is there any hope honda will match the 06' yfz with the 06' 450r

[troutman561]

With the newer,stronger,faster yfz450.. i was wondering if anyone knows if honda is going to beable to counter this on the 06' R...also the craptor 700... anyone heard of a honda 650 or around there sport.. they really need to get on top of things because people are gona be drawn to these new yamahas and hondas gona lose good business

[450RgETiRdONE]

Yeah true..... but its like 400, then 450, then a 650, then 700, then 1000cc freakin fourwheelers. Its got to stop some where. Or they might as well just come with a Cofin!!! Or how ever you spell it!


But they should hurry up and come out with an '06 450r if thats what you ment. People might want to get an '05 honda then they see the rad '06 yfz and want it...

If i had hondas number i'd be on the phone right now sayn wheres the '06 kidz!

[04EXdude]

Honda seriously needs to start paying attention to the customers wants and needs. Heck, i'd still be on a Honda if the 450 just had an E start (along with a half a million other people)............:confused:

[Smoker]

You have to hand it to Yamaha, at least they have the cahona's to develop new stuff. There probably wouldn't even be a 450R unless Yamaha developed a 450 bike. That Raptor looks fun, wider, lower, and rip your arms off fast. Don't be in a rush to buy the first production year though (tick, tick, tick, tick, BOOM).

[nat3060]

Originally posted by 04EXdude
Honda seriously needs to start paying attention to the customers wants and needs. Heck, i'd still be on a Honda if the 450 just had an E start (along with a half a million other people)............:confused:

E start? how lazy can you be? i can kick my R sitting down and im a girl.

i cant stand when people start b:mad:tching about no electric start or reverse, are people that much of a pu:mad::mad:y that they can get off of the bike and push back or kick it.. sorry but im just sick of hearing it. i like my kick, its reliable... and no reverse is one less piece of crap to have on the quad

[chad502ex]

Originally posted by nat3060
a pu:mad::mad:y

LOL! crack'n me up

[nat3060]

;)

[Shawn H]

LMAO

04exdude YOUR OWNED:p

I agree with the Girl too:cool:

Originally posted by troutman561
With the newer,stronger,faster yfz450.. i was wondering if anyone knows if honda is going to beable to counter this on the 06' R...also the craptor 700... anyone heard of a honda 650 or around there sport.. they really need to get on top of things because people are gona be drawn to these new yamahas and hondas gona lose good business

Honda doesnt need to match the raptor 700, not many people will buy that, sept for drag racers or such, plus the fact that its gonna have a lot of problems like the cannondales did the first year, also did you notice the only actuall changes they made to the yfz450 was the 10cc more, that really wont make a differance, they did that to compete with honda and say that they had a 450, the 2006 450R doesnt need any changes, the bike is perfect, the only thing i could see them doing would be maybe adding 2 differant models, 1 E start, and 1 kick start, that way they can claim more of the market, we may also see a new color of plastic, but really that would be about it

[cals400ex]

where can i read about the changes made to the yami's?

Originally posted by cals400ex
where can i read about the changes made to the yami's?

open forum

Originally posted by nat3060
E start? how lazy can you be? i can kick my R sitting down and im a girl.

i cant stand when people start b:mad:tching about no electric start or reverse, are people that much of a pu:mad::mad:y that they can get off of the bike and push back or kick it.. sorry but im just sick of hearing it. i like my kick, its reliable... and no reverse is one less piece of crap to have on the quad

go natty, go natty

[Jonas]

What the girl said!!!!!

Honda built what they and I consider to be a "race" bike, not a bike for your mother-in-law. It's true that it would have sold more if it had more mother-in-law-friendly-features, but I'm ok with that.

Let's see a show of hands of who would want an xr650r dirt bike over a crf450r from people who have ridden both. My hand's not up!

People who are certain they would enjoy a trx650r (with e-start, reverse, and beer holder) over a trx450r are either 300lbs or just don't have enough knowledge of bikes in my opinion.

If you feel that e-start would give you an advantage in the kind of racing you do that's great, but me and many others that now own a 450r are very happy they left it off. You can't make everyone happy with one bike.

Also, I'll have to check my facts on who made the 450 dirtbike first??? Was Yamaha the one? Not sure about that??? Regardless, do you really want the bike that is out the first or the one that you feel is best for you. How fast do you want Honda to rush their quad through r&d?

[Out_Sider]

hell... i was scared honda would put e start on the 450r for 06, tahts why i got a 05, lmao

e start is a big waste of my time

[troutman561]

no we dont want them to rush.. but thats us, not the general hey i want the best tihng out there idiots... i personally like honda better, but someone who is wanting the best out there.. well their gona do a search and see that the yfz is killin it in everything with the 450r in close second.. so for the average joe, what do you think they will pick, what they perceive to be second best or what the research is telling them is the "best".. just a thought tho, jsut wanted to see if anyone knew anything from honda since yami's new editions........ i still like my 400 :D

[Smoker]

I was actually refering to the quad when I said bike, it's a habit of mine. Yamaha built the YZF 400 in 98 I believe and the CRF450 didn't come out until 01-02, correct me if I'm wrong. Not that it matters, I'll always be on Honda, regardless of what other people are building, it's just frustrating that Honda isn't as innovative as they could be, especially with quads. I understand, it's their safe business sense that allows them to be such a large company, but with the following they have, people would buy their latest and greatest. IMO :p

[hondaracer305]

Originally posted by nat3060
E start? how lazy can you be? i can kick my R sitting down and im a girl.

i cant stand when people start b:mad:tching about no electric start or reverse, are people that much of a pu:mad::mad:y that they can get off of the bike and push back or kick it.. sorry but im just sick of hearing it. i like my kick, its reliable... and no reverse is one less piece of crap to have on the quad

LMAO, true, true, haha

[rob-u/21]

One thing I would like to see from an '06 honda is a different rear shock. Honda should re-do the whole rear suspension.

[hondaracer305]

Originally posted by rob-u/21
One thing I would like to see from an '06 honda is a different rear shock. Honda should re-do the whole rear suspension.

if your talking about the pogo stick action, just buy an Elka rear linkage setup, from what ive heard, it works wonders

[Punk'd]

I think that honda will have something good for us...

(i hope)

[Bill Fuller]

:D :D This pu:mad: :mad: Y loves his electric start.You Honda loyalist crack me up,to hear the things you say in defense of you quads.Once again these releases prove Yamaha is doing things right.Face it people you bought your Honda just because it said Honda,you would be happy riding a turd on wheels if thats what they offered.:devil:

Originally posted by Bill Fuller
:D :D This pu:mad: :mad: Y loves his electric start.You Honda loyalist crack me up,to hear the things you say in defense of you quads.Once again these releases prove Yamaha is doing things right.Face it people you bought your Honda just because it said Honda,you would be happy riding a turd on wheels if thats what they offered.:devil: you won't see my honda do this .... face it, you wish you were on a honda :blah: http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid169/p86d8712ae1d096d106bbec4d33a6bb9e/f4026f45.jpg

[wvspeedfreak]

Geez guys,it's all personal preference.Ride what you like and be happy that you have a quad at all.

[Shawn H]

Honda will be changing some things just hold your shorts and wait.

I have been told by a very reliable source that there is changes and its not plastic color either!

Dont bother calling me out cuz I CAN not and will not tell!

There's a reason Im selling 1 of my 450rs for the 06!

