Predator 90 Update

[Ty1on]

Here is my most recent story on My sons 2005 Predator 90. I'll let you be the judge of Polaris. My son is a first time rider 8 years old and only 70lbs.


COMPLAINT ACTIVITY REPORT Case # 57058438 Better Business Bureau of Minnesota and North Dakota

Consumer Info: Ty Business Info: Polaris Industries Inc. 2100 Highway 55 Hamel, MN 55340-9100 763 542-0500

Consumer's Original Complaint : I purchased a 2005 Polaris Predator 90cc for my 8 year old son for Christmas in December of 2004. after 3 months of him riding this the transmission gears broke and the part was on back order for at least 4 weeks and was in the repair shop for at least 6 weeks total if not more. Recently the frame on this ATV broke and I have been told and have verified from Polaris Industries that the parts to repair this frame are on back order until 10/22/05. This ATV has been in the shop since 9/12/05. This back order on these parts is unacceptable and the bike reliability is unacceptable. I would like Polaris to refund my money for my purchase and take this ATV back as it is unreliable and it takes months to get replacement parts leaving my 8 year old having a ATV for 10 months that so far he has only been able to ride it for 8 months due to break downs and back ordered parts. The VIN # is RF3KA09C75T008703.

Consumer's Desired Resolution: Take the ATV back and refund the purchase price to me.

BBB Processing 10/07/2005 web BBB Complaint Received by BBB 10/10/2005 DLH BBB Complaint Validated by BBB Operator 10/10/2005 Otto EMAIL Send acknowledgement to Consumer 10/10/2005 Otto MAIL Inform Business of the Complaint 10/19/2005 WEB BBB RECEIVE BUSINESS RESPONSE :

October 19, 2005 Mr. Ty

RE: Better Business Bureau Complaint# 57058438 Dear Mr. Ty: Thank you for the opportunity to respond to your concern with Polaris Industries Inc. regarding your 2005 Polaris Predator, VIN#: RF3KA09C75T008703. I am sorry to hear that you have experienced a problem with your ATV and I look forward to assisting you in a resolution. We have previously reviewed your case and determined with the help of your dealer, Spina’s, the failure to your frame was not the result of a factory defect. In an effort to keep you as a happy Polaris consumer, we agreed to a one-time goodwill assistance toward a new frame. We have also been notified that the frame had been modified by way of welded nerf bars, which would also void warranty on that part. Upon further contacts from you, we also goodwilled new plastic panels for your ATV for customer satisfaction, as the status of the frame is on backorder at this point in time. We at Polaris feel we have accommodated your requests and have gone above and beyond a normal warranty situation by way of goodwill. As we have previously, we apologize the parts are not available currently. Polaris is doing everything in its power to expedite the parts needed to your dealer. Again, thank you for taking the time to contact Polaris Industries and provide us with your valuable feedback. If you have any further questions or comments please feel free to contact the Polaris Consumer Department at (763)-417-8650, Monday through Friday, from 8:30 a.m. till 4:30 p.m., Central Standard Time.

Sincerely, Adam Augst Polaris Consumer Representative Polaris Industries, Inc.


10/19/2005 DLH EMAIL VF13 - Forward Business response to Consumer 10/20/2005 WEB BBB RECEIVED CONSUMER REBUTTAL : (The consumer indicated he/she DID NOT accept the response from the business.)


First I would like to clarify that in no way possible was the frames integrity or strength was jeopardized due to spot welding of the nerf bars onto the lower part of the frame. The part of the frame that broke was under the seat where the rear swing arm shock mount is located and could not have been jeopardized in any means by spot welding onto the lower part of the frame. This installation of the nerf bars did NOT contribute to the upper part of the frame to break totally in half in 2 separate places. So every one who don’t have a engineering degree I would like to put this in perspective… Scenario you bought a new truck and installed running board to assist you in getting in the truck you tacked the running board onto the frame you didn’t cut the frame you spot welded onto the frame only and several months later the frame breaks where the truck rear shocks are mounted to the frame. As Polaris and I both know that the addition of these nerf bars had no impact on where the frame broke in half. Sounds to me that this response is a escape to cover up a the real issue of a weak frame and material strength or actually a weak point in the frame. With that aside the fact that every time this ATV has broken down the parts have been on back order for at least 4 weeks and this time even longer. Like I said before my 8 year old son has had this quad for 10 months and out of the 10 months has only been able to ride this ATV for no more than 8 months out of the 10 months due to parts being on back order. Warranty or no warranty the ATV is unreliable and part availability is unacceptable. Consumers of this product should not need to wait this long for parts. And why are all these parts on back order??? If others aren’t having similar break downs? This is a very serious problem given that a child could be severely injured due to these critical mechanical break downs. My wife and myself are no longer comfortable letting our child ride this ATV due to the history of failures in the short amount of time that our child has been able to ride this ATV. I feel that a consumer shouldn't wait 4-6 weeks for part replacements and that the reliability and safety of this ATV due to mechanical break downs is a concern of our family no longer feeling comfortable letting our son ride this Polaris Product.

