how to make a 450r lighter?

[One_Bad_400]

i'm about to build a TT bike and try and build this thing in a few weeks for paducha national... and i want to make this thing light as possable... i already thought about it some about how to make it lighter? what did yall do to yall's 450R's to make them lighter...

i was thinking, take off the lights, all the electrical and just have a key, take off the fan, tale light, grab bar, skids, parking break, air box, and heal gards... and all that crap under the seat...

[plkmonster2]

Get the lightest wheels and tires, get a hood, take off the front fenders that cover the wheels, take off heel guards, get lighter pegs, etc...

[mikes450r]

you can drop almost 85-100 pounds off the bike..not sure for tt though

Originally posted by mikes450r
you can drop almost 85-100 pounds off the bike..not sure for tt though

whoa!!! tell me how!! :macho

[MR.BIG]

Originally posted by mikes450r
you can drop almost 85-100 pounds off the bike..not sure for tt though

What are you nuts! So your saying you can have a 450r weigh in at 250lbs. tell me how can you lose that much weight!

[mikes450r]

now im talking just for drag racing...

Originally posted by mikes450r
now im talking just for drag racing...

o ok, i thought u meant like XC racing and stuff, i was like wow, im doing that for sure lol

helium instead of air in your tires helps...:devil: :blah:

[mikes450r]

ya thats why when i said that i said im not sure for tt though...you dont do any jumping in tt do you..

Originally posted by mikes450r
ya thats why when i said that i said im not sure for tt though...you dont do any jumping in tt do you..

the national series u do, but local series etc, its just an oval

[One_Bad_400]

there not all oval... mater of fact i have never been to an oval track... but theres not many jump and when there are... there like the size of what you make with your shoval.. becasue you cant make hard landings with that strut and sway bar

Originally posted by One_Bad_400
there not all oval... mater of fact i have never been to an oval track... but theres not many jump and when there are... there like the size of what you make with your shoval.. becasue you cant make hard landings with that strut and sway bar

o, all of the local TT races i have been to are oval

[R3Concepts]

Originally posted by mikes450r
you can drop almost 85-100 pounds off the bike..not sure for tt though

Our 480 drag bike is STRIPPED. And it weighs 300 lbs. Even some of the Ti banshees Ive seen weigh 275.

[mikes450r]

Originally posted by R3Concepts426ex
Our 480 drag bike is STRIPPED. And it weighs 300 lbs. Even some of the Ti banshees Ive seen weigh 275.

ya i have seen a pic of your 480 drag bike...there still stuff to take off and or replace on 480..

[R3Concepts]

What? The fan? Front hubs?

[mikes450r]

Originally posted by R3Concepts426ex
What? The fan? Front hubs?

that would be a start..

you shaved the fenders already right? also get a smaller gas tank ti bolts and a ti rear shock spring and switch any thing else steel to aluminum or ti if you can, get hyper wheels and pink power bands they save like 20lb :eek2:

[mikes450r]

i have been hearing that alot latly about the pink power bands...lol

have you tried them yet..

l;ol

[R3Concepts]

For one we keep the fan so our potenetial customers can ride our drag bike at the dunes, without blowing it up. With spindle mount front wheels youll rip them off if you dune it aggresively. Swithing everything to Ti bolts is a waste, maybe save 1 lb throughtout all bolts taht you would change. The rear shock spring going to Ti is a waste when you can buy a Marvin Shaw billet shock, for less then the Ti spring would cost, and it only weighs 2 lbs. But we are interested in seeing what you come up with on this drag bike, it has a lot more to do with setup then anything.

[mikes450r]

so your saying if i had another 20-30 pounds on you it wouldnt matter...im not trying to argue with you but some people just dont relize how light you can get these bikes..

mike

[R3Concepts]

We built a 480R (a customer bike) that was more stripped than ours. Billet drag axle, .65 wall chromoly arms, no fan,no front hubs, spindle mount front wheels, no nothing, and it weighed 296 with 1 gal. of gas in it.. Im not saying you cant get it down, but I am saying its going to add up A LOT faster then you think..Why do you think they put 100lb kids on these bikes at 4SW? Cause they cant get the bikes weight down all that much.