Originally posted by snowgasm

There's a reason Im selling 1 of my 450rs for the 06! well that sucks i'm stuck with my POS 2004 now I guess

[nat3060]

Originally posted by Bill Fuller
:D :D This pu:mad: :mad: Y loves his electric start.You Honda loyalist crack me up,to hear the things you say in defense of you quads.Once again these releases prove Yamaha is doing things right.Face it people you bought your Honda just because it said Honda,you would be happy riding a turd on wheels if thats what they offered.:devil:

Actually, ive been wanting kickstart ever since i saw a 250R back when i was 12yrs. I owned a 400ex with electric start, it was nice to just push a button, but i like knowing my quad is reliable and ill never have to worrie about a battery or my quad burning to the ground.

It has nothing to do with defending a honda, it just so happens its them who did the smart thing.

im getting pretty sick of yami guys also, yamaha finally does something RIGHT in years with the yfz, and they think it makes up for all the other crap that they put out.

and again, my quad wont ever look like this:

[nat3060]

only thing i can see is honda putting the hrc kit in so it comes stock with it and a new color (maybe), and doing something with the rear suspension since there was so much complaining about it, personally i dont see what the big deal is, especially since people go with aftermarket anyways.

it doesnt need to be changed, its perfect as it is

[happyboy]

Originally posted by nat3060
only thing i can see is honda putting the hrc kit in so it comes stock with it and a new color (maybe), and doing something with the rear suspension since there was so much complaining about it, personally i dont see what the big deal is, especially since people go with aftermarket anyways.

it doesnt need to be changed, its perfect as it is

Give us a freaking break!! You ignorant honda lemmings!!! (not aimed at the normal joe, just the blind moranic lemmings) I can't beleive anyone would buy a honda even if there was something better with a different name!! What are you thinking?? Honda makes a great quad, YES. Best? All in the owner's opinion.

Now, is it perfect? Heck no!! You said it yourself, HRC kit. How about some better shocks? Oh yeah, gotta have a kill switch. Nerfs stock would be nice. Different exhaust definately. Good night, if it were perfect then we wouldn't need aftermarket stuff or modification!!

And stop your defense of the kick start already!! A 450R can burn up just as easy as anything else. Gas leak+hot exhaust and you are on a piece of charcoal.

[Punk'd]

Originally posted by MixMasterMike
well that sucks i'm stuck with my POS 2004 now I guess

ME TO!!!!!:mad: :grr:

[nat3060]

Originally posted by happyboy
Give us a freaking break!! You ignorant honda lemmings!!! (not aimed at the normal joe, just the blind moranic lemmings) I can't beleive anyone would buy a honda even if there was something better with a different name!! What are you thinking?? Honda makes a great quad, YES. Best? All in the owner's opinion.

Now, is it perfect? Heck no!! You said it yourself, HRC kit. How about some better shocks? Oh yeah, gotta have a kill switch. Nerfs stock would be nice. Different exhaust definately. Good night, if it were perfect then we wouldn't need aftermarket stuff or modification!!

And stop your defense of the kick start already!! A 450R can burn up just as easy as anything else. Gas leak+hot exhaust and you are on a piece of charcoal.


wooooo someones getting defensive, go check your blood pressure buddy :eek:

yea anything with gas can burn.. but its mainly electrical problems ;) anyways, dont get your panties in a wad.. and if you cant stand honda so much, why are you in the 450R forums?

yall keep getting pissed and defensive, its pretty entertaining :D

[nat3060]

Originally posted by MixMasterMike
well that sucks i'm stuck with my POS 2004 now I guess


Originally posted by Punk'd
ME TO!!!!!:mad: :grr:

i got an easy solution, SELL IT

[Punk'd]

Originally posted by nat3060
i got an easy solution, SELL IT

Sell it for me:macho

[nat3060]

Originally posted by Punk'd
Sell it for me:macho

bring it to me ;)

[DH400EX]

if ur a true honda ridr u wont give a **** about the new yfz. and if u race urs will already be modded and can beat a stock 06 yfz.:rolleyes:

[wvspeedfreak]

Originally posted by Punk'd
ME TO!!!!!:mad: :grr:

Don't get too upset yet.Just because something "new and improved" is coming out doesn't automatically make your quad a POS.I am happy with my '04 and don't plan on getting rid of it anytime soon.I seriously doubt the upgrades on the new one will be any better than the upgrades I have currently on mine.

[Punk'd]

Originally posted by nat3060
bring it to me ;)

OH its already been brought!:blah:

[happyboy]

Originally posted by DH400EX
if ur a true honda ridr u wont give a **** about the new yfz. and if u race urs will already be modded and can beat a stock 06 yfz.:rolleyes:

Wow, a modded 450r beating a stock YFZ, now that is an accomplishment.


And I don't hate the hondas. Just can't stand people that are sold on 1 brand. Honda, Yammy, Ford, Chevy. Those people are boneheads and need to be told so.

[nat3060]

Originally posted by happyboy
Wow, a modded 450r beating a stock YFZ, now that is an accomplishment.


And I don't hate the hondas. Just can't stand people that are sold on 1 brand. Honda, Yammy, Ford, Chevy. Those people are boneheads and need to be told so.

im not sold just on one brand, if i had the extra cash id own a yfz too, but since i had to choose one i rathered it be a honda

[MyFlyin450R]

Let me just say to the Yamaha crowd that the quality is not as good as the Honda. I own both.

[Shawn H]

Originally posted by wvspeedfreak
Don't get too upset yet.Just because something "new and improved" is coming out doesn't automatically make your quad a POS.I am happy with my '04 and don't plan on getting rid of it anytime soon.I seriously doubt the upgrades on the new one will be any better than the upgrades I have currently on mine.


You CAN not make your 04 or 05 like the 06 Bottom line>

I have aftermarket everything on my 450r and it wont be the same.

[Punk'd]

Originally posted by snowgasm
You CAN not make your 04 or 05 like the 06 Bottom line>

I have aftermarket everything on my 450r and it wont be the same.

Just tell us! They come with HRC now? What do you mean with all the mods it wont be the same? tell us we will keep it on the low!:macho

[Shawn H]

I cant say but its nothing to do with the motor that Im talking about. Not that the motor is not neccessarily getting an upgrade:D

[Punk'd]

Originally posted by snowgasm
I cant say but its nothing to do with the motor that Im talking about. Not that the motor is not neccessarily getting an upgrade:D

:eek2: Your makeing me and everybody else on this fourm cry now please tell us:D Is the carb considered part of the motor?:D

When do they plan to release it?

[Shawn H]

Im sorry I CANT>Your thinking motor and there are other things as well that will be changed.

I heard around Sept :(


Just drop it I cant tell and Wont. My source would hang me:ermm:


Anyone who says Im full of chit All I got to say is will see!:cool:

[cheetah]

One thing Yamaha can't put on their machines is the rider and that is where it is at.;)

[Punk'd]

Originally posted by snowgasm
Im sorry I CANT>Your thinking motor and there are other things as well that will be changed.

I heard around Sept :(


Just drop it I cant tell and Wont. My source would hang me:ermm:


Anyone who says Im full of chit All I got to say is will see!:cool:

Ehh september.. Ok but tell me this is there any updates preformance wise?

