86 250r HELP

[mctyier]

my friend is selling his 86 250r, it is a clean bike always taken care of barely ridden and all original except for the pipe and rims and tires. But i heard from a guy that the 86's arent very desireable because of a different rear end or something. i was wondering if i could get any help from you guys who know more then me. i would appreciate it , thanks a lot

[86-250Rnut]

The 86's are the quads that guys want IMO. the 86-87 swing arms are over an inch longer then the 88-89. also the 86's have more frame gusses making them stronger, sum guys say it dosent matter but i think it does alot!
but the 86-87 motors have short rods, some guys want the 88-89 motors because they have logrods and they like the low end power. but some guys like the higher and faster reves of the 86-87's.
Mitch:macho

[250r4life]

huh, everybody that i have always talked to said to get the 88/89s.. the 89 had a better clutch but the 88 was supposed to put out more HP... but the 86s are great bikes too. how much is he asking for it? by the way the 87s had long rods too.

[beerock]

Originally posted by 86-250Rnut
The 86's are the quads that guys want IMO. the 86-87 swing arms are over an inch longer then the 88-89. also the 86's have more frame gusses making them stronger, sum guys say it dosent matter but i think it does alot!
but the 86-87 motors have short rods, some guys want the 88-89 motors because they have logrods and they like the low end power. but some guys like the higher and faster reves of the 86-87's.
Mitch:macho

wow this is the most opinionated answer i have read in a long time to someone who has a 86 R and wants to think its better then the other years.

theres 2 things wrong with your post
1. the 87 motor isnt a short rod its a long rod

2. the 86 is the weakest frame(the 88-89 have the most gusseting)

i dont want to come off as an ***** but dude your facts are almost all wrong. sorry

now, the 86 is still a R and if you ever get around to gusseting it the frame will be the same strength as a 88-89 that is properly gusseted.
if the price is right go for it.

the 88-89's are more desireable though.

[zedicus00]

haha go get em bee....

while the 88-89 is more desireable style, if its a good deal you will b happy with it. i ride an 86 and love it, i prefer the short rods (85-86) i wouldnt mind having an 88-89 tranny but o well... frames we wont get into, the main difference is the rear motor mount and how the swinger mounts, 86-87 is a little harder to find a aftermarket swinger for. front ends are interchangeable but the 86-87 had a lil different geometry..

i would say get it if its a good deal

[beerock]

Originally posted by zedicus00
haha go get em bee....

while the 88-89 is more desireable style, if its a good deal you will b happy with it. i ride an 86 and love it, i prefer the short rods (85-86) i wouldnt mind having an 88-89 tranny but o well... frames we wont get into, the main difference is the rear motor mount and how the swinger mounts, 86-87 is a little harder to find a aftermarket swinger for. front ends are interchangeable but the 86-87 had a lil different geometry..

i would say get it if its a good deal


if you want a 87-89 tranny all you have to do is swap out the 5th and 6th gears on the counter and main shaft.

I run a hybrid myself. its a 88 countershaft and mainshaft with 88 gears from 1st to 4th then i put in 86 5th and 6th on the counter and main shaft.

I run this setup for MORE top speed in 5th and 6th ;)

[86-250Rnut]

My bad fellas. i thought the 87's were short rods. but i heard from people that the 86's where the strongest,, that they had more gussets. im sure thats what i herd. but i still think that the 86's are more wanted because of the extra length that they have.
Mitch:macho

[250r4life]

i think you may be right about the 86 frame being the strongest, but yah the 87 were long rods... i dunno, everybody i have ever talked to would like the 88 or 89... i have an 89 and love it, but to tell you the truth i dont know as how i ever rode an 86... i dont remember.. i have owned several 250r three wheelers, but i dont know if i have ever ridden an 86 trx250... you may prefer the 86, but i think if you were to take a consensus you would lose as most people would prefer an 88/89... however, this is all irrelevant, because the bike at hand is an 86, which is also a great bike... if you can get a good 86 for a good price, than get the 86... if it was gunna cost me 2 grand more for an equally good in shapy 88, i would probably go with the 86...

[ESR250R]

ive heard from everyone that the swinger and the frame are both stronger on the 86, but at a price... they weight a bit more.

[zedicus00]

actually the 88-89 were liked more because they were shorter... it made them handle better... the 86-87 would prolly make a better hillshooter or dragger but they weighed more...

and im not sure where the '86 is the strongest frame' thing came about but it does seem to be the general consencous... i guess i cant prove rather its right or wrong at the moment though...

bee did hav some good points last time we got him fired up about it...

[beerock]

250r nut thanks for takin my arrogance in such a mature manner and not flippin out.

