Here we go again, this time the Clutch...?

[JhallettEX]

OK, where do I begin....I just installed a new Barnett clutch, I am now putting it back together and I can't get the clutch in work at all.......

First of all lets start at the beginning with the lifter piece (the piece that goes through the pressure plate) that piece should be put on before the pressure plate, correct? That is what I have done. So now I have the pressure plate on and have installed the springs.

Next step is the side case and installing the Lifter arm.......This is were it starts to go wrong, How exactly does the return spring go in? I know I have it right but when I go ahead and install everything and go to engage the the arm with the lifter piece the farthest that I can turn the lifter arm clockwise is to about ummm say 11 o'clock, I can force it as much as I want to but it will not go any further, which mean I can attach the clutch cable to it.... I don't know what to do, I have sat outside and worked at it for about 3 hours now, It time for me to ask for help. Does anyone know what is wrong?

[JhallettEX]

Come on, can anyone help?

[nakomis0]

The case slapped together ok?

If so, Loosen the cable up at the lever. That hopefully will give you enough slack. good luck

[JhallettEX]

i thaught about that but I have the magura clutch, but I am going to try.

[nakomis0]

In my manual it says Major adjustments can be done at the lower adjusting nut at the engine.

Loosen lock nut and turn adjusting nut. after done tighten the lock nut.

[nakomis0]

btw, 3+ hours on a 30 minute job...lol.

Not to shabby:p

Took me about 3 days to do the same job. ha! But thats cause I busted a bolt and had to get a whole new clutch hub.:rolleyes: :blah

[JhallettEX]

OK here is the deal, I now have it all together, the only part I have yet to do is add the oil. Just to make sure that the clutch worked before I dumped the oil in it I wanted to make sure the clutch would engage and it would not, I pulled in the clutch and tryed rolling it and it wouldnt acted like it was still in gear when I pulled the clutch in? Whats up? Do I have to have oil in it for the clutch to work?

[nakomis0]

Should engage and disengage without oil I would guess.

Is the clutch arm coming out of the case moving when you pull the clutch?

[JhallettEX]

Let me go take some pics when it is and is not engaged. Cant believe this ****.

[harebounder]

I know this is not going to help you. How do you like that magura clutch. How much better is it than a ez-pull. Do you think it is worth the money. Or is it about the same as an ez-pull clutch lever

[JhallettEX]

clucth NOT engaged

[nakomis0]

Ez pull and Magura aint even in the same league.

[JhallettEX]

and when clutch is engaged, you can barly tell a difference but in this pick I have pulled the clutch lever in, I would say it moves the lifter arm about a 1/4 inch

[nakomis0]

Ya man you need to adjust that cable somehow, it should move more than that.

it looks more like 3/8 to 1/2" but that may not be your problem.

Did you soak the clutch plates in oil before assembly??? If not this would cause more friction than normal.

I have found that almost every clutch I have installed needed a little time to "set up" or brake in.

Check out the specs on the magura also as there may be some way to increase the travel also.

Good luck.

PS did you ever find out what was the starting problem after your rebuild ????

[JhallettEX]

it doesnt make a difference how much more I adjust because the arm will not go forward any more at all, I can force it all I want and it will not budge.

Ya man you need to adjust that cable somehow, it should move more than that.

Just checked mine and it doesnt move too much more than that.

Did you put oil in it and run it yet??????

[nakomis0]

I just went out and looked at mine.

Mine looks like your second pic, when the lever is not pulled.

When I pull the lever it moves about 1/2" and is parallel or kinda centered looking with the part coming out of the engine.... erm if that makes any sense:rolleyes:

[nakomis0]

Dang doOd,

sounds like you might have tio open the case back up again.

[JhallettEX]

NO I have not put oil in it yet, b/c I didnt want ti to be wrong and have to drain my oil and everything again, I run synthetic and it is really expensive as well.

[JhallettEX]

also I did let it soak in oil but h*** that was many hours ago.

[JhallettEX]

Man this is pissin me off, I hate to do this but, IT IS FOR SALE.

your killin me :D

after the starting problem this is cake.

It looks like your new friction plates may be thicker than the stockers and are not allowing the clutch to fully return and the actuator arm is not moving all the way back.

When I compare your pics to my stock clutch with 1-1/2 years on it the diff is that your arm does not return as far back as mine. I am thinking that unless you totally missed something on assembly that the plates or thicknees of the plates must be causing this.

And if you are changing the oil and its fresh just empty it into a clean container if you need to remove the case again.

[carbonfiber440]

I had the same problem a few weeks ago when i changed out my stock plates, with a heavy duty one form whitebrothers. the first thing i nocticed between the two was the thickness differnce between the stock plates an the whitebros plates, i also noticed that the stock springs were much shorter than the new springs. after i instaled the new plates my clucth was also not fully engaging simaliar to what you are describing. I just filled her up with some fresh oil n took her out for a 25-30 minute ride and the problem was taken care of, so my suggestion to you would be to take it out for a ride and it should take care of it self. i guess they need to be broken in.

[JhallettEX]

Thanks Carbon.....