[Smoker]

Motor changes don't really concern me, they really haven't changed the 06 CRF so the motor isn't going to change worlds. Suspension, with the upgrades I have, they have nothing to offer me. The only thing is if they redesigned the chassis significantly to lower the center of gravity, more of a 250r feel. That would be the only thing that would bum me out about having a 04, but then again, I love my quad the way it is. :p

[RedRacer44]

Its anyone's guess on what they're going to do on the '06 450Rs, we've all heard different things. I talked to my Honda shop who sponsors me and they said all they know is pretty much the same rumors that we're hearing. Now if he is lying or not, who knows. I'm anxious to see what Honda does, it should be good.

A few things I look to see on the '06s (but wouldnt be surprised if it didnt happen) :

1. New Rear End (Shock/Linkage/Valving, etc)
2. FCR Carb
3. Different Cam
4. Motor Relocation (Like what Farr has done)
5. Electric Start (Dont want but wouldnt be surprised)

Dont bust my nuts on these things, these are just things that would be kinda obvious upgrades I think. Nothing to radical except for the motor relocation but who knows. I would rather not have electric start, i'm used to the kick-start and love it from having a 250R. But it wouldnt surprise me because Honda came out with the CRF450X (crf bike w/ e-start). As long as they offer a kick-start option, i'm cool w/ the e-start

I'm going to buy one whenever they come out just to upgrade to a new bike. My '04 450R has been put through the paces with being my full-time MX race bike and its time to be retired to a practice bike or sold! I'm putting all my aftermarket goodies on the '06 though :devil: Put the stock stuff on the '04 to sell or whatever....

Originally posted by RedRacer44
A few things I look to see on the '06s (but wouldnt be surprised if it didnt happen) :

1. New Rear End (Shock/Linkage/Valving, etc)
2. FCR Carb
3. Different Cam
4. Motor Relocation (Like what Farr has done)
5. Electric Start (Dont want but wouldnt be surprised)


I agree 100%

[04EXdude]

Originally posted by nat3060
E start? how lazy can you be? i can kick my R sitting down and im a girl.

i cant stand when people start b:mad:tching about no electric start or reverse, are people that much of a pu:mad::mad:y that they can get off of the bike and push back or kick it.. sorry but im just sick of hearing it. i like my kick, its reliable... and no reverse is one less piece of crap to have on the quad

Pu:mad: :mad: y?...............You shouldn't really use that word unless your offering some............;)

OK.......I'm hearing that most of you guys (and girl) absolutely love your kick start and thats cool for you but what if Honda does put in E start for 06? Does that mean that you people wouldn't buy it? Because it don't have a kicker? Its funny to me how you people take this annoying aspect of this machine and try to make it a "manly" necessity..............:D
When I'm watching GNCC racing and I watch an already beat rider trying to kick his stalled 450R, it looks like he could really use an E start...........but maybe thats just me...........Happy Wheeling! :D

[D-7#61-450r]

I would love to see all but #5 myself. A battery and starter are just a couple of more problems. All you 400 ex riders ever have a battery come off during a race. I haven't on my 450r, and thats the way a race quad should be. also have seen multiple battery concerns on the yfz.

Originally posted by 04EXdude
Pu:mad: :mad: y?...............You shouldn't really use that word unless your offering some............;)

OK.......I'm hearing that most of you guys (and girl) absolutely love your kick start and thats cool for you but what if Honda does put in E start for 06? Does that mean that you people wouldn't buy it? Because it don't have a kicker? Its funny to me how you people take this annoying aspect of this machine and try to make it a "manly" necessity..............:D
When I'm watching GNCC racing and I watch an already beat rider trying to kick his stalled 450R, it looks like he could really use an E start...........but maybe thats just me...........Happy Wheeling! :D

id still buy it, battery or not, just i like the kick start over the electric because then you have nothing electrical to deal with, no dead battery, and along with that no added weight

[RedRacer44]

I will say I love the kick start for simplicity and its lowers the risk of electrical problems but man, it does suck when you stall it in a race, MX or XC! I've stalled my bike a few times on the 4th or 5th lap in a MX race.....and its a chore when you're already fatigued and under stress from the race :ermm:

But I still prefer my kickstart over e-start any day :D

the only time i ever wish i had estart was if it dies on a hill, i hardly ever kill my 450 anyway so that is fine, i love my kick start, but on a hill, man that thing is a pain to kick

[nat3060]

Originally posted by 04EXdude
Pu:mad: :mad: y?...............You shouldn't really use that word unless your offering some............;)

OK.......I'm hearing that most of you guys (and girl) absolutely love your kick start and thats cool for you but what if Honda does put in E start for 06? Does that mean that you people wouldn't buy it? Because it don't have a kicker? Its funny to me how you people take this annoying aspect of this machine and try to make it a "manly" necessity..............:D
When I'm watching GNCC racing and I watch an already beat rider trying to kick his stalled 450R, it looks like he could really use an E start...........but maybe thats just me...........Happy Wheeling! :D

id still buy it, but i much rather a kickstart

sorry if my post sounded cruel, but it hits a nerve when someone mentions the estart or reverse

[Punk'd]

DUDE...04EXdude were do you live? I live in Stl also:D

[nowukno]

I have a 05 450r and im very happy with it and i will not trade it no matter whats on the 06 , you guys who want to trade in on newer models when you already have a 04 or 05 make me laugh. Just do some mods to your slightly older quad and make it faster or handle better or whatever , but go ahead and trade in your quad for a 06 then next year you will want a 07 and then a 08. Because every year there are going to be new upgrades.

[troutman561]

do u think honda will actually make more upgrades on the R for all those years..hmm maybe a new color:ermm:

[Rich250RRacer]

I'm sure I'm going to get bashed for this but I have to stick my nose in too. As you can see from my sig, I'm a Honda loyalist. I've owned Yamahas in the past, dirt bikes, street bikes and quads, and still own one now ( an '85 Tri-Z :huh ). I work on street bikes, dirt bikes and quads nearly every day, all brands and all sizes, and from my extensive experience, I can tell you this. No other Japanese company is as well engineered, more reliable, or pays as much attention to detail as Honda. They are on a totally different level from the other three. To Yamaha's credit they are not afraid to take chances, and this has led to some very interesting machines, such as the V-max bike (and snowmobile), the Tri-Z, the Banshee, and of course the new four-strokes. But when you work on these things day in and day out, you really get to see who builds quality machines. There are days when I'll look at something on a Yamaha, Kawasaki, or Suzuki and just scratch my head trying to figure out just what the hell they were thinking.

Yamaha- Dares to be different

Honda- Strives to be the very best.

I'll take the best over different any day, even if it's not quite as fast, or flashy. I just know I'm not ridin' the bandwagon, like alot of others.

[Pepto_Bismol]

Before all of you forum trolls get your undies in a budle, :blah:

Consider yamaha's new upgrade to the YZF540 Here:

http://www.yamaha-motor.com/sport/products/modelspeccompare/323/1142/0/compare.aspx

A side by side comparison from the "old" to the new shows some decent, but not unexpected changes.

My point is, is that when Honda announces whatever changes they make, it still won't be "so significant", that eventually you won't desire to start purchasing after market mods anyway.

For Example,
From yamaha, a "new rear suspension"? Ok, that is good, but not one serious racer will leave that unmodded. ( I am not knocking Yamaha either, brand wars are not my thing).

Point being, as stated before, each year, there are improvements to products, and you will always have the "last years" model.