[QuadJunkies]

I have read ALOT about the frames and the Stator

I hope it all works in your favor :ermm:

[bc1540]

The backorder situation sucks but for reference we have 2 predator 90's and ride with kids that have them and race mx. We are probably lucky but we have not seen any frame failures. We have ordered a dozen things for this quad (replacement parts) and all shipped to our dealer in 1-2 days. Your frame is another matter.
I guess my opinion is you bought a tiawanese/chinese made imported mini-quad, modified it, rode it , it broke, they are replacing the broken part (although it is on backorder) and thats it . Life is too short. If you want to step up to a custom built hetrick quad , you can forget these problems , and spend 4 times what you paid for the predator. We all have failure issues of one sort or another, don't get me started on my 2002 Grizzly 660.
Gussett the new frame when you get it back, realize it will break something else down the line and move on.

Brad

[400ex4ever]

I have read a lot about the frames breaking at the subframe due to the stiff shocks. I installed ELKA's and have not had a problem yet. I still plan to gusset the frame due to MX racing.

As for the Tranny issue. Due to the reverse gear the newer Predator's have, I have only heard and seen horror stories. ONe of the kid's we race against went through 2 trannys until they switch over to a Kasea motor.

I hope everything works out for you.

[dj250r]

sorry to hear you having problems it dose suck
i have a broken kasea frame in the back yard
went through 2 sets of trans gears at the last race
on the kasea
the polaris atv is made ( im guessing) like these other cvt quads
if your racing throw the warranty out the window
gusset the frame
and get extra trans gears
at this point i dont know of a trany set up that will not break
but we are going to test some gears that were made out of 9310 and heat treated and have alot less backlash
is there anyone out there that hasnt broke a trans with a mod motor ??
just checkin
:D
Dwayne

[Sjorge450R]

i weight 130# and raced an entire season on a partialy worked 90 predator, the only problem we had was the swing arm cracking. I never heard of the gears breaking. :huh

[Samson]

Originally posted by Sjorge300EX
i weight 130# and raced an entire season on a partialy worked 90 predator, the only problem we had was the swing arm cracking. I never heard of the gears breaking. :huh

I'm with you. Not under normal use. :rolleyes:

[dj250r]

guess were not running under normal conditions??:rolleyes:
and got just about everything on the motor we can think of
and we never really broke anything till he started racing hard
big jumps and whoops take there toll on the trans gears
Dwayne

[212racing]

we have witnessed many frame failures on the polaris during racing, the stock rear shock bottoms out and breaks there.
motor mounts need reinforced, the welds are hit and miss from machine to machine on the whole frame. check each weld carefully after purchase.

[Rocketman80]

I've seen the same thing happen to another 05 preddy. Frame broke in half right under the seat. It didn't have any nerfs on it at that time. The guy who owns it lives in Central PA they own M&A cycles. We have a predator also and if your son is running it hard these things happen. I don't want to be the first to tell you this but if you're even considering racing it or jumping it in anyway, you should get use to things getting broke and it doesn't matter what quad you run or who you get it from. It's just what happens to all mechanical equipment.
Now as far as your transmission problem, I'm gonna go out on a limb here but if your son is jumping it, which I suspect he is, the tranny is going out because he's not letting off the gas when he comes down and it''s tearing up the gears in the tranny. We've been there and done that, infact we went through three of them before my son got it figured out that you have to let off the gas in the air. That's just a educated guess. We ended up putting a Kasea transmission in our preddy and it's been great ever since. Don't know if that's the point my kid learned to let off the gas or if they are just a better transmission. But it's been great since... knock on wood.
The really bad news. You should consider yourself lucky that polaris even wants to help you at all. Even though you put the nerf bars on and it's no where around where the frame broke, it still voids their warranty. They also can say that the machine is being run under conditions that it's not made for. The stock machines are not meant to be jumped or do anymore than just putt around the yard. If the govenor restrictor plate has been removed that will void the warranty also. That's why local dealers aren't suppose to tell you about how to remove it.
Best advice! stop worrying about what polaris is going to do for you and just find a good mini quad builder. I.E. Hetrick's. and be prepared to pay to have the machine running right out of your own pocket. Otherwords your child will be waiting a long time to enjoy his machine. That's really the bottom line when it comes to having any type of recreational equipment. Either learn to work on it yourself or have a good mechanic who is close by that is willing to help you keep the machines running. If you had the ability to weld the nerfs on you must have the resources to fix the frame yourself also. So don't give up on your preddy, keep your chin up and work through it. When there's a will, there's a way.