[mikes450r]

so your saying that a customers bike with all that was only 4 lbs less than your 480...oh well i guess maybe we did alittle more looking around...see ya at FSW.;)

thanks mike:cool:

[sampleez]

the engine weighs a bunch.........take it out :o :p

[mikes450r]

Originally posted by sampleez
the engine weighs a bunch.........take it out :o :p


:eek: .....lmao....we'll just tie a rope to a sand rail...lol

mike

[dunebuggie66]

if your only using it for tt, and are serious about it. drill 1/4 " holes all through the frame about 2" apart from each other.

[Cody_300ex]

Originally posted by One_Bad_400
i'm about to build a TT bike and try and build this thing in a few weeks for paducha national... and i want to make this thing light as possable... i already thought about it some about how to make it lighter? what did yall do to yall's 450R's to make them lighter...

i was thinking, take off the lights, all the electrical and just have a key, take off the fan, tale light, grab bar, skids, parking break, air box, and heal gards... and all that crap under the seat...

You have right at 2 months, so I would get to ordering. But you have the right idea. RPM makes a ti, and a aluimiun axle you might wanna look into them. Also its paducah. See you there! And the paducah track only has to humps, that the pros only get 6-8 inches off of.

what all can i take off for XC racing, ive already got rid of the lights in the front and put a hood on, and got rid of the rear brake light, i also took off the parking brake and have new levers :confused:

[TURBO-530R]

Originally posted by R3Concepts426ex
Our 480 drag bike is STRIPPED. And it weighs 300 lbs. Even some of the Ti bans hees Ive seen weigh 275. Do you have any pic's of your drag bike ? what does it run in 300 ft or 1/8th mile?

[R3Concepts]

Originally posted by mikes450r
so your saying that a customers bike with all that was only 4 lbs less than your 480...oh well i guess maybe we did alittle more looking around...see ya at FSW.;)

thanks mike:cool:

Go ahead and tell us what your bike weighs...let us guess...280 LOL..Not. Weren't you the one asking Morgan about the Mysto cam he has in his 480? Arent you luda450r at .org? I think you asked him quite a bit about setup? Maybe Im wrong?

Yes, we have more pics of his bike. We ride his bike at the dunes only its more of a potential customer bike to see if they want to get one of our bikes. And I doubt that it would touch your 530 Turbo bike, but if you feel the need to turn this into a pi**ing contest go ahead. We'll never be the fastest, neither will you. We put out good bikes and good products.

[devil6]

I would love to see the actual weight of a Ti bolt compared to the stock honda bolts. Honda does a pretty good job of countersinking the heads on the stock bolts. Ti isnt as light as most people think either. I read the total weight savings on a streetbike was only a couple pounds. The biggest weight savings were already mentioned in the springs and axles. But for the price, unless the factorys buying them for me, i'll trim it from elsewhere.

Not callin anyone fat, i'm 200 on a light day, but do you guys ever diet down for the season? I trained down to 168 a yr or so ago and the bike i was on turned into a rocket. Obviously some guys who are 145 soakin wet cant, but there has to be some guys out there who could just say no to that second double cheesburger.:p

[chad502ex]

Originally posted by R3Concepts426ex
And I doubt that it would touch your 530 Turbo bike, but if you feel the need to turn this into a pi**ing contest go ahead. We'll never be the fastest, neither will you. We put out good bikes and good products.

who said anything about a pi55'n contest? I do not like you starting crap. TURBO-530R said nothing to you about pi55'n contest, all he did was ask you for pics and times... If you don't have any or you put out bikes that are slower than his- just say so, cause that would be the manly thing for you to admit. But do not start crap with ppl cause you feel inferior and threatened- that was obvious,....:rolleyes:

I could be mistaken, but i think TURBO-530R was asking you because he was interested- not starting crap with you...