But from year to year, each change is generally made to address concerns for the John Q puplic, who only leave their quad in stock form and are not interested in spending another $4000.00 to get the most of their purchase 9and the base price keeps going up).

My mods that I will be installing, are the mods that I want, not paying for a "slightly" improved quad, just to remove those items anyway just to put on what I want.


Pepto:cool:

[RedRacer44]

In response to what nowukno said and in my defense....

I'm getting an '06 just for the sake of really to have a new bike. My '04 isnt out-dated by no means or anything......has all the good aftermarket stuff too. Its just starting get to be a little bit "used" you might say. Racing MX full time puts a toll on a quad and I dont wanna start worrying about "whats going to break next?" or "Is this part going to wear out soon and I'm not going to know it till the final lap in a critical race?" Its for peace of mind really.

Plus I like to build MX race quads and I'm going to go a few different routes (motor, suspension, etc) on this bike, see how things work out for me :D

[mstrav1]

these threads are great!!!! I like how people think that yamaha answers peoples requests for changes of the different bikes!

lets see:

-blasters had front drum brakes until what 03'
-how many years to finally widen the craptor that flips with ease
-banshee suspension is real nice after 17 years?
-warrier (need i say more)
-after (2) model years the yfz450 is going to be a true "450" (well this sucks for part inter-changability doesn't it)
-why is the kick start $500 in parts alone? (couldn't it just have it already?)
-my 04' yfz 450 major electrical problems (dealer said, just run with the lights on (which i was already doing). I told them to f-off and bought my honda (WHICH IS FLAWLESS AFTER 10 MONTHS)
-fuel injection (didn' another brand that went belly up have this? oh yeah cannondale) makes jetting mods a breeze (ha ha you have to pay someone to f$^& with the comp. this should be fun out at comp on a weekend.)


SINCE YAMAHA LISTENS SO WELL.

DEAR YAMAHA CAN YOU PLEASE MAKE THE ABOVE CHANGES ASAP. I KNOW FROM THE PAST AND FROM EVERYONE HEAR THAT SAYS YOU GUYS REALLY LISTEN TO US CONSUMERS AND RESPOND REALLY FAST. THANKS - MATT


:D

[Shawn H]

Originally posted by Smoker
Motor changes don't really concern me, they really haven't changed the 06 CRF so the motor isn't going to change worlds. Suspension, with the upgrades I have, they have nothing to offer me. The only thing is if they redesigned the chassis significantly to lower the center of gravity, more of a 250r feel. That would be the only thing that would bum me out about having a 04, but then again, I love my quad the way it is. :p


This guy is the closest!!
The motor is supposed to get something but I truly dont know what.He wouldnt tell me:mad:

Next year Im racing the Stock class GNCC and was told I would be at a HUGE disadvantage with a 05 or 04,So I'm keeping my 05 modded and will use the 06 for the stock class.

Originally posted by snowgasm
This guy is the closest!!
The motor is supposed to get something but I truly dont know what.He wouldnt tell me:mad:

Next year Im racing the Stock class GNCC and was told I would be at a HUGE disadvantage with a 05 or 04,So I'm keeping my 05 modded and will use the 06 for the stock class.

i think that is bs, they couldnt improve it enough to justify a complete disadvantage, maybe a higher comp piston and better shocks, most likely the HRC cam stock, that isnt enough for a disadvantage in my opinion, look at borich and ballance....yamaha 470cc stroker yfz450 vs a stock 450r with the hrc cam...and borich still pulls him on straight aways, go honda :macho

[Shawn H]

Think watcha want!
You have a right too!

A complete advantage in the Stock class against a 04 or 05 450R!

Reread and then post your comments:rolleyes:

You need better info besides DW too Ballance does not use a 470 stroker its stock with minor mods for reliability!

[cmhracing]

Very well said Rich250RRacer, I agree 100%

Originally posted by snowgasm
Think watcha want!
You have a right too!

A complete Disadvantage in the Stock class against a 04 or 05 450R!

Reread and then post your comments:rolleyes:

You need better info besides DW too Ballance does not use a 470 stroker its stock with minor mods for reliability!

hrmm i heard that he was using a 470 stroker, but i dunno, i guess technically a suspension upgrade or a high comp piston etc, would make a big diff for stock class, but i really cant c honda changing nething majorly, because then the people who modded their stuff would be pissed off if it was something really major

Originally posted by snowgasm
A complete Disadvantage in the Stock class against a 04 or 05 450R!

what? so they 06 450R is gonna be worse then the 04 or 05? thats what ur saying right there :confused:

[Shawn H]

LMAO
Thats not what I meant but at least ya read it:D


Advantage with a 06 Disadvantage with the older:devil:

Originally posted by snowgasm
LMAO
Thats not what I meant but at least ya read it:D


Advantage with a 06 Disadvantage with the older:devil:

i kno i was jus making fun of what u said lol :blah:

[450R_lover]

All I have to say is.... It's about time Yamaha learned from the best! ( chain adjustment and LED tail light) :p

Originally posted by mstrav1
these threads are great!!!! I like how people think that yamaha answers peoples requests for changes of the different bikes!

lets see:

-blasters had front drum brakes until what 03'
-how many years to finally widen the craptor that flips with ease
-banshee suspension is real nice after 17 years?
-warrier (need i say more)
-after (2) model years the yfz450 is going to be a true "450" (well this sucks for part inter-changability doesn't it)
-why is the kick start $500 in parts alone? (couldn't it just have it already?)
-my 04' yfz 450 major electrical problems (dealer said, just run with the lights on (which i was already doing). I told them to f-off and bought my honda (WHICH IS FLAWLESS AFTER 10 MONTHS)
-fuel injection (didn' another brand that went belly up have this? oh yeah cannondale) makes jetting mods a breeze (ha ha you have to pay someone to f$^& with the comp. this should be fun out at comp on a weekend.)


SINCE YAMAHA LISTENS SO WELL.

DEAR YAMAHA CAN YOU PLEASE MAKE THE ABOVE CHANGES ASAP. I KNOW FROM THE PAST AND FROM EVERYONE HEAR THAT SAYS YOU GUYS REALLY LISTEN TO US CONSUMERS AND RESPOND REALLY FAST. THANKS - MATT


:D

rock on, mstrav1!! That was awesome.

[Punk'd]

Originally posted by 450R_lover
All I have to say is.... It's about time Yamaha learned from the best! ( chain adjustment and LED tail light) :p

Amen:blah:

[kgbg]

Honda doesnt need to match the raptor 700, not many people will buy that, sept for drag racers or such, plus the fact that its gonna have a lot of problems like the cannondales did the first year, also did you notice the only actuall changes they made to the yfz450 was the 10cc more, that really wont make a differance, they did that to compete with honda and say that they had a 450, the 2006 450R doesnt need any changes, the bike is perfect, the only thing i could see them doing would be maybe adding 2 differant models, 1 E start, and 1 kick start, that way they can claim more of the market, we may also see a new color of plastic, but really that would be about it

Hond does need to match the 700 Raptor. Its not a drag race bike, its a big caddilac FI tral/dune quad. The guys with big wallets , older guys, who do not want a little 450, want 700cc's they want FI they want a bling bling looking quad. Yamaha produced it.
You say it will have problems like the Cannondale did.....You have no idea. You cannot compare Cannondales limited 7 figure budget for R&D with Yamaha's almost unlimited R&D budget. This FI system has been run for years, and is not going to have problems. There will be some new things required when you hop up a engine, but like rejetting, you will just need a re program your ECU.
The YFZ450 just got 10 cc's....You say...
Come on, it got a stroked crank, it got a redesigned combustion chamber, it got different port configuration, it got a Honda style carrier.
Right now Honda is very far behind, and Yamaha has all the thunder. I am a huge Honda fan, but if Honda does not start building the machines that , lets face it, Yamaha is building, their hold on masses sales are going to fall. Where do you think the money comes to fund race teams, r&d, ect? Hint, its not from the 10% of quad purchasers who race them.
The 450 needs E start ( I hate it, but the YFZ has it and its the same weight as a Honda, the electrical problems are from Yamahas decision to stick to a DC system is the reason for electrical issues, not the e start.
I like Honda, and I am a Honda guy, but the way Yamaha did this is the way Honda should.