Guys, the frame strength issue has been going on for a long time. Don't ask me how it was started. I have seen posts about the 86 being stronger from 4 YEARS AGO.

this is an issue which i try to address everytime someone says the 86 is stronger. I have posted pics of two fully gusseted R frames 86 and a 88 regardless of the gusseting on them you can see how the 88 has OEM gussets in the front shock mount area, and steering stem area. the frame progressed throughout the years with minor changes here and there. I think we all need pictures of 86 through 89 stock oem frames with multiple pictures to show the sifferences, i have tried to show them over and over but no one seems to see where im comin from. I think zedicus actually sees where im coming from, but thats just one dude. this rumor is in alot of peoples minds.

I should add the SWINGARM on the 86 is stronger, but its to long, 2nd did they weigh the frame with the swingarm it weighs ALOT mroe then the aluminum one?hmmmm who has actually weighed each frame?

[ESR250R]

i have read on a older 250r site years ago that the 86 weighted about 8-10 pounds heavier and was made of thicker metal and had thicker welds. honda went to thinner metal and added a few gussets to lighten the frame a little bit. and gave the frame a little better geometry (moved the footpegs, moved the swingarm and moved the a arms). this is only what ive been told and what ive heard but it seemed like decent facts and thats what ive been goin off of for a long time. it also seems like alot more people complain about cracks in the later model frames. i still have my original 86 frame and it has only one crack in it after 18 years of being used. this arguement really doesnt matter to me though i have a frame with 89 geometry and holds up 10 times better than either of these frames. i would like to hear some more about this though, once again i am just stating what ive been told.

[JTRtrx250r]

86's are 4 lbs heavier, better gusseted,stronger and have closed tubing so they dont rust from the inside out like the 87-89's w/ plastic caps

to make an 86 exactly like an 89(other than rear stock shock valving/linkage) just go -1 swinger and +1 aarms, and maybe a long rod and they're no diffrent

the whole more desirable gig is the 88 red plastics, and 89''s uppdated clutch, that and the fact they are 2 yrs newer than the 86.... no biggie if you ask me..

[Tom TRX250R]

Yep Jeremy is right on with the weight of the frames and other info. I just sold an 87 frame on ebay and it was in fact roughly 5 lbs lighter than my 86 when I had mine torn down powdercoating it. And thats on a digital UPS scale so I don't think they lie!!!

The 88-89 geometry (-1 swingarm, +1 forward a-arms) is preferred for MX, but really any year is preferred because you can make any year identical with the right parts. I would say go for it if it is a good deal.

[beerock]

Originally posted by JTRtrx250r
86's are 4 lbs heavier, better gusseted,stronger and have closed tubing so they dont rust from the inside out like the 87-89's w/ plastic caps

to make an 86 exactly like an 89(other than rear stock shock valving/linkage) just go -1 swinger and +1 aarms, and maybe a long rod and they're no diffrent

the whole more desirable gig is the 88 red plastics, and 89''s uppdated clutch, that and the fact they are 2 yrs newer than the 86.... no biggie if you ask me..

sorry bro im dissagreeing with you, you are one of the guys that believe the 86 is stronger. the frame does not have closed tubing and is NOT heavier gusseted. use your eyes you can tell from looking at the front the 88-89 is gusseted more.

the weight thing i am not sure of, the front mounts on the 86 are DEF heavier then the 87-89 (i think they changed the front mounts for the 87 model too)
theres also alot of BS tabs on the 86 frame that the newer frames didnt have.

[JTRtrx250r]

Originally posted by beerock
sorry bro im dissagreeing with you, you are one of the guys that believe the 86 is stronger. the frame does not have closed tubing and is NOT heavier gusseted. use your eyes you can tell from looking at the front the 88-89 is gusseted more.

the weight thing i am not sure of, the front mounts on the 86 are DEF heavier then the 87-89 (i think they changed the front mounts for the 87 model too)
theres also alot of BS tabs on the 86 frame that the newer frames didnt have. dude, look at where the subframe tags in w/ the main cradle on the 86 and then look at an 87on, also look at the rear sub tubes on an 86(very back, basically the end) and then look at the 87-on

the 86 frame is more rigid due to the extra tube gussets below the motor-mounts. Its easy to tell the motor-mounts are beafier

I dont have an 88 or 89 frame so Im not exactly 100% sure on the front and where its gusseted other than the vin plate,and other than the front bumper mount(which is another reason I like the 86... its got a slight bit of "give" in the mishap of a hard tag b/c of the extruding tubing opposed to the solid bumpermount that takes the front end w/ it incase of a front end bash, altho a small deal, I also like it:D )

the main reason for the skimpier motor mounts, open end tubing, less frame gussets,pegs etc... was to save of weight against the LT and Tetaci4 .... for what...2 yrs:rolleyes: :blah: they found area's where they could save weight

I dont think theres anybetter yr, no boubt a shorter swinger is better for mx and ft, and longer for xc,drag and hillclimbs, the aluminum swinger on the 88-89 dont hold up as well so thats a trade off:blah:

:D Fire away B':D

[beerock]

the 86 is not closed tubing, and i know the mounts on the 86 are HEAVIER that doesnt make the frame more rigid. if you really knew what you were alking about you would know the 88-89 is more rigid because of the rear motor mount going across the left and right main tube for the frame, THAT MAKES IT MORE RIGID AND STRONGER. aside form the gussets up by the front shocks and steering stem.
the motor mounts of a 86 tend to break at the welds it may look beefier and it does weigh more but its not stronger then the newer front mounts.

ill argue this till the day i die because when i look at both frames i can tell the 88-89 style is stronger, it has more relief points then the 86-87. its BS that the 86 is stronger, sorry.

I dont even have a stock frame anymroe so its not like im stickin up for my year frame. I did have a 88 though.

[86-250Rnut]

Ill go take sum pics of my 86 frame and post them in the morning.
Mitch:macho

[beerock]

Originally posted by 86-250Rnut
Ill go take sum pics of my 86 frame and post them in the morning.
Mitch:macho

photography of this is important, make sure you get a front view with the whole frame in the pic, a left side, right side and a rear view, then close up on front rear, left side right side areas. I will need these pics done right to show you the differences.

I will post a topic for this, this is going to be the end of the rumors.

[mctyier]

thanks alot for all the info gentlemen, you are a great help, but i guess i want to cut to the chase. If i put money into it can i have a great handling great jumping and fast bike?? thats all im worried about

[beerock]

yea sorry LOL

yes you will!

[86-250Rnut]

there known for there handling and performance. i wouldnt own 1 if she did move and handle like a dream. You will love it like your left nut!
Mitch:macho

[JTRtrx250r]

Originally posted by beerock


ill argue this till the day i die because when i look at both frames i can tell the 88-89 style is stronger, it has more relief points then the 86-87. its BS that the 86 is stronger, sorry. I know how you are mang:D

Good point on the rear 88-89 motor support, didnt even think about that:o I was thinking more of the middle-lower part of the frame, all I know is Ive seen the same probs on all yr frames. as far as handling and mods... it all goes together depending on what you want it set up for. I have 2 86's and 1 waisted 87, the 86 has welded shut ends instead of plastic caps that after 18-20 are missing on most subframes, thats where alot of water,mud,sand etc ..enter the open frames and cause them to rust out, Ive seen it on my 87 frame as well as others. After 18-20 yrs, getting a straight, solid good frame w/ an R is the challenge, most have been raced or wadded up many times. To me , I dont care what yr it is as long as its straight and not a hck job, b/c even an 86 can have a longrod,-1,+1 ,pro-pegs etc, is it still not gonna handle/feel like an 89?;)

[1shooter]

i got a new 400ex i shoot up hills on and a just got a 86 250r now the 250r handles a hell of a lot better up the hills than the 400 did. But my only point is this. 89 geometry is best for racing!
My only proof of this is simple, buy a aftermarket frame with any other years geomeotry? I never seen one yet. I know they made the 250r stronger over the years because they where breaking in half in the races. I like to climb hills. So a little more wieght and if anybody things 10lbs is more wieght stop eating for a day and your bike will loose even more wieght take off the plastic its holding you up! those brakes are for cowards they got to wiegh at least 2lbs. i mean really man. Honda made them better as they went for racing! NOT ANYTHING ELSE>
But man it handles like a dream!!

[beerock]

actually the 86 -89 frames have the exact same geometry, the arms and swingarms are different

[wicked265R]

Originally posted by JTRtrx250r
86's are 4 lbs heavier, better gusseted,stronger and have closed tubing so they dont rust from the inside out like the 87-89's w/ plastic caps

to make an 86 exactly like an 89(other than rear stock shock valving/linkage) just go -1 swinger and +1 aarms, and maybe a long rod and they're no diffrent

the whole more desirable gig is the 88 red plastics, and 89''s uppdated clutch, that and the fact they are 2 yrs newer than the 86.... no biggie if you ask me..


hey, i guess i have the best '86 250r u can make then since mines a long rod, -1 swinger, +3+1 a-arms, 89 clutch upgrade swapped out gears in the tranny, and gussetted frame lol. so i guess i have the "hybrid" R out of all the years? lol just thought i'd add that in that the '86's arent bad bikes. i love how it handles and the power is amazing with the spacer plate/long rod combo.

when i was 15, i was riding an 86. my father was riding an 89. when he went to sell one, he gave me the choice of which to keep. i kept the 86, because it was much more stable when hill climbing. and hill climbing is what we did.