[R3Concepts]

Sorry about that, that post was made by an employee who is not suppose to be on this member name but I cannot babysit these guys. I dont drag my bike on aphalt or sand drags, just mainly at the dunes, and a local place in AZ. Its not the fastest, and we dont feel threatened or inferior to anyone. We just have fun building bikes, and they happen to make me a lot of money, along with my fab shop. So here are so more pics, and again sorry about that..Morgan @ R3Concepts.

[TURBO-530R]

Go ahead and tell us what your bike weighs...let us guess...280 LOL..Not. Weren't you the one asking Morgan about the Mysto cam he has in his 480? Arent you luda450r at .org? I think you asked him quite a bit about setup? Maybe Im wrong?[/QUOTE]

WoW
I just wanted to see If I could lighten up my bike up some more.Sorry for asking.Thought you might want to share info.Is'nt that these fourms are for. Who is luda450r at .org? Who is Morgan? Who said they were faster? What is your PROBLEM? I guess you don't Know who you are even talikng to.
:eek2: [QUOTE]

[TURBO-530R]

Thanks Morgan sorry for the over lap I type slow.:rolleyes:

[R3Concepts]

Yeah, no problem. You can PM, me if youd like, I have a few more ideas that would be helpful for you guys. Cant really say it on the thread.

[mikes450r]

Originally posted by R3Concepts426ex
Yeah, no problem. You can PM, me if youd like, I have a few more ideas that would be helpful for you guys. Cant really say it on the thread.

I didnt ask any questions about your setup...dont know why i would my bike will have many different parts that wouldnt even pertain to your bike..I will let you know the exact weight whens its finished...and just from the pic of your bike there i can find about 15lbs..and thats just from a picture..so lets not argue about being able to make the bike lighter it can be done but you guys choose not to for your customers...which is fine but theres no reason to get flamed for saying you can make them lighter..

mike

[R3Concepts]

Did you not read the above post, where I apologized for the comments made in a prior post, by someone who should not have been on here? Anyway, good luck with your bike and it will be fun to see what it turns out like..But I will go out on a limb and say that we now have other ways to lighten a 450R, but just need a bike to test them out on, I can see a pic of your final bike and probably shave weight off it..IE..a one lower arm front end using a hollow spindle and Marvin Shaw drag strut to hold it up..The guy who posted is arrogant as can be..but his fab work does the talking.

[mikes450r]

Originally posted by R3Concepts426ex
Did you not read the above post, where I apologized for the comments made in a prior post, by someone who should not have been on here? Anyway, good luck with your bike and it will be fun to see what it turns out like..But I will go out on a limb and say that we now have other ways to lighten a 450R, but just need a bike to test them out on, I can see a pic of your final bike and probably shave weight off it..IE..a one lower arm front end using a hollow spindle and Marvin Shaw drag strut to hold it up..The guy who posted is arrogant as can be..but his fab work does the talking.

ah its no big deal...and i wasnt making it a big deal...but ya i seen a sparks bike with only one drag strut and lower arm...im not to sure i would want to be on that one..lol..i think with my final build you maybe able to find at the most 5lbs...unless you go with carbon fiber stem,handle bars,tie rods and axle...then you could shave plenty more off the bike..But it will be dialed in for sure..not sure where you guys ride at but it would be fun to meet up sometime for some riding..

later mike

[One_Bad_400]

Originally posted by Lil_300Ex_Kid
You have right at 2 months, so I would get to ordering. But you have the right idea. RPM makes a ti, and a aluimiun axle you might wanna look into them. Also its paducah. See you there! And the paducah track only has to humps, that the pros only get 6-8 inches off of.

are you racing or watching... ya i went last year just to watch... they get like 1 foot off the ground but they fly like a good 70 ft.