[Shawn H]

I dont know if it will come with Estart but I sure hope it doesnt or is offered with or without!

I wont make the upgrade to the 06 if its Estart> No matter what the upgrades are.

[oldsandman]

Originally posted by kgbg
Hond does need to match the 700 Raptor. Its not a drag race bike, its a big caddilac FI tral/dune quad. The guys with big wallets , older guys, who do not want a little 450, want 700cc's they want FI they want a bling bling looking quad. Yamaha produced it.
You say it will have problems like the Cannondale did.....You have no idea. You cannot compare Cannondales limited 7 figure budget for R&D with Yamaha's almost R&D budget. This FI system has been run for years, and is not going to have problems. There will be some new things required when you hop up a engine, but like rejetting, you will just need a re program your ECU.
The YFZ450 just got 10 cc's....You say...
Come on, it got a stroked crank, it got a redesigned combustion chamber, it got different port configuration, it got a Honda style carrier.
Right now Honda is very far behind, and Yamaha has all the thunder. I am a huge Honda fan, but if Honda does not start building the machines that , lets face it, Yamaha is building, their hold on masses sales are going to fall. Where do you think the money comes to fund race teams, r&d, ect? Hint, its not from the 10% of quad purchasers who race them.
The 450 needs E start ( I hate it, but the YFZ has it ans its the same weight as a Honda, the electrical problems are form Yamahas decision to stick to a DC system is the reason for electrical systems, not the e start.
I like Honda, and I am a Honda guy, but the way Yamaha did this is the way Honda should.

Well stated! The new Raptor will be the quad of choice for the upscale maket duner and trail rider. Demographicly the guy with $$$ who doesn't want to turn wrenchs, just ride. Yamaha has hit a homerun with their new lineup. Let's see if Honda can respond.

[bbrad mulvey]

All I can say is thereis one huge differnce between Honda and Yamahahaha, is that Honda does there research and development as Yamaha does development then research. Havent you Yamaha peple ever realized that the first year yamaha is about as strong as the first year of a YuGo? You NEVER buy a first year or two of a yamaha! Theyare great machines once the bugs are fixed though I will give them that. Plus Honda does and EXTREMELY good job of keeping their new stuff hush-hush. And If they find one thing wrong with it they will not release it until it is ready for consumers to put it to the test. Look how manytimes the 450r got posponed on its release date! It was suppose to be released in august, then they had to fix the tie rods, so they put it off for a while then the camshaft, then the rearbrakes. But now look at when it was released, what did they have problems with?
My point is if anybody needs to get their ***** together it will need to be Yamaha, honda is doing just fine, its the after market that sucks for honda;)

[happyboy]

didn't they have a problem with frames cracking in spots and the kick start cracking the crank case or something? Oh and the cranks messing up...can't forget that one....

lol, they all have their problems. Even honda!! So get off the "its perfect" bandwagon and give the new raptor its due. I think its great they are pushing the envelope and hope the best for them.

Originally posted by happyboy
didn't they have a problem with frames cracking in spots and the kick start cracking the crank case or something? Oh and the cranks messing up...can't forget that one....

lol, they all have their problems. Even honda!! So get off the "its perfect" bandwagon and give the new raptor its due. I think its great they are pushing the envelope and hope the best for them.

whoa hold up there buddy, the crank bearing problems were very rare and only happened in a few models, and most were due to people installing them wrong and they have no problem with the kick starts, unless of course you give it gas when you kick it, but other then that nope

[bbrad mulvey]

oh Im not saying its perfect, but you watch, that raptor will be back in for recalls before you know it. I like its great, but its not quite 700cc. 686 is a far cry from 700. But I think honda does that with the 600rr also. I am just saying that I would NEVER buy a first year yamaha, especially since they always have problems.

Now as far as the case cracking, the yamaha does it too. Yes the crank bairings are junk on the 05 450rs, so replace them before you have to. Frame cracking is fixed if you go after market on the rear link. Now lets compare to a yamaha frame(450vs450) why is it that they make an after market frame ofr the YFZ for the pros and not for the 450r Pros? why is it that when you order a Honda gusset kit it come with 4 to 6 gussets as compared to the yamaha wicth comes with a like a dozen, it should come with a get well soon card from having to pay a small fortune for it too.

Each comapany has there own up and down, but I would much rather deal with Hondas downs than Yamahas ups. Either way my opinion is bias, either way there is only two companies that know how to make sport quads(sorry polaris,kawi,suzuki,gas gas, artic cat, atk,cannondale0 they just dont have the R&D that these two(yamaha and honda) have.

And since I have beeten the horse way past death. I am done. I am not anything bad, I am just defending the company that to me KNOWS how to listen to their costomers. And that IS Honda...

[happyboy]

Brad, you had me going right up until the last little Honda hurray! And I don't necessarily agree with the other companies not knowing how to make sport quads. Suziki did a great job with the Z400, can't wait for the 450. And then Cannondale did a fantastic job with the dale but ran short of cash and burned. If they would have been able to make it out of the bankruptcy I would love to see where they would be now.

So yeah, they all have their problems. And I am glad that you at least know and admit to the Honda faults. I know the Yammi problems and beleive me, I know the Cannondale problems. But the point is they all have their own problems. Can't deny that.

And I still love how people jump in without knowing what they are talking about to defend the 450R.
whoa hold up there buddy, the crank bearing problems were very rare and only happened in a few models, and most were due to people installing them wrong

[kgbg]

whoa hold up there buddy, the crank bearing problems were very rare and only happened in a few models, and most were due to people installing them wrong and they have no problem with the kick starts, unless of course you give it gas when you kick it, but other then that nope

Do you just make things up?

There is a updated crank bearing in all 2005 engines built past a certain date.

The difference between Honda and Yamaha is that when there is a problem Honda pays for it to be fixed, right now, even if you past warranty, like I was when my crank went out (read that close, not the bearings, the CRANK), and Yamaha says too bad, your out of warranty, or you abused it.

The Raptor 700R will not be in for recalls, Yamaha does not do recalls, ask anyone who bought a 2001 Raptor, with a bad tranny.

[Bill Fuller]

As the world turns............................................. ................................Where are you guys reading this chit from.Honda is moving backwards,they have completely missed the boat here.Not only am I talking about the 450r but look at the pityful upgrades they gave the 400ex.They couldn't even put resivior shocks on the damn thing.Honda has had their share of problems just like Yamaha.Don't buy a first year Yamaha you say,my '04 YFZ runs like a champ:macho Does anyone care to admit that 2nd gear on the 400ex was weak and swing arms were weaker??Let's face it we could go on forever about the other ATV's,but why???Are you telling me if I gave you my Yamaha you wouldn't take it?I was brand loyal just like I hear alot af you are,but I realized there is better stuff out there other than Honda.Have any of you even owned a Cannondale?I have and I can say the EFI system was awsome.I never had problems and tuning was a breeze with the proper tools(lap top/maps)I can say that EFI was the only reason I waited on the Honda,even with the kicker I would have bought it.Suzuki can't build a quad:confused: Just wait when their 450 comes out this crap will start all over again.Why can't you guys pe happy that the manufactuers are paying attention to the customers demands?Our sport can only continue to grow and every year something new is going to come out,get used to it Honda guys you will not always be the best.I can honestly say that if Honda released an electric start 450r tommorrow I still wouldn't go buy one,I am that happy with my YFZ.Will my next quad be a Yamaha???I don't know the answer to that question,If they have what I am looking for in a quad then maybe if not then whoever does will get my money.

[chad502ex]

everyone- looky again!! i've already mentioned the changes before in other threads that will occur on the 06' 450R. HONDA always invests serious R&D into their products like Rich says (thumbs up i like the way you summed it up about HONDA) and HONDA is always are a bit behind in releasing their innovation cause of a leak to YAMI who beats them to the punch. Ever noticed how YAMI always seem to within months before HONDA hurry to release what takes HONDA years to design? Just about every time i see YAMI do this there is always serious problems with the design. Let's take a closer look at the new raptor and see what HONDA will release as I've said it before,... :D

1. one piece aluminum Spar frame technology as seen on CRF's, CBR street bikes. In addition, slightly new geometry with ~20mm lower countershaft.
2. fuel injection.

the second is a 650EX!

NOW, You've heard it!

:macho

:D kinda fun too.

[ThumPIN_450R]

This whole thread was kind of pissing me off with all the bickering between the two brands that has been seen here millions of times before but I just realized how great it is that there are 2 high performance bikes good enough for people to argue about and actually have good points of why one is better than the other. I love my honda but it is far from stock and far from perfect as well I have blown my tranny up costing me big money and had to replace my frame (which was covered by warrantee) I have also seen yamahas have there fair share of problems with frame cracks, catching on fire (never seen in person) I have also seen a yammi break a tennis ball sized hole in the front of a cylinder. The bottom line is every thing will break but the real question is what will break and when and what will it cost. I like both machines and Bill Fuller I would gladly take you're quad if you wanted to give it to me and I'm sure you wouldn't turn down my honda either

[mstrav1]

Talk about not adding resi's to a new bike. It sure doesn't look like the p.o.s. raptor has resi's and its a whole re-design. the 400ex just got new plastics just like your "raptor 350" did. you yamaha guys are all a bunch of baby's. Its funny how you post your probs. on the honda sights to solve your yamaha probs, but your the first to throw stones when something new that none of you *********s have even touched, seen in person, rode or even know anybody that has ridden it yet. so shut the f-up and bring your p.o.s. raptor to the flats at pismo on the 4th of july and we will see who wins!!!!!


**********************P.S.******************

1)If anybody wants do do a reliability study go check out the rental bike fleets at pismo beach out. WHY ARE THERE NO YAMAHAS? these bikes get the crap beat out of them and drive though salt everyday and they are all honda's (the 50's and 90's are honda or suzuki)!!!! l:D


2) If tuning is such a g-dam breeze why do you need a laptop.
thats crap. I like being able to adjust my carb in the field, in the rain, in the snow, at the hill or wherever whenever and not have to carry $15k worth of comp equipment to make an adjustment.

[Fred55]

Originally posted by mstrav1
Talk about not adding resi's to a new bike. It sure doesn't look like the p.o.s. raptor has resi's and its a whole re-design. the 400ex just got new plastics just like your "raptor 350" did. you yamaha guys are all a bunch of baby's.

**********************P.S.******************

The raptor 700 atleast got NEW shocks, with new valving and such...and thats what makes a shock good or not...its the valving...

The raptor 350 got TONS more than just plastics, all new rear linkage and shock, new front shocks, new exhuast, new caburator, new tires.... atleast yamaha is trying to improve their products to make them perform better......why dont you learn all the facts before going off on how something sucks..

[04EXdude]

HA HA!.........If everyone is bickering now, what if Honda did the ultimate comeback and finally release the 650EX for 06. Wouldn't that be sweet timing for it to match the new Rappy?.............Then we would really have something to bicker about................:D

[mstrav1]

yamaha is so good / quick about fixing and addresing problems arn't they my yamaha brothers!!!

-warrier (circa 1987) got some p.o.s upgrades in 05' - 18 years for a response

-banshee (1987) j-arm change 90-91? plastics 05' - whow the suspension is really great - 18 years for new plastics?

-blaster (1988) it had frigen drum breaks on the front until 03' - 15 years for a response

- raptor (01') tranny probs, to skinny, to tall all at the expense of their owners getting told "thats not under warranty", but thanks for paying for the engineering since we would rather make it and perfect it later. so skinny that they tip with ease. fuel injection so you will have to pay a shop to re-map every single time you put an aftermarket part on it - 06'

its not even a true 700 what the hell!!!!! and better yet none of you guys have seen it or touched it and your talking mean crap!!!

[Fred55]

Originally posted by mstrav1
. fuel injection so you will have to pay a shop to re-map every single time you put an aftermarket part on it -



I dont know where you get your information but...its not correct! EFI automatically compensates for mods! when you ad a pipe, oo it knows that and will give the engine more fuel! same with other mods, the only reason to change the maps if you are really serious about riding one type over the other..and when you remap is just changes the power band around to how you like it.

[wvspeedfreak]

Just stop bickering.This is the first time in history we have had so many choices in off road machines.Remember the 90's when none of the manufacturers were coming out with anything new in the sport quad catagory?Everyone was *****ing about it.Now you have more choices than ever and guess what?Everybody's *****ing about it.
The sport atv market is on one hell of a roll right now........enjoy it.No matter which color plastic is you favorite.

[fastrider450r]

Originally posted by 450R_lover
All I have to say is.... It's about time Yamaha learned from the best! ( chain adjustment and LED tail light) :p
your d**n right!:devil:

[fastrider450r]

By the way in Dirtwheels in the issue were Ballance and Jones are riding together they say that Ballance's uses a 470 stroker.
Then Borich's only uses the HRC, and PIPE.

[happyboy]

Originally posted by Fred55
I dont know where you get your information but...its not correct! EFI automatically compensates for mods! when you ad a pipe, oo it knows that and will give the engine more fuel! same with other mods, the only reason to change the maps if you are really serious about riding one type over the other..and when you remap is just changes the power band around to how you like it.

This may or not be true for the new Raptor. You are talking about an open system versus a closed system. Many non-complicated EFI motors have closed systems, bikes, boats, cannondales have the closed system. This means it will not automatically compensate for a bad map(ie wrong afr). That is why we tune the maps with an afr meter or a dyno. The good thing is they have an air sensor on the intake that helps change the fuel amounts on the map, but not perfect like an O2 sensor would.


I posted this in the raptor section, but it seems lost over there....
This is in regards to what the new raptor is really for......

I know this is just a test. They are wanting to see what the public think of EFI on the quad. They weren't going to risk it all on the 450 with EFI. It could ruin them if it didn't succeed. Well, the big part of its success is how you can change the mapping to fit your needs so easily. Well, easily for us (cannondales). We hook up the D&M kit and boom! It goes from liesure trail quad to kick ars motorcross mapping. And yes! It does make a world of difference between some maps. I hope that Yammi does give this power to the consumer. This is one huge plus for the consumer if they do. That way the motor can actually be good for all types of riding versus just having it setup good for 1 type.

[sampleez]

hey mstrav1, WTF dude. get off your high horse. or better yet, your head out of your *****. honda doesn't hardly update their stuff either.

what about the 300ex?? what's been changed(of importance) since 93? and its not a true 300, oh no!!!!

400ex, took em 5 years put reverse on it like everyone wanted the whole time. and then the plastic change, which most people i know think looks worse. what a piece, it's not even a true 400 :rolleyes:

not to mention most of the other quad's out right now. it would sound stupid to have the true cc in the name. 282ex, 397ex, raptor 686, etc.....

i just can't see why most of you honda guys on here bash yamaha for trying to better their designs (luckily there are a few with enough common sence that realize it's a good thing for everyone). like there might not even been a 450r if it wasn't for the yfz coming out

[mstrav1]

but does honda take 18 fricken years guy to make a change? does ther product have a realistic track record of reliability (go ahead ***** about some broken parts that you have heard about breaking on the 450r)? how come you don't see yamaha generators? I WILL ADMIT THAT YAMAHA MAKES A HELL OF A PIANO THOUGH!!!!!!!!!:D

my 04' yfz 450 was a p.o.s. and i'm lucky my electrical probs didn't burn my bike down!!!!! have any trx450's cought on fire?

also sampleez,
why are using your stock needle? have you heard of ncvq? but you are a no it all so i guess you have a reason!! those hand guards you run look cute!!!!! and nice to know you had to use a honda throttle, what was wrong with the yamaha one? It couldn't have been a P.O.S. was it?

[Fred55]

Originally posted by mstrav1
but does honda take 18 fricken years guy to make a change? does ther product have a realistic track record of reliability (go ahead ***** about some broken parts that you have heard about breaking on the 450r)? how come you don't see yamaha generators? I WILL ADMIT THAT YAMAHA MAKES A HELL OF A PIANO THOUGH!!!!!!!!!:D

my 04' yfz 450 was a p.o.s. and i'm lucky my electrical probs didn't burn my bike down!!!!! have any trx450's cought on fire?

Seriously? How old are you? You are SO brand loyal its not funny,,, you would buy a turd with wheels if it said HONDA on it...open up your eyes and see that Yamaha is doing a great job and are making EXCELLENT machines....
maybe when you have more than 10 posts then people might take you seriously...

[sampleez]

when did the raptor come out?? i don't remember it being 18 yrs ago. and maybe if people took care of their bikes, they wouldn't have stuff like that happen. if you keep this up, you could probably make the top ten list of the worst douchebags on this site's history

Originally posted by chad502ex
everyone- looky again!! i've already mentioned the changes before in other threads that will occur on the 06' 450R. HONDA always invests serious R&D into their products like Rich says (thumbs up i like the way you summed it up about HONDA) and HONDA is always are a bit behind in releasing their innovation cause of a leak to YAMI who beats them to the punch. Ever noticed how YAMI always seem to within months before HONDA hurry to release what takes HONDA years to design? Just about every time i see YAMI do this there is always serious problems with the design. Let's take a closer look at the new raptor and see what HONDA will release as I've said it before,... :D

1. one piece aluminum Spar frame technology as seen on CRF's, CBR street bikes. In addition, slightly new geometry with ~20mm lower countershaft.
2. fuel injection.

the second is a 650EX!

NOW, You've heard it!

:macho

:D kinda fun too.

if that is true, can you convert the 05 or 04 to the EFI system, and can you convert the geometry etc?

[mstrav1]

regarding a retro on efi on a trx450 or any bike for that matter.

have you ever seen a 55' chevy with fuel injection? It sure wasn't avilable in 55' when they built the car. if you have the money anything is posible. either way the 06 450 isn't fuel injected anyways.

[ubnpast]

First,I consider myself a Honda guy. To stick up for mstrav1, I know what he's saying. Honda gets a 10 year ban on the production of a sportquad because it dominated the race track in the late 80's. All the other companies kept producing race quads (ie: LT250, Tecate, Banshee) Where did the Tecate go? How about the LT? 18 yrs later here's the same banshee. All the while Honda is dominating the circuit. Until 1999 after Honda's ban was lifted did the sport market run rampid with new quads. (ie: 400EX) Yamahas attempt to fight back was a Raptor.?.? Look at how the little 400 could keep up with that. Then the battle of the 450's. Whose is better? The Raptor and YFZ get updates for this coming year. Props to Yamaha for having the ease of electric start and still weighing the same as the Honda.

With the above being said, who was sitting on their hands for the last 18 years? To me it looks like all of them have been. Less than 18 yrs before the late 80's we had air cooled engines. Water cooling was a big step. I think fuel injection should have came a long time ago. Why are they still basing geometry off of a late 80's quad? Did Honda hit the nail on the head with the first try in the quad building market?

All in all, the ATC/ATV industry has came a long way, personally I thought we'd be more advanced than we are by now. I eat, sleep and breathe Honda Red and I don't have any worries that all this hype is anything more than that. It's only numbers on paper right now, see if the numbers show up on the podium.

Eric

[Shawn H]

Originally posted by fastrider450r
By the way in Dirtwheels in the issue were Ballance and Jones are riding together they say that Ballance's uses a 470 stroker.
Then Borich's only uses the HRC, and PIPE.


BTW:It does say that but thats not what he races the GNCC'S with anymore.It also said in another issue Bill only made 80g's and thats B.S AS WELL.

Do you believe everythign you read in DW:rolleyes:

[motoboy66]

Originally posted by chad502ex
everyone- looky again!! i've already mentioned the changes before in other threads that will occur on the 06' 450R. HONDA always invests serious R&D into their products like Rich says (thumbs up i like the way you summed it up about HONDA) and HONDA is always are a bit behind in releasing their innovation cause of a leak to YAMI who beats them to the punch. Ever noticed how YAMI always seem to within months before HONDA hurry to release what takes HONDA years to design? Just about every time i see YAMI do this there is always serious problems with the design. Let's take a closer look at the new raptor and see what HONDA will release as I've said it before,... :D

1. one piece aluminum Spar frame technology as seen on CRF's, CBR street bikes. In addition, slightly new geometry with ~20mm lower countershaft.
2. fuel injection.

the second is a 650EX!

NOW, You've heard it!

:macho

:D kinda fun too.

This is what I see in the future too. Why would they not do the same frame as on thier bikes? i am also a techno geek, and would love to plug the laptop into change stuff around that i know nothing about. All I know is I work to pass both these bikes in the woods and then just see them go around me in the open sections. The old 400 just can't hang there. When this new model comes out I will sell some of my toys and get a new race bike. Just wish that my shocks would transfere over, but oh well I guess its a sign that its time for new ones.

[bbrad mulvey]

Good one nat, I hope you are reading all of this you really opened a can of worms here:D

ok it was interesting reading all of this when I got home from work:devil:

Happyboy, I am still standing next to my word on the cannondale and the suzuki. They are not that great. If it wasnt for Gust, Jones and Goodman they would still be the Kawi/suzuki they were in the 80-90's. Just like if it wasnt for Bubba Stewert people would still cringe when they saw green. C/dale got too far ahead of them selves way too fast, when I saw them release that quad I first wowed them but then I thought that they were gonna go under fast, sure enough...

Sampleez I beg to differ abou t witch 450 came out first. I saw picture and hearad about the honda almost a year before yamaha brought out their 450. Infact I remember the day clearly when I very good friend of me called me up and said" you are not gonna beleive what yamaha just sent us and didnt tell us" and as I race there it was siiting all nice and blue with like 2 dozen people around it. Nobody knew that was even coming out! So spare me about the YFZ being the creator of the 450r. No to see the real beast of the 450 class lets see who has to change something major first to satisfy an error that the compnay lacked...oops yamaha had to redesign the seat and something else( I honestly cant remember). Honda changed a bearing in LATE 05.

I am defending honda. Mainly because they take care of their costomers in leaps and bounds over yamaha. And honda actually puts time into making it right, and even if the final result isnt right, they bring it back and it doesnt leave their hands until it is right! I have heard of many more people blow their yamaha motor in the GNC than honda correct?

There is nothing more than what I would love to see is fuel injection in a quad! I love it myself! When all my friends desided to bolt on their edelbrocks I was changing the volts on my TPS. And EFI does not learn how to calibrate bolt ons I dont care what you say. You still need minor tweeking with a computer. Ford is the only one that I know has a relearning computer that relearns its setting that need to be be made when the battery is unpluged. This will never reach our hobby anytime soon. But if the quad market does go the direction like the EEC IV system like ford. Watch out because we are in for a whole new era of quads!

[chad502ex]

Originally posted by XxHonda_RacerxX
if that is true, can you convert the 05 or 04 to the EFI system, and can you convert the geometry etc?

EFI could easily be adapted, frame no. I suspect that the whole spar all aluminum frame is one piece unlike the hybrid two piece yami.

I have to tell ya though if HONDA changes the fuel delivery with same carburation, then they will go to FCR.

[HUNTSALOT]

I think they have to be very careful on what they do. You cant forget why they stop making quads LAWSUITS. Let them focus on there 400 & 450 making them better.

Originally posted by chad502ex
EFI could easily be adapted, frame no. I suspect that the whole spar all aluminum frame is one piece unlike the hybrid two piece yami.

I have to tell ya though if HONDA changes the fuel delivery with same carburation, then they will go to FCR.

ya the FCR is definantly the best carb out there

[motox450]

I believe we will all see aluminum frames on almost all race quads in the next 2-3 years. Aluminum is much cheaper to work with than steel of the same strength. This was proven in the BMX industry in the last 5 years or so. When alumunum BMX frames first came out they were the hot ticket. They were lighter and suppose to be as strong as the 4130 cromoly frames of the same time. So companies charges double and sometimes tripple what it would cost for a standard cromoly frame. Then it came out that it was costing the companies far LESS to produce the aluminum frames than it did to make the cromoly ones. Some big companies went bankrupt because of this namely GT, Powerlite, Robinson, Schwinn, and Mongoose I believe. These were the big time heavy hitters in durring the 90's. Now most of them are gone, or selling bikes in walmart. There are some very good alumimum frame builders in the BMX world today, but generally you don't pay as much for them as you do a high quality steel frame of the same weight. Motorcylce manufactures have caught onto this as well. It is easier, faster, and cheaper to produce an aluminum cast part, or to hydro-form an aluminum tube than it is to bend and press a steel one. And the manufacturers charge the same as they did for the steel components. Its a win win situation for them. They save money in the production process, and charge the same as they did previously. So i won't be surprised if we don't see all kinds of aluminum quads in the very near future.

[Rich250RRacer]

Originally posted by ubnpast
First,I consider myself a Honda guy. To stick up for mstrav1, I know what he's saying. Honda gets a 10 year ban on the production of a sportquad because it dominated the race track in the late 80's. All the other companies kept producing race quads (ie: LT250, Tecate, Banshee) Where did the Tecate go? How about the LT? 18 yrs later here's the same banshee. All the while Honda is dominating the circuit. Until 1999 after Honda's ban was lifted did the sport market run rampid with new quads. (ie: 400EX) Yamahas attempt to fight back was a Raptor.?.? Look at how the little 400 could keep up with that. Then the battle of the 450's. Whose is better? The Raptor and YFZ get updates for this coming year. Props to Yamaha for having the ease of electric start and still weighing the same as the Honda.

With the above being said, who was sitting on their hands for the last 18 years? To me it looks like all of them have been. Less than 18 yrs before the late 80's we had air cooled engines. Water cooling was a big step. I think fuel injection should have came a long time ago. Why are they still basing geometry off of a late 80's quad? Did Honda hit the nail on the head with the first try in the quad building market?

All in all, the ATC/ATV industry has came a long way, personally I thought we'd be more advanced than we are by now. I eat, sleep and breathe Honda Red and I don't have any worries that all this hype is anything more than that. It's only numbers on paper right now, see if the numbers show up on the podium.

Eric

They got it right with their first performance quad, they hit the nail square on the head, and it's still the benchmark for ALL quads today, almost 20 years later.

[team_450_88]

Originally posted by troutman561
no we dont want them to rush.. but thats us, not the general hey i want the best tihng out there idiots... i personally like honda better, but someone who is wanting the best out there.. well their gona do a search and see that the yfz is killin it in everything with the 450r in close second.. so for the average joe, what do you think they will pick, what they perceive to be second best or what the research is telling them is the "best".. just a thought tho, jsut wanted to see if anyone knew anything from honda since yami's new editions........ i still like my 400 :D

yfz is killing? check out the GNC MX point standings!!:rolleyes:

[troutman561]

i meant in magazine shootouts and that type of thing.. should have been more specific.

[fastrider450r]

Originally posted by snowgasm
BTW:It does say that but thats not what he races the GNCC'S with anymore.It also said in another issue Bill only made 80g's and thats B.S AS WELL.

Do you believe everythign you read in DW:rolleyes:
No i no he makes more than 80g's a year.
Dirt wheels like to BS a lot I know.

[RunninWILD]

People buy what is best for them. You cant please everyone, and what difference does it make whateveryone else wants. I would think it only matters what you want. Is it that important for you to have something that you think everyone else wants? Sounds like some security issues going on here. LOL Just my opinion.


Originally posted by troutman561
no we dont want them to rush.. but thats us, not the general hey i want the best tihng out there idiots... i personally like honda better, but someone who is wanting the best out there.. well their gona do a search and see that the yfz is killin it in everything with the 450r in close second.. so for the average joe, what do you think they will pick, what they perceive to be second best or what the research is telling them is the "best".. just a thought tho, jsut wanted to see if anyone knew anything from honda since yami's new editions........ i still like my 400 :D

[mstrav1]

Anybody that buys something just because dirtwheels says is a looser with more money than brains anyways!!!!!!! those magazines are PAID to have an opinon! I decide what I like from what I see at the dunes / track or whatever. Do you really beleive the shoot-outs are accurate? :mad:

[troutman561]

i do not... but im talking about the aberage person who knows nothing of 4wheeling... i personally am goin to get the 450r in the not to distant future