min but it's still there and will only come off to race southwick;)

[Jonas]

Originally posted by KRMit
To be honest this is my first new bike so I can't really compare the case saver on it to other bikes'. If other companies' case savers are of this poor quality then shame on them too. I like Honda and am still very happy with my 450r, I just think this is one area where they could have done better. I had to recently remove my skid plate to accomodate the new linkage or it would still be there. Speaking of which, does anyone know of a good one that won't get in the way of the aftermarket linkages?

It's hard to believe how many times the chain broke on my Banshee without damaging anything without a case saver. Dumb luck I guess.

What you may be missing is that the chain guide that runs between your chain links is not a case saver. Honda doesn't call it a case saver and it won't save your case for that matter. It is there to help keep your chain from derailing from the front sprocket only. Don't mean to batter this to death but Honda doesn't expect your chain to break or come off and break because of how they build the quad stock. If your quad isn't stock then you can't say anything bad about how Honda designed the bike in my opinion. Good luck to ya.

[KRMit]

I have no problem saying anything bad about how Honda designed the bike. I like Honda, but I don't consider it blasphemy to say they could have improved on something. Saying you don't plan on your chain breaking is like saying you don't plan on running out of gas. You can plan whatever you want but stuff still happens. Everyone seems to assume my chain broke because I wasn't running a skid plate. The fact is the chain never derailed due to not having a guide because I had it adjusted correctly. Everyone at the track we were running at was in agreement that the most likely cause of all this was a rock getting caught between the chain and sprocket causing it to stretch and break. The evidence is in the chain and sprocket. I suppose your next statement will be that Honda never intended for this ATV to be rode in gravel?

Now again let me state that I in no way blame Honda for my chain breaking and they can call the guard in front of the sprocket whatever they like. All I'm trying to say is Honda could definately have designed some better form of protection for the case in that area. I strongly recommend that everyone get a good aftermarket case saver as mentioned before.

Jonas, you say I can't say anything bad about how Honda designed the bike because my quad isn't stock. The case saver (or chain guide) is one of the few parts that is stock so why can't I talk about it?

[jb500ex]

i have heard of this happening a few times already too the 06, exactly the same thing. some thought it was a bad design for the case saver but not everyone was using an aftermarket case saver.

[Jonas]

Originally posted by KRMit
I have no problem saying anything bad about how Honda designed the bike. I like Honda, but I don't consider it blasphemy to say they could have improved on something. Saying you don't plan on your chain breaking is like saying you don't plan on running out of gas. You can plan whatever you want but stuff still happens. Everyone seems to assume my chain broke because I wasn't running a skid plate. The fact is the chain never derailed due to not having a guide because I had it adjusted correctly. Everyone at the track we were running at was in agreement that the most likely cause of all this was a rock getting caught between the chain and sprocket causing it to stretch and break. The evidence is in the chain and sprocket. I suppose your next statement will be that Honda never intended for this ATV to be rode in gravel?

Now again let me state that I in no way blame Honda for my chain breaking and they can call the guard in front of the sprocket whatever they like. All I'm trying to say is Honda could definately have designed some better form of protection for the case in that area. I strongly recommend that everyone get a good aftermarket case saver as mentioned before.

Jonas, you say I can't say anything bad about how Honda designed the bike because my quad isn't stock. The case saver (or chain guide) is one of the few parts that is stock so why can't I talk about it?

First of all, I hope this can stay a friendly discussion because just the fact that you ride the quad you do makes you cool with me.

Also, you can rip Honda all you want, but you may want to expect that when you do that people will want to look into the truth of the matter. Personally, I have been riding for 25 years and have not once broke a chain. Also, the only time that I have seen someone break a chain under normal riding conditions was when they had modified their bike similiar to the way you have. Honda and all other manufacturers could have beefed up this area of the quad yes, they also could have put steel wheels on the quad and added a whole bunch more weight to it in other areas also. I have seen a bunch of people's weekends end when they dent in a wheel and their tire goes flat. You can go on and on about things that people have destroyed on their quads that manufacturers could have beef up. But would you be riding a 350lb something quad? In my experiences it is very uncommon for this to happen if everything is stock, the way they gave you the quad. If someone is racing motocross and such they throw on a high tensile strength gold chain or something similar because they know they are going to put the quad through a beating that it was not designed to take in stock form. Honda doesn't expect your chain to come off just like they don't expect your wheel to fall off. Like I said before, they don't call it a case saver because it's NOT. Anyways, hope you get it back together and get out and ride:D

the case saver needs to be redesigned as something that mounts to the frame...........instead of mounting to your case.
plain and simple.

[KRMit]

Making an actual case saver to replace the chain guide wouldn't necessarily cost more money to manufacture or weigh any more. It needs to be positioned closer to the case and have longer bolts into the case for support (at least in my uneducated opinion). There's a big difference between something as small as a case saver being redesigned and swapping wheels from aluminum to steel, although I see the point you're trying to make. Making it 25 years without once breaking a chain is something to be proud of, but it does happen to other people that properly maintain their stuff. I admit my chain breaking is a freak thing but that doesn't mean it can't happen under normal situations.

I'm just saying Honda could have easily designed something to protect the case better. I don't expect perfection from a manufacturer, but we have to point out areas of improvement or they are never improved upon.

[Dave400ex]

KRMit PRM has a skidplate that doesn't have a linkage box, would work perfect.

Sounds like this problem is with all years, not just the 06. I just ordered the Noss for mine.

[DirtDevilBT]

Man KRMit, I love you bro;) .

I use the Armidillo skid plate found at RockyMountainATVMC.com. I use some big crush washers like the one for the drain bolt. It gives me enough clearance to run my elka link no problem. The skid plate still has the guard for the linkage so I'm not sacrificing protect. All it needs to be is 1/8-3/16 shimed off the swingarm.

I think all manufacturers need to beef up the area in question. With the use of aluminum instead of the stock steel CS there would be minimal weight gain.

I only attacked the idea of running without a skid plate because you're asking for trouble, not that it had anything to do with the breakage of your chain. KRMit and Wanna-be, I feel for your damage done to the cases and hope for a speedy recovery. I don't know to what extent your quads are modded but it makes me wonder if I should upgrade my chain.

Does anyone know what manufacturer supplies Honda with chains? Honda sure as hell doesn't make their own.

[E.POWERSPORTS]

DID and RK both supply Honda with chains. But you can get a stronger DID or RK ofcourse. A good idea for someone that has their chain fall off all the time;)