[R3Concepts]

Originally posted by mikes450r
ah its no big deal...and i wasnt making it a big deal...but ya i seen a sparks bike with only one drag strut and lower arm...im not to sure i would want to be on that one..lol..i think with my final build you maybe able to find at the most 5lbs...unless you go with carbon fiber stem,handle bars,tie rods and axle...then you could shave plenty more off the bike..But it will be dialed in for sure..not sure where you guys ride at but it would be fun to meet up sometime for some riding..

later mike

Yeah for sure that would be awesome. We will be at either Buttercup, Gordons Well or Olgilby on Halloween and then about 10 more times during the season...Go to atvfanatics.com, then to the video forum towards the bottom, then click on CRF drag bike video, that bikes about as light as it gets, its mega quick, especially off the line but still gets beat by the big dog shees.

[Iliketogofast]

Hmmm... 250 pounds? Who the hell needs brakes, that's what parachutes are for! It will save us at least 20 pounds!

[Iliketogofast]

And while you're at it, get rid of that pesky swingarm. Those thigs weigh about 40 pounds, and besides, who needs 'em?

[mikes450r]

Originally posted by Iliketogofast
And while you're at it, get rid of that pesky swingarm. Those thigs weigh about 40 pounds, and besides, who needs 'em?

:D

actually brakes is a good idea...if u jus use it at FSW for a drag bike...y not do that and take them off...u would save a good amount of weight...u could lose all the master cylinder and everything...that would be a good 20-25 pounds off

[Iliketogofast]

I think you forgot what the brakes are there for. You're not supposed to take them off, because they're there so that you won't die.

[mikes450r]

I think you have no clue about drag racing...maybe post on a topic you actually know something about..;)

mike

[450Racer]

you can spend a week ripping your quad down and putting in Ti bolts that'll save you 2 pounds. i weigh 123 pounds at 5'5. i pulled the holeshot wtih my stock 400ex against piped YFZ's. they weighed around 180. now that i have my 450, i've been getting quite a few of the holeshots. 60 pounds is a HUGE difference.

i'd get +2 a-arms with 3+2 wheels. that may help some instead of +3 and 4+1. i believe water weights 8 pounds a gallon. may not seem like a lot but if you race, put one gallon in instead of 2. that saves nearly ten pounds, that'll make a difference. buy a prefilter and run an airbox elimiator kit or make your own if you're able to, that'll save maybe half a pound. if you're going to get a swingarm, look into what material it's made out of. some maybe be chromoloy while other are Ti there may be a few pounds there. tires are the most important thing they weigh nearly 10 pounds each. HiPer's will cut back 1.5 pounds each wheel, i weighed mine. maybe this helps.

[aroracer72]

I know how to save over 60 pds.......while maintaining all strength and functionability. But its expensive.........called titanium. And removing alot of the stuff you said. You can save easily 50 pds in replacing steel parts with ti...but GOD is it expensive!!!!!!
CHAD

[mikes450r]

Does anyone on here know the actual weight of the titanium swing arm from lsr

mike

[aroracer72]

problem with swingarms are.....is every aftermarket swingarm is heavier then our stock cast aluminum ones. Were ti saves the weight is a-arms...steering stem....and axle. Also all three shocks if they ahd ti springs...would save a total weight of aorund 8-10pds alone.
CHAD

[mikes450r]

well the drag swinger we have found is lighter than the stocker..thats why i was asking what the weight of the ti one is..

mike

[aroracer72]

I was talking about swingers you could still jump on and stuff....not sjut a straight line swinger.
CHAD

[R3Concepts]

Marvin Shaw billet shocks are lighter then stockers with Ti springs, so lets just steer away from that. The LSR Ti swinger is less then 10 I know that. Some of these guys are funny, I think mikes450r is just entertaining kids now:D

[mikes450r]

Originally posted by R3Concepts426ex
Marvin Shaw billet shocks are lighter then stockers with Ti springs, so lets just steer away from that. The LSR Ti swinger is less then 10 I know that. Some of these guys are funny, I think mikes450r is just entertaining kids now:D

what is that suppose to mean..

[mikes450r]

Originally posted by aroracer72
I was talking about swingers you could still jump on and stuff....not sjut a straight line swinger.
CHAD

ya i agree with that..the mx ones are quite a bit heavier..

[Chef]

Is this a drag race post or a TT post? Talk about thread hi-jacking.