[416 EXtreme]

I installed the same clutch.When i first got it running it had the free play adjusted the same way as before i did it.When i pulled in the clutch and put it in gear it crept forward a little.Then when i trie4d to put it in neutral it was impossible while it was running.I shut it off,and i could put it into neutral with no problem.Then i was told its just clutch drag,just take it for a ride and beat on it a little.Well about ten laps on the track and i can now put it in neutral.So give it a ride and see what happens.

[400exRacerX]

Were you seriously thinking of selling it because of that problem??

did you fix this problem yet...if not it's not your clutch ...it's the teeth in the shaft that engages and disengages your friction plate.. you must get these theet lined up to make it all work.. i can'r remeber the motor right now so i can't tell you what to do but i hope i gave you a idea.

[phatswinn]

in the pic it dosent look like yur covers bolted on , if it even makes a diff, i read somewhere to soak the plates in oil 15 mins. prior to putting them in so they last longer

[JhallettEX]

it is fixed

[Leo]

Originally posted by JhallettEX
it is fixed

what did you find out..? might help someone in the future :)

Leo

[JhallettEX]

I really didnt do anything different, I just decided to go ahead and put oil in it and went and ran it, it is still slippying a little, I will have the clutch pulled in and the rear tires will still spin, also I still cant shift into neutral at all when it is running.

well ****, its not fixed yet, still sounds messed up to me

How much riding time id you put on it after the new clutch?

If it was not a lot maybe you should give it a little more run time ( to let the friction plate brake in) and try to re adjust the settings.

bleed your hyd clutch !!!!! it should pull 1/2 inch .....what is that monkey biss with the nut's on it ,at the bottom of your hyd clutch ? that is not supos to be there ! sounds like you need a little pro help on getting the quad set up 2nd throw that oil in the garbage ! syn are no good in a quad motor ! use kendal 50wt ....


sound's like to me,your not schooled enuf on the 400 to be doing theses repairs . your best off getting help before you damage the quad worse !

Bartlett racing

Originally posted by bartlettracing
2nd throw that oil in the garbage ! syn are no good in a quad motor !

Please explain why????? :huh :huh :rolleyes:

[JhallettEX]

Bartlett, sounds like you don't know what the **** your talkin about, you were better of just being a visitor here and not becoming a member. Take that Kendall 50wt and shove it up your ***, while your hand is up there grab a english book and learn how to communicate iiidiot.

Hallett Racing lol

The easyest way to exspain why synthetic oil's are not recomended in a quad motor is there to slipery ,and cause the clutch to prematurly wear out . Also read your owners manual it states the same thing . you can use any 4 stroke type oil you chose . kendal seems to stand up the best .

** to the guy with all the nice thing's to say about me :

It's not my quad that is JIMMYED together and not working! then you blame the quad ? (IM selling It)

I only posted to help you ,you cant exspect a clutch system to work properly when it's installed poorly.

Magnura send's there clutch out with a black braket and about 5 diferant shim's ,not old nut's found in a toolbox .

also bike's that run kevlar clutches need to have there oil changed very often .kevlar is not motor friendly !

todate we use stock clutch plates and cr125 springs this setup works very well. a clutch last's us about six months of racing on a 450 lrd motor ....

[harebounder]

I think your are mislead on the fifty wieght oil. Fifty wieght is way to thick for a straight wieght oil in a machine the straightest wieght oil i have ever heard run is forty. Maybe some 20w 50 but i wouldn't suggest anyone running straight fifty wieght. Unless you are running in extreme hot conditions from warm up on through. Far as running synthetic oil I also heard that you are to run oil that is specifically made for motorcycle engines. I usally will run semi synethetic mix. I use to run regular polaris snowmobile two-stroke oil in my banshee. It not only ran better but took the cold bloodedness out of it.

[Leo]

Over a year and my clutch is still going strong... and I treat it with very little respect :)

I don't buy the whole "it's to slippery" argument..

Leo

The easyest way to exspain why synthetic oil's are not recomended in a quad motor is there to slipery ,and cause the clutch to prematurly wear out .


Over a year and my clutch is still going strong... and I treat it with very little respect I don't buy the whole "it's to slippery" argument..

:huh :huh :huh I am so confooosed :huh :huh :huh

It just seems that I can not get the hard evidence either way on this one.

May need to just test it out myself and see what happens.

I've been running 100% synthetic for well over a year and a half now and had no problems,,,Gabe's been using it with his stock clutch for almost 3 years running the PRO class in a harescramble series,,as we Kentuckian's would say,,,,,,,that's hog wash..:eek:

[400exBro]

I have been running 100% syn kendel oil since winter and have had no problems, also it seems to shift a lot nicer than mineral oil...
i would perfer syn over minerail oil any day, except when breaking in a motor..
lata
Bro

I know I have asked this before but is this regular auto syn oil?

I have 3 qts of mobil1 15w50 just waiting for me to give it a try but I keep using the GN4 cause I just keep thinking it aint MC oil:confused:

[Leo]

I've been using the good old red-cap Mobil 1 :)

Leo

[harebounder]

I use to run Kendall GT 1 two stroke oil in my banshee was very good oil. I run polaris snowmobile oil in it now what a difference took the cold bloodedness out. I am running GN4 in my 400 because it was free.