[QuadJunkies]

Originally posted by Samson
I'm with you. Not under normal use. :rolleyes:
never had gears brek in ours either ... But I have heard of the swingers breaking

[Rocketman80]

We had the swing arm break also. Pretty common stuff. Frame, tranny, even snapped a axle. It's all part of the game. Welcome to the club...LOL

[Evana13]

look at this as your learning curve. we have all been through it.

[newnick]

I agree with the bunch of posts. I've been hanging at these sites for about 3 years now and have heard all this over and over. Because I was forwarned my son has not broke his frame or tore up his trans yet, knock on wood. I think your frame has bad welds myself. With that said, if the welds were good it could of broke the frame somewhere else. If your not racing, I would continue on the path you are on. Find a better built quad for trail riding, one with a solid reputation, like a Honda and don't look back. Good luck and have some fun with your son when you get this straightened out.

[Samson]

Originally posted by dj250r
guess were not running under normal conditions??:rolleyes:
and got just about everything on the motor we can think of
and we never really broke anything till he started racing hard
big jumps and whoops take there toll on the trans gears
Dwayne

This guy said he had nerfs. Where did he say the engine was modified? Stock engine tearing the gears up? For that matter, when did he say he was racing? Just get the feeling we aren't hearing the whole story.

And who's we? I wasn't talking about your machine, Mr. Sensative. :p

[Spike99]

.

Ty1on,

I get the impression you are very upset that your brand new Pred-90 broke. I can understand your frustrations. I've been frustrated over our broken Pred-90 as well. One does get very upset to buy something new and have to put repairs into it.

To me, you have 3 choices. They are:

1 - Allow Polaris and your dealer to fix its frame and tranny back to "pure stock" condition. From there, you can either sell it (to recover some dollars) or drive it "like it is". If you keep it and drive it as pure stock again, it will probably break again. If something breaks once, it will break again.

2 - Allow Polaris and your dealer to fix its frame and tranny back to "pure stock" condition. Once they "sign off" on its repairs, take it into your shop(s) and install frame guessets, better shocks and other "hard driving" upgrades. These upgrades will reduce the risk of it breaking again.

3 - Fix to the level that is "sell-able" and replace with a different mini. If you get a "pure stock" 90 in a different brand, you may want to install gussets and shocks in that other brand as well.

Most of the brands are made for around the house and minor trails. If your young rider is an aggressive trail rider and/or extreme racer, then certain things on a mini need to be upgraded. Frame guessets, shocks and A-Arms / Swing Arm and longer axle are the more common improvements for extreme riders.

If your young rider does trail riding, there's other upgrades that are common as well. For a list of these items, surf: http://www.atvwild.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2840

Let's face it, minis and even the bigger ATVs aren't perfect. In the next 5-10 years, they might be!!!!! For today, we should accept their base construction and further improve for each of our unique riding conditions.

As stated above, I can feel your frustrations with your broken Pred-90. I've been there myself a few times as well. As a suggestion, remove the emotions from your situation (sometimes, emotions clouds one's mind) and make a decision on what action you need to take. Fix "as is" and drive it, fix and improve to reduce future repairs or fix "as is" and sell, to replace with another pure stock mini.


Hope this helps....

.

[Spike99]

.

I know what you mean about being upset over something that has a solid or "better then market average" reputation. In the spring, I did my homework on a used replacement vehicle and narrowed my list down down one specific model. In the spring, we bought the vehicle we felt was the best (for us). It ran great for 45 days (yes, 15 days past the dealer's included FREE warranty) and we encountered Brake problems after brake problems. Over $800+ dollars in trying to get it fixed. $800+ on our credit line because it was more money at something we don't have the cash for. Finally, one of our shop's head mechanic said, "replace its entire braking computer system for $$mega bucks$$ or pull its $2.00 ABS fuse". We pulled its ABS fuse and drive it like a 70s/early 80s vehicle. Like an older vehicle that doesn't have factory ABS brakes. Since that point on, our braking problem was resolved. Wasn't the solution I wanted and probably NOT recommended by many shops (especially from the factory), but it did work for us. It's been running excellent ever since. And yes, I was "wound up" over that recent buy as well. Perhaps we have the "only lemon" in this specific vehicle model, or its our usual "bad luck"? Not too sure. Regardless of the reason, I still understand your frustrations in buying something with a good reputation and expecting it to be flawless out the gate. . . I really do understand your situation....

.

[Evana13]

I think we have all gone through that one way or another.:mad:

[250xdude]

Been there broke that!

http://www.predatorowners.com/memberphotos/predator/1927/sept%202004%200181.jpg
http://www.predatorowners.com/memberphotos/predator/1927/june%202004%20019.jpg

Then did something about it.

http://www.predatorowners.com/memberphotos/predator/1927/june%202004%20023.jpg

[Sjorge450R]

:eek2: i didnt break my swinger that bad and that frame break looks nice...lol. The rider must have been throwing that thing in the air

[212racing]

don't have to jump to high to break a polaris.