345 lbs. Battery, Electric Start, etc.

[mikes450r]

Originally posted by R3Concepts426ex
Marvin Shaw billet shocks are lighter then stockers with Ti springs, so lets just steer away from that. The LSR Ti swinger is less then 10 I know that. Some of these guys are funny, I think mikes450r is just entertaining kids now:D

you going to explain your B.S. post or just blame it on another employee...http://www.trx450r.org/forum/uploads/post-696-1105670986.gif

[aroracer72]

Get a kick starter kit for your ex......dump the battery and electric start motor.....save more pds.....my friend did it.
CHAD

[aroracer72]

yeah and lets see you take arvins aluminum shocks off of an 80 foot tripple......or even a little 10ft double. Drag racers dont count on this psot....make another thread. Im trying to giove advice for a TT or MX lightening strategy...cause i bet there are racers from both those genres in this thread looking for little tips.
CHAD

[One_Bad_400]

DAUM chef... is that your TT bike... that is bad arse.. whats the motor got done to it, i have a 416 in my EX, think thats good enough for nationals?... how did you get it that light... i was going to build my 400ex into my TT bike but my brother and dad think thats a dumb idea? but i onow...

aroracer72= i've never seen a kick start for a 400ex? you got any pics?

[aroracer72]

no.......but if im at that friends house ill snap a couple pcis(he lvies far away).
CHAD

[cals400ex]

chef has one or two minor mods inside that bike :eek2:

[R3Concepts]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by mikes450r
you going to explain your B.S. post or just blame it on another employee...http://www.trx450r.org/forum/uploads/post-696-1105670986.gif [/QUOT

Chill...My post was sarcastic in the fact that this was mostly a drag bike lightening thread and now all of the sudden we got people talking about only +2s and running 3+2s to save weight and this and that, and we all know you use stock width of not narrower on drag bikes...Figure the post out before you make snide remarks. Morgan @ R3Concepts.


Marvin Shaws are drag shocks, not TT (although they have been used for TT to reduce roll) or MX shocks, so where does the comment "lets see you take those Shaw shocks off an 80 ft. triple" come into play? A little out of context.

[450Rcarbonpro]

First thing is titanium is the way to go to save weight on parts that are needed to be strong. I worked with Walsh racecraft in developing his titanium aarms. They save exactly 6lbs over his steel aarms. Plus they are a little stronger due to the specific grades of titanium that needed to be used. A titanium steering stem from graves motorsports weighs 1.68 lbs. Once again grade selection increased strength over 4130. Titanium bolt kit is good for 4lbs, all bolts including frame and motor. I supply ti bolts for some factory teams. Also for tt use an aluminum axle. I havent weighted one but seen claims of 7 to 9 lbs. A titanium axle is possible for mx but no one has designed one correctly yet. I know and work with a company that is in the design phase of a titanium axle that is estimated at 5lbs with hubs and all. Hubs are aluminum. Also the same design is applicable to an aluminum axle that is strong enough for mx. They are also designing a carbon fiber titanium hybrid steering stem, estimated weight .75 lbs. Ti swing arm is not needed as aluminum swing arms are soon to hit the market and will be lighter and stiffer. Ti swing arms flex too much and cost is bad for your health. Aluminum is best suited for this application when designed correctly. A titanium subframe for the honda but not the yamaha as stock is already lighter than a titanium design. Other things to consider are wiring harness. Use a trimmed crf 450 wiring harness with flywheel and ignition. This set up is good for atleast 5 lbs. Plus it makes your bike faster. Bonus. Get lakers custom plastic as it is lighter than stock, not sure by how much. Titanium springs are the way to go for mx. Im not familiar with marvin shaw shocks but then they have never pushed for the atv marked anyways. Not interested. May work for tt??? Each ti front shock spring saves about 1.5 lbs. And the rear saves just under 3 lbs. That is just under 6 lbs. As you can see the numbers are adding up. How about a 225 lbs banshee. all ti and aluminum and is strong enough for motocross. Things can be done it just takes a commitment to money. By the way the 225 lbs banshee is a bike of one of the owners at nmotion. Also general weight differences of titanium, aluminum, and steel. In reference to steel aluminum is 1/3, titanium is 1/2. Different grades of each metal may vary in weight by 2 to 3 percent.

[mikes450r]

so can your get these bolt packages...let me know

thanks mike

yeah dennis kirk sell some aluminum bolt kits, also like carbonpro said aluminum is lighter than titanium on most parts, also look into getting some magnisuim or berilium parts wich is even lighter than aluminum, alot of pro dirt bike riders are runnin mag hubs and calipers, but i dont know of any one that makes those parts for quads

[450Rcarbonpro]

Also when you lighten your bike you have to adjust your shock to compensate for weight distribution. If you lighten it enough you may need softer main springs on your shocks. If you think you front end is to light try adjusting you rear shock a little softer until your bike feels balanced again. I worked with elka on some ti components that affected the spring rate needed. For example titanium aarms are ligher and react more quickly to the shock than do steel aarms. So the spring rate was reduced to allow the aarms to react more quckly accurately. A small amount of wieght reduction allowed the shocks to work a little better. We are not talking leaps and bound but enough for the pro riders to take notice.

[Chef]

Originally posted by One_Bad_400
DAUM chef... is that your TT bike... that is bad arse.. whats the motor got done to it, i have a 416 in my EX, think thats good enough for nationals?... how did you get it that light... i was going to build my 400ex into my TT bike but my brother and dad think thats a dumb idea? but i onow...


It was my TT bike. Thats the bike I won the Open 4 Stroke championship on, and used it one race last year. It was a 440, around there, the piston that was in it actually was a little smaller than a wiseco 89mm, so it was like a 433 or 34 I think. About 14.5:1, 3mm over valves, lightened crank, Ti valves, Aluminum Rod, lightened flywheel, etc.

We built this last year to replace the 400. 500cc

[chad502ex]

Originally posted by Chef
It was my TT bike. Thats the bike I won the Open 4 Stroke championship on, and used it one race last year. It was a 440, around there, the piston that was in it actually was a little smaller than a wiseco 89mm, so it was like a 433 or 34 I think. About 14.5:1, 3mm over valves, lightened crank, Ti valves, Aluminum Rod, lightened flywheel, etc.

We built this last year to replace the 400. 500cc

that's kewl look'n!

[450r51]

take the engine out, i heard thats the best way

[mikes450r]

Originally posted by 450r51
take the engine out, i heard thats the best way

:o wow that was a good one..

[450Rcarbonpro]

mike450r did you get my PM?

[450Rcarbonpro]

I almost forgot. There are aluminum ceramic composite brake disk rotors that save 1 lb compared to a wave rotor. They are trick. They are used in all forms of road racing and sprint cars. They fit our hub patterns. Also measured on a dyno the with the weight reduction you get just under 1 HP. They use carbon fiber brake pads and work much more responsively than steel rotors or titanium rotors. Side winder has titanium rotors. The composite brake rotors are not cheap as they cost around 250 each. Like I said money makes magic and one sweet atv.

[mikes450r]

Originally posted by 450Rcarbonpro
I almost forgot. There are aluminum ceramic composite brake disk rotors that save 1 lb compared to a wave rotor. They are trick. They are used in all forms of road racing and sprint cars. They fit our hub patterns. Also measured on a dyno the with the weight reduction you get just under 1 HP. They use carbon fiber brake pads and work much more responsively than steel rotors or titanium rotors. Side winder has titanium rotors. The composite brake rotors are not cheap as they cost around 250 each. Like I said money makes magic and one sweet atv.

hey i just checked it...those bolts sure do cost a pretty penny..lol

i will be ordering everything the end of this week so i may hit u up on some stuff your talking about..

ike

[sampleez]

Originally posted by 450r51
take the engine out, i heard thats the best way

your a funny one....and original too

http://www.yfztech.com/forum/style_emoticons/default/101.gif

:devil: